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Departmental Functions

Dáil Éireann Debate, Wednesday - 8 December 2021

Wednesday, 8 December 2021

Questions (13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18)

Mary Lou McDonald

Question:

13. Deputy Mary Lou McDonald asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [58550/21]

View answer

Alan Kelly

Question:

14. Deputy Alan Kelly asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [60110/21]

View answer

Richard Boyd Barrett

Question:

15. Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [60207/21]

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Paul Murphy

Question:

16. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [60210/21]

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Cian O'Callaghan

Question:

17. Deputy Cian O'Callaghan asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [60356/21]

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Dara Calleary

Question:

18. Deputy Dara Calleary asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [60570/21]

View answer

Oral answers (10 contributions)

I propose to take Questions Nos. 13 to 18, inclusive, together.

The social dialogue unit, part of the economic division in my Department, co-ordinates and supports the Government's overall approach to social dialogue through a variety of mechanisms. These mechanisms includes LEEF, the labour employer economic forum, which engages with representatives of employers and trade unions on economic and employment issues insofar as they affect the labour market. The LEEF has met regularly to facilitate discussions with Government on issues related to the Covid-19 pandemic and our economic recovery. The most recent plenary meeting, which I chaired, took place on 28 October.

Social dialogue through the LEEF process played a crucial role in ensuring workplaces are safe during the Covid-19 pandemic, and a subgroup of LEEF was responsible for preparing, updating and overseeing a work safely protocol which has provided guidance to employers and workers on the steps they need to take collectively to ensure workplaces are safe during the pandemic. The most recent update of the protocol, along with a LEEF guidance note, was published in November. Under the auspices of LEEF, there has also been significant progress on other issues such as the introduction of statutory sick pay, remote working and establishment of a high level review of collective bargaining. There are also LEEF sub-groups dealing with issues including aviation, childcare and the shared island initiative.

The social dialogue unit in my Department also supports my engagements with representatives from the environmental pillar, the community and voluntary pillar and the farming and agriculture pillar. This has included a series of meetings between myself and key Ministers with those groups earlier this year. This was an opportunity to discuss how social dialogue can be strengthened, as well as current issues of concern to those sectors. Social dialogue between Government, trade unions and other representative groups also takes place through structures like the national economic dialogue, the National Economic and Social Council and the National Competitiveness and Productivity Council, through many sectoral groups and with Ministers and Departments directly. The Government is keen to build on these structures, including through a national dialogue on climate action as part of the climate action plan.

As we manage the economy through these challenging times, the Government will continue to engage with representatives under the aegis of LEEF, as well as other stakeholders, and work to strengthen the structures and practice of social dialogue across all areas.

One of the social issues that has captured the hearts and minds of our people over the last year has been the plight of families with homes crumbling down around them in the west of Ireland. The Government has taken action in the last week to address this but I have to raise with the Taoiseach again this issue of the sliding scale. I have correspondence from the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage to Donegal County Council. The Taoiseach said we have to take the politics out of the sliding scale and that it is a matter for the Society of Chartered Surveyors of Ireland, and that it is agreed by all that it sets a benchmark for what it should cost per square foot to rebuild a home. In the correspondence from the Minister to the cathaoirleach of Donegal County Council, he clearly said: "The grant calculation methodology will be based on the cost per square foot (psf) of rebuilding the existing home, with costings to be set by me in consultation with the Society of Chartered Surveyors Ireland." The concern is that the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage officials will stick to this scale, which has no relevance whatsoever, according to the chartered surveyors, quantity surveyors and engineers. The Taoiseach knows that. I ask him again please to remove the sliding scale and then we will have a scheme that the families can work with in the west, which is the place we all want to get to.

What are the Taoiseach's future intentions for this unit? Will it be underpinned by legislation or is it just a kind of social partnership by another name? The labour employer economic forum, or LEEF, as it is called, is one of the key groups supported by this unit and it is currently examining proposals for a bonus for front-line workers. It is 18 months since this was first brought up. The Taoiseach has been completely inconsistent on this. We do not know where he is at in this regard. Following an earlier request from a Deputy, I have no idea what the Taoiseach meant by his reply. A tax free voucher of €500 has been floated and there have been multiple proposals for bank holidays, whether it is 1 February or another day on the other side of St. Patrick's Day. Will the Taoiseach please inform the House what is the status in regard to recognising these workers? What is the Taoiseach planning? Once and for all, will he give some commentary to the public out there on what the Government is thinking on this? At this moment in time, there is complete confusion.

I remain baffled as to the hesitation, reluctance and inaction that the Taoiseach is demonstrating when it comes to the issue of ventilation, air quality and air filtration. He said earlier today that he would do anything to protect life and limb, yet we know that providing minimum standards in terms of air quality and systems that can purify the air could potentially have a dramatic effect on the ability of this disease to transmit in the particular settings and particular types of buildings where it has been prevalent, such as school buildings of poor quality, nursing homes that are old and often not well ventilated, hospitals and so on.

The Irish Congress of Trade Unions, ICTU, supports our Bill and the Irish Nurses and Midwives Organisation, INMO, has been saying this for a long time about the hospitals. I do not understand. It is a win-win for the Government. We could significantly reduce the impact of other measures and potentially get beyond this grim situation we are in if we took this issue seriously. The Taoiseach was talking about health and safety in workplaces. The amount of resources that would be required to do this would be a tiny fraction of the amount the Government is having to spend on income supports, yet the Taoiseach seems to be slow, reluctant, hesitant and dismissive. I do not understand it. Perhaps the Taoiseach could explain.

