The Order of Business is No. 1, Thirty-second Amendment of the Constitution (Abolition of Seanad Éireann) Bill 2013 - Committee Stage, to be taken on the conclusion of the Order of Business and to be adjourned no later than 3 p.m.; No. 3, Private Members' Business, Parental Leave Bill 2013 - Second Stage, to be taken at 3 p.m. and to conclude no later than 5 p.m.; and No. 4, Houses of the Oireachtas (Inquiries, Privileges and Procedures) Bill 2013 - Second Stage, to be taken at 5 p.m. and to conclude no later than 7 p.m., with the contributions of group spokespersons not to exceed eight minutes, those of all other Senators not to exceed five minutes and the Minister to be called on to reply no later than 6.50 p.m.
Order of Business
The Taoiseach indicated that he would return to the House for Committee Stage of the Thirty-second Amendment of the Constitution (Abolition of Seanad Éireann) Bill 2013. Will he be doing so for today's session? If the Taoiseach is not going to be present today, is the Leader in a position to indicate the point in the debate at which he will attend the House to answer the questions put to him on Second Stage? I welcome the Leader's commitment to ensuring that as much time as possible will be allocated in respect of the debate on the Bill and that the guillotine will not apply either on Committee Stage or Report and Final Stages.
I wish to put on record a great sporting achievement that took place yesterday. I congratulate the Irish cricket team on qualifying for the cricket world cup in Australia in 2015. This is an all-Ireland team and it shows how sport can bring together both traditions on the island. It is a magnificent achievement. This is the third world cup in a row that the Irish cricket team has qualified for. It would be remiss of me not to mention my county, Dublin, whose hurlers won the Leinster championship for the first time in 52 years. What a fantastic result that was.
I wish to raise a more serious note. On several occasions I have raised in the House the issue with regard to ambulance coverage and especially the HSE ambulance service. We are all aware of several instances that occurred recently in Cork and Kerry where ambulances, unfortunately, were sent to the wrong addresses and where tragedies occurred. I am just as concerned about the fact that there was no ambulance cover in a large part of Dublin yesterday. This is not the first time it has happened. An ambulance crew resuscitated a lady taken from the sea last week but yesterday, due to cutbacks within the HSE, there was no ambulance service covering 200,000 people in the north county area. I have asked for it before but I am asking again for a debate on the emergency services and the resources available, if not in this session, then early in the new session.
I wish to ask the Leader something once more. Yesterday, my colleague, Senator Thomas Byrne, raised an issue which I continue to raise with the Leader, namely, the revised code of conduct on mortgage arrears. We should have a debate with the Minister for Finance in the House in respect of the revised code of conduct on mortgage arrears. I have no wish to sound like a broken record. I have tried to raise the issue when dealing with other Bills but it has not been allowed, and I understand why. We need a specific debate on this matter.
I offer one example of what the new code of conduct is doing to the cohort of more than 150,000 people who are in mortgage arrears on their principal private residences. I received a case yesterday. Obviously, I will not name the person in question. He received a letter from one of our pillar banks, the ICS Building Society. It relates to a principal private residence where there is a father, a mother and three young children. The bank flatly turned down a proposal although this is a case in which the people involved are making an effort to pay the mortgage. The bank said it had carefully assessed the request, taking into account the details provided by the customer of his financial situation. A formal review was carried out by the bank's mortgage appeals board. What did it come up with? There were two options. The first was voluntary sale, whereby the customer is instructed to appoint his choice of estate agent and solicitor to progress sale of the property. Then, where a sale is agreed at a satisfactory price, the bank would facilitate the sale and, in the event of a shortfall, it will discuss with the customer the repayment proposals for the residual balance. That is option one.
Option two is voluntary surrender. This is where the customer could hand back the keys of the property to enable the bank to realise its security in respect of the customer's debt. These are the only two options for the family home. The letter states that after that, in the event of a shortfall, the customer would remain liable for the cost of outstanding debt, including accrued interest, charges and legal selling and other related costs. That is what is happening under the code of conduct for mortgage arrears. That is a fact.
That is one of many cases that I have received and that I am working on. I imagine every Senator in the House has received the same. What in God's name are we actually doing about it? We are doing nothing. The Government has caved in to the banks with the new code of conduct on mortgage arrears. The Government has given everything. The letter from the ICS Building Society is dated this week. That it what they are operating under. It relates to a principal private residence, a family home. Where are these people going to go?
Senator, I must ask you to conclude.
