Enda Kenny
Question:9 Mr. Kenny asked the Taoiseach the appointments made by him since June 2002 to State boards or other agencies within his aegis; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [1029/04]
View answerWednesday, 3 March 2004
Questions (9, 10, 11, 12)
Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin
Question:10 Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin asked the Taoiseach the appointments he has made to State boards since June 2002; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5625/04]
View answer
Trevor Sargent
Question:11 Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach the appointments made by him since June 2002 to State boards and other agencies; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [5659/04]
View answer
Joe Higgins
Question:12 Mr. J. Higgins asked the Taoiseach the appointments which have been made by him to State boards and other agencies since June 2002. [6694/04]
View answerOral answers (24 contributions)
I propose to take Questions Nos. 9 to 12, inclusive, together.
The bodies under the aegis of my Department are the National Statistics Board, the National Economic and Social Council, NESC, the National Economic and Social Forum, NESF, the Information Society Commission, the National Centre for Partnership and Performance, NCPP, the Law Reform Commission, and the International Financial Services Centre Group.
The appointments made by me to these bodies since June 2002 are set out in the following schedule.
Appointments to bodies under the aegis of the Department of Taoiseach since June 2002.
|
Body |
Appointments |
Date of Appointment |
|
National Economic and |
Mr. Jack O’Connor (SIPTU) |
All made in September and |
|
Social Council |
Ms Aileen O’Donoghue (IBEC) |
October 2003 |
|
Ms Deirdre Garvey (The Wheel) |
||
|
Mr. John Mark McCafferty (St. Vincent de Paul) |
||
|
Mr. John Dolan (Disability Federation of Ireland) |
||
|
Mr. Niall Callan (Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government) |
||
|
Mr. Colin Hunt (Goodbody Stockbrokers) |
||
|
Professor Brigid Laffan (UCD) |
||
|
Professor John Fitzgerald (ESRI) |
||
|
Professor Eithne McLaughlin (Queens University) |
||
|
Mr. Peter Bacon (Economic Consultant) |
||
|
National Centre for |
Mr. John Walsh (Department of Enterprise, Trade and |
July 2002 |
|
Partnership and |
Employment) |
|
|
Performance |
Mr. Fergus Whelan (ICTU) |
November 2003 |
|
IFSC Clearing House |
Mr. Walter Brazil (AIB Capital Markets) |
Reconstituted November 2002 |
|
Group |
Mr. Gavin Caldwell |
|
|
Mr. Denis Casey (Irish Life and Permanent) |
||
|
Mr. Brian Collins (Bank of Ireland Security Services) |
||
|
Mr. Peter Coyne (Dublin Docklands Development Authority) |
||
|
Mr. Colm Doherty (AIB Capital Markets) |
||
|
Mr. Brian Goggin (Bank of Ireland) |
||
|
Mr. John Larkin (William Fry Solicitors) |
||
|
Ms Aileen O’Donoghue (Financial Services Ireland) |
||
|
Mr. Michael Ryan (Merrill Lynch Capital Markets Bank Limited) |
||
|
Mr. Willie Slattery (State Street International Ireland Limited) |
||
|
Mr. Pat Wall (PricewaterhouseCoopers) |
||
|
National Economic and Social Forum |
Of the 62 NESF members, 50 are appointed by nominating bodies, five members are ex officio and five independent members are appointed by the Government. The five NESF independent appointments are: Dr. Mary P Corcoran (NUI, Maynooth) Cáit Keane (South Dublin County Council) Dr. Colm Harmon (UCD) Dr. Brian Nolan (ESRI) Mr. Paul Tansey (Economist) The Government also appoints the Chair and deputy Chair. |
Reconstitution of the NESF has recently been finalised. Members appointed during January and February 2004. |
|
National Statistics Board |
Professor Brendan Walsh (UCD) Chair Dr. Patricia O’Hara (Western Development Commission) Ms Mary Doyle (Assistant Secretary, Department of the Taoiseach) Mr. Derek Moran (Assistant Secretary, Department of Finance) Ms Paula Carey (ICTU Trade Union Pillar nominee) Mr. Ciaran Dolan (ICMSA, Farming Pillar nominee) Mr. Frank Cuneen (Business Pillar nominee) Mr. Donal Garvey, Director General of the Central Statistics Office is a member of the board ex officio. |
Reconstituted with effect from 9 February 2004. |
I can give the Taoiseach a gem of information. A report by the United Nations Development Fund for Women, published in May 2003, showed that Ireland lags seriously behind in the percentage of women in national Parliament and other representative positions. For instance, sub-Saharan African states such as Eritrea, Uganda and Mozambique have a higher female representation than Ireland.
