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Joint Committee on Transport and Communications debate -
Thursday, 30 Jun 2022

Road Safety Strategy 2021-30: Discussion

The purpose of today's meeting is to receive an update on the Government's road safety strategy for the period 2021-30. We are joined by representatives of the Road Safety Authority, RSA, An Garda Síochána and the Medical Bureau of Road Safety. On behalf of the committee, I am pleased to welcome Mr. Sam Waide, CEO of the RSA. Attending remotely from the RSA are: Ms Denise Barry, director of strategy, policy and technology; Mr. Brian Farrell, communications manager; and Ms Velma Burns, research manager. From An Garda Síochána, I welcome: Assistant Commissioner Paula Hilman, who has responsibility for road policing and community engagement; Chief Superintendent Michael Hennebry of the National Roads Policy Bureau; Superintendent Thomas Murphy; and Superintendent Mr. Sean O’Reardon. From the Medical Bureau of Road Safety, I welcome Professor Denis Cusack, director. I thank the witnesses for taking the time out of their busy schedules for this meeting. Based on recent events, we felt it important to have an update, particularly as the committee responsible for this area.

Witnesses are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not criticise or make charges against any person or entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable, or otherwise engage in speech that might be regarded as damaging to the good name of the person or entity. Therefore, if their statements are potentially defamatory in respect of an identifiable person or entity, they will be directed to discontinue their remarks. It is imperative that they comply with any such direction.

Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or an official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. I also remind members of the constitutional requirement that they be physically present in the confines of the Leinster House complex to participate in public meetings. I will not permit a member to participate where he or she is not able to meet this constitutional requirement. Therefore, any member who attempts to participate from outside the precincts will be asked to leave the meeting. In this regard, I ask any member participating using Microsoft Teams to confirm that he or she is on the grounds of the Leinster House campus prior to making his or her contribution. Members attending in the committee room are asked to exercise personal responsibility to protect themselves and others from the risk of contracting Covid-19.

I invite Mr. Waide to make his opening statement on behalf of the RSA.

Mr. Sam Waide

I thank the committee and the Chair for the opportunity to speak to it this evening to give an update on the Government's road safety strategy for the period 2021-30. When I last met with the committee on 1 March, I outlined the transformational nature of Ireland's fifth Government road safety strategy, Our Journey Towards Vision Zero, and the focus on collaboration between key road safety partners, international experts and the public.

The road safety strategy is the first step towards achieving Vision Zero, which is the elimination of all road deaths and serious injuries on Irish roads by 2050. It aims to reduce deaths and serious injuries on Irish roads by 50% by 2030. In March, I advised the committee that this means reducing deaths on Ireland’s roads annually from 144 to 72 or lower and reducing serious injuries from 1,259 to 630 or lower by 2030. Unfortunately, we are meeting today against the backdrop of the recent rise in road traffic collision fatalities, which is of significant concern to the RSA. Accordingly, redoubling our collective efforts focused on road safety and delivering on the road safety strategy has to be an even more pressing priority for all of us.

The strategy is being delivered in three phases. Phase 1, which runs from 2021 to 2024, contains 50 high-impact actions and 136 support actions. The safe system approach underpinning the strategy emphasises shared responsibility among those who design, build, manage and use the roads and vehicles to prevent or reduce collision impacts and those who provide post-crash response to mitigate injury. Close collaboration between all partners is key to successful delivery and achieving the transformation and ambition within the road safety strategy. We have put strong governance structures in place to support this.

The road safety transformation partnership board, which is chaired by the Department of Transport and comprises senior representatives of the key State stakeholders, is governing delivery. It has met twice this year and will meet again this week to review progress in the first half of this year. The board of senior officials reports to the ministerial committee on road safety, which will meet in July. Funding, legislation and data have been identified as key enablers and individual programme groups are being established to remove blockers, identify opportunities and help advance delivery of the actions with dependencies in these areas. The RSA has mobilised a transformation management office to monitor and oversee delivery of the road safety strategy.

At this time, the vast majority of actions are on track and where challenges do arise, we are working with partner organisations in monitoring these closely to ensure they stay on track. While it is not possible to provide an update in this statement on all 186 actions, I will briefly mention some of those that were discussed when I last attended a meeting of this committee in March and some that are particularly relevant in light of recent trends in road fatalities. I am happy to submit a high-level written update on all of the actions following the road safety transformation partnership board meeting this week.

As of this morning, there have been 83 road user fatalities in 2022 to date. My thoughts go out to those families who have suffered loss and who are affected. Along with colleagues from An Garda Síochána and the Medical Bureau of Road Safety, I attended a special meeting convened by the Ministers for Transport and Justice. We discussed the key issues in detail and the urgent next steps that must be undertaken to further protect people on our roads. Further to this, the RSA, in collaboration with An Garda Síochána, has been examining all available data to develop an understanding of the circumstances of these collisions with a view to refining and tailoring our targeted interventions, including up-weighting our awareness campaigns on national media, to prevent any further loss of life.

Specific activities include an in-depth review of the profile of fatal and serious injury collisions by time of day to inform education and enforcement activity acknowledging the recent re-emergence of fatalities occurring late at night or early in the morning at weekends, which is action 106 in the action plan relating to the strategy, and a review of timings and focus of key public awareness activities in light of emerging data on 2022 fatality trends, which is action 21. In the context of action 21, we are developing new public awareness campaigns in response to emerging road safety issues, including campaigns relating to the increase in fatalities in 2022 highlighting the importance of using the roads safely to prevent further road trauma, 80km/h roads in light of the higher number of fatalities occurring on higher-speed rural roads and male drivers in light of the stark evidence that the majority of driver fatalities are male and those detected committing traffic offences are overwhelmingly male.

I will highlight progress relating to three of the high-impact actions for 2022. Under action 6, the working group established to examine and review the framework for the setting of speed limits and to consider the introduction of a 30km/h default speed limit in urban areas has met on a number of occasions. It is reviewing the existing system for setting and managing speed limits to identify strengths, weaknesses and gaps and to develop policy recommendations. A number of activities are under way, including the County and City Management Association conducting an inventory of 30km/h zones while the RSA is commissioning a research study on best practice speed limit management to inform the work of the group.

Under action 7, a task force has been established to share data and information on speeding, make recommendations and urgently implement any further measures identified to reverse the trend of non-compliance. This action is planned for July of this year in light of the importance of reducing speed for fatality reductions.

Under action 30, work is getting under way on reviewing the penalties for serious road traffic offences, including impaired driving, speeding, mobile phone use, non-wearing of seat belts and carrying unrestrained children in a vehicle. This action was initially due for completion in quarter four 2024 but I have requested that it be reprioritised for completion this year in light of the significant increase in fatalities to date.

My update has focused primarily on actions where the RSA is a lead or joint lead. We are all keenly aware of the important role enforcement plays in improving behaviour on our roads and this is an area where we work continuously with our colleagues in An Garda Síochána. I know that Assistant Commissioner Hilman will be updating the committee in this regard today.

I understand that Ireland is not alone in seeing fatality increases this year. However, we will never accept such horrific preventable losses of life, and must act now to reverse this devastating trend and to reduce serious injuries. The road safety transformation partnership board will be reporting back to the ministerial committee in July. With the support and commitment of the members, as political leaders, Government, the road safety transformation partnership board, our stakeholders and the public, we will implement the urgent next steps and priority measures and work together to save lives.

I now invite Ms Hilman to make her opening statement.

Ms Paula Hilman

I thank the committee for delaying this meeting. I was unable to attend last week so I thank the committee for its co-operation with me. I am the assistant commissioner with strategic lead in An Garda Síochána for the national roads policing bureau, community engagement, youth diversion and the events and public order. I am also responsible for the implementation of several of the recommendations contained in the Commission on the Future of Policing in Ireland's report. I am accompanied by Chief Superintendent Michael Hennebry from the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau, who co-ordinates and monitors the activities of the sections under the bureau. I am also accompanied by Superintendent Tom Murphy and Superintendent Sean O'Reardon from the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau

Road safety and roads policing remains a strategic priority for An Garda Síochána and is included in our policing plan 2022, which gives effect to our strategy statement 2022 to 24, which was published earlier this month. This continues to promote and enforce responsible behaviours on our roads reducing risk to vulnerable users through targeted prevention, intervention and enforcement activities working in partnership with the RSA.

I work collaboratively with statutory bodies and our interagency partners to strengthen our collaboration to achieve our collective vision and deliver road safety objectives through high-visibility operations, education and co-operation. Our partners include the RSA, the Health and Safety Authority; Transport Infrastructure Ireland; the Medical Bureau of Road Safety, the National Office of Traffic Medicine and victim advocacy groups such as the Irish Road Victims' Association and PARC. The preservation of life is a key priority for An Garda Síochána and this includes keeping our roads safe, protecting lives and reducing serious injuries on our roads.

I will now outline the structures and governance within An Garda Síochána to show how we deliver roads policing and how that links to the Government road safety strategy. I have strategic oversight of divisional roads policing units, which are under the control of each divisional officer. In the context of their performance, the divisional officers report to each of our four regional assistant commissioners.

Each regional assistant commissioner is also responsible for implementing and overseeing operations in his or her region to ensure that roads policing performance is achieved. Divisional roads policing inspectors lead at operational level and oversee divisional roads policing units, which are responsible for: enforcement of road traffic legislation including GoSafe; prevention activities; investigation; forensic collision investigators; and education. The current roads policing strength in An Garda Síochána, as of June 2022, is 724 members, which accounts for approximately 5% of our workforce.

A chief superintendent has been assigned a roads policing portfolio in each of our four regions. The selected chief superintendents represent their regions at monthly national roads policing co-ordination meetings convened and chaired by Chief Superintendent Hennebry of the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau, who is seated to my left. They have ownership and governance of roads policing at a regional level in the short and medium term until finalisation of the Garda Síochána operating model. The objective is to deliver a consistent approach to roads policing tasking and performance across our regions taking into account national and regional trends.

The annual national Garda Síochána roads policing operations plan, RPOP, is a significant contributor to the success of Garda roads policing enforcement operations and underpins and guides our enforcement strategy to keep all road users safe and to reduce serious injury and fatal road traffic collisions. The plan is evidence-based and data-led and represents current trends and statistics provided to us by the Garda Síochána analysis service. The roads policing operations plan is divided into four quarters that are monitored, reviewed and amended each quarter. This approach affords us the time and opportunity to regularly review and amend enforcement activity plans throughout the year and supports an agile response to identified trends in fatal and serious injury collisions. The Garda Síochána roads policing operations plan is aligned with a national communications plan and media strategy agreed in advance with the RSA. The RPOP also incorporates inter-agency enforcement operations with the Health and Safety Authority and the RSA.

Along with our counterparts, An Garda Síochána are significant stakeholders in the Government road safety strategy. With phase one of the action plan under way, with a timeline of 2021 to 2022, An Garda Síochána is responsible for leading or jointly leading 11 high-impact actions. Seven of these are led by An Garda Síochána and four are four led with other organisations. We are working closely with the RSA in progressing actions. We are also actively working as a support agency for 65 of the other Government road safety strategy actions.

I have covered our internal structures, which report to our internal performance framework. In terms of the Government road safety strategy, governance sits with the road safety transformation partnership board, of which I am a member. There are three working groups, data, finance and legislation, at which we are appropriately represented. The third accountability strand for An Garda Síochána is via the Policing Authority, to which I regularly report on roads policing. I thank members for their time today and am happy to provide more detail on any aspect of the high-level overview I have given them.

I thank Ms Hilman and invite Professor Cusack to make his opening statement on behalf of the Medical Bureau of Road Safety.

Professor Denis Cusack

On behalf of the Medical Bureau of Road Safety and as its director, I thank the Chairman and members of the committee for the kind invitation to present to and assist the committee in relation to the update on the road safety strategy for the period 2021-30.

Everybody here is aware of the number of deaths and injuries in Ireland as a result of road traffic crashes and the recent alarming increase in that number since the beginning of the year. I know that my colleagues from the RSA and the Garda are addressing and have addressed particular aspects of that strategy and for that reason I will emphasise the forensic and medical aspects of this topic as director of the Medical Bureau of Road Safety and as a medical doctor within the context of the road strategy. The functions of the bureau are laid down in the Road Traffic Acts 1968 to 2016 and regulations under those Acts. Those functions are set out more plainly and summarised in the Medical Bureau of Road Safety annual report of 2020, a copy of which was sent to the committee. My colleague, Dr. Declan Bedford, was before the committee just a few weeks ago, and I am happy to follow up in respect of anything there.

I have been privileged to have been involved in each of the Government road safety strategies since the first in 1998, when the number of road fatalities in Ireland was 472 or 124 per million of population. The current strategy covers the period 2021-30. In 2021, the road fatality figure in Ireland was just under 41 per million of population. By any standard, this significant decline in deaths is a good news story, if the death and injury of even a single person can be described as such. However, we have had a very shocking reminder of how these figures are subject to stark change. In the year to date we will have heard that 83 people have died on our roads to 27 June, compared with 51 to the same date in 2021, although the change is not as stark if we go back to the pre-Covid year of 2019. That is shocking and it is why we must remind ourselves that these are not just figures – these are unique individuals with loving families and friends who are now lost to us. The number of serious injuries, with blighted lives, has also increased. This is the reminder of the constant challenge and the great leveller against our societal complacency about road safety.

We need to ask why this has occurred when we appeared to be on the right track towards Vision Zero. What if any differences have occurred in the first half of 2022 which might explain this deterioration in road safety? What are the factors on an evidence-based examination? Is it due to random or unrelated factors unique to each tragic incident? What can we do and how do we refocus our current road safety strategy? Factors causing road crashes include: speeding; non-use of safety belts and protective gear; dangerous and careless driving due to fatigue; inattention due to mobile phone use and so on; and of course driving under the influence of intoxicants. In order to tackle that last problem we must look across the entire spectrum of other factors. Are there statistical differences in road crashes and safety factors in gender, age, time of day, location, vehicle user type or vulnerable groups? The answer to these questions is yes, there are differences, but have they changed again recently?

Driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs remains a very significant problem in Ireland. The Medical Bureau of Road Safety is the national, independent, statutory forensic body with responsibility for testing for intoxicants in Ireland and with a designated role in implementing safety actions and advising on these matters. Last year, a total of 5,862 blood and urine driver samples were received by the Medical Bureau of Road Safety for alcohol and drug testing, and more than 3,200 breath samples were tested for alcohol on the instruments in Garda stations. The number of blood and urine samples received this year to 27 June was 2,881, a 23% increase on the same period in the pre-Covid year of 2019. Alcohol remains the most frequently used intoxicant in driving. In drivers found positive for alcohol in 2021, the figures for those certified over the blood alcohol level equivalent of 100, which is twice the non-specified driver limit, were quite startling at 71% in blood, 71% in urine and 64% in breath.

Drug analyses results from the samples show: 2,498 confirmed positive for cannabis in 2021; 1,369 for cocaine; and 620 for benzodiazepines. That pattern has continued. An important Health Research Board study published on 8 June on substance use among young people found that cannabis remains the most commonly used illicit drug and that the use of stimulants, including ecstasy and cocaine, has increased in this age group with Ireland having the second highest use of these drugs in the European countries studied. This is an important confirmation of growing concerns for increased use of drugs other than alcohol by those of driver age. There needs to be an informed discussion on the issue of medicinal cannabis and cannabis use generally in society as well as the widespread non-therapeutic use of other drugs.

Methods of detection of drugs driving by means of roadside impairment testing and with particular emphasis on roadside drug testing have been developed substantially. Following a significant increase in the number available at the roadside since August 2020, the increased level of Garda enforcement and detection of drugs driving must be recognised. This is a positive story from the road safety strategy. Later this year the number of drugs which can be tested for at the roadside on the new devices being tested at present will increase from the current cannabis, cocaine, benzodiazepines and opiates to include amphetamine and methamphetamine. A more user-friendly system with increased roadside testing will soon be available to the Garda.

Actions 24, 31, 119 and 169 of the road safety strategy action plan are about impairment testing, increased sanctions for polydrug and drug and alcohol use while driving, alcohol interlocks and the preliminary roadside drug testing system to which I refer. In the debate on drugs and driving, we must ensure that drivers who are on medications that are properly prescribed and dispensed continue to take those medications. The medical fitness to drive guidelines in Sláinte agus Tiomáint are important. Road safety must also continue to be grounded in individual responsibility.

I will end on a positive note. The Government road safety strategy, launched by the Minister for Transport, led by the RSA and supported by the Department of Transport, encompasses an interagency collaboration. The structure of this approach and the active engagement through the road safety transformation partnership Board, which met earlier this afternoon, is challenging but innovative and I believe that it is the best structured strategy seen to date in this country. If implemented and supported, there is every hope and realistic expectation that it will reduce road crashes and the consequential deaths and serious injuries that cause incalculable grief to families and substantial economic loss to society.

I am pleased to assist the committee and to answer any questions arising. I thank the Chairman and members for their courtesy and attention.

I thank Professor Cusack. I thank our guests for their opening statements. The structure for our discussions and questioning is very much in focus. I now move to members in the order agreed. First up is Senator Gerry Horkan. The Senator has ten minutes.

I thank all our guests. While I was not present earlier, I have read all of their opening statements. I thank them all for being here so late on a Thursday evening. I attended a nice event this morning to celebrate 100 years of the Garda. It was hosted in, of all places, the famous Stepaside Garda station and the former Minister for Transport even turned up.

It has been reopened.

Some people were claiming full credit for it, regardless of whether they were involved or not.

I thank all of our guests for attending. I appreciate the work they are doing. While there is science behind it, we all know the problems. If I am right, and I picked it up from all of them, those problems stem from alcohol, drugs, speeding, tiredness, losing attention and forgetting that one is driving a large dangerous piece of equipment.

One of my questions is about Vision Zero, which is fantastic. It is where we all want to go. Almost all of this is human error. How do we manage to reduce human error? Is it more technology? Is it more telemetry? In 30 years' time we may all have self-driving cars or whatever, but we are not there yet. We all perform better when we are being watched, but what I took from Professor Cusack's statement is that the number of breath tests, urine tests and blood tests is relatively low in light of the size of our population and the number of vehicles on the road. That said, the positivity rate is quite high. This is probably because gardaí are only testing the people they are suspicious of in the first place. Do we need more of a Garda presence?

The Chairman generally takes the train. In the context of speed cameras and the average speed at which people are travelling between junctions 23 and 27 on the M7, are there any figures yet on how the monitoring of this is going? As we are all aware, people will jam on the brakes if they know there is a speed camera in place or if they see a white van with yellow stickers or whatever on it parked at the side of the road. Can we get more technology within cars? There is a vote happening in the Seanad but I think I will skip it. Can we get more technology to track people driving - perhaps in the steering wheel - to analyse whether what is coming out of their pores contains alcohol or drugs? Is there other technology in terms of tracking that if one is driving through a country village that is a 50 km/h zone and one is doing 60 km/h, 70 km/h or 80 km/h, one's car automatically sends a signal to the driver or to the insurance company that the car is not doing what it should be doing? Is such technology available and can is it capable of being used?

I have a question on speed limits. The Stillorgan dual-carriageway, with which I am familiar, has a 60 km/h speed limit. We are all familiar with rural parts of the country where there is an 80 km/h speed limit on very small roads. While it may not be possible to achieve 80 km/h on those roads, it is still permissible to do so. Those speed limits are a reserve function. I served as chairman of a transport strategic policy committee, SPC, in the past. We looked at speed limits in Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown. I wonder do we need to do much more on speed limits and the enforcement of them? I saw reference to 30 km/h zones. If everybody was adhering to the 50 km/h limit, it would be a good start. Certainly, there are roads in my area on which 50 km/h limits apply. When it is busy, they are busy. When it is not busy, however, people are certainly doing more than 50 km/h. I am interested in our guests' thoughts on how we enhance and harness technology in terms of in-car aids and average speed, whether it be in the context of a journey from the Dunkettle interchange to the Red Cow roundabout or a shorter distance in between. Is technology in this regard available and can it be used? Is there a reason it is not being used?

I am not sure who is the most appropriate person for all of these questions. They are for any and all of the witnesses.

We will start with An Garda Síochána.

Ms Paula Hilman

I thank the Senator. Much of that technology is available. It is one of the deliverables under the road safety strategy regarding the increased use of technology. I will give an example - the very example the Senator used about the M7 in Tipperary. We had a clear communications strategy letting people know that enforcement was starting on a particular day. That was because we want people to change their behaviour. This is what it is about. If we look at data that was released today, it shows that prior to the equipment being erected, the compliance rate with the speed limit was 69%. This means that 31% of drivers did not comply with the speed limit. That was before the equipment was erected.

Those are big numbers. It is a busy road.

Ms Paula Hilman

Once the equipment went up and before it went live, the level of compliance increased to 89%, which meant 11% were still not compliant. Once we went live, the compliance rate rose to 96%. We know it is the same with the Dublin Port tunnel, which has been in operation for much longer. There is a 99% compliance rate in the port tunnel. People have changed their behaviour. They know that if they exceed the average speed, there will be consequences. Perhaps it is down to the wider strategy and financing of that, but we would be supportive of the average speed cameras.

Has there been a drop in incidents, fatal or otherwise? Generally, motorways are probably the safest roads we have per percentage of the volume travelled and the volume of people on the road, etc. However, has the Garda seen a reduction in the number of incidents since the cameras on particular stretch went live?

Ms Paula Hilman

We have.

Compliance has gone up, but I wonder has the number of incidents decreased.

Ms Paula Hilman

That area was chosen. It was identified because it is prone to frequent weather-related events, particularly hailstorms. You will hear us saying on many occasions that the speed limit is not a target and that people should take cognisance of road and weather conditions as they drive. That is why that section of road was identified and used. There are approximately 47 detections daily on that stretch.

All kinds of things turned up during Covid. The Garda discovered all kinds of nefarious activity that it would not normally find because the volume of traffic was low. Has the Garda seen a difference in behaviour coming out of Covid and behaviour pre Covid?

Ms Paula Hilman

We have seen many of our detections, in terms of the lifesaver offences that we talked about, which are speeding, drink- and drug-driving, inattention, mobile phone use and seat-belt use. They are similar to pre Covid. Where we saw the difference was during Covid, which was a significant increase in drug-driving detections rather than drink-driving. Drink-driving increased again as we moved out of the Covid restrictions and the number of detections in that regard has also increased. The drink-driving detections are on a par with where we were previously, but the number of drug-driving detections has increased.

That is one of the areas that has changed.

I do not want to target anywhere but is drink-driving and drug-driving more prevalent in urban or rural areas? Does it occur on small country lanes where people think they will not get caught or in urban areas where the volume of traffic is higher? Where does it tend to occur?

Ms Paula Hilman

The incidence is widespread across all regions. Mr. Murphy has the regional breakdown and the rates are similar in all regions, with both Dublin and the eastern region having 1,000-----

Is that 1,000 incidents or what percentages are-----

Ms Paula Hilman

For drink and drug-driving, yes.

Yes, but obviously Dublin has 1,000 incidents based on a population of 1 million versus Leitrim, which has 100 based on a population of 40,000. Percentage-wise, are there black spots? Are there places where people are less likely to get caught? In rural areas there is little by way of alternative public transport options. In urban areas, people can avail of taxis, the Luas, bus services, other means of transport and the distances are generally shorter. I am not accusing anyone but is it a case that there is no alternative in rural areas? People whose local pub is, say, four miles away might decide to take a chance and drive. Are statistics available that identify where the problem is more prevalent?

Ms Paula Hilman

We have statistics but they are not broken down as a percentage of the population. However, we know that in Dublin the Dublin metropolitan region, DMR, north division and DMR west division in Dublin have higher number of detections than the others. In the eastern region, Kildare has-----

Do the statistics drive the detection strategy? Does the Garda locate more checkpoints in areas that have more activity in order to improve compliance?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes, it does. The regional assistant commissioners and divisional officers receive a monthly report so they can see the performance of their roads policing units monthly. In some of the towns that we look at, it is even about the number of our checkpoints. You can have a high number of checkpoints but it is a question of how that translates into detections. We know we breathalyse a lot of people but we need to know how that translates into detections. The percentage of positive results is at a lower percentage because the majority of people pass the tests that are done at checkpoints.

By way of conveying a message from the witnesses to the committee and to the wider public, what else do they want us all to do? I am amazed that people do not wear a seat belt. At this stage it is quite annoying when you sit in your car without putting on a seat belt because in almost all cars now, it starts to make a pinging noise. I do not know anybody who does not wear a seat belt. What is the detection rate for not wearing a seat belt?

Ms Paula Hilman

From looking at Road Safety Authority analysis, we know that almost 28% of people who were involved in fatal road traffic collisions had not been wearing a seat belt.

To what year does that figure 28% apply?

Mr. Sam Waide

It was from 2021.

So nearly one third of all the people who have been killed in road collisions did not wear their safety belt.

Is that just drivers? I ask because the fatalities could be back-seat passengers or whatever.

Mr. Sam Waide

My understanding is that the percentage includes passengers as well as drivers.

Everybody should wear a seat belt and every car is equipped with seat belts for every seat. I certainly never sit in a car even as a passenger without wearing a seat belt, even if I am seated in the back. Does the Garda Síochána still encounter drivers who are not wearing a seat belt and are involved in collisions?

Mr. Tom Murphy

Absolutely, yes.

Geographically, where is the worst area? Does not wearing a seat belt occur across the country? I am not trying to pinpoint anywhere. I simply want to identify where there is a behavioural pattern that is worse than other areas so that the message can be conveyed that people must wear their seat belts in that part of the country, and people have died due to not wearing a seat belt.

Mr. Sam Waide

I know the question is on seat belts and speeding but I can list by county the 2022 fatalities to date, which come to 83 fatalities, albeit these are provisional data. The top five counties are Cork, Dublin, Meath, Limerick and Wexford with fatalities totalling ten, nine, seven, five and five, respectively.

Every single death is a tragedy for the person's family, friends and all of the people connected to him or her There were nine fatalities in Dublin, which has a population of 1 million, and I presume that the figure of five fatalities in Wexford is based on a much smaller population. What metric is used to analyse the statistics? What counties are the worst when certain metrics are used?

Mr. Sam Waide

We can submit detailed information to the committee but one of the counties with the highest number of fatalities per 100,000 population is Longford.

Has the reason Longford is worse than anywhere else been investigated? I think that the entire committee would like to convey the message to the people of Longford that its statistics are worse than everywhere else so please take extra care.

Mr. Sam Waide

I am happy for the assistant commissioner to come but we work with all of the councils, through the County and City Management Association, CCMA, and the Local Government Management Agency, LGMA, which are the overarching bodies for all of the councils and part of the partnership board. Each of those councils has a road safety officer. We work in partnership with those councils to provide targeted education programmes. There are a number of education-based actions in the strategy to deliver education-based programmes. The RSA and An Garda Síochána have worked with, and increasingly so, with the likes of Age Friendly Ireland so we do target specific groups.

I will come back in later if there is time. As a former chair of a transport strategic policy committee, SPC, for an urban local authority that analysed the statistics on road deaths, I reiterate that one death is one too many. There was an AXA roadshow for transition year students and they could discuss road safety with doctors and paramedics.

Professor Denis Cusack

A very good question was asked about why do the numbers of blood, urine and breath samples seem so low and one must put that in context. At the roadside more than 200,000 alcohol tests were done. So the Garda are very good at picking up and bringing people to a station and when they do the breath test, it turns out to be positive for alcohol, and usually high positive for alcohol in cases. Similarly, we reckon that there were about 12,000 drug tests, which is a much more complex process at the roadside but, again, they require blood and urine. On the samples coming in, 12,000 drug samples were tested on the side of the road, so the number is quite large. It is a credit to the members of the Garda that they pick up these things.

