Seanad Éireann debate -
Thursday, 2 Feb 2017

Vol. 249 No. 14

Commencement Matters

Broadcasting Service Provision

Senator Billy Lawless

I thank the Leas-Chathaoirleach for selecting this important matter. I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Joe McHugh, to discuss it.

I take my appointment as Ireland’s first emigrant Senator seriously. That mandate extends not only to the diaspora in the United States, with whom I am more familiar, but also to the diaspora across the globe. One issue which comes up time and again with elderly members of the diaspora in the United Kingdom is continued access to RTE's long wave radio service which is set to be abolished at some point in 2017. There may be many young or more digitally orientated people in RTE management who may scoff at the notion of retaining for what for them may be a feature of bygone era. However, this narrow thinking does not understand the richness RTE provides for the tens of thousands of listeners in the United Kingdom who tune into its long wave service every single day.

There are more than 600,000 Irish-born emigrants living in the United Kingdom. Many of their older members were forced out of Ireland in the 1950s with little education and no prospects of finding work at home. In January 2016 the Social Policy Research Centre at Middlesex University in London, funded by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, conducted a study of emigrants’ usage of RTE's long wave service. Up to 92% of respondents stated they listened to it every day or most days, with 44% listening to it in the car or another vehicle. Less than half of the respondents had used a television or some digital device to access the radio service. Unsurprisingly, it was the so-called older age groups who did not access the service on digital radio platforms on a laptop or digital TV. Will the Minister of State consider the findings of the survey, given that it was funded by the previous Government, and implore RTE management to reconsider this ageist and discriminatory cutting of RTE's long wave service planned for 2017? Nobody is trying to halt the digitalisation of the media or impede RTE in its process of modernisation. However, it must be reminded of its public service remit.

The historic first state visit of Uachtarán na hÉireann to the United Kingdom in 2014 was an incredible moment for the Irish community living in the United Kingdom, particularly its elderly members who had been through difficult times for the Irish during the Troubles.

Anyone who watched the concerts and events held to mark the President's visit could see that they reconnected many Irish men and women from humble economic and social backgrounds in a way that had not been done for many generations. It was an extremely proud moment, not just for these immigrants but also for the diaspora throughout the world. It showed that the nation was wider than its borders. I ask the Minister of State what message is sent to the people concerned when three years later the switch is turned off on RTE's long wave radio service which is the daily and perhaps only link for so many with home. Thankfully, we have exited the period of austerity. It seems to be an extremely harsh and unfair decision for RTE to directly target some of the most elderly and vulnerable people who use its services. This is not what public service broadcasting is supposed to be about.

Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade (Deputy Joe McHugh)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Seanadóir as an gceist tábhachtach seo a chur faoin tseirbhís thar a bheith tábhachtach ar son muintir na hÉireann sa Bhreatain.

By way of background, in September 2014, RTE announced plans to shut down its longwave 252 service, which enables RTE Radio 1 to be broadcast into Britain. While the initial plan was for the longwave 252 service to close on 27 October 2014, it was further deferred until 19 January 2015. On 18 December 2014 a decision was taken to continue long wave radio services until 2017. Following this announcement, the Government’s emigrant support programme which is administered by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade supported research into listenership figures in Britain for RTE's longwave 252 service. The purpose of the research was to obtain concrete data for the current listenership and also to explore the possibility of continuing the service using alternate technologies. The research was conducted by the Social Policy Research Centre at Middlesex University which was appointed following a competitive tender process run by Irish in Britain, the national representative organisation for the Irish community in England, Scotland and Wales. Information was gathered through individual and group submissions and focus groups. Overseeing the research was a consultative group of key stakeholders which was composed of representatives of RTE, Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade officials based in Dublin and at the Embassy of Ireland in London and representatives of the Irish community in Britain.

