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Seanad Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 11 Mar 2008

Vol. 188 No. 22

Schools Building Projects.

Dromclough national school, Listowel, County Kerry, has been already brought to the attention of the Department of Education and Science by Senator Ned O'Sullivan, who shares my interest and concern in this regard. I wish also to raise the situation at Rahan national school, Mallow, County Cork.

Both schools have experienced various problems for many years. Of concern to both schools is their position on the Department's list. The Department's school building programme is based on various stages including stage 1, initial sketch; stage 2, design; stage 3, tender, action, evaluation and award; stage 4, construction; stage 5, hand-over of works and so on. Two problems arise, namely, the Department regularly changes the stages of development and there is no clear transparency in this regard. I know that the Minister of State has had to deal with these issues. Schools must be kept informed of their position on the list and of their progress from year to year.

Dromclough national school has experienced subsidence in sections of its building; the heating failed completely and had to be replaced; pipes underneath the building are broken and floors are cracked. One might well ask what the problem is. The problem is that the school has been waiting more than two years for a site visit and is having difficulty obtaining information through Tullamore and the various press offices. When one phones the building section, one is told it communicates only with the Minister's office and when one rings the Minister's office one is told to ring the building section. This has happened. I have a record of it in my office. I spoke to a person in the building section and was told to take up the matter with the Minister's office. When I contacted that office I was told to take up the matter with the building section and the person in the Minister's office with whom I spoke then put me through to the same person in the building section who earlier could not deal with my query. The system is a nonsense. We have complained about procedures in the HSE on various occasions, but I have outlined what is happening in this Department. I should not have to raise this matter here. I should know exactly what is the position in regard to these school projects, what will happen next in the process, when the next stage will occur and what is the likely stage of projects in the process. That is simply not happening.

We need to know the reason Drumclough national school has been waiting one and half years for a technical team visit, and the names and locations all the schools on the list awaiting a technical visit. The Minister usually appoints such a team at the beginning of each year, but we do not know the exact date of that proposed technical visit. We do not know why the school was not assessed, when it will be assessed, who will assess it and where it will be ranked on the list. I could go on about the position of this school.

Rahan national school has a problem of rat infestation and a school building issue. The project is at stage 1, preliminary level, but it should be processed to stage 2 because it has been designated as a school that needs to accommodate the requirements of a principal and eight teachers. Why has a stop been put to the school's progressing to the next stage of project? The board of management had an open discussion with the Department of Education and Science in Tullamore last month about the position, but the Department would not commit on the position. It has said that a ministerial decision is required and that the project is subject to funding, whatever that means at this stage.

The principal of Rahan national school told me that the school he attended in the 1960s was in better condition than the school of which he is principal. This position is appalling. There are many schools in a similar position. The principals and teachers in these schools do not believe their pupils are getting the chance to which they are entitled in a modern 21st century school.

The difficulty is how the schools progress from step to step in this process. Members should not have to raise the case of three or four schools on the Adjournment every week. We should know where schools are on the list of projects and the schools that move up the list. Such a list should be no different from an accident and emergency list, a waiting list to see a consultant or to have an operation. The position should be clear and projects should move from one stage of the process to the other.

Transparency is needed in this process. While I appreciate that the Minister of State's reply will be circumscribed, as that is the nature of these matters, can he tell me when these two schools will be given clearance for the process to move to the next stage? If he cannot tell me that, can he tell the problem preventing such clearance in these two schools? We are not aware of any problem, the school authorities have met the demands and done everything required of them, but they still do not know what will happen next. I look forward to a positive reply from the Minister of State and to hearing that something will be done.

I thank the Senator for raising this matter. I am replying on behalf of the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Hanafin, who is unable to be here. I assure the Senator that I will bring the contents of his contribution to the attention of the Minister tomorrow.

As the Senator is aware, all applications for capital funding are assessed in the modernisation and policy unit of the Department of Education and Science. The assessment process determines the extent and type of need presenting based on the demographics of an area, proposed housing developments, condition of buildings, site capacity etc., leading ultimately to an appropriate accommodation solution. As part of this process, a project is assigned a band rating under published prioritisation criteria for large-scale building projects. These criteria were devised following consultation with the education partners. Projects are selected for inclusion in the school building and modernisation programme on the basis of priority of need. This is reflected in the band rating assigned to a project. In other words, a proposed building project moves through the system commensurate with the band rating assigned to it.

