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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Friday, 25 May 1984

Vol. 350 No. 11

Estimates, 1984. - Vote 38: Agriculture (Revised Estimate).

I move:

That a sum not exceeding £268,854,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of December, 1984, for the salaries and expenses of the Office of the Minister for Agriculture, including certain services administered by that Office, and of the Irish Land Commission, and for payment of certain subsidies and sundry grants-in-aid.

Deputies will note from the motion that the provisions for my Department are now included in a single vote and not under two Votes — Agriculture and Lands — as was the case in previous years. This change gives formal recognition to the integration of staff and activities since 1977 and means that common Departmental items such as pay, travel expenses, postal services, etc., are brought together under the A group of subheads while Land Commission services and schemes appear under the L group.

Notes on the main activities of my Department, including the Land Commission, have already been circulated and will, I trust, be of assistance to Deputies in their consideration of the Estimate.

Before dealing with the detailed aspects of the Estimate I should like to make a few general observations on the current situation in agriculture and on its role in the economy.

Developments in the agricultural sector have mirrored to a large extent the path of the national economy in recent years. The year 1979 heralded a reverse in the fortunes of the agricultural sector following the growth in output and incomes of previous years. Gross agricultural output in volume terms fell by nearly 4 per cent between 1978 and 1981. This adverse movement in output was compounded by an equally adverse movement in the relationship between the cost of the farmer's inputs and the prices he received for his output. As a result, farm incomes over the period 1978-1981 fell by 8 per cent in nominal terms and by 43 per cent in real terms.

The year 1982 was one of recovery in farming following three relatively poor years. Gross agricultural output was up by over 3 per cent in volume terms and net agricultural output by over 5 per cent.

This improved development continued in 1983, with gross agricultural output increasing by some 3 per cent in volume terms to stand at some £2,400 million. This represents its highest ever level. The outturn was facilitated by output increases in the cattle, milk, sheep and pig sectors. Total farm incomes increased by some 13 per cent in nominal terms and by about 2 per cent in real terms. Per capita real farm incomes rose by nearly 5 per cent. This growth in real farm incomes has been greatly assisted by the downward trend in the rate of inflation, which is now at its lowest level since 1978.

Overall, the performance of the agricultural sector in 1983 in terms of output, incomes and exports growth was a welcome one following the depression of recent years in farming and is one which we as a Government will be doing our utmost to encourage and build upon this year and in the years ahead.

The 1984-85 farm price package concluded on 30-31 March will have an important bearing on the development of Irish agriculture in these years. The agreement was reached following what has been fairly described as the toughest set of agricultural negotiations since we joined the Community. They were the toughest negotiations in any sphere, agricultural or otherwise, since we joined the Community. We had tough negotiations on fisheries policies in October 1976 at The Hague but most people would agree that the agricultural discussions on the super-levy, which lasted from July 1983 until 31 March 1984, were the toughest since we joined the Community. When one considers the opposition ranged against Ireland in these marathon talks, the outcome we achieved was a very satisfactory one. Much of the comment made since the end of March has been concerned with that part of the arrangement we negotiated on the super-levy. I shall go into this in some detail later when dealing with the milk sector.

The producer price changes in the package were significantly affected by a green currency adjustment. As a result there was a net increase of about 2.5 per cent in the support levy for milk; for beef the net increase is 3 per cent to 4 per cent; for sheepmeat the increase is 5 per cent including the final step in the realignment of Community prices, while an increase of 2.3 per cent is provided for pigmeat, cereals and sugar. There has been a major agreement on MCAs. In future no new fixed positive MCAs will be created following changes in monetary parities. Existing positive MCAs are being reduced and it is the Commission's intention to have them completely removed within a matter of two years. The new negative MCAs created as a consequence of this change are being eliminated at the beginning of the 1984-85 marketing year for each product. The elimination of positive MCAs is of considerable assistance to this country and probably has not received sufficient attention because of the overriding attention given to the super-levy. It will place farmers, farm enterprises and industry in a much better competitive position. Positive MCAs have been a distinct impediment in agricultural trading. The resultant change in the representative rate for the IR£ provided an increase for Irish support prices of some 3.4 per cent. This greatly helped to offset the effect of the original restrictive proposals on prices, which would have involved price reductions for most of the products of interest to Ireland. When one considers the critical financial situation of the EEC, to get any price increase was a considerable achievement. The EEC's agricultural budget is in deficit to the extent of two billion ECUs, about IR£1,300 million. To get concessions in such a dire financial situation is a major achievement.

Another major feature of these negotiations has been the changes in the United Kingdom variable premium scheme for beef — known as the slaughter premium. For a number of years the method of operating the scheme had given United Kingdom beef exporters a considerable advantage over Irish traders on export markets and large numbers of our cattle were being attracted over the Border for slaughter in Northern Ireland. The price package provides for a reduction in the rate of premium and for the introduction of a clawback of the premium on exports of beef from Britain and Northern Ireland. This change will provide new scope for the expansion of the Irish beef industry. I will deal with the matter further when I come to the beef sector.

This has put a number of our beef processing plants in serious difficulty, particularly in the last 18 months to two years, although the premium has been in existence for 11 years since the British joined the EEC. It was introduced to subsidise the price of beef to the British consumer. We never objected when it was being used for that purpose, but in recent years as the British began to be self-sufficient in beef, they began to develop an export market in beef. This meant that a country which was a net importer of beef suddenly became an exporter of processed beef. The variable premium constituted a major subsidy to the export of British beef. What was happening was that they were capturing a considerable number of markets on the Continent which previously had been Irish, and this put many of our exporters in serious difficulty. We have been strenuously opposing the renewal of this premium for the past 15 months and I am glad to say our efforts have been successful. It is significant that representatives of our meat trade say that the removal of the more annoying and damaging aspects of the variable premium have been the most significant developments in the beef industry since our entry into the EEC.

The price package is worth some £65 million to the Irish farm sector in a full year. This figure represents only part of the benefit to Irish agriculture as a result of the negotiations. If one takes account of what the impact on Ireland of the super-levy under the original Commission proposal would have been, there is in effect a further benefit of some £180 million. Given the restrictive budgetary situation in the Community at present, the outcome of this year's price package was most favourable not only for our farmers but for the economy as a whole. If we take the price package as being worth £65 million, the deal on the milk super-levy in the current year being worth £180 million and add the benefit of the changes in the operation of the United Kingdom variable premium and the reduction in positive MCAs, we can see that overall the 31 March agreement is worth a vast amount of money. It is difficult to quantify the last two, but overall the price package would be worth something in the region of £300 million to this country in 1984.

Turning now to the Estimate itself, the gross sum is over £395 million, which is £42 million or 12 per cent above the amount expended in 1983.

Despite this clearcut statistic it is surprising to hear Opposition spokesmen and others saying that there has been a cutback. There has, in fact, been an increase of £42 million, or 12 per cent in 1984 over 1983. The net estimate is up by £13 million or 5 per cent, reflecting the fact that receipts are estimated to rise by £29 million. The sectors which principally contribute to the increase in gross expenditure are salaries and wages, the rescue package and market intervention. The increased receipts arise mainly from EEC contributions in respect of market intervention, veterinary inspection fees and the disease levy, but these are offset by a reduction in EEC receipts under the farm modernisation scheme.

It is important to stress that the gross total of £395 million in the Estimate represents only part of the total expenditure on agriculture. Account must also be taken of the EEC funds disbursed by my Department in respect of agricultural support measures. In 1983 these amounted to some £470 million. In addition, a sum of £310 million was raised to meet the capital cost of intervention purchases of beef, butter, skimmed milk powder and cereals. Thus, on top of the £395 million in the Estimate, a further £780 million was spent on EEC measures. One could say that in the Estimate we are talking about a figure, not of £395 million but something like £1,175 million. That is the true figure which is involved.

I should now like to deal with some of the main agricultural products. The year 1983 was a reasonably satisfactory one for the cattle and beef industry. The volume of cattle output increased by 2 per cent and exports of livestock and meat were worth £180 million and accounted for 45 per cent of agricultural exports. Slaughterings at export plants at 981,000 head were 4 per cent higher than in 1982. Slaughterings this year are showing a welcome upward trend and it is expected that the total for the year will exceed a million head for the first time since 1980.

More than any other single element in the agricultural sector of our economy, beef is an export-oriented industry. It is important in this regard that the industry should consider its output as a consumer product and that from the point of view of job creation and expansion of export outlets, every effort should be made to produce quality and value-added products. Marketing is also vitally important and in this connection CBF's promotional activities on our main markets have been paying dividends. A sum of £785,000 is provided under subhead H.1 to assist CBF to continue those activities.

The expansion of the national herd is essential if the beef industry is to make its proper contribution to farm income and the national economy. There is a wide range of measures which encourage farmers to increase their herds. Thus, there are the cattle headage and beef cow schemes in the disadvantaged areas, the EEC suckler cow scheme, the calved heifer scheme and the calf premium. Taken together an additional calved heifer with calf can represent as much as an extra £157 to a farmer in the disadvantaged areas and an extra £106 to a farmer elsewhere. These are very worthwhile incentives indeed.

When speaking about CBF and their valuable work, I must compliment them on the markets which they are helping to secure in third countries. They have been doing wonderful work in countries in Northern Africa and the Middle East, Egypt — which is a huge new market in recent years — Libya, Algeria, Saudi-Arabia, Iraq and more recently Iran, where, with the help of CBF and some of our major meat processors we secured a contract worth some £80 million for processed beef. The CBF are to be complimented on the efforts which they are making to open up these new markets which are invaluable to our cattle industry.

Currently there are some indications of shortfalls in supplies from traditional beef exporters to the world market. We should do everything possible to derive the maximum benefit from this situation. As I have mentioned, slaughterings at beef export premises are in fact showing buoyancy at present.

Some countries, particularly Saudi-Arabia and Australia have not the same volume of supplies as they normally would have and we have been able to benefit from the shortage of supplies in the world market. That has been a great help to us in getting these additional markets abroad. Of course, we shall always have the controversy as to whether we should export cattle live or in processed form. The answer is that one must pay attention to the market demand. If people want to buy live cattle and we have them, we have an obligation to sell live cattle. However, it would be preferable if the meat were processed before leaving the country. That is a natural evolution. There is a continuous increase in the proportion of beef processed before export. I gave the figure here last year showing that since we joined the EEC there has been a radical change in that regard. When we joined we were exporting about two-thirds of our beef on the hoof, in other words live. We were exporting one-third in a processed form. Last year's statistics showed that the situation has been reversed, with two-thirds of the beef being exported in processed form and one-third live. The trend towards processed rather than live beef is continuing and is to be welcomed and encouraged. It means more jobs here.

I must stress that the live trade has always given the beef industry that competitive aspect which is so vital. When that competitive aspect was not available back in 1974, there were disastrous repercussions within our beef trade. It is vital that there be a strong element of competition to keep prices up.

The EEC price agreement this year included two measures of great importance for the beef sector. Firstly, as I have already indicated, a clawback of the variable premium has been introduced for all exports of beef from the UK. This removes a serious anomaly which had enabled British and Northern exporters to outbid our factories for cattle and undercut them in selling beef abroad. With this distorting element out of the way, we should now see the resumption of fair competition and, I trust, a return of our exporters to some markets they have been squeezed out of in recent years. We retain entitlement to the variable premium on our own exports of cattle and beef to Britain. If the premium, while it operates, were not applicable to our exports to Britain, it just would not be possible for us to sell on the market there. The payment of the premium on our supplies merely equalises conditions of competition on the UK market. This does not give us preferential treatment on the British or other markets. It merely equalises our ability to compete. I notice that some British commentators and people in the beef trade said that it would give us an advantage, but it does not. It merely equalises what has been for us an unfair situation. Similarly, the clawback of premium on exports of beef from the UK merely puts our exporters once again on an equal footing with UK exporters. We shall be in a position to get back some of our markets. These were primarily on the Continent, in Germany and France. They were taken by British exporters of beef who had this unfair competitive edge because of the premium which was introduced as a subsidy for the British consumer but which had been translated into an export subsidy for British beef exporters.

The other major development has been the introduction of the carcase classification grid for intervention purchasing throughout the Community. The object is to buy-in identical qualities of cattle in all ten member states, and to pay identical prices for them. Prices for some qualities in some continental member states were appreciably higher than here, and while the harmonisation is not happening all at once, we have made a start. More or less the same qualities are now being bought-in in all member states and prices are being harmonised in three stages, with final alignment due in April 1986. The effect of the alignment in our case this year was to offset a 1 per cent fall in the intervention price; and so allowing for the green rate adjustment, our intervention prices have actually risen by about 3.5 per cent on average since the beginning of April. The markedly higher intervention prices for better grades should provide the incentive for farmers to produce a better quality of beef cattle than at present. People will now get paid proportionately for good quality beef which has not necessarily been the case in the past. There was not much of an incentive for people to produce high quality beef because of the lack of a system such as a classification premium.

Also in the beef sector, we have retained the EEC suckler cow premium with the special Community financing arrangement for Ireland being continued. In addition, the agreement includes the continuation of the calf premium but at a reduced rate of about £10 per calf. This is very welcome considering that the original proposal was for the abolition of the calf premium completely. Some Opposition Member announced in the House that it had been abolished. It is not abolished. It is retained at £10 per calf.

Some references have been made recently to the cost of operating the inspection service at meat factories and the fees charged to the factories for the service. In fact, the overall cost of the service is estimated at £7.3 million while the fees charged are expected to realise £5.8 million. The Department do not make any profit on the inspection fees being collected. They actually have to subsidise the veterinary services being provided.

It should not be overlooked that my Department are obliged under national law and EEC rules to provide this service. Indeed, since Ireland is a major exporter of beef it is necessary to be particularly careful about our inspection arrangements. With increased consumer awareness greater demands are in fact being placed on our resources in this area. The inspection service extends further than the factory floor. For example, we are now obliged to a greater extent than heretofore to provide laboratory services to check samples for freedom from a wide variety of residues. The service provided is monitored on an on-going basis and every effort is made to see that economies are effected consistent with the need to provide an efficient and comprehensive service.

People who complain about the cost of these services should remember that the people to whom we are exporting are watching comments which are being made about the quality of beef in this country. If they are not happy that we are taking every possible measure to see that the quality is of the highest standard then our beef export trade will be jeopardised. The veterinary inspection fees are a very small proportion of the cost of beef and cattle in this country at the moment. It is a very small price to pay and it is essential that we satisfy our customers that there is no dangerous residue in the meat that is exported.

My Department are continuing the various measures for improving the genetic merit of our livestock and expenditure on these appears under subhead C.1. Imports of high quality bulls and semen of proven bulls are being continued and the programmes of progeny testing bulls in AI and of performance testing beef breed bulls are being expanded. In addition, under the EEC Programme of Special Measures for Ireland, £300,000 is being provided as part of subhead M.9 to expand performance and progeny testing facilities. Inseminations by the AI service were 1,305,000 in 1983 and maintained their upward trend with beef breeds accounting for 53 per cent of the total as compared with 47 per cent for dairy breeds. The EEC programme also provided an AI subsidy but this ceased at 30 April when the programme expired. I am anxious to see the re-introduction of a subsidy because of its beneficial effects in encouraging the use of AI and I am hopeful that I still can make some progress on this. I am actually entertaining plans at the moment of adopting strategies which may well result in the resumption of this very valuable subsidy.

Following the discontinuation of bull licensing in 1983, I had the matter examined by the Cattle Advisory Committee. In the light of their recommendations, some alternative arrangements are currently being considered. I am providing £305,000 under subhead C.1. to fund the reorganisation of the revised milk recording service. Full responsibility for the service will shortly devolve to the Irish Dairy Records Co-operative, which is representative of creamery co-ops, milk boards and AI bodies. While I expect that over 100,000 cows will be milk recorded this year, we are still a long way behind our European partners in this important activity. However, I am confident that the new co-op will generate a rapid expansion in the level of milk recording in the next few years.

Creamery milk production in 1983 at close to 1,015 million gallons showed an increase of some 9 per cent compared with the previous year. The upward trend has been maintained this year but at a more modest rate. Assuming that the industry organises itself effectively to take advantage of the concession won in the super-levy negotiations, expansion should continue throughout this year. The volume increase in 1983, combined with the relatively modest price rise, resulted in a significant improvement in returns from dairying.

