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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 29 Mar 1955

Vol. 149 No. 6

Committee on Finance. - Vote 50—Industry and Commerce (Resumed).

Many people in the country looked with hope to the Minister's speech on this Estimate. Unfortunately, they have been very disillusioned indeed. For the most part, the Minister indulged in generalities and in no instance did he give a specific case of anything which was being done by his Department, except one mention of the oil refinery. That has disillusioned many industrialists in the country as a whole and it has disillusioned many of those who voted for the inter-Party Government in the last election or for their candidates.

There are some points which I think should be referred to specifically when the Minister is replying. I and other Deputies find from time to time that when we put down a question here about C.I.E. the Minister invariably says that he has no function. He dealt with C.I.E. at very great length in his speech. What I want to know is, if he has no function in the operating of C.I.E., would he tell me why he interfered with a major decision taken by the entire board and unanimously agreed by them? I refer to the decision by C.I.E. to establish in Limerick a steam locomotive repair unit. I understand that that industry—it could be called an industry—would have meant 120 employees coming from Dublin to the City of Limerick and I understand also that, in due course, these 120 keymen would have trained other operatives and that an apprenticeship scheme was to be initiated. It would have meant to the City of Limerick over £60,000 a year in revenue, in wages, and would also have been of great benefit to the rates of the city.

The Minister gave as an explanation in relation to one question I put down here that he had no function in the matter and then, when I asked why this decision had been reversed, he said he had made representations to C.I.E. The Minister cannot have it both ways. If he has no function, why did he make representations? The full board of C.I.E. unanimously adopted this decision and then the Minister interfered and used his position. I should like him to give a detailed statement on that matter. The employment position in Limerick is not good to-day and this would have meant quite a lot to us down there.

When I raised the question of the scrapping of the timber wagons, I again got the answer that the Minister had no function. I again point out to him, as he has interested himself so vitally in the affairs of C.I.E., that every week timber wagons are being scrapped in Limerick for the sake of a cost of £50 or £60 and being sent to Cork and eventually to Haulbowline. I do not think that is good enough and the Minister should find out the exact details of that situation. If he wants any further assistance from me, I shall be glad to help him in that line. I have heard it discussed by workers, supporters of all political Parties, in the locomotive works in Limerick and they say that it is fantastic that this policy of scrapping timber wagons for the sake of such a small expenditure should be pursued. We all know what Limerick suffered in the past under the Coalition Government. We know that the wagon shops which were to be built there and which would have given a great deal of employment were scrapped and I can hardly be blamed, therefore, if I get up here to look after the interests of Limerick, in view of what took place in the past and what has taken place in the very recent past.

The previous Government earmarked a sum of £20,000 from the National Development Fund for the construction of a bridge or a tunnel across the main Limerick-Cork road in connection with the link line connecting the cement factory with the railway station. That sum has been taken out of the allocations from the National Development Fund and C.I.E has now published its intention and has lodged its plans under the Transport Act of 1950. I have inspected these plans and I find that they show a level crossing. I submit that, if anything, the tendency is— and it had the unanimous support of all parties previously—that level crossings should be done away with on main trunk roads. It is a very serious thing that, on the main Limerick-Cork road, 220 yards from the regional hospital, C.I.E. should put down a level crossing.

I cannot see why that sum of £20,000 was taken from us in Limerick. The Minister for Agriculture took £600,000 from us when he transferred the bovine tuberculosis scheme up to Sligo. Perhaps he had grounds for doing so, but I do say that the Minister should seriously consider making this allocation for a tunnel or a bridge across this main trunk road. Most Deputies know the Dublin-Limerick road and they know that five miles from Limerick, at Lisnagry, there is a level crossing and that, for some reason best known to C.I.E. when a train is at Castleconnell, cars on either side are held up for quite long periods. I am sure that every Deputy has had that experience. I think it was the intention of the previous Government to earmark a sum for a tunnel or a bridge in that area also. However, it is a matter of major policy which was agreed on by C.I.E., but, due to the intervention of the Minister, or the Government as a whole, the idea has been dropped and it is just another case of money allocated to Limerick— in this case, £20,000—which would not have cost the ratepayers one penny being taken from us.

