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Seanad Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 23 Feb 1983

Vol. 100 No. 1

Foyle Fisheries (Amendment) Bill, 1981: Second Stage.

Question proposed: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

Minister for Fisheries and Forestry (Mr. P. O'Toole)

Ba mhaith liom i dtosach tréaslú leat féin as ucht do cheapacháin, agus tréaslú leis na comhaltaí gur éirigh leo an Teach seo a bhaint amach, agus gur fada buan iad.

I am sorry that my first appearance in this House as a Minister is to promote a Bill the object of which is to provide for increased penalties for offences under the Foyle Fisheries Acts, 1952 to 1976. The Foyle Fisheries Act, 1952, established the Foyle Fisheries Commission which is a joint North/South body with statutory responsibility for conservation, protection and development of the fisheries in the Foyle area. That Act also defines the Foyle area and lays down the fishery law for the area and the penalties for breaches thereof. The Foyle area comprises the entire catchment area of the River Foyle which flows partly in County Donegal and partly in Counties Derry and Tyrone. The Foyle Fisheries (Amendment) Acts of 1961 and 1976 amended and extended the provisions of the Foyle Fisheries Act, 1952. Legislation similar in terms to the Foyle Fisheries Acts was enacted by the Northern Ireland authorities.

Most of the penalties for offences under the Foyle Fisheries Acts, 1952 and 1961, have not been changed since 1952. The changed money values in the meantime and the growing level of illegal fishing in the Foyle area, including incidents of violence involving members of the Foyle Fisheries Commission's protection staff, clearly indicate that the existing penalties are not an adequate deterrent. Furthermore, the Fisheries Act, 1980, provides for substantial increases in fines for the same offences throughout the rest of the State.

The Bill provides for substantial increases in penalties for fishery offences in the Moville area which is the part of the Foyle area located in County Donegal. Maximum penalties of up to £600 or imprisonment for any term not exceeding six months or both such fine and such imprisonment are prescribed on summary conviction. For the more serious offences provision is made for trial on indictment and the maximum penalty on conviction for such offences is £2,000 or imprisonment for any term not exceeding two years or both such fine and such imprisonment. In general the penalties prescribed in the Bill are in line with the penalties for similar offences as provided for in the Fisheries Act, 1980.

I am very concerned about the high level of illegal fishing taking place not only in the Foyle area but in the country as a whole. Our valuable salmon stocks have been seriously depleted in recent years because of illegal activities. We all have a duty to ensure that these stocks are safeguarded in the interests of our commercial fishermen, anglers and our very important tourist industry. I am satisfied that the setting up in 1980 of the regional fisheries boards has helped to improve protection and will continue to do so in the future. The increase in fines provided for in the Fisheries Act, 1980 has also contributed to a reduction in illegal fishing and I am satisfied that the increased penalties now proposed for the Foyle area will likewise act as a good deterrent against illegal fishing there.

I should like to emphasise, as strongly as I can, that while I hold the office of Minister for Fisheries and Forestry I will spare no effort to ensure that the cancer of illegal salmon fishing is reduced to the minimum. I look forward to the continued co-operation of the Regional Fisheries Boards, the Naval Service and the Gardaí in achieving that target.

I would refer Senators to the explanatory memorandum accompanying the Bill which sets out the existing penalties and the proposed increased penalties. Similar provisions for increases in penalties for the same offences have been prescribed in a Fisheries Amendment (Northern Ireland) Order. It is proposed that both the Bill, when enacted, and the Northern Ireland Order should come into operation at the same time.

I congratulate you, Sir, on your appointment as Cathaoirleach and wish you well in your office. You will have the co-operation of my party. I welcome the Minister for Fisheries and Forestry. I congratulate him on his appointment and wish him well.

We are in agreement with the Bill. The Foyle Fisheries Commission is a fine example of North-South co-operation. The purpose of this Bill is to introduce increased penalties for illegal fishing. While penalties might be severe, this legislation is necessary particularly in regard to the conservation of salmon stocks. Poaching is posing a threat to our salmon stocks and to fishing in general. At one time it was only a case of a person poaching a salmon for his dinner, but now poaching is done for commercial reasons. These poachers are professional people. The methods they use are very cruel and are not in keeping with the ethical standards of fisheries. Poachers are definitely the enemies of fishermen. The full co-operation of all fishermen is needed to ensure that poaching is eliminated and to ensure the future livelihood of fishermen.