With that in mind, I propose an amendment to the Order of Business again today such that the Minister for Finance would come to the House for one hour to allow us to debate the new code of conduct on mortgage arrears and how the Minister believes the new code of conduct, approved by this Government, will assist people like these, who are being given warning letters and told to sell their homes or give back the keys, with no other options available. It is disgraceful.
I imagine other colleagues will want to join me in commending the firefighters who went to the scene of a fire at a block of apartments in Clondalkin yesterday from which several adults and children had to be rescued. It was good news that there were no serious injuries as a result of the fire, but it was a timely reminder of how important the work of firefighters is. I commend the firefighters and the neighbours who, before the fire crews arrived on the scene, helped to evacuate the residents from the apartment block as well. It was a terrifying experience for all involved.
I join my colleagues who called yesterday for a debate on direct provision. I call on the Leader to arrange a debate on the matter early in the next session. It is worth our examining the issue in some detail. I am mindful that the number of asylum seekers in direct provision has reduced in recent years, but there are still serious concerns about the living conditions of people, especially families with children in direct provision as well as the plight of unaccompanied minors who have come to Ireland and who are in direct provision. We might have a debate on that.
I warmly welcome the news, following yesterday's Cabinet meeting, that a referendum will be held on lowering the voting age from 18 to 16 years as a result of the recommendation of the Constitutional Convention and on lowering the age of eligibility to be President from 35 to 21 years. There was a lively debate at the Constitutional Convention on the issue of voting age, perhaps more lively than many commentators had expected. People were genuinely persuaded by the arguments heard. I gather the Leader has said that we will have Tom Arnold, chairperson of the Constitutional Convention, in the House in the autumn. That might be another issue on which he could address the House.
I look forward to our debate tomorrow on the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill, which is due to conclude in the Dáil tonight. I welcome the fact that after 21 years we are facing up to our responsibility as legislators to deal with the issue. I call on the Leader, in the aftermath of the Bill, perhaps in the autumn, to arrange a debate on the separation of church and State, given the rather robust interventions by the bishops, essentially seeking to tell legislators what to do, which, I believe, is not appropriate in a republic.
Does Senator Bacik want to gag them?
One does not expect much in the way of initiative or intelligence from the Government, but it would be refreshing if, occasionally, it joined up one or two of the dots. I speak particularly of the situation whereby we are implementing charges for water. We do not know what the charges are. We do not know what the costs of meters are. We know it is going out to tender. I have spoken in the House on this issue and I have seen Ministers sitting in the chair nodding away like little Dachshund puppets on the back of Angela Merkel's Volkswagen at the truth of what I said when I pointed out that it would be quite possible and reasonable to put in a multipurpose meter.
Hear, hear.
The gas board is involved in putting them in. That is called gas, spelled G-A-S. It is putting in the water, spelled W-A-T-E-R. The same operation provides electricity, spelled E-L-E-C-T-R-I-C-T-Y.
Senator Norris got that wrong.
In other countries it is perfectly feasible to put remotely readable meters in. Why not put the whole bloody lot in at the same time and stop them digging up pavements, including antique listed pavements in the centre of Dublin, three times in order that we can pay English companies for the benefit of wrecking our city? Could the Leader ask the Minister to try to join up a small number of dots? This would save the taxpayer money and make things reasonable.
I was at home yesterday. What did I find when I went to the letterbox? I found that a gentleman from the gas board had called. However, there was no sign of a ring on the bell or a rat-tat-tat on the knocker. It is much easier to shove the thing in and read it oneself. Let us get rid of that. Let us join the 21st century.
Could we also have a debate on Egypt? A worrying situation is blowing up there. I do not have much time for Mr. Morsi or the Muslim Brotherhood but I believe that they are a good deal less dangerous than people imagine and that their threat has been exaggerated. The real threat comes from the subversion of democracy. We do not always get the people we want, but everywhere a regime in the Middle East or north Africa has sprung up with anything like an aggressive Muslim or Islamic bent, or whatever one wishes to call it, it has been undemocratically undone.
Let us recall the Government in Algeria, which won an overwhelming victory some 15 or 20 years ago. Then, the Europeans and Americans plunged that country into civil war because they could not accept the will of the people there. We must accept it and it is the same in Egypt. Mr. Morsi was put in by a vote of the people. This is a military coup; there is no question about it. The gentleman who is running the show now, that is, the general from the army, was advocating and trying to implement forced virginity tests for the protesters in Tahrir Square.
Let us have a bit of subtlety in our approach and let us have a debate in this House.
