Today's Order of Business is items 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5. Item 1, by agreement, will be without debate. I do not expect item 2, the reporting of amendments from the Dáil to a Seanad Bill, will take very long. There will be a time limit of 30 minutes per speaker on Item 3, the Freedom of Information Bill, 1996, Second Stage of which will probably not conclude today. That item will follow the completion of the Civil Liability (Amendment) Bill, 1996, until 4 p.m. There will be a sos from 1 p.m. to 2 p.m. Item 4 will commence at 4 p.m. and, subject to what I said yesterday, if there is agreement, we will take all Stages of item 4; item 5 will be taken from 4 p.m. If there is a difficulty about that, we will simply take Second Stage of item 4 and the remaining Stages and item 5 on today's Order Paper after the Appropriation Bill, which will be debated tomorrow.
Order of Business.
On item 3, if Senator Roche, who introduced a Freedom of Information Bill last year, required 45 minutes would that cause a problem?
On item 4, I agree with the Leader that, subject to the way the debate develops, we will meet tomorrow so it may be dealt with in that fashion.
I noted in the financial pages of this morning's newspaper that the Credit Union Bill has been flagged. I asked the Leader yesterday if he had any information on the matter. If he has, I would appreciate it.
If Senator Roche is to have 45 minutes on the Freedom of Information Bill, the House deserves an early warning notice to prepare itself. We will have a meeting of the Independents to see if we can agree to that and we will communicate with the Leader.
Many Senators raised the fact that, since the number of sittings days has increased, we need to take a serious look at the resources available to Members. Every Member should now be entitled to exclusive secretarial support. It is becoming more difficult for our staff to keep up with the business of two or three Senators. I know it is a matter for the Committee on Procedure and Privileges in the first instance but it is also a matter of which Members should be aware. We should start waving flags about and getting some reaction on the matter.
The other matter of which I would like to make the House aware in case I would be embarrassed at some other time, is that I have been involved recently with the parents council of the local post primary school in Swords, County Dublin. My wife and I have, at various times, gone around to local people, including, I must shamefully say, some supermarket owners, including that of my colleague, Senator Quinn, and, on a number of occasions, some of these supermarkets, including that of my colleague, have invested money in local school outings. I am sure this might find its way to the front page of some newspaper some time in the future so I would like to put it on the record. We are absolutely ashamed of what we did and I am sure Senator Quinn will share my shame in this, but that is the way life is at present.
I have no objection whatever to Senator Roche having an hour if he so wishes. Perhaps the Leader will consider that.
It must be Christmas.
Senator Magner should not tempt us. There might be an outbreak of seasonal humbug and ill will.
To follow on what Senator Wright said about the Credit Union Bill, which we have asked about for some time and for which the Leader gave a detailed timescale within the past couple of weeks, will the Leader outline the most up to date position?
To re-emphasise a point made yesterday we need an early debate on Northern Ireland, particularly in view of the statement made yesterday by the British Prime Minister that he felt the talks were now at a standstill. We should also note the remarks of the deputy leader of the Alliance Party, Mr. Séamus Close, when he said that politicians need guts and leadership to negotiate an agreement. The worry is that unless progress is made through talks and peaceful means, the vacuum which is inevitably created by a standstill will be filled by violence. We hope there will be no more violence, particularly over Christmas, and we ask IRA/Sinn Féin to restore the ceasefire at least temporarily. We all wish it to be restored permanently so that we can progress to meaningful talks.
I have no objection to giving Senator Roche 45 minutes on the Freedom of Information Bill as long as we do not have to give Senator Ross 45 minutes. It looks as if we will not finish Second Stage of that Bill today. I am anxious that it be dealt with as early as possible in the new session because it will take some time before it is passed. Public bodies and Departments will have to adjust to a big change in political culture from an assumption of secrecy to one of openness. We welcome this change but it will take time. It will also take time for the public to adapt to the fact that they are entitled to information that was denied to them for so long. I ask the Leader to deal with the rest of the Bill as soon as possible in the next session. I would also like to see the Credit Union Bill. I expected a copy of it this morning. I hope it will be made available to us as soon as possible.
I agree with Senator Dardis in relation to Northern Ireland. We call for a ceasefire and also for progress in the talks. Christmas is a time of reflection and we can only hope that this will lead to taking steps forward rather than backward. I agree that we should have a debate in this House as soon as possible in the new session.
The efficiency audit group which has been looking into the operations of the Army, the Navy and the Air Corps has been working for some time and we have not yet heard any of its results. Senator Dardis has an interest in this topic as he wants an airport opened on the south side of Dublin as do I. However, there are major concerns about the progress of the efficiency audit group and I would like the Minister for Defence to be present as early as possible in the next session for a major debate on the defence forces, the progress of the efficiency audit group report and the future of the Army.
