Seanad Éireann debate -
Thursday, 7 Nov 2024

Vol. 303 No. 14

Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters

Education Policy

Senator Mary Fitzpatrick

I thank the Minister for being here this morning. I have tabled this Commencement Matter on behalf of those who have been diagnosed with dyslexia, their families, teachers and friends and the society that represents those with dyslexia and dyspraxia. I am asking for an update from the Minister on what engagement the Department has had with the SEC on their request for extra time for students with dyslexia or dyspraxia to complete exams. When we think about it, we have all got our own challenges, abilities and disabilities; some of them seen, some of them not. Dyslexia and dyspraxia are two quite common challenges that a lot of people have. Some of the brightest names in history - people such as Leonardo da Vinci, Pablo Picasso, Albert Einstein, many Hollywood stars and many other great names who succeeded in the world, made their mark and made huge contributions to society, culture, commerce, engineering and all walks of life - had dyslexia. As a young person trying to develop as a person and move from childhood to adolescence, one of the biggest challenges we all face is going through and completing State exams. It is a very daunting challenge even for the brightest and most capable of students because it is the first time in a person’s life they are objectively, independently measured on their academic capacity. Even the brightest, most capable, most prepared and well-resourced students can struggle in that moment of examination and the pressure of exam time.

When we then think of those who have the additional challenge of dyslexia and dyspraxia, it is not too much to ask that we recognise and support those students to achieve their maximum potential. I fully acknowledge the additional supports that are in place for students with additional learning needs, they are very welcome and valued. However sometimes time is the most precious commodity. For those students in an exam setting; time is incredibly valuable. For the students, teachers, parents friends, supporters and community, the society that represents those students is asking simply that they be given some extra time when it comes to completing their educational exams. I am hoping the Minister of State can provide an update on what engagement the Department has had with the SEC and I look forward to his updating the House in a positive way on what progress has been made to meet that request. It is a reasonable request with which I hope the Minister of State agrees and I hope he will be forthcoming with a positive response.

Acting Chairperson (Senator Mary Seery Kearney)

I welcome Deputy Bacik and her guest - it is fitting that we see her here on the last day of the Seanad as we did on the first - we wish her the best of luck in not coming back here but going to the other House. I call on the Minister of State.

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Colm Burke)

I thank the Acting Chairperson. I am here on behalf of the Minister for Education. I thank the Senator for the opportunity to update the House on this important matter. The State Examinations Commission or the SEC has responsibility for operational matters relating to State examinations. There is a reasonable accommodation for certificate examination scheme which facilitates access for candidates who would have difficulty in accessing examinations or communicating what they know to an examiner because of a physical disability.

This includes medical, sensory, behavioural and mental health difficulties as well as physical difficulties, visual and hearing impairments or a learning difficulty. The category of learning difficulty encompasses a range of conditions such as dyslexia but also general learning difficulties, dysgraphia, dyspraxia and dyscalculia.

A central tenet of the RACE scheme is to ensure equitable treatment for all candidates, and the range of accommodations provided within the scheme has been designed to ensure fairness for all when facilitating candidates in demonstrating their level of achievement. It is important to note that access to the scheme is needs-based rather than based on a specific diagnosis. Almost one in four candidates at the 2024 certificate examinations was provided with some form of reasonable accommodation within the scheme to support them in accessing the State examinations.

As regards candidates with dyslexia, general learning difficulties, dyscalculia and other forms of learning, an extensive range of accommodations is available. These include an individual reader, a reading assistant, an exam reading pen, a word processor, a recording device and additional time for any candidate using a scribe to provide for time overhead in dictating answers.

I can advise that the challenge in determining the allocation of additional time for candidates with learning difficulties, including dyslexia, was recognised by an expert advisory group some years ago, leading to two particular measures being introduced to the scheme. First, additional time of 20 minutes per examination paper was introduced for all candidates in the leaving certificate subjects of Irish, English, history and geography. Second, a waiver from spelling, grammar and punctuation was also established. The SEC has advised that this waiver is, to its knowledge, unique to the Irish examination system.

