Seanad Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 16 Jun 1999

Vol. 159 No. 16

Order of Business.

Mr. Cassidy

Before proceeding to the Order of Business, on behalf of the House, I congratulate Senator Avril Doyle on becoming a Member of the European Parliament. We are all proud of her achievements. I have no doubt that she is a very suitable person to represent Ireland. We know of her many qualities. The people of Leinster are very fortunate to have someone of her ability to represent them in Europe for the next five years.

I also congratulate all the local authority members who have been elected or re-elected throughout the country and commiserate with those who have been defeated, particularly those with long service who did not avail of the retirement package. In his wisdom I hope the Minister for the Environment and Local Government will take the state of the economy into consideration and acknowledge their long service and great courage in standing for re-election, albeit unsuccessfully.

Today's Order of Business is Nos. 1 and 21, motion 28. On No. 1, Committee and Remaining Stages shall be taken today. No. 21, motion 28, shall be taken from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m., and business will resume thereafter, if not previously concluded.

Mr. Manning

I join the Leader in congratulating Senator Avril Doyle on her election to the European Parliament. This was an outstanding performance as it is an extraordinary achievement for someone to obtain 51 per cent of the votes in their county. The people of Wexford and Leinster have picked a candidate who will strongly represent them in Europe. We send our good wishes to the Senator who will remain in the House for the duration of this Parliament. Her election gives the House an opportunity to do something we have talked about as it gives an added European dimension to our debates through a link with the European Parliament. We should make good use of this opportunity.

I also congratulate other Members on their election, including the Leader who had a splendid vote. I hope this does not mean he will be leaving us to go to a lower place at some future date. I congratulate all those who were successful in the election. There were some spectacular vote getters among colleagues. I extend my sympathy to the small number of Members who were unsuccessful but this will be a temporary blip in their political careers.

On the Order of Business, will the Leader communicate with the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform as to the facts concerning the decision to refuse entry to a number of Polish visitors at the weekend? There appears to be some dispute over the facts. The Polish consul appears to be saying that these people were locked up and made to wear prison uniforms and were turned back in an arbitrary way. The authorities are saying otherwise. We cannot pass judgment but it is important that the Minister reports the facts to the House.

Will the Leader arrange a debate on the recent Ombudsman's report on the delays experienced by many elderly people in obtaining pensions to which they are entitled? This startling report is a credit to the Ombudsman and we would like to debate this issue.

Perhaps by tomorrow the Leader could let us know of the legislation he proposes to bring before the House by the end of the session.

Mr. O'Toole

I reiterate the congratulations and commiserations to those who stood in the local elections. As someone who never had any aspirations to stand in local elections and who has never been a member of a local authority I note that the work done by these authorities is not properly appreciated. It is important that those who are not members of local authorities show an appreciation of that work. The decision to stand for election should be appreciated as a participatory action in a democracy which is to be welcomed. I congratulate those who took part in the election.

I wish to return to an issue which I raised before in the House, namely the atrocious level of taxi and hackney services throughout the country. I know of cases in which business people, trade unionists and others will not come to Dub lin for meetings because of the difficulties of getting taxis to the airport. I am not making this up. We should double the number of taxis and hackneys in Dublin and other provincial centres immediately as there is no service. My understanding is that the Minister for the Environment and Local Government has taken steps to address this situation but these measures have not been acted upon at local authority level. They should be acted upon immediately. The situation is disgraceful and some people are taking risks by drinking and driving because they cannot get taxis or hackneys.

Will the Leader inquire as to whether the Minister for the Environment and Local Government is aware of a recent report published by the British traffic and accident authorities on the factors which contribute to road accidents? They have found conclusively that speed contributes only to approximately 4 per cent of accidents. If this is so, we have been misled badly because gardaí are giving people £50 speeding tickets for driving at 61 m.p.h. on perfectly good roads when they could be performing other functions. We are being misled regarding the "speed kills" campaign and I ask the Minister to come to this House to debate the matter.

On pensions, the situation outlined by the Ombudsman and referred to in a number of editorials in today's newspapers is disgraceful and needs to be debated in this House. There are 10,000 retired teachers and approximately 5,000 who retired prior to 1996 are still awaiting payment. Some £5 million in payments is still outstanding and many people have died without receiving this money.

I again ask the Leader for a debate on mandatory reporting. There have been horrific disclosures over the last two or three days in this regard and it is time there was a full debate on the issue in this House.