The Deputy must ask a question. It is not appropriate to give information to the Taoiseach. The purpose of Question Time is to elicit information from the Taoiseach, so the Deputy should confine himself to a question.
At this rate it will take 370 years for the percentage of women in the Dáil to reach 50%. I hope the effort on this side of the House will bear some fruit inside a reasonable time. Is the Taoiseach aware that, ten years ago, the then Minister for Equality and Law Reform, Mervyn Taylor of the Labour Party, directed that State boards should appoint women to 40% of their positions? Today the average across Departments is just 29%, well below the target of 40% which is ten years old. Some State boards have no female representation. What action is the Taoiseach taking to address this? Does he plan to implement the recommendations of the National Women's Council of Ireland in its November 2002 report? Does the target of 40% representation by women on State boards still stand? Will the Taoiseach attempt to reach these targets during the course of this Administration?
The question refers specifically to the Department of the Taoiseach.
I do all I can to enforce the rules and continually press Ministers to do likewise. It is monitored by one of my ministerial colleagues. Women represent 37% of the National Statistics Board; 19% of the National Economic and Social Council, NESC; 42% of the National Economic and Social Forum; 40% of the Information Society Commission; 29.5% the National Centre for Partnership and Performance; 60% of the Law Reform Commission; and 14.3% of the International Financial Services Centre Clearing House Group.
As Deputy Kenny is aware my capacity to appoint members to the boards under my aegis is constrained by those selected by nominating bodies. All I can do is to press them and encourage them as I continually do with some difficulty. In some cases the level of representation by women is good and in others it is not so good. The International Financial Services Centre Clearing House Group represents specialist groups and membership of that board depends on availability of specialists. The women on that board are extremely helpful and give of their time very generously. While their representation at 14% is considerably below what I would like, those people are nominated by the industry.
While appointments are made to other boards not under my aegis, I continually try to ensure the target of 40% is achieved if not exceeded.
Does the Taoiseach agree that fundamental reform of the method of appointment of people to State boards is long overdue? Is he aware that the Central Bank and Financial Services Authority of Ireland Bill will establish the financial services ombudsman and other related bodies, including consumer panels and industry panels, which will result in an additional 50 or more appointments to State boards? Does the Taoiseach have an estimate of the number of people now serving on State boards? In my view it must run to many hundreds. It is all the more important to have a regularised process.
Would the Taoiseach not agree that we need a system that is open to all citizens with appointments based on suitability, ability and the level of information or application of the person? Would it not be preferable to have such an open and transparent system rather than the current system that is open to the accusation that it is only accessed by those who know somebody or as a sweetener for those who support particular political parties? The Taoiseach will have to agree——
It is not appropriate to give your view at this stage.
I am asking the Taoiseach a question.
As I pointed out to Deputy Kenny, the purpose of Question Time is to elicit information from the Taoiseach.
I am asking the Taoiseach——
The Deputy will want to give him time to answer as we are coming to the end of the time for questions to the Taoiseach. The Deputy should not make statements and should confine himself to questions.
Does the Taoiseach agree that the exposure by the "Prime Time" programme last week of the so-called "prison visiting boards" is a further indication of the type of abuses and shows the concern that exists in the wider public? Would the Taoiseach not agree that we need an advertised system, the criteria of qualification to be published, members of the public to be allowed to apply and suitable candidates interviewed? That is the correct way and I hope the Taoiseach will agree.
I can only answer for the boards for which I am responsible. It might help if we were to advertise for members of the National Statistics Board, the Law Reform Commission, the International Financial Services Centre Groups and the Information Society Commission. It might make it somewhat easier to get dedicated busy people with professional competence to give of their time as existing members do. Others who have been in Government before me will know that it is hard enough to get people to serve on the vast majority of boards and this is likely to get harder.