While dealing with C.I.E., there is another matter in regard to which the Minister might have inquiries made— the complete lack of bus shelters in the city. It is not my intention to go over all the policy of the Minister, but I am citing certain specific matters. I have made representations on several occasions to C.I.E., with a view to having bus shelters erected in the city, but we have got no satisfaction whatever. Certainly their suggestion that, in places, the footpaths are too small or too narrow could not stand up. The Minister surely cannot say again that he has no function in the matter and that it is a matter for C.I.E., because the Minister interested himself very vitally in the Dún Laoghaire-Dublin route and expressed himself very strongly in this House as being of the opinion that the services given by C.I.E. on that run were totally unsuitable and inadequate. The Minister can interest himself in these matters and surely he will not forget that there is a city called Limerick and will make representations with a view to getting something done for the unfortunate citizens there who are being drowned every year.

The Minister, in the whole of his speech, made no reference at all to prices. Only last Sunday, I was looking again at the document that was hawked around—they should get a hawker's licence for it—setting out the prices prevailing in 1951 and in 1954. It is not my intention to give any more quotations—we have had enough quotations from election addresses— but at the bottom of the document there is: "Vote Fine Gael for better times." The citizens of this country know now what they are getting. They are getting "quare times", and it is not Pat Taaffe who is riding——

We heard it before, Joe.

——but Costello, trained by Larkin. Two of the most important statements on this Estimate were those made by Deputy Kyne and Deputy Larkin. I wonder did many people take notice of what Deputy Kyne said? We have Fine Gael, as usual, screaming they made no promises and we have one of the stalwarts of the Labour Party using these words:—

"I know exactly the promises that were made. I was the instrument of the Party here in relation to certain essential promises. I remember quite well what was said: `We would not take part in any Government, and neither would we support a Government, which would not undertake to bring down the prices of essential commodities to the level of the 1952 Budget. We will not fall down on that promise. That promise was firmly made. We have indicated that should subsidies be required they would be made available. We are of that opinion still'."

That is the Labour Party and these are the words of Deputy Kyne on the 23rd February. He then goes to say:—

"It is sufficient to say that the Labour Party was instrumental in putting as much pressure as possible on the whole Cabinet and to say to them: ‘We feel it is essential that the public should not receive the full impact of an increase in the price of tea'..."

The operative word there is "pressure".

Would the Deputy give the reference?

It is Volume 148, No. 5, of the Official Debates. I have been quoting from columns 714-715. As I say, the operative word there is "pressure". By the talk that went on in this House from Fine Gael one would think it was a unanimous decision they lauded it so much but the word "pressure" would suggest that there was some objection or resistance. To every action there was an equal reaction. Evidently, we find out from Deputy Kyne that there was not such unanimity after all. The matter was discussed at length and there were quite considerable objections. However, Deputy Kyne is evidently far more explicit than the Minister has been in his speech dealing with this matter. Great note should be taken of that speech by Deputy Kyne and great note has been taken by this side of the House. It will be used on all possible occasions and we hope much sooner than is expected by members of the Government.

I would also like to refer to a very important statement made by Deputy J. Larkin on the 17th February when speaking on the Second Stage of the Supplies and Services Bill. Deputy Larkin said:—

"...where economic factors were such that it was not possible to bring down the price of essential foods, then, in our opinion, the policy of subsidisation should be utilised."

He then goes on to say:—

"As far as I know, the Labour Party has not changed its view on that up to to-night...."

—that is the 17th February, 1955—

"...nor, I think, are we likely to do so.