It is true, that, in spite of the action aimed at achieving market balance which was agreed upon recently in the Council of Ministers, the Community milk market is still faced with great difficulties. Owing to the continuing economic recession and strong pressure from competitors, Community exports of the main dairy products, with the exception of cheese, show a disturbing decline and intervention stocks are currently at unprecedented high levels. People will have to bear that in mind. We cannot be living in a fool's paradise. Intervention stocks are still building up enormously.

Hand in hand with the new quota system in the dairy sector, we can expect a restrictive price policy for some time. More than ever before, dairy farmers will need to exercise greater control over costs and achieve a more efficient use of inputs so that the maximum benefit is obtained from investment and the continued profitability of dairying is ensured. With prudent management and in spite of the super-levy, it will still be attractive for many farmers to continue to expand milk production. We still have genuine potential for development in the dairy industry in Ireland and it is in the interests of both farmers and the economy as a whole to exploit it; otherwise, we will be failing to make use of the valuable concessions obtained in the super-levy negotiations. Producers should not think they are tied to an increase of 4.6 per cent. In many cases people will be able to increase their milk production in 1984 by as much as 15 or 20 per cent, because there will always be people going out of milk production. Some may do so because of disease in their animals, others may decide to let their land. This will mean that some farmers will be able to jump forward and develop at a faster rate than ever, but it is something they must do in conjunction with their local co-operative from whom they must get very careful advice. There will be enormous opportunities for people to expand, even with the 4.6 increase. Development farmers should be able to expand well in excess of that.

It is worth emphasising the extent to which concessions have been made to us on the super-levy issue. The Commission originally proposed a super-levy based on 1981 deliveries plus 1 per cent. This would have resulted in a cutback in Irish deliveries of over 13 per cent and would have prevented all possibility of improvement in the future. It would have been an unmitigated disaster for the Irish dairy industry, Irish agriculture and the whole economy if it had been adopted. The Government used every diplomatic and politicial approach open to them to oppose the proposal and to make the facts of the Irish milk situation and the unique importance of milk to the Irish economy known to our partners.

The significance of the contribution made by the Taoiseach to these negotiations is not stressed often enough. His knowledge of the workings of the super-levy proposal and of the price package in general, designed to bring about financial rectitude within the EEC, absolutely baffled other heads of government and ministers. There was widespread recognition that his grasp of the situation was brilliant and that it was of major assistance. Ireland's negotiating team at those talks was exceptional. The senior officials from the Department of Agriculture, in particular, excelled. The standard of our team was at least on a par with any other group of officials at the talks and probably superior. That was a major contributory factor to the satisfactory outcome of the discussions. The officials of the Department of Agriculture and the Department of Foreign Affairs, as well as the Irish ambassador in Brussels and his staff, all played a very significant part. They contributed in an excellent manner at the initial talks in Athens and the later talks in Brussels. It was their good advice and diligence which led to the breakthrough at the end of the day. Many of our counterparts still cannot believe that we got such a concession.

For a while it looked as if there would be an agreement among the other member states on a super-levy with a basis considerably less rigid than the 1981 base proposed. In that context our problem would not have been as difficult to solve. The original Greek proposal made in Athens last December was generous, but the Commission found it too generous and could not afford to pay for it. They made sure that the eventual proposals were a lot less generous.

We were particularly fortunate in that the Presidency of the EEC happened to be in the hands of two countries who were most helpful. The Greeks could not have done more for us and at no stage during the French Presidency did France show anything but the greatest sympathy for Ireland's case. They were absolutely wonderful and backed us to the hilt to the end, even when the bulk of the other countries were showing tremendous resistance to any special exemption for Ireland. The French always stood by us, as did the Greeks.

As the budget and market situation worsened it became clear early this year that most member states were prepared to settle for a super-levy based on 1981 production plus 1 per cent. The longer the super-levy debate went on, the more difficult it became for us to get a good deal because of the chronic financial crisis within the Community. I hate to think what would have happened if we had not reached a satisfactory conclusion on 31 March. The cutbacks which had already been made by the Commission would have seemed like child's play compared with what they would have had to do subsequently. It is only common sense to recognise that support for intervention and export refunds would have been very seriously affected and would have had enormously damaging repercussions for agriculture here. People in the dairy and meat industries recognise that fact, although it may not be generally known. There would have been a shattering effect because of the critical state of the finances of the Community. The agriculture budget for 1984, even with the agreement for cutbacks, is in deficit to the tune of 2 billion ECUs, IR£1,300 million. Without the agreement of 31 March those figures would be increased considerably because there would be no curtailment on the output of milk and the situation would deteriorate very quickly, affecting this country more than any other country proportionately because of our dependence on milk and beef exports. We did not let that fact deter us from getting the best possible deal. The most extraordinary outcome of the talks is that while we were under immense pressure we still got the maximum possible deal in percentage terms.

For a number of member states the deal meant accepting a production cutback of up to 8 per cent and this made the negotiation of a derogation for Ireland very difficult indeed. Because of reserves and other implications of the super-levy in individual countries, some farmers are taking cutbacks of up to 12 per cent. In Britain it is 9 per cent. This is a colossal cutback. It is no wonder we have heard rumours in recent weeks that Northern Ireland farmers are offering milk to Southern co-operatives for 40p a gallon. The alternative is to pour it down the drain. Of course there would be no question of our accepting any such milk from Northern Ireland or anywhere else. It is our duty to fill the quota ourselves but this shows the panic in countries which have had to take cutbacks of up to 12 per cent. Because of the outcome of the discussions, relations between me and some of the other agriculture Ministers are not as good as they might be. This is only natural because they have had to take a terrible beating from their own farmers. Nevertheless most of them have accepted it and I do not believe there will be any lasting ill will towards Ireland. They are being hammered for taking a reduction while we are getting an increase.

It is important that we maintain good relations because everything in Brussels is done by consensus. You do not go around kicking down doors or hammering tables with your fists or your shoes, like Khruschev did 25 years ago. You must negotiate like a reasonable human being. It does not suit us to be making bad friends; we can be tough, uncompromising and rigid in our stand, but that is expected and people admire you for doing it.

In the end a series of compromises was put forward to meet our position. The one to which we finally agreed gave us a basic entitlement of 1983 deliveries plus over 4.6 per cent with a guarantee that this quantity could not be reduced. Furthermore we are to have priority in the division of any quantities which become available in future years. That is an important commitment.

In accepting this we were conscious of how far we had advanced from the original Commission proposal. We were also acutely aware of the impossibility of getting further concessions from our partners, most of whom were themselves having to settle for substantial cutbacks in production. To the extent that any delay would have caused a further deterioration in the budgetary position, a later settlement would inevitably have been a worse settlement. In those circumstances we accepted the final compromise which gave us the right to expand this year at a rate similar to our average over the past decade and which held out the prospect of further increases being possible in the future. If the national increase here in 1984 was only 2 per cent on 1983 it does not mean that we will have lost 2.6 per cent. We still retain that 4.6 per cent. That is our base year, not 1981, as is the case with the other countries. We do not believe there will be enormous quantities of milk available in 1985 because it will take the super-levy some time to take effect — how long is very difficult to gauge.

Certainly, the position of the industry here is far different from that of the industries elsewhere in the Community. The reductions in the case of three of the largest milk producing member states are between 7 per cent and 8 per cent compared to 1983. The fact that in those circumstances our partners were prepared to concede so much to us is a testimony to the strength of our case and the persistence with which we pursued it. It is a testimony also to the political courage of the Ministers concerned in the other member states who recognised the tremendous problem which the super-levy proposal presented for us.

Anybody who reads the British or European papers will notice that. The reaction has been quite violent. It was always in our interest that the escalating imbalance between the dairy production in the Community and the disposal possibilities available should be brought under control. However, it was essential this should be done without causing real damage to our own industry. We have succeeded in achieving this, and that is a major success.

This was itemised in The Farmers Journal this week. They gave details of the trends of milk production in other countries. It is too early yet to see the effects of the super-levy. It will be a couple of years before we can be definite about future prospects. Taking March and April, there were tiny increases in some European countries, about 2 per cent. There were decreases in places like Holland and the UK. In March in the UK it was 2.8 per cent and in Holland, which was the most intensive milk producer in the Community, the decrease was 4 per cent in the month of April. From those figures it appears that the super-levy is beginning to bite. In West Germany, another intensive milk producer, there has been an increase of 0.1 per cent.

In contrast, the Irish figures are rather interesting. The figures for the first quarter showed an increase of 9.2 per cent and in March alone it was 6.8 per cent. While others were almost static or dropping, Ireland has jumped forward, which shows we are living up to what we said we could do.

Milk production in the first quarter in the US has gone down by 1.4 per cent. That is a welcome trend because many of the problems in Europe in recent years were caused by the US flooding Europe with milk products at low prices. We have been involved in cut-throat competition on the open world market with the US and, to a lesser extent with New Zealand. However, the US have made valiant efforts to cut back on their milk production. They did it in a way which we would abhor, the alternative to the super-levy, the cutting of prices directly. It is a different method from getting people to drop production. Milk production in the US is decreasing. I had hoped it would have decreased by more because one way to get rid of the huge stocks of intervention butter is to reduce competition from countries like the US. We know how Bord Bainne lost a huge market in Mexico last year because the US undercut us: they sold a vast quantity of skimmed milk powder to Mexico at dirt cheap prices and we were not able to compete. The sooner European countries generally, with the exception of Ireland, cut back production according with the super-levy proposals, and the Americans do it by cutting prices, the better. We can then hope for a further leap forward in milk production here. That is our ambition.

The successful outcome of the super-levy negotiations affords our producers real possibilities for continued expansion of milk output. It is essential that we produce up to the full level of our guaranteed quantity. Failure to do this would represent inefficiency in the use of our production and processing capacity and it would also weaken our case for an increased quota in future years. There are indications that producers now realise the flexibility which Ireland's special super-levy arrangement allows them and that they will respond in a disciplined and intelligent manner to the circumstances which now prevail.

Deputies will be aware Ireland has opted for what is know as formula B for the purpose of the super-levy. This means that the quotas will be on a creamery or dairy basis so that a surplus in some creameries can be offset against decreases in others. I am glad to say that there is a good possibility that a national purchasing agency will be set up which will include most if not all creameries and dairies. It does not matter too much if three or four drop out. The purpose of a national purchasing agency is to achieve flexibility and mobility in the use of milk. In other words, if one co-operative does not achieve the target of 4.6 per cent and if another co-operative is in excess of that figure, milk can be transferred from one to the other through the national purchasing agency. It is a most desirable objective and I am glad to say the farming bodies in the umbrella organisation of the co-operatives are fully in agreement with our suggestions in this regard.

With regard to the allocations to creameries and dairies, I have had a joint recommendation from the IFA and the ICMSA that a special allocation of milk should be made to small producers. The allocation will apply to such producers all over the country but because of the greater proportion of small producers in the west the recommendation will have the effect of switching milk from the south and the south-east to western areas. There is some disagreement within the co-operative organisations about the recommendation. I had a meeting yesterday afternoon with the IFA and the ICMSA about the matter and I hope to make an announcement during the coming week. It is a very vexed question. The farming bodies have made a recommendation that would have allowed a considerable shift of milk from the southern part of the country to western and northern parts but, on the other hand, the big co-operatives in the south feel they would suffer financially by the introduction of such a scheme. We have to have a certain balance in the system and that is not easy. I know the Ceann Comhairle is anxious about the matter and is fearful that Killeshandra, Bailie-boro', Monaghan town and Lough Egish might not do so well. I am sure he thinks that people in the north-east and the north-west should get extra consideration. I sympathise but I have my own problems also.

I must maintain my role as constitutional chairman.

There are difficulties but I hope we can come to a reasonable accommodation. One would require the wisdom of Solomon to arrive at a conclusion satisfactory to all.

(Limerick West): The Minister has all the wisdom.

I have a certain amount of native cunning but that kind of wisdom is in short supply. While the increase in milk deliveries in Ireland is most welcome it has implications for Exchequer expenditure. In line with the trend elsewhere in the Community, there has been substantially increased usage of the EEC intervention support system here during the current year. At present we have 77,000 tonnes of butter in intervention and 73,000 tonnes of skimmed milk powder. These involve a capital investment of over £250 million and it is expected this will increase to over £375 million by the end of the year. The capital will be reimbursed by the Community when the stocks are disposed of but in the interim there will be a considerable net cost to the Exchequer in financing the capital and in storing the product. This expenditure is, of course, justified in order to give the necessary support to the milk sector but nevertheless it represents an additional Exchequer burden which we can ill afford.

In addition, the reimbursement is not fully in line with interest rates because the rate at which we get reimbursement is less than the current interest rates. It represents a considerable cost to the Exchequer and we would be in a much better position to help agriculture if we did not have any stocks in intervention. Putting commodities into intervention is costing us a considerable amount and if we could get rid of the 77,000 tonnes of butter and the 73,000 tonnes of skimmed milk powder we would be in a much healthier position financially. In recent months we have had to lease ships to put butter into intervention because we have not been able to find sufficient storage on the mainland. That is an indication of the seriousness of the problem. I appeal to the co-operatives and the processors to produce commodities that do not have to be put into intervention. I know that the word "diversify" has been bandied about like confetti but it is essential for the dairy industry that we produce a whole range of new products that can be sold on the open market. Some of the products now going into intervention will have to be dumped eventually. There is no sale for those products at the moment and they will not last indefinitely, even in cold storage. They will not be fit for human consumption after a certain period. It is important to diversify but we have been particularly negligent in the past in not producing products that could be sold at home and abroad.

I am glad that certain co-operatives have taken an initiative in this regard. Recently the Kerry co-operative announced a research and development programme costing £1.7 million. They are moving into a whole range of new products, not just in milk but in pork and bacon also. They have even set up marketing offices in London and Chicago. This is the kind of enterprise and initiative we need. A number of other co-operatives, including one in Waterford and one in the Ceann Comhairle's constituency in Monaghan, have gone into the production of yogurt with considerable success. Other co-operatives have gone into the cream liqeur market. I was in Bailieboro' recently and there the organisation is about to erect a large factory for the manufacturing of fat cheese mainly for export. Intervention is costing us a lot of money and it is endangering the whole milk scene in Europe because of the cost. We must sell our products instead of putting them into intervention and collecting the money. That is not really playing the game. Intervention is a safety hatch: its purpose is not to allow people to mass produce commodities that cannot be sold.

I mentioned the initiative taken by the Kerry co-operative but other co-operatives are doing likewise. I was pleased to see that Bord Bainne are talking about having a fund of £5 million to promote the development of new varieties of milk products. I hope there will be agreement between the co-operatives to collect that money because we need that kind of development.

I am disappointed at the lack of utilisation of the dairy science faculty in UCC. This faculty was built not only for dairy science but also for meat processing in the late 1970s at a cost of £6 million. This is a sizeable amount of research and development. I visited the area two weeks ago. The faculty in question is outstanding, but I am sad that it is not being utilised to the full by food processors. It is a sad reflection on us when we should be diversifying. We have some of the best facilities in Europe available at very nominal charges. It is a shame that people are not availing of that facility. It is an indictment of many of the people involved in the food processing industry. Some co-operatives and processors are using it but they are in a minority.

A major provision in the Estimate is that of £56.05 million under subhead E. for the consumer subsidies on milk and butter. The present rates of subsidy are about 4p per pint on milk in the Dublin area and 4.5p per pint elsewhere and 23p per lb. on butter. These are very substantial subsidies, reducing the price of milk by some 17 per cent and that of butter by about 20 per cent.