I do not agree with assertions that have been made outside the House, which come from those who are not informed about the knowledge and expertise required and did little to find out. Boards such as the National Statistics Board and the National Economic and Social Council are absolutely transparent as to their members. The State gives them responsibility. The NESC comprises a chairperson, deputy chairperson and approximately 60 members picked by the various pillars. The same applies to the NESF. The National Statistics Board normally comprises professionals. The Information Society Commission mainly comprises non-political people who give of their time. While I am sure they vote on election day, they are people from large companies. The Law Reform Commission is made up of legal experts. Half of the appointees to the International Financial Services Centre Clearing House Group are not from Ireland.
It is getting increasingly harder to get people to serve on boards for effectively nothing or what they would earn in a very short period of time. They are dedicated and give of their time only to get pilloried for their effort.
It is quite frustrating to hear the Taoiseach talk about how difficult it is to get people and then to say he sees no point in advertising. This is a contradiction in terms. Would the Taoiseach agree there is nothing to be lost by advertising the positions? People who are capable, patriotic enough and in any way skilled should make their names known for a selection procedure. I share the Taoiseach's belief concerning women or men with family commitments and there may also be other factors. Has there been any evaluation of the factors that give rise to the difficulty people have with involvement in State boards apart from the fact that they are not advertised and kept within a circle of people who know each other? Would the Taoiseach not consider it preferable to have advertising, which would at least provide a cross-section of society who may be unknown to the Government?
I do not like saying this but many of these boards comprise Oireachtas Members. It is hard enough to get us to participate in these boards.
The Taoiseach should not mind that.
This is an important point. This is totally open and transparent and Oireachtas Members are on these boards when we can get people to participate. Does the Deputy really believe that people who kindly give of their expertise and time to the National Statistics Board, such as Professor Brendan Walsh, the chairman, or Dr. Patricia O'Hara would submit their names following an advertisement for board membership in the newspapers? The Deputy should get real for God's sake. They will not do so. The same applies to those from AIB Capital Markets or Irish Life who are members of the IFSC Clearing House Group.
The Taoiseach is nominating them.
These are experts in their field who are picked not because of their political persuasion, but because we can get them to do the job. On most State boards we are increasingly trying to get international and local representatives. I do not think there is much political chicanery regardless of who is in Government. I reject that suggestion. I reject also the suggestion that people who are politicians or who were politicians in the past should not be on boards. The House knows my view on such matters. I believe we would be far better off if there were more politicians or former politicians on boards.
Would the Taoiseach accept that he is presenting himself as a helpless person on the sidelines? Does he accept that when it comes to participation of women in positions of power and authority, nothing will change unless it is made to change and that part of the reason there is such an imbalance is that there is so much lip service and so little action? Surely the Taoiseach is aware that when it comes to women participating on State boards he can instruct Ministers to ensure that this happens?
Second, not only are women willing to go on these boards, databases are being compiled, the most recent of which I am aware being the Irish forum of the International Women's Federation, where women are offering to serve not just on State boards but on the boards of private companies as well. The Taoiseach must either prove he is serious about this or admit that there is no commitment in Government to ensure that inequality regarding women will be addressed.
The databases mentioned by the Deputy are used by Government and many good people have been recruited from them. The boards to which I refer, which are representative of the social partners and other agencies, insist on putting forward numbers. We are forever asking them to ensure balance. The national statistic is that 37% of board members are women, but the National Economic and Social Forum statistic is 19%. That is made up of the social partner groups and various organisations within society that nominate a number of people. They do not, in some cases, put forward women, and that is why the proportion of women on these boards is 19%
That is why the Taoiseach must ask them to do so.
It is an endless battle to try to get them to put forward women for appointment to boards. This has happened not only in recent times, it has been going on for years in some organisations. At least when the Government is appointing a board of, say, ten people it can insist on having a balance. It is extremely difficult to get the social partners and pillars in society to put forward the required number of women even when we delay them. We use the database to select women for State boards and commercial semi-State boards, and it is very useful. We have selected several people who would not have been known either personally or in terms of Government, but who had extremely good CVs and who put their names forward, and they have proved themselves. In the past two days the Minister for Transport has done the same, although I am not sure if he has yet announced the board. Nobody knew the person in question, but we are glad to make such appointments.