Is it agreed that we now adjourn?
Business of Select Committee
It is not agreed.
How does the Deputy propose to——
I propose that we stay here to complete the work.
It has already been discussed and agreed to at this meeting. The Deputy was not present; it is not our fault.
The suggestion at the moment is that we adjourn now and not continue for the next ten minutes.
I am suggesting the committee decides to complete the work this evening.
There was a decision.
Shall I go back into private session?
I do not think there is a need to do that. A decision was taken that we would sit until 6 p.m. and that decision cannot be revisited. I am happy to stay here until 6 p.m.
I came in here today to work on the Bill until midnight if that was what it took. I cleared my diary to make sure I could stay here all evening so the Bill could be completed today. A decision was taken by the committee to finish at 6 p.m.; I cannot understand why another decision cannot now be taken, in view of what the Chief Whip has told us, to revert to the original decision and continue to work on the Bill until it is finished.
The problem with this Bill is that it is being rushed through. There is limited opportunity for discussion on Report Stage. It has been suggested that the Bill be guillotined on Wednesday. If it is being rushed through today or any other day, it means the amendments that have been tabled, and the Bill as a whole, will not be given proper scrutiny on Committee Stage. The committee had decided that we would adjourn today and return on Monday and even on Tuesday, if required, to facilitate the passage of the Bill. The business of the Dáil has not been decided for the final week of the term, which is the week after next. Therefore, the argument that we must conclude today is bogus.
I understand that when the committee decided on its business earlier, the view was that a number of spokespersons, Opposition spokespersons in particular, would not be present.
I apologise for my absence earlier. I was in the Chamber for much of that time for the debate on the Bill dealing with the Ward Union. I suggest that circumstances have changed in light of the messages coming to the committee and I assume it is in order to change our decision and continue the business this evening. I cannot see why that would not be in order.
My advice is we can revisit the decision and that the decision is a matter for the committee.
Many Bills are rushed through the Dáil in a day as emergency legislation. We have two sitting weeks left and it seems extraordinary that we cannot facilitate dealing with this on Monday and allowing the Bill go through the Dáil during the two remaining weeks.
The decision that was taken should stand. We discussed it in detail earlier.
I am advised that because the decision is within the remit of committee members, they can revisit it. If there is a proposal, it will ——
Changing the decision is quite unfair on members who have been here since we began at 11.15 a.m. this morning. They have participated in the debate for the entire day and they took a decision to end at 6 p.m. and come back on Monday, and changed their schedules on Monday to facilitate that. Now members who decided to turn up at 5.50 p.m., having been absent for the debate — I appreciate Deputy Byrne was in the Chamber, but we all have other places ——
I and Deputy McGrath were debating another issue all day.
Yes, but they were not speaking all day and that debate is still going on. The Deputy spoke for a maximum of 20 minutes and was not available to be here. Many of us who are here would have liked to take part in that debate, but we did not have that opportunity.
I took part in the debate just as Deputy Enright did in this one. I was in the Chamber for most of the time. The issue affects my constituency.
It affects the constituencies of many of us. The point is we have been here working on this all day. A decision was taken by the committee that we would come back and finish it on Monday and that decision should stand.
The decision was also taken with the agreement of the Minister.
Yes, but at that stage I was not aware there was a problem in the Bills Office of which I have since been made aware.
There is no problem with the Bills Office.
I have no problem with coming in on Friday or Saturday. I always put legislative issues first. I cleared my diary for today, leaving the evening clear so that if debate continued, I would be available to deal with it. I have no problem with clearing my diary for tomorrow if that was convenient. I have no problem with doing that for Saturday or Sunday. However, I have been told by the Bills Office, through the whip, that the Bill cannot proceed to the Dáil on Wednesday, as scheduled, if it is completed on Monday. I did not realise that when we discussed it earlier, but have since been made aware of it. Therefore, this changes the situation dramatically.
The Chair is in the hands of the members. Does Deputy Byrne wish to make a proposal?
I apologise for being absent earlier, but I had good reason and will not be criticised for that.
None of the Fianna Fáil members was here for any of the meeting.
Allow Deputy Byrne make his proposal.
