Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 13 Dec 1979

Vol. 317 No. 9

Supplementary Estimates, 1979. - Vote 47: Army Pensions.

Minister for Defence (Mr. Faulkner)

I move:

Go ndeonófar suim fhorlíontach nach mó ná £1,450,000 chun íoctha an mhuirir a thiocfaidh chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 3 lú lá de Nollaig, 1979, le haghaidh pá scoir, pinsin, cúiteamh, liúntais agus aiscí is iníoctha faoi reachtanna iolartha le comhaltaí d'Óglaigh na hÉireann agus dEagraíochtaí Míleata áirithe eile, etc., nó ina leith sin, agus le haghaidh ranníocaí agus costais éagsúla i ndáil leo sin; le haghaidh liúntais eisreachtúla áirithe leanaí agus le haghaidh ildeontas.

The main Estimate for Army Pensions for the year ending on 31 December 1979 is for a net sum of £15,774,000. The Supplementary Estimate which I am now introducing is for an additional sum of £1,450,000. The gross Supplementary comprises £1,635,000 for pensions and allowances, reduced to £1,450,000 by estimated savings of £185,000 including an increase of £50,000 in Appropriations-in-Aid.

The main Estimate included a provision of £118,000 towards the cost of the increases in pensions and allowances which came into operation from 1 July 1979. The additional sums now sought are required to meet the cost of the actual increases.

In the case of Military Service Pensions—subhead D—and allowances and gratuities paid to dependants under subhead C, the increase with effect from 1 July 1979 amounted to 21.8 per cent. Deputies will be interested to hear that at present there are about 3,000 military service pensioners in receipt of pensions and there are 4,200 widows of military service pensioners in receipt of allowances equal to one half of their deceased husband's pension at current rates subject to a minimum amount of £188.76 a year.

Special allowances, which are provided for in subhead G, have been increased three times this year. In addition to the specific increase of £100 announced in the 1979 Budget, there were two subsequent increases which together amounted to £70. Effectively, therefore, special allowances have been increased at the rate of £170 per annum from 1 July 1979. At present there are some 6,000 special allowance holders involved.

As regards Defence Forces Scheme Pensions—subhead E—increases at various rates, depending on former rank, retrospective to 1 July 1978, have been granted. Effective from 1 July 1979 the increase has been of the order of 10 per cent and a further increase of 9 per cent also effective from that date has been approved.

As regards savings, these are made up of £6,000 for wound and disability pensions—subhead B; £69,000 in respect of grants for free travel and so on—subhead L—and £60,000 for funeral grants—subhead M. In addition there is an increase of £50,000 in Appropriations in Aid—subhead N.

Taken together the effect of these savings is, as I said at the outset, to reduce the current requirement by £185,000 to a net sum of £1,450,000.

Mr. M. Cosgrave

I congratulate the Minister on his appointment and wish him the best of luck and every success in the future. I pay tribute to Deputy Molloy, who formerly held the post. I understand that Deputy Molloy was popular with the Army and that they were very sad to see him go.

I welcome this Estimate and would appeal to the Minister to grant the special allowance without a means test. The recipients of the special allowance are fewer each year and the Minister should pay attention to the means test.

In relation to the targets we have set for the services, I understand that the Army target is 15,000 persons, the Navy target is 1,500 and the Air Corps is 700 persons. This year I understand that 1,000 men have left the Army and that the Navy is 800 persons short. The reason for this could be the poor pension rights, which would not encourage a person to join. Pensions must be improved if we are to encourage people to join. Also the same pension rights should be granted to the Womens Corps when it is set up in the Army.

I paid a visit to our troops in the Lebanon and while I was there tributes were paid to the behaviour of our troops and with regard to the wonderful job they are doing there. President Sarkis of the Lebanon pointed out that we were one of the leaders in the field of peace keeping and have been for the past 20 years, and he also pointed out the dangerous task ahead of our troops. When I visited our troops in the southern part of the Lebanon I found them a little unhappy about pay and pension conditions. Will the Minister look seriously at the position of pensions with a view to encouraging more people to join the services?

Mr. J. Ryan

I wish the Minister well in his new portfolio. He can be assured of my cooperation at all times in my capacity as spokesman on Defence for the Labour Party.

Earlier this year we were given a list of legislative items that were to be introduced in the House. One of those items was an Army Pensions Bill to provide for enhanced pensions for widows or dependants of soldiers killed or who had died from wounds. This Bill was of personal interest because of a tragedy which occurred when a member of the Army from my constituency was killed while on special duty on a parachute course in Peterborough in England some years ago. Deputy Molloy, as Minister for Defence, and I had considerable correspondence and discussion about this case. The outcome of that discussion and correspondence was that the Minister agreed to introduce amending legislation which would cover this case and any similar case that might occur in the future. As yet, this Bill has not been introduced. I would ask the new Minister to introduce this amending legislation promptly in the new year to ensure that the family of the late Corporal Michael Rouine, who was killed in Peterborough in 1976, is paid compensation and that any other people who are the victims of tragedies that might occur in the Army at home or abroad are also compensated.

Minister for Defence (Mr. Faulkner)

I appreciate the remarks of Deputy Cosgrave and Deputy Ryan in relation to my appointment as Minister.

Deputy Cosgrave raised the question of the means test. This has been raised at regular intervals and the Deputy will appreciate that the special allowance is to give a measure of support to veterans who because of age or incapacity are not in a position to support themselves. Considerable changes have been made in the means test over the years and it is not particularly severe at the moment.

Deputy Cosgrave mentioned the Women's Corps. They will be entitled to the same benefits as the men under the Defence Forces pension schemes. The question of whether it will be necessary to bring in special legislation for that purpose is being examined.

Deputy Ryan raised a particular case. The position is that an Army Pensions Bill will be introduced in the near future, which among other things will enable late application such as in the case mentioned to be submitted. I hope to have the Bill introduced in the next session. On behalf of the Army I appreciate the compliments paid to the members of our Defence Forces who are serving abroad.

Vote put and agreed to.

An Ceann Comhairle

Vote No. 21 will be taken with the Finance group of Estimates, so I will move on to Vote 50.