I welcome the opening of the Middle Eastern market for Irish beef. We have been locked out of those markets since 1996 when the BSE problem broke here. It opens up a market of 43.6 million people, which is a huge boost for the Irish beef sector. All we can hope for is that we get fine weather and the farmers will be able to get lots of hay and silage to continue to feed their animals next winter.
I concur with what Senator Comiskey has said. Good news is always welcome. In my anger with the Minister of State, Deputy Kelly, yesterday over the dismantling of the rural transport schemes, I failed to pay tribute to the Ministers, Deputies Varadkar and Coveney, on their initiative in making the use of personal locator beacons mandatory. I welcome the initiative, which is something very close to my heart. In this type of weather people are jumping to get into the sea, rivers and lakes. I join Irish Water Safety in urging people to be careful and cautious. They need to remember that the sea is very dangerous and has claimed many people's lives over the years. In this beautiful weather we need to remind young people in particular not to take risks.
The following issue is a bugbear of mine. On this wonderful occasion in Union Hall on Monday, while the Ministers, Deputies Varadkar and Coveney, are very welcome, local councillors and Oireachtas Members should have been notified. This is the second occasion. I have made a personal complaint to the Minister, Deputy Coveney, that I was given no notice of the event in Union Hall. It is a disgrace and very mean. It is not something I would raise here lightly and it is wrong. Approximately 18 months ago a wonderful €40 million project to develop the harbour and pier in Castletownbere was opened and I only found out the following day that the Minister, Deputy Coveney, had been to the town for that opening. It does not take much to send an e-mail or make a phone call. I was the only Oireachtas Member not present and I regret it because of my interest in and love of fishing and the water. I ask the Leader to raise this with the Ministers.
Last year, for example, the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Burton, was in Goleen and we had a wonderful day leaving politics out of these things. It is very wrong for Fianna Fáil and Sinn Féin local authority members not to be informed of what is going on in the constituency on these most important issues. I praise the Ministers for this wonderful development, which I wish well. However, I was disappointed that I got no notice of the event taking place.
I second Senator Darragh O'Brien's amendment to the Order of Business.
As Senator Darragh O'Brien knows, I have great sympathy for what he is proposing. I am also aware that the Leader has attempted on a number of occasions to get the Minister, Deputy Noonan, to come to the House. We all accept he is doing his best in this matter. Now that our Presidency of the EU has concluded, it is time the Minister came in here to discuss the matter fully and frankly with the House. I raised the matter yesterday during the debate on the Land and Conveyancing Law Reform Bill 2013. As Senator Darragh O'Brien knows, I have enormous difficulties with the current code of conduct on mortgage arrears, which is a charter for banks. On a regular basis I also deal with people who are in this heart-breaking position. The country will never move on from the banking crisis and economic collapse until the matter is resolved fairly to the satisfaction of everyone.
I wish to speak about the buy-to-let mortgages. I am concerned that the Governor of the Central Bank, Professor Patrick Honohan, has stated that very few family homes will be repossessed. His view of a family home is a home that is occupied as a principal private residence. He said that there was a backlog of approximately 30,000 buy-to-let properties waiting to be repossessed by the banks given the level of arrears. They are people's family homes. One in five families live in rented accommodation. It is one in four in city areas and one in three in some areas of the capital. Many of those families are in receipt of rent supplement. In other words, by definition, they are on social welfare payments of some description. Those are family homes. There is no code of conduct about how those homes will be treated. I ask the Leader to bring this to the attention of the Minister for Finance. We stand at the cusp of a very serious difficulty if we start repossessing buy-to-let properties without taking into account what will happen to the people living in those family homes.
The Government is preparing important whistleblower legislation. We should also include in it provision for non-whistleblowers. Perhaps they should be called whistle inhalers or whistle swallowers. At the weekend, a major figure in one of the banks said he knew the tapes existed but said nothing because no one asked him. That opting out should not be allowed in the new legislation. In the US, the Sarbanes-Oxley Act 2002 provides for mandatory disclosure in matters relating to stocks and bonds. Someone saying that he said nothing because no one asked him is not acceptable as we attempt to deal with the banking situation. There should be a duty to speak up in the whistleblower legislation and a penalty for non-whistleblowers.
Like Senator Bacik I welcome tomorrow's debate on the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill, but unlike her I do not see the church as interfering or dictating but merely having its say like everyone else, to which it is perfectly entitled. Everyone deserves to be heard. I know that some people on both sides of the argument are an annoyance and a total bloody nuisance, if I may say so. However, that is something we, as democrats must put up with and we are prepared to live with that. However, I do not see the church in that light whatsoever.