I asked for a debate on the National Roads Authority some time ago. I also said that the reports of the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs are still not being published. What has the Leader been able to do about both those issues? The Credit Union Bill was mentioned. I note that, according to the terms of the Bill, credit unions will be able to offer credit card services. Perhaps the banks might cancel all our cards between now and Christmas incase the credit unions get a commercial advantage over them.
I am not sure exactly what Senator O'Toole was getting at when he spoke about looking for Christmas goodies from various bodies. I pay tribute to Dunnes Stores and everybody in that group for their contributions to charity over the years. There is no charity in Ireland which has not received a contribution from Dunnes Stores. As Mayor of Kilkenny, I can state that Dunnes Stores was first to send a subscription when requested.
That is not a matter for the Order of Business.
Dunnes Stores has been one of the largest contributors to charities throughout the world.
Senator Hayes asked about the safe return of the two farm leaders to Colombia. The Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs has tried to ensure that this will happen but who can ask the Government of Colombia to guarantee anyone's safety? That Government is run by a drug cartel and receives billions of dollars from——
A question to the Leader.
Will the Leader ask Senator Hayes to contact the Government of the United States to request the Colombian Government and President to stop discussing the sale of drugs? Perhaps we can then ensure the safety of all people living in Colombia.
Could the Senator run that by me again?
No.
I join with calls for a debate on Northern Ireland. I wish to draw attention to two aspects of this issue which the Leader might communicate to the Taoiseach and the Minister for Foreign Affairs. I do not recall any reference being made in the House to the 2,500 lb. bomb discovered at Drumadd on 28 November, the mortars found in west Belfast or the ongoing punishment beatings. However, for some reason, Members have mentioned other matters which caused concern, including the behaviour of a number of Protestants in Harryville. It is good that the actions of these individuals were condemned by many other Protestants living in that area.
Another matter, which should not be treated as of lesser importance I suggest the Leader raise with the Taoiseach, involves people such as myself who cannot vote for the British Labour Party. An organisation of which I am a member picketed Tony Blair outside Queen's University but when I spoke to him I merely received a wintry glance in return. There is no way I can vote for the party which, it appears, will govern Northern Ireland following the next British general election. I do not know how the Taoiseach and the Minister for Foreign Affairs might raise this worthy issue. We fought to halt the excesses of the Stormont Government and formed the first real opposition at that forum to highlight those excesses. We are surely entitled to a say and to vote for the British Labour Party when the time comes, regardless of whether it is in Opposition.
I am not satisfied with the Order of Business and I suggest that items No. 4 — the Oireachtas (Miscellaneous Provisions) and Ministerial and Parliamentary Offices (Amendment) Bill — and No. 5 not be taken today. I do not oppose the Bill in principle, but I oppose taking it today. To do so will send the wrong message to the public. The Bill will triple the revenue of the major political parties, which is not a trivial matter, and it is to be pushed through all Stages in 36 hours. I spoke in the House at 2.30 p.m. yesterday but I was unable to obtain a copy of the Bill at that time because it was not available. I only received a copy after 3 p.m. when it was finally published. The Bill was passed by the Dáil last night and it is intended to rush it through the Seanad today. Item No. 5 then requests that the President sign the Bill immediately.
What message does this send to the people about us? It states that politicians suit themselves and they push through legislation when they want something done. The Bill should not be taken today because of the aspect of retrospection. It should not be rushed through the House in such a short period. When Bills dealing with taxes or social welfare payments are debated, the public is made aware, months in advance, of the changes being introduced. This Bill has been made retrospective, but we can deal with that issue during this afternoon's debate.
I am not opposed to the Bill in principle, but to the message which rushing it through today sends out. I ask the Leader to amend the Order of Business and that we do not take this Bill today. The message the public will receive is that we are not cleaning the stables but feathering the nest. That is the opposite to what we want to convey. I suggest we do not take these two Bills until we have time to consider them and to let the public know we consider such matters seriously.
Will the Leader ask the Minister for the Environment to come to the House to discuss planning? Planning permission takes too long, particularly when we are trying to locate industries in rural areas. By the time environmental impact statements and objections have been dealt with, such industries will have set up elsewhere, for example, in Scotland, Devon or Cornwall. We should discuss this matter soon so that we can speed up the planning process.
Yesterday on the Order of Business I tried to raise an urgent matter. I am in a dilemma in that I must arrange a debate on the serious situation in Foyle Fisheries Commission before we adjourn. Our Government is party to religious discrimination and has been fined £40,000 as it is a joint manager. In the absence of a debate, will the Leader contact the Minister for the Marine? We want the resignation of two commissioners and we want the manager of Foyle Fisheries Commission to be sacked as he has been found guilty of religious discrimination which contributes——
That matter does not arise on the Order of Business. The Senator has an alternative way to raise this issue.
Unfortunately, I do not have an alternative.
The matter may be resubmitted for tomorrow's Adjournment debate and it might be sympathetically considered.
