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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 18 Nov 1942

Vol. 88 No. 16

Adjournment Debate. - Importation of Watches.

On to-day's Order Paper there were two questions, one over the name of Deputy Davin and one over my name. These questions related to the considerable embarrassment caused to watch importers through goods consigned to them from Switzerland being held up by the customs authorities, largely because of the interference of the Department of Finance. The first question was as follows:——

To ask the Minister for Finance if he will state (a) the number and (b) the value of Swiss watches invoiced to Irish nationals now held by the customs section of the General Post Office; the period for which and the grounds on which they are so held; whether, if these goods are held on his instructions, he will state the grounds on which such instructions were framed, and the nature of the inquiries made by him regarding the effect such instructions will have on employment in the retail jewellery and kindred trades, and on the credit abroad of Irish importers.

The second question was:—

To ask the Minister for Finance if he is aware that the banks have been forbidden by his Department to buy foreign currency for the purpose of enabling their customers to pay for quantities of Swiss watches held for their customers by the customs authorities; whether this prohibition was based on the grounds that the demand for foreign currency could not be met by his Department; and, if so, whether he will state why the Department refused later to release watches where the Swiss exporters have intimated their willingness to give delivery without any transfer of foreign currency or of sterling from this country; and, further, whether he will state why Irish importers are prohibited from taking delivery of goods already lying in this country in circumstances which do not involve the buying of foreign currency or the export of Irish currency.

The Minister, in the course of his replies, admitted that these goods had been held up for a period amounting, in some cases, to no less than five months, and he gave as an excuse for not permitting the goods to be paid for in the manner suggested by the importers that the payment to an account in an Irish bank in the name of the Swiss firms would create a liability to Switzerland at a future date. In answer to that I would like to point out that the release of these watches would keep the jewellery trade in existence here, it would keep a large number of people in employment, and the money, having regard to the manner in which the payment was suggested, would be in an Irish bank under the control of the Minister for Finance.

It is interesting to observe that the Minister found no difficulty in permitting payment for a consignment of cigars from Cuba and wines from Portugal. Some of these cigars are retailed at as much as £4 10s. for 25. Surely nobody will deny that these come under the heading of luxuries. The Minister, in adopting this attitude in relation to the import of watches, is following the same lines as the Government followed two years ago in regard to tea, wheat, petrol and other commodities which are not now obtainable. In September, 1940, a tea importer asked permission to import a cargo of tea which he had bought in the United States, but permission was refused. When the tea became scarce, the Government approached the importer, but tea was not then available. The position at the moment, in so far as the import of watches is concerned, is that the Swiss frontier is closed, and will remain so until the end of the war, and no more watches or clocks will be available for export. The export of British and American watches and clocks has stopped.

I must say that the Minister's replies to-day were evasive. The Minister's explanation that these watches were being held because the customs duty was not paid is nothing more than an evasion on his part. How on earth could the importers pay the duty? The banks could not release the documents until they had permission to do so. Of course, the moment the documents are released the Minister would collect no less than £10,000 in duty. At the moment there are no less than £30,000 worth of watches in the hands of the customs authorities. The traders are sorely in need of them in order to give them to their customers.

It seems that the real position in this matter is that the Minister is not master in his own house. I can well understand his difficulties in relation to sterling. We know that he is acting under the direction of his unwhipped mistress, the Old Lady of Threadneedle Street. Surely the Minister should make an effort to accommodate the watch importers in this country and maintain the employment given in this particular trade.

It should be clearly understood in relation to this matter that the moment the embargo was put on by the Department of Finance these traders discontinued placing orders in Switzerland. Owing to the war situation, orders had to be placed for a very considerable time before consignments of goods could be delivered. Many months elapsed between the time orders were placed and the delivery of the goods here in Dublin. The whole position now is that these traders ordered their goods before any Order was made by the Department of Finance, before any embargo was placed on import, and the goods have been lying in Dublin for a very considerable time now. I seriously suggest to the Minister that, having regard to the readiness of the Swiss firm to accept payment in the manner already indicated to his Department, he could, without in any way conflicting with the Order made by the Department some months ago, facilitate these importers in having the goods released.