Mr. Costello

I support the remarks made in relation to the magnificent victory of Senator Avril Doyle on her election to the European Parliament and I wish her well in her new career. I congratulate all those who were successful in the local elections and commiserate with those who unfortunately were not successful on this occasion. However, these people will be back again. In that context, I ask the Leader of the House to raise with the Minister for the Environment and Local Government the issue of the low poll in the two elections and the referendum and I ask for a debate in this House on the issue. We need to have a look at the considerable decline in voting patterns in recent years. We must consider a suitable day for elections and whether multiple items should be dealt with on the same day. There was enormous apathy in relation to the referendum and very few people knew what the content of it was. This indicates that there is a need for considerable information to be made available. We must also consider put ting photographs on all ballot papers. This seems to have been successful in the European election. Many issues need to be considered and I call on the Leader to ask the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to come to this House to debate electoral democracy.

I also ask the Leader to approach the Minister for the Environment and Local Government in order to determine whether he has any plans for a millennium purchase scheme for local authority housing. There was such a scheme in Dublin in 1988 which was known as the millennium scheme. This was a very attractive package under which many local authority tenants bought their homes. The scheme was never extended to the country and as we approach the end of this millennium it would seem appropriate to have such a national scheme for local authority tenants. I would like to have a response from the Minister on the issue. I would also like a further response in relation to local authority flats. It has not been possible to purchase these flats because of legal conundrums but there seems to be no problem with private apartments. This issue must be addressed so that these flats can be included in the scheme.

On the question raised by Senator Manning regarding the refusal of entry to Polish visitors over the weekend, we should have a response from the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. Perhaps he will indicate whether he is making provision, as the Progressive Democrats and other Members of this House wish, for employment of asylum seekers for the duration of their application. Will he also indicate why he is refusing to allow the Department of Education and Science to provide State funding for students from this group who are taking post-leaving certificate courses and third level courses while such funding is allowed in primary and second level schools? These are serious matters.

I agree with Senator Manning's remarks on the report of the Ombudsman in relation to the disgraceful treatment of pensioners. The House should hold a full debate on the issue.

Mr. Dardis

I join my colleagues in congratulating Senator Keogh on her election to the European Parliament and in wishing her well.

Mrs. Ridge

Senator Doyle.

Mr. Dardis

I should say Senator Doyle. I wish it were Senator Keogh.

Mr. T. Hayes

That is wishful thinking.

Mr. Lanigan

At least the Senator has the right mindset.

Mr. Manning

Surely Senator Doyle is not that unobtrusive.

An Cathaoirleach

A slip of the tongue, Senator Dardis.

Mr. Dardis

There is only a passing similarity between the two Senators. I congratulate Senator Doyle on her election to the European Parliament. She will be an effective and good parliamentarian. She will be missed in the Seanad but we wish her well. It was a formidable electoral performance.

I also congratulate Members who won seats on various local authorities and I commiserate with those who did not succeed. I hope it will not diminish their enthusiasm for elected office or political life.

I agree with Senator Costello to a large extent. It would be useful if the Seanad reviewed the recent election and, perhaps, the days on which elections are held. A long time ago, I attempted to amend legislation in the Seanad to provide for the inclusion of candidates' pictures on ballot papers. I am glad they were included on the European election ballot papers. The practice should be implemented more widely. Nobody should be excluded from casting a vote because they might be illiterate or disabled in some other way. Inclusion of the candidates' pictures on the ballot papers is of major assistance. When I sought unsuccessfully to amend the legislation to that effect, it was suggested that it would create a beauty contest. I reject that. It should be done.

Another matter which causes concern and which should be considered during that debate is the deficiencies in electoral registers. Several people have pointed out in the past few days that there are considerable gaps in the registers. That is undesirable. If people wish to cast their vote, they should be able to do so. In the recent election, people turned up at polling stations only to be turned away. They had been on the electoral register for a long time – it was not a question of their being included on it for the first time – and their names had disappeared. That should not happen.

An Cathaoirleach

I wish to be associated with the congratulations and good wishes which have been extended to Senator Doyle on her election to the European Parliament.

Before I call the next speaker, I remind Senators that the Order of Business is limited to 30 minutes. Thirteen of those minutes have now elapsed and 12 Senators wish to speak. I ask them to be brief so as many speakers as possible can be facilitated.

Mr. Coogan

I have a record of being extremely brief.

An Cathaoirleach

That is correct.

Mr. Coogan

Senators referred to the recent elections. One of the disgraceful features of the poll was how the referendum was conducted. The majority of people did not have a notion about it. In fact, some had to ask returning officers what the amendment meant and they did not know either. The Government must be blamed for that.

