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Seanad Éireann debate -
Thursday, 6 May 1993

Vol. 136 No. 2

Roads Bill, 1991: Second Stage (Resumed).

Question again proposed: "That the Bill be now road a Second Time."

I want to stress the importance of the Castletownbere port not only to the Beara area where employment opportunities are few but as a national port. The road to the port must be improved irrespective of whether it becomes the responsibility of the National Roads Authority.

EC money for roads is welcome but I fear most of it will be spent on major road improvements only and that little will be left for county roads. I believe EC money is being spent wisely, but I hope, as Senator Farrelly suggested, a percentage will be allocated to roads in rural areas. Without money to improve these roads rural under-development will continue.

Motorways, national primary routes and national secondary routes have the highest classification followed by regional routes and county roads. The bulk of the money is spent on the major roads; there is not enough money for the maintenance of county roads, let alone road improvements. More money must be spent on the local improvement schemes to bring these roads up to standard.

Cyclists are in more danger than other road users. Many continental countries have cycle lanes. In Germany, paths are divided for walking and cycling. In Berlin pathways are made from a special type of stone. Cyclists must be accommodated because more people than ever are cycling now. If there were as many cyclists in Ireland as there are in Holland there would not be the same level of congestion in our cities.

The Bill also refers to vegetation. Commercial drivers continuously claim that vegetation does an enormous amount of damage to the mirrors and sides of their vehicles. If a left hand side mirror is broken by a branch that immediately creates an element of danger; by law, the driver should stop and get the mirror repaired. However, in reality, the driver must finish his day's work. The National Roads Authority should take this issue into account when formulating policy.

The present policy covering the clearing of roadsides is unclear. At present, Telecom Éireann and the ESB clear trees and small vegetation, if they are a danger to wires or are causing damage to communication lines. This absolves councils of responsibility for some stretches of road. County councils are only responsible for clearing growth for four feet on either side of the road on the outer side of the fence. Thereafter responsibility lies with the landowners.

A policy of clearing overhanging trees would provide work, firewood and so on. Some people like to see trees overhanging the road because of their environmental value but this must be balanced by considerations of safety and the cost of repairs to side mirrors and to the sides of vehicles. There is a danger that a child who puts his head out the window could be seriously injured by overhanging vegetation.

The system of roadsigns must be standardised: at present, one finds signs of different shapes, sizes and colours fulfilling similar functions. It is not good enough for signs giving advance notice of roadworks, to be painted on boards, in any colour and in any shape. Frequently one may pass a signpost without seeing it.

During the Seanad election campaign I often went 50 metres past a turn before realising I had gone wrong. Even on English country roads advance signposting is of a very high standard. One sees the sign well in advance of the turn and then can note the finger posts showing the distance in miles of the actual turn. It is dangerous for drivers to make late turns at crossroads, having just seen the signposts. We must standardise and regulate the signs, finger posts and lines on our roads.

When two lanes merge should it be to the right or to the left? This needs to be standardised or accidents will occur. It must be clear who has the right of way.

On motorways all over the world, hitch-hiking is prohibited because of the danger to hitch-hikers and to traffic. Hitch-hiking on other roads is acceptable however, because it enables young people especially to travel cheaply. I would not like to see a total ban on hitching. When I was a student I was very glad to be able to hitch a lift; it spared me the bus fare. It was better to be able to use the money for entertainment.

The toll road on the western side of Dublin was a high cost project and I understand why a toll is being charged in that case. However I would like tolls to be lifted after a certain length of time. If the present situation is taken to its logical conclusion all new roads will be toll roads because all roads are expensive to build. I understand that where big projects are involved and bridges or tunnels must be built, the amount of money involved make a toll necessary but I would not like additional toll roads. The cost of motoring is high enough without adding a further bill to it.

Cork County Council allows the use of its roads for races, rallies and the west Cork sport of bowling. Horse racing on the road has a certain character about it and I know of a race that is run every year. If there were any difficulty in running such races it would cause great disappointment. These races are part of the social calendar for people living in rural communities. However, the cost of insurance for these races is so high that some of them can no longer be held. Luckily, some races can afford the insurance costs and have managed to survive.

