Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 19 February 2019
47. Deputy John Brady asked the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection if she is satisfied that all issues relating to illness benefit have been resolved; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [8288/19]
View answerThe new system for illness benefit payments has caused massive problems since it was first rolled out in the second half of 2018. Many issues had been flagged before Christmas, in October and November. Have they all been resolved at this stage? Just before Christmas the Minister gave us a categorical assurance that they would all be resolved and that there would be no more problems. Is that now the case?
As the Deputy is aware, payment issues arose under the illness benefit schemes last year when my Department transferred administration of the scheme from an old legacy IT payments system to the new core business IT platform which is managing many of its other scheme payments. At the time I expressed my apologies to all of those who were affected, of whom there were far too many. I am very happy to do so again today. It should not have happened and we can do better. My Department has since been working hard to resolve the issues and ensure claims are processed and paid promptly. We have made good progress in that regard, with payment levels in the past few months being maintained at the expected norms for the time of the year. The telephone helpline and call handling performance system has also been addressed because it endured major stress because of the numbers calling us. It is now back to normal levels, although customers may still experience some delays owing to call volumes at particular times, perhaps during the flu season and so on.
There was an increase in the number of claims for illness benefit in January, but it reflected the typical annual increase at the time of year owing to seasonal illnesses.
Currently, people who are due a payment and whose certificates and claims are in order receive their payment promptly. It is important to note, as I have a number of times before, that there have been and will always be cases in which people's payments are legitimately stopped, paused or delayed for a variety of reasons, including the late submission of medical certificates. In addition and as was always the case, human errors can be made from time to time by departmental staff or applicants and it is up to us to ensure we rectify those in as timely a manner as possible. This is to be expected in a scheme that processes between 9,000 and 10,000 certificates a day. I am satisfied, given that we are processing 50,000 certificates into payment every week in line with the normal level established over many years, that such issues are normal processing issues. While I would obviously prefer that every application was administered correctly in the first instance, we are only human and 100% perfection is not always attainable. However, my Department is learning from the recent challenges and is constantly looking to improve its services.
Additional information not given on the floor of the House
As ever, people who experience an urgent financial need while awaiting an illness benefit payment can apply to my Department's community welfare service to receive an interim payment and should contact the relevant local Intreo centre in that regard.
While I hear what the Minister says, illness benefit is still a mess and causing untold problems for people out there. These are not isolated cases. Not a day goes by without someone contacting my constituency offices on the problems he or she is experiencing. There are many cases. Yesterday, a man came to my clinic who has been in receipt of illness benefit since 4 January 2019. On that date, he received a full payment whereas the week after he received a part payment. The following week he got no payment and the week after that he received three part payments to make up the full payment. Last week, he got a full payment. His certificates had been submitted well ahead of time and this is not an isolated incident. This is going on right across the State and it is an unmitigated mess. General practitioners, GPs, are hesitant to fill in the new forms, which have been rolled out to allow people to go beyond the week. That is despite the encouragement of patients by the Department to do so. Has the Minister engaged with GPs on the serious problem with the new forms?
I call the Minister.
What has the Minister done? Will she write to GPs?
Please, Deputy Brady. There are other Members who want to have an opportunity to ask questions.
I confirm that discussions with GP representatives on a move from paper to e-certification concluded successfully weeks ago. I expect e-certification to be introduced with GP co-operation later this year, which will improve services for clients and GPs significantly. The relationship between the Department and GPs is at an all-time high. If there are particular GPs in Bray or the Deputy's neck of the woods generally who have a difficulty, I ask him to give me their names. I will contact them to sort out any issues. In the main, we have 50,000 certificates coming in every week and are bang on target to the level we were at this time last year and in the years before. While there may be cases of delayed payment or of extra or double payments in a particular week on foot of the way the system currently works, there are no more and no fewer such cases than there were one or five years ago.
I call the final supplementary.
We have approximately 90 applications per week which feature some error or difficulty in the interaction out of 50,000.
The Minister will have another minute. I call the final supplementary.
That is exactly within the norms we have always had.
A final supplementary, Deputy Brady.
The Minister knows that people who get illness benefit are very ill. They include cancer patients and people with terminal illnesses. To not know from week to week what payment will come in, if it comes in at all, is a problem. While I appreciate that staff within the illness benefit section of the Department do tremendous work and certainly do not blame them, the new system that was rolled out to streamline and improve things has actually caused an unmitigated disaster. It has left an absolute mess in its wake. It has not succeeded. In previous discussions, the Minister has said the system was due to be extended to other social welfare payments. Does she still intend to roll the system out to other payments when there are still problems here? If it is rolled out, it will cause an unmitigated disaster.
The Deputy's definition of "unmitigated disaster" and the reality of the incredibly hard-working people providing the illness benefit service in my Department are poles apart. I have told the Deputy that we are taking in more than 50,000 certificates every week. If even 1% of those people have a difficulty, the Deputy will focus his attention there, rather than on the 99% success rate on which most people would focus. I have told the Deputy that the system is being operated by humans, including those applying, GPs submitting certificates on their behalf and the staff receiving the applications, and that there will be mistakes. There will be times that a medical certificate which was supposed to arrive on a Monday does not come in until the Wednesday, which will mean a split payment the following week. The system is a new one. Either the Deputy has misunderstood me or I have misinformed the House, but no one is moving to a new system. The illness system is for the illness benefit payment scheme. While other schemes might be moving towards our new IT platform, that is just a matter of moving from one server to another. It does not affect the system's design or operation.
That is it.
I note to the Leas-Cheann Comhairle again that we have had a rough couple of months for staff and for those who receive payments since the changes last August.
Come on.
The people in my Department, including the extra staff who have been deployed and in particular those who have been there all day every day for 15 years-----
Minister, please.
-----have worked incredibly hard-----
I call Deputy Penrose to ask Question No. 48.
-----to make inroads into solving this problem. They have done an incredible job.
Minister, please. Other Members have tabled questions.