The Senator asked about technology. One of the actions that we are considering is Alcolocks for when the driver gets into a vehicle. There is a European directive that must be implemented shortly so that within a number of years, all cars must be fitted or be capable of being fitted with alcohol detection and if alcohol is detected, then the car will not start.

Third, it is a limit of speed, not a target. Recently I was in Germany where they have fixed cameras and at another meeting a few hours ago, I made the point that I do not speed but the position there is clear. They tell you where the fixed cameras are coming up and everybody slows down. It is about behaviour.

To answer another question, let us be careful in our analysis of the number of deaths so far. Sadly, we need more information about the fatalities and to learn the contributing factors. As a coroner I made a presentation to the Joint Committee on Justice on 31 May and we must be careful not to prejudge what people may or may not have done in their behaviour. It takes about three months to get toxicology results from the State Laboratory. The results from living drivers and an alcohol test takes about ten days. It takes about two months to analyse drugs as they are much more complex. We must be very careful as we gather information together and this is one of the issues that arose when we spoke to the Minister for Justice and the Minister of State at the Department of Transport last week. We actually said let us get our information first, let us see what is different, if anything, let us target, let us focus and let us communicate. Yes, there are geographical differences as can be seen on page 9 of the 2020 annual report.

We have to be careful in picking out a county. We also are going to look at the issue in terms of population but we have to be careful. We are not targeting young men, Donegal, Kerry or Wexford. Let us get the evidence and focus.

Some members have come back. I want to set the scene. The witnesses are before us because there were eight fatalities over the bank holiday weekend. There had been 78 fatalities to date this year when we were due to meet originally and the number has increased to 83. The figures this year appear to be a reversal of a trend. We would like to know why in order that we can assist as a committee. Will the witnesses give a quick breakdown of the 83 fatalities to date, including whether they are male or female, what age they are, and whether it involves drink or drugs or not? I will not look at the counties. I hope there were no children involved but the witnesses might say if there were.

Will that include cyclists and pedestrians?

We note that there have been 17 fatalities among motorcyclists so far this year. There was a total of 21 last year. We are here today because there appears to have been a significant increase in fatalities in the first six months of this year and we wish to know why. I will not ask questions but wished to set the stage. Professor Cusack spoke about data. These are the data we want to probe.

Ms Paula Hilman

When broken down, we see that 49%, or 41 people, of the 83 fatalities were drivers. Before I start to go through this, I want to echo what has already been said, namely, that every one of these figures is an empty seat at a table and somebody's loved one. It is important to say that at the outset. Forty-one drivers, 17 motorcyclists, 12 pedestrians, ten passengers, two pedal cyclists and one e-scooter user have been killed on our roads this year. I do not have the number, but 88% of fatalities are male.

What is the age profile?

Ms Paula Hilman

The fatalities span all age groups. We have been conscious, in our media message and education, of reaching out to everyone. There were three fatalities among people aged between 11 and 15, eight aged between 16 and 20, five aged between 21 and 25, six aged between 26 and 30, six aged between 31 and 35, six aged between 36 and 40, five aged between 41 and 45, six aged between 46 and 50, one aged between 51 and 55, two aged between 56 and 60, ten aged between 61 and 65, nine aged between 66 and 70, seven aged between 71 and 75, three aged between 76 and 80, and six aged over 81. Members can see there is a spread.

Those figures would be against the public perception. I will hand back to members. That is the context of the meeting today.

I probably will try to get back in if there is time. I thank the witnesses for everything they are doing. If there is anything our committee can do to help them, please let us know.

I thank members for their indulgence. I wanted to set the scene. I will call Senator Buttimer.

I will defer to others because I was late.

I had indicated that Deputy Lowry would come in prior to other members. I will call him now.

I thank the witnesses for their attendance and their interesting, informative presentation. It is alarming that we have this number of fatalities. The surge in the past six months seems to go against past trends. That level of fatality is unacceptable. We have had horror crashes, devastated families and broken communities. The message the witnesses are conveying is a stark warning that needs to be heeded, otherwise we will have continuance of this surge in deaths on our roads. I believe there should be more emphasis on prevention. If one wants to bring the public along, the message has to be about prevention, particularly with regard to young people.

I represent a rural county. The perception in rural Ireland is that there is a high Garda presence in rural areas. It often amazes me when I see that we have groups of young people congregating. I had the perception that many of these tragedies happen after nightclubs empty out and young people take to their cars, which eventually leads to fatal crashes. Many people in rural Ireland say to me that gardaí are out in rural areas, maybe watching an old guy coming out of a pub, and ask me why they are not outside a place where the local young lads and girls congregate to speak to and discourage them. They ask why we do not have gardaí in the car parks of places rather than being on the road to wait for them after they get into the car. They should say to young people that they are not in a position to drive and discourage them from driving. They should not wait until somebody is dead until they do it.

There is a perception in rural Ireland that the Garda is not doing the job properly. I am not aware of too many people being killed in zones with a 30 mph speed limit. I see one suggestion here is to start imposing further restrictions on 30 mph zones. That does not make sense to me. My view of it is that young people have to be educated that they cannot drink and drive and that by doing so, they are endangering themselves and their companions. That message is not being driven home enough. If we had a Garda presence where those young people are congregating, to give them that message, I think it would help. Every time I hear of an accident, when I look at where the traffic emerged from, it is usually a place where many young people congregate. I would like to see more emphasis on that.

Drug-driving is obviously a serious problem. Professor Cusack has given an example of how technical and difficult it is. The numbers increased and it involves a huge workload for gardaí. We have only started drug-testing on a real scale in Ireland over the past five or six years. What kinds of data do we have on that? Is drug-driving now as serious a problem as drink-driving? Somebody mentioned earlier that drugs may not be a problem in rural areas. Drug-driving is the same in rural areas as in urban centres and cities. We have drugs at every crossroads. There was a time when it was a city problem, then it became a town problem, then a parish and rural problem. Now it is a crossroads problem. There is drug-driving right across the country. How good are we at detecting that?

There was a suggestion in one presentation of how it should be possible to retrofit all cars with alcohol recognition ability.

How advanced are we in Ireland in regard to alcohol recognition ability? Have we made progress on it? There is an EU directive on it. What is the timescale for that? Have we any possibility of meeting it? Finally in regard to fatalities, everyone understands that a road is closed off in order for technical examinations to take place. Everyone is very sensitive to it. What is the chain of command in minor accidents? There have been many minor accidents on motorways as a result of which we had colossal chaos, a huge backup of traffic and very poor direction in rerouting traffic leading to massive delays and inconvenience to the public. There does not appear to be any chain of command. What is the protocol or the procedure when there is an accident? Who is responsible for what?

Ms Paula Hilman

I will start with some of the fatalities and those data. I will hand over shortly to Superintendent Murphy to cover the minor collisions on motorways. To return to the commentary on the fatalities, we examine what the data are telling us this year and what are we seeing. This year we have seen that Sunday and Friday are the days when most fatalities occurred, with 16 on Sundays and 15 on Fridays. Some 50% of fatal road traffic collisions this year occurred between 10 a.m. and 6 p.m. The timeframe with the most, 17% or 14 fatal collisions-----

Is that during the day, from 10 a.m. to 6 p.m.?

How unusual is that? Is that in form with past years?

Ms Paula Hilman

There was a perception that this always happened in the early hours of the morning.

That was my perception.

Ms Paula Hilman

Also, 4 p.m. to 6 p.m. is the time bracket when most fatalities, 14, occurred.

How many occurred?

Ms Paula Hilman

A total of 14 out of 83. We are looking at tasking, and I talked earlier about the operational plan which is reviewed and issued quarterly. It used to be issued annually but now we issue it quarterly to take into account what we are seeing in order that we can tell our roads policing members what times they need to be out, and where and when. That is our own initial analysis. Another thing we have done this year to try to get that understanding - and the chief superintendent, Mr. Hennebry, tasked this piece of work with our forensic collision investigators who go to the scene of every fatal road traffic collision - is we looked at what they and their initial analysis see as the contributory factors to fatal road traffic collisions this year. The initial assessment on the first review is that 29% of fatal road traffic collisions have been reported as having speed as a contributory factor. That is 29%. I am not sure if members have seen it. We were asked by the Ministers to look at some immediate actions that could be done. We started a social media campaign last weekend asking everyone to slow down. We have reached out to well-known sports people, some television people and also local people within local communities and the message is very clear: "please slow down". We know if you reduce your speed by 5%, we could reduce fatal road traffic collisions by 30%. That message about "please slow down" is ongoing. Will Mr. Hennebry give the outreach we have had for that campaign?

Before he does that, will Ms Hilman just give us the breakdown of the 83? How many of those had contributory factors of drink, drugs and non-drink or drugs because that is the final component.

Ms Paula Hilman

Okay, so the contributory factor of 29% of fatal road traffic collisions was speeding, 20% are still under investigation, and a further 20% is intoxicants, that is drugs or alcohol. Another 20% is possibly medical; we have some fatalities that were potentially medical and someone has died at the wheel. That would be clarified through the Coroner's Court. Dangerous driving makes up 18%, distraction 14%, seat belt 7% and drugs 5%. That is the initial assessment of what we have seen this year to date of the fatal road traffic collisions. These are still subject to full investigation but we did that initial review to try to get an understanding of what we see happening this year.

Ms Hilman mentions the contributory factor of 29% of fatal road traffic collisions was speeding and of 18% was dangerous driving. Is that potentially 47% accounted for by speed?

Ms Paula Hilman

Potentially, it could be. That is a fair assessment.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

There can also be multiple contributory factors to a single collision. Some of the collisions that we report on could have multiple factors so that the percentages do not add up to 100%. This means that dangerous driving and speed, or even speed and alcohol or drug use comprise multiple factors. Bearing in mind what the assistant commissioner, Ms Hilman, said, they are under active investigation at the moment and when we get the final forensic collision reports we will be in a much clearer position in partnership with the road safety authority, RSA. So far this year to try to identify contributory factors there has been an action to expedite the sharing of the forensic collision reports with the RSA. Obviously they just have to be redacted at the moment. We are redacting the forensic collision investigation reports and providing those reports to the RSA with a view to letting that evidence inform where we are going to go from a strategy perspective. The assistant commissioner also mentioned about the campaign which started on Monday. Between social media and traditional print and broadcast media we have had a reach of 2.3 million people who have engaged with the campaign in one way or other. The engagement rate on social media is 2.5% which is double the standard rate on social media. Our message for that campaign is mainly to slow down. We have done a great deal on media and what we are trying to do is to get people to use their influence to get people to change their behaviours. The professor mentioned that some of these deaths are very preventable. We need a change of behaviour. We need a national focus on behavioural change on the roads. We are focusing on use of shared spaces. Nobody owns the road. We all have to look after each other. We are reaching into communities to try to start that change in behaviour. This is the first phase of that.

Ms Paula Hilman

I ask Superintendent Murphy to speak on minor collisions on motorways.

Mr. Thomas Murphy

Regarding the motorways and minor collisions, Transport Infrastructure Ireland, TII, which we deal with on a daily basis is responsible for the motorways. Its contractors and subcontractors provide a 24-7 service along those in regard to attending at collisions, including minor collisions. They will assist An Garda Síochána if called to the scene. Where possible they will try to clear a scene. We have co-ordinated diversion routes with TII along motorway sections where, if needs be, traffic can be diverted off. The bottom line is safety for other road users. We have a system in place along with TII contractors to slow the traffic that is coming up behind the collision. A lot of technology is used with signage. The motorway traffic control centre which was opened last year has essentially the most up-to-date equipment. It is like the Star Trek Enterprise with the technology that is being used on a 24-7 basis. We work collectively with TII staff on a daily basis. I take the point in relation to delays. They are frustrating but it is about getting people and vehicles off the road safely. Sometimes there are difficulties with cars where gearboxes are stuck. Many issues can arise with collisions as members will be aware. It is just not straightforward to remove a vehicle.

There could be fluid leakages that mean it is not safe to allow a road to open. That delays matters further again and has a knock-on effect. By and large, fender benders are cleared as quickly as possible but it is a team effort between the contractors from Transport Infrastructure Ireland, TII, and the Garda to move them. The bottom line is the safety of the road users, the Garda staff and TII staff.

Much of that depends on the reliability and response time of the subcontractors. The Garda is the lead organisation and calls in the subcontractors when they are needed but it is up to TII to ensure its contractors are on the spot as quickly as possible.

Mr. Thomas Murphy

TII would be monitoring the motorways. It is able to detect when there is a slowdown in traffic. Its systems are linked on the roadway and its staff get an alert. The Deputy may be familiar with Google Maps. A red line comes up and the TII staff are able to see there is an issue. TII checks the cameras first and then asks its staff to check. The emergency motorway network phone system can also be utilised. It is that build up that will cause the delay to traffic, particularly during the rush hours in the early morning and the evening time. It is the system that is there. It is technology-driven and very advanced.

For members who were missing, I will add a small bit of context.

That is okay. I will bring people up to speed. Some 50% of collisions occur between 10 a.m. and 6 p.m.

Will the Chairman say that again?

Between the hours of 10 a.m. and 6 p.m., 50% of fatalities from collisions occur. Fourteen of the 83 fatalities so far this year occurred between 4 p.m. and 6 p.m. There were 16 on Sundays and 15 on Fridays, which represent 37% of the total. Speed was a contributing factor in 29% of fatalities. A further 20% of cases are under investigation. Intoxicating drugs or alcohol were a contributing factor in 20% of cases. Medical reasons contributed to 20% of cases. Dangerous driving contributed to 18% of cases. Distractions contributed to 14% of cases. What was involved in the other 7% of cases?

Ms Paula Hilman

Seatbelts.

What are the medical reasons? Are they things such as heart attacks and strokes?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes.

Drugs were noted to contribute to 5% of cases. Some 25% of these causes involve drugs and alcohol. Have our guests been able to correlate how many of the cases involving speeding also included drugs? Have our guests been able to link those factors?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

We have not done so as yet. We are waiting for the investigation to be concluded. We rely heavily on our highly trained forensic collision investigators to give us the ultimate statistics. We are still in the early stages and the figures are subject to change. It is important to point that out.