Rallies are also held on our roads. Very often people come to see the rally from abroad bringing much-needed money into the area. In Clonakilty, a rally attracted visitors from Britain and all over Ireland who stayed in guest houses in the off-peak season when business is usually slow. This was a great boost to the local economy.

Ból Chumann na h-Éireann and Cork County Council enjoy a very good relationship. This sport is not played in some countries but it is very popular in the south-west. Ból-Chumann na hÉireann usually invites the chairman of the county council and the county manager to its functions because a special type of chip is needed on roads used for bowling. The surface of the road must be smooth. It is great on a Sunday evening to see people taking part in this sport.

School bus drivers must be complimented on the work they do. They can have three or four scamps in the back seat — scamps usually sit in the back seat — and they control the children and drive safely at the same time. These people must be magicians to do their job so well.

Co-op drivers are also to be commended on the good work they do. A previous speaker mentioned that lorries are getting bigger and cannot always get into farmyards. We have to examine this problem seriously because if a small farmer cannot get a truck into his yard it will eventually mean ceasing production if he cannot obtain equipment necessary to do the work.

Road workers are becoming scarce. In the past many road workers were employed and it was money well spent. A road worker who knows his area well will know where trenches and drains are situated. The cost of road repairs can often be reduced by draining flood water from roads. The ganger who knew every drain, pool and turn on the road has become a thing of the past and their work is done now by machinery. Road workers are essential for road maintenance. This is also a form of employment at a time when employment is scarce. I know the importance of road and forestry workers. They are a rare species today, whereas in the past many families were reared on their earnings. The more road and forestry workers we have the better.

I commend the people who have made such a fine job of Millstreet in preparation for the Eurovision Song Contest. Tremendous work has been done there by engineers, road workers and machinery operators. I know that the contest will be a tremendous boost for the Millstreet area and for the south west.

I welcome this Roads Bill. We need a roads authority to coordinate the improvements of our roads.

A Leas-Chathaoirligh, cuirim fáilte roimh an mBille seo, agus tá súil agam go rachaidh sé tríd an Seanad go tapa ionas go mbeimid ábalta cruth a chur ar bhóithre na h-Eireann.

I welcome the Bill, and as the Minister said in his opening speech, this is probably the most important Roads Bill ever to be brought before the Houses of the Oireachtas. Our infrastructure and our roads are of vital importance to the country for the facilitation of communication between cities, towns, villages and parishes. While a certain amount of work has been done on roads throughout the country much of it has been done at local level. The roads in the Minister for the Environment's constitutency are always in good condition, but the roads in other constituencies are not always as good. I travelled around the country like everybody else during the election and when I got to Mayo I almost got lost because the place had totally changed. The Westport by-pass would meet the needs of the city of Dublin let alone Westport. Meanwhile, in Limerick, a city ten times the size of Westport, a heavy traffic flow is catered for by a boreen, a small by-pass around the city. We ought to get our priorities right by looking after the cities and catering for people who live a distance from the main urban centres.

I travel 1,000 miles a week to and from Dublin. One of the cumanns I visit for constituency work in south Kerry is 96 miles from Dingle. The road I travel to Sneem is diabolical. The county council has made very little effort down the years to improve the roads. I cannot understand the huge amounts of money being spent maintaining roads in other areas. I travel through Limerick and there is a beautiful by-pass going past Rathkeale from Adare into Newcastle West. The road into Newcastle West was tarmacadamed about four years ago, and the same five-mile stretch was done again last year. However, when you leave Newcastle West, you drive into a boreen.

The way county councils their engineers and staff operate is open to criticism. The Minister said that local authorities would be relied upon to prepare road designs, etc. I am amazed that every county council has not already prepared a road design so that we could fight for whatever money is needed. The more I travel the 221 miles from Dublin to Dingle the more amazed I become at how different county councils operate. After the Naas dual carriageway and motorway to Kildare you come to the bad road to Portlaoise. This road is full of black spots and danger signs. I cannot understand why this road does not receive priority funding for improvements.

