The Order of Business for today is No. 1, ACC Bank Bill, 2001 – Second Stage, with the contributions of spokespersons not to exceed 20 minutes and of all other Senators not to exceed 15 minutes, and Senators may share time.
Order of Business.
Will the Leader let me know if he can arrange a debate on Northern Ireland in the near future? There is a general feeling in the House that such a debate should take place.
I had not intended to get into the controversy on the protocol surrounding last Monday's State occasion in Dublin Castle, but I find the comments of the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy O'Donnell, a bit rich. The one group that behaved with propriety in this controversy is the Roman Catholic Church, including the cardinal. For the Minister of State to gratuitously and offensively attack the Roman Catholic Church for—
Will Senator Manning bear with me?
I will, a Chathaoirligh.
I ruled discussion on this matter out of order yesterday morning and I would prefer that a controversial matter such as that, which is not relevant to the Order of Business, should not be raised.
When the Cathaoirleach made his ruling yesterday, the Minister of State had not made her utterly unfair remarks, which will offend a great number of people. Will the Leader of the House allow time to discuss this matter?
I do not intend to get involved in a controversy on this matter, except to say that there are issues that could be discussed without alluding to the personalities involved, in so far as that is possible.
Hear, hear.
As a black Protestant, I fully endorse what Senator Manning said. The Roman Catholic Church has behaved very well and with immense dignity in this controversy and has been put in great political difficulty. That is all I have to say on that issue.
Will the Leader allow time for a debate on the power and role of the trade unions, during which some of us could question the fact that the authority of the Oireachtas, this House in particular, has been usurped by what are euphemistically known as the social partners, particularly the senior social partner? It is a legitimate subject for scrutiny and debate.
I will not get engaged in the controversy between church and State, but the general issues involved could be addressed in an open, logical debate. The proper protocols that operate in both church and State require discussion in that those of each operate independently. This controversy could have been avoided if there had been a clear elaboration of what those protocols are and how the State conducts its business.
Will the Leader let me know when the Local Government Bill will come before the House? We have raised this week after week and we have had all sorts of rumours and speculations by the media. We believe there are negotiations taking place between the Independent Members and the Chief Whip and we do not know what will happen. Now we are approaching the end of the session in the Oireachtas, and we were led to believe that the Bill would be taken well before now. I am concerned that it will proceed into the autumn and time may not be available to deal properly with the legislation in this House.
I will not get involved in controversy, but I will raise a practical issue concerning the decision by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Rural Development to allow farm-to-farm sales. The roundabout way of attaining permits to transport cattle that are being sold is very inconvenient to farmers, especially buyers and sellers. I urge the Leader of the House to ask the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry if there is some way of expediting this system. Currently one has to get a form from the local Teagasc office, send it to Bandon and then wait a couple of days for it to come back. It is supposed to arrive by return of post but that is not the case. I know farmers who have experienced a longer wait than three days for the forms and it is seriously inconveniencing them.
I agree with the remarks of my leader this morning with regard to church-State protocols. I hope it is a matter which can be resolved satisfactorily in the near future.
Many of our tax exiles occupy exalted positions in this country and play prominent roles in society. The Government has favoured a number of them with various State appointments.
Senator Coghlan might leave out the preamble and put his question or request to the Leader of the House.
Are you trying to kill me off altogether? As ever, I was coming to it. Will the Leader tell us the plans of the Government, if any, to encourage the relocation of these tax exiles and help to make them more patriotic?
It would take more than an Act of Parliament to do that.
I support the matter raised by Senator Rory Kiely as I had an urgent call regarding this matter this morning. While I welcome the thrust of the Minister's announcement last week, I join with the Senator in calling on him to simplify procedures regarding farm to farm movements.
Would it be possible to invite the Minister for the Environment and Local Government into this House to have a debate on the law as it pertains to transient traders? This matter has been around for quite some time. Large convoys of caravans are invading private property and money is demanded from the owner to leave, which is an absolute scandal.
I can assure Senator Costello that this side of the House is extremely concerned about the Local Government Bill, but I am confident that the Government will deal effectively with it. When it comes into this House, as the Leader of the House has said, it will get a speedy and efficient passage and I hope we will have the co-operation of the Labour Party.
