I welcome the provisions of this Bill which, as is apparent to everybody, are urgently needed. As we are amending the licensing laws at all I would ask the Minister to take this opportunity to correct them in respect of matters in which they have been found wanting, even since the passage of recent legislation. We had, for instance, the matter that Deputy Corry has referred to. Various public bodies in County Mayo have protested and have passed resolutions condemning the position that people in rural areas and country towns are not entitled to the same facilities on Sunday as are provided for the people in the cities. There does not appear to be any reason why the people in the country should not be entitled to the same facilities as are provided in the towns.
As a matter of fact, a much better argument can be put forward for the country dweller, inasmuch as Sunday is his only day off. In the case of the farm labourer or the small farmer in the West of Ireland, it is the only day he gets to meet his friends in the local town. As everyone knows, it is much easier to provide for the enforcement of the law if the law is reasonable, as when the people feel that this law will not be enforced in some towns and that in the cities the citizens are normally entitled to go into a public house for a couple of hours on a Sunday, they have no respect for the provisions of the licensing laws and there is a temptation to break them. There is always a great temptation to country publicans, when people come into the town on Sunday—the only day of the week on which they can enjoy a couple of hours' leisure—and try to prevail on them to let them in for a drink. If the provisions suggested here were inserted, to legalise the opening in country towns just the same as in the cities, for a couple of hours on Sunday, it would remove a lot of the Gárda difficulties. It would create greater respect for the law and greater respect in the minds of individual country people for the enforcement of the licensing laws.
Since the previous Licensing Acts were passed here, it has been found that we made a bad mess of the question of occasional licences. For instance, in regard to the town of Westport, in County Mayo, where the famous Croagh Patrick pilgrimage takes place each year, the people in that town from time immemorial have kept open on the night previous to the pilgrimage, as pilgrims were coming in from all over the country and travelling long distances, so that they might cater for those pilgrims. It has been found that, under the recent legislation, the courts had no power to grant licences to cover that occasion and as a result those people, who have been catering from time immemorial for such pilgrims, were forced to close down completely. The pilgrims who had travelled from all parts of this country —and who, in normal times, travel from various parts of the world—find that in the only town close to Croagh Patrick where they used to get facilities in the way of meals, sandwiches and drinks, the shops—and particularly the public houses—have had to close down, since no provision is made at law under which the traders could apply for occasional licences to meet the situation. That is one instance in my own county and I am sure there are various other instances in connection with other fixtures in different counties where the same difficulties have been encountered. I would like that power be given to district justices to meet special occasions of that kind, by putting in a section in this Bill.
At present there is no provision for transferring a licence from a particular house to some other house some distance away, even though it is extinguishing the original licence. Reference has been made here, in the discussion on the Bill, to licensed premises, possibly in a slum area, the owner of which wants to build elsewhere. That provision is not there now, but it was suggested that we should legislate for it. I think the provision could be stretched even further, to enable somebody even outside a town or outside the location of the public house altogether, to transfer that licence—providing it is extinguished in the house to which it applies—to a completely different house in a different area. I have one special case in mind where such a provision would be necessary. We have a very ancient system of distilling which has not been referred to here very much, that is, the poteen industry, from the ravages of which we suffered quite a lot in the West of Ireland over a great number of years. It has been held by very many people that the best method of combating illicit distillation would be to provide reasonable public house or drinking facilities in those areas. Like every other traffic, it is the consumer who provides the prosperity for the poteen maker. Although at the moment the poteen has suffered an almost fatal blow during the emergency, owing to the lack of supplies and lack of sugar, we all look forward to the time when we will have these articles in normal supply again and, no doubt, the old poteen industry will flourish as it has flourished throughout the centuries, irrespective of the very heavy penalties laid down by law to eradicate it.
I would like to see a provision in this Bill whereby licences could be transferred outside even the town they are in. We know that, since 1902, we cannot have new public house licences, unless the licence existed then, except in the case of hotels. The number of licences would not be increased by this suggestion and possibly they would be distributed more equitably and there would also be the possibility of combating the traffic to which I have referred, which is a very serious problem in the West of Ireland. By the suggested provisions, it would be possible to establish licensed premises in one of those areas and that might be the most effective way of combating the traffic.
I do not accept the argument of Deputy Coogan in connection with the proximity of Gárda stations to the premises envisaged under this particular Bill. I have listened to this argument both here and in the courts over a long number of years and I have failed to understand the logic behind it, in the case of public houses, dance halls or any other form of licensed premises. I do not see why, in considering the grant of a licence, the proximity to the Gárda station should be taken into account at all. The natural and logical conclusion one has to come to is to build all the public houses round about the Gárda station. Surely the Gárda are there to administer the law, while the licensed premises under this Bill are to be provided for the accommodation of the people in the particular area in which they are required? It might be a very good thing that notice should be served on the Gárdaí in connection with these licences, as they may be useful in giving evidence as to the character of the applicant or his or her suitability as a licensee; but I do not think the position of the barracks in relation to the new licensed premises should be taken into account at all. Where you have these turf development workers, there are bound to be new districts and, if facilities for drinking are to be provided for those workers in those isolated areas, one of the first considerations should be the workers' comforts. I would not like it to be suggested that these men, after their hard day's work in the bogs, would be compelled to travel several miles, in order that the local Gárda might have only a couple of hundred yards to go. I think that if we are establishing these premises at all, the main consideration should be the facilities to be provided for the people for whom we are catering. I have no doubt that if there are abuses the nearest Gárda station will be in a position to take care of them. I do not think that is a matter that should be considered when dealing with the principle of this Bill.
In view of the fact that we have had so many changes in the licensing laws of the country, I urge on the Minister that, when we are making this particular change, he should try to put right some things that have gone wrong under previous licensing legislation, and in particular he should abolish the hurtful discrimination there is between country dweller and town dweller under the present licensing laws. By doing so, he would be contributing towards better respect for the licensing laws in this State. By many people they are regarded as very much of a farce. This country is much too small to have one licensing law for one city or county and another licensing law for another city or county.