The point I am trying to make is that well over 50% of those accidents might have their basis in speeding and intoxication. Speed and intoxication may have been dual contributory factors. The motorist may have been speeding and under the influence of alcohol and drugs. When do we get that level of forensic detail?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Depending on the individual collision and the factors involved, it could take three to six months to get the final report. It is a very detailed report, to be fair to those who compile it. The data they collect and present at the Coroner's Court and for criminal prosecutions are nearly to an engineer's standards.

I appreciate that. As laypeople, we might be inclined to ask why it takes so long. A six-month wait makes it hard to react in real time.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

We have the data from last year and the year before. They reflect the trends. We do not see anything remarkably different this year. We have approximately 30 to 35 fully trained forensic collision investigators who are deployed throughout the country. We deploy them to collisions involving fatalities and serious injuries.

Last year's figures show 137 fatalities. How many of those were a combination of drink or drugs and speeding?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

I do not have those data with me but we could certainly supply them.

I apologise to our guests for being in and out of the meeting. I thank them for their work. Today is an important day because, as the Assistant Commissioner said, it is about people. We have seen a lot of commentary about the upsurge in road deaths. It is people to whom that is happening. That is what we are about.

The comparable figures to this year are those for 2019 rather than those during the pandemic in 2020. Would that be fair comment? Okay. I apologise in advance because I have a couple of hobbyhorses and I am probably wrong about this. I am happy to stand corrected. I support all our guests in the work they are doing. Professor Cusack made an important point in his presentation on which we have not dwelled. It was in the context of medications properly prescribed and dispensed. Is the use of prescription medications when people go behind the wheel something about which we should have a national discussion? I know the pamphlet with some medications states they may cause drowsiness. Is this a significant factor on which we should be dwelling further?

Professor Denis Cusack

It is an important factor. I thank the Senator for the question. We do not know whether these prescribable drugs, such as benzodiazepines, which include sleeping tablets and Valium, are actually used on prescription. It would appear they are not. It would appear in this context that those drugs are off prescription and people have borrowed them or got them on the black market. For the National Office for Traffic Medicine in the College of Physicians, on which I serve, and the RSA, the Sláinte agus Tiomáint document, is very important. As a doctor, I would say we do not want the wrong message to go out there so that people who are taking medication think they should not take drugs and drive. Medications are prescribed for a reason. They are prescribed to make patients better, healthier and safer drivers. People should take them but should be careful about a change in dosage or brand. They should consult their pharmacists and doctors. The advice is there. I urge people to keep taking their medication.

Sláinte agus Tiomáint is a fantastic document. I am on a number of international committees. Doctors and patients can look at this document. If people are taking medications legitimately, on prescription and under advice, it is good. That is not the case for people who are not taking them on prescription or are popping an extra few pills on the basis that if one is good, two are better. However, I do not believe that is a major factor in accidents. It is important that we do not give out a negative message that would scare people off. On the other hand, we must have an honest discussion, although I am not going to get into it today, about the use of cannabis and cocaine. Those are real problems and we must ensure we discuss them.

My next question is in the context of Professor Curran's piece around Health Research Board Ireland and the finding that cannabis is the most commonly used illicit drug, followed by stimulants such as ecstasy and cocaine. That is another conversation. The RSA had a very good advertising campaign. Has it given any consideration to pursuing an advertising campaign along those lines?

Mr. Sam Waide

I thank the Senator for the question. I will give an overarching answer to the question because there are a number of campaigns. To answer the Senator's question, we have considered such campaigns. We target different groups of road users in different campaigns. We specifically target those groups for different reasons. I am not suggesting for one moment that older persons take more medicated drug than younger persons because it happens across the spectrum. We work in a preventative and positive way. I mentioned earlier that we work with the likes of Age Friendly Ireland. We work in a positive way to enhance awareness for pedestrians and those who drive different vehicles. It is important, as Professor Cusack has highlighted.

I will pass over to my head of communications and campaigns, Mr. Brian Farrell, who is joining us via video link. He may wish to expand on specific campaigns and the areas about which the Senator has asked.

Mr. Brian Farrell

In answer to Senator Buttimer's question, we have campaigns that are aimed at addressing the problem of drug-driving on our roads. The campaigns are very much focused on digital and social media because that is where the target audience is that consumes media and where we need to be to deliver those messages. The campaigns we have at the moment and the videos we have deployed at the moment on social media aim to do three things. The first point is to raise awareness that the use of drugs causes impairment while driving. The second point is that gardaí now have the tools and devices at the roadside to test for these drugs and you cannot escape or evade those devices. They will detect your drug use if you are using drugs. The final point of the communication is to highlight that with a drug-driving conviction you face disqualification, that there are very real ramifications and consequences for you as an individual if you are disqualified and that this will have implications for your lifestyle and your job if you rely on your licence.

Mr. Brian Farrell

The campaign at the moment across digital and social media is very much targeting a younger audience across TikTok, Instagram and Snapchat, etc. It is across video-on-demand and YouTube as well.

Mr. Brian Farrell

We are definitely in that space with that message.

I thank Mr. Farrell. I compliment the RSA. Its advertising campaigns have been very effective and it should be commended on that.

I have a question for the assistant commissioner in the context of Deputy Lowry's intervention earlier, to which I think Superintendent Murphy replied. The Deputy made a very positive suggestion about meeting young people immediately after a night out, particularly in areas where they congregate like car parks, etc. It might be different in Dublin or Cork where there is probably no set meeting point but it is important. Deputy Lowry's contribution is something we should come back to as a committee to assist in further discussion on this issue. It is important to intervene earlier rather than later. I am aware we live in real time so we cannot get everything right but our guests might consider what the Deputy said. Having a checkpoint or speed van ten minutes out the road may be too late in some cases. That is one point.

A hobby horse of mine is the Cork to Dublin motorway. I am curious about it. As Members know, I travel on it every week. You could meet five speed checks with different varieties of speed camera or a garda with the gun or the car between Cork and Dublin. It baffles me that you could have between one and five speed checks on a road like that. I am curious about the number of accidents on the road and the number of fatalities. You could travel to different parts of the country on minor roads and meet nobody, even though the speed and the behaviour on those roads can be extraordinary. I am curious about the reasoning and rationale for the heavy presence, at times, on the motorway. Is there a reason for that?

Ms Paula Hilman

I thank the Senator for the question. We target both intercepting and non-intercept detections. I will hand over shortly to Superintendent O'Reardon, who can tell the Senator a bit more about what we are doing and the review we are undertaking of our GoSafe vans given what we have seen and the increase in fatalities. We are looking at and updating how we use the GoSafe vans to ensure they are in the areas where historically there have been collisions and both serious and fatal road traffic collisions. We are also now getting input from divisional officers and local gardaí about where they believe speeding is occurring.

Ms Paula Hilman

We want that local input. That is something we are going to do differently as well. Again, our own Garda members will be looking at what they see in their trends locally and what they know from a local basis. Obviously the Senator's experience has been that he has seen some of those on-----

I will give the assistant commissioner an example. Nine times out of ten I could leave here and drive out almost to Avoca in CityWest and there will be a speed van in a particular location. I could nearly bet my life on it. There is a reason I am asking the question. I am aware it is about analysis, but I would like to hear the analysis that informs what the Garda does. I can tell our guests where the Garda will potentially use a speed trap, if I can use that phrase, on the road. I am not against it, as they know, but it just baffles me that I can tell our guests the spots between here, Portlaoise, Abbeyleix, Tipperary, Kilkenny, Cork to Limerick and Tipperary down to Cork.

Ms Paula Hilman

In some ways that is the same as if you had static cameras as well. Static cameras are put in locations to change behaviours and reducing speed.

Ms Paula Hilman

Superintendent O'Reardon may want to go over some of the work that has been done with the GoSafe vans and the new locations we are going to introduce.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

I travel that road, although I do not have the pleasure of going all the way to Cork. I go to Thurles, County Tipperary where the fixed charge processing office is. I go there at least once a week and have been doing so since last October. I have probably done the journey 50 times or more. I understand what the Senator is saying about the location of vans. I agree with him.

At the moment, I get a daily report from GoSafe on its activity. We base the zones or the locations of GoSafe vans on three criteria, the first of which is accident locations. There is a points system to locate a GoSafe van in a particular area. The second thing is local knowledge from gardaí. We ask local gardaí to give us their input and say where they feel there is an issue, so we put vans in before the accident happens, as it were, as a preventative measure. The third thing is when local authorities contact us and say they have an issue in an area and provide some sort of analysis they have carried out. We then put a camera van in that location.

On the locations of vans, only 4% of GoSafe vans are allocated to motorways. With regional roads it is 55%, with national roads it is 26% and with local roads it is 9%. We have it broken down according to the actual accident statistics and the needs. In a motorway you are kind of trapped. The Senator is travelling that way very regularly. I am going the opposite direction. I am heading down the country in the mornings. I do not have the same perception. I see them on occasion but they are very effective in that what we are trying to do is tackle a culture. As the Senator says, it is not about catching people. It is about tackling the culture, so for example-----

I appreciate that now, to be fair.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Yes. It is funny. I am in the Garda and when I see a van I look at my speed and ensure I am not speeding but it is a culture, it is a-----

You are not the only one.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Yes. It is an important point.

This is the advantage of white vans.

You should check.

We could paint them all blue.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Some poor builder is broken down at the side of the road and we are panicking because we think we are being detected speeding. In all seriousness, GoSafe tells me we have a 99.5% compliance rate. I get the daily statistics from GoSafe every single day. We have monthly meetings with it where we set the criteria, set the parameters and agree them. At the moment we are rolling out new GoSafe zones nationally. We have exactly 1,312 zones and 1,491 sites where GoSafe locates. It currently has 54 vans operating nationally. We are now rolling out 225 new sites. We are ready today to pull the trigger on 87 sites. As soon as the new roster comes out with GoSafe, we are going to have those. We are splitting them up 50:50 between Dublin and the rest of the country.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

At the moment, as I said, 87 are ready to go. Every day I get the actual daily report from GoSafe and we can then set our policing strategy around the reports. We know from the statistics, because GoSafe breaks it down by zone. It is all done by county, by speed limit zone and the number of vehicles checked and the number detected. For example, for Tuesday of this week GoSafe was able to tell me it checked 110,000 vehicles. It only got-----

What does it mean when Superintendent O'Reardon says "checked"?

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Some 110,000 vehicles passed GoSafe's vans.

Did they pass its vans at different speeds?

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

They passed them at varying speeds. Of those checks, GoSafe vans made 389 detections. The figure sounds very low, but it is actually a very good news story, in that people are obeying the speed limit. That is what we want. GoSafe breaks it down for us, according to zones of 50 km/h, 60 km/h, 80 km/h, 100 km/h and 120 km/h. It also feeds into us-----

I will ask a question, out of curiosity, and it is fine if Superintendent O'Reardon does not have the data to respond. Does he have a figure for the number of people who are breaking the speed limit in a 120 km/h zone?

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Some seven people were detected breaking the speed limit, out of 8,251 detections.

How many people were detected in the other zones?

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

The following figures are just for Tuesday of this week. GoSafe vans checked 25,143 vehicles in a 50 km/h zone, out of which 144 people were over the limit. Of 18,638 vehicles checked in a 60 km/h zone, 102 were over the limit. Of 22,828 vehicles checked in a 80 km/h zone, 30 people were over the speed limit. Of 35,442 vehicles checked in a 100 km/h zone, 106 were over the limit. That is a daily breakdown. GoSafe also sends us the photographs of people who are 30 km/h over the limit. If there is evidence to suggest dangerous driving, we can take a separate course of action. We would pursue the individual who was doing 248 km/h for dangerous driving, as a preference.

I thank and applaud the members of the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau for the work they do every day. My questions were not a criticism. To be fair to members of An Garda Síochána, during Covid they were out on the checkpoints doing a job that many people did not want them to be there for. We should thank them today. I have, unfortunately, had to meet members of An Garda Síochána at accidents. Their professionalism and humanity, even though they have a very difficult job, is to be commended. We should dwell on Deputy Lowry's point. I wish to bring back Professor Cusack, in terms of the Sláinte agus Tiomáint report. It will be interesting. I thank the RSA for its work. We are all committed to the elimination of fatalities and to improving our behaviour on the roads.

With regard to the speed vans we see, not only on motorways, is the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau able to correlate its data, to see where the fatalities happen, for there to be known spots for speeding? A very high percentage of 29% of fatal road traffic collisions were reported to have had speeding as a contributory factor. When the Garda National Roads Policing Bureau does its forensic work, is it able to collate those data to show that there is a direct correlation between spots where there is speeding and those where accidents are happening in which there are fatalities?

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Originally, the vans were put in locations where accidents happened. There was a weighting factor. To get a van in an area, we had criteria of up to ten points. A fatal collision was nine points. A serious injury was six points to eight points. We got a zone based on the weighting factors. That was the original way, based on the analysis from our analysis service in terms of accidents. We have a map with the exact number of accidents throughout the country. All the locations are on our website for people to be aware of them in advance.

Senator Buttimer needs to look at the website before he asks a question.

I think the Senator devised the website.

Mr. Sam Waide

I will expand on what Superintendent O'Reardon said. It comes back to the question of location. It is my duty to flag to every member of the committee that with regard to the enforcement and location of vans, fixed cameras or other interventions in speed, serious injuries are part of the challenge in the strategy to make our roads safer. We know from historical data that the majority of serious injuries occur in urban areas. The challenge is not just about excessive speeding on rural roads and on motorways. It is also about speeding in built-up, urban areas. I stated in my opening statement that reducing serious injuries by 50%, from 1,259 to 630 or lower, is a significant challenge. It is about serious injuries, not just reducing fatalities.

Professor Denis Cusack

I support that, medically. I understand Deputy Lowry's question about 30 km/h zones. I was on the Continent last week, where I have seen it. Without going into the medical details, there is a considerable difference in injuries between a car impacting somebody at 15 km/h, 30 km/h or 45 km/h, especially with children. It is a very good way of reasoning it. Sometimes, sadly, we forget about the number of serious injuries, which can be five times the number of people killed. One only has to go to the National Rehabilitation Hospital on Rochestown Avenue to see young lives - perhaps it would be an understatement to say "blighted" - destroyed by paralysis. I support, from a medical point of view, trying to reduce speed to prevent serious injuries.