The figures show that of 3,191 people who completed the individual surveys, 72% of those who responded were over 60 years, 68% of respondents were born in Ireland, while 62% were retired. For the majority of respondents, the long wave service was seen as a lifeline to Ireland, helping them to maintain a sense of Irishness and keep up with events back home. The majority of listeners in the focus groups preferred the familiar, analogue service, as opposed to digital platforms, computers, laptops and smartphones. The Government recognises the special value placed on RTE's longwave 252 service by some Irish citizens in Britain, especially the elderly, and my Department is working closely with RTE to ensure the views of this community are heard in any decision-making process.

While any decision on the future of long wave services in Britain is ultimately an operational matter for RTE, it can, as a result of the study, now be informed by awareness of the role the service plays in preserving and enhancing links with Ireland and keeping Irish people living in Britain informed of important events and developments such as the United Kingdom’s vote to leave the European Union and the Irish Government’s position. A meeting of the consultative group will take place in London next week in order to discuss the next steps to be taken, explore possible ways forward In the context of maintaining the link with audiences in Britain and keeping the Irish community involved in decision-making. I am hopeful a positive outcome can be achieved.

Senator Billy Lawless

I thank the Minister of State. That is very encouraging and I am sure my colleagues will be more than happy with his response. It is vital that we look after the elderly, not just those living in the United Kingdom but also in the United States. The Irish emigrant population are getting older and need these links.

Senator Catherine Noone

Hear, hear.

Senator Billy Lawless

I am delighted to hear the Minister of State's response. While he is here, will he indicate if a decision has been taken on the undocumented Irish? This matter is close to my heart and, of course, that of the Minister of State also. Will he provide an update on what has happened in the past ten days in the United States?

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

That is a separate matter. If the Minister of State wishes to respond, he may do so.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Out of respect for the Senator's global reach which is not just confined to the United Kingdom, there is an intensive effort to continue the dialogue and conversation with all front-line services in America. It also continues at a political level in the US Senate and House of Representatives. The Senator is involved in that effort. He took part in a very important meeting in America on 12 January. The meetings with the consulates and the embassy are so important. In the context of what we can control in terms of the budget, €2.3 million was allocated as part of last year's programme to the emigrant support service. We support many emigrant support services, be they in San Diego, San Francisco, Boston or New York, and we need to continue that support.

We also need to continue work to maintain our strong relationship with the United States. When the Taoiseach travels to the White House on 17 March, it is going to be about that relationship. Foremost in the mind of every politician, including my colleague, the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Charles Flanagan, who is in the United States this week, are the undocumented. It is a top priority and will continue to be. It was my priority when I was in San Francisco, New York and Boston. I am due to go again - the Senator will be joining me- to visit the the east coast and we have to make it a priority because there are people who feel vulnerable. We have to ensure the relationship between Ireland and the United States will continue, in a similar vein to the Senator's comments on the relationship with the United Kingdom. They are two separate issues but one and the same in keeping relationships strong.

Senator Billy Lawless

I thank the Minister of State.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

I also thank him. That was very nice.

Hospitals Car Park Charges

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Catherine Byrne. The next matter is in the names of Senators Catherine Noone and Gabrielle McFadden. As Senator Gabrielle McFadden is not present, Senator Catherine Noone may have to go it alone.

Senator Catherine Noone

I thank the Leas-Chathaoirleach.

The motion speaks for itself and relates to the high cost of car parking in many public hospitals, especially for long-term patients. I wish to ask the Minister of State if the Minister for Health, Deputy Simon Harris, will consider providing car parking guidelines for hospitals or the private companies that run hospital car parks in an effort to reduce the cost for patients with a long-term illness and their families. The exorbitant cost of hospital car parking across the country needs to be addressed. I was dismayed to hear about the wife of a cancer patient who had been forced to fork out €1,200 in hospital car parking charges at Beaumont Hospital over a six month period. A three-hour stay in the car park at Tallaght Hospital costs €7.50. This is almost twice what shoppers pay at the Square shopping centre which is a stone's throw from the hospital and which clearly has a similar value of real estate. According to a recent report by the Irish Cancer Society, Dublin hospitals are the most expensive, which is logical in a sense owing to real estate prices, etc. A four-hour stay at one of these hospitals costs €8.86 on average. At hospitals in Munster a four-hour stay costs approximately €6.70 on average. This has a huge effect on people's lives at a time when they are extremely vulnerable. Meanwhile, only seven of the 27 cancer treatment hospitals offer weekly discounted car parking rates.

