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British-Irish Co-operation

Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 15 June 2021

Tuesday, 15 June 2021

Questions (1, 2, 3, 4)

Brendan Smith

Question:

1. Deputy Brendan Smith asked the Taoiseach if legacy issues were discussed during his recent meeting with Prime Minister Johnson. [27628/21]

View answer

Brendan Smith

Question:

2. Deputy Brendan Smith asked the Taoiseach if the need to implement in full the Stormont House Agreement was discussed during his recent meeting with Prime Minister Johnson. [27629/21]

View answer

Bernard Durkan

Question:

3. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Taoiseach the outcome of discussions he has had with the British Prime Minister with regard to the impact of Brexit, the Northern Ireland protocol and the degree to which all parties have seen possibilities for resolution of outstanding issues arising from Brexit . [27952/21]

View answer

Alan Kelly

Question:

4. Deputy Alan Kelly asked the Taoiseach if he will report on his recent meeting with the UK Prime Minister. [29458/21]

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Oral answers (9 contributions)

I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 4, inclusive, together.

I met with the Prime Minister, Mr. Boris Johnson, in Chequers on Friday, 14 May. We had a constructive engagement across a number of issues. Our discussions focused on ways our two Governments can continue to work together to support all the institutions of the Good Friday Agreement and promote peace and prosperity on both a North-South and east-west basis. We also discussed issues around implementation of the Northern Ireland protocol and stressed the importance of addressing implementation issues in the agreed European Union-United Kingdom framework.

We discussed the long journey of the Ballymurphy families to achieve justice and vindicate the innocence of their loved ones. In that context, I emphasised the importance of the British Government responding to the families in a way that recognises the gravity of the findings of the inquiry, which categorically established that ten innocent people were killed. As well as discussing Ballymurphy specifically, Prime Minister Johnson and I spoke about legacy issues and how best to secure progress and answers for the many families who have been pursuing truth and justice for far too many years. These include the families of those killed in the Dublin and Monaghan bombings on 17 May 1974, the Dublin bombings of 1972 and 1973 and the bombing of Kay's Tavern in Dundalk, as well as that of Seamus Ludlow and the families of those killed in atrocities in Belturbet and elsewhere, all of whom the Government is fully committed to supporting in line with the programme for Government commitment and the three motions passed unanimously by Dáil Éireann.

I was clear with the Prime Minister that every family bereaved in the conflict should have access to an effective investigation and a process of justice, regardless of the perpetrator. The Stormont House Agreement framework allows for the crucial elements we need, namely, investigations, truth recovery, oral history, reconciliation and acknowledgement. While the Government is ready to engage and work with the British Government and the Northern Ireland parties in regard to any concerns around the aspects of the implementation of the Stormont House Agreement, I made clear that this must be a collaborative and collective process. I also made clear that unilateral action cannot be the basis of any sustainable way forward. We will continue to engage with the UK Government on this.

We also discussed British-Irish relations. We are both ambitious for the development of the next phase of the bilateral relationship, framed around a number of areas of common interest, including research and innovation, sport and tackling climate change. We had a good exchange on the response to the Covid-19 pandemic and the value of working together. The Prime Minister and I agreed to remain in close touch over the coming weeks.

I thank the Taoiseach for his reply. I am very glad both he and Prime Minister Johnson committed to supporting all the institutions of the Good Friday Agreement. The agreement must be implemented in all its aspects, with no cherry-picking of its provisions. It is very important that the Taoiseach raised a number of atrocities that were committed, including, unfortunately, some in my constituency, namely, the Belturbet bombing and the Monaghan bombings, as well as the Dublin bombings.