I join with what Senator Buttimer has said. I have met gardaí in all sorts of circumstances, for many a long year. The most recent time I met a garda was at 2 a.m., close to Lamb Doyles pub, when I was driving home. For the first time in 49 years, I was breathalysed. I am happy to say I passed, but it was a strange experience. I compliment the gardaí who are out on the beat and taking some of the abuse that they take.

Ms Hilman has blown me away with the statistics on the age spread. What was said is unbelievable. We are talking about teenagers right through to octogenarians. That is absolutely frightening. It sort of gives way to the lie that it is always young drivers who behave in this way. Clearly, it is not. I thank her for putting that on the record. It is very important.

My colleagues mentioned the speed control area on the Limerick to Dublin motorway. It is one of the greatest things that has been done in recent times. I do not know why it is not everywhere. I smile to myself when I am driving towards Limerick and some guy overtakes me at high speed. I think that he can fire away and that he is dead. I am sure there is a considerable change in behaviour on that stretch of road. I have to compliment the speed control area and I am sure we should have more of them.

On the downside, I ask those involved to stop parking the speed van on the N11, on the little slip road down to Stillorgan, because we all drive slowly down to it and then boot on afterwards, until we get down to-----

The Senator can speak for himself.

It seems a bit ridiculous to have a van there at 8.30 a.m., when traffic is bumper to bumper. I have no difficulty with checking traffic on the N11. Speed on that road is especially fast, but surely it is not at 8.30 a.m.

I complained some years ago about cyclists crashing the red light, because I was on the road. I did so on social media and, immediately, a challenge was put out to me to cycle around Dublin, which I did over three days. Two observations came out of that. One was that the drivers of heavy vehicles, such as buses and trucks, were extremely courteous to me as a cyclist. The other was that drivers of cars seem to compete at traffic lights. They were watching me and the lights. The moment the light turned green, they took off. Is there is a case to be made for a green light to come up for cyclists at every set of traffic lights, in order that they have the right of way a minute before cars?

I am just chucking that out there. Does the witness want me to stop there and answer that or will I keep going for the moment?

Mr. Thomas Murphy

I will reply to that. A scheme was brought in by Dublin City Council that was a light for a bicycle with the standard vehicle light. The bicycle green light got a ten-second head start so the bicycles could clear the junction. That is working quite well at the moment.

Would Superintendent Murphy recommend that throughout all the cities in the country?

Mr. Thomas Murphy

It is effective. It is down to the local authorities but we would be supportive of that measure, yes.

Reference was made earlier to e-scooters. I drive a car. If an e-scooter hits me at 20 km per hour, the rider is not insured and is not paying any road tax. He or she will certainly damage my car. That is the first point. The second point is that there is no safety equipment whatsoever involved when travelling on one of these things. I am sure that Professor Cusack would be interested to know that I have recently seen two children as pillion passengers on the board of one e-scooter. I understand that the Garda's hands are quite tied with regard to these issues at the moment. E-scooters are all over Europe and no matter what city one goes to there are e-scooters that one can use. The problem is that we have done away with all the hard work with regard to head protection for people who are on bicycles. Around Dundrum, Sandyford and other parts of that general area, I have seen people using unicycles: a guy standing up on a wheel. It is totally beyond me how one could control that. I understand there is difficulty with regard to e-scooters and the law. Is there a difficulty also around the use of a single wheel and the law?

Ms Paula Hilman

I thank the Senator. We were actually having a conversation here about the single-wheel question. We can certainly get back to the Senator on that, unless someone can come up with some knowledge on it.

With regard to the e-scooters, we have inputted feedback into the proposed legislation for e-scooters. We very much welcome regulation in this area as well. That would help all of us.

On the safety aspect, we have discussed this and I believe that Professor Cusack would like to come in on the helmet aspect. When we have the regulations it would be helpful to all of us and we look forward to that. We have had input on what we in An Garda Síochána feel is relevant to the ages of people who should be in charge of the scooters and riding them, and relevant to some safety measures around helmets. We have fed this into those who are designing the legislation.

On the carrying of pillion passengers, and especially very young children, two days ago I observed a woman with what looked to me like four-year-olds or five-year-olds up on the board of an e-scooter. Even if they never hit a car, if they hit a bump on the road the wheel is so small it is likely the children would be thrown. Is An Garda Síochána empowered to do something about that? It is clearly reckless behaviour.

Ms Paula Hilman

It is something we look at on a case-by-case basis currently. Aspects such as that can be provided for under proposed legislation, including being drunk while riding an e-scooter. We are also looking at other jurisdictions with a lot of the work we have done here. My colleagues took a trip recently to look at e-scooters and the experience in other jurisdictions where people have been detected drink driving. This would be very important as well.

Professor Denis Cusack

I gave about 50 papers summarising experiences from around Australia, Europe and the US. I can tell the committee about e-scooters. The Senator asked if there was anything we could ask the committee as legislators to help with. The evidence is for helmets, including a study in our own jurisdiction. Head injuries are devastating. E-scooters must have protective gear and particularly on the head. Studies in Europe have shown that alcohol and the use of e-scooters is a problem. More than one passenger is also an issue. Something else that I found surprising is that in two or three of the studies, which I recently presented to the Department of Transport, a significant number of injuries were of pedestrians.

Perhaps Professor Cusack would forward on those papers to the committee.

Professor Denis Cusack

Certainly. I have the papers and I have summarised five of them. A significant number of those pedestrians were older people who tripped over the e-scooters on the footpaths. I suggested to the Department they might consider legislating for it to be an offence not to park an e-scooter, be it rented or otherwise, in a safe position so as not to be a hazard or danger to others. It surprised me the number of pedestrians who were injured by falling over e-scooters. Some of the injuries were quite serious, and particularly for older people who are in serious trouble if they break an arm, a leg or a hip.

I have a lot of information on e-scooters. It is evidence-based about what we could do safely. In some of the jurisdictions they are now changing the law and bringing in helmets and looking at age limits. There was some advice as to whether or not there can be an age limit. E-scooters are here to stay. Let us make them safe and bring in evidence-based, medical prevention.

We recently had Committee Stage of the Road Traffic and Roads Bill. We asked that before the Bill comes back on Report Stage the Minister would look at the age limit. They are basically saying that we cannot limit for age for the purchase of an e-scooter. We have asked them to look at it again.

Perhaps Professor Cusack would send that on to us and to An Garda Síochána as well. As the witnesses are probably aware, the legislation is only framework legislation. It is not detailed legislation. It would come in by way of statutory instrument from the Minister directly. That body of work is yet to take place. The committee would like to contribute to that. The committee, the Road Safety Authority and An Garda Síochána would appreciate any paper that Professor Cusack has on the subject.

Professor Denis Cusack

I will send that on. Deputy Lowry is gone but I will also forward the information on the EU regulation for alcolocks, which actually applies from next Wednesday, 6 July.

What are the implications for Ireland with regard to cars and to a timeframe?

Professor Denis Cusack

As the Chairman will be aware, European Union directives and regulations are applied at a certain date, and then each country has quite a number of years to actually implement them. It is then retrospective. For the new fleet of cars we may be looking at ten or 15 years, but we are getting there. The National Office for Traffic Medicine has set up its own working group to look at it medically. We have worked with the RSA on this and there has been progress on action No. 23 for alcolocks. Again, perhaps this is something the legislators can help us with positively over the next year or two.

Most Garda drivers who are in vehicles are fully trained and trained to the highest standard. I am familiar with the fact that every now and then there is a car chase, and especially in cities. Garda drivers are skilled at what they do and they know how to handle a vehicle. Unfortunately, the people they are chasing are not skilled and do not know how to handle a vehicle. Are there any statistics as to how many of those car chases finished up in an accident? Were there fatalities? Is there a better way to stop these thugs, for want of a better description?

Ms Paula Hilman

We do not have the figures with us. It is certainly something we could look at. We do have a policy in relation to containment and pursuit. That is currently being reviewed. Superintendent Murphy is in charge of reviewing that policy and around all decisions we make in relation to actions that we take, including our own drivers and the control rooms. We need to ensure that the people in our control rooms who are managing the pursuit are given the appropriate training. We are currently looking at that.

All decisions are made around threat, risk, Article 2 issues, and how we use the decision-making model for what is the right thing to do at that time, taking all of the circumstances into account. This would include the road, the weather conditions, the number of pedestrians, and how built up an area is. All of that needs to be taken into account in the decisions that need to be made about the continuance of the pursuit and how one manages the pursuit. We also have stinger devices that we can put out along the road. Our Garda members are trained in that. We can use those to stop the vehicles. There are various things we are doing. Perhaps Superintendent Murphy would like to add to that. I am aware that the superintendent is reviewing that policy.

Mr. Thomas Murphy

We are just looking around Europe now to see what other equipment our neighbouring police forces are using that are similar to the stinger devices in order to slow or stop chases so they can come to a safe halt.

We were told at a recent meeting there was a significant number of people caught and charged by the Garda Síochána but it was not possible to enforce the outcome of a court hearing because of a failure in having the correct address or the person did not turn up in court. I cannot remember the exact statistic but apparently a significant number of people have been disqualified from driving but are still driving around the place because their licence was never presented in court. They did not present themselves in court. Is there random checking of people's licences on the road and would gardaí know immediately, on checking a licence, that a person is banned?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

We have a database of disqualified drivers and we can detect them. We have the power to demand production of a driving licence or certificate of insurance or exemption. We conduct checkpoints like that very regularly. We have number plate recognition technology which would alert us to people potentially driving without a driving licence.

If a person is disqualified in court, how long does it take for gardaí to get notification of the disqualification? How long before it comes to the system? Is there talk of an electronic transfer system being put in place so that if somebody is disqualified in court, it would go straight to the system and gardaí on patrol could see straight away if a person is disqualified. Is there a time lag?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

There is a slight time lag but we are working very closely with the Courts Service and the Road Safety Authority around the transfer of data so we can have access to real-time data, which is the ultimate aim. All our Garda roads policing members have a mobility app and a phone and they can get all the data on the roadside. There is a strong drive with ourselves, the Department of Transport and the criminal justice fixed charge working group to get that transfer of data sorted out. We are making good progress on it.

How long will that take?

Mr. Sam Waide

Building on what the chief superintendent has said, there is a specific action within the strategy. I welcome the opportunity to raise this because I can go back to the earlier question of how the Deputies and Senators as a committee can help. The road traffic Bill was referred to by the Chairman and one of the items in Part 3 is linking the licensed drivers to registered vehicles. That will assist in the enforcement of the people who demonstrate poor behaviour and break the law. It will also assist An Garda Síochána in identifying drivers correctly against penalty points.

I will touch on some other parts of the Bill and I ask the committee to support the legislation. There are elements of antisocial and dangerous off-road use of scramblers and I know it has been discussed previously. A member of the committee mentioned insurance earlier and in Part 4 of the Bill there is a technical amendment that will allow vehicle insurers to share details of policy cover with members of An Garda Síochána in real time. Finally, part of the Bill deals with uninsured vehicles. We know from evidence and research that uninsured vehicles are more likely to engage in riskier and potentially dangerous behaviour on the roads. Part of the Bill will enable us to get that shared information from insurers. Insurance Ireland is a delivery partner within the road safety strategy.

We touched on the final part of the Bill in detail earlier and it deals with speed. It considers the varying of speed limits, primarily on the M50. As An Garda Síochána colleagues indicated earlier, we have looked at other countries and visited other jurisdictions to look at the varying of speed limits not just to change the behaviour of drivers in order to be safer but in order to link to weather conditions, for example. In Madrid, for example, the varying of speed limits is linked to pollution levels. There are a number of items in the Bill that I ask the committee to support.

On the question of the varying of speed, I had to pass through Kilreekil before I had a motorway to go to Galway. One could drive at 100 km/h and shortly before the village this was dropped to 60 km/h, and less than 100 yd later this dropped again to 50 km/h. It seemed a little crazy that one would slow to hit 60 km/h but a person could be breaking the speed limit because of the short distance between the limits.

This is pertinent on rural roads. As Senators, we travel every road in the country to meet our electorate and I really try to work out in my head some of the speed limits. There are 100 km/h limits on sections where nobody would do the speed but on others there is a limit of 80 km/h on stretches that seem perfectly safe for a slightly faster speed. I digress.

There was a problem where if people did not receive a notice of a road traffic violation, the person would be called to court. That would happen where the fine was not paid. If people had not received the notice properly, the case would be struck out. Has the Garda done anything to improve the delivery of notices of breaches of traffic law and stop this happening?

Ms Paula Hilman

We have monthly reports managing the performance around the service of summonses. That includes personal service and use of the postal service. We use both methods. We continue to monitor the work in this area. There are figures for the number of fixed charges paid and they may be of interest to the Senator.

Mr. Sean O'Reardon

Between 70% and 75% of the overall notices are paid straight away. A person has up to 28 days to pay and there is another option to pay up to day 56 at an increased penalty. A further 8% generally pay at that stage. There is another option to pay up to a week before going to court and another 4% pay then. I have statistics for the past few years and, on average, 88% are paid prior to court and only 12% go to court. These are the statistics for speeding offences from the fixed charge processing office in Tipperary. It takes in the work of GoSafe vans and gardaí.

I hope the GoSafe vans are self-financing at this stage. I thank the witnesses for being here and particularly Professor Cusack for his input. I compliment the work of the Road Safety Authority and the work it does is fantastic. Driving in this country has changed over the past 45 or 50 years in an amazing way. Everybody here does a great job and I hope I do not meet any of them breaking a speed limit in the near future.

To take up Senator Craughwell's point, one could be travelling at 100 km/h before coming to a 60 km/h limit at Lissard in Cork. Is there a thought process around going from 100 km/h in a graded way to 80 km/h and then a speed appropriate to a village like Lissard? It is a fair point.