There is one final point to which I should like to draw the Minister's attention. Does he realise the damaging effect on the credit of firms in this country which have been dealing with firms in Switzerland in not paying for goods ordered by them? Already there has been very considerable delay, and I suggest that if the Minister does not adopt the scheme or plan with which both parties are satisfied, he is doing an unnecessary, and a very grave, injustice to Irish nationals in this trade.

I do not at all admit that I have done any injustice whatever to any Irish national legitimately engaged in this trade. I have been very generous and very lenient with a number of these people in not prosecuting them for disobeying the Orders—the Emergency Powers (Finance) Orders—issued immediately on the outbreak of the war, which made it illegal for these people to engage in trade involving us in the provision of foreign currency without prior sanction. That is the Order, and the fact that, for some time, in relation to some of these cases, it was not enforced against them does not mean that the Order was not there, or that they were not breaking the law. We have done all that was necessary for the legitimate traders in this business. We have provided, and more than provided, for the normal trade of these people, jewellers and watch people in Dublin, importing from all sources and not from Switzerland alone. What is now asked is that we should provide foreign Swiss francs to finance a trade five or six times as great as was done in any year before the war. There are things more essential for the welfare of our people than watches.

The figures do not indicate that.

I know what the figures are, and I am giving the facts: I cannot give details, because the details of our trade statistics have not been published since the war.

The Minister has given details showing that, between the years 1938 and 1941, the amount of customs duty collected did not vary by more than about £2,000. In 1941, the amount collected in customs duty was more than £2,000 less than the amount collected in 1938—the year prior to the war.

I am taking a normal period before the war, and, over a number of years, the average importation of watches from all countries was about £36,000. Now we are asked to provide Swiss francs for five or six times that amount for certain people in the watch trade. We are not going to do it.

Is it not better to secure——

I am in possession. The Deputy had his chance, and he could have talked for another quarter of an hour, if he had wished. What is necessary for that trade—the normal trade and even more than the normal trade—we shall do our best to provide, but certainly we are not going to provide money for a trade which is not essential. With the amount that has been imported already this year, there must be an enormous boom in the watch trade, and in addition to the men in employment previously, many others must have got employment in the watch trade, in the making and repairing of watches, judging by the amount of materials we have already provided francs for. For this half-year just ended, more than ever was asked for in any year for 20 or 25 years before the war has already been imported.

There will not be any watches available next year or the year after.

If we have to do with what watches are already legally in the country for the next three or four years, none of us will die.

Would the Minister not think it better to secure goods than to build up paper credits, a policy which has been so strongly condemned by the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Finance?

We will use our credits in the way we think proper for the benefit of this State and to provide essentials for the people. So far as we can get foreign exchange from Switzerland or elsewhere, we shall try to get it for essential things. I have a doubt in my mind as to what happens some of these watches which have been imported to such an extravagant extent compared with previous years. I do not think this is an essential trade. So far as employment in the industry is concerned, there is plenty of material, and we shall see to it, so far as we can, that the legitimate trade will have all it requires.

Do not make suggestions. Let the Minister say what is in his mind. We are prepared to hear it all.

We shall provide all the material, so far as foreign exchange can be got, necessary for the legitimate trade.

No question of foreign exchange is involved.

The Deputy got an opportunity of making his case and he must let the Minister conclude.

If the Deputy can point to any essential for the life of this community, if he should ask me to provide to the same extent as he is asking in respect of watches money for something which this country wants, such as tea, and, if we could get it from Switzerland, I should be happy to provide it, but not for this trade. It is not an essential. We have already provided for the legitimate trade vastly more than was provided in any other year. In one half year, as I say, we have provided vastly more than was provided in any year for the 20 years before the war. In doing that, we have laid in reserves for this trade, and I do not think anything more is necessary.

Does the Minister realise that the amount paid for watches is to a very large extent explained by the fact that watches have more than doubled in price and that insurance amounts to 20 per cent.?

I have allowed for that.

The Dáil adjourned at 9.20 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Thursday, 19th November, 1942.

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