Dingle will soon be on a par with Castletownbere as a fisheries harbour centre. In tonnage of fish landed, Dingle fisheries harbour passed out Castletownbere almost two years ago. There is largescale transfer of fish and other produce between Castletownbere and Dingle involving articulated lorries, sometimes laded with 20 or 30 tonnes of fish, which have to travel on very bad roads.

I welcome this Bill but I would sound a word of warning to many of our county engineers. Not every county engineer is the same but I have found fault with local engineers over the years. The local engineer is a man who goes through college and university, then qualifies and gets a job in Dingle, or some other area as a glorified foreman with no suitable work to do apart from supervising 15 or 20 men. A local engineer does not design the roads. If a small bridge has to be constructed a consultant will be brought in to design it. What are these engineers doing? Their role should be changed and all those qualified, brilliant engineers would operate from a central office planning the roads. That way they could still sign dockets for the district under their control, but at present they are doing nothing but making sure a worker opens a drain here or there. The engineer drives around clocking up mileage. This is a crazy system.

I am amazed how county councils waste money by, for example, using huge machinery to open dikes. In Limerick I saw three men, a JCB and a driver on the side of the road. They opened the drain with the JCB; one man was at the back of the vehicle with a stop sign and another stood at the front directing traffic. Three men and not a shovel between them, yet the drain could have been opened and cleaned by a man with a shovel. On the same stretch of road from Pallaskenry to Limerick, which had been tarred and chipped, there was a 15-stone truck marked "Traffic Control" driving at a speed of five miles an hour. One had to stay behind that truck all the way to the regional hospital where it turned and went back the other way. All day that worker was driving along that stretch of road, slowing traffic in case the chips might break someone's windscreen.

That is because there are two Ministers in that constituency.

That lorry cost £28 an hour while a small dumper would have done the just as well and cheaper. Those are areas where money is wasted. There is an attitude taken by county councils that since money will be available they will carry on in the same way year after year. I do not know whether other Senators get the same message, but when I complain to the county council I am told: "You get the money and we will fix the roads." However, even when they get the money the road is left in the same condition.

Some 75 per cent of our tourists visit the Cork/Kerry region, and 60 per cent of them visit the Dingle peninsula, and I am delighted they do. I am not looking for a motorway or a dual carriageway in Kerry but there is very heavy traffic on some of those roads. The average width of the road from Tralee to Dingle is 12 feet and the sides are falling away. Buses, lorries and other traffic have to stay in the middle of the road. In 1956 the famous Dingle-Tralee railway was dismantled. That railway ran alongside the road for about 70 per cent of the journey to Tralee. About a mile of that railway line only has been taken in for road widening since 1956 despite repeated requests. It is pointless for any engineer to protest that it is a big job to widen the Dingle-Tralee road by including the former railway. If trains ran there, surely it will take cars and lorries?

There was mention earlier of airports and seaports, etc. The ferry from Killimer to Tarbert is a vital link between Clare and the rest of Munster. However, the road from Ennis to Killimer is disastrous and with the exception of about two or three miles there is no opportunity to pass another vehicle.

The Tarbert-Listowel road on the other side is in a disastrous state also, largely because it goes through a bog. Money will have to be spent on it. By way of illustration, a lorry load of timber was going to Dingle when the engine broke down on the Tarbert road. The driver parked on the side of the road and went to make a phone call. When he came back the lorry was upside down in the ditch. Nobody had interferred with it; it just slowly sank and turned over.

The last speaker mentioned Millstreet. A fantastic job has been done there. Why could Cork County Council not have done this job last year or the year before? Going into Millstreet from the Mallow road now is like entering another world. There are wide sidewalks, parking spaces, lovely trees, tarmacadamed roads and so on. The bends seem to have disappeared over-night. If somebody in Cork County three years ago had suggested the road be improved in this way there would have been interminable delays with CPOs and other measures. Yet when the decision was made to hold the Eurovision Song Contest in Millstreet, a way was found to improve the road there immediately.