On many occasions in this House and in committees, I have repeated my call for a full, thorough and comprehensive investigation into the Belturbet bombing of December 1972. That appalling atrocity resulted in the death of two young teenagers, Geraldine O'Reilly from Belturbet and Patrick Stanley from Clara, County Offaly. Last September, the University of Nottingham provided information to me, through the work of Professor Edward Burke, which I put on the record of the House. I am very glad the Minister, Deputy McEntee, referred that information to An Garda Síochána for investigation. The work done by the University of Nottingham, involving research into state papers in Britain, clearly shows there was collusion by state forces in Northern Ireland with the UVF and other paramilitaries, which resulted in a bomb being brought across the Border from County Fermanagh into Belturbet that cost the lives of two young people and caused injuries to many more. Unfortunately, the perpetrators have never been brought to justice for that heinous crime. We need a comprehensive investigation in Northern Ireland into the atrocity. It happened nearly 50 years ago but it is never too late to get to the truth. I have campaigned along with the O'Reilly and Stanley families, who have made their case with great dignity despite their terrible grieving for the loss of their young family members. I am very glad the Taoiseach has raised this matter and I sincerely hope the information I put on the record of the House will be thoroughly investigated by the Northern Irish and British authorities.

In regard to the Dublin and Monaghan bombings, it is absolutely reprehensible that the British Government has not responded to the requests of this Parliament in July 2008, May 2011 and May 2016, when we, as a Dáil, unanimously passed motions calling on the British Government to give access to an independent international legal person to all files and papers pertaining to the Dublin and Monaghan bombings of 17 May 1974. The 47th anniversary of that desperate atrocity, when 33 people were killed and hundreds more injured, has just passed. The Taoiseach will agree it is absolutely scandalous that the British Government has not responded to the unanimous calls from this sovereign Parliament on three occasions for Britain to co-operate in a meaningful way and advance the investigation into an atrocity that resulted in the greatest number of deaths in a single day during the era of the Troubles on this island.

I thank the Taoiseach for his comprehensive reply. Does he remain satisfied regarding the sincerity of the British Government in undertaking to ensure that the letter and spirit of the Northern protocol are accepted and implemented in full? There are things happening on an ongoing basis that appear to undermine the protocol. At the same time, the protocol seems to be blamed for any issue that has arisen when, in fact, Brexit is the real reason for those issues. That was pointed out in the beginning to everybody involved. Moreover, the British Government knew full well what the consequences would be before all this debate started. At this stage, it should be mentioned again that the people of Northern Ireland did not vote for Brexit but are being forced to accept it. The economy of Northern Ireland is being forced to accept the downside of Brexit just because it suited the British Government at the time. Will the Taoiseach continue to impress upon his British colleagues the necessity to ensure that any agreement reached is honoured in full, with no exceptions?

It is a month since the Taoiseach met Boris Johnson and vowed to work with him on Northern Ireland's future in the aftermath of the Ballymurphy inquiry report. He described it at the time as a constructive discussion. However, things have deteriorated incredibly since then and there is deep concern across a whole range of issues. Last Sunday, Mr. Johnson said he would do whatever it takes to protect the territorial integrity of the UK, as he recklessly wound up tensions over the Northern Ireland protocol. Following on from that, we have had various loyalists saying they are coming to Dublin with their protests. They are playing with fire, as I am sure the Taoiseach agrees. One thing follows the other and there has been a deliberate stoking of the issue just as the power-sharing institutions at Stormont are at risk.

This is a cyclical process and we have been here before. Now, however, the situation seems to be more sinister and dangerous and the British are all but threatening to trigger Article 16 at the end of the month. Can the Taoiseach give the House an honest assessment of where we are at in this regard? Such a development would be potentially devastating to the peace process. Has he any sense of what is being talked about in terms of the EU applying trade sanctions and tariffs, if that happens? We hope it will not. Has he spoken to Boris Johnson since the weekend and, if not, does he intend to do so? The next month or month and a half is going to be incredibly tense.

Did the Taoiseach discuss the Delta variant with the Prime Minister?

Despite the vaccination programme in the UK being well advanced, the spread of this variant has forced the Government there to delay the reopening. When I raised this issue in the House three weeks ago, we had 70 cases of the Delta variant here and now we have 130-plus cases. There is a real danger of it getting out of control. The variant presents a real danger to people's health, to their lives and to our ability to reopen society, provided it manages to beat us as we race to get people fully vaccinated. This is because it is 50% more transmissible and because one dose of the either the AstraZeneca or the Pfizer vaccine is not very effective against the Delta variant.