Pork and bacon, or pig meat as they call it in the European market, have been under considerable pressure in the last year, particularly in the final quarter of 1983. The problem is due to poor markets, not just in this country but throughout the Community. Over the year, I sought the introduction of several remedial measures to alleviate some of the problems producers were facing. As part of the 1983-84 prices package I negotiated the transfer to Ireland of feed wheat from intervention stores in Germany. More recently, I got the EEC to introduce aids for private storage of pigmeat and this has been very beneficial to bacon producers here. We also got increases in the level of export refunds on specialised pork cuts to Japan and that also has been very beneficial to our industry. We had a major success in the bacon and pork export market to Japan in 1983 but it is not as good as it looks. We got into Japan in a big way because the Danes were ruled out of the Japanese market because of an outbreak of disease in Denmark. Denmark is now disease free, they have got back into the Japanese market and are highly competitive. Whereas we exported £25 million worth of bacon and pork to Japan in 1983 we will not be able to attain that figure in 1984. We are making efforts to maintain a strong foothold in that market but the Danes are very strong competitors and are willing to reduce the prices dramatically to get back into a market like that.

There are now some signs of an upturn in the market. Producer prices have risen in recent weeks and the increase, coupled with an expected decline in feed costs, will be very welcome to producers. I am glad to say that there has been a smooth transition in replacing the State-sponsored body, the Pigs and Bacon Commission. The transfer to Pigs and Bacon Commission Ltd., the private company, took place on 1 August 1983. I mentioned that our exports to Japan were worth £25 million, that figure should have been £30 million. There has been a change recently in the industry's own arrangements for exporting pigmeat and this is, of course, a matter which can only be resolved by the industry itself. It would be serious if the long-term interest of the industry were to suffer but I am sure they are able to solve their problems.

We have had considerable investment recently in the pork and bacon industry and the Minister for Industry, Trade, Commerce and Tourism, Deputy John Bruton, announced projects last Monday amounting to over £20 million mainly in the pigmeat sector although to a lesser degree they also involve poultry. It is encouraging to see people investing so heavily in bacon and pork products. I saw details of the projects and some are very advanced. The whole trend is towards value-added products, particularly with an eye to the export market. In this regard, it is interesting to note that we have not been exporting bacon to the United States and many of these firms which were grant-aided as a result of last Monday's announcement will be working with an eye on the American market which has enormous potential. There are many bacon plants in this country which should be modernised and upgraded and should improve their facilities. I mentioned Hanleys of Rooskey, and McCarrens of Cavan who have modernised their plants——

It is a great constituency.

Everything good in this speech refers to your constituency. Those firms have advanced and one of the projects announced last Monday referred to a concern in Naas where they are amalgamating three slaughtering houses for a centralised operation, that is the only way to operate efficiently. To compete with Denmark and Holland you must work on a large scale, be highly modernised and efficient. Unfortunately, many of our bacon plants do not fall into that category. The Government and the IDA are willing to help them if they put their best foot forward. I am sad to note that there has not been a tendency in the southern part of the country to get together to utilise central slaughtering facilities or to modernise. They do not seem to have the will to do that and I said so in my recent trips around the country. I am told that the advantage is as much as £4 per pig if they are slaughtered in a central factory as was opened in Naas last week and those in Rooskey and Cavan. That is a considerable amount of money and if the pig industry is to be competitive it must invest in that type of operation. People must co-operate and co-ordinate their efforts rather than running small, potentially uneconomic units.

In the EEC they refer to mutton and lamb as sheepmeat, although I do not know how they differentiate between lamb and mutton. The EEC sheepmeat regime has provided sheep farmers with a valuable measure of stability. The growth in sheep numbers from 2.34 million in 1980 to 2.54 million in 1983 is indicative of the encouragement which the regime has offered, particularly in the number of lowland sheep.

In regard to ewe premium payments under the sheepmeat regulations, the total premium for 1983-84 was fixed in Brussels this week at over £13 per ewe. Some £5 of this has already been paid and the balance of £8 will be paid to the 30,000 flockowners in the country at an early date. This will mean that flockowners will receive some £26 million from the EEC in respect of the premium for the year. In addition, flockowners in the disadvantaged areas will receive about £9 million in headage payments.

While our exports to continental markets are faring reasonably well, not all Irish lamb is commanding a premium price. It is necessary to have greater emphasis on the production of the quality of lamb which export markets require. Quality begins with breeding. It is particularly important that only the best rams are used, and that ewes unsuitable for the production of a good quality lamb are culled from the flock. Of course, breeding is not the only factor. It should be accompanied by good management involving attention to proper feeding and good husbandry.

As regards encouraging the better quality of sheep in lowland areas, ACOT have said they intend to provide a further research station in a lowland area in the eastern part of the country. It would seem that we have put an over-emphasis on hill sheep up to now. By that I do not mean anything derogatory. It has been the most traditional way of sheep farming. There is an outstanding market for good quality lowland sheep, and we have not been taking advantage of the potential in that area. Our breeding patterns have not been good enough. I am glad the Department in conjunction with the sheep breeders' associations are importing a number of top class rams from Britain in particular in order to improve the strain of our lambs. We are making considerable progress in that regard and it is a very welcome development.

I have been speaking to people in the sheep trade in France and Germany. They would love to get more Irish lamb, but they object to the quality. By that I mean specifically that our lamb is too fat. Continentals have an aversion to eating meat of any kind which contains fat. Why I do not know. I like a bit of fat on meat and I think most Irish people do. I like streaky bacon or a bit of fat on steak or a chop. I do not see anything objectionable about that. It is a fact of life that most of the continentals will eat only pure lean meat and our lamb is much too fat. We have to improve the quality of our breeding stock.

Up to now we have had a system which seemed to be aimed only at producing heavy fat lamb. I suppose that was for the home market primarily. We must think of the export market. If we are to develop that we must produce lean meat. The same goes for beef. The beef processors have gone out of their way to try to produce a quality of animal which will be well received on the Continent. There is still a problem with beef. In our markets in third countries we are running into difficulties. People in North Africa and in the Middle East also tell us they want lean meat.

Our exporters have been finding it difficult to compete with the Germans and the French who are exporting to those markets. They are producing a great deal of bull beef which is particularly lean but not as succulent as Irish beef. It is lean and it is more acceptable for export. Those are areas to which we need to pay particular attention. Our export trade in lamb and sheep is being seriously inhibited because the quality is not just right for export. It is too fat.

Sheep rearing is one of the least capital intensive enterprises and mixed stocking of sheep and cattle can be quite profitable. While many farmers have not traditionally engaged in sheep production, it would be worth their while in present circumstances to look at this line of production as a means of augmenting their income. There is a second and probably more important reason why people should be looking at sheep as an alternative type of farm enterprise. Sheep meat is about the only commodity in the Community which we can produce and which is under-supplied. I am open to correction on that. It is about the only major commodity we produce which is in deficit in the Community. The community are producing about 75 per cent of their needs of sheep meat. They have a vast surplus of milk, cereals and wine. They have an over supply of beef, pork and bacon. There is an enormous potential for growth in the sheep market.

The year 1983 was not a particularly good year for the poultry industry. In the egg sector higher prices for feeding stuffs and reduced consumption led to weaker returns to producers. However, an encouraging feature has been the good response to the scheme of aid for commercial egg packers for which provision is made under subhead M.6. This scheme provides grants to enable the packers to modernise their premises and, in addition, the investment attracts substantial FEOGA aid.

Many of our problems in the poultry and egg areas are due to the fact that producers in Northern Ireland are far more competitive. Their structures were much more advanced when we all entered the EEC in 1973. As well as that, their overhead costs are lower. That is a strain which runs through my whole speech where I am referring to the processing industry. Our costs are a very serious handicap when it comes to competition not only in the export markets but in the market at home.

In last week's report on food substitutes, in other words, foods which we could produce at home but which we are importing, poultry and eggs were very high on the list. We are importing over £20 million worth of poultry and eggs largely from Northern Ireland because up to now we have been relatively uncompetitive. There is a recognition of this within the industry and, in last Monday's announcement about a series of new industries by the Minister for Industry, Trade, Commerce and Tourism, there were a number of projects involving poultry and the processing of poultry products of the value-added type. That is exactly what we need.

It is an interesting statistic that consumption of turkeys here has doubled over the past five years which means the consumption of turkeys in not confined to Christmas Day only. The turkey is becoming a bird for all seasons. Consumption of chicken has also inceased considerably. There is a vibrant home market and there are considerable possibilities for exports as well. We will give every possible aid to the industry.

The acreage under cereals in 1983 showed a reduction of about 7 per cent as compared with 1982 but yields were above average, with the exception of spring barley. About two-thirds of the total cereals acreage is given to feeding barley, while wheat and malting barley make up most of the balance. There has been a swing in recent years from spring to winter varieties with the result that about 82 per cent of the crop is now winter wheat. In the 1983-84 marketing year, grain prices have remained above support price levels and no grain has been offered into intervention. Sales of compound feedingstuffs increased by over 10 per cent in 1983. I suppose that is a reflection of the fact that farm incomes have picked up. This was due also to weather conditions, particularly in the spring time when grass was late and scarce.

For some two years the flourmilling industry has been experiencing difficulty in competing with lower priced imported flour. I would appeal to all concerned, consumers, retailers, bakers, flourmillers and grain growers to bear in mind the importance of a national flourmilling industry to our economy. I can understand that the availability of cheaper flour is attractive but it should be remembered that the native flour milling and wheat growing industries are dependent on the support of the Irish consumer.

I should like to say at this juncture that I am not at all happy about the level of flour imports. Some people will say that we should stop those imports but that is a simplistic and incorrect argument. We cannot do that unless the EEC deem those imports to be dumping. In my opinion there must be a very strong suspicion that the imports of flour from Britain are being sold at a cheaper price to Irish bakeries than are being sold to bakeries in Britain. That is suspicious and indicates that the excess production of flour in Britain is being hived off on us. If it is being hived off at what appears to be a lesser price it constitutes dumping. We brought this to the notice of the European Commission and, in particular, Commissioner Andriessan who is responsible for unfair competition. I had a meeting last week with the Minister for Industry, Trade, Commerce and Tourism and I let it be known that I intend bringing this matter to the attention of the Commission. We will not tolerate the dumping of flour here because it results in a loss of jobs in the flour milling industry and it is also causing a reduced rate of growing of cereals. It is particularly worrying that this is going on and that the Commission are not taking any action. We will have to continue to press them to take action. Our flour milling business could be in jeopardy if this trend is allowed to continue. There are indications that the imports are increasing rather than decreasing or stabilising. It is up to the Commission to deal with this. We have made our case but we will make it again. We will have to continue to press the Commission to take action.

The commercial horticultural sector continued to make a valuable contribution to overall agricultural output. The acreage of field vegetables increased by 2 per cent while mushrooms production continued to expand and now accounts for 18 per cent of total output. People will be pleased to hear that we have a substantial export trade in mushrooms, processed mushrooms in particular. Tomato growers benefit from the heavy demand resulting from the exceptionally good weather, and the difficulties of recent years were not repeated. The weather last spring and early summer was ideal for tomato production. It did not suit growers in Britain or on the Continent. The Dutch producers in particular took a bit of a beating last year and we did not have that enormous flood of cheap Dutch tomatoes on our market. Irish producers were able to corner the market for a substantial part of the year.

Under subhead D.3 I am continuing the provision towards the cost of a market co-ordinator for glasshouse products. This project was launched last year in order to bring much needed improvement into the organised marketing of Irish tomatoes and other glasshouse crops. The main function of the co-ordinator is to provide a link between growers and traders so as to facilitate the orderly flow of produce to the market throughout the season. He also has the task of seeking to organise a much greater participation of growers in producer groups and, in this connection, a provision of £25,000 has been made under subhead M.8 towards the formation and operation of costs of producer groups. I sincerely hope that both growers and traders will give these measures their full support.

The acreage of main crop potatoes decreased by approximately 12 per cent in 1982 to 32,000 hectares compared with 36,000 in the previous year. In addition yields were down considerably on the previous year. Although the acreage decreased the yields were down substantially because it was a very bad potato-growing year. I have had to allow in Cypriot potatoes in recent weeks because the Irish stocks were either so inferior that we could not expect the public to purchase them or they had run out completely.

We did not have any dumping of those potatoes. There were no reception committees on the quays to meet them this year. They have been accepted and I have not had one complaint about the bringing in of Cypriot potatoes this year. My officials tell me I am being brought to the European Court for not allowing them in last year. The Cypriots have a special concession with regard to the export of their potatoes to the Community but I refused to accept that last year because we had a glut here. It did not seem to make good sense that we should allow in potatoes from Cyprus when we had too many of them at home. This year we have to bring in Cypriot potatoes to augment our rather meagre supplies. Imports of potatoes were approximately 31,000 tonnes in 1983 compared with 84,000 tonnes in 1982. There was a welcome decrease in the amount of imports but they are still too high. We should not be importing any potatoes here except some at this time of the year when the main crop has been used up or has deteriorated in quality and we are waiting for the new crop — they may not be available for a further two or three weeks. It is nice that the total of imports was considerably less in 1983 than in 1982.

In my Estimate speech last year I referred to the need to improve quality and presentation of Irish potatoes and to the need for proper storage and other things that go to help potatoes retain their quality. We provided £100,000 in the Estimates to help set up a national potato co-operative and we are permitting the growers to organise this themselves. I believe this move will be successful and if it is it will be a considerable advancement. We would then be encouraged to introduce the same concept to other areas in the horticultural field, we could have horticultural co-operatives and fruit co-operatives. We are experimenting with the national potato co-operative and I hope it will prove successful so that we can move on further. In addition we are providing £120,000 to enable Irish Potato Marketing Limited to compete in the highly competitive seed export market. We have taken a beating in that area in recent years. The Dutch, and the British, have perfected a superior variety of potatoes for seed purposes and taken a lot of our markets abroad. Donegal seed potato growers in particular have experienced great difficulty because of the competition from abroad. However, we have developed a new variety here called Lara which is proving competitive.

The sugar industry continues to improve. We have produced 197,000 tonnes in the 1983-84 campaign and that enabled us to fill almost completely our A and B quotas. That is very important, like filling our milk quotas. That level of production has been exceeded only by the record outturn of the preceding campaign. Both results will stand to our advantage when the quota arrangements for the post-1986 period come to be negotiated in just over a year's time. The Sugar Company itself is well on the way out of its recent difficulties. A sum of £20 million new equity was injected by the Exchequer in late 1983. Together with the £30 million advanced a year earlier, this has brought the State's holding in the company to £56.5 million. As a result of the rationalisation measures and investment of the past few years a significant improvement has taken place in the company's position. All of this, together with the fact that we kept Tuam open, means that the activities of the Sugar Company are looking fairly well and the future looks bright for that concern.

The future of Irish agriculture and, indeed, the economy depends largely on the food processing industry. Roughly one-fifth of those employed in the manufacturing sector are in industries directly dependent on agricultural output, while agricultural products amount to 25 per cent of total exports. Unlike the bulk of our other exports, the import content of our food exports is very small and so the real contribution of food exports to the balance of payments is enormous. However, the potential of the food industry is far from being fully exploited, and we must maximise the added value and employment. Unfortunately, much of our agricultural exports are still being treated as commodities, without enough attention being given to added value.

In the United States three people are employed in agricultural activities for each one employed on the farm. The figures in this country are the very reverse. In other words, for everybody working on the land in the US three people are involved in the processing industry. In this country for every three working on the land only one is working in processing industry. That is a ridiculous contrast. I suppose a partial explanation is the fact that we suffer a great deal from having a small domestic market of three and a half million people whereas in the US the domestic market is something like 200 million people. That is a major reason why they can have such intensive food processing projects which we have not.

That is not the full story. The potential for increased processing in food in this country is enormous. The inter-departmental committee which I set up last year to monitor the pattern of food imports issued their report in the past few weeks. That report is extremely interesting. It shows that we can produce over £200 million of the £750 million worth of foodstuffs which we import. Not alone does it give the blanket figure of £200 million, it goes down to the nuts and bolts and quantifies the amount of each commodity or product which we import. That is very helpful. It gives us targets. I have already pointed out that over £20 million worth consisted of poultry and eggs, nearly £100 million consisted of cereals and cereal products like cornflakes, rice krispies, potato crisps and so on — potato crisps would come under potatoes which accounted for something like £23 million. The report identified exactly what was being brought in and the value of importations.