In the tunnel in Limerick on the way to Clare one goes from 120 km/h to 100 km/h to 80 km/h.

Deputy Matthews is being very patient.

Sorry. My other question is about road rage. Has there been an increase in road rage leading to accidents and fatalities? I did not realise Deputy Matthews was waiting.

Mr. Sam Waide

I will take that first aspect of the question and then pass over to An Garda Síochána. On the speed review and graduation, as part of the strategy, there is an action to review speeds limits, and not just the 30 km/h limit. The working group in that regard includes representation from the local councils. The guidance is being reviewed. Earlier today the road safety transformation partnership board discussed the graduation of going from 100 km/h to 80 km/h to 60 km/h limits. That is under review as part of the strategy.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

There is a speed limit appeals panel on which I sit with representatives of Transport Infrastructure Ireland and local authorities. We consider, upon request, various appeals that come in from around the country to adjust the speed limit in areas where it may be appropriate to do so.

Ms Paula Hilman

Regarding road rage, there may be individual cases that have occurred, but we have not seen patterns of behaviour that have escalated or been raised to our level of attention. No, we have not seen that.

I will take the last hour if the Chair does not mind.

A bonus point.

I thank the witnesses for attending. I echo what others have said, and thank them for the work they do in trying to improve road safety and in the context of all their other tasks. It is quite a balancing act for the Garda to deal with all the crime issues as well as to deal with road safety. I know it is a constant battle, and we appreciate all they do.

In dealing with road safety, the committee has given extensive consideration to issues relating to national routes, speeding and fatalities. I will concentrate on urban areas and on areas in which lower speed limits apply and where there are difficulties. Representatives from the Love 30 campaign came before the committee - Mr. Waide was present at that meeting - and we discussed 30 km/h zones in urban areas. I want to concentrate on urban areas.

We have seen the figures relating to fatalities. Do we also collate all the figures for injuries in respect of which hospitalisation was required and injuries where it was not required but where the incidents that occurred were reported to the Garda? Professor Cusack said that strategy needs to be evidence-based. I would like to pull all that evidence together. Do we collate the detail relating to incidents where: a cyclist is struck by a vehicle; there is a near miss that causes an accident and it is reported to the Garda, a cyclist sustains an injury and goes to hospital or to a doctor; a cyclist has to be out of work for more than three days and the matter is has to be reported to the Health and Safety Authority? The latter only relates to injuries sustained at work. Do we collate that detail for pedestrians as well? Is all the data pulled together in one place?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Yes, all collisions reported to us are recorded through our computer-aided dispatch, CAD, system and are collated on the Garda PULSE system. We have many categories-----

How many cyclists have been struck by a vehicle this year?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

I do not have that figure with me.

But An Garda Síochána could provide it because it is recorded.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Yes. Where incidents are reported, the PULSE system will contain the data.

Any time a cyclist ends up in hospital because of a collision or a near miss in which he or she, having taken corrective action, fell off the bike and sustained an injury, is that reported to the Garda? Where is that information held?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

If it is reported to the Garda, the information is held on PULSE.

Mr. Sam Waide

The question is about when someone presents at an accident and emergency department and has an injury. There is a lot of data in the health space and there is a project that RSA is working on at present. I will pass to the head of research, Ms Velma Burns, who can expand on what happens with that data and information.

Could Ms Burns tell me the different areas from where that information is pulled, such as hospitals and Garda records? Are there any other data sources?

Ms Velma Burns

First, we have access to data sets from PULSE. That is our primary source of information on serious incidents.

Is that only Garda information?

Ms Velma Burns

Yes. That data comes to us, which we have a statutory responsibility to collate information. We also have an official reporting duty regarding those statistics. That data is only based on serious injuries that are reported to An Garda Síochána, which is an important distinction. Cyclists were mentioned. We know that the vast majority of cyclist casualties in the police data involve another vehicle. The figure is over 80% of those incidents. But we did go-----

Very few of those incidents involve cyclists crashing by themselves. Some 80% of incidents are because of another vehicle or a third party.

Ms Velma Burns

Yes, very few of those occur when a cyclist falls off a bike, which is called a single-cyclist injury or collision. We know from international studies that there are quite a lot more incidents of single-cyclist collisions that are not reported to the police but the cyclists do present to a hospital. Hospital data will show single-cyclist injuries, some of which might be quite severe injuries. In light of the complexity of all of this, we are working with the HSE and Trinity College Dublin on a three-way collaboration. This project commenced in the past three months. We are getting access to hospital data sets to look specifically at serious injuries, to compare the results and identify where there are gaps.

I thank Ms Burns for that and apologise for interrupting, but we are on time limits and I have a lot to get through.

Professor Denis Cusack

There is a problem-----

I agree completely with Professor Cusack about that.

Professor Denis Cusack

-----in terms of the HSE and different hospitals. The Irish Association for Emergency Medicine has brought this up. The problem is now being tackled. There is a deficiency in getting that information about injuries together. There is a system called hospital inpatient enquiry, HIPE, as well as others within the health service. It is now about how we bring all of these together into one place. It would be wrong to say that we are there. No, we are not.

It is exactly about this thing that if you cannot measure or monitor something, you cannot manage it. I also pose the same question regarding pedestrians, and not just cyclists, in the context of incidents where pedestrians were injured or had to step back because a car zoomed by them. These are all indicators that under another set of circumstances, different weather or lighting conditions, one split-second difference in any of these could add another fatality to the statistics. The statistics on fatalities are horrific for every single family. No one can understand what it means unless he or she is part of family that has been affected by it. The statistics that show near misses and incidents are indicators that action needs to be taken on it. Does the RSA follow up on those incidents? Is that part of an action number in the RSA strategy?

Mr. Sam Waide

Yes. As Professor Cusack highlighted, it far from completed because it is very complex. It is about the incidents we know about, where someone presents at an accident and emergency department and provide the information to say that an incident happened as opposed to just presenting with a broken limb and saying nothing else.

Chief Superintendent Hennebry mentioned that this requires behavioural change. I say to people that if they are involved in an incident, to report it to the Garda. The response I often hear is that the Garda will not do anything or that the matter will not be followed up. That is a flippant and off-the-cuff remark. am not saying that gardaí do not follow up because I know they have done so in some cases. That perception is out there, however. I encourage people at all times to report cars that are parked on footpaths, double yellow lines or in cycle lanes. How many fixed-charge notices have gardaí issued in respect of people parking in cycle lanes in the past year or two? I do not expect the witnesses to have that information off the top of their heads, but it is information I would like followed up on. When will the pulling together of complex data be completed in order that we can develop good indicators that there are road safety issues which may not be recorded in easily read statistics?

Mr. Sam Waide

At a minimum, it is an 18-month project. That is in light of the number of entities and facilities across the whole health service.

It is a massive challenge. When we get there it will inform better intervention. My understanding of the coding of the information is that, and my colleague Ms Burns can confirm this, it will allow us to compare with other countries where there is a standardised coding of serious injuries.

Can I follow up on that? Is it publicly available information? Are we able to look at roads and see where fatalities are recorded? Is that a publicly accessible piece of information? That you can analyse a road and find out-----

Mr. Sam Waide

In terms of location, we have historical legacy data. I will refer to my colleague Ms Burns on the availability of that information.

Is that available publicly?

Ms Velma Burns

We publish aggregated reports on fatalities and injuries. We have tables published on our website. We have aggregated information, but we do not have record-level information available. There are challenges associated with sharing that record-level data, in terms of GDPR.

I understand that.

Ms Velma Burns

However, certainly, aggregated data is available.

Is there a mechanism being looked at whereby we can protect certain personal information related to those latest incidents and accidents but can still provide the information to members of the public to say that an incident occurred here that resulted in a fatality? I would expand that by saying that an incident recorded here was reported to An Garda Síochána and it was a near-miss strike, a minor or major injury or a hospitalisation. We need to build up a pattern if we are to deal with the situation. People need to realise how many of these near misses are happening out there. It is happening regularly, and it is not getting reported.

Ms Velma Burns

On a point of clarification, we do not have access to data on near misses at all. We receive information on incidents that have occurred. These are both serious and minor road traffic collisions. That is our remit. We do have, and maybe this is what the Deputy is alluding to, information on material damage collisions, which are also recorded on those. We receipt those. We do not do detailed analysis on those. Our remit is to look at collisions where an injury has occurred. As such, we do not have data on near misses.

I suggest that it would be helpful for someone to report a near miss and for it to be recorded somewhere centrally. If I ring Bray Garda Station to say that someone has nearly run me off the Dublin Road on my bike, it can be properly recorded in Bray Garda Station. However, if that happened in Wexford, Cork or Limerick, is there a central point whereby we say, “this year we had 15,000 near misses reported”? We should record the locations and build up a pattern. It is only about building up----

Ms Velma Burns

That is a valid point. The TII does conduct analysis on near misses.

The TII is for motorways, which is a matter of vehicle near misses with each other. I am talking about the cyclist who is on the local authority road, the national route and in the urban centres. Where do we record that information? How are we building up a profile of driver behaviour and interactions between cyclists and motorists? I see it daily as I walk around the place. I am sure that everybody else does as well. These are incidences that, under a different set of circumstances, could result in a fatality or in a life-changing injury.

Ms Paula Hilman

I thank the Deputy for his support when he says he encourages people to please report this to An Garda Síochána. That is exactly what we want.

I have been listening to what the Deputy has been saying about the near misses specifically in relation to cyclists. Under the road safety strategy there is an action about the online reporting portal. We are working towards this. We are supportive of that. It will be dependent on legislation and the financing of an IT strategy. We looked at international best practice in this area. We still need the person to report the matter to us. It will not be a matter of someone uploading a video from a dashcam or camera. It needs to be followed up with a report. The person will get a link and then we will investigate. It is important for managing expectations that people understand that even when we get through the financing and legislation in this area, it still will not be a matter of a report to An Garda Síochána. They will get a link to upload their footage. In the intervening period ahead of that, we were asked what we can do differently now, because 85 people were tragically killed on our roads. What can we do in the here and now? We are going to reinvigorate our traffic-watch process. Over recent years the reports of our traffic watch have declined. In quarter three we will do some media around this to reinvigorate that. We are going to align that. We have our regional control centres. We are now going to be doing the reports in a different way internally so that we can manage this. The reports will come through to the control centres. This means that if something in live time that we potentially need to look at, for example, a person whose driving is erratic or who is a potentially drink or drug driver, it can be dealt with in live time, or we can have a follow up-----

I think An Garda Síochána have the national roads, routes and motorways well managed. I see patrol cars on them. I am worried about the urban centres.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes.

In the opening statement by An Garda Síochána, it said that there is approximately a 5% policing personnel time to roads. Is that correct?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

That is it.

Can An Garda Síochána break that down into how much of that time is spent on the national routes and the motorways, as opposed to the urban centres, in order to deal with what is probably considered by many people to be minor? This includes, for example, a car that is parked on a footpath during the time in which children are going to school. That would push a child who is on a bike out into the roadway and into an unsafe situation. All those things should be included. Of the 5% that is allocated to roads policing, how much of is it done in the neighbourhood?

Ms Paula Hilman

Our local policing, as well as the gardaí, can enforce that. Much of the work they do is engaging with schools. We encourage people to report that. It is an interesting point when we look at how we use technology for traffic management. It may not be able to assist in individual cases, such as in certain schools or some locations, but for example, in other jurisdictions, if you drive in a bus lane, there are cameras for enforcing that. It is therefore not reliant on An Garda Síochána.

I take the point that An Garda Síochána does not just want people to send in a photograph. They need to complete the proper paperwork. Would they support an online portal whereby people can upload this information, such as the photographs they take of infringements, the dashcam footage and helmet cam footage that cyclists wear? This would even provide an indicator. It would not be for taking a prosecution on it. If An Garda Síochána is getting 30 reports on the Dublin Road on a bend, for example, that that is where cyclists are having clips, side swipes or potential side swipes of cyclists, then it will then know that this is a hot spot. The local authority will then know that it has to do something there. An Garda Síochána should be using them as indicators rather than as evidence for taking a prosecution. I know that prosecutions can be important. However, when we deal with the indicators, we know that there is a problem here. Would An Garda Síochána support that type of citizen engagement and citizen reporting that is not for prosecution but purely as a-----

A preventative measure.

Ms Paula Hilman

I will hand over to Chief Hennebry. He will cover that. However, in terms of schools or locations like that for example, where we want that to happen, and it does happen, is for people to engage with community policing teams. We see that whereby people will say that cars are speeding outside their school or are parking there. The community policing team will task roads policing to go to that. Schools are therefore more straightforward. Does Chief Hennebry want to cover-----

Can I comment on that for one second as well? I reiterate the thanks we all have for the work that they do.

On a daily basis, I see gardaí walking by cars that are parked in cycle lanes and on footpaths. I had an interaction with a garda recently whereby a car was parked on a cycle lane and had two of its wheels on a kerb. I said to the garda, “Is that illegal and can you prosecute it?” I will not relay the conversation that unfolded because I do not think that he is representative of An Garda Síochána. However, An Garda Síochána talks about behavioural change. People need to see a zero-tolerance out there for what are perceived as minor parking infringements that create safety hazards for people. It is unacceptable. We are moving more to a society of active travel. We are spending a lot of money on active travel. We are spending a lot of money on trying to encourage people to walk, to cycle to school, on safe routes to school and cycleways.

We need to shift the balance and stop this allowance of bad driving behaviour. Drivers park on the path so as to keep the road free. They are imposing on the most vulnerable people - children, elderly people walking on the footpath, wheelchair users - because they want to keep the carriageway free for cars. A whole shift in perception is required to shift the balance back away from car dominance.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Action 29 is the online portal action. We are looking at international best practice. We are looking abroad to see how the online portal is working there. We are developing a digital evidence management system within An Garda Síochána and we envisage that the online portal will form part of that. We have resources afforded to that.

Our initial learnings from our near neighbours in the area of the online portal would suggest that it is contingent on the reporting person making a report or following it up by way of supporting a prosecution. We are looking very closely at it. It is one of the actions that we are looking at.