But having said that, it does not alter the fact that the election is now some eight months behind us and that in the meantime the problem of prices has still continued to be a problem. It is quite correct to say, I suppose, that some 15 to 20 items of various kinds have increased in price. Some of them we can easily try to dismiss by the argument that they are not essential. While the increase in the price of coffee, for instance, has its own significance, nobody is going to suggest that it has the same significance as increases in the price of bread, tea or sugar. What is significant is that among the number of items in regard to which prices have increased there are some important food groups. There has been an increase in the price of tea. There has been, as usual, a periodic or seasonal increase in the price of eggs though the price of eggs is now coming down. We have had increases in the price of such commodities as cocoa and oatenmeal. There are essential foods."

Then he goes on to make a very important statement:—

"I think any member of this House who tries to shut his eyes to these happenings or tries to argue that there has been no increase, and that everything in the garden is lovely, is not only being foolish from a political point of view but is storing up trouble for himself. The situation with which we are faced is present to the mind of every Party. There has been a small or large increase in the price of a number of items, some of them important, some of them not so important. Some of us have the feeling that the index has not changed more than one or two points, that the situation is not serious, and that, maybe, if we hold on for a couple of months more, the index will drop to the previous figure. My fear is that we are in a situation which, if we do not try to deal with it now, will develop in the next two or three months to a point where we shall not be able to stop a really significant increase in prices and the cost of living, because prices are like a snowball."

That is Deputy J. Larkin. I think members on all sides of the House have taken serious note of his remarks.

I would also refer the Minister to his statement in connection with the tanning industry as a whole. I asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce if he would take any specific steps to try to see that the oldest industry in Limerick City would be re-established after the disastrous fire which took place some years ago. He said that was a matter for the firm concerned.

The firm is re-established and is functioning.

Yes, but the firm is not functioning on anything like the lines it functioned.

The question the Deputy asked me was whether I would make them rebuild. I have no power to make them rebuild. The Deputy should tell the facts to the House. He said rebuild and not re-establish.

I also asked the Minister to use his good offices with the firm. I certainly think the Minister would do a good day's work for Limerick if he could endeavour to arrange a conference with the directors of this firm. Now the Minister has stated that the company is operating, I would like him to make a note of the fact that this firm is operating under the most appalling conditions. I am not so much interested in the directors as I am in the welfare of the workers. They are working there under a makeshift factory of galvanised sheets with the rain coming through and 80 per cent. of the workers work for long periods out in the open.

I do not agree the Minister can say that that factory is re-established. I wonder if the Minister is aware that after the fire four years ago the directors of this factory got an option from the Limerick Corporation of eight acres of land? That was four years ago and they have not yet done anything about building the factory.

And for three out of those four years the Deputy's Government was in office.

It does not necessarily mean because my Government was in office that I could be in agreement with everything that might or might not be done if it affected Limerick City. It is quite possible that I might have got up and spoken a few choice words to Deputy Lemass if the position which obtains now obtained then. However, I do not think the Minister has as many facts about this matter as I have.

The Deputy has the choice words.

I have. I sincerely hope that in view of what I said to him—I intend writing to him further on the matter—he will try to do something for this very old industry which existed in Limerick. The Minister told me, in reply to a question in connection with employment in the Limerick clothing factory, that he had no function in the matter, but, from the information he had received, he was satisfied that no serious unemployment had taken place or was taking place in the factory in question. I can tell the Minister now that there are dismissals weekly. I can assure him that the people affected are not casual employees but employees who have been there for many years. The company is working on short time. I would appeal to the Minister to consider the position of that factory at the present moment.

The Minister was, unfortunately, not present for the most important matter I wanted to raise on this Estimate in connection with the steam locomotive repair depot in Limerick. However, I will not traverse that ground again.

I asked a question recently about the scarcity of anthracite in Limerick City and the Minister said that his information was that there was no undue scarcity and that no representations had been made to him by the merchants. I can assure the Minister, and I am sure the other Deputies representing Limerick City will bear me out in this, that there is a very acute shortage of anthracite in Limerick. It may seem like parish pump politics to be discussing a shortage of anthracite in Limerick here in this House, but the matter is a serious one for the people concerned and I would appeal to the Minister to use his good offices with those responsible for allocating anthracite to Limerick to ensure that the supply position improves.

