Select Committee on Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht debate -
Wednesday, 28 Mar 2018

Vote 33 - Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht (Revised)

Chairman

Is féidir linn an cruinniú a thosnú. Táimid i seisiún poiblí anois. Níl aon leithscéalta faighte agam. Comharlaím do na baill go léir na gutháin phóca a mhúchadh, ionas nach gcuireann siad isteach ar an gcóras fuaime agus ar chraolachán na cruinnithe. I ask members to ensure their mobile phones are switched off le do thoil.

Táimid ag díriú isteach ar Vóta 33 - Cultúr, Oidhreacht agus Gaeltacht, Meastachán Athbhreithnithe, providing for gross voted expenditure of €303 million, with €54 million in capital expenditure and current expenditure of €248 million.

Inniu táimid chun é sin a phlé leis an Aire Cultúir, Oidhreachta agus Gaeltachta, an Teachta Madigan, maidir le Vóta 33. Fanaimid go dtiocfaidh na haíonna so cuirfimid ar fionraí é le haghaidh cúpla nóiméad. We will suspend briefly to allow our guests take their seats.

Sitting suspended at 1.39 p.m. and resumed at 1.42 p.m.

Chairman

Táimid í seisiún poiblí arís, le cúnamh Dé. Cuirim fáilte mhór roimh an Aire Cultúir, Oidhreachta agus Gaeltachta, an Teachta Madigan, agus roimh an Aire Stáit, an Teachta McHugh, agus na hoifigigh ón Roinn freisin. Before the Minister addresses the meeting, I draw attention to the fact that by virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of the evidence they are to give to the committee. If, however, they are directed by it to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and continue to so do, they are entitled thereafter only to qualified privilege in respect of their evidence. They are directed that only evidence connected with the subject matter of these proceedings is to be given and asked to respect the parliamentary practice to the effect that, where possible, they should not criticise or make charges against any person or an entity by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable. Any submission or opening statement submitted to the committee may be published on its website after the meeting.

Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or an official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable.

Chun tús a chur leis an gcomhrá, tugaim cuireadh don Aire, an Teachta Madigan, a cur i láthair a dhéanamh anois. I invite the Minister to make her opening statement.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Is mór agam an deis seo a fháil inniu chun Meastacháin mo Roinne do 2018 a phlé. I am pleased to have this opportunity to discuss with the committee the 2018 priorities for my Department. I will also mention the significant programme of capital investment outlined for my Department under Project Ireland 2040 and acknowledge the hugely positive impact this will have in terms of strengthening and expanding the valuable work of my Department in supporting and promoting our national culture, heritage and language.

The responsibilities of my Department are broad and diverse and include the conservation, preservation, protection, development and presentation of Ireland's heritage and culture, the promotion of the Irish language and support of the Gaeltacht and island communities. I propose to address the issues arising across my Department's Vote on a programme by programme basis. In the first instance, I will provide a broad outline of the overall position.

A gross provision of slightly less than €303 million is available to my Department in 2018. An additional €700,000 in funding has been carried over from the 2017 capital provision for expenditure on priority projects in accordance with the provisions of public financial procedures. In broad terms, the 2018 breakdown of allocations to my Vote is as follows: €167.3 million for arts, culture and film, including €68.2 million for the Arts Council; €45.3 million for the national cultural institutions; €18 million for the Irish Film Board; €10.4 million for cultural infrastructure and development and a dedicated funding stream of €6 million for Creative Ireland, the Government’s legacy project for Ireland 2016; more than €47.1 million for the conservation and protection of Ireland's built and natural heritage, including almost €12 million for natural heritage; slightly less than €6.4 million for the Heritage Council and slightly more than €5 million for built heritage, including the successful built heritage investment scheme; €48.6 million for the Irish language, Gaeltacht and islands; and slightly less than €40 million for North-South co-operation, including support for two North-South implementation bodies, namely, Waterways Ireland and An Foras Teanga.

The gross allocation for my Department in 2018 is more than 5% higher than the comparable figure for 2017 as per the further Revised Estimates for 2017 which took account of the transfer of the regional and rural functions and associated allocations to the Department of Rural and Community Development.

The 2018 provision allows for increases in funding across a range of bodies under my Department's remit, as well as increases in funding for a number of arts, heritage and Gaeltacht schemes. This additional funding is targeted at key initiatives, including an additional €3 million for the Arts Council, a 5% increase in its annual budget; an additional €1.5 million for the Irish Film Board, representing a 9% increase in its annual allocation; boosts in funding for all of the national cultural institutions; dedicated funding of €6 million for the implementation of the Creative Ireland programme; additional funding for a further round of the very successful arts and culture capital scheme in 2018; an additional €1.5 million for heritage, including measures to support biodiversity; an extra €2.5 million for the Irish language, Gaeltacht and the islands; and an extra €1 million for Waterways Ireland.

The significance of Project Ireland 2040, the national planning framework and associated national development plan launched by the Taoiseach in Sligo cannot be overstated in the case of my Department. For the first time ever, the value and importance of our culture, language and heritage are fully recognised and given equal standing with economic targets and essential infrastructure such as roads, schools and hospitals. The national development plan has allocated an unprecedented €1 billion for capital investment in our culture and heritage over the next ten years. This is in addition to an investment of €178 million in the Irish language and in supporting and sustaining our unique Gaeltacht and island communities. The scale of this investment will be transformative, allowing us to renew and redevelop our national cultural institutions, enhance the cultural offering in theatres and other cultural facilities throughout the country, digitise the national collections and support Galway 2020 European Capital of Culture.

Our creativity and culture investment programme will deliver on the objectives of Creative Ireland, both in terms of enhancing our cultural infrastructure and making significant investments in expanding our creative industries. A particular focus for this investment will be in the audiovisual sector.

Our national heritage was specifically identified in Project Ireland 2040 as essential for enhancing the liveability of our communities and creating opportunities for tourism. Under the plan, my Department will invest in our built heritage to ensure that the historical cores of our cities, towns and villages are protected and regenerated. I also intend to significantly ramp up investment in our inland waterways, including in the restoration of the Ulster Canal.

The value of our natural heritage should not be underestimated either. Over the next ten years, my Department will develop and implement a major new investment programme for our national parks and nature reserves. These invaluable natural assets teach us the value of our natural heritage, as well as being hubs for outdoor activities and tourism. In 2017 alone, 4 million visitors visited our six national parks at Wicklow, Killarney, the Burren, Connemara, Ballycroy and Glenveagh.

We also need to protect our natural environment. The plan will provide for the implementation of the national biodiversity plan, protecting our unique landscapes, peatlands and biodiversity for future generations.

My colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Joe McHugh, and I shall both make brief remarks on individual programme areas. We are happy to later expand on any matter that members wish to raise.

I shall commence with some details, with the permission of the Chair, on the culture programme. A sum of €167 million will be provided for arts, culture and film in 2018. As members will know, the Creative Ireland programme is the Government's legacy project for Ireland. Creative Ireland aims to harness the goodwill, engagement and momentum created by the Ireland 2016 programme and places creativity at the centre of public policy. 2017 was year 1 of a five-year initiative, which has already yielded positive results in both rural and urban communities with more people engaging with creativity than ever before. The increased funding allocation for 2018 will build on the momentum by further developing the programme as well as providing increased funding to key institutions, agencies and initiatives that deliver arts, creativity and culture across the country.

The 2018 allocation for my Department's Vote includes boosts in funding for all of the national cultural institutions. The combined total allocation for 2017 was in excess of €45 million. The Arts Council will receive an additional €3 million this year to enhance its support to artists and arts organisations of all sizes throughout the country. The Irish Film Board will receive an additional €1.5 million to build on its vital work in supporting Irish film, television, drama, documentary and animation. The work of the board is key to the successful roll-out of Pillar 4 of the Creative Ireland programme, which focuses on fostering Ireland's potential as a centre of excellence in media production.

Increasing access to arts, culture and creativity is the driving force of the Creative Ireland programme. A sum of €1 million has been allocated to accelerate the Creative Children initiative under Pillar 1 of the programme. The funding will be matched by a further €1 million from the Department of Education and Skills. The programme will be delivered in partnership with the Arts Council. Similarly, the Department's funding to local authorities in 2018, to support and build on the work of the local Creative Ireland culture teams, has been doubled with a view to harnessing the energy of Pillar 2, entitled Enabling Creativity in Every Community, which saw 750 events take place across Ireland in 2017.

Culture Ireland will receive an extra €500,000 this year thus enabling an enhanced culture programme to be presented across Great Britain in 2018. The initiative will build on the unique cultural relationship between the two countries and expand the reach of Irish culture to new audiences. It will also build on Pillar 5 of the Creative Ireland programme, which hinges on extending our cultural footprint globally and highlighting our culture as a unique national strength.

The Creative Ireland programme is the implementation vehicle for a wider, all-of-Government policy on culture in Ireland. It also links to the heritage, Gaeltacht and Irish language sectors, which all enjoy increased funding for 2018.

Funding of over €47 million has been made available for my Department's heritage programme for this year.

Chairman

I ask the Minister to delay discussing the heritage section.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Yes.

Chairman

I wish to give members the opportunity to ask the Minister questions about subhead A.

Deputy Niamh Smyth

I wish to make an observation about the Creative Ireland programme. I note that the Cruinniú na Cásca festival has been axed. Perhaps it has been replaced with the Creative Children initiative. Has Cruinniú na Cásca been replaced? I ask the Minister to outline the details behind the decision.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Cruinniú na Cásca has not been cancelled. I understand that Cruinniú na Cásca took place on Easter Monday. A similar event will take place and we will make an announcement in the next week. My Department and I are working out the finer details but the event may take place around June. We will build on the event this year. We have taken soundings on how the event was transposed across the country last year. The event will not be the same but it will come under that creative umbrella. Last year, Cruinniú na Cásca was very successful and most of the local authorities were involved.

Deputy Niamh Smyth

The event generated 500,000 visitors, which proves it was very successful. Is there a reason the event has been postponed? Easter is a good time of year to celebrate the arts. There is merit in having nationwide festivals. Cruinniú na Cásca involved artists and local authorities. Has the idea of holding the event at Easter been axed from now on?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The local authorities requested more time to examine the event. We also felt that it might be better to hold the event during the summer. I am not at liberty to announce the details of the event today but I shall do so shortly. I will inform the Deputy as soon as I have the information.

Deputy Niamh Smyth

Will there be no Cruinniú na Cásca like last year?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

There will be no Cruinniú na Cásca. We will hold a similar event and its title will include the word "cruinniú". Last year, was the first time that a cruinniú event was held. Many events took place on St. Stephen's Green in Dublin and across the country. We decided to slightly change the event because we want to build on its success and take account of the challenges faced by the local authorities. A similar event will take place in or around June. I shall inform the Deputy when I know the details.

Deputy Niamh Smyth

I thank the Minister.

Chairman

I want to ask the Minister a few questions.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

May I ask a question?

Chairman

Yes. The Deputy is on my list.

Subhead A relates to the National Archives (Amendment) Bill that we, as a select committee, have recently discussed. One of the problems with the Bill that people have mentioned was how much funding is necessary to allow them to process. I have read the Vote but there does not seem to have been an increase in funding for the area. How do we achieve the objectives of the National Archives (Amendment) Bill in that situation?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I attended the meeting of the select committee to discuss the National Archives (Amendment) Bill. Does the Chairman wish to ask a specific question?