I appreciate that. It is good to hear. When gardaí ticket a car for a parking offence, there is not always a visual sign of that as a ticket is not put on the windscreen any more. A lot of people see cars parked and they do not see a ticket, so there is a perception that no policing is being done. Would the Garda consider a sticker saying a person has been ticketed so that other people would not do it, as people follow behaviour?

Mr. Thomas Murphy

That suggestion has been made by members of the Garda themselves. We are looking at going back to the issuing of the yellow label to notify members of the public and other gardaí that a ticket has been issued.

In response to what Deputy Matthews mentioned earlier about bus lanes and cycle lanes as well, we had worked closely with the Department of Transport teams on co-ordinating the technology behind the issuing of FCNs in line with the statutory instrument, in order to dovetail the two of them together given that the fines were recently doubled for parking in those areas.

I urge the Garda, with its experience, and Professor Cusack and Mr. Waide to come back to us as a committee and tell us which parts of the legislation are problematic in terms of doing the things they want to do to improve road safety. They are the kinds of things we will work on.

Thank you for the time, a Chathaoirligh. My final point is for Professor Cusack. In terms of scooters and people falling over them, I would fully support road space allocation so that we could have proper sheltered parking spaces for cyclists, e-bikes and scooters. We have allocated thousands of kilometres of public space for cars to park. We need to do the same for e-scooters and bikes and then we will avoid that trip hazard because at the moment they have no choice. People have to try to tie their bike or scooter to a lamp post or something like that. Professor Cusack's point is a valid one. It is something that was raised with us previously by disability groups as well when we were looking at the roads Bill.

I want to discuss data in my own time. Could the witnesses explain the difference between "road death totals" and "fatal road collisions"? What is the difference? For instance, in 2021, there were 136 road deaths and 123 fatal road collisions. Does the "fatal road collisions" total involve a car whereas the balance, which is 13, relates to pedestrians and others?

Ms Paula Hilman

Or multiple people could be killed in a collision.

The difference between the two totals is 13. The total for road deaths was 136 and the total for fatal road collisions was 123. What is the difference?

Mr. Thomas Murphy

In the recent motorcycle collision on the M50, for example, there were two fatalities but one collision.

Okay. Of the 83 deaths that took place, there were 17 motorcyclists, ten passengers, 41 drivers, 12 pedestrians and two cyclists. How many of those involved one car, as distinct from two cars?

Ms Paula Hilman

There were 48 single-vehicle accidents.

Some 48 were single-vehicle accidents.

Ms Paula Hilman

They were single-vehicle accidents with a single death. There was one collision involving a single vehicle with multiple deaths.

So that is 49 of the 83 that involved a single car. I should be able to calculate the difference in my head.

Ms Paula Hilman

The total of multiple-vehicle collisions with a single death was 29. There were two multiple-vehicle collisions with multiple deaths. That adds to 80 collisions, which is the number of collisions we have had this year. There were 83 deaths from the 80 collisions.

That does not take account of life-changing injuries in those cases. There could be one death and several people's lives destroyed.

I wish to get down to the nuts and bolts. That means that 49 of the 80 collisions involved just one car. If it involved just one car, therefore the likelihood is that speed must have been a factor.

Ms Paula Hilman

Or sometimes it is medical.

Or drink and drugs.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes.

We have the statistics for last year, 2021. When we look at speed, drink and drugs, what was the key commonality among the factors?

Ms Paula Hilman

I do not think we have that information, but we could get it.

That is important to me. What was the profile of the eight people who were killed on roads on the bank holiday? These are human beings.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes.

I want to get an idea of whether they were young or old. Was there a similar breakdown between motorcyclists and other road users? What was their profile?

Ms Paula Hilman

We have that information. There were six collisions in 2022 resulting in eight fatalities.

There were six collisions and that resulted in eight deaths. Were they all in cars?

Ms Paula Hilman

No. There were three drivers, three motorcyclists, one passenger and one pedestrian. The figures for 2019 were the same.

Was that on the bank holiday weekend?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes, on the same bank holiday weekend in June.

In 2019, there were also eight fatalities.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes. There were six collisions and eight fatalities.

My god. So there is something about that bank holiday weekend. Going back to Senator Buttimer's point, 2019 is probably the best contrast because it was pre-Covid and while we are not exactly post-Covid the situation has improved in that regard.

Ms Paula Hilman

I could also-----

There is commonality here. That is the point I want to get at.

Ms Paula Hilman

I also have the number of people who were seriously injured.

Was it six collisions in which the eight fatalities were involved in 2019? How many were drivers?

Ms Paula Hilman

Four.

How many were motorcyclists?

Ms Paula Hilman

None. There were two pedestrians, one passenger and one pedal cyclist.

I am almost there. I looked at the statistics for the previous four years. Percentage-wise, drivers and passengers are more or less the same. It is dreadful to have statistics like this and to be even quoting them. The number of motorcyclists is up considerably, by 20% this year alone. The number of motorcycle fatalities for this year so far is 17 while it was 21 for the entire year last year. For six months of the year, we have more or less the same figure. What was the profile? Were they male or female, young or old, single collisions or multiple collisions? What was the situation? I notice a discernible increase in the number of motorcyclists on the roads at the moment. They are doing serious speed on the motorways and driving in twos and threes. That is something I observe. Could Ms Hilman give me the statistics in that regard please?

Ms Paula Hilman

The motorcyclists range in age from the youngest in the 16 to 20 age group right up to the 66 to 70 age group. They are broken down across the groups.

Could Ms Hilman give me a quick run through of the ages and the numbers?

Ms Paula Hilman

There was one in the 16 to 20 age group, one in the 21 to 25 age group; two in the 26 to 30 age group; one in the 31 to 35 age group; two in the 36 to 40 age group; one in the 41 to 45 age group; two in the 46 to 50 age group; zero in the 51 to 55 age group; two in the 56 to 60 age group; four in the 60 to 65 age group and one in the 66 to 70 age group.

My God. The one thing that has come out of our deliberations today is that it is a myth that fatalities entirely involve people in a much younger age group. That is not the situation unfolding. Is that a fair comment?

Ms Paula Hilman

It is.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

These are the fatalities. We are not attributing blame.

Ms Paula Hilman

We are not.

We are not. I am just making the point. Of the incidents relating to the 83 fatalities, how many of the other parties involved were not fatally injured? Ms Hilman has already given me a statistic. Some 48 accidents involved single vehicles and 29 involved multiple vehicles. Of the balance of 49, how many of the collisions were not fatal. With regard to the incidents were people crashed and were killed, especially the multiple-vehicle collisions, others could have been the cause of the accident and may not have been fatally injured. We are only getting part of the picture.

What I am getting out of this discussion is that it happens across all the age groups. There is a discernible increase in fatalities among motorcyclists. The bank holiday weekend, based on 2019 and this year, is a clear crisis point. What can be done for the future, in terms of other bank holiday weekends, that is different from what was done last bank holiday weekend? Will Ms Hilman expand a little more on what An Garda Síochána will do differently and on the other policies it is going to bring in from here on?

We are looking at a situation whereby there have been 83 fatalities. Ironically, the number of fatalities this year, on the same time last year, is up 63%. The number of fatalities this year is already at 63% of the number for last year. The increase from this time last year is two thirds. Fatalities are already at two thirds of what they were last year, and we are only halfway through the year. What will be done?

Professor Cusack made reference to the fact that Ireland is the second highest in terms of drug use. I ask that he deal with that matter first. He made a reference to Ireland having the second-highest drug use among drivers. I did not quite catch what he said.

Professor Denis Cusack

I referred to the use of drugs in society. That is one point I want to make. With the increase of drug use-----

Is Ireland the second highest?

Professor Denis Cusack

It is, but this use is not directly related to cars.

I accept that.

Professor Denis Cusack

Ireland has the second-highest use of drugs, ecstasy and cocaine, in the European countries studied.

During what year?

How many countries were studied?

I do not really want to go into detail.

Professor Denis Cusack

The countries were studied between 2011 and 2019.

When Ms Hilman is answering the question, will she give me a statistic for what has been the increase in detection of drink- and drug-driving? An Garda Síochána does fantastic work, but Ms Hilman will appreciate that we have a role as a committee to ask the questions. What has been the change in the detection rate for alcohol and drugs for the first six months of this year relative to last year?

Ms Paula Hilman

I will finish my answer on the bank holiday weekend. In terms of the fatalities, there were 13 people seriously injured over the bank holiday weekend.

That is 21 people.

Ms Paula Hilman

There were 20 people seriously injured in 2019.

That is 28 people. We will get rid of the statistic about drugs and alcohol first. I will then go into the substantive issue of the bank holiday weekend and what will be done differently. How can we assist An Garda Síochána in terms of legislation?

Ms Paula Hilman

I will look at drink-driving generally and then I will come on to the bank holiday, because it is interesting. If we look at January to June of this year, which is six months, we have detected and arrested 2,649 people who were drink-driving and we have arrested 1,533 people for drug-driving. If we compare that with 2019-----

Is Ms Hilman talking about a six-month period in 2019?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes. I will compare with a six-month period in 2019 because it is more comparable than the years of Covid. We arrested 2,911 people who were drink-driving.

That is a reduction.

Ms Paula Hilman

It is a reduction of 9%. We arrested 1,092 people who were drug-driving. This year's figures represent an increase of 40%.

Does An Garda Síochána have many more machines on the go? Those figures came through road policing and community engagement. Is that correct?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes. Some 43 devices were on the roadside in 2020 and into 2021. The Medical Bureau of Road Safety released some of the station-bound machines. We have more mobile machines in order that our members can detect at the roadside.

We have Chief Superintendent Gerard Roche and the joint policing committees in Limerick. I always follow the statistics. The drug side of them is going up exponentially.

Ms Paula Hilman

It is.

I ask Ms Hilman to talk about the bank holiday. It is quite amazing. There are a total of 21. There were eight fatalities and 13 serious injuries. In 2019, there were eight fatalities and 20 serious injuries. It is the exact same number of fatalities. What is happening?

Ms Paula Hilman

In partnership with the RSA and, at times, the Medical Bureau of Road Safety, we always do a media campaign ahead of a bank holiday. We said we would focus on the morning after on the weekend of St. Patrick's Day. We detected people drinking the morning after. We also did a campaign at Easter about staying safe on our roads. There was a considerable amount of activity that June bank holiday. I will give the committee some examples.

Is that the bank holiday just gone?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes, it is the bank holiday just gone. This year, we arrested 114 people for drink-driving on the bank holiday weekend. In 2019, we arrested 115, so it is very much on a par.

That is amazing.

Ms Paula Hilman

In 2019, we arrested 32 people for drug-driving and in 2022, we arrested 69 people.

That is double.

Ms Paula Hilman

It is an increase of 116%. When we say visible, out-on-the-road enforcement, there was considerable enforcement that bank holiday weekend. We also did additional media campaigning.

How many of those were single-vehicle collisions? I apologise. Ms Hilman has already given me a figure on that, in fairness.

Ms Paula Hilman

We need to be very careful. The media we did around the bank holiday weekend was talking about general road safety messaging, because we need to carry out the investigation.

I ask Ms Hilman to explain. With all the measures An Garda Síochána puts in place, how many speeding detections did it make?

Ms Paula Hilman

In total?

Ms Paula Hilman

I can break them down into intercept and non-intercept.

No, I wish to know about the bank holiday weekend.

Ms Paula Hilman

We made 2,599 detections on the bank holiday weekend.

How many were made in 2019?

Ms Paula Hilman

Some 1,762 were made. The figure for 2022 is an increase of 48%.

An Garda Síochána is doing all of this very good policing work.

Why then did we have eight fatalities and 13 serious injuries on the roads? We have to ask the hard questions. It is not personal. As public representatives, we are duty-bound to ask those questions.

Ms Paula Hilman

I do not think anyone sets out to be involved in a fatal traffic collision. Even over that weekend and despite the fact that we did additional media work, we could see what was happening. We appealed to everyone to take care on the roads, especially on the Monday because we knew people would be driving back home. We were looking carefully at what was happening that weekend. Without making judgments, each of the collisions is subject to thorough investigation by the forensic collision investigators and the investigating officers. It comes back to what Chief Superintendent Hennebry talked about regarding our messaging. We need more people within communities saying "Let us look out for one another and let us change behaviours". The focus of the Slow Down campaign we launched on Monday is that we all have a responsibility for road safety. We all need to look out for one another. By all of us slowing down, we can help reduce the numbers of people being killed or seriously injured on our roads. We have looked at some of the collisions.

Is Ms Hilman referring to the bank holiday weekend?

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes, but I am very conscious that the incidents are still subject to investigation.

And the families-----

Ms Paula Hilman

It would be fair to say that enforcement would not have prevented some of the collisions or the circumstances in which a number of the collisions occurred.

What does Ms Hilman mean by that?

Ms Paula Hilman

We stopped using the term "road traffic accident". We now use the term "road traffic collision". In some of the cases, there may have been a split second of inattention that had devastating consequences. We know that lifesaving behaviours involve reducing speed, people not drink- or drug-driving and wearing seat belts.

Ms Hilman provided statistics on the percentages involving speeding, under investigation and intoxication. Is there are a breakdown of what the eight cases involved?

Ms Paula Hilman

In terms of their age?

No not in terms of age, but what was the cause of the accident.

Ms Paula Hilman

Not at this time. It is too early.

Will Ms Hilman indicate what can be done differently? Were they freak accidents over the bank holiday weekend? Were they preventable? What can be done differently now to get to a point where we do not have road collision fatalities?

Ms Paula Hilman

I think it is the approach we have taken in terms of education, enforcement and prevention, and there is the media aspect as well. We will continue with that. For example - and this is not just on the bank holiday weekend - but County Meath has had the greatest number of road deaths. On one day in Meath alone, we did a great campaign with all the schoolchildren using the RSA and the simulator device. We brought in all the schoolchildren and did a road safety campaign with them. On the same morning, we attended a conference with Age Friendly Ireland to talk to older drivers. We need to keep looking at what the data is telling us and engaging with all the age groups, both in terms of the prevention message and the engagement on social media and regular media, groups and anyone who can help get the message out about road safety.