Recently Age Action researched and produced a report on the experiences of older people attending outpatient services at University Hospital Galway. Some 68% of respondents said they found car parking charges excessive. Paying such high rates on a regular basis adds financial pressure on families and patients who are already under significant physical and psychological stress. Although a discounted car parking rate is offered to relatives of long-term patients in some hospitals, this is not enough. As a result, I am calling for the issuing of car parking guidelines, similar to those issued by the NHS in the United Kingdom, in order to reduce and streamline the cost of parking for patients with a long-term illness and their families. I am well aware that, in many instances, private companies run the car parks.

We can introduce a policy that would affect them by implementing some regulation or at least guidelines to help families who find themselves in this situation. Hospitals or the companies that are allowed to franchise out or rent the land should not profit hugely at the expense of patients who are in long-term care services, in particular.

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Catherine Byrne)

As the Senator can see, I am not the Minister for Health, Deputy Simon Harris. I am here on his behalf.

In the past decade parking charges have been introduced at many hospitals. It is important to note that they are part of the series of measures which ensure the operational cost of providing parking services does not cause an adverse impact on their budgets. As demand for parking services at hospitals increases, so too does the associated cost of providing them such as the initial capital cost of purchasing or renting parking areas, the cost of developing extra parking spaces, the need to provide and upgrade security schemes in hospital car parks, the cost of staffing and general maintenance of parking services. The cost of providing these services needs to be recouped and I am sure we will all agree that the cost of providing them for visitors, staff and patients should not impact on a hospital's budget to provide health care services for patients.

The Health Service Executive, HSE, has advised that it does not have a single contract to provide parking services at all hospitals. Instead each hospital has a unique arrangement which reflects its specific circumstances. For example, Temple Street Children's University Hospital, the National Maternity Hospital and Mercy University Hospital in Cork do not provide public car parking spaces. Furthermore, some hospitals such as St. Luke's Hospital in Rathgar, Merlin Park University Hospital in Galway and Mallow General Hospital do not have a charge for parking a car. There is free parking. The HSE advises that a number of hospitals use parking revenue solely for maintenance and reinvestment in parking facilities, including repayment of loans obtained for upgrading such facilities and investing in security. The remainder of hospitals use parking revenue to cover the cost of parking services, with any additional income contributing to the general hospital budget or funding research or specific patient facilities.

The Minister is aware that those hospitals which charge parking fees are very conscious of the financial impact of parking costs on patients and their families, particularly those with a long-term illness. Consequently, the hospitals have introduced a maximum daily fixed parking charge and thus have capped these expenses. While there is no national HSE policy covering car parking charges, the executive advises the Minister that it keeps hospital parking charges under review.

We must take into account public transport services when considering further development of the hospital system. This is evidenced by planning and development and support for the expansion of public transport facilities, especially for the new national children's hospital. We continue to provide more transport choices for the public when visiting their loved ones in hospitals.

