Thursday, 21 Oct 2004

Priority Questions.

Telecommunications Services.

Questions (1, 2)

Bernard J. Durkan

Question:

1 Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources the circumstances surrounding the recent discontinuation of television and telecommunications services to thousands of homes in the Dublin area; if the health and safety factors have been identified which brought about this situation; if similar technology is being used in other households; the extent to which he has been in touch with ComReg on this issue; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25929/04]

Oral answers (31 contributions)

Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey)

Before I start, I offer my congratulations to the Deputy on his promotion to Opposition spokesperson in this area. I look forward to working with him into the future.

I have no function in the matter raised by the Deputy. This is a matter for the Commission for Communications Regulations, ComReg. ComReg has statutory independence in the exercise of its functions. Responsibility for the protection and promotion of consumer interests for electronic communications networks and services and the integrity of the network rests with ComReg under the European Communities (Electronic Communications Networks and Services) (Universal Service and Users Rights) Regulation, SI 308 of 2003. ComReg is mandated to ensure a high level of protection for consumers in their dealings with suppliers and to investigate complaints from consumers regarding the supply of, and access to, electronic communications services, networks and associated facilities. ComReg understands that the company is concerned that the equipment which it installed in customers' homes may, in certain circumstances, constitute a potential safety hazard through overheating.

The manufacturers of the equipment issued a press release stating that, based on the evidence available to them, the probable cause of these incidents was the improper installation of the equipment. The company is required to protect its consumers and it must immediately offer an alternative provider and without exposing them to additional costs associated with such a transfer. I understand that ComReg has met the company and instructed it to take immediate steps to minimise the impact of the interruption of its customers' telephone service, in addition to considering issues concerning the equipment.

Specific issues which ComReg has immediately required of the company include establishing a dedicated freefone telephone number so that affected customers can obtain information on the issue and be provided with advice and assistance in restoring telephone service; discussing with other telephone service providers the possibility of similar facilities for affected customers; establishing call forwarding or call divert facilities so that customers can continue to receive incoming calls made using the existing number; and meeting the direct costs of the above which customers would otherwise have to pay. I understand that ComReg will continue to closely monitor the situation to ensure that the company in question complies with its obligations.

Mr. Durkan

I thank the Minister for his good wishes. I return them to him and extend them to his colleague, the Minister for State, Deputy Gallagher. It is the first time we have faced each other in this position across the floor. We would not want to get along too well together, however.

I feel that there is an inadequacy in the Minister's answers and I ask him to address the following questions. There is a health and safety issue that has not been adequately addressed because there is no reference to the possibility that similar equipment has been installed in other houses. This may well present a health or fire hazard. What does the Minister propose to do about that? Does he intend to give instructions to ComReg or anyone else in the matter?

What was the degree to which the hazard became known and what action was taken? Was immediate action taken, or was there a delay? What recompense has been made to the consumers? I recognise what the Minister has said about ComReg having full responsibility for the consumer, but that is a delegated responsibility from this House. To what extent have consumers' concerns been addressed in terms of inconvenience and discomfort, as well as the health, safety and fire issues?

An Ceann Comhairle

The Chair is reluctant to intervene on Priority Questions, but I point out to the House that the Chair ruled out a number of questions that were specifically the responsibility of ComReg. It would be inappropriate for the Chair to then allow those questions as supplementaries to this question. The first question raised by the Deputy was in order.

Mr. N. Dempsey

One of the questions was on how quickly the action was taken. The action was taken almost immediately by ComReg. I am sure the Deputy has heard this from people directly involved, but the initial notification by the company of this problem was not a classic example of good customer relations. It is not satisfactory just to send a letter of notification out to state that there is a problem and that the service is being withdrawn due to possible health and safety issues. I hope that the company will have learned from that. When ComReg became aware of this, it moved very quickly and issued directions to the company on what it needed to do. I listed them all and I will not repeat them because of time constraints.

There is a dispute on whether this is a health and safety issue. NTL states that there is, but the company that provides the equipment states that it is the way it is installed. The company has taken the view that it is not taking any chances and we should commend it for that, even if it did not go about it in a very good way. ComReg has made known its views on compensation to the company itself. In the end, customers will have recourse either to ComReg or to a legal route if they are not satisfied with compensation or with the response they get.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will accept a very brief supplementary from the Deputy.