I am advised by the SEC that it absolutely acknowledges there is increasing complexity in the special educational landscape and, by extension, in the impact on candidates with special educational needs taking the certificate examinations, and that there has been a recent focus on a number of areas, including the adequacy of additional time within the scheme. I can also advise that, in the context of senior cycle redevelopment, the SEC has commenced work on a comprehensive system-wide review of the RACE scheme. This is being overseen by the board of commissioners in the SEC, which has recently agreed the terms of reference for the review, and it is due to commence by the year end. In particular, the SEC has affirmed that the review will consider all relevant issues, including the question of additional time, and that it will involve extensive consultation with as broad a range of stakeholders as possible.

Senator Mary Fitzpatrick

I thank the Minister of State for the reply. I welcome the fact the SEC acknowledges the increasing complexity, particularly in terms of special educational needs and examination of students with special educational needs. I also welcome the fact the SEC has committed to undertaking and will undertake a full and comprehensive review of the arrangements that are in place. The accommodations already in place are acknowledged by Dyslexia Ireland and all those who campaign on behalf of people with dyslexia. Those accommodations are valued. It is recognising the value of those accommodations that has helped identify this additional need for additional time. I welcome the fact the review will take place. I urge the SEC in completing its review to engage with all stakeholders - Dyslexia Ireland, the parents, the teachers and, indeed, some of the young people who have gone through the State examinations with dyslexia and with the benefit of the supports that are in place - in order that we can come to an accommodation that ensures every young person gets the opportunity to reach his or her full potential and the opportunity to have a positive experience from the State exams. That is what it should be. It should be a springboard from which young people move forward, confident they have the abilities to achieve their full potential.

Deputy Colm Burke

I think the Senator would acknowledge that the SEC in the past has taken on board the concerns of both parents and students and has developed a comprehensive scheme. It is important there is a review. As mentioned earlier, almost one in four candidates in the 2024 certificate examinations was provided with some form of reasonable accommodation within the RACE scheme to support them in accessing the State examinations, underlying the importance of the scheme. The SEC has affirmed that its review of the RACE scheme will consider all relevant issues, including the question of additional time, which was the issue the Senator focused on. I welcome this and the SEC's intention to consult extensively with stakeholders, including representative organisations, as it progresses its review.

School Transport

Senator Malcolm Byrne

Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit. I have regularly raised questions in this House about the school transport scheme. While it was certainly welcome the Minister, Norma Foley, carried out the first review of the scheme, which was published in February of this year, the first review since the scheme was established in 1967, we still need to see some of the detail. I have raised this previously. We have seen over recent years an expansion in the number of school bus places available. There has been a significant increase in the number of concessionary tickets, but a very clear commitment was given within School Transport 2030 to introduce a number of pilot bus schemes that would address the issue of distance and the problem of distance to schools. The Minister of State will be aware that the rule requires that, to qualify for an automatic ticket, one travel to one's nearest education centre. That does not suit in every case.

I have been raising the case of roughly 190 students from the north Wexford area who travel to schools in Gorey, Enniscorthy and Wexford. The primary reason they do this is that their nearest education centre is Coláiste an Átha, in Kilmuckridge. It is an excellent small school, but there would be a huge increase in its population if all 190 were to attend there, and there simply is not the space at present. The Minister, Deputy Foley, and the Department sanctioned one of the pilot schemes to be offered to some of the children in that area, that is, children who might have been travelling into Gorey from areas such as Monamolin, Oulart, the Ballagh, Ballyedmond and so on. That was sanctioned earlier this year, but the bus still has not been put on the route. There is a particular desire as well on the part of the parents and the children who travel from that area to use one of the pilot bus schemes to travel into Wexford town. I certainly hope that, as the scheme is expanded, they can be catered for.

