It is proposed to take Nos. 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 in that order. It is proposed, in the event of No. 3 not being concluded by 5.30, that the debate on that Bill be adjourned at that stage and that we proceed to No. 4.
Order of Business.
On the Order of Business, since both Houses of the Oireachtas have been in recess there have been a great many dramatic developments outside this country which have a great deal to do with Ireland. I consider that the circumstances in which this country finds itself vis-a-vis foreign policy at present are very special. Therefore, I would ask that item No. 21, which is a motion in the names of myself and Senator Murphy calling on the Government to make a clear statement of Ireland's foreign policy in the light of recent events in Iran and Afghanistan be added to the Order of Business, not be substituted, because there are such special circumstances occasioned by the fact that neither House has been sitting for some time that we seem to have some doubts about our foreign policy. I would ask the Leader of the House if it were possible, despite the absence abroad of the Minister for Foreign Affairs, to have a statement on Irish foreign policy, and that this motion be added to the Order of Business even if it means sitting tomorrow.
I should like to support Senator Hussey very strongly. However we differ on the present nature of the international crisis and how it may be alleviated, there can be no doubting its gravity. The other House is not convening until the 20 February which happens to be the day of President Carter's ultimatum. On that occasion I take it that House will be far too busy discussing the budget and economic policy. As Senator Hussey has said, the Government's response to the grave events that are happening in the world is less than clear. Today's session of the Seanad——
This is not a matter for discussion here at present.
I am not discussing the substance of the matter. I am simply giving additional reasons why Senator Hussey's motion should be carefully considered. Today's session of the Seanad is a most opportune occasion for airing the views of this body and eliciting a Government response. I would suggest that Senator Hussey's proposal is given greater urgency by yesterday's meeting of the nine Foreign Ministers, which ended inconclusively and at which it seemed that Ireland was under some pressure as a result of its non-NATO membership. Yesterday's meeting, the Franco-German Summit, which was clearly at attempt to put pressure on the minor partners——
The Senator cannot use this time of the Seanad to make statements.
To conclude, I would suggest that, in view of the threat to our own precarious military neutrality, the shreds of our independent foreign policy, this is a matter of great urgency. In fact there is a Minister at hand to deal with the matter who was in Brussels yesterday, Minister of State, Deputy Raphael Burke.
I would like to support the request for an early debate on this subject. I do not necessarily press for that debate to be held today, but I do think it should be held very quickly indeed. The matter is obviously serious. I do not wish to rush into a rebuke by the Chair, so I will not develop any view on the matter. But it does seem to be a matter on which, if we are going to have a pertinent debate, it should be held at an early date.
I, too, would like to support the request by Senators Hussey and Murphy to have this motion taken at the first opportunity. I appreciate, as I am sure everybody on this side of the House does, the fact that there is a Fine Gael motion listed to be taken this afternoon and that there is an arrangement to try to have one motion taken each month that the House is sitting, and indeed that the present Leader of the House has taken steps to ensure that this practice is adhered to. While appreciating that this should also allow for the possibility of motions to be taken apart from the monthly motion, when the matter is of urgency, when, as has been pointed out, the other House is not sitting and when it is in the interests of the Irish people that there be a clear Government statement on our foreign policy. Therefore, I would like to support this. I certainly would be prepared to see the House sitting tomorrow, or indeed next week, in order to have this motion considered. I would ask the Leader of the House to make an exception so that an opportunity could be provided to Members of this House to comment on the extremely serious and rapidly changing situation in the world, particularly arising from the events in Iran and Afghanistan.
I should like to add my voice to those who have asked to have the motion added to the Order Paper. One aspect that strikes me as being significant with regard to the ordering of the business of the Seanad down through the years is that the Seanad has very rarely discussed foreign policy. It seems to me that a Chamber like this is peculiarly well adapted for doing it. Indeed, a motion like this, which is really the result of a very urgent international situation, is one which could easily be added to the Order Paper. In a sense it would be useful to the Government in general and to the people in general to have an airing of views on this subject, because there is an intense interest in the media and in the country at large in relation to it. There is much diversity of views here which could be usefully and fruitfully aired. Therefore, I would like to support that plea.
I support the views expressed by those who seek this debate on Motion No. 21 in the names of Senators Hussey and Murphy. A great deal has happened in the area of international politics since we last sat. I take the view that there is a need for solidarity in the free world on an issue such as this. Our country, small as it is, should have a view to express. Recently the Minister for Foreign Affairs made a statement in which he really opted out to the extent of suggesting that it would be an initiative on the part of the EEC——
We cannot go into a discussion on this.
——rather than of this country individually. There is certainly the need for a debate. Clearly there is disquiet around the country on this issue. Let me say finally that while I support the views expressed, it is possibly unrealistic to expect a debate this week because there is an order which had been previously agreed so that if we had a debate on this issue this week it might be of a very confined nature. Therefore, would you consider an arrangement under which Seanad Éireann would meet next week and have as its principal item on the agenda, this issue?
I agree with what has been said regarding the point raised by Senator Hussey but I should like also to ask the Leader of the House when it would be possible to make time for items Nos. 6 and 7 on the Order Paper. Successive Governments have given an undertaking to afford the House reasonably adequate opportunities for discussing developments in the Community. This year in particular when there is a big problem vis-a-vis the budget of the Communities and the implications it is having on various aspects of life and the economy in this country, I would ask that the House be given the opportunity to discuss items Nos. 6 and 7 as early as possible. It is a shame that these two items should be on together. We were told in 1973 that we would have an opportunity twice yearly, every six months, for a discussion on this matter.
As regards Nos. 6 and 7, they will certainly be taken together and we will try to arrange for them to be taken as soon as possible. With regard to motion No. 21, it would be impossible to deal with it this week, partly because we have already agreed to take another motion and partly because the Minister concerned is abroad. I appreciate the feeling of many Members of the House that this is a matter which could appropriately be discussed by the Seanad and I shall consider whether it may be possible to take it in the near future.
Is the Order of Business agreed to?
Would you clarify the point on which the Order of Business is being challenged, namely to add item No. 21?
There was no amendment to that effect. The question is: "That the Order of Business be agreed to." Is it agreed to? I think the motion is agreed to.
Senators
Votáil.
Question put.
Question declared carried, with Senators Martin, Murphy and Hussey dissenting.