Has the report of the Radiological Institute been completed? I asked about this on a number of occasions. If it has been completed, will the Leader bring it before the House for debate?

Two weeks ago I asked about the gas find off the west coast and asked the Leader to invite the Minister for the Marine and Natural Resources to the Seanad. The Leader said the Minister had been in the House seven weeks previously and that he would not come back to the House. However, the Minister told the House nothing nine weeks ago. I am anxious to find out if the assets from the west are being given away – not just sold – and what benefits will accrue to the west if this happens. I again ask the Leader to organise a debate on the gas find off the west coast.

Mr. Glynn

I wish to refer briefly to the constitutional referendum. I chaired an all-party committee when I was president of the Association of Municipal Authorities of Ireland in 1989-90 which brought forward that recommendation. It was also brought forward by the general council and, subsequently, by LAMA. It is clear that the Minister for the Environment and Local Government listens to such advice. There was no provision in the Constitution recognising local government. It could have been abolished at any time at the whim of Government. It is important it is there and that elections must be held every five years.

On the electoral register, it is an absolute disgrace—

An Cathaoirleach

It is totally irrelevant to the Order of Business of the House.

Mr. Glynn

I am making a proposal on this matter.

An Cathaoirleach

It is not in order to make proposals on the Order of Business.

Mr. Glynn

I am calling for a debate.

An Cathaoirleach

It is in order to do so only in so far as they affect the business of the day.

Mr. Glynn

If the Cathaoirleach allows me to continue I will come to that.

Mr. Burke

Is the Senator expecting an election?

Mr. Glynn

Not at all, but we will deal with it if it occurs. There is no fear about that. We must look at the way the electoral register is compiled. It is an abject failure as it stands. The names of people who have been dead ten and 12 years were on the electoral register in my county. That is an absolute disgrace.

Mr. O'Toole

Did they vote?

Mr. Glynn

That is a fact. We should invite the Minister to the House and bring forward proposals to improve the compilation of the register.

My final point is a matter which has been raised in this House previously. I was very dismayed and disturbed to learn that yet again there have been attempted abductions of children around the country. It is absolutely imperative that the Garda, parents, each Member of this House and the public at large are on their guard against this. What proposals can this House make? We debated this matter not too long ago but I feel it is opportune to have another debate. I propose we do so.

Mrs. Ridge

I want to mention the beauty contest. I believe I mentioned putting the faces of candidates on ballot papers. I emphasised it was a political beauty contest which is a completely different thing.

I agree with Senator O'Toole on the taxi and hackney service. Why can quality bus corridors not be released to hackney drivers as well as taxi drivers?

My main point is that in view of the entry of VHI into the child care field, it is imperative we have a debate regarding the provision of what is a non-health service. I am not disputing anyone's right to provide it; the need for it is very great. However, I wonder whether it will be included in the yearly premium. Existing providers may have been left out, with a large group coming in to provide an essential service. I hope the Leader will accept the urgency of this matter and have an early debate in it.

Mr. Ross

Perhaps the Leader would ask the Minister for Public Enterprise to make a statement on a disturbing aspect of the Telecom flotation. Banks are, almost unanimously, shovelling money at punters to gamble in the Telecom flotation. All the banks are issuing pamphlets suggesting people take out 100 per cent unsecured loans to gamble in Telecom shares. This is irresponsible banking and targets people who are vulnerable in areas of which they are totally ignorant. The Minister should make a statement to discourage people and banks from taking this course. It is the only blot on an extremely healthy flotation.

I have consistently asked for a reply on the issue of lobbyists in this House. Like many of the more controversial issues this is resting with a distant sub-committee which has yet to report. I will not personalise this, but there are lobbyists in this House representing God knows who and doing God knows what. It is time they were regulated and we knew what they are doing and who they represent. I would like the Leader to state what he intends to do about it soon. There has been a recent controversy in this area to which I do not wish to refer as I do not know the rights and wrongs of it. However, it has brought the issue to a head and we need an immediate answer.

Mr. Finneran

I agree with Senator Ross's point about banks intending to give 100 per cent loans to people to buy shares in Telecom Éireann. It is an unsavoury involvement in the share offer and they should be discouraged from doing so. People may be vulnerable in that they could believe a nest egg is for the taking. I would like some form of regulation or guidance from the Department of Finance in the form of either a ministerial order or statement.