I raised this issue six months ago, and at that time the Minister of State, Niall Collins, responded on behalf of the Minister and made clear that a number of the pilot projects for 2024-25 would be put in place and would be in operation. While we have sanction for one in north Wexford, it is still not in operation. At the time, six months ago, I was informed by the Department that it was looking at the possibility of integrating some of these pilot projects with the public transport network but that, if not, it would engage with private contractors. I know the Department and Bus Éireann have been in contact with private contractors in the area, but the Minister of State will appreciate we are now into the middle of November in the 2024-25 school year. The pilot bus schemes are not yet in operation. It is critical we put on the record of the House where we are with those, especially for those parents who have been told the pilot schemes have been sanctioned. If he can, I ask the Minister of State to give us a very clear date as to when the pilot service will actually commence. We have been raising this around extending to those children who are impacted a pilot operating into Wexford town. Again, I know inquiries were made, and I hope the Minister of State might be able to give some answer on that. Even more generally, under the commitment to establish a number of pilot schemes, how many pilot schemes around the country will be established?

Deputy Colm Burke

I am taking this matter on behalf of the Minister for Education. I think Thomas Byrne was to take it but he is in the Dáil dealing with a number of matters.

I thank the Senator for raising this matter. Before I address the specific issue raised, I will provide an outline of the extent of the school transport scheme. The school transport scheme is a significant operation managed by Bus Éireann on behalf of the Department of Education. In the 2023-24 school year, over 163,800 children were transported daily to primary and post-primary schools throughout the country. This figure includes over 136,000 pupils travelling on primary and post-primary services, 20,200 pupils with special educational needs and 7,400 pupils who have arrived in Ireland from Ukraine. The total cost of the scheme in 2023 was €382.02 million. Over 142,000 mainstream tickets have issued for the 2024-25 school year, which is already 4% more than the total tickets issued for the full 2023-24 school year.

The school transport scheme is an important service for families and children. The purpose of the Department's school transport scheme is, having regard to available resources, to support the transport to and from school of children who reside remotely from their nearest school. Under the current scheme, children are eligible for transport at primary school level where they reside not less than 3.2 km from, and are attending, their nearest national school. At post-primary level, young people are eligible where they reside not less than 4.8 kilometres from, and are attending, their nearest post-primary school or education centre as determined by the Department and-or Bus Éireann, having regard to ethos and language.

Children who are eligible for school transport and who complete the application process on time, that is those who apply on time and pay on time, are accommodated on school transport services where such services are in operation. Temporary alleviation measures at post-primary level, which have been in place since 2019, are being continued for the 2024-25 school year. Under these measures, transport is provided where there is a route in operation and where capacity exists for concessionary post-primary pupils who are eligible for transport to their nearest school and are attending their second nearest school. They must also, of course, apply and pay on time. Children who are not eligible for school transport may apply for transport on a concessionary basis only and will be facilitated where spare seats are available after eligible children have been accommodated. Where the number of ineligible children exceeds the number of spare seats available, Bus Éireann will allocate tickets for the spare seats using an agreed selection process.

The school transport 2030 report, which was published earlier this year, marks the largest review of the school transport scheme since it was established in 1967. The Government is committed to working to achieve the report's recommendation of expanding access to the scheme so that an additional 100,000 pupils can be carried by 2030. The analysis conducted as part of this comprehensive review has illustrated the importance of school transport to families but has also shown how the scheme can support wider Government policies, including supporting climate action targets, supporting working parents and the labour market, supporting families to live and work in rural Ireland and teaching life skills for children.

The recommended changes to the future operation of the schemes include expanding the current eligibility criteria, addressing current operational challenges and moving towards better integration with public transport to ensure the best value for money to the Exchequer. I envisage that over time this will lead to expanding the provision of transport and reducing the reliance on individual car trips for school journeys. A phased implementation of the review’s recommendations began in September 2024. This has included a shared effort between the Department of Education and the Department of Transport to pilot and introduce greater integration of transport networks with school transport routes.