However the bulk of the foods being imported, over £550 million worth, are foods which we cannot produce in this country, things like bananas, citrus fruits, cocoa, coffee and so on. Therefore, it is not a case of £750 million, it is a case of £200 million. However, we must set about eliminating those imports and not alone eliminating them; in doing so we can also create export markets.

The report did a useful job in highlighting the reasons for the imports. These include the free trade situation, high production costs to which I referred earlier, the influence of multinational companies, seasonality of Irish production, and the lack of an overall strategy amongst producers, manufacturers and traders in regard to supply and marketing. The report pointed out that, as a large net agricultural exporter, it would not be in our interests to seek to restrict food imports. However, the alternative solution suggested, specialisation in those areas where we have a comparative advantage, is eminently reasonable.

I might point out that one thing which is mentioned is a free trade situation. People either do not understand this or they refuse to recognise it, but up to 1980 we had very stringent plant disease regulations whereby we could stop any plants or vegetables coming in from other countries. We had a very high status in that area. However, in 1980 we did not lose it but other countries attained an equal status and as a result they are able to export into this country, so we cannot stop horticultural or fruit products coming in from other members of the EEC. That is why the Dutch can pour in potatoes and vegetables and the French can pour in apples and other fruits in a manner which is seemingly unrestricted. We are in the EEC and we cannot discriminate against fellow members. It would not suit us to discriminate anyway, because, while we might import £200 million worth of goods which we can produce here at home, we export about £2 billion worth of agricultural commodities, so it would not suit us to try to impose protectionism. The net benefit to this country is enormous.

In the last ten years the Irish food industry received £110 million from national and EEC resources for investment in processing and marketing facilities, and a further £100 million has been allocated for projects still to be completed. It is particularly disappointing to see so much fresh produce being imported. I have mentioned the amount I am giving to the potato co-operative.

Under the farm modernisation scheme aid for farm buildings and equipment was suspended early in 1983 pending a review of the entire scheme. Following the review, a revised scheme was introduced with effect from 3 January 1984 which provides aid for land improvement and a limited range of farm buildings and fixed assets. Grant-aid is available to farmers in the development of other high category areas while commercial farmers are eligible for an interest subsidy which is equivalent to a 15 per cent capital grant and payable in 14 instalments over seven years.

A sum of £23.6 million is provided under subhead M.1 for expenditure on the scheme this year. Having regard to the severe pressure on Exchequer resources this is a significant amount and should prove to be of considerable benefit to farmers in encouraging investment aimed at improving efficiency, expanding output and raising incomes. I am aware that many farmers were annoyed because they had applied to be included under the farm modernisation scheme prior to 9 February 1983 but were not approved. I am still considering their situation. If I can possibly get money through savings elsewhere in my Estimate I will be very sympathetic to dealing with those people. Certainly I will give very serious consideration to that. That would be welcomed by the farming community in general. Sometimes you must bring in cuts which are rather unsavoury. I do not particularly like doing this but when you have not got the money it is not possible to do what you would like to do.

The Minister has some savings in the area of a lime subsidy. Maybe the Minister could put it in there.

Maybe not. I have other ideas. I am full of bright ideas today. I was the original bright ideas politician. I should have been in one of those Hollywood studios as an ideas man sitting around the pool all day with a cigar and a bottle of coke.

The Minister should have gone to Hollywood for his career.

We have some interesting ideas.

That will be a change.

No, it will not. We have always had them. We are noted for them. Imagination is probably the most wonderful attribute of all and we need a great deal of it.

It is not noticeable today.

My poor secretary is not too happy. He does not want to see commitments to something we might not be able to deliver. I understand his predicament. However, I have said if we can do it we will, and I am examining the matter closely. The EEC directive 72/159, under which the farm modernisation scheme is implemented, was due to expire at the end of 1983 but has been extended to the end of next month. During 1983 the EEC Commission put forward proposals on the structural policies to apply for the next ten years. One of the main changes proposed is the widening of the range of farmers eligible for development category to include full-time farmers below the comparable income level, who can make profitable investments. This is a welcome development which I support fully and I am glad it has been agreed upon. Discussions on the Commission's proposals are now well advanced and I am hopeful that agreement can be reached on them fairly soon.

The western drainage scheme which came into operation on 1 January 1979, aims at accelerating drainage in the west and provided initially for the field drainage of 100,000 hectares over five years. It was extended in July 1981 to include field drainage of an additional 50,000 hectares up to 31 December 1986. The scheme is financed on a 50:50 basis by the EEC and the Exchequer and the grant is 70 per cent of the approved cost. The response to the scheme has exceeded all expectations. We are examining the possibility of increasing the area to be covered by this scheme. We hope that we will be able to increase it further because the uptake has been enormous and we are not able to deal with the backlog of applications at present. Therefore, we will be looking for further assistance in that area. At 31 December 1983 approvals had been issued covering 154,000 hectares attracting grants totalling some £59,000 million. For 1984 I am providing £9 million on the subhead M.1 for the scheme.

For the programme for western development £4 million has been included under Subhead M.1. The programme provides grants not only for land improvement and for capital investment on the farm but also for improved training and advisory services for western farmers, for forestry development, the improvement of rural infrastructures such as roads, water supplies and electricity and the development of facilities for processing and marketing of agricultural products. Grants are available for the division and pasture improvement of commonages and mountain and hill grazing and for reclamation in the lowland areas of farms. Finally, farmers who follow an improvement plan aiming at increased production of beef or sheep can obtain grants for farm buildings and fixed equipment.

Progress under the programme is satisfactory apart from the sectors dealing with the improvement of divided commonages, orientation of agricultural production and private forestry in which there has been relatively little interest to date. There is provision in the EEC Regulation for a review of the programme and this will take place next year.

Under subhead M.2 a sum of £36.4 million is provided for livestock headage grants in the disadvantaged areas of which £27.8 million relates to cattle and £8.6 million to sheep. Rates of payment and the conditions for the scheme in 1984 remain the same as for 1983.

There are three other cattle schemes applying to the entire country. Two of these — the suckler cow scheme and the calf premium scheme — are directly financed by the EEC and expenditure on them this year will amount to about £52 million. The third scheme is the calved heifer scheme which is nationally financed and for which £8 million is provided under subhead D.2. Cattle grant payments this year will amount to £88 million in total under the various headage and premium schemes.

To facilitate farmers who wish to apply under the cattle grant schemes I have arranged for composite application forms to be issued to upward of 200,000 farmers who applied under last year's schemes. These forms are currently being posted to the farmers concerned. Separate application forms for the calved heifer scheme are available on request from local offices of the Department.

The continuation of these various schemes provides generous incentives to encourage farmers to maintain and expand their herds and flocks. Sheep inspections in disadvantaged areas are now under way. I have also arranged that cattle inspections in all areas of the country will start this year on 25 June. This is two weeks earlier than last year and nine weeks earlier than in 1982, and this will greatly facilitate farmers in marketing their cattle in the autumn.

The financial provision under subheads C.2, C.3 and C.5 for the disease eradication programme in 1984 amounts to £21 million. Included in this total is a sum of £1 million for the hardship fund from which payments are made to herdowners with chronically infected herds who depopulate on the advice of my Department's veterinary officers. Because of the grave budgetary situation the allocation this year is down compared with expenditure of £23 million in 1983. I must point out, however, that the reduced provision does not necessarily imply that the disease eradication schemes will suffer or that progress cannot be achieved in lowering disease incidence levels this year. A carefully worked-out strategy has been adopted to ensure that available funds are spent to the best advantage.

Recently the country was declared to be free of brucellosis. This declaration has been well received by the farming community. This means that cattle can be moved around in a non-restricted manner. Unfortunately, the progress in regard to TB has not been as encouraging. The 1983 round of testing just completed shows that there are 5,400 herds restricted because of TB, giving a disease incidence of 2.24 per cent of herds compared with 2.11 per cent in 1981. These statistics indicate the need for a fresh approach. I have given instructions in my Department for a new series of measures to be taken and I hope these will result in a significant improvement. I have set a target of reducing the incidence of TB in herds to less than 1 per cent within three years. This target may be difficult to achieve but we will try very hard to achieve it.

We have introduced special status zones and Kerry is to be the first of those. The private veterinary practitioners and the departmental veterinary practitioners are working very well in this regard. The aim is to reduce in Kerry the incidence to 0.2 per cent of herds. If we are successful in Kerry we will move to other counties, perhaps even to Wexford in order to remain friendly with Deputy Byrne who is such a nice guy.

There is not too much in the Estimate for Wexford.

Bovine TB is an extremely infectious organism and it is a well-publicised fact that most TB breakdowns can be traced back to direct contact between an infected animal and cattle in a clear herd. It is a lateral sort of infection or spread. Down through the years we have invested £600 million in TB eradication measures so we would need to be making very real progress at this stage.

Receipts of £5 million are expected from the bovine diseases levies this year. This reflects the seriousness of the Exchequer situation. We must get the money from somewhere. The rates are £1.90 per animal and 0.3 pence per gallon of milk. On the question of antibiotics and hormones, there is increasing consumer concern at home and abroad about residues in livestock products arising from the use of veterinary medicines in animal husbandry. There has been a big increase in the number of these products on the market in recent years. Properly used they can be of significant benefit to farmers but used improperly they can pose health risks. It is essential, therefore, that there be adequate and appropriate controls in the use of these substances. My Department have drawn up comprehensive proposals for controls on the use of the products involved, in particular growth promoters and antibiotics. These proposals include rules on how and by whom the substances might be administered, systems to facilitate checking that withdrawal periods are observed and powers for veterinary examiners in slaughtering premises to examine and test for hormone and antibiotic residues and to reject animals and carcases where such residues are present. The farming, professional and trade interests have been consulted and there is a general appreciation among all concerned that more stringent controls are necessary. What is important now is to introduce the controls and I propose to do that shortly.

I propose also to set up an assessment system for all veterinary medicines so that only those products which need specified safety, quality and labelling criteria may be placed on the market.

I am very pleased to say that the monitoring and penalty measures introduced recently in the case of liquid milk have been proving very effective in dealing with the problem of antibiotics residues.

I wish to refer also to a matter that has been highlighted recently. This is the danger of rabies being brought into the country. At a recent seminar great concern was expressed about this danger. Obviously, we are vulnerable because of the volume of sea traffic, particularly, and air traffic also between this country and the continent. Rabies has spread very far north on the Continent and it is in the vicinity of Britanny which is not all that far from us and where there are a number of ports with which we are trading regularly. We must be especially careful and vigilant to ensure that this dreadful disease is kept from our shores. If it were to come here it could cause our agricultural industry enormous problems. Despite the best efforts of my Department I do not think there is a general recognition among the public about the inherent danger of rabies reaching this country. We hear hair-raising stories of dogs that have been brought from Spain, Portugal or France being found on yachts in this country or being taken for walks by their owners along the quayside. Our port authorities are doing a very good job but they cannot be vigilant 24 hours a day. It would be impossible to man every port in the country. There is a particular danger in the south-east where there is constant trading between the ports there and those parts of Europe in which rabies is prevalent. Added to that there is the difficulty of the vast numbers of stray cats and dogs. If the disease spread to Ireland it would be extremely difficult to control. An inter-departmental committee was set up to study the problems created by stray animals. I intend to see that action is taken on their report quickly.

Local authorities have been extremely remiss in not providing homes for stray animals, in particular dogs and cats. It is their job to do so. It may not seem a huge problem but if we ever had an outbreak of rabies it would be. Local authorities can get a 50 per cent grant from the Department of the Environment to erect an animal shelter. Only half a dozen local authorities have done this. Some members of local authorities are most vociferous in complaining about the damage stray dogs do to sheep and other animals. Yet they will not provide one of these shelters. The cost of doing so is not great. The grant is very generous. I know of instances where farming bodies and others made contributions over and above 50 per cent of the cost. Some local authorities have been extremely negligent in not making every effort to deal with the massive stray dog problem we have.

There has been some talk about increasing the licence fee but there is little point in doing that because the Garda do not have the manpower to see that all dogs are licensed. They are under pressure and have to deal with more serious matters. There is need for local authorities to take up the matter and provide animal shelters.

The Irish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals have been most helpful. They provide generous assistance and in some cases provided personnel. It is an area which needs to be looked at and diligently pursued. I intend to initiate a programme for the control of stray dogs. It would be intolerable, if we had an outbreak of rabies, to have the high proportion of stray animals we have at present.

Contagious equine metritis, a venereal disease of horses, continues to be a hazard to the horse breeding industry, especially the bloodstock section. The voluntary co-operation of the industry to prevent any outbreak or spread of the disease continues to be successfully organised by the Irish Liaison Committee on Equine Diseases with the full co-operation of my Department. In this connection, a common code of practice for the control of the disease has been agreed with the horse breeding interests in Britain and France. My Department's veterinary research laboratories together with a number of other approved laboratories are engaged in the examination of specimens for the disease. I urge all horse owners and stud managers to continue to avail themselves of the services provided for the control of the disease.

I make reference to the wonderful work done by ACOT and the Farm Apprenticeship Board. I am providing a grant in aid of £17.93 million under subhead B.12 for ACOT's general purposes as well as £1.25 million under subhead B.13 for capital purposes. This involves the construction of 22 new agricultural training centres and the provision of an additional 190 student places at agricultural colleges.

We have had a proliferation of reports and the latest was from the National Planning Board. They are extremely useful and make a number of specific recommendations. They deal with the need for further education and efficiency in farming.

As regards An Foras Talúntais, they will receive £15.61 million under subhead B.3. They are doing very valuable work in research. I have referred to the very modern research and development facilities at UCC which cost £6 million and which are grossly underutilised. I would like to see the food industry making greater use of these facilities. Bord na gCapall have been given the sum of £474,000 under subhead 1. I am glad to say that the board is working well and doing a good job.

Provisions totalling £1.5 million are made under subheads F.3. and M.1. for the EEC and the national 5 per cent interest subsidy schemes. These schemes were designed to help farmers who because of increased interest rates had difficulty in meeting their commitments in respect of moneys borrowed for farm investment. The schemes which were introduced in 1981 terminated on 31 December 1983. Up to the end of 1983 a total of 8,500 farmers received subsidies amounting to £7.2 million under the EEC scheme, while some 6,000 farmers received a total of £2.1 million under the national scheme.

The reduced interest scheme for farmers in severe financial difficulty or, as it is more commonly known, the rescue package, was introduced in April 1982. This scheme is operated by the State in conjunction with the associated banks and the Agricultural Credit Corporation. It provides an interest subsidy of up to 8.75 per cent for three years for farmers in severe financial difficulty but who can regain viability with the aid of the scheme. Nearly 4,500 farmers are obtaining relief on their interest payments under the scheme and a provision of £5.5 million is made under subhead F.4. for the purpose.

Low interest loans funded from foreign borrowings have been made available in recent years to farmers by the ACC and the associated banks. The total loan capital made available is approximately £100 million, financed mainly in German marks and Dutch guilders. A sum of £3 million is provided under subhead F.2. to cover the foreign exchange losses of the lending institutions in respect of the borrowings. A sum of £84.3 million is provided under subheads M.4. and M.5. in respect of expenses and losses on market intervention. This is some £34 million higher than the 1983 figure.

This shows the cost of intervention and how important it is to get away from it. As regards the rescue package and the banks, I asked the Department to arrange a meeting with the banks. I had a meeting six months ago with the Banks Standing Committee. I emphasised that I should like to see them adopt a sympathetic attitude towards farmers in severe financial difficulties who did not come within the scope of the rescue package. The people I met adopted a reasonable attitude. However, it comes to my notice almost daily that certain bank managers are not adopting an attitude which could be described as sympathetic. In any system one will get a range of qualities in people. Some farmers who are in severe financial difficulty and do not come under the scope of the rescue package could return to viability given a little understanding and less rigid approach from the banks. I suspect that much depends on the bank manager who is dealing with the farmer in financial trouble. I intend to discuss that with the banks. It is important that farmers who can get back into a viable situation should be treated with a certain amount of sympathy and given a certain degree of latitude.