There are many difficulties. We know that the legislation, if and when it is passed, is very likely to be challenged, and for that reason, I would hope the President in his sanguinity and wisdom will call in the Council of State to refer the matter to the Supreme Court in order that it can be put beyond doubt one way or another.
That is a matter for the President.
Of course that is a matter for the President, and I said that. There will be more of that anon in tomorrow's debate.
I join Senator Darragh O'Brien in reiterating the call for a discussion on mortgage arrears. The Senator and Senator Hayden cited examples, as I did yesterday on behalf of a number of people for whom I am acting as intermediary. The banks are no longer calling it repossession but are calling it assisted sale. Either way it involves putting families out of homes. People might be surprised to hear that many of the very few split mortgages that have taken place are for investors in buy-to-let properties rather than people with family homes. I believe an investigation might show that to be the case. Was that the intention of the Government of the day in recommending the use of split mortgages or was it done in the spirit of assisting families to stay in their homes?
From the work I have done, there is substantial evidence to suggest that the repossessions being focused on first are not the basket cases. The banks are saying to the people with real equity in their homes that if those people cannot pay, the banks will put the property up for sale and take the equity to cover the debt. It is fundamentally wrong. For generations we will regret allowing this code of conduct to be the only safeguard over the legislation we are passing this week to allow repossessions to proceed. I accept the anomaly arising from the Dunne judgment needs to be addressed. However, to do it in isolation without putting tangible options in place, involving an independent debt settlement office, the courts or whoever to adjudicate over what the banks are actually doing for people, is fundamentally wrong.
I have said this since 2009. Representatives of the banks appearing before Oireachtas committees are able to give the statistical analysis to show how much they are engaging and how they are doing the devil and all for people.
The reality is that they are superficially engaging and doing nothing other than striving for that bottom line improvement as quickly as possible, and they are happy to burn families, so to speak, in the process. I ask that the relevant Minister be made attend the House. It was welcome to have the Minister of State, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, in the House yesterday to hear our points of view on this but she has enough to be doing in her own Departments rather than trying to understand and implement the good suggestions of Members in this House. Anyone other than the Minister, Deputy Noonan, will not be acceptable on this issue. He should be a little more relaxed now in terms of the European issues and therefore we expect him to attend here before the recess.
On Monday very good news was broadcast by the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Joan Burton, in Waterford, the capital of the south east, when she launched the JobsPlus scheme, which provides an opportunity for long-term unemployed people to get back into full-time work. If we want any proof of the success of the Seanad we should take that as an example. This initiative was brought to the Seanad by Senator John Kelly and to the Joint Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation of which Senator Kelly is a member. It was championed by him, and then became a Government initiative. Those who say the work of the Seanad is meaningless should be aware that thousands of people will avail of this scheme in the coming months.
This is an important scheme but it involves many nuances, angles and eligibility criteria. I call on the Leader to request the Minister, Deputy Burton, to attend the House to outline the detail of this scheme for Members so that we can be acquainted with it and ensure that the maximum number of those who are long-term unemployed can get back to work while giving an opportunity to employers to increase the number of people they employ.
I support the comments made earlier by Senator O'Donovan, who has left the Chamber. I, too, found myself in a situation on Monday where there was a number of visits, as the previous speaker said, by a number of Ministers to Waterford to which I was not invited. We also had an event at which the Minister, Deputy Bruton, addressed some business leaders. Again, all Oireachtas Members were not invited to that event. I did not receive an invitation. It is important that when Ministers visit constituencies all Oireachtas Members are informed of those events. I would have attended the jobs event held in Waterford but I did not receive an invitation.
It is time for this House to have another debate on jobs. In the Joint Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation yesterday the Minister, Deputy Bruton, gave an update on the jobs action strategy and it is about time this House had a similar update from him. As the Leader will be aware, negotiations are ongoing between Ireland and the European Union on the regional grant aid available to the various regions and how that will play out for all the regions. Currently, because of issues in the past the Border Midlands Western, BMW, region has the highest levels of grant-aid where IDA Ireland can give higher levels of investment aid to multinational companies but the south east region has the highest level of unemployment. It is important, when the Government is reviewing these guidelines, that the south east region is given priority and is on a par with other regions because we need every bit of support we can get.