The pilot projects in the 2024-25 school year will provide a valuable insight into the impact on the scheme of increased demand, the possibilities to integrate public transport services with school transport services and the possibilities to facilitate more sustainable modes of transport. These impacts will be fully assessed and costed as required. The projects will evaluate and assess the scale of planning and implementation required for a national roll-out of a revised school transport scheme. As part of this, they will include the integration of public transport and school transport services. The school transport scheme and public transport integration project is a joint effort between the Department of Education and the Department of Transport, supported by the National Transport Authority and Bus Éireann.

While phase 1 of the implementation of the school transport 2030 report in the current school year has seen the initial establishment of two pilot projects, in the Clare-Limerick and Athlone-Roscommon areas, as committed to at the time of publication of the review, the Department intends to establish further pilots in a number of areas, including north County Wexford, subject to available resources, such as buses and drivers. The sourcing of drivers and buses is ongoing and updates will be provided as resources become available.

Senator Malcolm Byrne

I thank the Minister of State and appreciate that he is simply taking this Commencement matter on behalf of the Department of Education, but I refer him to the answer I received regarding this issue six months ago. Except for two or three lines, this response is a cut-and-paste of that answer from the Department. Basically, in terms of the pilot, the only thing the Department has announced is that the north County Wexford scheme is now included. The other two pilot schemes are not really new bus services. They are using the existing public transport network.

If pilot schemes are being introduced and reviewed for the 2024-25 school year, and this was committed to under the school transport 2030 review, my problem is that we do not have them in operation yet. I must question what the point is in sanctioning a scheme if we do have it up and operating. Looking at the response from the Department, my problem is that it is practically a cut-and-paste of the exact same answer I got six months ago.

The Minister of State will appreciate that I fully understand, as he does, how the school transport scheme operates. This was not the question I was asking. I asked the Department when the pilot schemes were going to start and where they were going to be operating.

Deputy Colm Burke

I understand the Senator's frustration. This was the response I was given by the Department of Education. In fairness to the Department, it is continuing to review the situation. From my experience, I know that one of the challenges in several areas is getting drivers. It is a challenge. By the way, the closing statement I have here refers to the Senator as a Deputy. I am sure this was someone looking to the future.

I thank the Senator for the opportunity to update him on the ongoing work on the school transport 2030 review and the roll-out of the pilot areas. As outlined, these pilot projects will provide valuable insights on the impact increased demand will have on the scheme and the potential to integrate public transport services, which is what seems to be being spoken of, with school transport services and the facilitation of more sustainable modes of transport. I remind the Senator that all the Government's commitments to achieving the report's recommendations of expanding access to the scheme so that an additional 100,000 pupils can be carried by 2030 will be in addition to the 161,600 children who currently travel daily on school transport services.

A large part of my constituency is rural as well and I understand the challenges there. The choice of school is impacted too. That is another specific issue. I do, therefore, understand fully the difficulties that parents have, but I think the Department is doing everything possible to resolve those issues. Long-term planning is going on regarding this problem, which I think is extremely important. It is going to be rolled out over the next four to five years and it is important that we support the Department in undertaking this work.

Special Educational Needs

Senator Micheál Carrigy

I welcome the Minister of State and thank him for taking my Commencement matter. I stand here today talking about a matter that touches the heart of every family and community. It is an area I have worked on over my four and a half years in this House. I am talking about ensuring that we give every child the opportunity to maximise their potential in life. The Government has been extremely supportive in opening a significant number of special classes, particularly in our primary school system, but the reality is that we are not opening a sufficient number of classes in the post-primary system to cater for the demand stemming from the pupils coming through. As I said, it is important that every child gets this opportunity to achieve their potential.

I have been speaking to the family of a young boy by the name of Fiachra. He is only one child from among numerous families in the same position. He is now in sixth class in a special school. He had early intervention and eight full years of primary school in a special class. Now, though, the family does not know if they will be guaranteed a place for Fiachra in September 2025.