Every county council in Ireland should target a town in their own county to be improved over a two or three year period as Millstreet has recently been due to substantial investment. Millstreet has been transformed — the roads in every direction are better, the hedges have been trimmed, potholes filled and all for four or five hours of a Eurovision Song Contest. Why could we not take an example from that and do a similar job for other towns?

I hope the intentions of this Bill are correct. I notice that a board of 17 people is proposed. That is less than one for every county. I would like a Kerry man or a Dingle man on the board. There should be somebody on the board from every county because each will be pulling for her or his own corner. A Kerry man on the board might be able to obtain a good sum of money for Kerry. There is a good road to Wexford as the Minister knows.

The aims of the Bill are good and I wish it success. It is about time a Bill came before the House which will make it possible to draw up one plan for the roads network. Without roads we are going nowhere.

I wish to make a few proposals to the Minister and to reiterate some that have already been made by my own county council.

The Galway-Roscommon road, the N63, which I am sure will also be of interest to the Leas-Chathaoirleach, should be upgraded from the status of national secondary to national primary route. It is unable to cope in its present state with the volume of traffic using it.

Reiterating the plea from Galway County Council, a special case should be made for the roads of Connemara. Due to the physical terrain, these roads tend to sink and break up. Some are in a deplorable state and a rescue package is vital. In addition, the Galway-Headford Road, locally known as the Curaline, carries a huge volume of tourist and business traffic and there is a request for a special rescue package for that road.

The Western Railway Committee have submitted a fine proposal for a rail-road traffic link from Sligo to Limerick to Rosslare. Ultimately this would establish a rail link between the north-west and Europe. This application has been sent to the Minister with the request that the development and improvement of the Sligo-Limerick-Rosslare rail link, and the retention and improvement of the Collooney-Claremorris portion of this link, be formally included in the National Development Plan to ensure the eligibility of this project for EC funding.

Much research, thought and discussion has gone into this application. I strongly appeal to the Minister and the National Roads Authority to give it favourable consideration. The application is already with the Government and we have discussed the matter with the EC Commissioners. It must be included in the National Development Plan before it can be brought to Europe. I appeal, as a member of the Western Railway Committee and as a public representative for the area, that this proposal be included in the National Development Plan which I understand is being drawn up this month.

It is incumbent on the Government to negotiate with the EC to allow the spending of at least 10 per cent of European funds on county roads. The former EC Commissioner, Mr. Ray MacSharry, stated at a LAMA conference in Donegal which I attended, that the councils of Ireland should be calling on the national Government to try and bring that about. Motions poured in after the Commissioner's statement, via the General Council of County Councils, calling on the Government to act in the suggested manner. To date nothing has happened. I call on the Government, in the context of the new National Roads Authority, and on our MEPs, to contact our EC Commissioner and negotiate to secure proper funding for our county roads. We could remind our MEPs that they will be travelling these county roads some time next year in search of the elusive votes which will keep them in the European Parliament.

I hope that the Government will immediately set up the proposed regional councils as defined in the local government reform package and that these councils will be empowered to negotiate directly with Europe for funds, especially for county roads. The west in particular — my region — has been neglected and we feel that we have been propping up the east for too long. All the moneys have been going into the major by-passes around Dublin etc. As John Healy once said about the death of an Irish town, it is time that somebody cried stop. The Government's neglect of the west must not be allowed to continue. A rescue package for roads in the west is vital or many of the roads will be reduced to the status of paths.

The county engineers have been vocal in describing the deplorable state of the roads, particularly the county roads on the western seaboard. In recent years many of the county engineers would have felt like John the Baptist crying in the wilderness with nobody heeding their plaintive cries. If the Government does not respond soon to the pleas of the county engineers many of the roads of rural Ireland will disintegrate. Already many of the roads are not safe for bicycles, never mind cars.