I have no sympathy with farmers, or anybody else, who are able to meet their commitments but do not make any effort to do so and who deliberately ignore the institutions from whom they borrowed. I do not see how the lending institutions can be blamed for taking a tough line with people who have adopted a totally unreasonable attitude, but there are some farmers in difficulty and if they were treated sympathetically they could return to normal trading and viability. The local bank manager makes that decision and there are varying degrees of interpretation as to how these people are to be helped or otherwise. I do not want to see anybody put out of farming because a too rigid attitude was adopted. I want to make that very clear. I would like to discuss this matter with the banks because the treatment given to these people varies from bank to bank, or from place to place. I hope my remarks are not misinterpreted, but in my view there is an unequal application of set procedures.

Anybody who shows a willingness to co-operate and who is working hard should be given an opportunity to return to viability. If there has to be a write off, then this should be done. I have heard of banks refusing to agree to a strategy put forward by a farmer with the result that the farmers have not been able to operate in a commercial way and, at the end of the day, the banks fared off worse because the farmers had virtually gone to the wall. It would be better if they reached an accommodation at an early stage, even if it means a considerable write-off on the part of the banks. It is important that the farmer be made commercially viable as soon as possible. I want to stress that I am not making a case for people who could meet their commitments but are not making any efforts to do so, who are getting on the bandwagon and trying to benefit because other farmers who are in financial difficulties are being treated sympathetically. Some people are not living up to their commitments but those who are doing their best should be given a fair deal.

I spoke about the amount being lost because of the payments we have to make to intervention and the contributions we make to the various voluntary agricultural organisations, such as ICOS, ICA, Macra na Feirme, Muintir na Tíre and so on.

We all know the difficulties which have been affecting the Land Commission in recent years. Their main efforts are towards increasing land mobility. The role of the Land Commission was to acquire land and this has virtually come to a halt. The Land Commission still have a very useful role to play and we hope they will be of considerable assistance in the land leasing programme and in organising farmers into groups to buy land which becomes available. A sum of £4.9 million is provided under subhead L.2. to meet the cumulative effect of distributing land at less than the Land Commission paid for it and of reducing annuities in certain instances. That means we are having to sell or lease land at considerably less than we bought it. There is a provision of £1.55 million under subhead L.4. in respect of deficiency in income from untenanted land. Rents obtained last year averaged £62 per hectare for grazing and £125 per hectare for tillage. The Land Commission will continue to help overcome the problem of fragmented farms. It would be incorrect to say that they have completely got out of acquiring land because if there are little bits of land which would help to create a logical holding, then the Land Commission will acquire them. The commission still retain those powers and will use them.

Dividing commonages is another major activity in which the Land Commission will still engage. As regards leasing, my Minister of State, Deputy Connaughton, introduced new legislation into the Seanad recently. The main purpose of the legislation is to exclude agricultural leases from any statutory provisions which might be regarded as inhibiting the development of leasing as part of our land tenure system. The legislation will give equal status to both lessor and lessee and enable them to agree between themselves on the terms of the lease without any overriding statutory provision. A wider acceptance of the concept of leasing among farmers will make a big contribution to increasing agricultural output. A group of Land Commission officers have been assigned specifically to the task of promoting medium-term leasing. They will foster discussion and will co-operate fully and actively with farming organisations, co-operatives and other local bodies which are anxious to bring potential lessors and lessees together.

While I am talking about leasing, I would like to point out that the Social Welfare Act, 1984, contains provision for new rules on assessment of means for social assistance in cases where land is leased. This will remove what had been a serious obstacle to the adoption of leasing. Before I leave the subject I would like to say that I have been considering whether leasing might be encouraged in other ways.

These four measures — group purchase, rearrangement, commonage division and leasing — which have already been introduced are only part of a land reform programme designed to promote the efficient use of land for agricultural development. Apart from these there are other measures which must be considered. There is, for example, the question of controlling sales of land that come on the open market and if there should be some control on such sales. I want to say this quite specifically; I am not in favour of putting controls on land which come on the open market for sale. The constitutional right of people engaged in farming who want to sell or buy land should not be affected.

I want to make it absolutely clear that under no circumstances will I put any impediment or inhibition in the way of those who are legally involved in the purchase or sale of land. We enter into a very dangerous area if we consider any sanctions or restrictions in that regard. It is essential that people be allowed to sell and buy freely, as has always been the case. One suggestion is that there might be a surcharge on the purchase price on sliding scale, depending on who buys the land. Anybody who might be afraid that such a measure would be introduced can rest assured that that is a non-runner. As I pointed out, there will be no impediment. Another suggestion is that possession of agricultural education and training, such as the ACOT Green Cert, should eventually be necessary for any purchaser of land. I readily accept that any such controls would introduce an obstacle or impediment to the free sale of land and as such would be open to some objection. That is a matter which must be examined extremely carefully. We will not allow anything to create an impediment or an obstacle. It is important, however, to ensure that all our land is used in the most gainful manner possible but we can do that without introducing any restrictive measures.

Earlier this week the report of the Working Group on a four-year plan for agriculture was published and its reception was quite good. I should like to thank the people who constituted this group. they spent much time and effort and I am hopeful that we shall be able to implement quite a large proportion of their recommendations. It will constitute a major part of the Governments medium-term plan for agriculture over the next three years. I have had that plan available since last October and deliberately did not publish it because it could have caused me great difficulty in the negotiations at Brussels on the super-levy. It would have given ammunition to our opponents in several areas and I am thinking in particular of one area. The projection in that plan was that milk output here would average an increase of 3.8 per cent for each of the next four years. I should have looked a little foolish asking for 8 per cent in Brussels while a national plan prepared here by all the farming interests suggested that we could produce only 3.8 per cent. Had I to work on that basis, we might have ended up with a lot less than 3.8 per cent, or nothing at all. In the event, we got 4.6 per cent. I thought it was unwise to publish that plan at that time, when we could afford to wait for the outcome of the discussions on the Common Agricultural Policy. People may differ with me on that, but I think it was the correct line to adopt.

There is a fairly large relevant section in the plan produced by the National Planning Board two weeks ago. I would take what is contained therein in conjuncition with what is in the four-year plan and hope to work out the medium-term plan for agriculture for the next three years in conjunction with general Government policy.

I am sorry for having taken up so much time, but this is a vast area and I have tried to cut down on my speech. I commend the Estimate to the House and hope that there will be constructive debate for the rest of the day.

(Limerick West): I assure the Chair that I do not intend to take the same time as the Minister. There are many aspects of agriculture about which I would like to talk, but there are on his side of the House and on this side many other Members who wish to contribute to this debate. They will have something to offer, certainly. As a result, I hope to keep my contribution as brief as possible.

At the outset, irrespective of what gloss the Minister has put on his contribution here this morning and of his approach with regard to illustrating statistics — and to a certain extent using them to highlight what the Government and he are doing with regard to Agriculture — that is not in keeping with the real facts of the case. The Government's disregard of agriculture is illustrated by the fact that approximately 80 per cent of the increased provision of the Estimate for 1984 on which the Minister has just spoken is allotted to salaries and travelling expenses of Department staff. I am not taking issue with that — it is right and proper and in keeping with national pay guidelines. I am taking issue, however, on the 20 per cent which is left for agricultural development. This Estimate could be likened to a lighthouse in a bog. It looks good but makes no real contribution to agricultural development. In other words, the Minister is all talk and no action — certainly, we have seen no action and I shall prove this during my contribution.

Investment in production was never more needed than at present and the Minister's record to date can be gleaned from the fact that real farm incomes dropped by 10 per cent in 1983 as against an increase of 7 per cent in 1982. The indications are that they will drop again this year by at least 6 per cent in real terms. That is the Minister's Government's contribution to agriculture and, might I say, to rural Ireland. Nothing has been done by the Government to alter this slide.

We all know that unemployment figures have increased by upwards of 50,000 since this Government took office and the drift from the land over that period has contributed in the region of 20 per cent to that. The Government should now be concentrating on arresting this movement and generating employment by provision of low cost, intensive type production of import substitutes as outlined in the recent report of the monitoring committee on food imports.

The reduction in the provision for the eradication of bovine tuberculosis of 11 per cent is appalling. This disease is now almost as serious a threat to farmers as is the milk super-levy. I urge the Minister not to hesitate to take whatever measures are necessary to eliminate the severe losses being caused, even to the most efficient of our farmers. He will have my support and that of my party, even to the extent of treading on corns to have this disease eliminated.

At this stage it is imperative that some policies be introduced to make land available to young farmers who are constrained through lack of acreage. These policies must be practical and not merely aspirational. It should be possible to devise inducements to older farmers to transfer the use of land but not its ownership. This will involve social welfare and health aspects also. I shall deal more deeply with land problems later. I deplore the Minister's recent public statement that Ireland will not reach its quota of milk production this year.

On a point of order, I did not say that. I pointed out that there was a danger we may not reach it.

(Limerick West): The Minister may mince words anyway he likes. I deplore that statement by him. It has been denied by the farming organisations and the co-operatives. Indications from the various co-operatives are that the milk increase is well in excess of 5 per cent over this time last year. The Minister has given advance notice to Brussels that we do not deserve sympathy when it comes to any additional quota next year. I cannot understand his attitude. At this stage he should be doing everything possible not to compound the damage already done. Farmers' confidence has been shattered by the imposition of the super-levy, which is one of the biggest blows not alone to agricultural production but to the nation as a whole. I urge the Government and the Minister to promote the consumption of milk throughout Europe. This would be far more positive than devising ways and means of imposing penalties on increased production.

Since my appointment as spokesman on agriculture for my party I have referred time and time again to the apparent retreat of the Government from rural Ireland. The main focus of their attention has been on urban areas and the eastern half of the country. They have largely ignored the major contribution they could make to agriculture and the agri-business. We have cutbacks in the farm modernisation scheme, agricultural training, lime and AI subsidies, wool marketing and many other areas. The only increases which impinge on farmers are the unwelcome rises such as those on sheep and slaughter levies. Farmers have been let down badly by the Minister's performance in Europe.

I want to pay tribute to the staff of the Department of Agriculture. I agree with the Minister that those people are one of the finest staff one would get in the Community but they need the support and political will of the Government. They are not getting guidelanes or leadership from their political head. Apart from the Minister's negotiations on the super-levy very little effort has been made to get help for the agricultural industry. We have apparently lost the lime and AI subsidies. Those were very productive subsidies. If the appropriate tenacity was shown in the EEC negotiations. I believe we would have secured their retention. I ask the Minister to let us know if those subsidies will be introduced later this year.

The main thrust of Commision thinking is on structural aids. We should be fighting for a large share of such aid. I have in mind the provision of land for our young farmers and the promotion of land leasing on a positive manner. I mean a plan for land leasing not like the Bill before the House which is merely a repeal of old Land Acts going back to the last century. An industry so dependent on EEC and Government decisions, such as agriculture, needs a clear and pragmatic plan. The targets of such a plan may not always be reached because of climatic conditions. This does not reflect on the usefulness of such a plan. The purpose of a plan is to signpost the way ahead for everybody connected with farming from the primary customer to the producer. Decisions taken today by farmers may not give a return for several years. If farmers and processors are to make a substantial financial commitment they are entitled to know the plans the Government have for the industry. The four-year plan for agriculture recently published has been described as containing 67 recommendations and is a highly commendable document. The report is overshadowed by the rider added by the Department of Finance describing it as a a list of desirable measures rather than a plan. I take this to mean that the Department will not allow any significant part of the plan to be implemented.

It is peculiar that a document which uses the word "plan" in its title is described in its contents as not being a plan. Notwithstanding the Minister's lame excuse that the publication of this plan last October would have interfered with negotiations on the milk super-levy, I believe it would have helped because it would have outlined our planned agricultural development to our European partners. Instead the Government are releasing the plan three weeks before the European elections. It was completed seven months ago and I do not accept the Minister's reason for keeping it under wraps during such a traumatic time for our farmers. It should have been published immediately on its completion.

The Government would be quite happy if the impression were given that the many praiseworthy proposals in the plan were part of Government policy. Far from it — the Government do not have a policy. Anybody likely to fall into the trap should remember the old maxim — action speak louder than words. The abolition of the Wool Council and the closure of the home economics colleges, both of which were recently debated here, are two actions which are contrary to the recommendations of this report.

Deputy Lenihan, as Minister for Agriculture, set up this committee to draw up a four-year national plan for agriculture. The committee was comprised of representatives from all sectors in the industry but, as a result of frustration with the present Minister, the representatives of the leading farming organisations resigned. We must conclude that this report will be buried, although that would be most damaging to the industry. Agriculture has been clamouring for a plan in order to devise a strategy for the years ahead. I assure the House that on returning to Government this party will introduce a development plan for agriculture which will be supported politically and financially.

I refer to the recently published report of the monitoring committee of food imports. The food processing industry occupies a very important place and employs about 25 per cent of our workforce. It uses mainly native products and is controlled for the most part by Irish interests. Our research and development in food processing lags far behind that of our European partners.

It is vital to develop a proper marketing strategy and we must utilise the services of our embassies. There must be greater co-ordination between the production, processing and marketing sectors. An overall plan is important and we must identify the commodities which should be produced. There was a time when all animal feed requirements were home grown. Farmers must have guidance as to the kind of produce necessary. They must be given a clear outline of the way forward, as must the processing industry.

There must also be a plan in regard to vegetable production in order to avoid unnecessary imports. The Minister of State, Deputy Hegarty, has been frustrated in his efforts due to lack of Government commitment and finance. We must encourage the added value aspect. I totally agree with the Minister that we should consider products which are not being over-produced in Europe. I hope the necessary leadership will be forthcoming from the Department.

We must promote the consumption of native products on the home market and the various advisory bodies must come together to sort out the problem of the vast importation of foodstuffs. I suggest the co-operatives should encourage more home production. Many items used on farms are foreign produced and I cannot see why they are not being produced at home.

Are we spending enough in research and marketing? Do we know where the best markets are in which we can get rid of, for instance, our surplus milk? I call on the IDA and the Shannon Development Company to address themselves to this important aspect, and to have more regard to added value. In meat, are we monitoring our position and, in particular, are we moving fast enough in regard to consumer demands? Bodies such as the Central Bank, ACOT, ESRI and others should come together to provide the necessary finance for marketing strategy and research in this lucrative industry.

I agree with what the Minister said in regard to the sheep industry. Indeed I ask him to encourage an increase in production because sheep production at the moment is doing very well. It is a low capital industry and in certain parts of the country farmers could find it very profitable. I am glad sheep numbers are on the increase and I hope they will reach the level of the mid-sixties. The increase in price for sheepmeat in 1983 was 7 per cent more than the previous year and developments in the EEC are favourable to sheep production. I appeal to the Minister to ensure that our French market will be maintained and that he will make this a matter of priority, as well as all export outlets for sheepmeat. I am happy that the various grants and premiums to encourage sheep production are being continued.

I should like to see more emphasis on the advisory aspect of sheep production and I ask the Minister to request ACOT to concentrate on this, particularly sheep breeding. Already we have produced a good quality animal.

In the past number of years we have had many complaints from farmers in regard to the worrying of sheep by dogs and I hope steps will be taken by the Minister to take action on the report of the committee set up to deal with this matter. The Minister should give us some indication when he is replying about when we can expect proposals on this matter and if legislation will be required to implement the recommendations and what the time lag will be. It is not enough to blame local authorities who are now being denied Exchequer funds. The crisis proportions of this problem should be recognised and a positive approach taken by the Department and the Minister.

I have condemned the Government and the Department for abolishing the Wool Council, which was set up in 1968. That was a backward step. In most wool producing countries they have very successful wool marketing boards. We should have a positive approach to wool marketing and the saving of £100,000 on An Comhairle Olla was very shortsighted. We are beginning to appreciate the importance of sheep production and therefore we must appreciate the importance of wool. It has been part of the economy of small farmers for many years and they need the advice of a wool council like that which the Minister has just abolished. I hope he will do something about wool marketing because he emphasised in his speech that he would ensure the promotion of the sheep industry.

I would draw the Minister's attention to the need for his Department to devote themselves to the bringing together more closely of urban and rural populations because the importance of agriculture to the nation should be drawn to the attention of urban organisations. Seemingly, there is a tendency in many Departments to be slightly anti-farmers. I hope this situation will be improved and the Minister should convey to other Departments the role agriculture can play in the improvement of the general economy.