I know this is a hard question, but in the context of the eight incidents over the bank holiday weekend and the 13 serious injuries that occurred, how many involved drink and drugs?

Ms Paula Hilman

We could not say that at the moment. It is too soon.

We have to ask the question because it is quite extraordinary that we had the same figure, eight fatalities, on both the 2019 bank holiday weekend and this year's bank holiday weekend. There were also 13 serious injuries this year - and thank God nobody else was killed - and 20 serious injuries in 2019. For the public, the educational message is there. What further deterrents can An Garda Síochána bring to the table in terms of traffic policing that will let people know? The number of 2,600 speeding detections is a phenomenal number with 69-----

Ms Paula Hilman

Drug-driving.

Yes, 69 drug-driving and 140 drink-driving incidents. These numbers have more than doubled. The Garda is doing the detections. What would Ms Hilman's message be to the public in terms of what An Garda Síochána will be doing differently?

Ms Paula Hilman

Our message is that we will still be out policing the roads and detecting those who break the law. Our message to everyone is to please slow down. Part of the campaign we are doing this week is to get people to slow down. Speed contributes to a high number of fatal road traffic collisions. All of us slowing down by 5% could reduce the number of fatal road traffic collisions by 30%. Please slow down. Never drive under the influence of drink or drugs. Do not be distracted and wear your seat belt. Those are the four things - do not speed, do not drive under the influence of drink or drugs, do not be distracted and wear a seat belt.

I propose to give five minutes to anybody who wishes to contribute now.

Mr. Sam Waide

May I pick up on the offer of how this committee can help and contribute? It is particularly from a legislative point of view. I understand that this is the late shift, but this is very important. If we take consequence. A large number of road users in Ireland are respectful, they take care and do not demonstrate killer behaviours. However there are still several road users who demonstrate those killer behaviours. I will share this work that the RSA has done on comparators with neighbours, with EU member states and elsewhere. To put this into context, if you travel on a Luas tram without a valid ticket, you can receive a fine of €100.

What was that figure?

Mr. Sam Waide

If you travel on the Luas tram without a valid ticket, you can receive a fine of €100. The on-the-spot fine for littering or dumping is €150. The fine for gum litter is €150. Fines for dog fouling can range from €150 to €3,000. One of the strategic actions within this strategy for road safety to reduce and prevent loss of life involves reviewing the penalty points system. The system has not changed since 2014. I will not go through the details, but a very important action within the strategy review is reviewing penalty points and the consequence for those people who continue to take drugs while driving or drink while driving and other offences that might appear smaller. The Deputy mentioned earlier about cars parked illegally in cycle lanes and bus lanes. That particular action is important. From a legislation point of view, it is about putting it in the context of what is the consequence both in terms of a fine and penalty points.

Is Mr. Waide advocating a zero-tolerance approach?

Mr. Sam Waide

The review is going to take place.

I am not going to suggest that there is any predetermined outcome. The right people will be part of that review and then recommendations will be put forward because there is a need to review this. It is part of changing behaviour. We look at other EU member states and I am not focusing in on any one or particular user group. In Spain, we compared and benchmarked and a cyclist who wore headphones was fined €200. In Norway, if one speeds excessively, one will be fined the equivalent of one month's salary. There is a quite a varying range of consequence across EU member states and wider hence the reason for the action within the strategy.

I ask Professor Cusack and the assistant commissioner, as the representatives of the authority that enforces penalty points, for their views on what Mr. Waide has just said.

Professor Denis Cusack

The Chairman asked us how the committee could help us and I will put forward two things - which go also to legislation and are obviously within the remit of the committee - polydrug use; and alcohol and drugs. We have had graded penalties for years the higher the alcohol level is. In fact, like taxation, we have a very progressive scale but we do not have it for alcohol plus a drug, or a drug plus a drug, which I put forward many years ago and I know that the Minister supports that.

Second, we must look at repeat or high-risk offenders. I have some startling figures about repeat offenders; the Garda is looking at this matter with us and we are trying to put it in a medical context. Some people have an addiction or health problem with alcohol and drugs so we have got to try to find out, as well as being punitive, how can we support them through rehabilitation and medical support. I shall give one figure. In 2021, we had 15 drivers who were in three times, with a blood and urine sample, and one driver was in 15 times in three months. We must identify those people, and the gardaí are working with us on that, because we see that. Let us be charitable and consider ways to help those people to get off the road so they are not a danger to themselves and others. Somebody who presents 15 times in three months medically has a problem.

Professor Denis Cusack

One might say that these are very small numbers. My concern is that that person could be responsible for a number of crashes and, God forbid, may end up killing a number of people or injuring them. We are down to smaller numbers despite the terrible toll so I would ask the committee for help. I acknowledge the help and support provided by people who are not here so the Department of Transport officials and the Ministers involved. They are listening to us but sometimes legislation is very slow and that is not a criticism of the legislators.

We will follow up on everything.

To be fair, we had to vote earlier on various Bills.

I ask the assistant commissioner for her view on penalty points.

Ms Paula Hilman

Obviously we will operate within the legislative framework that exists. The Chairman has asked me a very specific question in terms of what has been said. We can detect a person but what is going to be the consequence of that detection? Let us say a person is detected as driving at a speed of 60 km or 90 km in a 50 km zone then he or she is fined and the penalty is the same. The superintendent talked about this earlier- if the speed is so excessive that it is deemed to be dangerous driving, and again we would have meet the proofs for dangerous driving, there is something about ensuring that as speed increases over the limit then what should be the penalty.

Would the assistant commissioner argue that if I drive at 150 km or 190 km on a motorway that it is dangerous driving? Surely the same applies if I drive at a speed of 60 km in a 30 km zone or 70 km in a 50 km zone? I mean that it is equally dangerous and probably more dangerous because members of the public may be present.

I ask the assistant commissioner to be brief because I want to bring members in and we need to be out of here by 8.30 p.m.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes. What some of it is that, yes we look at the proofs for the dangerous driving. Again, I think that there is something to be considered if speeds are excessive to a degree then what is the penalty point or fine before one reaches the threshold for dangerous driving, if one is over the speed limit. There is also opportunity, that we are looking at as well, to have legislation on how we could use, for example, technology to detect basics offences and also maybe mobile phone use or failure to wear a seatbelt. The GoSafe vans, potentially, could do that as well. We could use technology to detect no seatbelt wearing and mobile phone use. There is also distraction driving of which we are aware. Again, we would benchmark other jurisdictions where there is very specific legislation about distracted driving, which also involve, potentially, eating or another activity while driving. As the superintendent has said, we have examples of people having their phone on the windscreen but actually showing a film on their phone while driving.

So the detection moves with technology.

Ms Paula Hilman

Yes.

Great. I am conscious of time, as is the Clerk to the Committee, so I will give each member three minutes starting with Senators Horkan and Buttimer. Does Senator Craughwell wish to comment?

I call Senator Horkan and I urge him to stick to three minutes.

I spoke for ten minutes at 6 o'clock and waited around.

In fact, I timed the Senator and he spoke for 15 minutes so I was quite generous with time.

It was less than everybody else.

We have two accountants fighting.

No, there is one accountant fighting with me.

I am normally very generous, right?

Senator Horkan has just lost two minutes.

Senator Horkan has lost two minutes.

I was exceptionally generous with Senator Horkan before.

We can have a bit of levity but this matter is very serious.

Correct.

The reason that we are here at 8.30 p.m. on a Thursday evening is because we are serious about this.

The witnesses have been very open with us, which is very important.

I was going to make that point. Is all of the information that the witnesses have very kindly shared with us publicly available? Can it be made publicly available on a website? Can the information be shared? I want to know the answer to all of my questions so that people who live in, say, County Longford, can assess whether their county is at the top or bottom of the league table or people in counties Donegal, Cork and Kerry or the Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown area. The more communication, information and knowledge on this, the better.

Technology has a big part to play. Big gantries have been erected on the M7 motorway and they are clearly incredibly effective. What about using technology? What about having blackbox technology in cars? What about dashcam technology that looks in at the driver to see if he on his phone, not behaving himself or not wearing a seatbelt? All of that data goes up into the cloud and then insurance companies can look at a person, and you guys can look at us and say, right, this guy is a good driver. I say "guy" and I mean it generically but clearly 88% of offenders are males so they are the bigger problem. It cannot be that difficult for all this information to be collected. All our information is collected on our phones every time we walk anywhere or do anything. People should be watched because I think that we all behave better when we are watched.

On penalty points, the late Seamus Brennan was my local Deputy. He was the Minister for Transport who introduced penalty points. He faced a fair bit of resistance for it at the time from everybody. I recall that he suggested that he would introduce a penalty of three points and within weeks behaviour had changed. I know that there are only about 70 offences now. It is a positive scheme and needs to be updated. Black box activity is also important.

Lastly, I do not know who deals with the national car tests, NCT, system. Is it the RSA or some other body? My NCT is not due for a while but I looked at the website to see when I could get an appointment at local NCT centres. I was shocked to discover that the next dates available are 6 December at Deansgrange and Greenhills, and 29 November. That clearly shows there is a problem with securing an appointment. I know that if one checks the website at 3 o'clock in the morning, one might find a vacant slot. Clearly, there is something wrong with the NCT system in terms of availability. What level of activity or enforcement is being done with people who drive cars that do not have a valid NCT certificate? I understand that it is illegal to do so and I do not know whether driving without an NCT invalidates vehicle insurance. Are there penalty points for it? Are they being enforced?

So the Senator has first asked whether there is a problem and, second, the witnesses might deal with the question about people driving without an NCT.

I thank all of the organisations for everything that they do.

Mr. Sam Waide

The NCT presents a significant challenge post Covid. The provider of the service has significantly higher absenteeism as a result of Covid. To address the issue, RSA has proposals in place to increase recruitment and address those service issues.

The RSA also has been working with the provider to identify the sequencing of the tests and prioritisation. I am not sure if-----

From the Garda point of view, is it illegal to drive with an out-of-date NCT?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Yes.

We will follow up with our guests.

What are the penalties being enforced? If a garda at a checkpoint finds an out-of-date NCT, what happens next?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Prosecution.

Is that happening?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

Yes.

Is there a lacuna or latitude given if there is an application submitted?

Mr. Michael Hennebry

I suppose members of An Garda Síochána are aware of the difficulties of getting an NCT.

I am glad because people are trying to get tests. However, if they cannot get the tests, it is very hard to punish them if they booked a test.

Mr. Sam Waide

We will submit details of the mitigating actions for the NCT service.

Can I get a response to the other points as well?

On the NCTs, I note they are being offered in November.

Please. I call Deputy Matthews, who will be followed by Senator Buttimer.

I reiterate the request that I made to our guests from An Garda Síochána. Could they provide the committee with the number of fixed-charge notices and tickets for parking in cycle lanes that have been issued over the past couple of years and the number of cyclists truck by vehicles over the past couple of years as well? I would like their records on that.

Could Professor Cusack and RSA continuously update us on that incidents, accidents and injuries monitoring data that they are carrying out? Those are the indicators that we need. In addition, can the RSA report to us on any barriers on implementing on 30 km/h zones that it proposes.? I know it is its action No. 6. I would like to know any barriers the RSA is coming across on that.

Could Professor Cusack and RSA could continuously update us on that incidents, accidents, inuring monitoring data that they are carrying out? Those are the indicators that we need. In addition, could the RSA report to us on any barriers on implementing on 30 km zones that it is doing. I know it is its action No. 6. I would like to know any barriers the RSA is coming across on that.

I urge the members of the Garda throughout the towns and villages not to tolerate the bad parking and driving behaviour. People respect the Garda and listen to its members. They take note when they see that happening. I thank them for their work.

The assistant commissioner mentioned distractions. Are our vehicles today becoming too distracting? Are they becoming the dining room, the office, the entertainment or whatever else? Senator Horkan’s raised the point of having a black box in cars, which I know would never travel because of GDPR. However, on the issue of distractions, is our focus wrong? Are we focusing too much on speed? Is the distraction piece something we should focus in on?

My second and last point is on road incidents and being able to report bad parking or bad driving behaviour. I believe the Crimestoppers website stopped, is not functioning or perhaps is not being used perhaps for this. Could it be used for this? Is it being used by An Garda Síochána?

Again, I thank our guests for being here today.

Ms Paula Hilman

We all have a responsibility not to be distracted. Drivers of vehicles need to hear the message not to be distracted as well. However, it equally applies to pedestrians and other road users, such as cyclists. It applies to everyone. Do not be distracted. Focus on whatever activity you are engaged in on the road.

What about Crimestoppers?

Ms Paula Hilman

We talked about Traffic Watch but we do not use Crimestoppers-----

Mr. Michael Hennebry

We are reinvigorating Traffic Watch, which will cater for that public reporting of bad behaviours.

Could we use the Crimestoppers website? It may take a while to go to the Garda station and make a statement or whatever.

Mr. Michael Hennebry

The plan is that under the new reinvigorated Traffic Watch system, you could make a call and it would be received at the regional control room, so the nearest available patrol car will be dispatched straight away.

To answer the Senator's question very quickly, hybrid enforcement is where we are going. We will publish aggregated data on the website.

Ms Paula Hilman

Regarding motorbikes, we have also launched BikeSafe this year, which is an initiative for people to take a course with us about being safer drivers. That is something else we have done this year for motorcyclists.

I thank the broadcasting unit for remaining so late. I want to thank Mr. Waide, Assistant Commissioner Hilman and her colleagues, Chief Superintendent Hennebry and Superintendents Murphy and O'Reardon. I also thank Professor Cusack from the medical bureau and Mr. Waide from the RSA for assisting the committee in this important matter. I ask them to follow up with us. We thank them. We know it was very late, but nevertheless, it was a very important meeting. The meeting is now adjourned. The joint committee will next meet in private on MS Teams at 4 p.m. on Tuesday, 5 July.

The joint committee adjourned at 8.35 p.m. until 1.30 p.m. on Wednesday, 13 July 2022.
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