Mr. Durkan

The Ceann Comhairle knows me of old, and I am very brief. Does the Minister wish to have a report on the actual circumstances surrounding the cessation of service to find out if it was a health and safety issue or some other issue? Will he be in the position to get clarification? Notwithstanding the responsibilities that ComReg has in this matter, this is a delegated responsibility given by this House and by legislation. The responsibility does not rest entirely with ComReg, there is a need for the Minister to report fully to the House on the matter when he has that information available.

Mr. N. Dempsey

It is a delegated function and I do not intend to take back delegated functions every time something happens. However, in deference to what the Deputy said, we have been kept informed and we can make inquiries from ComReg on this. If the Deputy wants us to get a report, I am sure we can do that, or I am sure that ComReg will be willing to provide a report directly to the House. I will request that in this instance.

Thomas P. Broughan

Question:

2 Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources if he will request a full investigation and early report by ComReg into the scandal of split or paired lines and network performance issues on the national telecommunications landline network; his views on the performance of Eircom in discharging its role as universal service provider, especially on the provision of land lines and broadband to new residential estates; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25837/04]

Mr. N. Dempsey

I am responsible for policy on the telecommunications sector. The responsibility for regulation of the sector rests with the Commission for Communications Regulations, ComReg. Responsibility for the quality of telecommunications networks is a matter in the first instance for the network operators. The detailed operation and planning of telecommunication networks is also a matter for each operator. ComReg monitors the service level agreements that are put in place between operators and customers. I engage with and request information from Departments, ComReg and operators in the sector on an ongoing basis in discharging my policy role regarding these issues.

The provision of a telephone connection is a matter in the first instance for Eircom as the designated universal service provider operating in a fully liberalised market. There is no obligation, however, on Eircom, as designated USO provider, to supply broadband services. The regulations provide for functional Internet access only. Eircom needs to improve the transparency of the process it uses in answering requests for the provision of telephone and Internet access.

As the regulator in this area, the Commission for Communications Regulation recently concluded discussions with Eircom on the matter and on what constitutes functional Internet access. The discussions will be followed by a public consultation on the proposed revision of the conditions to be imposed by the commission on Eircom as the universal service provider, with particular regard to what constitutes reasonable access and the definition of functional Internet access. Any such proposed conditions will require my consent as Minister.

Mr. Broughan

I join Deputy Durkan in congratulating the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources on his appointment. I wish him well. I also congratulate the Minister of State, Deputy Gallagher, who responded to a matter I raised on the Adjournment last night. I also congratulate my old sparring partner from the Committee of Public Accounts, Deputy Durkan, who will join me again in trying to invigilate a Fianna Fáil Government.

Is it not the case that the Minister, Deputy Noel Dempsey, was dropped in it by the Taoiseach during the recent reshuffle? The problems with broadband roll-out probably constitute the single greatest scandal in Irish economic life. The Minister informed the Telecommunications and Internet Federation this morning that he has a target of 400,000 domestic broadband lines. If he is to achieve his target or to reach the European broadband average, as was the intention of the previous Minister, Deputy Dermot Ahern, Esat, Eircom and the third company will have to enrol people at a rate of between 6,000 and 10,000 each week. I understand that approximately 2,000 new customers come forward each week. Our current level of broadband development will not come close to meeting the target set by the Minister.

There is grave disquiet about the quality test indicators. Does the Minister accept that at least 30% of households will never get broadband because their telephone lines cannot be enabled? When the stakes were originally erected, the lines were placed on splitters or paired lines. The Government's broadband drive is pretty hopeless for that reason. A significant proportion of households and businesses will find it difficult to become broadband enabled. Our colleagues in the Visitors Gallery reported on the famous Pittsburgh project some months ago. The project involved Dr. Anthony O'Reilly and his colleagues taking over the Eircom company.

An Ceann Comhairle

Does the Deputy have a question? The Minister may not have time to reply.