Chairman

Yes. Funding has not been increased as the allocations for 2017 and 2018 are the same. The Bill proposes a big job of work and resources are required to achieve same.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Yes.

Chairman

How does one achieve the objectives of the Bill when the allocation has not been increased?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Obviously some funding is needed. The legislation has not passed all Stages yet. Significant funding will be required and that fact must be taken into account. If the Chairman wishes, I can outline in detail what the National Archives (Amendment) Bill entails?

Chairman

No.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Bill is due to be taken in the Seanad. Adequate funding will be provided in the budget and the matter will be discussed in later years.

Chairman

Subhead A.7 refers to cultural infrastructure and development. One can see that funding decreased by €2 million between 2017 and 2018. Why?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Can the Chairman ask me a specific question?

Chairman

On page 13 of the document, under subhead A.7 entitled cultural infrastructure and development, one can see a significant fall of over €2 million in funding. What affect will such a decrease have?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I understand, from my colleague seated beside me, that some of the projects have already been completed. That is why there is a shortfall.

Chairman

Which projects have been completed?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The National Gallery of Ireland, for example.

Chairman

In terms of Culture Ireland, what percentage of the money will be spent on cultural activity and on the promotion of Culture Ireland?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I will find that information now, please bear with me. Does the Chairman mean Creative Ireland or Culture Ireland?

Chairman

Culture Ireland first of all. I know, with regard to Creative Ireland, that there is an element of controversy in that a third of the funding for Creative Ireland has actually gone to cultural activities while two thirds of it has gone to promotion. Some people may feel that, in the same way there was the strategic communications unit, there was-----

Deputy Josepha Madigan

They are separate.

Chairman

They are separate, of course.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am just trying to ascertain the exact question. Is the Chairman asking about Creative Ireland or Culture Ireland?

Chairman

Culture Ireland.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Okay. So the Chairman wants to know what the change is.

Chairman

The breakdown of the funding and what was actually for cultural activities.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The 2017 allocation was €3.5 million. In 2018, the allocation for this subhead has been increased to €4 million to include funding for a special geographic focus on Great Britain which, as I said in my opening statement, is to build on cultural connections and generate wider benefits for Ireland's business and tourism relationships. The bulk of Culture Ireland money went on grants to performers.

Chairman

So maybe 90% of the money went on grants to performers?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Almost all of it. Culture Ireland also created the culture elements of the President's overseas visits to Cuba in spring 2017 and Australia and New Zealand in November 2017 at an estimated cost of €50,000 for travelling artists and performers. During 2017, Culture Ireland reached approximately 3.5 million live audience members. There were 7 million online viewers. There were some 450 events in more than 50 countries with Irish artists. A total of 169 presenters and programmers were supported to visit Ireland and experience Irish arts, performing at home and generating further touring contracts for Irish artists. It is a very important part of the Department. As I said in my opening statement, there is a further €500,000 being given to Culture Ireland this year too. A particular highlight of our work programme is GB18. I attended the Celtic Connections event in Scotland and also the Imagining Ireland concert in London to showcase Irish talent in this country.

Chairman

I have a question on subhead A10, the National Museum of Ireland. The Minister is new to this particular role and many issues that happened with the National Museum of Ireland happened long before her tenure. Good steps have been taken to improve the atmosphere in there. I had a parliamentary question recently for the Minister on this. There is €12 million for 2017. Do we know what percentage of that was spent on, for example, High Court cases, payments to staff who alleged bullying, etc., and costs such as consultants or reports that focused in on those spaces?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

With regard to the legal costs, if the Chairman is talking about any particular cases, that-----

Chairman

There is a new case in front of the High Court.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

That is with the State Claims Agency. That is not a matter for me to comment on but is specific to the museum itself. I think that is the bullying complaint that the Chairman is referring to, which came to light on 2 February of this year. That is what the Chairman is asking.

Chairman

There are three.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I cannot comment on the legal costs that the museum has paid because some of these are alleged cases and the Chairman will appreciate-----

Chairman

I said that.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Chairman is right that there have been ongoing issues but we have done a lot with regard to training and giving governance training to the board to make sure that the National Museum is compliant with employer legislation. That is important. We are doing everything we can to make sure that these sorts of issues do not arise in the future. There was a review of the Department documentation in 2017 and we have continued to support the board. We have had three human resources, HR, positions there. I sanctioned three HR people to help. One started in February of this year on an 18-month contract. That is a HR manager.

Chairman

I appreciate that there have been positive moves on that in recent times. It is good that the Department would keep an eye on the amount of spend on that space. I have a more parochial matter. We visited Trinity College as a committee recently. We also, as a committee, visited the repository of the National Museum of Ireland in Swords. It is the old Motorola factory in Swords where the museum holds everything that is not on display. A number of different cultural institutions have stated that they are under pressure for storage space for the future. I bring it to the Minister's attention that there is an old NEC factory in Ballivor standing idle at the moment which could potentially house a repository of some of these organisations if it was needed.

Before I finish, the film industry is an important issue. The film industry has been wonderful in recent years in that we have seen tremendous growth in indigenous and international film. There are a number of difficulties within the industry that I brought to the attention of the Minister before and that we discussed in this committee. The Irish Film Board stated that it would be interested in constituting a film forum which could look at the issues concerning the industry and that it hopes to fix it. Is it the Minister's view that it should constitute a film forum on this? We also discussed the issue of the craft sector of that industry and having somebody nominated to the film board, which would be very useful. If the Minister could nominate somebody from the craft sector, it would mean that that element of the film industry would be represented within the Irish Film Board and therefore would be able to get involved.

The Gate Theatre report has been published, looking at some of the difficulties that happened there. I request that the Minister looks at a similar report within the film industry, or at least a survey of experience among workers in the film industry on how they have experienced their working environments, and also of the production companies and managers too. It is very important that their experience of the industry there is understood too. Are there any actions to be taken from the Gate report?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I will go backwards through the Chairman's questions. If I forget anything, he might remind me. With regard to the Gate Theatre, we had an initiative in Liberty Hall last week which the Irish Theatre Institute, ITI, ran and my Department supported. This was called Speak Up & Call It Out. It was a collaborative event to help the sector deal with the bullying and harassment claims that have happened over recent years as a result of the investigations that happened in the Gate Theatre and it was very well received. There are learnings, in answer to the Chairman's questions, that can be had from that throughout all industries as well as the film industry. With regard to any appointments to the Irish Film Board, that is a matter for the Public Appointments Service, PAS. If there is somebody from the craft sector who is interested, if the Chairman is talking about an appointment-----

Chairman

The craft sector would feel that it is not represented on the Irish Film Board enough.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

If it applied through PAS-----

Chairman

I thought it was a ministerial appointment.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

It has to go through the Public Appointments Service before I can make any appointments, so they would have to meet those criteria. If somebody wants to apply, then he or she should do so, by all means. If that person gets through the PAS process and his or her name comes to me, we will take it into consideration. I am not sure if the Chairman is asking about the funding. We have given another €1.5 million to the film industry. The Chairman asked me about the film forum. We can consider something like that too. That could be beneficial.

Chairman

Are there any direct actions as a result of the Gate report?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The public conduct has been important as a result of that.

We have just granted a contract for training for various boards to ensure that they comply with governance and that integrity and dignity at work are consistent and maintained throughout those organisations. The same principles apply to the theatre and film industries.

Deputy Seán Canney

How much funding is being made available for Galway's stint as European Capital of Culture 2020 between now and 2020? Are figures available for that?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Some €15 million is being made available for that. I am hoping to travel to Galway on 12 or 13 April to discuss that subject. The title of European Capital of Culture is very important. I and my Department will do what we can to support that, because we want to highlight the cultural activity we have in this country, and having the European Capital of Culture in Galway would be a wonderful way to showcase everything good about our culture. It is important that we provide some funding for it. I have met the chairperson of the board. It is a very competent and proactive board which has really hit the ground running in terms of getting everything up and running for 2020. There is much work to do. I believe it is very important that we integrate the grassroots, local artists and people into the project. The board is reflective of that. It is made up of a wide range of people and it will work very well.

Deputy Seán Canney

When the Minister visits Galway I would like her to be clear that it is not a bid by Galway city but rather Galway city and county. It is very important that message is put out, and I would appreciate if the Minister would make that clear.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The board understands that. The Deputy is correct that it is a bid from Galway city and county. Ms Hannah Kiely is the CEO there, the chairman of the board. Mr. Chris Baldwin is the creative director. They are working hard to make sure that it is a great success. It will really put Ireland in the spotlight, and Galway in particular. We are very excited about it. It is something to look forward to in 2020.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

The Minister mentioned that the value of our national heritage should not be underestimated. Neither should our invaluable natural assets. The Minister spoke about other places but I wish to speak about the Killarney National Park.

Chairman

I do not wish to be awkward, but we are talking under each subhead. Subhead A is the arts and subhead B is heritage. The Minister will speak about subhead B in a couple of seconds and the Deputy can ask questions under that subhead then. We are taking each subhead as we go along.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

The Chair was talking for half an hour himself and nobody knows what he was actually talking about. He is supposed to be the Chair.

Chairman

I spoke for 11 minutes in total.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

It was a quarter of an hour or 20 minutes.

Chairman

It is recorded here, if the Deputy would like to check.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

Nobody interrupted the Chair.

Chairman

We will get on to a discussion about heritage in a few minutes. If the Deputy has a question on subhead A, he can ask that question now.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

Is the Chair saying that I cannot talk about the national park?

Chairman

The Deputy may discuss the national park in the next section.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

What about culture, festivals and local events?

Chairman

That fits under this subhead.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I wonder how much we are promoting and helping local communities to keep events going, because, for example, the cost of insurance is causing a massive problem for local committees. They are having trouble both costing and paying for it. Some festivals that have run for 50 years or more are now dying away because the cost of insurance is so high. We have wonderful events such as the Patrick O'Keeffe Traditional Music Festival in Castleisland in November, the World Fiddle Day in Scartaglin and the traditional 15 August fair in Kenmare and Sneem. Everyone can speak for his or her own place, but right around County Kerry festivals and local communities are having massive difficulty in sourcing insurance. If the Minister could help in some way to promote these festivals and to retain our culture, it would be greatly appreciated. Many small villages and towns now have lost many of their shops. Some may have a post office and some may not. Festivals are often the only way the identity of these towns can be retained, whether it is Maurice O'Keeffe Festival in Kiskeam or the Con Curtin Festival in Brosna. They are having a massive problem in keeping these things going, and we need to assist them to promote their events in the first place and to help with the insurance. If we lose these local events, we most likely will lose our identity, and local identity is very important. It is incumbent on me to stress the need to help these communities which do so much good voluntary work on their own. They have run up against a block wall now in terms of the cost of insurance. I am asking the Minister to help these communities to help themselves.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I agree that all local communities, including in Kerry, have access to funding for festivals and creative events. My Department only has a small amount of money available, approximately €50,000, and so the local authorities are best placed to look after any funding for events. We have increased our funding to local authorities to €3 million this year, which works out at around €96,000 per local authority, and this represents an increase of approximately €1 million from 2017. We also fund local arts infrastructure as well. If the Deputy knows of anyone specific who wishes to apply to the local authority for the events he is describing in Kerry, he or she can do that via the local authority. Fáilte Ireland and the Arts Council also provide significant support to major festivals. We might also be reopening the capital arts scheme later this year, and I can provide those details to the Deputy if he would like to inquire about that at a later stage.

