Seanad Éireann debate -
Thursday, 24 Oct 1996

Vol. 149 No. 1

Order of Business.

Mr. Manning

Before announcing today's Order of Business, I inform Members that the House will sit on Tuesday and Wednesday next week rather than the usual Wednesday and Thursday. This is because the EU Commissioner, Mr. Neil Kinnock will address the House. This is the second such address — the first was by the former Senator, Professor Jim Dooge on questions relating to the inter-governmental conference. Colleagues know Commissioner Kinnock's distinguished record as Leader of the British Labour Party and a good friend of this country, particularly in his role as Commissioner.

He will speak to the House at 4.30 p.m. on Tuesday. The format will be the same as when Professor Dooge spoke to the House. The Commissioner will be welcomed and will then address us on problems within his portfolio, especially as they relate to this country. There will be plenty of time for a full question and answer session afterwards. Although I am sure this will not enter into the consideration of Senators, the other House will not sit on that day so this event is likely to receive extensive television coverage.

I urge all colleagues to attend on Tuesday because it is an important occasion in the life of the Seanad. In particular, when this House is under scrutiny in the constitutional review committee as to its relevance, we should be seen to break new ground and make ourselves relevant to both European and Irish issues. If Members want details of the procedure, they are available in the motion passed last week or in the office of the Clerk to the Seanad.

Today's business is items Nos. 1 and 2. Item 1 will be taken until 1 p.m., there will then be a sos until 2 p.m. and item 2 will be taken until 6 p.m. I hope to finish Second Stage of item 2 but there is no guillotine so if it is not completed it will carry forward. I suggest a time limit of 20 minutes per speaker.

Mr. Wright

I am sure substantial progress will be made on both Bills today. We welcome the appearance of the EU Commissioner next Tuesday. The Leader has rightly stated that he has been a very good friend to Ireland, especially with regard to the restructuring of Aer Lingus. I am sure he will have many comments to make on issues relevant to Ireland. It may be worthwhile for the Whips to meet with the Cathaoirleach on the questions and answers session to ensure that it runs smoothly. Many questions will be asked of the Commissioner and it is important we ensure that everybody has an opportunity to participate.

Mr. Dardis

In view of the events of the past 24 hours has the Leader any intention of reopening the debate on agriculture? Given the Minister's facility for bi-location I suspect he will be able to make simultaneous statements in both Houses. It might also be useful if the Minister addressed the House and reconsidered some of the remarks he made about Senator Rory Kiely and Senator Byrne and The Examiner.

If anything, the situation has worsened. In addition, it appears to be suggested that newspapers should not publish facts, which I must reject. The Taoiseach has said that without truth there is no foundation for good Government. We could do with a good deal of truth this morning.

An Cathaoirleach

We are not discussing the beef crisis this morning.

Mr. D. Kiely

Will the Leader arrange for the Minister for the Environment to address the House on his intentions for future funding for local authorities? The general council of county councils and municipal authorities are concerned about this matter, especially when it appears that the Minister is to announce the abolition of water rates.

May we have a debate with the Minister for Transport, Energy and Communications on the proposed upgrading of the railway lines, especially in rural areas where there appears to be less funding available than for the main lines? The line from Tralee to Killarney is in a dangerous state. All citizens should be treated equally in this regard.

Will the Minister of State at the Department of the Marine, Deputy Gilmore, attend the House to debate his proposed fishing policy before it proceeds to legislation? The fishermen oppose the Minister's proposals and meetings have been called throughout the country. It would also be useful to have a debate on the fishing industry, especially as much of the tourism industry is dependent on it.

Will the Minister for Health attend the House to debate the transporting of mental patients to hospitals? Members of the Garda Síochána appear to be obliged to take patients to mental homes. Gardaí are concerned about this especially in view of the fact that many mental institutions are located in district hospitals. We should amend the antiquated law governing these arrangements.

An Cathaoirleach

We are not discussing that issue this morning.

Mr. D. Kiely

Will the Minister for Finance address the House on the national lottery? I am concerned about the secrecy of the lottery. I recently received information to the effect that a crime was committed which was organised by people in jail. This arose when the people who won the lottery were exposed by the media. We should debate this incident and the national lottery itself.

An Cathaoirleach

I am sure the Senator could find other ways of raising such issues.

Mr. D. Kiely

Will the Leader arrange a debate on the recent census? I do not know what Minister is responsible.