Senator Catherine Noone

I thank the Minister of the State for the response she gave on behalf of the Minister for Health, Deputy Simon Harris. I understand, as she said, that she is not actually the Minister. I refer to recouping costs, which obviously has to be part of the overall picture. There will be security costs and it is important that facilities be maintained. I anticipated the answer I have received because I said I knew that the HSE was going to state it did not actually manage hospitals. I have to take the answer at face value. What I would like and request from the Department is an outline of what is being charged at a discount rate at hospitals. It is stated in the reply that hospitals have introduced a maximum daily fixed parking charge, thus capping the expense incurred. I am aware of this, but I am not aware if it happens at all hospitals. I would definitely like to see such a system in place and also what it means in real terms for the families of patients. I will follow up separately with the Department in that regard. I request the HSE and the Minister who is in charge of everything related to health care to do everything to ensure the private companies which are in operation in hospitals will be given guidelines or regulations to ensure people will not be charged an excessive amount when their loved ones are in hospital.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

I have taken note of some of the Senator's concerns. I, too, have concerns about the charges levied at hospitals. However, there are some hospitals at which there is a maximum price. I can only refer to Tallaght Hospital which charges €10 to park for 24 hours, while St. James's Hospital and hospitals in Cork and Limerick charge €15. The sum of €1,200 is an exorbitant amount to ask anyone to pay when people are very sick. I know on a personal level - I have been in this position - that when my brother was very seriously ill in Tallaght Hospital last year - he later died - arrangements were made with the family to enable his eight children to visit him on a frequent basis. The hospital was very co-operative in providing parking facilities for them at a very low rate because they were with him 24/7 for at least three weeks. There are ways by which hospitals can look at the issue. What the Senator said is very relevant to some of the experiences I have had with the HSE in not having proper guidelines for hospitals. I will raise that issue with the Minister.

Hospital Facilities

Senator Maria Byrne

Last week when the Minister for Health, Deputy Simon Harris, was in the Chamber, he referred to the budget for this year, €14.6 billion, as being the highest ever. He also referred to the distress of patients and that of their families and the impact on staff of cramped and overcrowded conditions and high numbers of patients on trolleys. University Hospital Limerick has been to the forefront in media coverage for quite a while in having the highest number of patients on trolleys and because of overcrowding in the emergency department. I am aware that the new emergency department at the hospital is due to open in May 2017. The go-ahead was also received last week to proceed to design stage for the provision of 96 acute beds. At the same time this application was submitted, St. John's Hospital in Limerick which is part of the University of Limerick Hospital Group made an application for the replacement of 90 beds in the city centre. There are 99 beds in the hospital, ten of which are for patients in need of medical procedures, while ten are for day care patients. St. John's Hospital was built in 1780 as a fever and lock hospital. It is the second oldest hospital in the country, after the Rotunda Hospital which is still on the original site. The application was included as part of the University of Limerick Hospital Group's application to the national capital development fund. Both applications were put on a priority list at the same time.

To solve the problem with waiting lists and of overcrowding at the emergency department in University Hospital Limerick, we need to expedite the application at the same time as the application to provide 96 beds at the hospital. If the replacement beds are provided at St. John's Hospital, it will be possible to expand services. Some services currently operate from prefabs. The hospital has been struggling for a while to provide services both for staff and patients in a safe manner. The staff have certainly done their very best. The services are renowned and I compliment all involved who work in them. Because he visited the hospital recently and saw what was happening at first hand, the Minister of State is aware of the shortage and the problems being faced.

It is not just for the people of Limerick; it is also for the people of the mid-west because it is the main hospital. If the two applications could be put forward at the same time, it would help to expand services and create extra beds. It would also help to reduce waiting lists if more beds were available for day-care procedures in different services. It is mainly medical, gynaecological and general medical assessments that are carried out. There is also an injuries assessment unit. They are the main services provided in the hospital. It would also lead to job creation because of the proposed expansion. If the two applications could proceed in tandem, it would be great.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

The Minister for Health, Deputy Simon Harris, apologises for not being here.

I welcome the opportunity to address the House on this matter. A number of projects have been identified by the University of Limerick Hospital Group for further development. These include a proposal for a 96-bed ward block at University Hospital Limerick on the Dooradoyle campus and a 90-bed replacement ward block at St. John's Hospital in Limerick city. It will be necessary to prioritise these projects in a national context. It is important to note that a number of construction projects are under way at University Hospital Limerick. Acute hospital campuses are complex sites and all construction must be carefully planned and scheduled to ensure patient care is not impeded or unnecessarily impacted on.