Can we have a debate as soon as possible on the widespread use of illegal drugs given the arrest in the past 48 hours of approximately 200 drug dealers? The arrests were not confined to Dublin but extended over ten counties. One of the dealers is as young as 14. It is obvious to everyone that the drug problem affects every village and town and is a matter of grave public concern to parents, teachers and community leaders. While the Garda should be complimented on their activity and success in tackling the drugs problem, it is time the matter was debated. Perhaps the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform could attend on a suitable occasion when he could be made aware of the wisdom of the House on the matter.

Mr. Burke

I support Senator Coogan in his call for a debate on the gas find off the west coast and I hope the Leader arranges that.

One issue raised on doorsteps in the local elections was the long waiting lists for orthodontic treatment. It is a scandal that people must wait four, five and up to six years in some cases for orthodontic treatment in the era of the Celtic tiger. We should have a debate on the matter. Perhaps the Leader could arrange that at the earliest possible opportunity so that finances can be provided immediately to shorten the waiting lists.

Mr. Walsh

I join in the congratulations to my constituency colleague, Senator Avril Doyle. The high vote she obtained in Wexford is probably indicative of the sense of disadvantage Wexford people have given our low industrial base and high unemployment. I hope the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment will address those issues.

I concur with the comments of the Leader of the House regarding councillors who lost their seats, especially those who also lost the gratuity. I agree with him that there should be an early debate on the matter with the Minister for the Environment and Local Government in attendance. It would be a travesty if people who gave a lifetime of service to local government now found themselves without some financial recognition of those years of service.

While we had our examination on Friday, we should remember another group of people who are sitting their leaving certificate examination. Will the Leader raise with the Minister for Education and Science the manner in which leaving certificate papers are prepared? There has been a great deal of controversy in past days regarding a number of higher level papers which have not been in the format expected and have not adhered to the expected content. It is unfair to students who have given a number of years to studying hard to find themselves fazed as a consequence of being surprised by an exam paper. Will the Leader tell the Minister that this should not happen in future because it not only affects the results of this examination but also impinges on students' career prospects? It is a major issue which I would like to see addressed and debated in the House.

Mr. Quinn

Will the Leader ensure sufficient time is allocated to Committee Stage of the Copyright and Related Rights Bill tomorrow? The Bill is 196 pages long. We are debating the Committee and Remaining Stages of the Education (Welfare) Bill today which is all right because, at 30 pages, it is probably capable of being dealt with in one day. However, I am concerned that one of the few Bills initiated in the Seanad is being allocated too little time for its Committee Stage. Will the Leader ensure it is dealt with in chunks rather than an attempt being made to cover it all in one day? It is a worthy Bill which deserves a great deal of attention.

Given the importance to Ireland of a strong, credible World Trade Organisation, will the Leader ask the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment to ensure our representative to that organisation does all he or she can to ensure agreement is reached on the appointment of a new leader? It seems that a consensus was not reached at yesterday's meeting in Geneva in respect of either of the two nominees. Last week the Financial Times asked whether, in the event that such a consensus could not be reached, it would be possible to establish a committee under the chairmanship of, for example, Peter Sutherland, to search for a strong and important person to lead the World Trade Organisation. Ireland should take a proactive role in ensuring that agreement is reached on the appointment of someone to lead this important international body.

Ms Cox

I support calls for a debate on the local elections and the referendum. I understand that approximately £1 million was spent on promoting and disseminating information on the referendum. That was a disgraceful waste of money and it should not be allowed to happen again. We must re-examine the position and the Minister should come before the House to hear our views. It is vitally important to consider what is causing the trend toward low turnouts at elections and to take action to arrest that trend. We must ensure that young people are encouraged, whether by means of education or some other medium, to become interested in the political system. Ireland will not make progress if these people are not interested in the people elected to govern. It is vital that this matter be discussed.

Mr. Ryan

Does the Leader have any information about No. 3, Report Stage of the Criminal Justice (United Nations Convention against Torture) Bill, 1998? If Irish courts are to follow the British precedent, the fact that we have not enacted this legislation means that General Pinochet would go free if he ever landed in Ireland.

I wish to request a debate, hopefully in the presence of the Taoiseach or the Minister for Foreign Affairs, on the outcome of the Cologne summit where an alarming move towards European defence collaboration was agreed.

With regard to the Tánaiste's commitment to deregulate the licensing laws – I do not refer here to the extension of opening hours but to the deregulation of the system – when will the relevant legislation be introduced?