Mr. Broughan

Does the Minister accept the reports which were given to the financial interests behind the takeover of Eircom as part of the Pittsburgh project? The reports indicated that this country's telecommunications network is a shambles because it is decaying desperately.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy is taking up all the time available for this question by making a statement.

Mr. Broughan

They suggested that investment is not possible.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call the Minister.

Mr. Broughan

May I make a final point?

An Ceann Comhairle

There is no time for a final point. Six minutes have been allocated for this question but just 50 seconds are remaining.

Mr. Broughan

I will make the point in my follow-up question.

An Ceann Comhairle

There will not be a follow-up question during the time for this question.

Mr. Broughan

I will be brief.

An Ceann Comhairle

No.

Mr. N. Dempsey

I am delighted that the Taoiseach dropped me into the Department of Communications, Marine and Natural Resources. I do not have a difficulty with it. One will face various challenges in all Departments. I am pleased to accept this challenge, just as I was pleased when I was appointed to my previous ministerial positions.

I do not agree with Deputy Broughan's assertion that we will never reach the targeted level of broadband penetration because of the use of splitters and carriers in our system. Approximately 128,000 telephone lines in this country, or 8% of the total, are splitters or carriers. I do not accept the contention that we cannot reach the target figure.

Mr. Broughan

Where did the Minister get his figures?

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy should allow the Minister to speak without interruption.

Mr. N. Dempsey

I accept that it is a challenging target. I based the figures I cited this morning on the intention of two telecommunications operators to have 100,000 broadband customers each, as well as on other work which has been done, such as the Government's metropolitan area networks project and the group broadband work which is being rolled out. The Government's target is not only feasible, it is also achievable. I have asked the industry to aim for a higher figure of 500,000.

Mr. Broughan

By when?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I have asked the industry to enrol 500,000 customers by 2007.

Mr. Broughan

I would like to ask a tiny final question.

An Ceann Comhairle

We have dealt with just two questions in 15 minutes.

Mr. Broughan

I want to ask the Minister a single brief follow-up question.

An Ceann Comhairle

Sorry, Deputy, not one question.

Mr. Broughan

I will ask him later.

Energy Resources.

Questions (3)

Eamon Ryan

Question:

3 Mr. Eamon Ryan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources the analysis the Government has undertaken to investigate when global oil production is likely to peak; and the implications of such a peak for future energy prices. [25915/04]

Oral answers (8 contributions)

Mr. N. Dempsey

I have been asked when global oil production may peak against the background of the conventional notion of what is meant by "peak oil". The determination of the date and impact of the peak and decline of the world's oil production is a matter of worldwide concern. It is the focus of many, often conflicting, research studies, views and opinions. While I have not undertaken specific analysis of world oil production, I support and have access to such research because Ireland is a member of the European Union and the International Energy Agency. I understand that the agency will publish the 2004 edition of its World Energy Outlook on 26 October next. The implications of global "peak oil", whenever it occurs, on prevailing energy costs will be determined to a significant extent by the energy mix on the global demand side at the time.

In Ireland, as in other economies, the magnitude of the direct effect of a given oil price increase will depend on the degree of dependence of the various sectors of the economy on imported oil, the ability of end users to reduce consumption, the ability to switch away from oil and the impact of world oil prices on the cost to businesses and consumers of imported goods and raw materials. Reliance on oil must be eliminated over time, however, if global economic development and living standards are to be sustained. While there may be new oil finds and improvements in extraction technologies, the environmental impact and the finite nature of fossil fuels such as oil are key drivers of research into sustainable and renewable energy sources.

Mr. Eamon Ryan

I wish the Minister well in his new and challenging position. He said in his response that the Government follows the advice of the International Energy Agency and that there are many conflicting views in this regard. Is he familiar with the views of an expert on this matter, Dr. Colin Campbell, a former geologist with some of the major companies, who is based in west Cork? He believes that the International Energy Agency has not done its job properly because it has failed to conduct detailed field-by-field analysis of the remaining oil stocks. He argues that the markets reflect the increasing international concern that we may have reached peak oil production and may be moving towards a position of decline. Does the Minister believe that recent price increases were caused by the occurrence of such a peak in oil production or the prevailing geopolitical environment?