Deputy Michael Collins

I concur with Deputy Danny Healy-Rae's comments on festivals. I am involved in a festival committee myself, as most of us here are. I call Ballydehob the festival capital of Ireland. There seems to be a festival there most weekends. They are struggling, like in many other towns through west Cork, because the festivals cannot keep going back to struggling businesses to ask for funding. Many are going out of business in very rural parts of Ireland, or else they are paying high rates and cannot afford it. The voluntary groups who organise festivals end up paying large sums on accounts and for insurance. If a festival wants to have any chance of getting funding, it has to tick all those boxes, and I know some groups are paying €2,500 or €3,000 in insurance alone, before any claims, to keep the boat on the shore.

I will raise something which Deputy Healy-Rae mentioned and the Minister tried to cover in her answer. It is a little parochial but the Department of Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht is co-funding with Cork County Council a hugely successful visual arts degree which the Dublin Institute of Technology delivers on Sherkin Island in west Cork. Over the years, it has been a major boost, not only to Sherkin Island but also Baltimore, Union Hall, Glandore, Leap, Skibbereen and all the surrounding area where students and families can fill local establishments off-season. The Department has kept its commitment, and while I am not being critical of the Minister of State, Deputy McHugh, and it is super to deliver it on an island where there is little activity off-season, for some reason the local authority is dithering over its €20,000 commitment. The Department has funding of €167.3 million for arts and culture and €48.6 million for the islands, which we will discuss more with the Minister of State, Deputy McHugh. Sherkin Island cannot afford to lose this course. The Department has been the main pillar in this, and I am asking now that it be the main building because if the local authority continues dithering the way it is, the course will be dead in the ground. The local authority was supposed to come before the joint committee some weeks ago, but unfortunately the meeting could not go ahead because of the snow. I hope it will be rescheduled in the near future, but I am asking the Minister and the Minister of State to look to their Department to see if it can be the main funder. I understand that they will be unable to give me an answer now, but it cannot go on like this. They are looking for a commitment that was given by the local authority, which unfortunately was given verbally, although there are witnesses who can prove it. The council is now reneging on this commitment, the future of the funding is looking dodgy, and it looks as though that island will lose that course. I would appreciate if the Department could have a serious look at it to see how they might work together to resolve this, even if it means that the local authority is back on the field again. It would be hugely important.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I will ask the Minister of State to answer that question.

Minister of State at the Department of Arts, Heritage & the Gaeltacht and the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Joe McHugh)

I am aware of the project. A few years ago, I met the people who are running the project, which is excellent. It brings the arts out to where it should be, on a very important island. It is disappointing and I am disappointed that the arrangement where we matched funds with the local authority is threatened. We are still prepared to do that and we want to do that. My colleague, Senator Tim Lombard, has contacted me about this recently and I know that Deputy Collins has raised it in the Dáil several times. The AGM of Comhdháil Oileáin na hÉireann will be on Sherkin Island in a number of weeks. If there is anything we can do during that event, or as a side event, or if we can organise officials from the local authority in Cork to be there, my officials will be happy to do that. The Department's officials have had meetings in an effort to do something but there is a block somewhere. I do not know where it is. Deputy Collins may be more privy to that information at a local level, but if there is anything we can do, we will because it is an excellent project. It would be a retrograde step if it were not to go ahead.

Chairman

I wish to raise some other points before we conclude discussion on this subhead. On the decade of centenaries, we are at the centenary of the anti-conscription campaign. That was a campaign which saw the trade unions, political parties and the church come together to organise a strike successfully against the introduction of conscription into Ireland. Are there any commemorations to mark this event?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Not that I am aware of.

Chairman

Okay.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I can come back to the Chairman on that.

Chairman

It was quite a significant action by many sections of society. The other issue relates to Moore Street. I, Deputy Ó Cuív and some others visited the buildings in 14-17 Moore Street recently. We looked at the material health of the buildings which are currently in State hands. Water is gushing into 17 Moore Street. On the day we were there, there was a torrential flow of water entering the building. It is something that will obviously affect the physical integrity of the building. Water is also visible in 14 Moore Street, although it was far less. There is dampness and small sections of water ingress. The two middle buildings were dry as a bone, which one could feel, and their quality and integrity has been maintained. Given the decision in the court case, what is the Government's plan for those buildings?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am not aware of the issue regarding water. I will inquire into it and revert to the Deputy. We acquired those buildings in 2015 and want to ensure that we preserve them or, more accurately, decide what type of monument we will ultimately create with them. We will have to consult the Office of Public Works regarding the water. We want to preserve the buildings as some sort of monument appropriate to the historic issues attached to it and the historic significance of it. As part of his work with this committee, the Chairman will be familiar with the Moore Street Advisory Committee. I understand that Hammersons are meeting the committee tomorrow on this and I would love to see a consensus being reached now that we have the court ruling and we have clarity on this. Technically, we are still within the time limit for an appeal, so I do not want to say too much about this. Our intention is to work with the advisory committee and see what we can do about curating it.

Chairman

I now invite the Minister to make her presentation on subhead B.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I would like to ask one question first.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

To come back on the question of water, we were not allowed to take any remedial action due to the ongoing court case. I can get further clarification on this.

Chairman

There is come confusion on the matter, as significant remedial action on large areas of the building was taken under the court case.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I was satisfied with the information given.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

We are expecting the Office of Public Works to take remedial action now that the verdict has been given, so the Chairman can expect to see something happening.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

The Minister's predecessor had spoken about re-establishing the Oireachtas committee which advised on the decade of commemorations. Is it the Minister's intention to re-establish this?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Yes, it is.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

When will she do so?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Deputy may correct me if I am wrong, but the Ceann Comhairle may have mentioned this to me. Is the Ceann Comhairle involved in something like that?

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

He is involved in getting the names of the people.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Ceann Comhairle mentioned to me recently that it is something that he is interested in rolling out. My Department will be happy to be involved in that. It is something we are actively trying to pursue.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

The only thing is that time is marching on. In my view, the biggest event of that period was the democratic decision by the Irish people for independence, which was not something that Britain decided but that we decided for ourselves. This is the election of 1918 which led to the foundation of the first Dáil on 21 January 1919. It would be right that the Dáil or the Oireachtas as successor of the First Dáil, would have a major input into what I would hope would be a very major national celebration of the founding of democracy in this country.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

It is very important that we mark the foundation of the State.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Well-----

Deputy Josepha Madigan

We have every intention of working with the committee on this.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

My point is that the Department cannot work with a committee that it has not established.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I know, but we are at the infancy stages of looking at it. We hope to-----

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Can I remind the Minister-----

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Apparently, there has been some confusion about the nominations but I will look at it.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

What amazes me is that the election took place on 18 December 1918 and the Dáil was founded on 21 January 1919. They recorded every word spoken that day.

It was a proper Parliament constructed along parliamentary lines, despite the fact that most of the leaders were in prison. They did all the job right, as any parliament would, which was an amazing achievement in just over a month. When we compare that bureaucratic achievement to the difficulties in setting up a committee, the mind boggles. We think we are making progress in this country-----

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

It is backwards we are going.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

To be fair, the Ceann Comhairle mentioned it to me and I said I would be very happy to discuss it further, and I will be discussing it with my officials after this meeting. I thank the Deputy for raising it because I agree it is important that we commemorate it.

Chairman

Go raibh maith agat. Ar mhaith leis an Teachta tosnú ar subhead B.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Funding of over €47 million has been made available in 2018 for my Department's heritage programme. This includes €36.7 million allocated for current expenditure with a further €10.4 million in capital funding. This allocation has allowed for increased investment in both our built and natural heritage.

Our national parks and nature reserves remain a vital tourism resource which underpins the economy, both nationally and regionally. The strategic partnership between Fáilte Ireland and the National Parks and Wildlife Service will also increase the awareness of the benefits of our parks and reserves and show how they can help to create and sustain jobs as well as contribute to economic and regional development.

The built heritage investment scheme will operate again in 2018. The scheme aims to protect our built heritage and create and protect employment across the country and, together with the structures at risk fund, leverage significant private investment and stimulate labour intensive projects nationwide.

The protection of Ireland's unique raised bog special areas of conservation is a key concern, as is the avoidance of major fines by the European Court of Justice.

Priority also continues to be given to the turf cutter compensation schemes and investment in alternative turf cutting sites for affected cutters.

Does the Chairman want me to mention the Gaeltacht?

Chairman

No. We will deal with subhead B first.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I have three questions. When is it intended to finish the wildlife Bill? Is it intended to proceed with all or part of the Heritage Bill? Can the Minister tell me the number of objections, or negative observations, which I believe they are called now, that have been submitted by her Department through the National Parks and Wildlife Service to planning applications in the past year?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am checking the position on the wildlife Bill. I will come back to the Deputy shortly on that. I understand the Heritage Bill is scheduled to come before this committee on 25 April.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Does the Minister intend to proceed with the entire process?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Yes. We will be in a position to discuss that at length on the day.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

That is fine.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am checking the position on the wildlife Bill for the Deputy. I am not sure if it is in the legislative plan but I will find that out now for the Deputy.

On the planning applications, we would not have figures to hand. We will need to get back to the Deputy on that.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Will the Minister come back to me with figures on a county basis?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I will request that, if we have it.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I am sure the Minister does.

Chairman

I have a couple of questions for the Minister. A Bill on An Gorta Mór, the Great Irish Famine, was brought before the Dáil by myself and a Fine Gael backbench Deputy seeking that the Famine would have a fixed day of commemoration. The Bill is being held up by a money message. That is one of the difficulties many committees are dealing with currently. This is a heritage Bill brought before this Department and it does not seem to me that a money message would be very relevant to it. It is not looking to change anything other than fix a day so that, internationally, the Famine, which was probably the biggest event in our history, can be commemorated.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am not aware of the Bill the Chairman is talking about.

Chairman

There are two Bills.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I am aware there is a National Famine Commemoration Day, which will take place on 12 May in University College Cork. I hope to attend that, and I am aware President Higgins will speak at it also. The third term of the National Famine Commemoration Committee expired in December but we are making arrangements to set up a new committee in that regard. Perhaps it is something that could be discussed at that stage.

Chairman

The idea behind it is that, internationally, it is easier for groups to organise when they know the exact day on which a particular commemoration will take place. They can organise speakers and events and choose locations much easier when they know that it will be on a particular date in 2019. It is a small change but one that would facilitate that.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I appreciate that, and it is probably good to have some sort of continuity. I imagine that changing the date from year to year is probably to facilitate speakers, especially if they have An tUachtarán coming to speak. We also rotate the location of the event. The Chairman's comment is a valid one and may be something we can examine. Commemorating the Famine is very important, and it is very important that we have an annual memorial day every year.

Chairman

On subhead B5, National Parks and Wildlife Service, there is a big difference between the outturn and the Estimate for 2017, but there is a reduction for the 2018 Estimate. Why is that the case? It reduces from €13 million to €11 million in the space of the year.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I understand the 2017 allocation included €2 million of a capital carryover and €4 million in terms of environment. The reason for the increased expenditure on the subhead in 2017 was to do with capital repairs and maintenance works on foot of adverse weather, floods and storms in the past quarter of 2016 and the first quarter of 2017. It was also to facilitate the purchase of a strategic land bank adjacent to Ballycroy National Park, which became available during 2017.

Following the review of the turf cutting compensation scheme applications, it became apparent that the 2017 expenditure would exceed the original provision and additional funding was required. There were 2,037 applicants from special areas of conservation bogs and 254 applicants from the natural heritage area, NHA, bogs. There were 73 additional applicants from special areas of conservation, and 318 of the NHA applications were received in 2017. New applications each year are reviewed and assessed for payment also.