I support the calls for a debate on redefining the relationship between church and State. It is an important debate although the cir cumstances are a bit unfortunate. Everybody who was a principal player in this situation was hurt and upset about it. We have to look at the fact that there are people who are in second relationships and relationships outside marriage who deserve dignity. I deplore the opportunism of some members of the Church of Ireland clergy who seemed to jump on the bandwagon and try to upstage the Roman Catholic Church in a way that it I think was quite—
Senator Norris, please, this is not relevant to the Order of Business in the House.
I am calling for a debate so that we can redefine the relationship between church and State. I think it has changed since the Constitution of 1937, but I do not think it should be used as a device for hammering the Roman Catholic Church.
I ask the Leader to put a date on the debate he promised yesterday in a general sense on the Middle East. It is important that we have a debate in this House, among other things, to afford to people like myself who are strong supporters of Israel the opportunity to express their concern and also to condemn certain actions by the Israeli military.
I support the call by Senator Rory Kiely regarding the movement of cattle scheme. The situation which has developed is causing grave hardship throughout the country, both financial and otherwise. For some time I have been calling for a system of simple and easy movement of cattle which would involve the district veterinary office. This would be a simple procedure, but the Minister has not put it in place.
They seem to be able to move them freely in Tipperary.
But it took a few Kerrymen to move them. There is a shortfall in funding for the housing aid for the elderly scheme in almost every health board. We are certainly not doing good for the elderly. It is a good scheme that many people could avail of for basic facilities such as toilets or roofs, windows or doors etc. on their houses.
I take it you are seeking a debate on this issue.
I am not actually. I am seeking more funding from the Minister regarding it.
I support what Senator Manning said this morning. It is an extraordinary state of affairs when the State honours an individual in a very special way for the high office he has attained and then on the other hand attacks that individual and the institution he represents.
I will discuss Senator Manning's request for a debate on Northern Ireland with the leaders after the Order of Business today. In the light of the elections there we must consider the wisdom of a debate during this time.
I will bear in mind the requests of Senators Manning, Ross, Costello, Coghlan, Norris and Doyle. Senator Doyle has a long and distinguished record of service with the church.
I will allocate time for Senator Ross on the powers and role of the trade unions. Senator Costello called again for an update on the timeframe for the Local Government Bill in the Seanad. This Bill is currently in the Dáil and it is envisaged that all Stages will be passed in the Seanad before the summer recess. I put the House on notice that we will be sitting until the end of the second week of July especially to deal with this Bill. I do not want any Senators making holiday plans because we may have to sit in the third week if necessary.
Senators Rory Kiely, Coghlan and Tom Hayes called on the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Rural Development to further free up the farm-to-farm movement of cattle. I understand that the Minister is doing everything he possibly can under the circumstances and that this will be reviewed. It is hoped an announcement will be made in the next seven to ten days.
I have listened attentively to what Senator Coghlan has said on the matter he raised. I will allow time to accommodate Senator Glynn's call for a debate with the Minister for the Environment and Local Government on transient traders. With regard to Senator Norris's call for a timeframe on the Middle East debate, I said in the House yesterday that there is much legislation coming before us, five Bills in the next three weeks, and they will have to take priority. In view of the requests from Senators for debates on various important issues, I intend to discuss with the leaders and the whips this morning the possibility of sitting until ten o' clock on Tuesday evenings to allow some of these debates to take place.
I also have to bear in mind the staff and everyone else involved in the running of the House. The Cathaoirleach is always mindful of these issues. We either sit earlier on Tuesday or sit later to facilitate the various requests for debates. There is quite an amount of legislation coming up before the summer recess, not just these five Bills that we have in the next three weeks.
Senator Tom Hayes has been calling on the Minister for Health and Children regarding the care for the elderly scheme. As all of us who are members of health boards know, there has been a substantial increase in the allocation for it this year. I understand that it is difficult for the health boards to get contractors to do the work for those who are badly in need. That is the experience of the Midland Health Board area. Senator Tom Hayes is in a neighbouring health board area and I would not expect there to be much difference. This excellent scheme has great merit in that it allows people who have served the nation long and hard to stay in their own homes and long may it continue. It is magnificent to see it in operation, whether windows or doors are being replaced or a roof is being redone. The House will strive to secure even greater funding for it in the forthcoming budget and I have no doubt that the very efficient Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Martin, will provide for a further increase in its allocation.
I did not hear the reply of the Leader of the House as to whether he agrees with the views of the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy O'Donnell, on the current controversy. Perhaps he will let us have it.
Order of Business agreed to.