Staying on to finish this is highly inconvenient for us too, but we have a legislative duty. It is inconvenient for me, as I am sure it is for Deputy McGrath and Deputy Brady.
Not one of them sat here all day.
I propose that we continue sitting to complete the work on the Bill.
I second that proposal.
That is completely unreasonable. We have been here in this committee room since 9.30 a.m. this morning and it is just not on that we should sit beyond 6 p.m. A decision was taken by the committee, in conjunction with the Minister, that we should adjourn at 6 p.m. and we should stick with that decision.
What is the problem with sitting and working beyond 6 p.m? I have been doing that for my lifetime.
It is only fair that people would be given notice of that. People have other engagements tonight.
When I was informed of this meeting, I presumed the business would be completed today and that it would take whatever time it needed. I presumed that if it took until midnight, we would sit until midnight and I cleared my diary accordingly.
We did not have that presumption. We thought we would be finished in a reasonable time.
There was no finishing time mentioned on any paperwork I was given.
There are a number of points here. The committee schedule was circulated, but it did not specify that the business was guillotined and had to be concluded today. In addition, members of the committee would not have been aware of the schedule for next week earlier, unless they were informed by their whip. As I said earlier, there is nothing to prevent this Bill from being taken in the final week as the final week's schedule has not been published or discussed by the Whip's office yet. The problem in the Bills Office relates to the turnaround time for amendments, but it could still be done. In the past we have discussed amendments on Committee Stage and the legislation was published for Report Stage with amendments for the Dáil the following day. There is an issue if the debate is to be held next Wednesday, but there is nothing to prevent the Bill being taken next Thursday or Friday, which would allow the Bills Office the necessary turnaround time. The Bill is on the schedule for Wednesday, but there is nothing to prevent a swap for the Thursday or Friday, or for the Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday of the following week.
What is the reasoning behind the advice the Whip has given? Could we not make further contact with the Whip to sort this out and to back up what has been said by Deputy Ó Snodaigh? We should consider making a call to the Whip.
The message was conveyed to me through the Minister, Deputy Ó Cuív, and I am not in a position to explain it further. In fairness to the Chair, it is in the hands of the committee. I take the point made by Deputy Shortall with regard to the decisions we made earlier. However, I am obliged to take proposals from the floor. If a proposal is made, and one has been made by Deputy Byrne, the advice I have received from the clerk is that it is in order and I must put it to the meeting.
I put it to the Chair that it is completely unreasonable to change the arrangements at this point. I have an important meeting at 7.45 p.m. about cutbacks in services for people with disabilities. I could have made an arrangement earlier and got somebody to substitute for me, but I cannot do that now at such short notice.
In fairness, we all have commitments. I have too. I do not deny that it is, perhaps, unreasonable to change now. However, as Chair, if a proposal is made, it is in order and I am obliged to put it to the members.
Is there any problem with completing the debate tomorrow?
It is a matter for the committee and the Minister. Do members wish to adjourn for five minutes to discuss the issue?
No, it is better to talk it out and make a decision. Whatever, we are going to do, we may as well do it.
Does the Minister have an opinion on this?
The business is scheduled for the Dáil on Wednesday. When I agreed earlier to completing the debate on Monday, I did not realise there would be any difficulty with the Bills Office. If that was not an issue, there would be no problem.
What exactly is the difficulty with the Bills Office?
I suggest we suspend for five minutes to sort it out.
Sitting suspended at 6 p.m. and resumed at 6.05 p.m.
If Deputy Thomas Byrne withdraws his proposal, the suggestion is that we will reverse the decision to proceed on Monday.
I withdraw my motion. I proposed it on the basis of the advice given to me to the effect that difficulties would be created. I now understand difficulties will not be created. I am glad, as I did not want to be present any more than other members.
Is that agreed? Agreed.
Is there a change of date for Report Stage?
Apparently not. I thank members for their co-operation.
At what time are we meeting on Monday?
At 3 p.m.
Are we saying 2 p.m. or 3 p.m.?
At 3 p.m.
I thank members.
Progress reported; Committee to sit again.
The select committee adjourned at 6.05 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Monday, 28 June 2010.