There is no obvious alternative to the significant use of oil in sectors such as agriculture and transport because cars will not run on biodiesel or hydrogen for the next two to three decades at least. How high will oil prices have to rise before the Government starts to review public policy in such areas? Will the price have to reach $70 or $100 per barrel? If the price of oil continues to increase, at what point will a change in Government policy be triggered?

Mr. N. Dempsey

The Deputy and I agree that there is a great deal of conflicting evidence in this regard. When I read the information in my notes and scanned the Internet quickly to learn more about this subject, it struck me that there are as many opinions as there are experts. I am familiar with the work of Dr. Campbell who is not regarded as the only expert in this area. He has a particular point of view which may be valid. I do not think it is generally accepted that we have reached a peak in oil production.

The Government's overall energy policy obviously involves trying to ensure that we have security and diversity of energy sources. We depend largely on oil and gas at present, obviously. We obviously have gas. Our current target is for 13% of energy to come from alternative sources and that will be constantly reviewed. In the event of arriving at a situation where there is consensus that we are at peak oil use, that would obviously galvanise everyone into examining alternatives. At present, we are reviewing it continually and part of my job over the next three years will be to ensure that we continue to support alternative energy sources to make sure that we are not dependent on any single source of energy.

Mr. Eamon Ryan

It is only after the fact that we will know when the peak has occurred and that may be too late. We know for certain that it will be in the next five or ten years. It is a small point whether it is now or in ten years time. Is the Minister concerned at the comment of the OPEC president this summer when reacting to the price crisis when he said the problem was that there was no more supply? If OPEC is saying there is no more supply and the demand will continue to increase next year——

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy has made his point.

Mr. Eamon Ryan

——does that not raise concerns in the Minister's mind?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I would be concerned were that borne out, but we are awaiting the world energy outlook report, which will be published on 26 October. However, the conventional wisdom at this stage is that resources of conventional crude oil are adequate to meet demands until 2030. There is obviously a different view on that point.

Mr. Eamon Ryan

Is that the Government's view?

Fisheries Protection.

Questions (4)

Bernard J. Durkan

Question:

4 Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources the way in which his Department first had its attention drawn to alleged commercial fishing irregularities at Killybegs or other locations; the action or actions taken on foot of the information; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25930/04]

Oral answers (11 contributions)

Mr. N. Dempsey

The matter referred to was first brought to the attention of the Department by an individual who first wrote to the Department on 26 July 2004, stating that illegal fishing was taking place. The Department received that letter on 28 July and responded on 29 July seeking documentation and offering to meet the complainant.

Meetings were held with the complainant on 2 September and 9 September by departmental officials. The officials examined the matter and the issues arising and brought it to my attention on 1 October 2004. The complainant sent a letter to the Department dated 4 October, which was received on 11 October and which indicated that the complainant had also written on the matter to 12 European fisheries Ministers, the European Commission and the European Court of Justice in early October. The allegations made were considered to be very serious. I agreed with the Secretary General of the Department that he raise the issues with the Garda Síochána and he wrote to it advising it of the matter and requesting it to investigate it. He also offered to make all information on the matter in the Department's possession available to the Garda Síochána. The European Commission has also been formally advised of the matter and of the action taken.

I assure the Deputy that I take matters relating to illegal activity of any kind very seriously. The allegations in the letter are regarded as very serious concerning the responsibilities of fishermen regarding fisheries law, the Department regarding fisheries control and the legal obligations of Ireland regarding control under the EU Common Fisheries Policy. I understand the Garda Síochána is investigating the matter and the Deputy will appreciate that it would not be appropriate for me to give further details of the complaint for fear that it might prejudice any investigation taking place.

Mr. Durkan

Perhaps the Minister might provide further clarification. In his reply he said that the Department was contacted on 26 July and again on 4 October. With whom in the Department was contact made on 26 July, what discussion or debate took place and what action was taken following that debate? Did the subsequent letter on 4 October contain a reference to the fact that little or no action had taken place since 26 July?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I do not have the letters with me. However, from memory and from having looked at the file, the answer is "No". I believe the letter of 4 October appeared in one of the newspapers. To my recollection, it did not make any reference to the fact that no action had been taken. The gentleman concerned wrote the letter on 26 July. It arrived in the Department on 28 July.

