I welcome the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications, Deputy Eamon Ryan, to the House. Amendments Nos. 1, 7, 8, 11 to 13, inclusive, 15 and 24 are related and may be discussed together. Is that agreed? Agreed.
Electricity Costs (Domestic Electricity Accounts) Emergency Measures Bill 2022: Committee and Remaining Stages
SECTION 1
Amendment No. 1 not moved.
Section 1 agreed to.
SECTION 2
Amendments Nos. 2 and 9 are related and may be discussed together. Is that agreed? Agreed.
Amendment No. 2 not moved.
Amendment No. 3 is deemed out of order as it imposes a potential charge on the Exchequer.
Amendment No. 3 not moved.
Amendments Nos. 4 and 21 are related and may be discussed together. Is that agreed? Agreed.
Amendment No. 4 not moved.
Amendment No. 5 is deemed out of order as it imposes a potential charge on the Exchequer.
Amendment No. 5 not moved.
Amendments Nos. 6 and 17 are related and may be discussed together by agreement. Is that agreed? Agreed.
Government amendment No. 6:
In page 4, line 28, to delete “€215 million” and substitute “€400 million".
Amendment agreed to.
I move amendment No. 7:
In page 4, line 32, to delete “domestic electricity accounts” and substitute “active domestic electricity accounts”.
This amendment is linked to amendment No. 1. It substitutes the words "active domestic electricity accounts" for the words "domestic electricity accounts". This is tied to the proposal in amendment No. 1 to use the information the ESB has on the use of electricity in households. This information, which is given to the Central Statistics Office, CSO, is used to identify which homes may be vacant homes or holiday homes. Amendment No. 1 provides that an amount of energy consumption be used to identify holiday homes. It would, therefore, allow the measure to be slightly more targeted and would prevent those who have holiday homes from receiving the rebate, or do a decent job of trying to identify those who have holiday homes.
We exercised discretion in allowing the Senator to speak to the amendment. Does the Minister wish to respond?
While I understand the purpose of the amendment, we cannot accept it because this as an emergency measure and we want to be quick. There is benefit in universality. It is much easier, much quicker and much less expensive. We have the electricity meter or billing system to be able to action this. If we start trying to separate out a number of exceptions, we would be stuck in appeals and a whole range of other processes. This would put back the delivery of this important financial payment to people at a particularly hard time. I am afraid, therefore, that we cannot accept the amendment.
Amendment put and declared lost.
I move amendment No. 8.
In page 4, line 36, to delete “domestic electricity accounts” and substitute “active domestic electricity accounts”.
I have spoken to this amendment, which is the same as amendment No. 7. It proposes to delete the words "domestic electricity accounts" and substitute the words "active domestic electricity accounts".
I have a similar response, I am afraid. I cannot accept the amendment.
Amendment put and declared lost.
I move amendment No. 9:
In page 4, between lines 37 and 38, to insert the following:
“(e) The Minister shall make provision in the Electricity Costs Emergency Benefit Scheme to identify those who own holiday homes or multiple properties and put in place a mechanism to ensure such individuals do not receive more than one electricity costs emergency benefit payment.
(f) The Minister shall make provision in the Electricity Costs Emergency Benefit Scheme to identify those who are renting, to ensure renters receive the benefit of the electricity costs emergency benefit payment, and the Minister shall put in place a dispute resolution mechanism to resolve any disputes between renters and their landlords or property management companies over the electricity costs emergency benefit payment.
(g) The Minister shall make provision in the Electricity Costs Emergency Benefit Scheme to ensure those who do not need the financial support from the electricity costs emergency benefit payment, can inform their electricity supplier to redirect their electricity costs emergency benefit payment to a charity that supports and helps those living in energy poverty.”.
I wish to come in on amendment No. 2. I had expected to hear the bells go off but I did not. Hence, I am little late.
These amendments are related. They are specifically around ensuring that people who are paying the electricity bill, particularly those who are in rented accommodation, are the ones that will benefit from this measure. I understand that it is an emergency measure. I take the Minister’s points about universality being important. However, universality also needs to apply to people who are not necessarily the named person on the bill or the final payee, but to those who are renting and, therefore, are the people who are paying. I ask the Minister to accept this or, if possible, to introduce another regulation for renters, as well as for people who are paying an electricity bill, who are often in housing insecurity and who are paying insanely high rents, which are going up month-on-month. They should be the people to benefit from this cost-of-living measure, particularly regarding heating. Many renters around this country are now afraid to turn on their heating. This is because they are being hit with the double whammy of rental increases and the massive increase in the price of heating.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Amendment No. 10 is deemed out of order as a potential charge on the Revenue Commissioners.