There are five pupils leaving this national school where they have been for the last eight years. When we look at the numbers across the entire primary school network in County Longford, we see that there are not sufficient places available in the post-primary schools for every child that has that need. The application process for parents applying for the 2025-26 school year is open. Closing dates for the schools are in November, with notifications of whether a child has been accepted or not in December. As I said, we do not have sufficient places in the post-primary schools to cater for that demand. This is something we need to prioritise as a society. Education is key to all our children’s futures. In 2024, we cannot have a situation where parents do not know whether their child is going to have a place in second level education. It needs to be in their local area as well. We cannot have a situation where we are fighting to get additional classes opened in post-primary schools. We have had it before in other counties. It is the same in Westmeath where we have had issues, especially in Athlone, in the last couple of years. We do not want a situation where children and parents have to travel up to 50 miles return twice a day so the children can get their education. The figures are there for the children in special classes within the primary schools. We need to match them up and forward plan 12 to 18 months in advance, rather than waiting until January 2025 to start going to schools and trying to get classrooms open when the closing date for applications for the school year has passed.

I will give the number of places available in the various schools. I will be corrected if I am wrong. There are three places available in Ardscoil Phádraig and two in Cnoc Mhuire Secondary School, both of which are in Granard. There are two in Ballymahon Vocational School and four in Mercy Secondary School, also in Ballymahon. Some of the other schools do not have any availability. Within half the county we have only 11 places covering 20 to 25 primary schools and a significant number of children who have that need. We do not have the capacity in the post-primary schools to meet the demand for September 2025.

We are all aware that transitioning into secondary school is a milestone for any child. My son started only a number of weeks ago and I know what that is like, but for autistic children the change can be overwhelming. It brings new routines, new people and new challenges and we must ensure these transitions are met with support and understanding for those families, rather than obstacles. I ask we put in place a sufficient number of post-primary places in ASD classes throughout Longford and Westmeath to ensure we cater for every single child who needs a place for September 2025.

Deputy Colm Burke

I thank the Senator. I apologise that the Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, is not available to do the reply. She has asked me to deal with it on her behalf. A priority for this Government is to ensure that all children have an appropriate school placement and that the necessary supports are provided to our schools to ensure the needs of children with special educational needs are met. It is important to remember that the vast majority of children with special educational needs are supported to attend mainstream classes with their peers. To support children with more complex needs, special classes in mainstream schools and special schools are provided.

The Minister of State with responsibility for special education and inclusion, Deputy Naughton, is very aware of the work the Senator is doing to progress the provision of special education places in Longford. She has asked me to convey her apologies that she could not be here to address this matter with the Senator, but she has asked me to assure him that she looks forward to continuing to build on the progress they have made together in the provision of special education places for the children of Longford. As the Senator will know, the National Council for Special Education, NCSE, has responsibility for co-ordinating and advising on the education provision for children nationwide. The Department of Education and the NCSE have introduced a number of strategic initiatives to plan for and provide sufficient mainstream, special class and special school places. Almost 1,700 new special classes have been sanctioned over the last five years and 11 new special schools have been established.

The Senator references the issue of establishing new autism classes in County Longford. Six new classes have been sanctioned for the 2024-25 school year, with four being at primary level and two at post-primary level. This brings the total number of special classes in Longford to 47, of which 30 are at primary level and 17 at post-primary level. The vast majority of these are autism classes and have a teacher-student ratio of 1:6. The NCSE has recruited additional special education needs organisers, SENOs, advisers and team managers. A total of 120 SENOs now operate nationwide, which is almost double what we had previously. Longford now has a SENO dedicated solely to the county. The SENOs play an important role in ensuring there is adequate special educational provision within local areas and are currently visiting schools nationwide to conduct planning meetings. These visits will be key to forward planning for the 2025-26 school year.