Also, we need to discuss the proposals such as those about which Senator Landy spoke. We in Sinn Féin have constantly called for job subsidy schemes to be put in place, and any schemes that get people back to work must be welcomed but much more work needs to be done. There are many issues on which the Government is working but it is important that Members in this House are able to feed into those discussions. I am sure the Leader would wish to have his say about the regional aid guidelines and their impact in Waterford and the south east. If he could arrange for that debate with the Minister, Deputy Bruton, that would be of benefit to all Members of the House
I second Senator Landy's proposal that we ask the Minister for Social Protection to attend the House and update Members on the final detail of the JobsPlus scheme because it can be highly beneficial to employers. I believe it can be a great success but we all need to know a little more about the final details.
I ask the Leader to invite the Minister for Health to the House for a debate on certain health matters because there is much happening behind the scenes without any consultation, and people are being deprived of their rightful entitlements as a result. In recent weeks I have become aware of changes to medical card guidelines and assessments without any consultation. I have sought to raise that issue on the Adjournment tomorrow and I hope the Cathaoirleach might oblige me on that. Under the 1970 Health Act, someone with a medical card is entitled to a wide range of health services free of charge but that is no longer the case. I know an elderly man who has a medical card. He is going into hospital for a hip operation in the coming weeks. He has been told already that he will have to spend five days in hospital after the operation following which he must find a nursing home bed for the next five or six weeks but he cannot afford that. It will cost him between €5,000 and €6,000. He cannot benefit from the fair deal scheme. There is no help with the cost involved. That is not giving a medical card holder a free health service.
These issues need to be debated and the Minister for Health should attend the House and answer these questions. It is all very well for people who can afford that type of service but those who can afford it will not have a medical card. The people who have medical cards are not getting what they are entitled to under the 1970 Health Act. I call on the Leader to invite the Minister to attend the House to debate these issues.
I support Senator Bacik's comments on the Dublin Fire Brigade. An incident occurred last night in a hotel in the centre of the city which was attended by six units of the fire brigade, an ambulance and six gardaí. I commend them for their speedy, efficient and effective work in that regard. It was an electrical fire in a basement. The hotel was evacuated in an orderly manner. The management and staff of the hotel deserve a great deal of credit. If it had been more serious it would have been a tragedy because there were many Deputies and Senators resident who were woken up at 3 o'clock this morning. Some of them might not be as fresh as the Cathaoirleach would wish them to be.
Some months ago I welcomed the Narrow Water bridge initiative in my parish. I was saddened to hear yesterday that this project has been put on hold. Contract prices received varied significantly from €26.5 million plus VAT to €40 million plus VAT, almost twice the estimated costs which were in the region of €23 million or €24 million. It beggars belief that those who estimated what it would cost then discovered that contractors were widely different in their estimates. I appeal to both the Government and the Northern Ireland Executive in this regard. There is a shortfall of €15 million. I would hate to see this project lost to the north east, Louth County Council and Newry and Mourne council. Where will the €17.4 million funding agreed by the Special EU Programmes Body, SEUPB, go? Can contractors reduce the costs? We must examine that and appeal to both the Government and the Executive to come up with the shortfall. As I pointed out previously, the economic and tourism benefits to the Carlingford-Cooley peninsula and the Newry and Mourne areas will be lost and I would hate to see that happen. I ask the Leader to raise that issue with the Minister, Deputy Varadkar, and perhaps with his counterpart in Northern Ireland.
I have great sympathy for our colleague, Senator Brennan. It appeared this project would go ahead but whatever has happened, there is a need for intense discussions North and South, and even east-west on it. I suggest the Senator use his good offices to talk to his colleagues in Government who are members of the British-Irish Council and suggest that this matter should be raised at that level because this was a unique opportunity to bring two communities together.
I have great sympathy with his plight regarding the most recent announcement.
Will the Leader consider bringing to the House the Minister of State at the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Alan Kelly, to discuss rural transport? The media have reported on the initiative he launched yesterday whereby he intends to cut back the overall budget. It has been cloaked over with that wonderful term "reform" which is used from time to time when Governments wish to justify their actions. I have no doubt whatsoever there is a need to reform and review the rural transport scheme, which was first initiated in 2004, but successive Governments have cut back on the budget and it is inevitable any cutback will result in a reduction in services. I welcome the suggestion the rural transport scheme will come within the ambit of local authorities and that local authority members will have direct input into it. They input indirectly through their membership of various partnership boards throughout the country. I was a member of the partnership board during my time as a local authority member and I was very much involved, and have continued to take a great interest, in rural transport because it affects counties such as Leitrim with dispersed populations. It is important that Members of the House have an opportunity to quiz the Minister of State and put forward their views on how this excellent scheme should be protected. Such is its importance that today's newspapers have editorials on it.