Mr. Durkan

To whom was it addressed?

Mr. N. Dempsey

It was addressed to the Department and replied to by Mr. Kinneen, the sea fisheries control manager in the Department. The response on 29 July stated that the Department would view the allegations extremely seriously and that, whatever way the complainant wanted to — I presume that I may use the gentleman's name, since it has appeared in the newspapers?

An Ceann Comhairle

If it has appeared in the newspapers, that is all right.

Mr. N. Dempsey

It is Mr. Cannon. The Department replied saying that it viewed the allegations very seriously and offered to meet him or make some arrangement whereby he might send information to it by post. At the end of that letter of 29 July, it was stated that Mr. Kinneen would be going on holiday and that, if a letter arrived in the meantime, it would be dealt with immediately upon his return. The next document in the file, for 2 September, is a note of a meeting between Mr. Cannon and the Department, contact having obviously been made some time in August. A further meeting was arranged on 9 September. That meeting finished on the understanding that the Department needed documentary evidence and that, as soon as that was available, it would act.

The next contact was on 4 October, stating that a letter had already gone to the various Ministries in Europe and to the Commission. There was nothing after the meeting of 9 September. No further information was provided to the Department — no files, copies or anything else. Mr.Cannon refused to hand over the file. Although he allowed some information to be noted from it at the meetings, he would not allow any photocopies to be made. He wanted to hold onto it and said that it was his bargaining chip and that he would not hand it over. The Department had no documentary evidence of the allegations other than Mr. Cannon's word up until 4 October, when he said that he was sending the information to Europe.

Mr. Durkan

We all appreciate the need to preserve the good name and integrity of the fishing industry. That naturally entails early investigation of any complaint that might do anything to damage it. Is the Minister aware that it is alleged that, when Mr. Cannon first made his complaints to the Department, little or nothing was done and that it was in frustration that he subsequently made his complaints to another office, namely, the European Commission? Perhaps the Minister might also confirm whether, immediately after receiving the complaint, officials from his Department or anyone representing his office went to meet the complainant given the serious nature of the allegations being made. If not, why not? In the meantime, has the Minister, an official or anyone representing his Department made contact with the bodies, agencies or individuals involved? If so, to what extent?

Mr. N. Dempsey

It is exactly as I described to the Deputy. The gentleman contacted the Department by letter on 26 July. The letter was received by the Department on 28 July. A letter dated 29 July was immediately dispatched to Mr. Cannon. At no stage have I received a letter, nor am I aware of anyone except Mr. Cannon contacting anyone in the Department to say that the letter of 1 October would be sent to the Commission because the Department had not done anything for him. That is the first that I have heard of that allegation. If the Deputy has anything to back that up, I will certainly investigate it, but that was not the complaint made. Meetings were held with Mr. Cannon on 2 September. He wanted to raise other personal matters. This was the second reason he gave for raising the matter with officials in the Department. A further meeting was arranged for 9 September and that meeting finished on the basis that the Department needed some documentary evidence to investigate this. It was left open to Mr. Cannon to return to the Department but he did not do so. He wrote directly to the Commission.

Mr. Durkan

Did the Minister or his Department seek corroborative evidence when the Minister first became aware of the allegations?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I became aware of the allegations on 1 October in a written report made to me. I put a note on it to say that I presumed the matter was being followed up. On 11 October we got the word that the file was gone to Brussels. In the absence of documentary evidence it was very difficult to start an investigation. That was part of the difficulty.

Postal Services.

Questions (5)

Thomas P. Broughan

Question:

5 Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources the position with regard to restructuring An Post in view of the company’s recent announcement that it recorded operating losses of €43 million in 2003; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [25838/04]

Oral answers (3 contributions)

Mr. N. Dempsey

Deputies will be aware of the precarious financial situation my predecessor outlined in some detail to the House on 23 March with regard to An Post. On top of losses in 2001, the company lost approximately €60 million between 2002 and 2003 and has forecast further losses this year.