We need to take action now before it is too late, before the spread of this variant means that we cannot reopen and before it impacts on people's health and lives. The question is whether the Taoiseach accepts that what he is talking about with respect to extending at-home quarantine does not cut it. Many people cannot quarantine at home. There is also no supervisory mechanism. Will he move to introduce mandatory hotel quarantine for a period of a couple of months to allow us to stay ahead of the Delta variant? Will he act to reduce the time between doses for people in the older and more vulnerable categories so they are not vulnerable to this variant?

Deputy Quinlivan was indicating.

I am deputising for Deputy McDonald. The seventh meeting of the EU-UK joint committee took place recently. It was Lord David Frost's first meeting as co-chair since he replaced Michael Gove, MP. This change in personnel does not appear to have had any material impact on the British Government's approach to the work of the joint committee. From the comments of the European Commission Vice President, Maroš Šefčovič, following the meeting in question, it is clear that the EU's patience is running out and that further unilateral actions by the British Government are a real cause of concern. In light of this, US President Joe Biden's intervention in support of the Irish protocol and the Good Friday Agreement must be welcomed. Despite some of the vexatious public commentary on the flow of trade between the North and Britain, it is opinion of businesses and people in the North that operational challenges can be resolved for access to both the EU and British markets. It is critical therefore that all stakeholders speak with a unified voice to the effect that any further unilateral action by the British Government cannot be tolerated. It is our expectation that this is, and will continue to be, the clear message from the Taoiseach and his officials when engaging with their British counterparts.

I thank Deputies for raising those various issues. Deputy Brendan Smith has been a very strong advocate for the Stanley and Reilly families for many years regarding the murder of their loved ones, Patrick and Geraldine, in the 1972 Belturbet bombing and also in respect of the Dublin and Monaghan bombings. The information about the Nottingham University research which the Deputy referred to has been forwarded, as he said, to the Minister for Justice and may establish that there was collusion with the UVF in the context of that heinous crime. We will continue to pursue those issues. The key point is that the Stormont House Agreement provides us with mechanisms to deal with some of these cases but there must be political will on all fronts. The British Government must also be clearer about providing access to its files. The Irish Government has been open about any assertions of collusion in the Republic in respect of certain crimes and the Smithwick tribunal was an example of this. We continue to be open-minded about co-operating with any allegations or assertions in that regard but equally the British Government and other parties must come forward as well, in the form of giving full access to information and to all the files and papers relating to the Dublin and Monaghan bombings, as Deputy Brendan Smith has articulated. There must also a collective approach to legacy issues; there cannot be a unilateral one.

On issue of the protocol, which was raised by Deputy Durkan and others, the key avenues for resolving this are the Šefčovič-Frost discussions, the joint committee, the mechanisms in place in the Trade and Cooperation Agreement, the withdrawal agreement and the protocol itself. Where there is a will there is a way. I have spoken to Vice President Šefčovič and I have met with the Prime Minister and the Secretary of State, Lord Frost. The issues that are outstanding can without question be resolved if there is a will to resolve them and progress can be made. It is important all sides go at this with a view to, as Deputy Kelly said, defusing tensions and doing the responsible and sensible thing here to deal with the trading aspects of this protocol. The intervention by the American Administration last week, in making it clear that agreeing a sanitary and phytosanitary, SPS, agreement would not impair the capacity of the UK to do a comprehensive trade deal with the US, is significant. An SPS agreement was something the UK had advanced as being problematic. An SPS agreement would potentially remove up to 80% of the issues that have arisen. There are issues to be resolved, but I am convinced of Europe's bona fides in this regard and of its desire to have these issues resolved.

I should say we are not at the stage of trade tariffs, sanctions or anything like that yet. There needs to be serious engagement on the issues. If there is serious engagement, progress will be made. There is no doubt about that. The issue is whether people want progress to be made and whether there is a political will to make progress. The latter must be there on all sides.

I apologise to the Taoiseach but we are out of time. We must move on.

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