As the Senator is aware, almost €600 million in public funding is being provided for school buildings during 2008. This will enable the completion of work on 67 large-scale primary schools projects that will deliver 7,000 additional permanent school places in new schools and 2,300 additional permanent school places in existing schools; construction work on 150 devolved projects under the permanent accommodation scheme which will provide 8,000 additional places in existing primary schools; in the post-primary sector construction work will be completed on 19 large-scale projects, which will provide 2,400 permanent school places in four new schools; and additional accommodation and refurbishment works in 15 schools that will benefit over 7,000 pupil attendees; the purchase of sites to facilitate the smooth delivery of the school building programme particularly in rapidly developing areas; and the progression of new projects through architectural planning and design stages.

On 1 February last, the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Hanafin, announced the first tranche of projects that will proceed to construction this year. Further announcements will be made as the budgetary position for 2008 allows. Construction is also due to start in 2008 on the first bundle of PPP schools, while further will be offered to the market next year with a view to building work commencing in later years.

This is an enormous programme of work by any standards and, while there will continue to be a focus during the year on providing extra places in developing areas, the Department will also deliver improvements in the quality of existing primary and post-primary school accommodation throughout the country. The emphasis, however, will be on new schools and extensions to provide additionality in rapidly developing areas.

To address the projects of particular concern for the Senator, Dromclough national school is a co-educational facility with a current enrolment of 193 pupils. Since 2001, this represents a modest increase in enrolment of 29 pupils. The school has a current staffing of a principal, seven mainstream assistants and three learning support-resource teachers. The school authority submitted an application to the Department for large-scale capital funding for an extension project. The long-term staffing figure, on which accommodation needs will be based, has been determined. It has been agreed that accommodation should be provided to cater for a long-term projected staffing of a principal, eight mainstream assistants and appropriate ancillary accommodation.

Rahan national school is also a co-educational primary school with an enrolment of 91 pupils in September 2007. The school has a current staffing of a principal, three mainstream class teachers and one permanent learning support-resource teacher. The school has applied for a new school building. The long-term staffing has been agreed at a principal, eight mainstream assistants and appropriate ancillary accommodation.

Both these projects attract a band two rating. The next step for them is the appointment of a design team. This will be considered as the school building programme is rolled out over the coming months. In addition, an application by Rahan national school to replace temporary accommodation this year has been approved by the Department of Education and Science.

I thank the Senator for raising this matter and point out that over the lifetime of the national development plan the Government is providing funding of €4.5 billion for school buildings. This will be the largest investment programme in schools in the history of the State and it will enable my Department to ensure that school places are available where they are needed. This investment will allow my Department to continue the school building programme which commenced during the lifetime of the last national development plan when well over €2.6 billion was invested in school development, delivering over 7,800 projects.

I will bring the Senator's contribution to the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Hanafin.

I thank the Minster of State for his reply and appreciate what he said. I wish to make two points following his reply which he might also convey to the Minister. He said it was agreed that accommodation should be provided for Drumclough national school, of which the school authorities have been advised. I am trying to ascertain for them what will happen next in the process and when it will happen. The Minister of State does not have the answer to that question and I do not blame him for that, but the answer should be known.

What I find depressing about this process is the time wasted. I hate the waste of parliamentary time, whether in regard to parliamentary questions in the other House or Adjournment matters in this House. The official with whom I dealt in the building section of the Department — whom I will not embarrass by revealing the individual's name — asked why, if I was so concerned, I would not raise this matter as an Adjournment item. We are wasting our time like this.

The principal of Rahan national school asked me where is the dignity for the pupils progressing through a lovely rural location being taught in tight cramped substandard accommodation. What the Minister of State has told me in good faith is that the next step for these schools is the appointment of a design team and that this will be considered as the school building programme is rolled over the coming months. That is stated as if this process started today, but it went on all last year and the year prior to that. The applications have been agreed and the next step is for them to be considered as the school building programme is rolled out. There is no honesty in this system. The school authorities should be told that the additional accommodation will not be provided or it will be provided next year, in six months or is under examination. A major operation is taking place in this respect and the Minister of State, myself and the people in the House tonight are being sucked into part of it in a time-wasting project. I do not understand it. It is not an efficient business model by which to operate and it is utterly depressing.

In regard to Senator O'Toole's comment, it is not the duty, nor should it be the practice, of any public servant to proffer advice to a Member of the Oireachtas as to how he or she should proceed with his or her queries.

I totally agree.

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