On the issue of substances which are harmful to people's health, while I am concerned about the availability illegal substances I must reiterate that tobacco is responsible for killing huge numbers of people. A report on passive smoking and its impact on children's health was published today and I would like to see smoking banned in all areas where children or pregnant women are present.

I extend my best wishes to those junior certificate students who on Friday afternoon will sit the first examination in the State's history on civil, social and political studies. Students intent on taking this examination were advised to read the newspapers to discover what was happening in the political process. Most of the time they would have to search hard to discover what is happening in the political arena and the majority of these children who are 15 years of age should not be up at 11.30 p.m. watching "Oireachtas Report". It is very difficult for anyone to discover what is happening in the political arena.

I wish to draw the Leader's attention to a very serious matter arising from the list of papers laid before the Seanad. I refer to No. 5, Bass (Restriction on Sale) Order, 1999, and I believe the Leader should communicate with the Taoiseach on this as a matter of urgency.

Mr. Lanigan

Numerous calls have been made for the establishment of a press council. People must realise the enormity of the problem which exists in this area. In an article published in the Sunday Business Post on 13 June reference was made to a bankrupt solicitor's bizarre system of financial management being outlined in court and it was stated that Property World and Vincent O'Donoghue are separate. Mr. O'Donoghue was quoted as stating, “I have never had anything to do with Property World and I don't now.” On the same day the Sunday Independent, in the “Homes and Houses” supplement, under an article carrying the headline “You'll be moved to tears”, published another article entitled “Vincent O'Donoghue and Property World 2000 – Dublin-based firm offers northern portfolios for southern property investors”, which I guarantee will move Members to tears. A half page adver tisement was placed in a supplement of the Sunday Independent inviting Irish people to invest money in properties while at the same time the court was grilling the promoter. This is an example of why we need a genuine press council. I ask the Leader to consider this matter seriously. An advertisement was placed in a reputable supplement inviting investment while at the same time we have a bizarre bankrupt system of financial management. The headline provided by Madeleine Keane would move anyone to tears. Taking the two articles together her headline is probably correct.

Mr. Norris

On the Order Paper there are a number of motions expressing, representing or reflecting concern about the attitude of immigration officials. Today is special for many people in Dublin because it is Bloomsday. With that in mind I ask the Leader to express to the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the strong concern of Members about the arrest of a Japanese lady yesterday at 1 p.m. Perhaps we should have an investigation into the facts surrounding this case. I was apprised of the arrest by the secretary of a former Minister at 1 p.m. yesterday. This lady has a substantial income and her family has a business in Tokyo. She travelled to Dublin for Bloomsday and did not need a visa to do so. Unfortunately, she was arrested on foot of information that she had been refused a visa in London and was put on a plane back to Amsterdam. That is an extraordinary and high-handed way to behave.

Mr. Ryan

It is typical.

Mr. Norris

Representatives from the other House attempted to contact the immigration officials concerned by telephone but they refused to talk to them. As a gesture of goodwill the Government should pay the fare for that women to come back here and I will entertain her at the James Joyce Centre. The ill treatment of this lady will do irreparable damage to the image of Ireland in Japan. This is a serious issue and no one should make a joke of it. We are happy to make money out of our great writers when it suits us. We talk about Ireland being an island of the welcomes. Let us ensure that our immigration officials do not let us down.

My colleague and friend Senator Ross mentioned lobbyists. They are a matter of concern. However, I am also concerned about the way political parties make use of every fragment of information and put a malign construction on it. I warned Fianna Fáil when they started to attack programme managers because they are an excellent device for mediating between professional politicians and civil servants. I said it in the past and I say it now because it appears the same thing is happening to the Taoiseach's adviser, whom I will not name but whom the House knows well. He is a thoroughly decent man with whom I am glad and honoured to be associated in cultural activities.

An Cathaoirleach

In accordance with the resolution of the House and as 30 minutes have now elapsed since the Order of Business was proposed, I must call the Leader to conclude.

Mr. Callanan

On a point of order, it is well past the time. Would it not have been better to adhere to the 30 minute limit or allow it to continue?

Mr. Cassidy

Senators Manning and O'Toole called on the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform to clarify the position regarding the refusal to allow Polish visitors into the country during the past number of days. I will convey their concerns to and seek clarification from the Minister on the issue. I will also inform the House tomorrow morning of the legislation that must be processed before the end of this session.

Senator Manning has called for a debate on the report and delay in providing pension rights on numerous occasions. I will set aside time for such a debate.

Senators O'Toole and Ridge expressed their concern about the poor taxi service in Dublin. I agree with their sentiments and I will set aside time for a debate to take place before the end of this session.