Another threat to this industry is pollution. I am sure steps are being taken by the powers that be to eliminate pollution. As a result of agricultural development there has been pollution, and I should like to see more grant aid from the Government to eliminate such pollution. I welcome the Bill and hope it will have the desired results.

I compliment the Minister on his statement. Having come from Derry I could not return without saying something about the Foyle fisheries and the powerful inpact that it has made. There were ugly incidents on Lough Foyle. These waters were disputed but the North-South co-operation measures taken at the time resolved those difficulties. I should like to emphasise that in any area where such co-operation can be mounted, that should be done. If I go to the west side of the Inishowen Peninsula, I am somewhat appalled when I see one of the largest factory ships from the USSR being fed not only by Irish trawlers but by all kinds of trawlers. A factory processing ship can come into the Swilly and actually anchor a few miles from Rathmullan or Buncrana. Surely it could be looked at in either Buncrana or Rathmullan.

The biggest single problem in the Republic and in Northern Ireland is unemployment. De Courcy Ireland, the other day in The Irish Times, an expert in maritime matters, pointed to the fact that in Denmark for one fisherman at sea there are eight ashore. I would be satisfied with four or five. That matter should be looked at.

It gives me great pleasure to congratulate you, Sir, on your appointment. As somebody who got to know you over the last number of years and whose friendship I choose to have, knowing your family background in political life and as a person in your own right I feel that you will wear this great honour with distinction.

I welcome the Minister to the House and congratulate him on his appointment and wish him well. I welcome Senator McGonagle from Derry and have noted his interest in fishery development. While for a second or two he was in the wrong bay when he moved into Lough Swilly rather than Lough Foyle, his interest is sincere.

The Minister said, and I agree, that it is not nice to have to welcome anything which introduces or increases penalties. Nevertheless because of depletion of salmon stocks in the Foyle and around our coasts, such measures have to be introduced. This is merely an extension of penalties provided under the Fisheries Act, 1980. A joint fisheries board was set up which comprised representatives from the North and South. For this reason the Foyle is different.

Senator Kiely referred to agricultural and other types of pollution. While I would not like to see industrial pollution in the Foyle I would like to see industry, particularly sea fishery related industries, there.

Fishermen in the area are opposed to night fishing. They are day fishing as a temporary measure and I should like the Minister to make that permanent. There are obvious dangers attached to fishing at night apart from storms. The Minister said that he would bring the Foyle into line with the rest of the country. Might I point out that the hours of fishing on the Foyle are four ten hour periods, that is, 40 hours a week. If the stocks are built up again, the Minister might consider extending that period. If the fishermen realise that the stocks are still depleted or run down they would want to cut down on the hours but, in the meantime, I ask the Minister to examine the possibility of extending these hours.

I should like to suggest the introduction of tags for salmon fisheries. It would be a way of curbing illegal fishing if only fish that were tagged could be marketed. The Minister might consider introducing such a method of tagging and give fishermen a quota of tags. When these were used up they could fall back on other lines of earnings.

There should either be a total ban on or the legalisation of monofilament netting. The killing powers of monofilament netting are better than those of other types of netting, even super nylon netting. If two boats are fishing side by side and one is using monofilament netting and the other not, then one catch will be bigger than the other. The Minister's predecessor said that to ban the importation of monofilament netting would also be banning its use for other jobs other than fishing. Might I suggest that he either ban it completely or ban netting ranging from four and a half inches to five and a quarter inches which would be used for fishing, or legalise it. It is attractive because it can be used in daylight. I ask the Minister to consider those points.

Donegal County Council have set up a fisheries committee comprising of ten members, two from each electoral area, and on to that they have co-opted six members to represent the various fishing interests. It is their desire that the Minister would appoint to that committee a senior management member from Bord lascaigh Mhara and a principal officer from his own Department. On their behalf I make that request to the Minister. I ask the Minister to keep in mind when he is considering this request that 60 per cent of the fish caught around these coasts are landed in Donegal. There are not enough on shore jobs relating to the fishing industry. I would welcome one in three or one in two. The Minister should treat this committee with keen interest and take it very seriously. Hopefully he will do as they request.