Some of the county engineers' reports of recent times are disturbing and no funds are available for surface dressing of regional or county roads. I understand that this is the sixth year that regional roads and the seventh year that county roads around the country will not be surface dressed. If this trend continues the roads will be beyond repair.

In my own county the local improvement schemes for farm roads have been savagely reduced. In County Galway the funding for 1993 is £136,000, which is a decrease of £32,000 on 1992. I would like the Minister and the new National Roads Authority to look at this sad and deplorable matter with a view to restoring the former levels of funding for these roads. I ask the Minister and any roads authority that may come into being to give priority treatment to the county roads since they are, as I have already said, in a deplorable state. If something is not done soon the roads will be so bad that no Government, regardless of funds, will be able to repair the damage. I make a special plea to the Minister to take a particular interest in the county roads before they disappear.

While my colleague, Senator McDonagh, was speaking I was thinking that in the last month we had four Government Ministers visiting County Leitrim. I am waiting for the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, to visit the county as well. The common factor is that the four Ministers arrived by helicopter. I have no doubt they realised that the condition of the roads in my county is so appalling that it is safer to arrive by helicopter than by car. The actions by the Ministers and the Government show that the amount of funding made available for road maintenance and repair in rural Ireland is quite appalling.

In my home town of Ballinamore the IDA built a factory about 17 or 18 years ago which, unfortunately, is still vacant. Originally the reason no industrialist would set up in the area was due to the bad road and telecommunications infrastructures. Over the last 17 years the telecommunications infrastructure in County Leitrim has become one of the most modern in Europe since it was one of the last areas to become automated. Unfortunately, I cannot say the same for the road network, which has deteriorated. One of the main reasons we still cannot attract industry to the county is the lack of a proper road infrastructure.

County Leitrim is in a unique position as it has only about 16 miles of national primary route. This year my county council colleague, Deputy Ellis, issued a statement in the local papers claiming that £5 million was to be spent on roads within the county. Every one of the 22 county councillors in County Leitrim has since been burdened by the local constituents thinking that there has been a windfall of money to be spent on roads in the county. The unfortunate aspect is that £3.5 million of this money is to be spent on the national primary routes. To take my argument on infrastructure, a bit further, I welcome the money being spent on the national primary routes.

It is essential for County Leitrim, and County Sligo, that the N4 be improved. Given that we are on the periphery of Europe it is essential for the transport of goods from Sligo to Dublin or to any other port, that there is an excellent national primary road infrastructure. The £3.5 million in County Leitrim is money well spent.

However, we have something like 2,200 miles of county roads in County Leitrim, including regional roads, and we have the paltry sum of £1.5 million to spend on them. It is impossible to maintain a respectable infrastructure with that level of funding. Senator McDonagh spoke of the former Commissioner MacSharry suggesting at a meeting in Donegal that the General Council of County Councils put pressure on the Government to have money from Europe spent on county roads. That is something which most rural councils would wish for. It is something that should be taken into consideration.

My colleague, Deputy Creed, put a question to the Minister for the Environment requesting that money coming directly from Europe should be spent on county roads this year. The answer was that in the 1993 Structural Funding programme the Government would take into consideration the request. I would ask the Minister to put as much pressure on the Cabinet as possible so that money becomes available to local authorities specifically for county roads.

The draft road works scheme for County Leitrim provides for ten new pilot schemes. These have been introduced in a number of counties. These schemes relate to roads in areas with low population densities. Leitrim has per capita more miles of county road than any other county. Some stretches of road two or three miles long may have only two families living on them. If priority is given to more populous areas the chances are that those roads will be tarred, as the county engineer stated to Leitrim County Council, only once every 40 years. This is one of the few services people in rural Ireland receive from the State. This pilot scheme is welcome but it is an indictment of previous Governments of all parties and their lack of interest in the development of the least populated parts of rural Ireland that people in these areas must pay for the resurfacing and maintenance of roads.