Chairman

I will make one suggestion to the Minister that might be useful. Canada has a wonderful system called riverine parks, which protect approximately 250 m each side of rivers, and as cities and towns develop around them, that river remains park land in its natural state. It means there are continuous parks in cities, which enhance well-being as people can enjoy the parks. It also protects the river basin from pollution and over development.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I suppose we own the land-----

Chairman

Obviously, the country brings in a law to the effect that development cannot happen in a particular river basin, etc. It then buys the land and creates a park.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

The Chairman wants to take over private land or farmers' land along rivers. What is he at?

Chairman

These are happening in cities. There is not much farming going on in cities.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

Some person owns the land. Some person paid for it.

Chairman

Exactly.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

Some person inherited it, and they had to be handed over. It may have been a tough story behind handing it over. The Chairman is proposing to take private land off people. That is ridiculous. I will not listen to that kind of-----

Chairman

Hold on. The Deputy is jumping in with his two feet without understanding what I am saying.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I understand fully what the Chairman is saying because it was part of policy previously to nationalise land. He will not get away with it here.

Chairman

Deputy Healy-Rae, what happens in Toronto is that they buy the land-----

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I do not mind what happens in Toronto but the Chairman will not suggest that land be taken over here without it being paid for. It is bad enough that-----

Chairman

Deputy Healy-Rae-----

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

It will not compensate farmers. That is bad enough with going on with this carry-on.

Chairman

I will have to ask the Deputy to leave if he is going to be as ignorant as this in future.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I do not know which of us will ask the other to leave because since I have been here the Chairman has not stopped talking and we cannot get to ask any questions. He then starts talking about something ridiculous like this-----

Chairman

I am suspending the meeting.

The select committee went into private session at 2.40 p.m. and resumed in public session at 2.41 p.m.

Chairman

We are resuming in public session.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

I intended to say that, assuming we owned the land, Waterways Ireland could look at greenways in parallel with the rivers. Perhaps that is something that could be explored.

Chairman

I have another question regarding greenways. There has been great development of greenways throughout the country in recent years. Is the budget for greenways with the Minister of State's Department?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

It is with the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport.

Chairman

Is there any budget in her Department for greenways?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

There is for Waterways Ireland, but not for greenways. We have 485 km of trails in the parks.

Chairman

There is an issue with the extraction of peat by large commercial companies in certain bogs. One bog that has been brought to my attention is that at Clonsura in Westmeath. The extraction there is, allegedly, being done outside the law and without the necessary environmental impact assessments, EIAs, being pursued. What type of regulation does the Department have to ensure that large commercial companies are extracting turf according to the law?

Deputy Josepha Madigan

We have the national peatlands strategy, which was published in 2016. It is important to point out that if you know anyone who is cutting turf in that way the Department should be told about it. Obviously, there is a balance between the right to cut turf and conservation and the legal obligations of the State. If members are aware of anybody doing it, please let us know.

There have been significant efforts by the State to resolve the issue of the protection of the bogs within the framework of the EU habitats directive, which is the law that covers this area. There has been a long-term compensation scheme in place to compensate active turf cutters for the loss arising from the cessation of turf cutting and we have seen the numbers fall over a number of years. Obviously, some of the habitat is protected, particularly the raised bog, and some of it has been lost over the last 20 years. It is a very nuanced and delicate balance to strike. On the one hand, we wish to protect the land and, on the other, we wish to ensure that turf cutters have a livelihood whereby they can do it without affecting the natural habitat.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

First, I wish to raise our national parks and especially Killarney National Park. It is a valuable attraction along with Muckross House and Killarney House. They are already massive tourist attractions but we must maintain the momentum. However, that momentum is being challenged by the rhododendron and massive numbers of deer. I understand there is a small amount of culling taking place at present, but the deer are affecting the trees and vegetation. They are also a danger to people driving their cars on the road. They are running amuck, especially in the Killarney park. Sadly, they have caused loss of life for some people. It is a serious issue that must be addressed. With regard to the rhododendron, I believe we are losing the battle to eradicate this scourge.

The Minister mentioned creating and protecting employment in the national parks. The number of staff in Killarney National Park has been greatly reduced in recent years. I ask the Minister to consider increasing the number of staff for a number of reasons, including maintaining the park in the way it should be maintained. It was given to the State a number of years ago. At 26,000 acres, it is a very valuable property. It is the jewel in the tourism product of Kerry. For that reason, I am asking the Minister to provide more staff for Killarney National Park, Killarney House and Muckross House. In addition, the number of paths in the park must be increased and they must be enhanced. Many more people are cycling and walking in the park so we must improve those areas to ensure their safety. That cannot be done without increased funding. I ask the Minister to ensure that funding is sourced and protected to do as I ask so the momentum of the park into the future is protected. Pat Dawson and his team are doing tremendous work, but they can only do so much. They could do a great deal more if they had more staff. Given the Minister's reference to creating and protecting employment, more staff are needed in Killarney National Park. When the economic crisis hit the country it hit the park as well, and the number of staff went down. I ask the Minister to ensure that the park gets more staff.

The Minister also spoke about turf cutting. That is something close to my heart because my grandmother and grandfather - and my father when he started out - survived by selling turf. We continue to cut our own turf, as many people in Kerry do from Gneevgullia, Kilcummin and Scartaglin back through Kilgarvan, Cahersiveen and all around. It is mentioned in the 2040 plan that turf cutting will be ended by 2030. Many people will be affected if the Government thinks it will be able to bring an end to cutting and burning turf at that stage. One Deputy in the Chamber said that people would be better off financially if they left the turf in the bog. Many people would be very cold if they left the turf in the bog because they have traditionally used it to heat their houses. Other people can afford oil and other fuels but many of those I represent cannot.

It will be serious and there will be repercussions not only in Kerry, but throughout the whole country if the Department tries to implement it at that stage.

Our national park is of vital importance to the tourism product of Killarney. We are grateful for what has taken place in recent years with the opening of Killarney House and so on. Indeed, my father worked hard to ensure that funding was put in place to enable the House to be reopened. In 2010, he ensured that the project was included in the investment programme for 2011 when he had sway with Government. He had fought for it for several years. We are glad the project is going ahead and progressing and I thank the Minister for that but, again, I urge the Minister not to forget Killarney National Park.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

The Deputy has asked several questions so I might take them backwards. If I omit a response to a question, please remind me.

I already touched on turf cutting in answer to the Chairman's question. We have no intention of ending the traditional right of someone to cut turf for domestic use, but obviously this must be balanced in any particular area with regard to the EU habitats directive. This is addressed on a case-by-case basis. Deputies may raise the issue with me again in respect of any specific case. We are aware of the tradition of turf cutting and the need to balance it with conservation challenges.

In 2017, we spent approximately €2 million on Killarney National Park. We opened Killarney House in 2017 and that project cost €7 million. It was a long awaited development. We have spent approximately €275,000 on the gardens since they opened.

The Deputy referred to the rhododendron. We have spent approximately €1 million on clearance since 2011, including €200,000 in 2016 and €300,000 in 2017. Right now, we are trying to operate a programme because it can be a total scourge. A strategic rhododendron management plan is being prepared. The Department has issued a tender to invite suitably qualified vendors for the term of four years to examine the matter. As the Deputy said, we want to ensure that Killarney National Park is a place where people can go to visit. It is difficult, costly and labour intensive to control the rhododendron but it is something of which we are aware.

A programme of works composed of four elements is under way. There is initial clearance and follow-up maintenance work by contractors. There is ongoing maintenance work by volunteers and students. There is a rhododendron eradication management contract. There is ongoing work by national parks staff, including co-ordination, research and monitoring. I note what the Deputy said about seeking an increase in staffing. We are coming through difficult times, as Deputies are aware, but I hope that as our finances improve there might be scope to increase the staffing.

A total of €12 million in funding has been allocated for the national parks in 2018. This includes funding for each of the six national parks and others activities. I do not have a specific breakdown as yet for Killarney National Park, as I have not had my sectoral launch yet. I hope to arrange that and I will let the Deputy know the details.

The Deputy also mentioned Muckross House. Right now we are investing €400,000 in conjunction with the trustees of Muckross House to upgrade the servants' dining area. That should be positive.

The Deputy mentioned the deer. I responded to a Topical Issue matter on this in the Dáil not long ago. Again, there is a balance between culling deer and trying not to slaughter deer unnecessarily, for want of a better expression. I understand an issue was raised on Kerry radio this morning about some deer swimming to Innisfallen Island. A total of 22 deer were culled this morning to ensure that we keep the herd at a level that is manageable.

There is scope for people to hold a licence under section 42 of the Wildlife Act to cull deer where necessary outside the annual open season. In the case of deer on private property, landowners may apply to the Department for permission to cull. Again, we want to protect them but we also want to ensure they do not cause issues or safety concerns for the people living in the area. The Deputy had raised an important issue in this regard.

Deputy Seán Canney

I wish to comment on the bogs because the issue is prevalent in my constituency. I thank the officials in the Department for the work they have been doing with turf cutters and their representatives in trying to find solutions to the issues. There is a good working arrangement now between the Department and turf cutters throughout the country. We have reached the stage where there is a good understanding of what the Department needs to do and what turf cutters want, especially those who are cutting turf for domestic use. My engagements with the Department have been positive. I hope we can finalise all outstanding issues in the not-too-distant future to ensure everyone is working together.

I welcome the fact that Coole Park in Gort has been included in the national development plan as one of the sites that will get investment from the Department. I wish to mention another place, and I am being complimentary in the sense that the Department purchased some land in what is known as Cnoc Meadha beside where I am based. I compliment the Department on its visionary approach to these issues. The amounts of money involved are not substantial but what happens when we spend small amounts of money in such areas is that we create a tourism product that is unique. We are probably developing assets whose potential we do not know. They can realise considerable tourism potential in places where we do not have a tourism brand yet. When we launch a tourism brand for the midlands, east and north, we will have products available to showcase it. I compliment the Department in this regard. If the Department is considering such projects, one message I wish to relay is that we do not need millions or billions. We only need some seed money because local communities are enthusiastic about buying in as can be seen in the case of Cnoc Meadha.

There is general collaboration between Fáilte Ireland, the Office of Public Works and the Department in the promotion of these areas where there are fantastic opportunities for tourism. We underestimate the fact that we have these natural amenities. We simply need to protect and enhance them. That is important throughout the country.

We are not on the Wild Atlantic Way although some of what we are doing is in the wild Atlantic region. It is important that we brand our products in Ireland and that we create different offerings for tourism. It does not necessarily all need to be down in Kerry or up in Donegal; some of it can be in the midlands or off the beaten track where there are hidden gems. We simply need to promote them. I hope the OPW, the Department and Fáilte Ireland will continue to work together to promote the sector.

Deputy Martin Heydon

I apologise for my missing the start of the meeting due to a prior engagement. I welcome the Minister and the Minister of State to the committee today.

One point I wish to touch on is how it is great to see proof of the ending of the lost decade, to which the Taoiseach and others have referred.

Increases in funding across the board in the Department are to be welcomed after several years when there were cuts as a result of economic circumstances. Now that the economy is being well enough managed to allow us to grow, investment in key areas is absolutely crucial.