For a brief moment, the value and essential nature of workers, those who are on the front line doing the work, had to be recognised in the pandemic. Chief among them, or certainly up there, were supermarket workers, who universally were accepted to be keeping our shops open and providing an essential service when most things were locked down. Even their employers were forced very briefly somewhat to recognise that, for example, with a 10% pandemic bonus from Tesco for its workers. However, as soon as they could, that was quickly forgotten. A few months later, the pandemic bonus was gone and then Tesco went on the offensive. It attempted to push through a very bad deal for workers which would scrap their Sunday premiums, convert a defined benefit pension into a defined contribution pension for new entrants and maintain a two-tier wage structure. The workers have resoundingly rejected those proposals, voting an incredible 88% “No”, and have organised on a rank-and-file basis to fight for the kind of improvements they want to see. My question to the Taoiseach is whether he believes that employers like Tesco and others should recognise the contribution of their workers by providing decent wages, terms and conditions.

I want to follow up on the previous question I asked. To be fair, the Taoiseach may not have fully understood me. The question was not one about Garda vetting. It is welcome if Garda vetting is being extended and, in particular, that must include staff in privately run emergency accommodation for homeless people, which is essential. With regard to what happened earlier this year to homeless people, the alleged perpetrator there was fully Garda vetted, so this is not an issue of Garda vetting. The issue is that the Garda vetting did not offer any protection to homeless people. What happens in other jurisdictions is that the police force, if it has credible allegations - if it is investigating live allegations and has credible evidence - then moves quickly to inform employers or other organisations that there is a real risk to people who are vulnerable and at risk. That did not happen here. We cannot countenance a situation where that could happen again. I ask for that to be looked at and, in particular, for the safeguarding legislation advanced by former Senator Colette Kelleher in the last Oireachtas to be advanced quickly by the Government, which was the intention in the last Oireachtas, I understand.

I understand that, within the next number of weeks, the Common Agricultural Policy, CAP, strategic plan will have to be submitted to the European Commission and, I presume, that goes to the Government for approval before submission to Europe.

As we know, since we joined the then EEC in 1973, the Common Agricultural Policy has been of huge importance to our farming and agrifood sector, to the rural economy and to the overall national economy. Thankfully we have record levels of drink and food exports today and they are critical to the creation and maintenance of employment throughout the country.

To the credit of the Minister, Deputy McConalogue, he has been engaged in a widespread consultation process but there is one proposal on a reduction in pillar 1 funding by 25% and a transfer to pillar 2. It is extremely important that farmers who are regarded as being in the productive sectors, be they dairy, beef, sheep or tillage farmers, continue to get the necessary supports. We all know that prices can be cyclical and income can depend on weather each season as well. Over the years the Common Agricultural Policy has been a hugely important factor in trying to keep farm incomes reasonable, although unfortunately they have not always been good due to external circumstances. It is important that in finalising the Common Agricultural Policy we take cognisance of what has worked for the Irish farming and agrifood sector over the years. I have said for many years that there has been a lazy and at times ill-informed narrative on farming and its importance, as well as its contribution to environmental standards. Our farmers work to extremely high and demanding standards, and rightly so, both from an environmental point of view and also from the point of view of farming practices, as do our processing sectors. The necessary support that has been provided over the years must continue.

On the last point, I will talk to the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine about the strategic plan. The Deputy is right about the need to do everything we possibly can to focus on what works and on food security in particular, which will remain a big challenge globally. That must be reconciled with the climate issues. Food security is still important and Ireland is probably one of the most carbon efficient production systems in Europe, both in dairy and beef. That should not be forgotten.

On Deputy Cian O’Callaghan’s point, we will examine former Senator Colette Kelleher’s legislation. However, we have a different legal system from those in other countries. If the Garda is in possession of knowledge or material that may not add up to a prosecution or that it has not passed to the DPP then that could be problematic in terms of the rights of the individual. The issue is not that simple but it merits close examination because we have to learn from experience as the Deputy has outlined.

On Deputy Paul Murphy's points, good terms and conditions are the most sustainable way to build and grow business and to build a loyal workforce that is productive. That goes without saying. There are labour relations and industrial relations processes that can facilitate the negotiation of good pay and conditions. Some employers are better than others, and that is particularly true in the retail sector. I have spoken to some traders and companies in the retail sector and they have been complimentary of the extraordinary efforts their workers have made over the last two years in particular.

Deputy Boyd Barrett raised the issue of ventilation. The Minister for Education has taken on board the expert advice she has received. Within the capital allocations to schools there is the facility to purchase high-efficiency particulate air, HEPA, filters if they are needed in certain settings. There is also a technical team in the Department that will work with schools in certain situations where schools may need more than just HEPA filters.

It is not just schools.

Widespread guidance has issued to employers and intensive care facilities have good air quality and so on. Ventilation is important and that has always been advised from the beginning of the pandemic. There have been arguments about the specific types of ventilation and I gave the Deputy the scientific advisory group for emergencies, SAGE's, perspective on HEPA filters yesterday, for example, which was interesting.

Deputy Kelly raised the social dialogue. LEEF has a lot of streams to it and it is going well. The aviation stream, construction and collective bargaining are all going well. Much good and substantive work is being done under the auspices of LEEF on substantive issues. We are building up the engagement and dialogue with the environmental NGOs and partners, with agriculture and I initiated an engagement on fishing as well. We will be bringing forward proposals on the recognition of front-line emergency workers in respect of the pandemic.

Deputy Mac Lochlainn raised the mica issue and I said that we wanted to take politics out of this issue. The Minister is adamant about the role of the Society of Chartered Surveyors Ireland. He has made that clear, most recently in his conversations with the representative bodies of homeowners. We want to do the right thing by homeowners and we want to make sure we can comprehensively assist them in getting their houses rebuilt or repaired, whichever is optimal for them.

Written Answers are published on the Oireachas website.
Sitting suspended at 2.06 p.m. and resumed at 3.06 p.m.
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