Mr. Manning

The Taoiseach.

Mr. D. Kiely

Will the Taoiseach attend the House to discuss this matter and the decline in the population of rural Ireland? In my own area there has been a 3 per cent decrease. It is a frightening matter which must be discussed because it affects all of rural Ireland in terms of schools, hospitals and so on.

An Cathaoirleach

We are not discussing that issue this morning.

Mr. Fitzgerald

When is it envisaged to present the Universities Bill to the House? I have a personal interest in it. Much lobbying is taking place. It is listed for the Dáil at present.

Next Monday is a bank holiday. This means that letters posted from the House tomorrow will not reach Members until next Tuesday when it will be too late to inform them of impending meetings. While the Leader and the Chief Whip are good at circulating the Order of Business, it would be appreciated if the Order of Business for next week were available early today for the benefit of Members.

Mr. Cashin

Carlow hosted the international ploughing championships at the beginning of the month. RTÉ broadcast aspects of the competition but not the ploughing despite the fact that a native defended his world title. To add insult to injury, a fellow townsman took the national and world title of the horse-ploughing championship and this was not broadcast, nor were the vintage ploughing and queen of the plough competitions.

An Cathaoirleach

We are straying from the Order of Business. The Senator must put a question to the Leader.

Mr. Cashin

If RTÉ has lost touch to that extent with rural Ireland it is good that the Minister for Arts, Culture and the Gaeltacht has proceeded with Telifís na Gaeilge, even though he may be ploughed to the ground for doing so. Will the Leader look into this matter?

Mr. R. Kiely

Now that it is established that the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry misled the public I support Senator Dardis's call for the Minister to attend the House and make a statement, as he is doing in the Dáil. I am aware that the Committee on Procedure and Privileges has discussed the matter I raised yesterday. When will its deliberations be made known to me?

Mr. Burke

Will the Leader arrange for a debate on waste disposal which is one of the biggest issues facing local authorities?

Mr. Maloney

Some time ago I requested a debate on the safety review of the fishing fleet. The report was published approximately three or four months ago. However, there are still many dangers. The report is well worth discussing and I ask the Leader to arrange for a debate.

Mr. Manning

I thank Senator Wright for his suggestions about the handling of the appearance next week of Commissioner Kinnock. There should be a meeting between the Whips and the Cathaoirleach to organise the question and answer session. I do not see the need for a further debate on agriculture this week as there was a full debate here on Tuesday.

Mr. R. Kiely

I did not ask for a debate; I asked for a statement from the Minister.

Mrs. McGennis

It is a very reasonable request.

Mr. Manning

Senator Dan Kiely raised a number of points and the easiest way of dealing with them would be to have the next meeting of the Cabinet in the Seanad. At the last count he wanted the Taoiseach and six Ministers in here. Many of the points the Senator raised have been covered virtually every day during the past few weeks and I have responded to them already, particularly local authority finance, which has been raised on three occasions, and I have said each time that there will be a full debate on that issue.

Senator Dan Kiely also raised the issue of fishing policy and there will be debate on this fairly soon. I will refer to the Minister his query on the conveying of mental cases. The Senator also raised the question of the census. Perhaps that could be handled by a motion on the Adjournment.

Senator Fitzgerald raised the Universities Bill. The latest information on that Bill is that it was supposed to start yesterday in the Dáil, but because the Employment Equality Bill took up all the time it did not start. It is now scheduled to commence Second Stage in the Dáil on 6 November. My reckoning is that it will take two weeks on Second Stage before Committee Stage, which, I would imagine, will be fairly extensive. I would be surprised if we have the Bill in this House much before Christmas if not until the beginning of the next session.

I have nothing to add to what Senator Cashin said about RTÉ and its coverage of the ploughing championships. I have no function in the decision of the Committee on Procedure and Privileges yesterday and Senator Kiely can discuss that with the Chairman of the Committee.

Senator Burke raised the question of waste disposal. This is a major issue and it might perhaps be discussed in conjunction with local authority financing because I intend that debate to include both the financing of local authorities and the wider problems they face, on which there is a huge depth of expertise in this House. I am sure that will be a long debate and I will try to introduce it fairly soon.

Senator Moloney again raised the report on the safety of the fishing fleet. That is an issue worthy of debate and perhaps it could be taken in conjunction with a wider debate on the marine, which I hope to have in the next couple of weeks.

Order of Business agreed to.