It must be pointed out to those who from time to time run down the contribution agriculture makes that the industry has still a long way to go. It is only since our EEC entry in 1973 that farmers have been able to make any progress. In some of those years development was restricted because of matters outside the control of the agricultural population.

The Minister must also take a look at the aids to agriculture which now are being eroded slowly and surely. For instance, we have had a reduction in the allocations to agricultural schools. There has been a reduction in the estimates for rural home economics colleges and there have been cuts in many other areas, including a cut of 1 per cent in real terms to the Agricultural Institute. All of this is eroding the contribution agriculture could make to the return of a buoyant economy. One may say that agriculture should accept a reduction in line with the reduction in Government expenditure generally but we must realise that agriculture is the basis of our economy and as such it should get priority in any Government plan or in any future economic strategy.

I read the programme carried out by the Department with regard to the promotion of the pig industry and to progeny and performance testing and it seems to me to be quite satisfactory. I wish to pay tribute to those involved in that work. I am reasonably satisfied with the purchase of pigs for leasing to pedigree breeders. This will improve the conformation and constitution of that breeding stock and ultimately it will lead to the provision of the top-quality stock so necessary in the industry at the moment. However, I must express concern with regard to the recent collapse of the pig marketing stabilisation fund. Something must be done immediately to reactivate this fund to improve the price on the domestic market, and I ask the Minister to see what can be done in that area. If this situation continues it could lead to a reduction in producer prices. The Minister should take an active role to encourage a favourable output in pig production because this plays an important part in agriculture. I hope something will be done to improve the industry. All the indications this year are that it will be a bumper year for grain. It appears also that, unfortunately, intervention will be a major outlet. The Department are the intervention agency. What arrangements have they made because now is the time to have such arrangements completed? There is little point in closing the door when the horse has bolted. Perhaps the Minister will let me know what arrangements have been made with regard to dealing with what appears will be a bumper harvest.

From time to time farmers have been accused of moaning too much and too frequently. I suppose in a sense they have a lot to moan about but there are some areas where they could improve their lot by taking some action of their own. In this connection I am thinking of farmers catering for the Irish consumers who have been rejecting Irish produce, especially vegetables. As I have stated, food imports are so considerable now that they are damaging not only the farmers but also our balance of payments. While the producers are not to blame, they could do a lot to reduce the imports of food. They could produce many commodities here that are now being imported. I hope that the agency being set up by the Minister of State, Deputy Hegarty, will play a vital role and that the industry itself will have a major contribution to make in ensuring that top-quality commodities are produced. Therefore, producers should concern themselves more directly with the marketing of products and ensure that there is an improvement in quality and presentation. I urge them to become more active in the formation and operation of producer groups and I ask the Minister and the Department to contribute positively to the setting up of these groups.

Cattle and beef production is an important agricultural enterprise. It is also probably the least developed and the most under-capitalised. Traditionally it has been run on an extensive rather than an intensive scale, with fluctuating and generally low profits. In addition, it has been characterised by different stages of production: calf rearing, summer stores, grazing and beef production are distinct activities and are not integrated on one farm. That has been the pattern of our farming. A major difficulty has often resulted from this fact and good profits from one sector have been at the expense of another sector.

Cattle farming, and in particular, beef fattening, is an important component in the farming pattern. Of equal importance is the employment given by meat plants. The extent of this employment in such factories was brought home to us in a very direct and unpleasant way in the past few years when many people in the industry were made redundant or were placed on short time. Thankfully, the situation has improved to a certain extent but this must not lull us into a sense of complacency. Too often we have seen this cycle in the past decade, swinging between over-supply and shortage. Unless the problems of seasonality are tackled by all in the industry we will not have an even flow of cattle to the factories.

Probably the most important factor in maintaining a constant flow of cattle is the provision of housing for cattle. Less than half our dry cattle are housed during the winter. This should not be the case. The existence of the farm modernisation scheme during the years has not given the necessary incentive and I am not at all satisfied with the present slimmed-down version of that scheme so far as housing is concerned. In the Department there must be a greater emphasis on low-cost housing specification. Grants should be modified so that cheaper sheds, constructed of native timber and possibly erected by farm labour, could be eligible for full grants. It will utilise our native industry and will provide cheap housing for cattle because the sheds can be erected by the farmers. Changing technology and new management practices often result in farm buildings having a useful life of about 25 years and timbered structures are more easily modified in such circumstances.

There has been an excessive delay in fixing EEC farm prices in recent years and this affects the cattle industry. I hope that in future we will see a more realistic approach in regard to the fixing of farm prices because if the deadline for agreement was observed there would be an improvement in numbers and a plan could be promoted by the farming industry for the improvement of the cattle industry. We cannot over-emphasise the importance of cattle production and the major contribution it can make to help us out of our current economic difficulties. The number of cattle exported in 1983 was something in the region of 60,000 more than in 1982. Think what this would mean to our balance of payments. It would generate extra employment and greater rural prosperity which would be added bonuses.

Given the proper economic climate and general incentive, there is no reason why we cannot increase or surpass that figure. Our main aim should be to send out as much as possible of this meat in processed from so that jobs will be provided in meat plants here rather than abroad. The Minister said it is very important to have a positive and healthy live trade because, in comparison with dead trade, competition is good. We must ensure that there is an ample supply for both live and dead trades and to achieve this we must have adequate numbers to cater for both. We can do that by providing incentives and reshaping and modifying the farm modernisation scheme to improve the type of beef cattle we produce. It has been said that over the years beef cattle are being bred from dairy breeds with the result that the formation of the carcase is not as good as it should be. For that reason I am unhappy that the AI subsidy has been removed by the EEC because it provided the wherewithal for the supply of good bulls for the improvement of our beef breed. It is important to improve the beef industry here and I should like to see a better type of animal being developed.

The recent trend to encourage calf to beef production is sensible and should lead to greater stability in the trade. I wish to pay tribute to the foresight of the last Fianna Fáil Government who introduced the calf subsidy which was a step in the right direction. It is sad that this has been reduced because of the inadequate approach by the Minister in negotiations in Europe. It is important, therefore, to emphasise the role of the cattle industry in our economy. The main task facing the cattle and beef industry at present is to increase our cattle herds and this should be given first priority in our programme for agricultural development as, apart from providing extra employment, such expansion would have enormous benefits for the economy. It is important to ensure that we utilise modern technology and all the aids and services available to secure this expansion.

I should like briefly to refer to the Land Bill which will be coming before this House. This Bill, which is now before the Seanad, does nothing to improve or promote land leasing. It is merely removing the legal and technical obstacles to land leasing but doing nothing to encourage it. The problem has been looked at in a strictly legal context. This is wrong because the problems of land ownership and leasing cannot be examined in such isolation. They must be viewed in a much wider scene as they are very closely tied with almost every aspect of a farmer's life. Major areas, such as the social welfare system, the income tax code and the availability of credit should be concenred with all aspects of land leasing. The lack of decisions on those aspects by the Department will determine whether long-term or medium-term leasing will have any impact on our farm structures. Unless we face reality we are wasting our time debating the Bill. We have been promised this Bill for quite some time and we were led to believe that it was going to encourage our many young, progressive farmers to lease land from those who, because of age or other circumstances, no longer wish to farm actively. This Bill is a bitter disappointment to those people. There is nothing in it to enable them to compete with larger farmers looking for conacre. To implement any worthwhile leasing scheme, money will have to be spent. The amount need not be very large and, while there will obviously have to be some contribution from the State, some funding also might be granted under one of the various EEC structures to which I will refer in a moment.

We must look at the contribution to this State from those EEC structures. This is an obvious area where we can benefit largely. Whatever money is spent will be well spent. The extra production from the increased productivity of such leased land will more than repay the initial outlay.

The problem of land leasing impinges on the farmers and it is also a social problem. If our young and most intelligent farmers see that they have no future in farming because they cannot obtain land to make their holdings viable, many of them will move to off-farm jobs, or add to the problem of unemployment. This will result in two possible outcomes for our farming structures. The larger farms will get bigger and the family farm will be squeezed out. We will go back to an almost subsistence form of low production farming such as we had 30 or 40 years ago.

I will have more to say about this on the Land Bill when it comes before the House. As a party, as we did in the past, we will make some positive suggestions to the Minister on how the Bill can be improved. I hope the Minister will accept our proposals and that he will not vote down worthwhile suggestions as they were voted down by the Government over the past 16 or 18 months.

The Minister laid great emphasis on the super-levy negotiations. He seemed to be more concerned about the other member states and their problems than the problems affecting Irish agriculture and the Irish farmer. He talked about vast reductions in production in other member states and the consequences for them of the imposition of the super-levy. The Minister is living in cloud-cuckooland. He does not realise that those memvers states are not as dependent on milk output as we are. I am not speaking about farmers only, but about our whole economy. We are ten times more dependent on agriculture than any other member state in the Community. It sounds very hollow when we hear the Minister expressing concern about other member states. He should concern himself with the problems affecting Irish agriculture.

The announcement of the super-levy package confirmed our worst fears. The Minister compounded the problem and threw in the towel for the negotiations next year when he said we will not reach the quota. That has been denied by the people who know best, the industry and the farming organisations. Milk production is well in excess of production last year. I cannot understand where the Minister got those figures. Is he trying to disown Irish agriculture and the Irish farmer, as he did in his deplorable negotiations on the price package earlier this year? The Taoiseach did not help by walking out from very important negotiations at the Summit. The Minister has destroyed any opportunity we had to reach European standards of production. We should be allowed milk production equal to that of our European partners to enable us to reach average European standards of production. Then we could talk about a super-levy.

There is a crisis in Irish agriculture. Immediate Government action is essential if permanent damage is not to be done. Like any other industry, agriculture cannot be planned on a short-term basis. We do not know what the effect, of the negotiations will be on 1985-86 production. A milk producer has to plan in advance and he is now planning for production next year. The imposition of the super-levy of 4.65 per cent has shattered the confidence of farmers, and uncertainty about the future has shattered their confidence still further.

We have no plan for the future. We need to know where the industry will be going for the duration of the super-levy which will be four years. I hope the imposition of the super-levy in the other member states will have the desired effect. We are not responsible for the glut of dairy products in Europe. This was not emphasised strongly enough in the negotiations in Europe. We produce about 4½ per cent of the total dairy products in Europe. The super-levy is contrary to the spirit and perhaps the letter of the Treaty of Rome. We joined the Community on the clear understanding that we would be an equal partner. We are not an equal partner now because our farmers are being denied the right to increase their production to the European average.

In his report on the super-levy negotiations the Minister misled people. We were told we got a great deal, but other member states got a far greater increase than we did. That proves the Minister's incompetence to negotiate a deal for us. It is disastrous in so far as there is no guarantee on output or prices beyond this year. The result is that dairy farmers cannot plan for the future.

The super-levy condemns Ireland to a permanent penalty and relegates our farmers to the poor relation in Europe. The Government, by their failure in these negotiations, have indicated that they are not capable of negotiating on behalf of the farming community because they do not have their welfare at heart. In the negotiations on the price package we were denied the lime and AI subsidies. Fianna Fáil won those schemes for our farmers. We were told that the imposition of the super-levy was inevitable but the super-levy is nothing new. It was spoken about in 1982 and 1983 but was resisted on both occasions by a Fianna Fáil Minister for Agriculture. It is wrong of the Minister to say that we got a good package. The reduction in the calf premium and the abolition of the lime and AI subsidies will mean a loss of between £37 million as against a provision of £38 million the previous year. There will be a reduction in benefits from the Community for agriculture this year.

Those moves do not take into account the millions of pounds that will be lost because of the undermining of confidence in the industry. It is estimated that farmers will suffer a loss in real income this year of 6 per cent. We do not have a plan for the future. It is imperative that the Government formulate a plan so that the confidence of farmers is not shattered further. My contribution on the Estimate is brief because other Members are anxious to contribute to the debate. However, it is important to stress that the industry is experiencing great difficulties at present. I hope that some of the recommendations in the four-year plan for agricultural development are implemented. It is necessary that a plan is produced to show the way ahead so that agriculture can get back to the position it enjoyed five or six years ago. I would be obliged if the Minister dealt with a query I put to him some weeks ago in regard to the transmissable gastro enteritis in two pig herds. Will the Minister tell the House if the herds have been destroyed and if an agreement has been reached with regard to compensation? This is a serious and highly contagious disease and I hope action is taken in regard to this matter. I hope I have given some food for thought to the Minister to help him produce guidelines for the industry and restore confidence in it. We must have a plan to show the way forward.

I am pleased to have an opportunity to contribute to the debate on this Estimate following the long contributions by the Minister and the Opposition spokesman. The Estimate deals with a vital Department in our economy. I am at a loss to know where Deputy Noonan got his information that there would be a 6 per cent loss of income in the agricultural sector. My understanding of the official figures — I believe they have been borne out by the EEC — is that in 1983 total farm incomes were, in real terms, up 2 per cent. The year before the figure was higher. I accept that the previous three years were bad but in the last two years farmers have been doing a lot better. I accept that the economy would be better off if farmers were in a better financial position. I have grave reservations about Deputy Noonan's figures. It is possible that he was referring to a projected loss of income this year but only crystal-ball gazing will give us that information. We do not know what the figure is likely to be at the end of the year.

For the benefit of other Members, I will not delay unduly on this Estimate. The Minister for Agriculture on a number of occasions, and again this morning, went to great lengths to point out the importance of the super-levy decision as far as our farmers are concerned. I do not propose to go over that ground again but I cannot accept the point of view of Deputy Noonan that it was a bad decision. Those who have read the agricultural newspapers, or the national newspapers, will realise that other EEC countries say that Ireland came out of the negotiations very well. Last night I saw on television a clip from the Balmoral Show in the North which indicated that there the farmers are sorry they did not get the type of facility that we got. They have every reason to be so and all they seem to want to do in recent times is to equate their position with ours. Against that background we must give credit where credit is due. The Minister for Agriculture and the negotiating team in the Department of Agriculture, with the Taoiseach, have done a good job for agriculture.

That is not to say that problems do not exist. There will always be problems in agriculture, but we have taken away the terrible scourge of a reduction in milk output. In this Chamber on many occasions in the last six months the importance of the milk industry has been stressed and I do not propose to go into that. However, I would imagine that from a global point of view it is important that the total quantity of milk produced in 1984 will be marginally above the super-levy facility that we have. However difficult the negotiations proved to be in the past the House can rest assured that the negotiations next year will be equally tough. For that reason farmers should not have undue lack of confidence about the output of milk. The nation is beginning to settle down and see that the various factors affecting the milk supply will not be favourable every year. The great natural barrier, so to speak, will be there always and this country is not likely to produce an 8, 9, 10 or 12 per cent increase in milk when it has not done this for many a day. For that reason, my advice as a farmer and politician to the nation's dairy farmers is to continue to do the right thing as they have been doing all the time. I hope that when the Minister makes his announcement, in conjunction with the farming organisations, about the redistribution of milk under the super-levy the small and medium farming families will be offered a facility that will enable them to continue as farming units in their own right.

I would like to say in regard to the land policy that I am adopting some aspects which have been in effect and operation for six or eight months. Deputy Noonan said that he was not very happy about some of the measures and that he was not at all happy with the Bill which I have before Seanad Éireann at the moment in so far as it relates to land leasing. For the record, we have had many Governments, Minister for Lands and Ministers of State and for some strange reason for the best part of 25 years everybody seemed to steer clear of the whole area of land structural problems. We had no shortage of plans or of criticisms of the land agency — in this case the Land Commission — but no new initiative to speak of emerged. I am glad to say that because of my involvement in the Department and the Government for the last 12 months I can see a new trend developing that will enable many of the neglected, locked-up acres of land be released for productive purposes. We have heard well-worn clichés about the importance of the land of Ireland, that it is a natural resource and so on. Basically, we want to ensure that every acre that is now either under-utilised or nearly derelict will be put into production. After that it is a question of who is best able to get that land into production. Because of the cost of land, the price per acre being paid for it to this day, one of the best mechanisms for getting land, under-utilised at the moment, for any one of a hundred reasons, is through land leasing. Leasing has been spoken about many times and people tend to shrug their shoulders and say that they have heard all this before, it is a nine-day wonder and then it goes away again. On this occasion that is far from the truth. An immense amount of work has been done in the Department in the last 12 months to ensure that this concept, entirely new to Irish agriculture — not new to talk about but new from the point of view of implementation of a plan — will get under-utilised land into the hands of persons who can work it.