A decent road structure is essential to maintain vibrant communities in rural Ireland. If funding continues to decline it will be possible to put a gate at each side of County Leitrim and close it off. People will not stay in isolated parts of Leitrim because they have no services. Services will only be available to them if they move to small towns and villages. A similar situation exists in other counties in the west. I presume that if we had more resources larger amounts would be spent on county road maintenance and repair.

My colleague, Senator McDonagh, referred to the amount of money spent on roads around Dublin. As a businessman I regard this as money well spent because the amount of time wasted by business people entering Dublin was horrendous. However, rural Ireland should also receive a fair distribution of the Structural Funds. There is no point in having within a radius of four to ten miles of Dublin highways, dual carriageways and motorways which provide quick access while further down the country having a whole clog up of traffic leading to the city.

It is very important that such development is extended to rural Ireland and peripheral areas of the country because of the open market and because we are about to receive our final allocation of Structural Funds. If this £8 billion is not spent more effectively than the £6 billion we received under the last phase of Structural Funds people will find it very hard to survive. Road infrastructure is one of the main means by which areas in rural Ireland can come to terms with their peripherality and become as competitive as their neighbours in Europe or along the east coast.

The R202 is a regional road which links Northern Ireland to the midlands. It runs through Dromod in Leitrim to Swanlinbar in County Cavan and into Enniskillen. The towns of Ballinamore and Mohill are on that road and the amount of time trucks and traffic are held up in both these towns must be soul destroying for business. Although Leitrim County Council does its best to widen and maintain roads it does not receive sufficient financial assistance to do this effectively. I ask the Minister to consider upgrading the R202 from a regional road to a national secondary route. The volume of traffic on this road justifies such an upgrading.

Senator McDonagh pointed out that local improvement scheme grants have been severely cut in Galway. The same is true of Leitrim. These schemes have done much worthwhile work over the last 15 or 20 years in different areas. Grant recipients have to pay 10 per cent of the cost of schemes, which gives them a sense of appreciation of the road they have as a result of the scheme. The Department should consider increasing the money made available for these schemes over the next few years. The recent decrease has been a retrograde rather than a positive step.

Most of what I have said has been negative and is related to the financial situation in which the Government finds itself. If Structural Funds are not used to develop rural Ireland it will never catch up with the east coast or mainland Europe. Rural Ireland, because of its peripherality, needs all the incentives and financial assistance it can get. I ask the Minister to bring this view to the Cabinet table in the hope that most of the Structural Funds allocated to road development will be spent in rural Ireland.

I have to defend Dublin as many of my colleagues have spoken in favour of the farmer. It is easy to point to the amount of money spent on roads in Dublin. When I moved to Blanchardstown 17 years ago its population was 1,000; today there are 60,000 people living there. One should look at the development of the road structure in Dublin on the basis of the number of people living there. I do not know why you all insist on coming to Dublin but we are delighted to have you here.

It is because we cannot get jobs anywhere else. We will take the Senator to County Leitrim.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

Senator McGennis without interruption.

I might go too.

As long as she changes her politics.

Not a chance. I might change house but not politics. I presume the Bill is complementary to the operational programme on peripherality and in that respect I welcome it. I have some reservations but I will go through these on Committee Stage. My reservations are mainly that the National Roads Authority will result in a diminution of the status and role of local authorities. I am sure this is not the Minister's intention but, as a local authority member, I am concerned about this.

The Minister pointed out that there are two aspects to this Bill. The first is the establishment of the National Roads Authority, while the second is the consolidation of existing road laws and updating of provisions. I welcome the second aspect although I have reservations about the first. Much of the legislation on roads is very much outdated and needs to be changed. That will be discussed in greater depth on Committee Stage.

The Minister, in establishing the National Roads Authority, is giving them substantial powers, which I hope does not imply criticism of the work of the local authorities. I am sure he will allay any fears I have in that regard.

Debate adjourned.
Sitting suspended at 1 p.m. and resumed at 2 p.m.
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