An extra €1 million has been allocated to Waterways Ireland. Is this for specific projects or for day-to-day operations? The built heritage investment scheme and structures at risk fund are important and I am delighted to see more money going into both. As the Minister stated earlier, these projects involve small-scale building contractors locally carrying out labour-intensive work. The built heritage investment scheme growing into the future is crucial. Will the Minister expand on the built heritage element of the €1 billion capital investment as part of Project Ireland 2040?

How does the Minister see the roll-out of the national biodiversity plan? The Curragh Plains, a 5,000 acre expanse, is not a national or designated heritage area. However, it is important from a biodiversity point of view. What are her broader plans for the national biodiversity plan?

I have had many dealings through the years regarding Mouds bog and there were difficulties in finding alternative turf cutting sites to it. I recognise the significant investment the State has put into the compensation for turf cutters and I hope that a permanent, long-term solution can be found for local residents and others.

The Barrow blueway has significant support in Kildare. While it ran into some planning difficulties in Carlow and the southern tip of Kildare, a significant part of it has planning permission. We are anxious to see this developed. It is another example of investment in our waterways, which is good from a heritage and tourism perspective and is crucial to rural areas like south Kildare.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

One of the highlights of the 2018 work programme for Waterways Ireland is to complete the redevelopment of the Royal Canal towpath and progress its development. We are going to deliver a prioritised infrastructure and maintenance programme focused on areas of greatest use and benefit to ensure 90% of navigable waterways are open to navigation from mid-March to October. We will continue to promote the existing blueway products on the River Shannon and the Shannon-Erne Waterway, as well as establishing new ones on the Royal Canal, Lough Erne and the Lower Bann. We also want to deliver two recreational activity hubs. We are going to continue to work with partners to provide water recreation programmes such as the Blueway 10K, Get Going, Get Rowing, Active Schools, Paddles Up and the open water swimming Couch to 5K to ensure more than 1,000 people learn a new water sport in 2018. We will host the 2018 world canals conference in Athlone in September. This usually attracts over 400 delegates, including international visitors and professionals. We hope to successfully deliver year two of the 22 km greenway development along the Ulster Canal from Smithborough in County Monaghan to Middletown in County Armagh. The inland waterways are not just an engineering marvel, but an amenity within our national tourism offering. I intend to ramp up investment including the restoration of the Ulster Canal.

I welcome the Deputy's comment on the national development plan and the biodiversity plan. This will help us implement the biodiversity plan in a way we were not able to do heretofore. The plan covers the period 2017 to 2021. It demonstrates our commitment to meeting our obligations to protect the diversity for the benefit of future generations through targeted strategies and actions. There are approximately 119 actions in the plan that we want to implement. It is important that we do so. There are several projects, such as that at Killarney House to which Deputy Danny Healy-Rae mentioned, as well as other implementations relating to landscapes, habitats, flora and fauna, along with telling the story of man's interaction over the years.

The built heritage investment scheme and structures at risk fund are important. There were 412 projects in 2017 and the priority is job creation. In 2018, €2 million funding will be allocated. The deadline for applications being accepted by local authorities for these schemes was 31 January. It is important in terms of assisting with the repair and conservation of structures which are protected under the Planning and Development Acts. The built heritage investment scheme leverages private capital for investment in a significant number of labour-intensive scale conservation projects. The structures at risk fund encourages the regeneration and reuse of heritage properties, as well as helping secure the preservation of protected structures which might otherwise be lost in private and public ownership. Up to €1.324 million is allocated to the fund for 2018. Private investment is usually 50-50, with four to five projects per county. The quality and scale of these projects is important. A good heritage officer in a county council helps with this too. It is important these schemes are availed of because they feed into the wider benefit of the community as a whole.

Chairman

B'fhéidir go leanfaimid ar aghaidh go dtí subhead C. An bhfuil an t-Aire Stáit ag iarraidh a chur i láthair a dhéanamh?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá allúntas de €62.6 milliún ina iomláine ar fáil don Ghaeilge, don Ghaeltacht agus do na hoileáin in 2018 i gcomparáid le €58.8 milliún do 2017. Ní áiríonn figiúirí 2017 €2.61 milliún breise a cuireadh ar fáil don Ghaeilge agus don Ghaeltacht ó fho-mhíreanna eile na Roinne i rith na bliana.

Maidir le caiteachas reatha, tá ardú ar allúntas mo Roinne ó bunaíodh an Rialtas seo agus cuirfidh an t-ardú seo ar ár gcumas tuilleadh acmhainní a chur i dtreo fhorfheimhmiú na straitéise 20 bliain don Ghaeilge agus an phróisis pleanála teanga ach go háirithe. Tá soláthar de €14.028 milliún curtha ar fáil don Fhoras Teanga do 2018 - an soláthar do Ghníomhaireacht na hUltaise agus do Bhliain na Gaeilge san áireamh. Níl eolas maidir leis an mbriseadh síos idir Fhoras na Gaeilge agus Gníomhaireachta na hUltaise ar fáil go fóill. Is gníomhaireacht den Fhoras Teanga é Foras na Gaeilge. Cuirtear maoiniú ar fáil d’Fhoras na Gaeilge agus Gníomhaireacht na hUltaise ó Roinn ó Dheas agus ón Roinn Pobal i dTuaisceart Éireann de réir bhuiséid atá ceadaithe ag an gComhairle Aireachta Thuaidh-Theas.

D’éirigh liom allúntas caipitil Údarás na Gaeltachta a ardú i mbliana go €7 milliún agus tugadh allúntas breise in airgead reatha don eagraíocht i mbliana le dáileadh ar na comharchumainn Gaeltachta. Tá €178 milliún in airgead caipitil curtha ar fáil i dTionscadal Éire 2040 le caitheamh ar thograí Gaeilge, Gaeltachta agus oileánda sa thréimhse deich mbliana atá amach romhainn.

Sin €78 milliún in airgead úr anuas ar an suim de níos mó ná €10 milliún in aghaidh na bliana atá á chaitheamh ar na nithe céanna faoi láthair. San áireamh sa phlean forbartha náisiúnta seo, tá gealltanas go méadófar buiséad caipitil Údarás na Gaeltachta go €12 mhilliún in aghaidh na bliana, go gcaithfidh mo Roinn €4 mhilliún ar lárionad Gaeilge i gcathair Bhaile Átha Cliath agus go ndéanfar forbairt ar ghréasán d’ionaid Gaeilge timpeall na tíre agus sna líonraí Gaeilge agus sna bailte seirbhíse Gaeltachta ach go háirithe. Cuirfear airgead breise isteach sna scéimeanna caipitil Gaeltachta atá á riar ag mo Roinn chomh maith, cur chuige a thacóidh le pobail Gaeltachta a gcuid pleananna teanga a chur i bhfeidhm.

Sa chomhthéacs sin, ní mór a nótáil chomh maith go bhfuil buiséad reatha na Roinne don phleanáil teanga méadaithe ó €1.25 milliún anuraidh go dtí €2.65 milliún i mbliana. D’fhógair mé roimh na Nollag go mbeidh allúntas breise ar fiú suas le €50,000 thar tréimhse 12 mhí á chur ar fáil faoin bpróiseas pleanála teanga i leith cúig limistéar faoi leith. Is de bharr dúshlán faoi leith atá bainteach leis na ceantair seo a tógadh an cinneadh seo. Is sa bhreis ar an €100,000 a bheidh ar fáil do gach limistéar pleanála teanga Gaeltachta a bhfuil plean teanga faofa agam faoin bpróiseas atá an t-allúntas breise seo á chur ar fáil. I bhfianaise go bhfuil dúshlán tíreolaíoch ar leith leis na trí oileáin Árann atá aitheanta mar limistéar pleanála teanga amháin, tá i gceist go dtiocfaidh an limistéar seo faoi scáth an tsocraithe seo chomh maith.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Is dóigh gur thug an Aire Stáit suntas an tseachtain seo caite don tuarascáil a réitigh Seosamh Mac Donnacha ar easpa cur i bhfeidhm na straitéise 20 bliain. Táispeánadh i ndáiríre nár cuireadh an straitéis i bhfeidhm. Cuireadh cinn ar éigean dó i bhfeidhm. An bhfuil i gceist ag an Rialtas an straitéis iomlán mar a scríobhadh é a chur i bhfeidhm? An bhfuil sé i gceist gach gné dó a chur i bhfeidhm trasna gach Roinn Stáit? Ba é an t-Aire Stáit féin a chur an bhéim ar go raibh sé anois ar bhord an Rialtais agus go mbeadh sé in ann a chinntiú go gcomhlíonfadh gach Roinn a ndualgais faoin straitéis. An bhfuil i gceist ag an Rialtas an straitéis a chur i bhfeidhm go hiomlán, rud a chruthaigh an tUasal Mac Donnacha nach bhfuil an Rialtas á dhéanamh?

Maidir le cúrsaí airgid, deirtear go bhfuil €178 mhilliún de chaipiteal ar fáil le caitheamh ar an nGaeltacht as seo go ceann deich mbliana. Is é sin €17.8 milliún in aghaidh na mbliana ar an meán. Níl ach €10 milliún ar fáil i mbliana. Sa mbliain 2008, nuair a bhí an caiteachas Stáit mar atá sé i láthair na huaire - go díreach mar a chéile leis an gcaiteachas atá i mbliana má bhreathnaítear ar an gcaiteachas vótáilte, so níl aon bhaint aige seo le hús nó rud ar bith mar sin - bhí €70 milliún caite i mbliain amháin ar chapiteal. An féidir leis an Aire Stáit a mhíniú cén fáth gur thit tábhacht na Gaeltachta agus na n-oileán chomh mór idir an dá linn?

De bharr nach bhfuil aon Fheidhmeannas ó Thuaidh, ní féidir cur leis an airgead atá á thabhairt d'Fhoras na Gaeilge mar tá srian leis an airgead ó thaobh an Thuaiscirt de. Cé na pleananna atá ag an Rialtas, ó tharla nach cosúil go mbeidh Feidhmeannas ann go luath, cur leis an gcaiteachas ar an nGaeilge ar fud an Stáit tríd an Roinn taobh amuigh den fhoras mar tá srianta móra, mar a dúirt mé, i gceist leis an bhforas?

Seo Bliain na Gaeilge. Cé mhéad atá i gceist ag an Roinn caitheamh ar Bhliain na Gaeilge i mbliana? Cuirim fáilte roimh an méid a dúirt an tAire ar ball beag go raibh €15 mhilliún le caitheamh ar an gcathair cultúrtha i nGaillimh. Caithfear €15 mhilliún as seo go 2020. Sin do chathair amháin le haghaidh bliain amháin. Cé mhéad airgid atá ar fáil do Bhliain na Gaeilge? Creidim go bhfuil an-spéis go pearsanta ag an Taoiseach ann, ach ní léir go bhfuil aon airgead ag leanacht.