I echo the call made by the Taoiseach yesterday for anybody with information on the disappeared victims of the Troubles and conflict in Northern Ireland to come forward to the victims remains commission and give such information in confidence. It is barbaric that many people who have lost loved ones are not allowed to bring closure to their grief. They should be allowed to organise a decent burial for their loved ones. If we are to ensure lasting peace in Northern Ireland these legacy issues must be dealt with. It is time people who have vital information which could help trace these missing persons should provide it as a matter of urgency.
I also call on people in the South of Ireland who have information on the many unsolved murders we have in our country, particularly the murders of many young women in the Midlands over recent decades. We have some high-profile unsolved murders and if we have an opportunity in the autumn I would like the Minister for Justice and Equality to come to the House to update us on the state of these inquiries. In some instances families have been grieving for decades. People North and South should be allowed to grieve with dignity and bring closure to their appalling loss.
The greatest challenge facing the country is to create employment and offer hope and a potential living to the 300,000 unemployed people and the young people in our schools and colleges. The only way we can create jobs is to encourage new enterprise. The biggest untapped source of enterprise is the 50% of the population comprising Irish woman who face multiple barriers in becoming entrepreneurs and developing businesses. At present two and a half times more men start up a business than women in Ireland. The bottom line is the responsibility for raising young children rests almost entirely with women.
My contribution to easing the barriers is to allow fathers share the responsibility of maternity leave. The Parental Leave Bill I will introduce in Seanad Éireann this evening proposes the father of a newborn baby can share the 26 weeks of maternity leave. This innovative legislation provides for the current maternity leave scheme to be amended to enable a woman transfer a proportion of her maternity leave and benefits to the father of the newborn baby. This flexibility in the maternity leave scheme would allow women entrepreneurs to devote more time to their enterprises, grow their businesses and create more jobs. The Parental Leave Bill 2013 is one of a series of innovative initiatives contained in a new Fianna Fáil policy paper-----
The Bill will be discussed this evening.
-----promoting women entrepreneurs in Ireland.
The Senator can make these points when the Bill is being discussed.
I call for all Members of Seanad Éireann to support the Bill in the Seanad this evening.
The monthly economic bulletin issued by the Department of Finance is interesting because it sets out the average weekly wage in the first quarter of 2013 was €696.67. It also highlights that in six of the 13 categories or sectors of employment there was an increase in salaries or wages and in certain sections there was a decrease, mainly in the professional sector. These are gross figures and no net figures are issued in respect of tax deductions in these average earnings. There is a grossly distorted view when one compares what the person earns in wages and salaries in gross terms compared to the net figures and then compared to social welfare payments which are net figures. We should also publish figures on net earnings of people after the deduction of tax, taking into account people's tax category. It is important that correct information is issued. When the Minister for Finance comes to the House this matter should be debated to ensure we issue correct figures on the real take-home pay of people as opposed to the false impression given with regard to what people earn.
I was very glad when my colleague, Senator Norris, paid tribute to Pope Francis yesterday regarding what he said in Lampedusa. Pope Francis went to Lampedusa to stand in solidarity with thousands of African boat people and illegal immigrants. In his comments Pope Francis asked who was responsible for the blood of these brothers and sisters and stated the answer was nobody. He stated everybody answers that he or she did not have anything to do with it so it must be someone else. He was warning against this attitude of individualism and the culture of comfort which makes us think only of ourselves.
These words are very wise and it reminds me that whether said by a Christian thinker such as Pope Francis or an atheist dissident such as Sakharov, words which call us to the best in ourselves and urge us to reflect deeply and conscientiously on very important issues should always be welcome in politics and welcomed by politicians. It is absolutely contemptible for any Member of the House or anybody else to seek to exclude the voices of church members or church leaders from these debates. We should be very wary about where such people would take our politics when they seek not to focus on the issues but rather to denigrate those who make arguments with sincerity.
I am reminded that what Pope Francis had to say has very broad application. Another famous voice of conscience was the German Protestant pastor Niemöller, who famously reminded us,
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.
Let us remember these words and never try to exclude such voices from our discussions.
I support Senator Mullen; his words are worthy of listening to. We need to be temperate in our language and expressions. Some of the expressions made in recent weeks, particularly on the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill, have been anything but temperate.