Senator O'Toole called on the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to have a debate and to publish a report on road accidents. During the local elections in County Westmeath the electorate did not raise many problems on the canvass over the past four weeks. The most important issue raised – 75 per cent more often than anything else – by residents and parents in towns and villages was the speed of traffic. I had thought it was just a case of one or two people getting anxious at our cumainn and comhairle cheantair meetings, but having canvassed door to door and having spoken to mothers, families and schools, I will allow time for a debate and will ask the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to attend. It is certainly the most important issue in rural Ireland. I put it down to the major investment made by the Government in upgrading the road system and to the new fine top tar system used.

Senator O'Toole called for a debate on pension rights for teachers and delays in that regard. He again called for mandatory reporting, an issue on which I have assured him we will have a debate before the end of this session. Senators Costello, Dardis and Cox conveyed their experiences of polling day and called for the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to come to the House in the light of the low poll turnout. Senator Dardis mentioned the register of electors. Those canvassing early and who called to people's doors before the Monday of the week preceding the election could have had people added to the register, particularly students. This was done in most areas and is the reason the Minister included this provision.

The low polling is a feature in cities rather than in rural areas. In rural areas, local radio has taken over, is widely listened to and is, in the main, very positive. National television, national press and radio are hammering politicians and the political system, saying it is not good and that it does nothing. They are brainwashing people into believing there is no point in voting. The economy and the achievements of this country are thanks to former Taoisigh and politicians. The sooner the media stops knocking the political system the better. I thank local radio and the local press for the positive role they have played. In my area, there was a 65 per cent turnout, which I believe was due mainly to the local media being so positive and relaying the good news.

Senator Costello also called for the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to allow the purchase of houses and flats for the millennium. This was proposed in the Dáil by Deputy Noel Ahern in no uncertain terms, and I fully agree with the sentiments expressed. I will allow time for this issue to be debated in the House and will pass on the request to the Minister's office today.

Senator Coogan and Senator Burke called on the Minister for the Marine and Natural Resources to come to the House for statements to bring us up to date on the gas find off Galway. Senator Cox also called for such a debate before the local elections and I will leave time aside to debate this issue. Senator Coogan wanted to know the up to date situation on the radiological report, and I will see at what stage it is after the Order of Business.

Senator Glynn expressed views on the referendum which relate to the previous remarks I made. He also called for a debate on child abduction. The Senator has highlighted this issue many times on the Orders of Business and it is a cause of considerable concern. I will allow time for such a debate. Senator Ross expressed concerns as a professional as well as a public representative about banks making unsecured loans available to people to purchase Telecom Éireann shares on flotation. I noted his remarks and will pass them on to the Minister for Finance.

Senator Finneran and Senator Ross called for the regulation of lobbyists, and for regulations to be put in place to govern lobbyists in the Houses. This can probably be included in the new ethics legislation which is due before the House shortly.

Senator Finneran called for a debate on the increasing drugs problem and drug dealers and I will allow time for this. Senator Paddy Burke called for a debate on the waiting lists for orthodontic treatment and I will also allow time for this. Senator Walsh called for recognition by the Minister for the Environment and Local Government of those who have served for a long time in public office as local authority members and who were unfortunate in not being re-elected. Senator Walsh is a former president of LAMA and has wide experience in this area. I welcome his support for the call which I made earlier.

Senator Quinn called for as much time as possible for Committee Stage of the Copyright and Related Rights Bill which will be taken tomorrow and I assure the Senator this will be done. I remind the Senator that last year one third of all legislation was initiated in the Seanad and this year at least one third will be initiated in the Seanad. I will also pass on Senator Quinn's views about the World Trade Organisation and I fully agree with the sentiments he expressed.

Senator Ryan expressed concerns about No. 3. This will be taken before the end of the session. Regarding the Taoiseach or the Minister for Foreign Affairs coming to the House for statements on the Cologne summit, I will see what I can do in relation to bringing the Minister to the House. Senator Ryan also raised the licensing regulations. As Members are aware, the licensing laws will be updated in the autumn. I will see how this is progressing and will return to the Senator on the matter.

Senator Lanigan again called for the establishment of a press council. I promised the House that I would allow time for a full debate on this matter and will do so at the earliest possible opportunity.

Senator Norris pointed out very serious concerns about a visitor from Japan. I will inquire about the matter from the offices of the Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on the conclusion of the Order of Business and will return to the Senator on it.

Order of Business agreed to.