In the 2017 national service plan the HSE has outlined a number of projects which are expected to be completed and become operational in 2017 or early 2018. In particular, the opening of the new emergency department at University Hospital Limerick has been identified as a priority in the 2017 service plan. The Minister has confirmed that an additional €1.4 million has been allocated to facilitate the opening of the new emergency department later this year. The new facility will triple the size of the emergency department and immeasurably improve the experience of patients in terms of comfort, privacy and dignity. The new emergency department is being fitted out and recruitment of the additional staff required for the enlarged facility is ongoing. The acute medical assessment unit and outpatient department are being refurbished and reconfigured to provide eight additional assessment places and 12 replacement assessment spaces. In addition, a surgical and pre-operative assessment unit is projected to open in the third quarter of 2017 and will provide 14 additional assessment spaces. I also note that the clinical education and research centre which is co-funded by the University of Limerick is projected to be operational by the fourth quarter of 2017. It has an estimated capital cost of €12.9 million.

These projects demonstrate the considerable investment in infrastructure which is under way on the University Hospital Limerick campus and which will benefit the wider hospital group. The HSE is concentrating on applying the limited funding available for infrastructural development in the most effective way possible to meet current and future needs. The reality is that limited funding is available for new projects in the multi-annual period from 2016 to 2021, given the level of commitments in place and the costs of completion of projects under way. Further investment in the University of Limerick Hospital group must, therefore, be considered within the overall acute hospital sector infrastructure programme and the overall capital envelope available to the health service. The House is aware that a proposed mid-term review of the State's capital envelope will assess progress and review emerging pressures and demands. It is expected that the mid-term review will be completed in 2017. The Department of Health will work with the HSE and the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform to conduct the review of the capital programme. The Department of Health will also conduct a bed capacity review which will assess projected health care needs in the next decade and the associated infrastructural requirements to meet these needs.

Senator Maria Byrne

I thank the Minister of State for her reply and welcome what she said. If the plan for the provision of 90 replacement beds could proceed to the design stage at the same time as the design stage for the provision of the 96 acute beds, it would be very helpful for the region. There is a shortage of funding, but I am sure the funding will come down the line as things begin to improve. If the project could be considered to proceed to design stage as part of the mid-term review, it would be very positive because the two applications need to be worked together to resolve the issue in Limerick.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

I will reply quickly to the Senator. I will raise the issue of capital funding and the mid-term review with the Minister. I will repeat the Senator's point that the 90 replacement beds should be put into service within a certain amount of time.

I will add to what the Senator said at the beginning. The Government has provided the largest ever health care budget. There are patients still waiting on trolleys but not in the significant numbers before Christmas. It causes considerable concern for families when loved ones are left in emergency departments on trolleys for longer than is required. I will raise these issues with the Minister and assure the Senator that he will do anything in his power, provided the budget is available, to make sure replacement hospital beds will be in place as soon as possible.

Mental Health Services Provision

Senator Joan Freeman

My Commencement matter is for the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

The Minister of State, Deputy Catherine Byrne, is taking this Commencement matter. The Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, is otherwise engaged.

Senator Joan Freeman

It is a pity that I did not know that because the purpose of my address is to give out but not to the Minister of State, Deputy Catherine Byrne, to whom I have never spoken previously.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

That is fine. The Senator's contribution will tell me from where she is coming.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

I am sure it will not be taken personally. The Senator should not worry.

Senator Joan Freeman

I have a sense of déjà vu that I have been here before and asked the same questions. I find it a little upsetting that the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, is not here because all of the requests I have made to meet her have been completely ignored. She promised to set up a meeting, but she has not done so.

