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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 30 Jun 1926

Vol. 16 No. 17

IN COMMITTEE ON FINANCE. - MONEY RESOLUTION—BETTING BILL, 1926.

I move:—

Go bhfuil sé oiriúnach a údarú go n-íocfar amach as airgead a sholáthróidh an tOireachtas aon chostaisí fé n-a raghfar ag an aon Achta i bhfeidhm a rithfar, sa tsiosón so chún socrú do dhéanamh chun gur fearrde a regleálfar agus a srianfar daoine dar gnó geallta do ghlaca agus chun regleáil agus srianadh do dhéanamh maidir le suimitheoirí d'úsáid, agus chun leasú do dhéanamh, chun na gerícheanna san agus chun crícheanna eile, ar an dlí a bhaineas le geallchur agus le tithe geall.

That it is expedient to authorise the payment out of moneys provided by the Oireachtas of the expenses incurred in carrying into execution any Act of the present session to make provision for the better regulation and control of persons engaged in the business of bookmaking, to regulate and control the use of totalisators, and for those and other purposes to amend the law relating to betting and betting houses.

It is difficult to estimate what the expense of carrying the Betting Bill into operation and the collection of the betting tax will be. It is not expected to be considerable, because while there may be re-scheming necessary in connection with Excise officers in certain districts, in order to allot a greater number of officers to a specified area than there is there at present, in other districts this re-scheming will not be necessary, because certain branches of Excise work are lighter than before. That is so in connection with old age pensions. Owing to the smaller number of pensioners and the smaller number of claimants—arising from the fact that we are getting past the period that represents the survival of the very big populations of the famine and post-famine times—the amount of work to be done by Excise officers in connection with pensions has been declining. So far as many Excise districts in the country are concerned, there has been a falling off in the work to be done by Excise officers, and, in a number of cases, we believe it will be possible to carry out the provisions of this Act, and the clauses of the Finance Act imposing the Betting Tax, without additional staff. In other places, there will be additional staff required. It is not expected that, in any case, will any sharp or considerable increase in staffs be required to deal with these matters. So far as the cost which may be involved in setting up the totalisator is concerned, it is not possible at this stage to give any information that would be of value to the Dáil.

In different countries widely different types of machines are used. There are machines in use costing anything from £70,000 to £120, and until a decision has been come to as to the type of machine and the type of structure that will be required in this country it is impossible to give any estimate. I think that the information in regard to the totalisators can only be given to the Dáil when we come with an Estimate asking for money to initiate the totalisator system.

I think that those Deputies who are in favour of this tax on betting should at this stage——

There is nothing at all about a tax on betting in this.

No, but it is to provide money to carry out an Act for the purpose of bookmaking.

Not for the purpose of bookmaking.

To regulate and control it. No specified sum is mentioned, and we do not know how much will be required. It may exceed thousands and it may be a few hundreds, but surely some figures should be put before the Dáil as to the amount that the Minister asks to have voted. The expenses of the country are too great, and a good deal of money is thrown away on foolish and unnecessary legislation that costs thousands and thousands of pounds. It is nearly time to call a halt somewhere. I know that the Minister for Finance keeps a very tight hold on money required for the relief of unemployment, but in a case like this he comes to the Dáil and asks for permission to make payment, without stating the amount of money required. Surely some information should be given as to whether hundreds of thousands of pounds, or even a million pounds, is required. We have nothing at all to go on with now.

Resolution put and agreed to.
The Dáil went out of Committee.
Resolution reported.
Question: "That the Dáil agree with the Committee in the resolution"—put and agreed to.
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