Seanad Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 24 Jul 1974

Vol. 78 No. 16

Fisheries (Amendment) Bill, 1974: Committee and Final Stages.

Section 1 agreed to.

SECTION 2.

Question proposed: "That section 2 stand part of the Bill."

Dr. West

There is a point about which I would like to ask the Parliamentary Secretary concerning elections of conservators and particularly with regard to the duties which they have. I think that the boards of conservators have some authority over the off-shore fishing that when it comes to dealing with off-shore fishing in their area it comes under their auspices.

What will be the position if our off-shore limits are considerably extended, a matter which is being discussed in the International Conference in Venezuela at the moment? Will the authority of the local boards extend to the ultimate limit of 50 miles or whatever limit is decided on at Venezuela or is it a much more restricted authority?

Mr. M.P. Murphy

Of course we will be anxiously awaiting the report from Venezuela to see what decisions are made there. We will be taking cognisance of such decisions and recommendations. At the present time the authority of the board extends to particular regions and so far as salmon are concerned, it extends out to sea.

Dr. West

Does it extend to the 12 mile limit or whatever the current limit is?

Mr. M.P. Murphy

The boards would have authority over salmon and other fish as well, some types of shell fish. All these points will be adequately covered. What this Bill seeks to do is to preserve the status quo for the ensuing 12 months.

Dr. West

I just wanted to check on the present position. They have authority as far as salmon and shell fish are concerned out to the 12 mile limit?

Mr. M.P. Murphy

Yes.

Dr. West

But not as far as sea fish are concerned?

Mr. M.P. Murphy

Sea fish, no, but it is not necessary at the present time in regard to sea fish. We have no problems at present. We will be addressing ourselves to problems concerning some seafish in the course of the next month, such as herring fishing and so on. This will not create a problem in so far as this measure is concerned with preserving the authority of the boards for the 12 months.

Mr. McGowan

Would the Parliamentary Secretary try to have figures published because all kinds of statements are being made about the increase in the number of salmon caught by the drift net fishermen and the number of sea trout that are caught? There are no figures available since 1971. Would the Parliamentary Secretary do his best to have figures published if they are available? If not, would he state this clearly and deny the figures that have been used? They were referred to in the House today by an Opposition Senator. Figures were quoted and I am informed that there is no basis on which he could quote figures at all. I would like to have an assurance from the Parliamentary Secretary on this point.

Mr. M.P. Murphy

Our policy is to try to publish factual appraisals of the position so far as fishing is concerned from time to time. Any figures published by the Department will be factual. I do not see that there is any need for treating such figures confidentially. Later on, if by virtue of our discussions with or commitments to other countries so far as fishing is concerned, any information must be treated confidentially—which I doubt—we will have to take cognisance of that. So far as the Department is concerned it is anxious to give whatever figures are available and to issue them to the public. I think the public involvement is necessary and essential and we try to give all the information we have to the public.

Mr. Deasy

When we set up the new boards of conservators will the Minister consider the payment of expenses to the members just as all members of local authority committees are paid travelling expenses and subsistence?

Mr. M.P. Murphy

I do not know what will replace the boards. This Bill enables us to prolong the period of office of the boards. We are awaiting reports and I cannot say what will replace the boards. We may have other suggestions of some kind of regional commission; anything could arise. The Senator's question, therefore, does not arise at present. If boards will be set up as a result of legislation then the question would be appropriate at that time and at that time only.

Dr. West

Just to follow up Senator McGowan's point, I am very glad to hear the Parliamentary Secretary say that he feels that these figures should be regularly made public. I think it would, as Senator McGowan has asked, eliminate much of the conjecture. We would have factual figures from the Department. Perhaps such figures are issued annually in the Department's report. If they are not I would argue that they should be issued annually. Perhaps I just do not know where to look.

Mr. M.P. Murphy

I think Sea and Inland Fisheries—this is a report for 1972—gives various statistics. This is an annual publication by the Department. It is our duty to make the figures available.

Dr. West

Is that circulated to every Member of the Oireachtas? I do not ever remember getting a copy.

Mr. M.P. Murphy

It is circulated to Members of the Oireachtas. The Senator should be more careful when the postman arrives.

Mr. McGowan

Would the Parliamentary Secretary consult or have consultations with the National Fishermens' Defence Association—the national executive? I am sure he has had sight of all the allegations and the replies that have been made and the booklet that was handed out.

Mr. M.P. Murphy

Certainly. It is my aim to have consultations with as many groups as possible including the group mentioned by the Senator. We try to arrange for a regional meeting. I am sure neither Senator McGowan nor any other Senator here would expect someone to travel around from pillar to post and meet this group today and that group tomorrow. In fact, it is much better to meet a larger group where possibly you have a difference of opinion within the group and you hear both sides. It is no harm to let the man in Galway hear the view of the man in Wexford. By having more national and more widespread groups I have found from experience that you can have healthier discussions. This exchange of views amongst the different groups and different peoples is a help also. If the Senator wishes to meet me privately I can discuss this with him.

Question put and agreed to.

Section 3 agreed to.

Title agreed to.

Bill reported without amendment, received for final consideration and passed.

The Seanad adjourned at 9 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Thursday 25th July, 1974.