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Third Level Fees

Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 8 February 2022

Tuesday, 8 February 2022

Questions (55)

Rose Conway-Walsh

Question:

55. Deputy Rose Conway-Walsh asked the Minister for Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science when he will bring forward a plan to reduce student fees for third level students; if this will be in place for the next academic year; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6450/22]

View answer

Oral answers (23 contributions)

We are facing a crisis in the cost of living and students and families have to pay the highest fees in the EU. As a means of taking the pressure off students and their parents, will the Minister and the Department reduce fees as part of a sustainable funding model for third level education? I am also conscious of the fact that they need help now so I again call on the Minister to increase SUSI support for this academic year. In addition, reducing the looming cost of third level fees coming down the line would be a welcome relief for many.

This is something on which we agree. I passionately believe we have to reduce the cost of education. We have already taken a number of steps since the Government took office just under two years ago. I will not go through them all in the time available. There is the first increase in the SUSI grants. I accept that some of them do not take effect until September, but some of them have taken effect this year. There have been increases in the student assistance fund, and the Deputy and I have engaged on this. Indeed, the Government will consider the cost of living in the round at a Cabinet committee later this week.

However, I am conscious that when we talk about a sustainable funding model for higher education, it cannot be just a model that is sustainable for the institutions, although that is very important. When I consider what a sustainable model would look like, I think of it as having three parts. It looks at the level of investment we need to put into higher education now and into the future to ensure it can meet the needs of our society and some of the issues the Deputy and I were discussing earlier, and how we can know it is adequately and sustainably funded. The second issue is how the grants system can be completely overhauled. We have a SUSI review to go alongside that. The third is the cost of education. I believe we need to do work with regard to the registration fee. The factual answer, as of now, is that I updated the Cabinet committee in December. I am engaging bilaterally with my colleague, the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform. The Minister of State, Deputy Niall Collins, and I will shortly bring forward proposals on what that sustainable funding model looks like. I must say again that we have ruled out student loans. That is very important. I do not believe it works; it is a failed model. Students should not be leaving college heavily indebted and paying back the Government for loans, at a time when they might well want to be saving for other things in their lives in terms of progression.

We have made a number of changes to the SUSI scheme. There have been changes that have taken effect, including in respect of postgraduate students. There are more to come in September. We announced an increase in the student assistance fund last week as well. We continue to keep all these issues under review. However, I wish to be clear that I want to see the cost of education go in a downward direction as we bring forward the sustainable funding model.

We have to be conscious of families who are really struggling at this stage, and of students who, because they cannot get accommodation even at a very high price, are driving long distances and of the extra cost that is putting on students. In addition, it is time for a new accommodation strategy because the cost of accommodation is prohibiting students from attending and participating in the colleges they wish to go to. We must do everything we can to bring higher education within the reach of everybody. That is why I am seeking a commitment from the Minister that fees will be reduced. With regard to SUSI, I hope the Cabinet decides, on the Minister's recommendation, to bring forward some of the reliefs there to take the pressure off students and parents.

I thank the Deputy for the points she raised and for the constructive manner in which she did so. It is important to say there are existing supports available, and I always say this particularly when I visit schools because sometimes students, when they hear about the cost of education, might not perhaps be aware of that fact. That is worth saying whilst trying to improve them. More than 65,000 students not only do not pay the highest tuition fee in Europe but pay either no tuition fee or a significantly reduced rate of fees. These costs are covered by my Department through the SUSI scheme. Last year, we allocated €190 million to meet those fees to help the students most in need of targeted interventions.

We have made a number of changes to the SUSI scheme. I accept they largely come into effect in the new academic year. It is the first increase in the grant for a number of years for everybody. There is a significant reduction in the adjacency rate so more students will qualify for the higher grant. There is also an increase in the income threshold so more students will qualify than previously. We need to continue to take many actions to reduce the cost of education.

On all parts of this island we have to reduce the cost of attending college. Yes, there is a student contribution fee of €3,000 in this jurisdiction and I would like that to go down. There is a tuition fee in Northern Ireland of €5,434. The only reason the Deputy can say we have the highest fees in Europe is that, sadly, Northern Ireland is not in the European Union. I hope she will join with me in taking an all-island approach to wanting to reduce fees. I was in Northern Ireland and the students there are not very happy with the Deputy at all.

The Minister should not worry. He should concentrate on the students down here-----

Surely the Deputy would like the Government to take an all-island approach.

-----where he has a mandate.

It is a commitment under the Good Friday Agreement that I must fulfil as a Government Minister.

The difference between Sinn Féin and this Government is that we listen to students and to what they want. The Minister knows that the only reason the fees in the North are not £9,250 as they are in England is that Sinn Féin in is government in the North as well. The Minister twisting his play of words is not fooling anybody.

That is an extraordinary answer.

It is not; it is a truthful answer. I want fees here to be reduced. I do not want the highest fees in the EU; that is not a label we want in this State.

We must work together to make sure they are reduced. The Minister said that some people do not pay fees. Yes, many do not. However, we see the people who are working day and night, the people who are excluded, locked out and not entitled to anything because they are just above the thresholds. We must help those students. We must give those students and their families the opportunities they deserve. We do not need to punish them for going out to work and for earning a very modest income that then excludes them from any help.

I am sure the Deputy did not mean it.

I presume the Sinn Féin Party is very much aware of my commitments under the Good Friday Agreement as part of the Irish Government to have an active interest in many things relating to Northern Ireland. The Deputy will ask me in the Higher Education Authority legislation to take an all-island approach, and I do and I will do so. That is why I visited Queen's University Belfast and Ulster University, and it is why we will deliver our commitments to students in the North. By the way, when Northern Ireland and Britain left the European Union, sadly, we continued to ensure students there could access the Erasmus programme. I have a very active interest in and fulfil my commitments relating to the North.

If I were the Deputy, I would work on the fees aspect. If her party is taking credit for not putting the fees at £9,000, I presume she is happy to see them at €5,434.57.

My maths skills are not great but we charge €3,000, which I see as too high. In the North, where Sinn Féin is in government, it is charging €5,434. Shame on the party.

We do not have control of those finances.

The Minister knows we do not control those finances.

It should listen to the students and reduce those fees in the North. Do something about the A levels as well.

The Minister should speak to British Prime Minister, Boris Johnson.

With the Minister of State, Deputy Niall Collins, we will reduce the fees over time for students. We will ensure a sustainable funding model and we will put more into SUSI. We will work on an all-island basis to look after all the young people.

We will see what is delivered.

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