Losses on this scale and of this duration are simply unsustainable. It is not in the interests of the company, its employees or customers that the situation remains unchecked. If the company is to return to profitability, it needs to be restructured. If this is to be a success, it is crucial that all stakeholders play a constructive part in this process.

The current industrial relations issues in An Post have been simmering for some time. The problems there are long-standing and deep-seated and it is clear that the solution to the current issues must put the company on a long-term sustainable financial and operational footing. The full scale of the financial problems facing An Post became clear to my Department during the second half of 2002 and to the then management of An Post some time later.

It is important that all stakeholders fully recognise the seriousness of the financial position and the threat this represents to the future of the company. Once the scale of the financial difficulties became clear during 2003 a recovery strategy was approved by the board and presented to my Department. The strategy sets out a roadmap to return An Post to profitability by 2005. It includes significant restructuring and almost 1,700 job losses. However, buy-in from the unions is crucial to agreement and implementation. This has not been an easy process. Change is never easy.

Following the industrial dispute last March, the Labour Relations Commission put forward a framework to resolve the differences between management and unions. Both parties have been engaged in protracted negotiations under the auspices of the Labour Relations Commission. It is expected that these talks will conclude shortly in the Labour Relations Commission and that outstanding issues will be referred to the Labour Court for determination.

It is important that a company such as An Post continues to be a strong player in the Irish postal market and provides quality services to customers. The recovery strategy approved by the board of An Post sets out the basis on which the company, in partnership with the trade unions, can move forward. While my Department is more than willing to assist in any way possible to facilitate an agreement, the responsibility for agreeing and implementing the recovery strategy rests primarily with the board, the management and unions in An Post.

Mr. Broughan

In responding to Question No. 2, the Minister referred to a figure of 8% of paired lines or splitters. I would be grateful if he would investigate that and ask ComReg for the facts. I believe it has them but has not published them.

Does the Minister still receive monthly reports on the progress of An Post? The Minister's predecessor came into this House very startled a few years ago, having discovered the ongoing losses. He initiated a process of receiving monthly board reports and a process of director training. Has the Minister any input into that?

Does the Minister consider it outrageous that An Post's 11,000 employees and its 8,000 pensioners have not got a penny of their increases due under Sustaining Progress? They did not get the 3% increase on 1 November 2003 nor the 2% rise on 1 August 2004. Up to now there is no indication that they will get the 2% increase next December. If not, in terms of increases they will be a cumulative 7% behind the Minister and myself, who get those increases. Is it not outrageous that workers on very modest incomes are treated in this manner by the management of An Post and, perhaps worse, that pensioners who have given up to 40 years of service, former civil servants, are being treated in the same way?

The Minister delivered a brief report on the current discussions. I understand that the national implementation body under the good auspices of Peter Cassells is involved in carrying through consultation between management and the workforce to develop a final transformation through partnership. Does the Minister expect a positive and early result from that so that what most people regard as an era of confrontation imposed by the current management of An Post will end and that recognising the problems in the area, with technology changes, deregulation and so on, we can move towards having a modern postal service?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I share the Deputy's view of what we need in terms of the future of An Post, namely, a modern postal service. That is achievable on a partnership basis by management and workers working together and on the basis that all meet the commitments they make, which is important. I do not want to delve into the discussions taking place on the basis that certain elements which were supposed to be delivered were not delivered. Sustaining Progress is about delivering change and about payments being made to workers on the basis of that change being delivered, as I know from my previous ministerial job. I hope that both sides will live up to their commitments with regard to those agreements. The Labour Relations Commission talks should finish shortly. If there are matters that must then be referred to the Labour Court I believe they will be taken there quickly.

The Minister of State has laid out the position regarding An Post pensioners. I have great sympathy with the pensioners who are out of the system and are not involved with this dispute, yet suffering as a result of it. With goodwill on all sides, that matter could be resolved quickly.

I also share the Deputy's view that it is time to get rid of some of the out-dated and out-moded practices in An Post. We need a company where management and unions work in partnership to provide the best possible service. That is achievable and when we reach the end of the latest round of talks, some of the old practices and attitudes on both sides will have gone and we can move forward.