This year, the Department of Education will spend in excess of €2.7 billion, or over a quarter of its budget, on providing additional teaching and care supports for children with special educational needs. For the first time we have over 41,500 staff working in the education system who are specifically dedicated to supporting students with special educational needs. For 2025, the Department will further increase the number of teaching and special needs assistant posts in our schools. There will be an additional 768 teachers and a further 1,600 SNAs in our schools. These posts will support the opening of 400 new special classes and 300 new special school places for the 2025-26 school year. The demand for new special classes at post-primary level is expected to increase significantly over the next few years, due to increasing demographics and increasing prevalence rates, and the Department and the NCSE have engaged with post-primary stakeholders about the provision of special classes. The Minister of State outlined the situation further in the circulated reply.

Senator Micheál Carrigy

I thank the Minister of State for the response. It is important to acknowledge there has been significant investment by the Government in additional school places. The Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, has been extremely proactive in the role. I acknowledge the opening of classes in the county and that a new SENO has been put in place. Today is 7 November and the application process for schools is currently ongoing. The closing date for applications for September 2025 is this month. It is stated in the reply that numerous additional places have been put in and are planned for the 2025-26 school year, but they are not there as of today. That is where I have an issue because parents are looking to make applications for special places in schools. Those places are not in place yet and that is what we need to address. The figures show we have 17 special classes at post-primary level and 30 at primary level. That matches up with the need transitioning from primary into secondary. That is what I wanted to highlight. We have fantastic plans, funding put in place, extra special class teachers and SNAs, but as of today there are parents in Longford and Westmeath who do not know if their child is going to have a place in September 2025. Answers are needed there immediately.

Deputy Colm Burke

In October 2022 the Department wrote to all post-primary schools requesting each school begin planning to provide for up to four special classes to meet the needs of children progressing from primary school.

Just last month, the Department issued a circular to all schools setting out new measures to support the forward planning of special education provision. Included in this circular was a reminder of the need for post-primary schools to continue with planning for this level of provision. As a result of this forward planning, four new special schools have opened for this school year and five more have been announced for the 2025-26 school year. Capacity is also expanded in a number of other special schools. The Minister of State, Deputy Naughton, has said that her Department and the NCSE will continue to monitor and review the need for further special classes and schools or the expansion of existing special schools over the coming months. The Department is committed to working in each area. As I have already set out, a SENO has been appointed for Longford to plan for the needs of the area.

Air Navigation Orders

Senator Alice-Mary Higgins

What inspections have taken place under the Air Navigation (Carriage of Munitions of War, Weapons and Dangerous Goods) Order since May 2024 to enforce the prohibition of the use of Irish airspace for the carriage of munitions of war, weapons, ammunition and dangerous goods, including dual-use goods? What exemptions have been granted under that order? This is important.

I have included that date because, as the Minister of State will be aware, I introduced the arms embargo Bill in June. At that time, the Minister, Deputy Ryan, while suggesting that there really was no need to be concerned about flights, explicitly stated that no Irish airport or Irish sovereign airspace was being used to transport weapons to Israel, despite claims to the contrary. It has since been proven and made evident that, as we suggested was likely at the time, Irish airspace has been used for the transport of weapons on multiple occasions. These weapons have been used in the destruction of life and potentially in the breaching of international law. These weapons have been used by the Israel Defense Forces. I have a list of ten such flights but time does not permit me to list them. However, one flight carried 24 tonnes of weaponry and explosives, including rounds of ammunition to be used by IDF snipers in some of the appalling deaths we have seen targeting civilians in Gaza. These are the kinds of weapons passing through Ireland.