Greencastle pier is in need of repairs. Donegal County Council this week have allocated a sum of £13,000 towards temporary repair of the pier. Since last year the number of boats landing at the pier has increased from 19 to 33. There are £25 million worth of fish imported here and it is a scandal that Ireland should have to import fish at all. The processing units for white fish in particular are not suitable at present. I ask the Minister to look at Donegal and see if something positive in the fishing line can be done at Killybegs, Burtonport, the Swilly area, Buncrana and Rathmullan.

By-election coming up.

Wrong constituency. The Bill increases penalties. The people in Donegal who might be buying fish from illegal salmon fishermen or supporting them in any other way should realise that there is a possibility that the Foyle may end up without salmon.

Minister for Fisheries and Forestry (Mr. P. O'Toole)

I sincerely thank Senators who contributed to the debate. I am glad to note that Senator Kiely felt as I do about discouraging poaching which is rampant both North and South. If we are to have salmon fishing in the future then this must be stamped out. He also referred to the fact that he was accepting the seriousness of this problem. I fully agree with him. I also thank Senator McGonagle for his contribution and welcome him to the House. He mentioned some matters concerning his own area and referred to problems which arose in the past in relation to poaching where members of the protection staff were involved. This kind of thing is regrettable. It was the co-operation of both southern and northern authorities that brought about a solution to the problem at that time. The commission staff and the Garda Síochána are to be complimented on the way in which they co-operate in stamping out breaches of the law in relation to fishing.

He mentioned the possibility of providing a processing facility in that area, having had experience of seeing Russian factory ships in that vicinity. As the Senator knows, this is a seasonal operation and he will agree that most of the fish caught for processing in that area would be processed normally in this country and specifically in Killybegs.

Senator Loughrey covered a lot of ground in his contribution. He will appreciate that I am not in a position to deal specifically with many of the matters he raised but I will be in touch with him later about them. He referred to fishing periods and an extension of same. That is something we can look at in the light of stock build up in the Foyle fishery area. In relation to the monofilament aspect of netting, we all know that the use of the monofilament type of net is a danger to stocks in that it seems to be, from experience we have of it, a much more efficient way of catching large stocks of fish. We are at present as the Senator will be glad to know, in contact with the Department of Agriculture with a view to discussing the banning of the importation of this type of net. He will appreciate that it is used for other types of fishing and also for agricultural purposes. While I may have my personal views on what should be done in relation to monofilament nets, there are other factors which must be taken into account before a decision is made. We are pursuing this matter and hope to have some definitive views on it in the not too distant future.

In relation to the tagging of fish and the issuing of tags on a quota basis — I understand that is what the Senator is referring to — there are problems there. While it might curtail the illegal fishing — the Senator put his finger on the real problem — basically, as long as there are people prepared to purchase fish caught illegally, they will be caught. It is a question of providing the kind of surveillance necessary to track down people receiving this commodity. That would be the greatest deterrent. There may be some merit in what the Senator has said, and it is something we can look at and, indeed, I will have a look at his suggestions.

On the specific matter of the re-establishment of a committee in Donegal comprised of the local authority members and others, the Senator is seeking an input from BIM and my own Department. We will look at it and see if our involvement, or the involvement as suggested by him with that committee, would be beneficial to the purpose for which the committee is being set up.

I thank the Senators who contributed to the Second Stage of the Bill. I can assure the House that I and my Department will spare no effort to stamp out something which we can no longer afford, that is, the prevalence of illegal fishing around our coasts, in our estuaries and, indeed, in our inland waters. We have a very valuable and precious commodity in salmon. We are now possibly the only major salmon fishery in western Europe, and to prevent that proud boast slipping away from us, we are obliged and we have a solemn duty to ensure that that fishery is protected to the best of our ability. While we may have problems and may be operating within limited resources, all of us have an obligation not to condone in any way, by word or by deed, any breaches of regulations in relation to illegal fishing.

Question put and agreed to.
Agreed to take remaining Stages today.
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