Shannon airport is a matter of importance to us in Limerick and indeed to the whole country. The Minister referred in great detail to the position of Shannon airport and I am glad to know that the position is not as bad as was expected. I have no intention now of taunting the Minister; indeed I congratulate him on the conversion that has taken place in his outlook both with regard to Shannon airport and Collinstown. We all know the strong ideas the Minister had with regard to the operation of these airports prior to the last election. It is gratifying to note that the Minister, having had certain facts and figures put before him, now appreciates that these airports are a sound proposition for the future of the country as a whole. Certainly, if a Fine Gael Deputy were Minister for Industry and Commerce to-day we all know the cuts that would have been made in relation to those airports.

I congratulate the Minister on being man enough to take the proper course having ascertained the full facts and come to an appreciation of the full position. One of the first question I put down here was to ask the Minister if there was any likelihood of a reduction in the staffs at Shannon airport and Collinstown airport, and I pointed out to him then that the gravest anxiety existed among the employees and their families; the Minister's reply was that such anxiety only existed in the unstable and fickle mind of the Deputy.

Hear, hear! I am glad to see that these anxieties have been allayed, apparently.

Was that a reply to a parliamentary question?

That was the reply I got from the Minister to the first question I asked in this House.

I think the Deputy ought to tell the House the whole story. Tell the House about the supplementaries too.

What about them?

I am not complaining about them at all. It is the delicate fears of the Deputy's colleagues that I am concerned about.

The delicate what?

I am concerned about the delicate atmosphere surrounding the Deputy's question.

The Minister has announced that extensions are to take place at Shannon airport in connection with the restaurant and passenger accommodation generally. When he comes to reply I hope he will be a little more detailed and state when these extensions will take place.

I understand there is a possibility of Aer Rianta or Aer Lingus making spare parts for their planes. In that connection I ask the Minister to bear Shannon in mind. He must recollect, above all, the very serious action of the last Coalition Government in scrapping the Lockheed repair factory in Shannon. Several hundreds could have been employed in that, but, as a result of the action of the Government of the day, they were compelled to seek employment elsewhere. Limerick City, Limerick County and County Clare suffered very much as a result of that.

The Minister has stated that he has caused Irish Shipping Limited to have inquiries made into the possibility of having a transatlantic shipping service. The Minister has not been specific. He did not tell us what the terms of reference are or when he expects to have a report. The Minister could come in here and say that he has asked the directors of Dunsink Observatory to let him have a report on a passenger plane service to the moon.

That means nothing as far as the general public is concerned. The Minister knows quite well in his heart that there is no future for this country in a transatlantic shipping service. He must agree that the whole tendency to-day is towards air transport. Now that his conversion is complete, I hope that he will ask for a report on the possibility of opening up a transatlantic airline service, a service which was dropped by the previous Coalition. If the Minister looks into the matter—he has not said anything about it so far—I am sure he will agree that there is a much greater possibility of establishing a transatlantic airline service between this country and the United States than there is of establishing a passenger liner service.

I feel that this Government like the previous inter-Party Government has completely neglected the third largest city in the State. I think it is about time that the actions of this Government both now and on the last occasion when they were in office were exposed. It would take too long to go into each matter in detail, but I dealt with some of the more important ones before the Minister came in. To cite another small example: the Minister betook himself to Killaloe and went up the Shannon to get a first-hand account of the possibilities and potentialities of having passenger boats on the upper and middle reaches of the Shannon. That idea of his has evidently become a fact and when I put down a question to him as to whether he would use his good offices with C.I.E. to have a passenger service from Limerick to Cappagh I got the usual stereotyped answer that the Minister had no function in the matter but understood C.I.E. were at present contemplating passenger services on the middle and upper reaches of the Shannon.