An bhfuil sé i gceist ag an Aire Stáit seirbhís aeir a chur go dtí Inishbofin ón gCloigeann agus ó na Mine? An bhfuil i gceist úsáid fhónta a bhaint as na haerstráicí sin? An bhfuil an Aire Stáit buartha faoin laghdú seirbhíse atá i gceist le na seirbhísí ar Árainn go dtí na hOileáin Árann? Tá mé ag ceapadh go bhfuil titim ollmhór ar líon na ndaoine atá ag dul ar an tseirbhís sin mar níl an caighdeán seirbhíse atá ar fáil anois mar a bhíodh sé. Níl an chinnteacht ann go bhfaighfí eitleán. An bhfuil an Aire Stáit buartha gur cosúil go bhfuil cuid mhaith do phobal Oileán Thoraigh nach bhfuil sásta leis an gcomhréiteach atá déanta agus a mhol Pól Ó Gallchóir? Molaim an obair a rinne an tUasal Ó Gallchóir. Fear níos fearr ní fhéadfaí a fháil. Ach an bhfuil díomá ar an Aire Stáit nach bhfuil níos mó ag glacadh leis na moltaí a réitigh sé?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Bhí sé cheist in iomlán. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Teachta faoi choinne na gceisteanna. Tá seans agam na sonraí a thabhairt i mo fhreagra. Maidir leis an straitéis 20 bliain, nuair a tháinig mé isteach sa phost in 2014 dúirt mé gurbh é an straitéis 20 bliain an chloch is mó ar mo phaidrín. Táim fós ar an intinn chéanna. Táimid ag obair ar an phlean gníomhaíochta cúig bliana. Beidh achan rud socraithe maidir leis na freagraí ó na Ranna éagsúla trasna an Rialtais. Beimid san áit cheart laistigh de choicís maidir leis sin. Maidir le cur i bhfeidhm na straitéise, ar a raibh ceist an Teachta, táimid ag dul ar aghaidh maidir leis an straitéis 20 bliain. In 2015 bhí €500,000 ar fáil faoi choinne-----

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

An ndúirt an Aire Stáit €500,000?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Ba cheart don Teachta fanacht ar mo fhreagra.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Cén tomhais-----

Deputy Joe McHugh

Bhí €500,000 leis an phleanáil teanga a chur i bhfeidhm in 2015. In 2016 bhí €1 milliún ar fáil. Anuraidh bhí €1.3 milliún ar fáil agus i mbliana tá €2.6 milliún ar fáil faoi choinne pleananna teanga a chur i bhfeidhm. Nuair a bheidh na limistéir teanga curtha i gcrích agus na dreamanna eile ag dul isteach sa phróiseas, beidh airgead breise ar fáil. Tá muidne ag dul ar aghaidh maidir leis an straitéis 20 bliain. Tá nasc idir na daoine uilig ar an talamh atá ag obair leis an Rialtas. Is iad na dreamanna a bheidh freagrach as an straitéis ar an talamh ná Údarás na Gaeltachta agus Foras na Gaeilge taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht. Sin an freagra maidir leis an straitéis 20 bliain. An bhfuil an Teachta chun fanacht ar na freagraí eile?

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Tá ceist an sciobtha agam. Beidh freagra "sea" nó "ní hea" i gceist. Ar léigh an Aire Stáit an straitéis riamh ó chlúdach go clúdach?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Léigh.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Caithfidh an Aire Stáit a admháil nach bhfuil an deichiú cuid dó á cur i bhfeidhm.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Sin sonra amháin maidir leis an straitéis agus an t-airgead a bheidh ar fáil faoi choinne na ndreamanna ar an talamh atá ag obair ar phleanáil teanga. Sin sonra amháin. Tá sonraí éagsúla ann maidir leis an straitéis. Tá sé sin soiléir.

Maidir leis an airgead a bheith ar fáil fá choinne an tionscadail deich mbliana, a d'fhógair muid i Sligeach cúpla mí ó shin, beidh €178 milliún ar fáil. Tá €10 milliún ar fáil fá choinne na rudaí caipitil i mbliana. Táimid ag brú ar aghaidh. Labhair an Teachta faoin airgead a bhí ar fáil in 2008. Bhí tír dhifriúil againn in 2008.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Tá an caiteachas mar a chéile.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Bhí airgead difriúil ar fáil in 2008.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Ní raibh.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá mé-----

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Gabh mo leithscéal-----

Chairman

Iarraim ar an Teachta deis a thabhairt don Aire Stáit an méid atá le rá aige a chríochnú.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Ba mhaith liom an tAire Stáit a cheartú ó thaobh na bhfíricí de.

Chairman

Ligfidh mé an Teachta isteach níos déanaí.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Ní aontaím leis an Teachta go bhfuil laghdú tagtha ar an tábhacht a thugtar do na ceantair Ghaeltachta. Tá cuid mhór oibre ag dul ar aghaidh. Is cinnte go raibh laghdú thar na blianta nuair a bhí an tír seo i dtrioblóid. Níl ceacht staire de dhíth anois. Beidh thart ar €170 milliún ar fáil amach anseo. Beimid ag treabhadh ar aghaidh leis an chaipitil bhreise fá choinne Údarás na Gaeltachta fosta. Táimid ag amharc go dtí an lá nuair a bheidh €12 mhilliún ar fáil le haghaidh na rudaí caipitil agus, tá súil againn, go mbeidh suas le 1,000 post bhreise sna ceantair Ghaeltachta.

Chuir an Teachta ceist orm faoin bhForas Teanga, comhlacht teanga Thuaidh-Theas atá comhdhéanta de dhá ghníomhaireacht - Foras na Gaeilge agus Gníomhaireacht na hUltaise, nó tha Boord o Ulster-Scotch. Is í an príomhfhreagracht atá ar Fhoras na Gaeilge ná an Ghaeilge a chur chun cinn i gach gné den saol ar fud oileán na hÉireann. Is í an phríomhfhreagracht atá ag Gníomhaireacht na hUltaise ná feasacht mhéadaithe ar an Ultais, ar shaincheisteanna cultúrtha na hAlbainis Uladh agus ar úsáid na hUltaise a chur chun cinn i dTuaisceart Éireann agus ar fud oileán na hÉireann. Ceadaíonn an Chomhairle Aireachta Thuaidh-Theas pleananna gnó bliantúla agus buiséid bhliantúla don dá ghníomhaireacht. Sa chomhthéacs sin, faigheann Foras na Gaeilge 75% dá chistiú ón Roinn seo agus 25% dá chistiú ón Roinn Phobail i dTuaisceart Éireann agus faigheann Gníomhaireacht na hUltaise 75% dá chistiú ón Roinn Phobail i dTuaisceart Éireann agus 25% dá chistiú ón Roinn seo. Ba cheart a thabhairt faoi deara nach rabhthas, de bharr cúinsí polaitiúla i dTuaisceart Éireann, in ann aon chruinniú de chuid an Chomhairle Aireachta Thuaidh-Theas a thionól sa bhliain 2017. Dá bhrí sin, níor ceadaíodh na pleananna gnó don bhliain 2017 nó don bhliain 2018 go fóill.

Thug an Teachta aitheantas don ról pearsanta atá ag an Taoiseach maidir le Bliain na Gaeilge. Tá an ceart aige go bhfuil suim mhór ag an Taoiseach sa cheist seo. D'fhógair sé Bliain na Gaeilge le Conradh na Gaeilge, a mhol i dtús báire go mbeadh Bliain na Gaeilge ann. Tá nasc idir Conradh na Gaeilge agus na dreamanna uilig ar an talamh atá ag obair. Tháinig €450 milliún isteach mar allúntas amháin ón Rialtas. Chomh maith leis sin-----

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Cé mhéad airgead atá i gceist?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá €450,000 i gceist.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

Milliún nó míle?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Míle, nach mór leathmhilliún.

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

An é sin é?

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá Gaillimh le Gaeilge agus na grúpaí uilig eile ar an talamh atá ag fáil tacaíochta ag obair ar Bhliain na Gaeilge fosta. Tá Bliain na Gaeilge sa Ghaeltacht agus taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht. Mar is eol don Teachta, beidh daoine atá ag obair ar Bhliain na Gaeilge, agus atá suim acu sa cheantar nó sa phobal, i dteagmháil leis ar an Idirlíon, srl. Teachtaireacht agus brandáil ollmhór ar son na Gaeilge atá i gceist.

Chairman

Tá 12 nóiméad caite ar an gceist seo againn. Ní ceart dúinn níos mó ná deich nóiméad a chaitheamh ar gach ceist.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Táthar ag breathnú ar na moltaí a tháinig isteach faoin bpróiseas comhairliúcháin phoiblí i dtaobh na haerstráicí. Tá plé ar bun leis na páirtithe leasmhara éagsúla, ar nós Feidhmeannacht na Seirbhíse Sláinte agus Garda Cósta na hÉireann maidir leis na haerstráicí. Aontaím leis an mhéid atá ráite faoin ról a bhí ag Pól Ó Gallchóir i dtaobh na hoileánaigh. Tháinig sé isteach coicís ó shin mar dhuine neamhspleách. Mar is eol don choiste, bhí pobalbhreith ann ag an deireadh seachtaine. Tá mé ag amharc ar an obair atá de dhíth amach anseo. Aontaím leis na moltaí a chur an tUasal Ó Gallchóir le chéile. Tá na hoifigigh ó Roinn na Gaeltachta ag obair leis an gcomharchumann inniu chun na moltaí a chur i bhfeidhm amach anseo. Tá sé tábhachtach. Tá an scéal maidir le hAer Árann casta. Baineann sé le rialacha soláthair poiblí agus le rialacha chúnaimh Stáit. Caithfidh mo Roinn cloí leis na rialacha sin. Is é sin an fáth nach bhfuil eitleán ar éileamh ar fáil faoin chonradh reatha.

Chairman

Ba mhaith liom cúpla ceist a chur ar an Aire Stáit. Níl mé ag iarraidh bheith trodach. Tá mé ag iarraidh bheith ionraic leis. B'fhéidir go mbeidh sé ionraic linn freisin. Tá a fhios agam go bhfuil grá aige don teanga. Tá a fhios agam freisin go bhfuil rudaí maithe mar gheall ar an teanga ag tarlú timpeall na tíre. Nuair atáimid ag iarraidh an pictiúr mór a thomhas, caithimid díriú isteach ar chúpla staitistic a thaispeánann beatha nó sláinte na teanga. Mar a dúirt an Teachta Ó Cuív, caitheadh seacht n-oiread níos mó airgid - maoiniú caipitil - ar an nGaeilge in 2008 ná i mbliana. Tá caiteachas iomlán an Rialtais beagnach mar an gcéanna is a bhí sé in 2008. Níl aon fhíordhifear idir an dá fhigiúr. Bhí an Roinn seo ag caitheamh seacht n-oiread níos mó airgid chaipitil ar an nGaeilge ag an am sin. Taispeánann sé sin an difear tábhachtach atá soiléir i gcaiteachas an Rialtais.

Tá mé ag iarraidh bheith dearfach mar gheall ar an teanga. Is aoibhinn liom an teanga freisin. Is í an staitistic is tábhachtaí don Rialtas agus do gach duine anseo ná an titim atá tagtha ar an mhéid daoine atá ag labhairt na Gaeilge lá i ndiaidh lae taobh amuigh den scoil. Is í sin an uimhir ar a mhaireann an Roinn, i slí amháin. Má thiteann an staitistic sin, tá rudaí ag dul in olcas. Má ardaíonn an staitistic sin, tá rudaí ag éirí níos fearr. Is í seo an fhadhb atá againn. Dá gcuirfear ceist ar dhaoine ar shráideanna Leitir Ceanainn, an Uaimh nó Carraig an tSionnaigh faoin mhéid airgid atá caite ag an Roinn seo ar an nGaeltacht agus ar an nGaeilge, i gcomparáid leis na healaíona agus leis an oidhreacht, déarfaidis ar fad go bhfuil níos mó airgid á chaitheamh ar an nGaeilge agus ar an nGaeltacht ná mar atá á chaitheamh ar na hábhair eile.