It has now been announced that a new regime and new legislation are intended and that these will be based on sampling, searching and sanctioning. I want to be clear on how we are using the powers we already have. What exactly are the new things that are going to be done as opposed to what could be done and I hope is being done with the powers we already have? To be really clear on the powers we already have as of today, including during the lacuna while an election takes place, the Minister has the power to allow an authorised person to enter and inspect an aircraft for the purposes of preventing a flight where it is likely that the flight might be in contravention of the orders that forbid the carriage of weapons, munitions or dangerous goods. Section 6 of the order also makes provision for cases where the carriage of such munitions of war can be reasonably suspected. There is reason to suspect that this is happening. When we see the litany of flights that have disregarded even the exemption process, it is clear that there is reason to inspect. While I look forward to hearing the detail of what exactly will be done with regard to overflights, with regard to flights that land in Ireland rather than solely going through our airspace, it is very clear we already have powers to inspect. If, as we have heard, FedEx flights are being used to transport weapons, we now have a very reasonable reason to suspect that there may be breaches of our prohibitions on munitions within such flights. I would therefore expect that any such chartered flights would now be inspected.

How are we using the existing powers? How will they be used and how have they been used over the past few months since the debate we had on the arms embargo Bill? I ask about the inspection powers that already exist in addition to whatever may be added to strengthen those in the future.

Deputy Colm Burke

I thank the Senator. I am taking this matter on behalf of the Minister. I apologise that he could not be here today to take this Commencement matter. The carriage of munitions of war is prohibited on any civil aircraft in Irish sovereign territory or on an Irish-registered civil aircraft, wherever it may be operating, unless an exemption is granted by the Minister for Transport. This is implemented in Irish law through the Air Navigation (Carriage of Munitions of War, Weapons and Dangerous Goods) Orders 1973 and 1989. These orders define munitions of war as “weapons and ammunition designed for use in warfare and includes parts of or for such weapons and ammunition”. Dual-use goods, which the Senator has mentioned, are not referenced within these orders. The orders further provide that weapons which are not considered to be munitions of war may be carried as part of the baggage of a passenger if kept in an inaccessible area of the aircraft and, if a firearm, is unloaded. This facility allows for hunting and sporting weapons to be carried on flights, which can be a common occurrence depending on the area of the world in which the flight is taking place.

Each year, approximately 1,000 exemptions are granted by the Department of Transport. These predominantly fall into two categories. The first relates to armed law enforcement or military personnel on Irish-registered aircraft operating scheduled flights in the European Union. The second relates to US military personnel carried by a US civil air operator either overflying or landing briefly in Ireland where the unloaded personal issue weapons of those personnel are on board. It is important to highlight that, in this second case, should no personal issued weapons be carried, no exemption would be required.

A long-established process of consideration and consultation is utilised when applications for exemptions are received from civil air operators. This includes consulting with the Departments of Foreign Affairs and Justice on foreign policy and security considerations. The Irish Aviation Authority, the State agency with responsibility for regulating the carriage of dangerous goods by air, is consulted on any applications for an exemption to permit the carriage of munitions of war also classified as dangerous goods, such as ammunition. In all cases, the Department of Defence is informed of applications received.

I can confirm that no inspections under the 1973 order have taken place since May 2024. The inspection provisions within the orders are limited to circumstances where there is an appearance that an aircraft is intended or likely to be flown from any place within the State in such circumstances that the flight would be in contravention of the order. However, these provisions are not deemed to be sufficient to provide for random inspections nor do they relate in any way to aircraft that are overflying and do not land on sovereign territory.

In answer to the second part of the Senator’s query, I am informed that, from May 2024 to the end of October 2024, the last full month, 686 applications for an exemption were received by the Department of Transport and 665 of these were granted. Of these 665 exemptions, 247 were granted to Irish-registered aircraft operating outside of the State, 135 were granted to civil aircraft landing in or taking off from the State and 283 were granted to civil aircraft overflying the State.

It must be noted that exemptions are granted to civil air operators and not to nation states. Furthermore, the exemption granted is for the carriage of munitions of war through Irish sovereign territory or on board an Irish-registered aircraft. It is not an approval to land at any airport outside the State. This is a matter for the state to which it is being flown and its own domestic procedures.

Senator Alice-Mary Higgins

What I am hearing is that the "eyes wide shut" approach is continuing.