I will tell the Minister of State, Deputy Catherine Byrne, in a nutshell what the problem is. I launched a project, Project 95, to address the fact that 95 children had been placed in adult psychiatric units in 2015. The traumatic effect it had on children was astounding. One can imagine how upsetting it is for a child to be placed in an ordinary ward for the treatment of physical health problem, but imagine what it must be like for him or her to be placed in an adult psychiatric ward. The Minister of State, Deputy Heln McEntee, is well aware of this issue as we have spoken at length about it on many occasions. It is no good to just highlight the issue. The media have highlighted it every single year. I have come up with a solution, yet the Minister of State continues to ignore it.

The solution is to have a collaborative working relationship between the public and private sectors. The private sector has beds available. It has psychiatric intensive care units, PICUs, for children who are in terrible distress and they are available at weekends. The public sector does not have anything available. All it would take is a series of conversations between the public and private sectors. It would reduce overnight the number of children who have to be placed in adult psychiatric units and also reduce the number of children - 2,500 - who are waiting to be seen and assessed by the child and adolescent mental health services, CAMHS. They cannot be seen and assisted by it mainly because the services do not have the personnel available because they are overwhelmed by the numbers. The private sector could jump in on a short-term basis and carry out assessments. Most of the children do not need CAMHS; rather, they need to be redirected to somewhere like Pieta House or Barnardos or one of the other organisations.

The Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, still refuses to consider the issue. What is tragic is that she and her Department are completely ignoring the fact that there are children on the waiting list with life-threatening issues. They are either starving to death because they are anorexic or they have strong suicidal ideation. For example, there were three young people in Cork who killed themselves just before Christmas. It has been suggested that if there was an out-of-hours service availabe, they would still be alive today. Can the Minister of State imagine not only the Christmas those families experienced but also what the year ahead will be like for them?

There is another issue I want to address with the Minister of State. I wonder how much of this will get to her ears and if she will address us. I know that the Minister of State, Deputy Catherine Byrne, is in the Chamber listening, but will the Minister of State with responsibility for this issue listen? I publicly asked about the allocation of funding the last time she was in the Chamber. How was the money spent? There is €35 million meant to be given every year under A Vision for Change. How was the money spent last year? More importantly, in the budget the Government indicated that there was another €35 million available under A Vision for Change, but very quietly it was let out that it would happen over two years. There is €15 million available this year. As I stated to the Minister of State at the time, it will act as a stop-gap or contingency fund to meet the inadequacies of the budget, but it will not be used to provide any direct support or services. Where and how will the €15 million be allocated?

Last year I had to publicly go with the 95 Project and ask the public to be aware of the chronic and disgraceful treatment of the children of the nation. I was recently advised that I was not angry enough or that my tone was not angry enough.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

I have given the Senator over a minute extra.

Senator Joan Freeman

It is not in my personality to be angry or aggressive, but I will leave it to the public. I will go on the airwaves if the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, does not answer these questions as soon as possible.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

I thank the Senator and apologise to her for the absence of the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee. I have been asked to take this matter and I am happy to do so.

In the period from 2012 to 2016, approximately €115 million was added to the Health Service Executive mental health budget, which totalled €826 million in 2016. This represents an increase of €41 million, or 5.2%, on the figure provided in 2015. A Programme for a Partnership Government gives a clear commitment to increasing the mental health budget annually, as resources allow, to expand existing services. Budget 2017 made allowance for an additional €35 million for services to be initiated in 2017. Key priorities to be addressed in the HSE's 2017 service plan include youth mental health; further improvements to child and adolescent mental health services, CAMHS, and adult services; older people’s services; and a further enhanced out-of-hours response for those in need of urgent services. Recognising the time lag in new staff taking up posts and the completion of preparations for the introduction of these services, it is estimated that the revenue spend in 2017 associated with this increased allocation will be approximately €15 million. There will also be an additional spend of €9.5 million in mental health services associated with increased pay rates. Details of the 2017 development money spending will be finalised with the HSE in the near future in the context of the 2017 HSE mental health division’s operational plan for 2017.