When I came to the Department I noticed that certain legal inhibitions seemed to give rise to certain doubts amongst owners of land here. This is a very fundamental issue that has existed for 100 years since the Land Acts of the 1880s. This aspect of the problem was never grappled with. I brought forward what I considered to be the necessary legislation which will enable me to give a guarantee to every land holder who would believe that it is in his or her interest to lease the land to a neighbour, a friend or whoever it might be. That legislation has been with the Seanad for some weeks and when it passes through that House and this House in the next few weeks we can give a categorical assurance to those people that at the end of the lease they will get their land back and will be the absolute owners of it. That guarantee is most important for the concept of land leasing. We never had such a provision previously. There was always a doubt about land leased for longer than 11 months. That is why we had what I consider to be a very poor farming practice, the 11-months system, creeping all over Ireland and under which today nearly 1.25 million acres are being farmed under poor circumstances because of that system. I would like to explain to Deputy Noonan that when I talk about a Bill for land leasing this was a fundamental problem and we are taking steps now to cure it. Of course, I accept that the measure in itself will not set the country on fire but without it we could not talk about medium-or long-term land leasing.

A number of things have begun to happen in the Department and the Land Commission in the last six months which signal a new direction in land policy. On an occasion like this it is worth mentioning that no single item on its own will get this locked-up land into productive hands. This is a many-sided problem which must be tackled as such.

The next step was to bring about what we call master leases. I shall not dwell on this aspect except to say that basically it means that if two farmers decide on a leasing arrangement they will have the advantage of having this document which was not available before. Reference has been made in this context to the social welfare implications but I am delighted to be able to tell the House what we have negotiated successfully between the Department of Agriculture and the Department of Social Welfare a facility which eliminates the situation that applied up to now whereby a farmer who rented land on the 11-month system and who, on reaching old age pension age, applied for that pension, was at a greater advantage than was a person of similar age and who rented a similar farm but on a long-term lease. Obviously, if that situation were to have been emphasised no elderly person on reaching pension age would lease land on either a medium or a long-term basis. The removal of that facility in the past few months was part of the Social Welfare Act that was before the House some time ago. It represents a small but an important achievement.

The whole question of stock relief is of vital importance in relation to all farming matters. Again, I am pleased to say that the Minister for Finance indicated his willingness, in certain conditions, to have stock relief applied to leases approved by the Land Commission. This is a major step forward and I am confident it will result in more short-term and long-term land leasing.

Because of the involvement of the Land Commission for so long in the whole land question, a group of Land Commission inspectors have been brought to Dublin for in-service training. They will be given special responsibilities in promoting land leasing in every part of the country.

It is very difficult, in the agricultural area particularly, to win widespread acceptance quickly for any new scheme. In this respect we must all work very hard. My views in regard to land leasing are well known nationally. Land leasing represents the way forward and the means of achieving greater production from every acre of land but it is of the utmost importance that this message be put across in every parish. There are inbuilt prejudices, anxieties and fears on the part of people who have land to rent. I am confident that a very good job can be done in this whole area of leasing by the socio-economic advisers who have been appointed to deal with such matters and with the question of farm inheritance and so on.

In 1972 when we were joining the EEC there was a good deal of talk about what was referred to as 12-year or long-term leasing. At the time I was very much involved at another level but I believed genuinely then that any period shorter than 12 years was uneconomic so far as leasing was concerned and that we should not even contemplate it. However, the years have taught me a somewhat different lesson. Twelve years is a long time. So far as the mentality of rural folk is concerned, it is too long. I would prefer at this stage that, in order to have the concept accepted we would be talking about medium-term leasing arrangements of perhaps four to seven years. This would be a far better idea than the 11-month system. I hope people will come to realise that this medium-term leasing is in the best interest of all concerned.

On the question of the promotion of land leasing, rural organisations have shown extreme interest so far. That is something I am very grateful for. The ICOS have been very active in a new concept, in that land leasing is based on the co-operatives. Because they have so many shareholders supplying either cattle to their marts or milk to their creamaries, they have set up what we could describe loosely as a matchmaking service whereby farmers who wish to expand in a certain area would be able to ascertain from the co-operatives where there might be land for renting. That concept is meeting with great success. A number of the leases are ready for signature but they cannot be signed legally until the Bill has been enacted. This, again, is a very important step and I am sure we will be hearing a lot more about it.

Another very important decision in the past six months and one that is gathering momentum by the week is the scheme I introduced for the joint purchase of land. That idea is new to this country but it has a lot to commend it. The basis of it is that any farmer who would wish to purchase land that would come on the market but also might not be in a position to do so because of high interest rates and the general non-availability of capital for land purchase, could form part of a group who, through the good offices of the Land Commission locally, would be helped at certain stages of the process. This results in two, three or perhaps four farmers purchasing jointly a farm that individually would be outside their ability to purchase. This scheme makes such good sense that one is amazed it was not thought of before. The figures for the months from January to April would indicate that the scheme is extremely popular. I commend it to any group of farmers who are anxious to acquire extra acreage. I will be keeping a very close eye on the operation of the scheme and if it is found that changes are necessary we will make those changes.

Another very important decision was taken about two years ago which is now beginning to pay great dividends in so far as the inheritance of land is concerned. I refer to the decision whereby a plan was drawn up for the exemption of stamp duty on the occasion of the transfer of a farm from father to son. In certain conditions — provided the son is under 35 and has had the benefit of a year in an agricultural college or of an EEC course of 100 hours — he would be entitled to be exempted totally from stamp duty. So far almost 3,000 farmers have seen fit to hand over their farms to their sons. This concept must raise a whole series of questions as to the method by which we would hope to bring about an earlier transfer of land. We will be looking at all aspects of farm inheritance and early retirement schemes. That is our greatest chance of getting land mobility.

There has been great interest in the division of commonages. Unfortunately one person can hold up the division of a commonage for selfish reasons. I am becoming very impatient with those people and the full rigours of the law, which were not used before, will apply now. Many commanages are now being divided and that is how it should be. The regulation of land sales is being looked at. Contrary to what has been said, the Government have not decided on any line of action. They are looking at various aspects of this. The Government will not interfere with an individual's right to put up for public auction his or her farm. That is central to our Constitution and will be accepted as such. That does not mean to say that there will not be certain checks made to ensure that a big percentage of available land will be chanelled to members of small and medium sized farming families. These are the people who are most likely to have the greatest production per acre and make the greatest contribution to the family.

The workings of the farm modernisation scheme are well known. However, because of many shortcomings in the scheme there are proposals in Brussels to change it and chart another road for the next ten years. The Government are very much in the thick of the fighting in Brussels at present. We want the best possible deal under the structures section. Every available opportunity is taken to ensure we get the best possible deal.

Heretofore a development farmer had a certain target which he was expected to reach in a certain time. This will be changed in that it is likely that a greater band of farmers will get benefit from the new structures. However, they will have to prove that any improvements they carry out will be lasting and represent value for money. This is a different concept from the one held by Mansholt when he visited Ireland 12 years ago.

We are talking about helping farmers not on the basis that production will be increased but on the basis of producing better quality products. That is related to the surpluses there are in Brussels. It is important that we get the type of schemes which will give a better standard of living to our farmers.

Deputy Noonan mentioned farm buildings and said we should have a policy of cheaper buildings without losing sight of certain standards and the desirability of housing all cattle during the winter. When the new structures are agreed we will have a free flowing system.

I am not happy with the amount of paper work and bureaucracy involved in grant approvals for farmers. There is too much to-ing and fro-ing between the agricultural adviser and the FDS officials before a grant is paid. I will ensure that that area is tightened up. I like the concept of cheap housing for cattle. The Agricultural Institute at Grange, County Meath, are testing a cheap type of cattle house which would suit a small or medium size farmer. It has been in operation for two winters and the Department will look closely at it and perhaps give grant aid for that type of building. This should alleviate the problem we have had of high cost farm buildings.

Until recently and because of the super-levy the beef cow sector was the cinderella of farming. There is no doubt that a national beef cow herd is very important. The Minister and Deputy Noonan pointed out the importance of beef exports to this country. I am worried about the fact that the numbers of the herd have not changed.

We must take note of the plan particularly where it deals with the grants available for animal breeders. This might have some relevance. It is of crucial importance that our beef cow herd be increased immediately. I have seen some recent figures to suggest that if there was one extra animal in each herd we would get a 10 per cent increase in the one year. With the current levels of subvention now available through the various grants, one would hope that farmers would see it was to their benefit to increase the beef cow herd. Some three-quarters of the beef cow herds are in the severely or less severely handicapped areas, normally in the north-west, and because of that there is considerable scope for expansion. The milk levy hatchet will fall in the next three or four years in that we may not be able to produce as much milk as we would have liked. Traditionally there has been traffic in calves from the south right across to the western areas and it may happen in the next year or so that certain types of calves will become very dear. In my view it would be much better for the beef cow herd owners to produce more. With the Charolais breed it is possible now to have a cross in breeding. This will mean good liveweight gains in the first years and as store cattle they should command a good price on the market.

The expert negotiating skill of the Minister in Brussels was most important so far as the variable premium was concerned. This has been heralded by the meat factories as one of the greatest victories we have had and so it should be. Before this everywhere our products went, because of the way the variable premium worked, British and Northern Ireland exporters had a head and shoulders start on us in every European market. We were beginning to feel that in a very vicious way in that many of our meat factories were working on half-time, some had closed and many redundancies were on the way.

It is important to have a good balance and good competition in the marketplace between cattle for the live trade and for the dead meat trade. All sectors of the farming industry are important but in my view the most important one is the dry cattle section. If there were any hiccup in our markets overseas or if cattle were devalued by £100 per head — this has always been possible in the cattle trade — then we would have serious problems. Because of the valuable work of many of our exporters, of Government intervention and the CBF, now we have access to some lucrative markets in Third World countries, a fact that is well known to every Irish farmer. However, a civil war in any of the countries or some embargo could cut off a most important export route for our cattle and sheep. I give the House an undertaking that this Government will do everything possible to open new doors and new export outlets for our cattle. This is an important aspect and it is something that impinges on the life of every farmer.

At the end of this year and early next year I intend to review the western package. This is an important measure for small farmers. We have had the western package for four years now. When it was introduced it was heralded as a great innovation and I agree that the concept was good. A sum of £30 million was to be made available over ten years for development in the north-west. Unfortunately, the various schemes drawn up were done hastily and without due regard to the circumstances in which they would have to work. In any event, certain parts of the scheme never got off the ground. For instance, there is a calf-to-beef scheme which had a price tag of about £8 million but only about £100,000 has been paid out of it in four years. Obviously we will have to be more sensible with regard to the type of projects in the new plan. Every effort will be made, in conjunction with the farming organisations and the various staffs, to ensure that the new scheme which we will submit to Brussels will overcome the difficulties that exist now. I do not want to go into too much detail today. It is the type of scheme that is potentially very good for small farmers. Great efforts are needed to ensure that we get the best return for the benefit of small farming families in the north-west.

I hope that 1983-84 will be remembered as a good year for sheep farmers. It was only this week that the final instalment in connection with payment of the EEC ewe premium was received. This means that the £5 for each breeding ewe will be topped up by another payment of £8.09 next month. That means a sum of more than £13 per breeding ewe has been received for this country through the various EEC mechanisms. The other disadvantaged area payments mean that under certain conditions some sheep farmers will get approximately £23 per breeding ewe. That is as it should be because the entire sheep industry was the cinderella of Irish farming for many years. It is only in the past three years that it has begun to come out of the doldrums.

Deputy Noonan said it was a retrograde step to discontinue the Wool Marketing Board. This board was set up to do a particular job some years ago and it did very good work. It was basically an educational job and it carried out its tasks with great fervour and enthusiasm. In my view it was very satisfactory. However, we have now reached the stage where we have overcome the difficulties and new circumstances exist. When one considers the healthy state of the sheep industry, both in terms of the price for sheep and the price for wool, the decision last year to discontinue with the board has not been the retrograde step referred to by Deputy Noonan. This Government are on the right track and the policies we are pursuing are the right ones. As far as Irish farming is concerned, as they say in the racing world, I hope that 1984 will prove to be a good year.

I should like to be able to share the optimism expressed just now by the Minister of State. Everything that the Government have done since coming into office has not been bad. Some measures have been of benefit to the farmers and I compliment them on that on behalf of the farmers of my own constituency and of the country in general. However, it is clear to me, and must be to everyone living in a rural area, that there is an air of despondency in agriculture, the like of which has not been seen since the foundation of this State. State investment has been cut drastically and these cuts will affect the productive section of agriculture, whereas the non-productive areas — namely the Department of Agriculture, ACOT and the officials are protected. The farmers are being skinned, to use a rural phrase. Things are worsening, incomes dropping, but that does not seem to be the case within the Department or among the personnel in ACOT, into whose salaries and travelling expenses money is being poured. I have my doubts that the people receiving these very fine salaries and travelling expenses are making the same input into our economy as are the farmers, or have the capacity to give the country what the farmers can give if supported a little better.

I am particularly worried that we may now be creating a monster in the administration of agriculture. I refer to ACOT which, in my recent experience, is eating up local democracy, taking all the powers away from the county committees of agriculture. The decision-making is being taken away from the green fields of Ireland and put into the concrete cages here in the city. Confidence in and amongst farmers has plummeted; we all realise that. They are making panic decisions. Of that I have no doubt, living in a county which is regarded as a model county — and it did not get that name for nothing. Per head of population and in relation to agriculture, that county gives more to this economy than any other, Yet, these decisions are being made because the farmers are convinced that our Minister for Agriculture is only a lightweight in the Cabinet. This is very clearly evidenced in the four-year plan recently produced, in which the Minister dictates to the working party which Fianna Fáil set up, telling them that the Minister for Finance cannot afford the agricultural plan.

Let us have a look at what has happened to our little country and to agriculture during the last year. There has been a drastic fall off in the national herd. That herd is the basis of good agriculture and good agriculture is the basis of a good economy. For the first time in our history a quota has been imposed in relation to milk products and milk production. We are now confined to 4.6 per cent extra over last year. In Wexford over the past three years production has been increased by 11 per cent each year. This year we again increase by 11 per cent but will we be allowed to? That is the big question. There is no use in the Minister's trying to put scare stories across — because no-one believes them any more — that we may not reach the 4.6 quota. If we do not, the blame can be laid fairly and squarely on his shoulders because of the scare stories which he is putting about and because farmers have sold off good cows because they did not want to be producing milk for nothing. I shall talk about that later.

There is also very strict control on the amount of sugar beet that can be produced. That is something to which neither the Minister nor anybody else has referred in this House today. Farmers are now expected to produce beet at £8 per tonne, whereas the cost of production of one tonne of beet is £22. Do the Minister and the Sugar Company think that the farmers would be so foolish as to produce beet at £8 per tonne? Has all this passed over the Minister's head. Could he not forsee that situation, and step in to defend an industry in which, according to Mr. Liam Cosgrave, the former Taoiseach, 25,000 people were employed?

We have the report of the monitoring committee on food imports which tells us that these imports are increasing annually — commodities which could be produced at home. We have lost the AI subsidy and the lime subsidy funded from Europe. We are throwing good money after bad. We have salvaged very little from this famous deal. The rural home economics colleges are due to close on 30 June, and I shall refer to them later.