I cannot see for the life of me why the Minister would not also consider asking C.I.E. to try if the service I refer to could not be given. I understand there was a passenger service between Limerick and Cappagh at one time, and it was availed of and was a financial success. I think, due to the location of Limerick City, such a service would have a great tourist attraction and would also be a considerable financial success. The Minister might consider that point.

The Minister, on the question of tourism, has gone into the greatest detail in speaking in this House about the attractive fisheries which exist for sportsmen in this country and about how it should be possible to attract many visitors from Britain. The Minister must well know that the greatest stretch of salmon fishing that this country ever knew was the Shannon at Castleconnell. I am not talking about the salmon weir at Galway— that is only murder and there is no art in that. The Minister must know that the Shannon at Castleconnell and the Enright rod were world famous, and now, due to action proposed by the E.S.B., which I brought to the attention of the Minister and on which he got misleading information from the board, it is proposed to have a fish pass erected at Ardnacrusha on the head race and that means, in fact, that the salmon will by-pass Castleconnell and land up in Lough Derg. There has been talk of erecting a bridge across the Shannon at Castleconnell. We would like a bridge there, with apologies to Deputy Corry, but there are other places that want these facilities.

There was a good deal of talk about developing Castleconnell as part of the tourist industry. A new industry has started there now or rather has been revised. I refer to the Enright rod. I know the Minister is genuine when he speaks of the great potentialities which exist from the point of view of salmon and trout fisheries, but a very serious position will arise if the E.S.B. proposal is allowed to go through. The Minister cannot get away from it by saying that he has no function. He can use his good offices with the board. The Minister often said he had no function with C.I.E., but if it appeared to him that an injustice would be done due to an action of the board he stepped in. He stepped in when there was a suggestion that the locomotive repair shops be set up in Limerick and that 120 families be brought from Dublin. He used his good offices there with effect to see that that did not happen.

I say to him now that in the interests of the tourist industry and in the interests of this vast area of the Shannon, he should have the whole position examined by impartial experts, or that is the end of Castleconnell and that is the end of fishing on the Shannon, the part of the Shannon, anyway, that is called the lower reaches of the Shannon.

When we came back to office when the Coalition was defeated on the last occasion, we completed the cement factory extension which had been knocked on the head by the Coalition, and, as a result of that Coalition action, the people who bought houses since then have been paying very dearly because foreign cement had to be imported and a subsidy paid. The time has now arrived, evidently, when the maximum output of Drogheda and Limerick is not fully absorbed by this country alone and it appears—and I am informed by people who know much more about it than I do—that there is no reason why Cement Ireland, Ltd., would not go into the export trade.

They are in it already, Deputy.

I am very glad to hear that but I am amazed to hear that such a very important announcement was not mentioned by the Minister in speaking on this Estimate. That is the best bit of news I have heard for a long time—that Cement Ireland, Ltd., are in the export market. A very successful market it will be. I wonder would they have been in this market if the Coalition had killed the plans for the extension in Drogheda and Limerick? That is the best bit of news that I have heard for a long time.

I hope the rest of your speech will be more cheerful.

I am amazed that the Minister made no reference to it. On the question of the oil refinery, I was interested in trying to put in a word for Limerick but I thought I might do more harm than good because some of the Cork Deputies on either side of the House might speak up. That does not mean I am going to injure the future of this industry first envisaged by Deputy Lemass. The Minister has not told us why have Esso, Caltex and Shell been given plenary powers in setting up this refinery. What about the very many other small companies which exist in this country? Are these three large firms to have a cartel and can the Minister say whether or not, as a result of the setting up of the refinery, oil prices will be reduced? Recently the O.E.E.C. published a report wherein they alleged a ring existed in oil prices throughout the world and I think the Minister, before he agreed to allow these three companies to set up a refinery, should have been in a position to obtain further information and be in a position to give the members of the House further detailed information on what will be one of the most important projects or proposals ever to come before this House or to be decided in this country.

Progress reported; Committee to sit again.
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