My attention was drawn to a different point. This week, Britain announced that it would arrange for the determination of school holidays to be left in the hands of individual schools instead of organising them centrally. Now, children will be out of school for six weeks, which made me realise how short their holidays actually were. We still get two or three months of holidays. Our approach dates back a long time to when people worked on the farm and they needed those holidays. We should draw attention to this matter. We could ask the Minister for Education and Skills to consider whether we are providing enough time for our children to be educated, given the holidays at Easter, Christmas and mid-terms and the two to three months in the summer. As a nation, we have a responsibility to ensure that our children are educated. We cannot do it in that length of time.
Senator Darragh O'Brien raised the question of ambulance cover in Dublin and elsewhere. As he suggested, I will ask the Minister to discuss that situation in the House in September.
I have asked the Minister for Finance to attend the House to debate the code of conduct on mortgage arrears. I have received no indication that he is willing to do so before the summer recess, but I will continue to ask. We had a comprehensive discussion on the subject during the debate on the land and conveyancing Bill yesterday. Senator MacSharry made a number of valid points on split mortgages. Senator Hayden made points on buy-to-let properties. Several other Senators raised points on the question of mortgage arrears. Members availed of the opportunity to address these matters, but I will continue asking the Minister to attend.
Senator Darragh O'Brien also referred to the options given to a certain person in difficulties. The letter from the bank was unacceptable. The matter should be addressed.
Senators Bacik and Leyden commended the firefighters involved in two incidents in Dublin yesterday.
Senator Bacik called for a debate on direct provision. Several such calls were made previously. I will attempt to arrange for the Minister to debate the matter in the House after the summer recess.
I do not intend to get into the debate on church and State. The church is entitled to have a say on matters that relate to it. No one can deny any person a say.
Hear, hear.
I do not intend to comment on matters relating to the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill. We will have ample time to discuss it. I am sure that we will have a dignified debate. A significant amount of time will be allocated to the Bill, and rightly so.
Senator Norris called for joined-up thinking in the provision of utilities. I could not agree more. There is nothing worse than a utility company digging up a road or footpath one week only to have another utility company dig it up again the next week. Joined-up thinking is necessary.
Will the Leader drop in a note?
To whom would I drop it? Every one of them-----
To the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Hogan.
We could do that, but he does not have-----
He has a big whip and a big stick.
-----responsibility for utilities. It would be local authorities, among several others.
To whomever. I am sure that someone could be found.
The Leader, without interruption.
I noted the Senator's point on Egypt. The Tánaiste should discuss that matter as well as the question of Syria in the House.
Senator Comiskey outlined the significant opportunities for Irish beef with the opening of the eastern markets. Senator O'Donovan also made this point. The latter thanked Ministers concerning the issues of personal locator beacons and people's safety at sea. He outlined that people needed to show caution when in the water, particularly at this time of the year.
I will remind the Ministers in question that all of the relevant Oireachtas Members should be notified when Ministers visit a constituency.
I noted Senator Hayden's point on buy-to-let properties, which she has raised numerous times. She made it forcibly yesterday while addressing the land and conveyancing Bill.
Senator Barrett raised the issue of whistleblower legislation. Such legislation was published last week. I am sure that it will be before the House in the autumn. In that context, we will have ample time to discuss the matters referred to by the Senator.
Senator Paul Coghlan referred to the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill. We will have plenty of time to discuss it.
Senator MacSharry mentioned the code of conduct. I have addressed that point.
Senators Landy and Kelly asked for a debate on the JobsPlus scheme with the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Burton. I have asked her to outline to the House what the scheme entails. She has agreed to attend on the matter next week.
Senator Cullinane raised the issue of the jobs action strategy. I will invite the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Bruton, to debate job creation and the Action Plan for Jobs with Senators. I also noted the Senator's point on differences between the foreign direct investment grant aid awarded to various regions. I have raised the matter with the Minister. I was not too hopeful following that discussion, but I hope that something can be done to redress the situation. Some regions have obviously benefited more than others.
Senator Kelly also raised the question of medical cards and asked for the Minister for Health to attend. As the Minister and all of the Ministers of State for health will attend for at least 24 hours on legislation during the next week or so, I doubt that they will be available to discuss other health matters. I urge the Senator to raise the medical card issue on the Adjournment tomorrow, as he said he would.
Senator Brennan referred to difficulties that have arisen at Narrow Water Bridge. Questions must be answered by any company that gives an estimate when the cost turns out to be double that amount.
Hear, hear.
I cannot understand how any reputable company, be it a quantity surveyor or anything else, could give an estimate of €20 million when the cost turned out to be €40 million. It is outrageous.