Amendment No. 10 not moved.
Section 2, as amended, agreed to.
SECTION 3
Amendment No. 11 has already been discussed with amendment No. 1. We will again exercise the same discretion both ways.
I move amendment No. 11:
In page 5, line 9, to delete “domestic electricity accounts” and substitute “active domestic electricity accounts”.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Section 3 agreed to.
SECTION 4
I move amendment No. 12:
In page 5, lines 14 and 15, to delete “domestic electricity accounts” and substitute “active domestic electricity accounts”.
Amendment put and declared lost.
I move amendment No. 13:
In page 5, lines 29 and 30, to delete “domestic electricity account” and substitute “active domestic electricity account”.
I cannot accept the amendment.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Amendment No. 14 is deemed out of order as a potential charge on the Revenue.
Amendment No. 14 not moved.
Section 4 agreed to.
SECTION 5
I move amendment No. 15:
In page 7, line 7, to delete “domestic electricity account” and substitute “active domestic electricity account”.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Amendment No. 16 is deemed out of order as a potential charge on the Revenue.
Amendment No. 16 not moved.
Government amendment No. 17:
“In page 7, line 7, to delete “€100” and substitute “€176.22”.”
Amendment agreed to.
Amendment No. 18 is deemed out of order as a potential charge on the Revenue.
Amendment No. 18 not moved.
Section 5, as amended, agreed to.
Sections 6 and 7 agreed to.
Amendment No. 19 is deemed out of order as not relevant to the subject matter of the Bill.
Amendment No. 19 not moved.
Amendment No. 20 is deemed out of order as a potential charge on the Revenue.
Amendment No. 20 not moved.
Section 8 agreed to.
SECTION 9
I move amendment No. 21:
In page 8, line 38, after “Oireachtas” to insert the following:
“excluding those monies which were allocated to budget sub-heads related to the prevention of energy poverty”.
Amendments Nos. 4 and 21 are linked in that the budget subheads of the money that would be funding this particular initiative would not be coming from money that has already been allocated to the prevention of energy poverty. That comes on the back of freedom of information, FOI, requests that have already been made. The Minister is saying that this is an energy poverty measure, but we do not want it to come out of money that has been allocated to other areas of energy poverty, including retrofitting. That is because in the FOIs, it was indicated that that is where the money is coming from. We are saying that this should be new funding that should be given towards energy poverty, given the level of the crisis. It should not come out of existing funding.
I thank the Senator for that succinct proposal. I invite the Minister to give a response to the House.
I thank the Senator and I can understand the concern, but I do not think that it applies in this case. None of the funding that has been allocated to this measure will come out of those other energy poverty measures, such as the better energy warmer homes scheme within our Department or several other measures which are also designed to tackle energy poverty. A certain amount of the funding will carry over from the previous year when, due to Covid-19, we were not able to carry out certain body works. However, the remainder will come from a separate Supplementary Estimate from my Department. This will be organised in conjunction with the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform. It will not lead to a diminution of any of the existing schemes. I am afraid, therefore, that I cannot agree to the amendment.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Section 9 agreed to.
Amendment No. 22 is deemed out of order as not relevant to the subject matter of the Bill.
Amendment No. 22 not moved.
Section 10 agreed to.
TITLE
Amendment No. 23 is deemed out of order because it would involve a potential charge on the Revenue.
Amendment No. 23 not moved.
I move amendment No. 24:
In page 3, lines 10 and 11, to delete “domestic electricity accounts” and substitute “active domestic electricity accounts”.
Amendment put and declared lost.
Title agreed to.
Bill reported with amendments.
When is it proposed to take Report Stage?
Now.
Is that agreed? Agreed.
Bill, as amended, received for final consideration.
When is it proposed to take Fifth Stage?
Now.
Is that agreed? Agreed.
Question, "That the Bill do now pass", put and agreed to.
I thank the Minister and colleagues very much for their co-operation on this very important matter to the people we represent. When is it proposed to sit again?
Tomorrow at 10.30 a.m.
Cuireadh an Seanad ar athló ar 7.23 p.m. go dtí 10.30 a.m. Dé Céadaoin, an 23 Feabhra 2022.
The Seanad adjourned at 7.23 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 23 February 2022.