Tá an Ghaeilge agus an Ghaeltacht beagnach ag bun an dréimire mar gheall ar an mhéid airgid atá ar fáil ón Roinn sna catagóirí seo. Ba cheart dúinn a rá go hionraic go léiríonn na príomhstaitisticí a bhaineann leis an ábhar seo go bhfuil rudaí olc go leor, agus go bhfuilimid i ndáiríre faoi dul chun cinn a dhéanamh sa chomhthéacs seo. Bheadh níos mó measa agam agus ag Gaeilgeoirí timpeall na tíre ar an Roinn dá mbeadh a leithéid á rá.

Tá deacracht agam leis an gcaiteachas de €500,000 ar Bhliain na Gaeilge. Críochnóidh mé leis an lár-ionad Gaeilge. Is rud maith é go bhfuil sé sa phlean fadtéarmach caipitil. Fáiltím roimhe sin. Dá mbeadh an tAire Stáit in ann a rá go bhfuil sé i gceist an t-ionad a thógáil i gceann trí bliana - dá mbeadh spriocdháta leagtha amach, an t-airgead curtha ar leataobh agus na pleananna ullmhaithe - bheadh níos mó muiníne ag daoine go bhfuil an Rialtas i ndáiríre faoin tionscadal seo. Iarraim ar an Aire Stáit freagra a thabhairt ar na pointí sin.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Aontaím gur cheart dúinn breathnú ar an bpictiúr mór maidir leis an nGaeilge. Rachaidh mé anseo is ansiúd agus mé ag freagairt na ceisteanna atá curtha ag an gCathaoirleach. Tá mé i gcroílár an chomhrá maidir leis an nGaeilge agus leis an nGaeltacht. Tá sé mar fhreagracht orm an Ghaeilge a chur chun cinn agus an teanga a choimeád beo sna ceantair Ghaeltachta. Caithfidh mé a rá mar fhocal pearsanta gurb iad na daoine uilig timpeall na tíre, go háirithe iad siúd atá lonnaithe sa Ghaeltacht, atá freagrach as an teanga. Má tá siad ag úsáid na Gaeilge achan lá sna siopaí agus nuair atá siad ag dul ag obair sa Ghaeltacht nó taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht, is é sin an tslat tomhais is tábhachtaí. Muna bhfuil na daoine ag úsáid na teanga, ní bheidh an teanga beo. Is í sin an fhírinne. Chuaigh mise agus an tAire, an Teachta Bruton, go dtí scoil i gContae na Mí roimh an Nollaig chun polasaí oideachais a lainseáil. Nuair a bhí mé taobh amuigh den scoil roimh an ócáid fhoirmiúil, bhí na daoine a bhí ag súgradh ag labhairt Gaeilge. Is é sin an tipping point. Má tá daoine ag úsáid na Gaeilge taobh amuigh den struchtúr foirmiúil, tarlóidh rudaí fíor-dhearfacha ar son na teanga.

Nuair atá daoine sa réimse polaitiúil ag déanamh díospóireachta agus comhrá faoin teanga, bíonn siad i gcónaí ag caint faoi airgead agus ag gearán nach bhfuil dóthain airgid ar fáil. Is cinnte go bhfuil sé sin tábhachtach. Tá an struchtúr maidir leis an straitéis, leis an choiste Gaeilge agus le Bille na dteangacha oifigiúla thar a bheith tábhachtach fosta. Nuair a bhíonn muidne i gcónaí ag troid faoi chúrsaí polaitiúla ar nós airgid agus caipitil, ní dhírítear aon aird ar na rudaí dearfacha atá á mbaint amach, ar nós scéim na bhfoghlaimeoirí Gaeilge; scéim na gcúntóirí teanga, a reáchtálann Muintearas agus Oidhreacht Chorca Dhuibhne; scéim na gcampaí samhraidh; an polasaí don oideachas Gaeltachta; agus an plean digiteach don Ghaeilge. Cuirfidh an tionscnamh ardscileanna Gaeilge daoine leis na scileanna go dtí Lucsamburg agus an Bhruiséil sa bhliain 2021. Nuair a bhí an Cathaoirleach i dTír Chonaill, chonaic sé an dea-scéal maidir le hAcadamh na hOllscolaíochta Gaeilge i nGaoth Dobhair. Tá an t-acadamh lonnaithe i gCarna na Gaillimhe fosta. Ba mhaith liom Ionad Cuimhneacháin na nImirceach i gCarna, Halla Naomh Fhionáin sna Crois Bhealaí, Amharclann Ghaoth Dobhair agus Teach an Phiarsaigh a lua sa chomhthéacs seo fosta. Tagann dea-scéal ó Choláiste Lurgan, i gContae na Gaillimhe, achan samhradh nuair a bhíonn déagóirí agus mic léinn ag déanamh rudaí difriúla agus ildánacha. Lainseáil mé an Bailiúchán Náisiúnta Béaloidis in UCD cúpla mí ó shin. Tá DCU agus Coláiste na Tríonóide ag treabhadh ar aghaidh fosta.

Tá cuid mhór oibre ag dul ar aghaidh taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht agus taobh amuigh de Roinn na Gaeltachta fosta. Tá achan oifigeach i mo Roinn, ón Ard-Rúnaí go dtí na hoifigigh sna rannóga oidhreachta agus cultúrtha, tiomanta i dtaobh na Gaeilge. Tá naisc fite fuaite idir gach rannóg sa Roinn. Mar shampla, bhí mé ag labhairt leis na daoine sa rannóg cultúir agus ealaíon i dtaobh iarratais a bhí á dhéanamh agam. Chas mé le grúpa i São Paulo na Brasaíle an tseachtain seo caite atá ag teacht go dtí an tír seo i mí Iúil agus atá ag iarraidh cuidiú le n-obair atá á déanamh acu maidir le scéal Roger Casement. Tá siad ag spreagadh na Gaeilge thar lear agus ag teacht ar ais go dtí an tír seo. Beidh an tacaíocht thábhachtach atá de dhíth orthu ag teacht ón rannóg cultúir, seachas ó mo rannóg féin. Tá na rudaí seo ar fad fite fuaite. Tá ról ollmhór ag an Roinn Oideachas agus Scileanna. Agus muid ag labhairt faoi airgead, ba cheart dom a rá go bhfuil €10 mbilliún ar fáil tríd an Roinn Oideachas agus Scileanna achan bhliain. Tá an Roinn sin ag tabhairt tacaíochta i mbliana i dtaobh mac léinn sna bunscoileanna agus na meánscoileanna.

Chairman

Molaim na dea-rudaí atá ag titim amach timpeall na tíre. Cé gur féidir linn díriú isteach ar na dea-shamplaí sin, ní féidir linn a rá go bhfuil rudaí ag dul i bhfeabhas. Is é an mórphictiúr an príomhrud go gcaithfimid díriú air. Bíonn an tAire Stáit ag caint go minic faoin Roinn Oideachas agus Scileanna. Tá dualgas iontach ar an Roinn sin sa chomhthéacs seo, ach níl aon phlean dréachtaithe ag an Roinn sin le haghaidh na Gaeilge sna Gaelscoileanna nó sna gnáthscoileanna taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht. Fáiltím roimh an bpolasaí don oideachas Gaeltachta atá foilsithe ag an Roinn Oideachas agus Scileanna. Nuair a d'iarr mé ar an Roinn cá bhfuil a plean le haghaidh na Gaeilge sna Gaelscoileanna agus sna gnáthscoileanna, dúradh liom nach bhfuil a leithéid de phlean ann. Tá sé sin dochreidte. Tá 46% de na naíonraí sa Ghaeltacht ag feidhmiú i mBéarla amháin faoi láthair. Níl aon phlean aitheantais ann. Níl aon phlean ann chun cabhrú leis na naíonraí. Níl aon Ghaeilge ar chor ar bith ag baint leis an gcuraclam faoin scéim ECCE, atá á riaradh ag Roinn an Aire, an Teachta Zappone. Ní fhéachann an Roinn Leanaí agus Gnóthaí Óige gur cheart go mbeadh an Ghaeilge bainteach leis an scéim sin. Ní thuigeann iad siúd atá freagrach as an bpríomhchloch atá againn i gcóras oideachais na tíre seo gur cheart dóibh aitheantas a thabhairt do mhaitheas nó luach na Gaeilge. Taispeánann sé sin drochmheas don teanga.

Dá mbeinn sa Rialtas agus ag iarraidh a thaispeáint do dhaoine go bhfuilim i ndáiríre faoin nGaeilge, an chéad rud a dhéanfainn ná meas iomlán a thabhairt don Ghaeilge, ní hamháin i bhfocail ach i ngníomhartha freisin. Tá gníomhartha ag teastáil mar gheall ar an straitéis 20 bliain. Is rud práinneach é. Tá an Ghaeltacht ag meath go han-tapa ar fad. Mar a dúirt mé leis an Aire Stáit cheana, tá 500 páiste idir trí bliana agus ceithre bliana ag labhairt na Gaeilge taobh amuigh den scoil sa Ghaeltacht anois. Tá an Ghaeltacht ag crith ar an ngéag chaol sin anois. Táimid ag fanacht le blianta le haghaidh plean gnímh don straitéis 20 bliain. Níl mé ag iarraidh bheith ró-dhiúltach ar an ábhar seo. Tá a fhios agam go bhfuil daoine i Roinn na Gaeltachta ag déanamh a ndíchill agus tá a fhios agam go bhfuil rudaí maithe ag tarlú, ach caithfimid féachaint ar an mórphictiúr. Má tá an tAire Stáit ag iarraidh muinín a thaispeáint do na gnáthdhaoine taobh amuigh, léireoidh sé go bhfuil sé i gceist ag an Rialtas teacht ar ais i gceann trí bliana nó ceithre bliana ar an €70 milliún a bhí ann le haghaidh maoinithe chaipitil. Tá an Rialtas ag rá go rachaimid ar ais go dtí an méid airgid sin, ach níl an teachtaireacht sin á fáil againn ón Aire agus ón Aire Stáit. Is é sin an pointe atá á dhéanamh agam.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Níl aon cheist curtha ag an gCathaoirleach.

Chairman

Tá fadhb mhór ann i dtaobh Fhoras na Gaeilge. Tá an chomhréir idir an Tuaisceart agus an Deisceart faoi ghlas de réir téarmaí Chomhaontú Aoine an Chéasta. Molaim don Rialtas roinnt dualgas a thógaint ón bhforas agus iad a thabhairt don Roinn. Bheadh an Rialtas in ann níos mó airgid a chur ar fáil chun na dualgais sin a mhaoiniú sa Roinn agus bheadh lucht Fhoras na Gaeilge in ann níos mó a dhéanamh laistigh den bhuiséad uafásach beag atá acu faoi láthair. Ós rud é nach féidir linn níos mó airgid a chur isteach san fhoras, b'fhéidir gur cheart dúinn cuid de na dualgais atá ar lucht an fhorais a bhaint uathu. Dá mbeadh na dualgais sin á gcomhlíonadh sa Roinn, bheadh an Rialtas in ann breis airgid a chur ar fáil dóibh. Tá na heagraíochtaí ag streachailt mar gheall ar an airgead atá acu. Cad a cheapann an tAire Stáit faoin smaoineamh sin?