There is a suggestion there has been no inspection despite the litany of reports we have seen. We are not calling for random inspections, we are calling for very real and reasonably targeted inspections of flights coming from countries such as the US and Germany in particular, which have been shown to be carrying arms. We have seen a pattern of arms being carried. Aircraft such as Challenger have been shown to have carried munitions through the State. There are also the FedEx flights that I mentioned. These are all reasonable grounds. The pattern of a clear assumption of full impunity for anybody flying through is the reason we need to exercise the powers that are there, where there may be reason to suspect - not where they may be suspected - that those carrying out flights may be likely to be in breach. These are grounds for inspection. These are not random inspections. They are inspections to ensure, enforce and be serious about the fact that we do not want to be complicit in the flow of arms to a genocide, and that we will take all action under the laws we already have.

With respect to the suggestion that dual-use goods are not included, dangerous goods are prohibited. There has been a sevenfold export of dual-use goods, which are goods that can be used for military purposes, from Ireland to Israel. This maps onto the year in which the war has been conducted. This is seven times the amount of such goods at a time when there is a tech slump in Israel, so we know that most of that technology must be going to its other use, which is the military use. To say these are not dangerous goods covered by this is, of course, yet another obfuscation. Will the Minister of State clarify not only the question of random goods and flights but why there have not been any inspections of flights, given the alarming information? Is there a plan to change this during the period when an election is taking place and the Government is being formed, when the deaths will be continuing? Surely we can have some use of the powers that exist while we wait. I will await measures to tackle the overflights issue and I will be supportive when they come.

Deputy Colm Burke

The legislation underpinning the carriage of munitions of war in civil aircraft was drafted in the 1970s, with amendments made in the 1980s. The context in which it was written pre-dates the significant growth seen in aviation in the following decades. As a result, it is deemed appropriate to update the legislation to ensure it is fit for purpose for the present day. The Minister for Transport has previously expressed a desire to put in place a system of random inspections of civil aircraft that have been granted exemptions to carry munitions of war through Irish sovereign territory under the relevant provisions of national law. Following the debate on the Private Members' Bill introduced by Senator Higgins in May, the Air Navigation and Transport (Arms Embargo) Bill 2024, the Minister tasked his officials to undertake an examination of the existing legislation from the perspective of the introduction of a random inspection regime. Earlier this week the Minister, Deputy Ryan, brought a memo to the Government providing an update on this work. The Minister outlined to Cabinet his views on the need to strengthen the State's ability to detect and sanction any civil air operator found to have contravened Irish law on the transportation of the munitions of war through our airports or sovereign airspace. The Minister outlined how he considers that Ireland's capabilities to ensure compliance could be strengthened and has asked his officials to engage with the Department of Foreign Affairs with a view to ensuring the State has the necessary legal powers to search aircraft and sample cargo documentation to ensure compliance with our laws and to sanction any contravening air operators.

Given that civil aviation is an international industry underpinned by multiple multilateral agreements to which the State is a party, due consideration need to be given to ensure any policy developed will be in line with the State's commitments under these agreements. The Government has noted the next steps in this process will be engagement between the Departments of Transport and Foreign Affairs on the development of policy on the detection of contravention of Irish law by civil air operators.

The Minister has set out a clear plan to look at current legislation and bring forward new proposals through new legislation. As I have said, the existing legislation goes back to the 1970s with amendments in the 1980s. It is no longer adequate for dealing with the volume of flights through Irish airports. Therefore, it is appropriate that we amend the legislation.

Senator Alice-Mary Higgins

It would be more credible if the Government took the powers it has and used them to the fullest extent. That the legislation is from the 1970s and 1980s does not tell us anything. I have explicitly read into the record the powers that are there at present. Obviously we should have stronger powers but we should certainly have a first step which not only looks at the legislation but begins to look at some of the flights.

Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 10.26 a.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 10.30 a.m.

Sitting suspended at 10.26 a.m. and resumed at 10.30 a.m.