Hear, hear.
This often happened during the so-called Celtic tiger era, when outrageous prices were charged for properties.
I have noted the points raised by Senator Mooney on rural transport. I addressed this yesterday but will ask the Minister of State at the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Alan Kelly, to debate the issue with us.
Senator Mullins rightly asked that the people whose loved ones are among the disappeared in Northern Ireland would be able to bring this issue to a conclusion. Our hearts go out to all families who have missing family members. I call on anybody who has information on this matter to bring it to the attention of the authorities. I note also his points on unsolved murders, particularly of women in this part of the country.
Senator White raised the issue of parental leave. The Parental Leave Bill 2013 will be taken in Private Members' time. I commend the Senator for introducing the Private Members' Bill and I am sure the Government will deal with it and possibly accept the Second Stage of the Bill.
I note the points raised by Senator Burke on gross and net salaries and the difference between net salaries and social welfare payments. We can debate this matter with the Ministers for Social Protection and Finance when they come to the House.
Senator Rónán Mullen commented on the visit of Pope Francis to Lampedusa, which we addressed yesterday and I take on board his points.
Senator Quinn called for temperate language and I hope we will be temperate and dignified when discussing matters in this House.
The issue of school holidays can be part of a debate on education when the Minister for Education and Skills next comes to the House.
I do not propose to accept the amendments as proposed to the order of business.
Senator Darragh O'Brien has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That one hour be allowed for a debate with the Minister for Finance on the revised code of conduct on mortgage arrears and that it be taken today." Is the amendment being pressed?
Amendment put:
The Seanad divided: Tá, 19; Níl, 31.
Tá
- Barrett, Sean D.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Leyden, Terry.
- MacSharry, Marc.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Norris, David.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Brien, Mary Ann.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- O'Sullivan, Ned.
- Ó Domhnaill, Brian.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Walsh, Jim.
- White, Mary M.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
Níl
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Bradford, Paul.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Clune, Deirdre.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- D'Arcy, Michael.
- Harte, Jimmy.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Healy Eames, Fidelma.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Higgins, Lorraine.
- Keane, Cáit.
- Kelly, John.
- Landy, Denis.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Moran, Mary.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Donnell, Marie-Louise.
- O'Keeffe, Susan.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- Sheahan, Tom.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Whelan, John.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Ned O'Sullivan and Diarmuid Wilson; Níl, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden.
Amendment declared lost.
The Leader wishes to amend the Order of Business.
I propose an amendment to the Order of Business: "That Committee Stage of the Thirty-second Amendment of the Constitution (Abolition of Seanad Éireann) Bill 2013 be resumed at 7 p.m. and adjourned no later than 10 p.m."
Is that agreed?
It is not. We should have had notice of this.
Amendment put:
The Seanad divided: Tá, 33; Níl, 19.
Tá
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Bradford, Paul.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Clune, Deirdre.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- D'Arcy, Michael.
- Gilroy, John.
- Harte, Jimmy.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Healy Eames, Fidelma.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Higgins, Lorraine.
- Keane, Cáit.
- Kelly, John.
- Landy, Denis.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Moran, Mary.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Brien, Mary Ann.
- O'Donnell, Marie-Louise.
- O'Keeffe, Susan.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- Sheahan, Tom.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Whelan, John.
Níl
- Barrett, Sean D.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Leyden, Terry.
- MacSharry, Marc.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Norris, David.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- O'Sullivan, Ned.
- Ó Domhnaill, Brian.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Walsh, Jim.
- White, Mary M.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden; Níl, Senators David Norris and Feargal Quinn.
Amendment declared carried.
Question put: "That the Order of Business, as amended, be agreed to."
The Seanad divided: Tá, 32; Níl, 20.
Tá
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Bradford, Paul.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Clune, Deirdre.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- D'Arcy, Michael.
- Gilroy, John.
- Harte, Jimmy.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Healy Eames, Fidelma.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Higgins, Lorraine.
- Keane, Cáit.
- Kelly, John.
- Landy, Denis.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Moran, Mary.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Donnell, Marie-Louise.
- O'Keeffe, Susan.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- Sheahan, Tom.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Whelan, John.
Níl
- Barrett, Sean D.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Leyden, Terry.
- MacSharry, Marc.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Norris, David.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Brien, Mary Ann.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- O'Sullivan, Ned.
- Ó Domhnaill, Brian.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Walsh, Jim.
- White, Mary M.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden; Níl, Senators Ned O'Sullivan and Diarmuid Wilson.
Question declared carried.