Deputy Joe McHugh

An chéad mhíbhuntáiste a ritheann liom ná nach bheinn in ann suí síos le mo chomhghleacaí sa Tuaisceart. Tá dualgas mór ar Fhoras na Gaeilge maidir leis na líonraí a chur i bhfeidhm. Tá freagracht mhór ar an fhoras maidir leis na bailte seirbhíse Gaeltachta, ar nós Daingean Uí Chúis, cathair na Gaillimhe agus Leitir Ceanainn. Tá muidne ag obair go cóngarach le Foras na Gaeilge. B'fhéidir go mbeidh tuilleadh airgid agam amach anseo. Tá dualgas ar Rialtas na hÉireann suas le €65 mhilliún a sholáthar.

Tá sin bunaithe ar fhigiúirí ó 2016. B'fhéidir go raibh an Cathaoirleach istigh san fhoirgneamh sa chathair seo, Baile Átha Cliath. An raibh sé istigh san fhoirngeamh úr?

Chairman

Ní raibh.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá dea-scéal maidir leis an fhoras. Tá an dualgas orainn uilig agus ar an fhoras freisin maidir le pleanáil teanga taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht. Beimid ag iarraidh dul níos cóngaraí leis sin. Ag dul ar ais do mholtaí an Chathaoirligh féin, bhí sé ag caint faoin Aire, an Teachta Zappone, agus an ról ata aici sa Roinn. Bím i mo shuí achan Mháirt leis an Taoiseach, an Teachta Varadkar, ar mo chlé agus an Aire, an Teachta Zappone, ar mo dheis. Táimse ag amharc go dtí Bille na dteangacha oifigiúla (leasú). Táimid ag iarraidh go mbeadh níos mó daoine le Gaeilge. Dá mbeidis in ann ár ndualgais agus ár sprioc i dtaca leis an 20% a bhaint amach, b'fhéidir go mbeimid i spás difriúil.

Maidir leis an cheist fadúda na scoileanna agus na Gaelscoileanna, d'fhéach mé ar ais tríd na blianta agus nuair a tháinig na Gaelscoileanna isteach b'fhéidir go raibh ceann amháin i nDún na nGall nó b'fhéidir ceann amháin nó dhá cheann i mBaile Átha Cliath ar dtús. Tá siad ag fás. Anois tá éileamh ollmhór i measc tuismitheoirí atá ag smaoineamh faoina bpáistí a sheoladh go dtí na Gaelscoileanna. Ach cad a bheidh na meánscoileanna eile ag déanamh? I nGuaire i gContae Loch Garman bhí sruth Gaeilge sa phobalscoil. Chuir Abbey Vocational School i nDún na nGall sruth Gaeile ar bun an bhliain seo caite.

Chairman

Más féidir liom teacht isteach, níl aon phróiseas oifigiúil sa Roinn Oideachais agus Scileanna inar féidir le scoileanna sruthanna Gaeilge nua a bhunú nó iompú go dtí Gaelscoil. Caithfidh siad é a thiomáint iad féin ina n-aonar. Tá córas oifigiúil ag an Roinn Oideachas agus Scileanna do scoileanna atá ag iarraidh athrú ó scoil Chaitliceach go scoil ilchreidmheach. Ach dá mbeadh scoil ag iarraidh athrú ó scoil Bhéarla go scoil Ghaeilge, caithfidh siad é a dhéanamh iad féin.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá an t-éileamh ann, mar shampla, i Sligeach fosta.

Chairman

Gan dabht.

Deputy Joe McHugh

Tá éileamh i mo cheantar féin, sa mheánscoil i mBaile an nGallóglach agus i gColáiste na Maoile Rua. Tá siad ag smaoineamh fadúda sruth Gaeilge fosta. Is é mo thuairim phearsanta ná dá mbeadh an teanga taobh amuigh den struchtúr foirmiúil agus dá mbeadh daoine ag úsáid na teanga achan lá ar an talamh, ba é sin an bealach is fearr.

Deputy Michael Collins

I would just like to raise a few issues in respect of the islands. I represent eight of them in my own constituency in Cork South-West. In fairness, when the Minister of State's name is mentioned there is always a positive response. As the old saying in west Cork goes, call a spade a spade and be straight with a person. Having attended the AGMs of various groups on some of those islands, the one issue that keeps coming up is the falling population on the islands. The question is when a council house was last built on an island. Is funding being made available to islands to turn this around? Many families would not have the finances to build a house but they are not being assisted by the local authority because the local authority says that it is not getting the funding to turn it around. I mentioned the eight islands. There is Dursey Island; Bere Island, which is a strong island and could take social or council housing; Whiddy Island; Long Island; Sherkin Island; Heir Island; Garnish Island; and Cape Clear. Some of these are very active islands but their populations are falling. Every set of statistics which is made available shows that clear trend. There has not been a focus, however, on building council houses on islands. That needs to turn around if we are not going to see the demise of islands.

Another issue is the Leader funding. That is an issue on the mainland as well as on the islands, but the islands will survive too and they are looking for Leader funding. The way in which Leader funding changed was a farce. It was basically destroyed. There are similar issues on the mainland, as I have said. Committee groups are looking for Leader funding, but islands are also looking for it and are finding it difficult to access the funding, which was freely available before.

Another issue which is close to my heart, but about which the Minister of State might not be able to do much, is the famous Fastnet Rock, which is an icon around the world. The Commissioners of Irish Lights has decided that it wants to tamper with it by dimming the light on Fastnet Rock. It would take the range of the beam down from 28 nautical miles down to 17 nautical miles. I take a very dim view of that decision, as does the local community. It is our heritage and our culture. People have told me that for hundreds of years it was the last light people saw when they left Ireland. The next light was the Statue of Liberty. Any movement by the Commissioners of Irish lights towards dimming this light is a backward decision. I cannot understand it. I know it has it nicely polished and is saying that there will be no visible difference to the structure of the building itself but it has been an iconic structure. It is just a few stone's throws away from my own house in west Cork. It is the wrong decision. I know the Minister of State cannot intervene personally, but if he could it would be great. I think it is good for me to highlight this issue and the upset which people have expressed on it.

Deputy Joe McHugh

I appreciate the Deputy's thoughts on the islands. We have issues around depopulation on some of our islands. I have responsibility for the populated islands. I am very aware of the potential on the likes of Bere Island and Sherkin Island. Particularly in respect of Bere Island we have to look at the military heritage. There is great leadership there in the likes of John Walsh. There are comharchumainn right through Sherkin Island. I was speaking to `the Minister of State, Deputy Jim Daly, today and he is looking at attending that AGM if it suits him. I asked him to check his diary. Maybe we can meet up with the comharchumann down there. There are so many other things at play with regard to responsibility for the islands. For example the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine had a special allocation of pillar 1 money for the islands. It looked at the islands on their own. That was a good thing. There are a number of issues and challenges. We have responsibility for the populated islands. The Deputy may have ideas for ways to maintain the current population and to get more people back.

Arranmore got an allocation from the Department of Rural and Community Development for a digital hub. That had a great positive knock-on effect. In fact, one person who had been living in Scotland was thinking about moving back and bringing their business back if the broadband was available. The islands are a big focus of the national development plan, as they should be. I have no problem putting on the record that we should be discriminate when we look at rolling out the national broadband plan. We have a tendency in Ireland to work from core to periphery. We have an opportunity here to start from the most peripheral isolated areas and to work back. That is a very black and white suggestion which probably requires a much more complex answer. Regardless of who gets the broadband contract, I have always said that we should look at the more vulnerable places when it is being rolled out. No doubt I will have the Deputy's support in that.

Deputy Michael Collins

Does the Minister of State have any comment on Fastnet Rock?

Deputy Joe McHugh

I do not think it is a populated island.

Deputy Michael Collins

It is still off our shore, however.

Deputy Joe McHugh

My only observation is that my experiences of the Commissioners of Irish Lights have been positive. I point to the teach solais up in Fanad.

It is a tremendous project where we are looking at hundreds of people coming even in the winter. During summer, many thousands of people will come there. It is a very good partnership project involving the Department, Irish Lights, the local authority, Fáilte Ireland and our own Department through the Gaeltacht. The people I have dealt with at Irish Lights listen and work with one and I recommend that the Deputy contacts them in a formal and direct way.

Chairman

I invite a presentation on programme D, if there is one, or questions.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

A provision of €40 million was made available to two implementation bodies to support North-South co-operation, namely, An Foras Teanga, comprising Foras na Gaeilge and the Ulster-Scots Agency, and Waterways Ireland. These allocations are also subject to the approval of the North-South Ministerial Council. The overall allocation for Waterways Ireland for 2018 is increased by over €1 million to just over €24 million. More than 90% of the waterways remained open during the 2017 boating season. Works to repair damaged infrastructure progressed throughout the year and the Shannon-Erne blueway continued to attract a significant number of visitors. The Minister of State, Deputy McHugh, has addressed the aspects of the Vote related to his brief.

Chairman

It is not my desire to put competing interests against one another with regard to funding but this goes back to my point on the Irish language and how poorly it is funded. Waterways Ireland receives €24 million for 2018, which it should, but Foras na Gaeilge has funding of €13 million, which is considerably less. As such, the Irish language is the poor relation. I guarantee that if one asked anyone on Grafton Street whether Waterways Ireland, which covers some canals and waterways, or Foras na Gaeilge received more, they would all say it was the latter which received a higher investment. However, that is not the case. I made the point to Deputy McHugh but I note it to Deputy Madigan also. Foras na Gaeilge is in trouble having regard to its funding because it is locked into a funding mechanism with the North, which has no Executive at present. It might be a way around that problem to take some of its responsibilities away from Foras na Gaeilge and fund them through other mechanisms. That would leave Foras na Gaeilge with its total funding intact but with fewer responsibilities to fund. Each one of its funding responsibilities would thereby have its funding increased. It might just be a work-around while the current system is in lockdown and the Minister might consider that suggestion.

Blueways are a great initiative and we are very fond of them. However, there are lots of rivers, such as the Boyne, which do not currently have blueways but which would benefit massively from them. If there was an energy injected into the development of blueways nationally, it would be useful.

Deputy Joe McHugh

I might take the questions on Foras na Gaeilge and the Minister might discuss the blueways. In his original question, the Chairman referred to the structure of the North-South institutions. It is very important, especially as we head towards the 20th anniversary of the Good Friday Agreement, to note the onus on us to protect any structures under it as best we can. That said and while it is a disadvantage that we cannot meet with our colleagues on a formal basis, there is engagement between the finance Departments North and South. It is very important to hold onto whatever structures are in place, especially as people are reflecting and until such time as we can sit down formally to discuss these things.

Deputy Josepha Madigan

Deputy McHugh has already covered some of this but Foras na Gaeilge is only one aspect of Irish language funding. We also fund Údarás na Gaeltachta, the Gaeltachtaí and Gaeilge directly. A provision of €13.989 million was also funded in the 2017 Revised Estimates of the Department to fund the work of An Foras Teanga.

I accept what the Chairman says about the importance of blueways. The graving docks site at Grand Canal Docks is designated within city block 19 of the North Lotts and Grand Canal Dock SDZ. There are three graving docks on the site, two of which were excavated by Waterways Ireland in 2002 while the third remains infilled. These have not been used for ship building and repair for almost a century. There is also the extension of the Longford branch of the Royal Canal where Waterways Ireland published a feasibility study. The Chairman is correct that blueways are important and that funding should go to those waterways.

Chairman

Ba mhaith liom míle buíochas a rá leis an Aire agus an Aire Stáit as teacht isteach anseo agus na ceisteanna seo a fhreagairt. We will deal briefly in private session with any other business.