Far be it for me to disagree with the procedure of the House as I have been a Member for a long time, but I must listen to fairly lengthy contributions from Members with less important business. I must take a stand. Will the Leader recognise that the Government of which his party is a member has been found guilty of discrimination in the courts? This is the essence of what Senator McAughtry spoke about and from where religious bigotry comes. I seek a debate on this issue and——
This is not the time to raise this matter.
——as the Minister for Finance, Deputy Quinn, once said, I am looking for heads and I intend to get them.
I join with Senator Calnan in calling for a debate on planning. I would like the Minister to come to the House to discuss the matter in detail and to explain why planners must wait until the last minute to give a decision. Senator Calnan referred to job creation. It can take nine or ten months to get planning permission while in other countries an indication can be given in one month. The problem is greatest in large cities.
Newspaper reports indicate the Cabinet has made a decision on the abolition of services charges. Will the Leader clarify whether proposals to abolish service charges at local level include library charges? I have received several approaches from county librarians and members of the Library Association of Ireland over the past 24 hours. The Library Association of Ireland is my nominating body so I have more than a passing interest in this subject. Proposals and discussions regarding service charges focus on water and sewerage charges but no reference is made to library charges. Senators who are members of local authorities will be aware that the imposition of library charges is decided at the annual Estimates meetings. It is a charge on local taxpayers and ratepayers and it is included in the annual budget of each local authority. It has been a controversial matter for many years and has led to a decline in the usage of public libraries by those who need them most. It has been bitterly and continuously opposed by librarians and the Library Association of Ireland.
Will the Leader of the House seek clarification of the newspaper report before tomorrow? I appreciate this is a budgetary matter but the fact that the Cabinet has made a decision on the abolition of service charges is now in the public domain. Can the Leader clarify if that decision applies to library charges? Would he go further and convey to the Minister for the Environment the serious opposition to these charges and the concerns that have been raised by librarians that if this matter is not dealt with now it could be left on the back burner? I am grateful to the Cathaoirleach for allowing me to raise this matter.
When Senator Wright sought an extension of time for Senator Roche's contribution, I thought the request might also apply to some of his colleagues during the Order of Business. There is no difficulty in Senator Roche speaking for 45 minutes. Other spokespersons can also take 45 minutes, with 30 minutes for speakers thereafter.
The Credit Union Bill has been cleared by the Cabinet. It is a large Bill but it will be published before the end of the year. Sadly, it will not be a Seanad Bill. Senator O'Toole raised the issue of resources for Members. That is a matter for the Committee on Procedures and Privileges and the Oireachtas Joint Services Committee. Senator Dardis sought a debate on Northern Ireland. He, Senator McAughtry and Senator McGowan have made a good case for a major debate on Northern Ireland early in the next session. I will try to set a date early in January.
Senator O'Sullivan asked about the Freedom of Information Bill. It is a priority Bill and Committee Stage will be taken early in the next session and as much time as is necessary will be devoted to it. She also appears to have joined the ranks of the people who attack Senator Ross. We will probably have to form a society for the protection of Senator Ross, although every attack must help his vote getting ability in a certain constituency.
Senator Lanigan's omnibus contribution would bring the House back two weeks early after the break if we were to cover every issue he mentioned. I agree with his suggestion of a debate on the National Roads Authority. A series of statements or a debate on the Defence Forces would also be worthwhile and there is a degree of expertise in the House on that issue. The foreign affairs issue is a matter for the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs. I have raised the matter with the Minister for Finance but I have other priorities for the Seanad. If, after those matters have been dealt with, I can give the Senator support in that regard I will do so. Senator McAughtry made some points which could be included in a debate on foreign affairs.
Senator Quinn spoke about legislation being rushed through the Oireachtas. It is not uncommon for Bills to pass all Stages in one day. This time last year we passed licensing legislation in one day to accommodate the sale of drink on Christmas Eve, which fell on a Sunday. With regard to today's legislation, I am prepared to take Second Stage today with no time limit. As long as Members wish to speak on Second Stage they can do so. Committee Stage can be taken tomorrow with, again, no time limit. Item 5, the request for early signature, is simply that. The President may do as she wishes and if she has doubts about the constitutionality of the Bill she can refer it to the Supreme Court. If she does not like the Bill she can wait for the prescribed constitutional time limit before signing it. It is simply a request to the President and she may act on her own discretion. I would not like the House to divide on this issue. I will make as much time as needed available and the same will apply tomorrow.
Senator Calnan and Senator Cassidy mentioned planning. If they put down a motion perhaps we can have a debate on the matter. Senator Mooney raised service charges which is a matter for the Minister of the Environment. I am not privy to what happened at Cabinet and I do not have any detailed statement. I cannot add anything today but I will try to obtain some information for him. Senator McGowan raised the Foyles Fisheries Commission which is more suitable as a matter on the Adjournment.
Senator Quinn has moved an amendment to the Order of Business: "That items 4 and 5 be deleted." The amendment was not seconded and consequentially falls.