For 2016 an additional €35 million in programme for Government funding was allocated for mental health services. This funding was spent on national mental health priorities as agreed between the Department of Health and the HSE and as signalled in the HSE's 2016 national service plan. Funding was issued in three parts. The first part, totalling approximately €22 million, was issued in June 2016 and used to fund such areas as homeless mental health services, service user engagement, the Jigsaw programme, the provision of additional counselling and psychology services and eating disorder posts. The second part, totalling €12 million, was issued in August 2016 and used to fund minor and capital works which addressed difficulties identified by Mental Health Commission inspectors, as well as an increase in the number of psychiatric nurse undergraduate training places. The final €1 million was allocated in December 2016 and helped to fund replacement vehicles for residential mental health units and mental health work by organisations such as Bodywhys, Áras Folláin, ADD Ireland and Focus Ireland. In cases where the HSE was unable to spend the full amount allocated to a certain area in 2016, it was reallocated to other mental health areas following sanction from the Department of Health. For example, €5 million issued for mental health services in the area of primary care was used to expand the range of small and minor capital works.

Mental health priorities for 2016 were agreed between the Department of Health and the HSE. They were published in the HSE's 2016 national service plan and in more detail in the HSE mental health division's 2016 operational plan. The breakdown of all mental health funding is available in the HSE mental health division’s operational plan which is published annually. The 2016 spend on these areas will be included in the forthcoming 2017 operational plan.

Senator Joan Freeman

I do not mean to shoot the messenger, but I must say my eyes glazed as the Minister of State was speaking. I know that she is reading the answer given to her by the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, but I have heard it all before. It is sad that I have come to realise the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee, has gone to the same school of language to which the Government and the HSE have gone. They have learned beautifully and effectively to fudge, placate and talk in circles. Every time I ask a question I hear that nonsense and it is nonsense. I am asking three very simple questions. I left my house at 7.30 a.m. to be here on time and prepared. I expected to meet the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee. As usual, I have seen the can being kicked down the street and a fudging of the real issues. I want answers to these three questions. What will the Minister of State do to prevent another 100 children from entering adult psychiatric units this year? What will she do about facilitating a meeting between the public and private sectors to erase all of these issues? How was the money spent last year and how does the Minister of State intend to spend the €15 million allocated this year? I want this said to her as soon as possible.

Deputy Catherine Byrne

I thank the Senator. The matter has the heading of transparency in mental health budget allocations and whether the Minister of State will agree to disclose where resources have been allocated since October 2016. In many ways, the response outlines how the funding was spent. I assure the Senator that, on any business I take here on behalf of a Minister or a Minister of State, I personally speak to them about the questions raised. It would be wrong to think I do not do so as I personally convey the issues raised. When I take a Topical Issues matter in the Dáil, I always speak to the relevant Minister or Ministers afterwards.

I agree with the Senator on a fundamental matter. I welcome the extra funding for CAMHS as, like any other public representative, I hear from many parents with a difficulty in gaining access to CAMHS for their children. I have come across a few disturbing cases. It is welcome there is money available in that regard. The Senator mentioned her Project 95. Although I have no knowledge of it, I will enlighten myself about it afterwards. What she has said is very true and honest and I will not argue with her. It is unacceptable that children and particularly young adults are housed in an adult ward when they have serious mental issues, including eating disorders.

I will personally bring the Senator's very clear messages to the Minister of State, Deputy Helen McEntee. I will relay to her the Senator's disappointment that she was not here and, above all, the fact that the Senator requested a meeting which not take place. I will bring these serious concerns to her.

Senator Joan Freeman

I believe the Minister of State and thank her for what she said. Will she also relay my frustration and anger?

Sitting suspended at 11.20 a.m. and resumed at 11.30 a.m.