Dáil Éireann Debate, Thursday - 24 November 2016
3. Deputy Dara Calleary asked the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform the budget that has been assigned to the public service pay commission, PSPC; if he will provide its final terms of reference and its proposed timeline; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [36521/16]
View answerThe PSPC was a part of last May's confidence and supply agreement, but we could not have anticipated the serious situation facing us now. Its role is even more important. What are its budget and terms of reference? What is the timeline for its work and has that timeline been reviewed in light of the current uncertainty around public service pay?
On 18 October at the conclusion of a period of consultation with stakeholders in the Lansdowne Road agreement, the Government approved the establishment of the PSPC to advise it on public service pay. For its initial report, the commission will be asked to consider the evolution of pay trends in the public and private sectors based on published data and a comparison of pay rates for identifiable groups within the public service with prevailing non-public sector market rates and international rates, having due regard to the national finances.
In reaching its findings, the commission should also have regard to the superannuation and other benefits applying in the public service; security of tenure where it applies; pay comparisons taking account of relevant characteristics; the reform agenda; evidence on recruitment and retention within the public service; other relevant matters, including impact on national competitiveness and the sustainability of the national finances; and any other issue determined by the Government. The PSPC is due to publish its first report in the second quarter of next year.
Details of the PSPC's budget will be set out soon in the Revised Estimates Volume and will fall under the Vote for the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform. While the commission will provide valuable inputs into the negotiation process, the Government and representatives of employees will retain their right to negotiate directly with one another. Having met the commission on Monday, I am even more certain of the valuable work that it will do.
I do not doubt the value of that work. There will be experienced heads around the table and that experience is needed now more than ever. When the Minister met the commission on Monday, did he discuss the current situation with it and seek advice based on its members' experiences in the private and public sectors as to how he might steer through this situation?
The timeline is admirable, but the train is about to leave the station and the PSPC might be left behind. Given the experience of its members and their ability to do deals and manage situations, it would be a shame if they remained apart from the current challenges facing the Minister. He should use their experience and views.
Regarding what the Minister wants the commission to do, the second quarter is any time between now and the end of June 2017. He then expects to move into a budgetary discussion and a negotiation with the unions ahead of budget 2018. It is an ambitious timescale, particularly given the external pressures. Does he expect the timescale to be maintained? What timescale does he anticipate for pay talks with the unions?
We could not have a discussion with the commission without a recognition of the context in which we find ourselves, but I did not raise the matter with it directly because it was never envisaged that the pay commission would deal with issues in the Lansdowne Road agreement. Its terms of reference relate to what will happen after that agreement and the future sustainability of public pay.
As to whether I asked its members for advice, I am not lacking for advice. The challenge is working with everyone to chart a way forward.
I thank the Deputy for his comments on the commission's experience. We have appointed a good group with a mixture of skills and experiences that will serve the State well.
The timescale will be the second quarter, but I will not confirm anything further at this point because I must hold additional discussions with the commission. It will be a demanding schedule, but I first had to undergo a period of consultation to get the commission established before then selecting a panel that would be acceptable to all and recognised in the way that the Deputy has just done.
I do not deny that the Minister is not lacking in advice, but what he does with it and who is giving it seem to be the problem.
I was intrigued by a comment made by the president of SIPTU, Mr. Jack O'Connor, when he was issuing various threats to the Minister that he did not know anything about the PSPC. The commission formed part of the confidence and supply agreement, and one of the reasons for delay in establishing it was the need for the Minister to consult various players in a public process. Did SIPTU involve itself in that public consultation process on the establishment of the PSPC? Has the Minister plans to review the commission's terms of reference in the light of the uncertainty surrounding public service pay?
I have no plans to review the terms of reference. As to SIPTU's role, parties to the Lansdowne Road agreement were required to have the opportunity to consult and give their views on the pay commission, which took up a fair bit of the summer period.
I do not know whether Mr. O'Connor is aware of it; I will not comment on that. Everybody was given an opportunity to give their input into the process. If there had not been a need for such a period, this body might have been set up a little quicker but I did need to go through a consultation period, which I wanted to do, because there would be no point putting in place a mechanism which would then be undermined by people who might use it as an input. It is now clear that if people were not aware of it then, everybody is certainly fully aware of it now. I am certain the role it will play will be in the aftermath of where we are now. Where we are now is a matter for the Government and for those who represent employees or who work in various public services. It is for that reason that we are engaging with the Irish Congress of Trade Unions.
will the Minister confirm that a replacement has been appointed for Oonagh Buckley who did great work in the Department and is now heading up the Workplace Relations Commission? That post holder will, effectively, be the lead civil servant in charge of the public service.
Yes, I can. A person has just been appointed and he and his team will play the lead role in the discussions to which the Deputy referred, with me, the Secretary General of my Department and the senior team there. I will be happy to confirm the details to the Deputy later.