The Land Commission may as well be done away with. They are not being given any money to buy land, with the result that the only people who can buy land which comes on the market today are the big farmers or non-farmers—solicitors, doctors, or anybody with money. The people who should be getting that land, our small farmers, the backbone of the economy, cannot compete in the market place. Their only chance was when the Land Commission had teeth or had the money to buy and could step in. They could then compete with the doctors, solicitors and anybody else with the money, but that is not the case any longer. A group of my constituents recently asked me to ensure that a particular plot of ground was purchased by the Land Commission, so that they might get a slice of it to make their holdings viable. I received back a letter from the Minister of State, Deputy Connaughton, who I am sorry to say is not present now, enclosing a beautiful, colourful brochure saying that he is now encouraging group purchase. I would not dare send that brochure to the farmers because if they could buy land they would not need any help or advice from the Government. What they want is to ensure that the doctors, solicitors and other professional people do not get their hands on it for tax or hobby purposes. Our land to be utilised correctly for the benefit of the economy should remain in the hands of the farmers who are anxious, even in these difficult times, to buy land to make their holdings viable.

The Land Commission were the last resort but they do not have any money; therefore they cannot compete. The big farmers are getting bigger and we are returning to the situation of many years ago of the landlord and the tenant. Do not let anybody tell me that that is emotional language. That is what is happening in the country. I am disappointed that the Minister for Agriculture is not aware of this. If he were, he would not stand for it.

The farm modernisation scheme was suspended — I would say done away with — and then reintroduced a year later. This was to aid farmers and encourage them to invest in their land. I ask the Minister of State, Deputy Hegarty, if he knows how many have applied for this new scheme. Wexford is a reasonable county on which to judge and since January of this year when the scheme was reintroduced, two people were interested and nobody applied. When the Fianna Fáil scheme was in operation the monthly intake was about 25 applicants. There are 2,500 farmers in Wexford still not in the scheme. Many people would be interested if the scheme was worthwhile but because it is not nobody is interested. Things are no better now than they were last year when the scheme was suspended. The farm retirement scheme was scrapped. I know that 607 farmers is not a very large number but those people involved themselves in the scheme and gave their land over to younger, more energetic people. That was a fairly successful scheme.

We had a lot of talk about the potato co-op last year. Great support was to be given to that but it has not got off the ground. I understand the Minister for Agriculture promised last year that he would give £1 million to this. When it came to the Estimates we find that only £100,000 was given. We must give credit to the Minister of State, Deputy Hegarty, for getting that sum. I do not believe any money would have been given if it was not for his interest. This will not be sufficient to get this scheme off the ground. It is so small that I believe it will destroy initiative.

I am disappointed the Minister is not here to listen to what I am saying. I am sure he would see the reasoning behind putting £1 million into the potato industry. He spoke this morning about £200 million of imports of potatoes. He is afforded a golden opportunity with this scheme to prevent some of those imports and to help resolve our balance of payments problem. The Minister for Finance is his boss and he is afraid of him. He dictates and if he says "jump" the Minister for Agriculture jumps.

The hardship fund has disappeared. I am sure the two farmers opposite know well that this fund was never more necessary than it is today. That is what has happened to our agriculture industry since the Coalition came into office. There are probably many other items which I could touch on but which I do not want to because my time is limited.

About 90,000 acres of sugar beet are grown every year. A former Taoiseach, Liam Cosgrave, claimed at one stage that 25,000 people are employed in this industry. Any interference with that industry will have disastrous consequences for the workforce and our economy. I was a beet grower up to the time I came in here. It would probably be more profitable for me if I continued growing beet. I know what went on in the business. The trend I see now with the Sugar Company and the Government is for less emphasis on the sugar beet industry and I do not like it. Our sugar factories are in Carlow, Mallow, Tuam and Thurles and they are completely out of date. The beet grown in Wexford goes to Thurles and the machinery there is very old. One of these days that factory will come to a halt. This will be very bad news for the Leas-Cheann Comhairle. If you have not an efficient factory you will not have an efficient industry.

I would like to refer to the new structure of pay for sugar beet. The price of beet in decided in the tare house. Tare and sugar are taken into account. The Sugar Company changed their strategy this year. Up to this they contracted on an acreage basis. They gave a farmer possibly ten acres and the company paid him for whatever tonnage he produced on that ten acres, whether it was 22 tonnes an acre, 20 tonnes or 17 tonnes an acre. The type of year decided the tonnage. In a poor year you could have a crop of 17 tonnes and in a good year you could have a crop of 22 tonnes. The Sugar Company have now said they want tonnage and they will pay the beet growers on tonnage. The beet grower who got paid on ten acres who now gets a tonnage of 170 tonnes will get £32 per tonne for all of it.

The sugar beet crop looks very good this year. We will assume that the farmer gets the 170 tonne yeild so he will be paid £32 for that. If the beet is very good and the yeild is in excess of 20 tonnes per acre the farmer will receive £8 per tonne for the remaining tonnage. Everybody knows that is where the profit is. I said before, and I repeat, that the Sugar Company have conned the farmer. They have been cheating him for years in relation to sugar content.

A few years ago I went abroad and the customs officials did not know that I had three sugar beet in my suitcase. I had them tested in a place near Brussels. The sugar content was 16.8 per cent. When the very same beet was tested by the Irish Sugar Company they gave me a return of 12.2 per cent, that is a difference of 4.6 per cent. This would have meant a lot to me at the time. Wexford is a good beet growing area. We grow over one-quarter of the nation's crop of beet. We have not got any sugar factory so the cost of transporting the beet is an enormous factor. It is killing the industry because the people transporting beet are making as much out of it as the people growing it. Transport costs are getting steeper every day and the growing of beet is becoming less attractive. The Minister must be careful how he treads in relation to the sugar beet industry and take stock of what is happening. Some 25,000 people are involved.

I am very disappointed that the suggestion made last year in regard to the potato co-ops has not got off the ground. There are 90,000 growers of potatoes annually and they produce an estimated 809,000 tonnes. Last year it is generally believed that between 98,000 and 123,000 acres were grown. There is no accurate detail. The estimated number of acreas for 1982 was 90,000. The market requires 890,000 tonnes and there was a shortfall of 85,000 tonnes in 1982. It is unbelievable that there should be a shortfall of potatoes. That represents a loss to the Exchequer of £30 million. There is potential for 25,000 tonnes of chipped potatoes.

In Holland there are 15,000 growers producing 4 million tonnes from 250,000 acres, of which they export 1.5 million tonnes. That is what could be done here if we set our minds to it. The pity is that we have not done so. The Minister had a golden opportunity of showing that he was boss in the Cabinet by getting £1 million to get this co-operative going. There is a similar effort in Holland and I believe most of the ideas in this document come from Holland. Confidence was beginning to grow amongst potato growers but when it came to the crunch the money was not there. In the Netherlands an industry-funded body carries out market research, as well as collecting and publishing statistical information. It also funds promotional activities and research and sets quality standards. Appropriate legislation provides this body with the necessary legal powers but it is self-financing. I believe the body which is to be set up here will become self-financing and it will not be a case of having to put State money into it every year. However, no such body exists in Ireland, nor is there any agency undertaking promotional activities. The existing marketing structures perform the basic function of transferring potatoes from the producer to the consumer but poor quality potatoes have not been discouraged, nor have the market forces encouraged the evolution of a competitive industry. These points are made in a document prepared by the Irish potato growers in conjunction with An Foras Talúntais. We do not have a co-ordinated approach to the potato industry. The opportunity was there but was lost. I appeal to the Minister to encourage the potato growers to live up to the promise.

I refer to the Four-Year Plan for Agriculture and the additional comments by Mr. Bart Brady of the Department of Finance. He states:

The report fails to establish priorities consistent with available resources and does not take due account of the present grave difficulties in the public finances. Thus it tends towards a list of desirable measures rather than a plan.

Obviously Mr. Bart Brady thinks damn all of the plan.

A letter written by the Minister for Agriculture on 16 March 1983 states:

It will be evident from the Budget statement of the Minister for Finance on 9 February that, because of the pressing need to reduce the Exchequer borrowing requirement and eliminate the current budget deficit, Exchequer spending must be kept within well defined limits not only in 1983 but for some years ahead. As a result, the extent to which Exchequer resources can be allocated for various services, including agriculture, will be seriously curtailed. Indeed, the constraints on Exchequer spending have made it impossible at this juncture to implement most of the interim recommendations put forward by the Working Group last October. I understand that the work of that group has progressed to the stage where it might expect to complete its report in the near future. It is important, therefore, that the Group should be fully cognisant of the current budgetary situation and the serious difficulties in the way of providing substantial additional Exchequer funds for any purpose.

Obviously the Minister has great confidence in agriculture.

The terms of reference of the working group were as follows:

To prepare a four-year plan for the development of Irish Agriculture including, in particular, the sustained expansion of agricultural production leading to the improvement of farm incomes, and bearing in mind the national economic situation and Ireland's membership of the EEC.

It is not possible to relate one to the other. On the one hand they are to prepare a plan, but on the other hand they must watch the Minister for Finance who is looking over the shoulder of the Minister for Agriculture.

The report, while it contains a lot of rubbish, provides the basis for a good plan, but we are going nowhere if we are prepared to accept the constraints. It is the contention of most people that if the economy is to get off its knees we must have a strong agricultural industry.

Much has been said about the milk levy and its importance. We can increase our production up to a limit of 4.6 per cent. It has been said by the Minister and others on his side that we may not reach this level of production and if this is the case it will be because farmers have been making panic decisions since last October. They became nervous. It became obvious from the complicated pronouncements of the Taoiseach and the Minister for Agriculture that the Government did not know where they were going. Farmers were reluctant to make provision for extra production, for extra fertility of the land in 1984.

Nobody can expect the farmers to produce milk for nothing. Some have sold off their cows and others have stopped feeding nitrogen to promote extra growth. They have stopped feeding meals. At home we used feed 10lbs of meal even throughout the summer. We felt it was worthwhile because it produced extra, and that is where the profit lay. This year it is different. I will not feed meals to increase my milk output beyond the 4.6 per cent because if I do I will be penalised for producing that milk. Mine is typical of the attitude of all farmers. Anybody who was at a calf market recently could see the numerous Friesian heifer calves for sale. They will probably be used for beef; farmers will not hold them and put young heifers in calf because farmers do not know where they are going, and with uncertainty in the co-operatives as to who should get what, it will be difficult to change that attitude.

A few weeks ago the Minister said that if something did not happen about the spread of the 4.6 per cent extra milk he would have to take action. In the west they cannot produce that extra milk. Will that be spread to Wexford where they can produce 11 per cent more? Nobody knows. The Minister said last week he would take action if something had not been done by last weekend. I am asking him to step in to make arrangements whereby there will be an even spread so that we will have the confidence to produce the extra that is needed for viability. When we go back to the negotiating table next year it is important that we will have achieved that. Of course we can produce the 4.6 per cent extra.

We must have confidence. We must be able to tell farmers to go ahead and produce the extra milk and we must be able to tell them they will be paid for all that milk. I appeal to the Minister to ease the terrible panic among dairy producers. If he does not, the effect will be felt soon.

The farm modernisation scheme was suspended in February 12 months ago and in January 1984 it was reintroduced. Since then it has been an abject failure because of the number of farmers who are not participating. The number is being reduced every day. In Wexford nobody has taken it up yet. This is bad for farming. However, I was pleased to hear the Minister say that he will investigate the possibility of paying farmers who were in the scheme and who had carried out work. I was delighted to hear that and I suggest that he should guarantee today that they will be paid because they kept their end of the bargain.

In the time I have left I will make a few suggestions on how the scheme could be improved. There was very little wrong with the original scheme and we are thinking on the right lines when we say that any State aid in future should be related to the capacity of the farmers to produce extra. I would even suggest that some of the grants might be withheld until farmers participating could show that the State aid was of benefit. Any farmer who reclaims land or puts up a building does it to increase viability, but I know of instances in which land drainage, for instance, did not work out. I agree with the philosophy that State aid must be related to the capacity to achieve targets.

I will refer briefly to the AI and lime subsidies which have been done away with. Provision was made for them in the Estimate but the Minister had to sell out on something in order to achieve something else in regard to the milk levy, and he sold out on these subsidies. I suggested this morning that some of the money saved on these subsidies might be allocated in another direction and the Minister said he had other ideas. Is it his intention to continue to pay 50 per cent of the lime and AI subsidies? This is the time when lime is spread on land and when the AI scheme is being most used. Every dairy farmer will know that in order to get most from your cow you must have her in calf by April if she is to be in milk in January.

If that is the Minister's intention let him go ahead now and announce it. Those two schemes were excellent and they were used extensively. Our milking herd would be improved by using the best bulls from abroad. Farmers had been inclined to use any old bull to get their cows in calf by April to give milk from 1 January. That AI subsidy scheme meant that excellent breeds were available and therefore the quality of herds was improved.

The lime subsidy definitely improved land fertility. It was a bad day's work by the Minister when he allowed those two schemes to go. The repercussions will be felt for many years unless he allows the subsidies to continue at the rate of 50 per cent as provided for in the Estimates. The calf subsidy has dropped from £22 to £9. That was another bad decision. We know that the number in the national herd has dropped. That is the basis of good agriculture and good agriculture is the basis of a sound economy. I have always held the view that the calf subsidy as it operated might not have been the proper way to operate the scheme. The dairyman got the subsidy but I have always thought that the person involved at the beef end of the business should have got it. However, we will leave that to the Minister.

Last week there was a debate on the rural home economics colleges and I am not at all convinced by anything the Minister had to say — which was very little — or anything the Ministers of State said — which was even less — that the colleges should close. As I said on that occasion, those colleges were the weak section and they were the ones the Government could attack because they did not have a large lobby. However, it will be disastrous if they are closed. Because of pressure I understand the colleges are putting forward a proposal to the YEA and to other agencies to provide funding. I ask the Minister to tell the House what is the situation. The colleges are now recruiting for next year but they do not know what will happen. It was grossly insensitive that last week representatives of ACOT should go to the colleges to say goodbye to the people working there; in other words, the doors were closing. That was most insensitive at a time when the whole matter was being considered. I ask the Minister to talk to his Department officials about it and at least to apologise to the people concerned. They have given great service in the area of education for many years. I have visited the college at Ramsgrange, which is near my home, on many occasions this year. The courses there are excellent and relevant and they are important for the growth of agriculture. Last week the Minister told me there were still 1,000 places available for boys and some 260 places available for girls. I want to know what will happen with regard to these places. Will he leave the RHE colleges just as white elephants and allow them to deteriorate?

Now that we have had the report on food imports I hope the Minister will act on it. He is full of good ideas but they are not worth a damn unless something is done about them. Is there money to back the ideas? Ideas are useless unless they are put into practice.

The silage season is now with us but farmers and contractors are using the same machinery they used three years ago. Next year, or even this year, the machines will break down. Agriculture is in such a state farmers cannot afford new machinery. For instance, in 1976 some 6,000 tractor units were bought and in 1982 some 2,000 were bought but this year the number is half that figure. We are getting to the stage where farm machinery is being run down.

I wish to thank the Deputies who took part in the debate and it is unfortunate that time did not allow more to participate. However, for rural Deputies Friday is not a very good day and whoever arranged the dates might have considered people who are here on days other than Friday. Thursday would have been a much more suitable day. A large proportion of backbenchers are rural Deputies. This is one of the few opportunities they get to speak on agriculture and it is unfortunate they were denied the opportunity because of the timing of the debate. I accept that I spoke for a long time this morning but I get few opportunities to do so and I had considerable ground to cover. I think we should ask the Whips to arrange a more suitable date for the debate in future.

The debate was constructive and helpful. There was no ill-will or deliberate misrepresentation but I think there were some misunderstandings and I shall refer to some of them. Deputy Noonan said that 80 per cent of the increase in the Estimate this year consisted of salaries and travelling expenses for officials in the Department of Agriculture. That is erroneous. The increase in the Estimate for 1984 is £42 million and the increase in respect of travelling expenses, salaries and general administrative costs is £4.5 million. Rather than being 80 per cent it is 10.7 per cent.

Deputy Noonan and Deputy Byrne referred to the need for an agricultural plan. As I said during the week, it is my intention that the views put forward in the four-year plan, together with the views of the National Planning Board which dealt with agriculture, will be incorporated in the Government plan dealing with the medium-term. The better parts of those two plans will be incorporated in our plan. The four-year plan referred to many matters about which we knew already.

Of course what we do has to be operated within the framework of the Common Agricultural Policy. It is no use suggesting items that amount to national aids or to schemes that will not be tolerated by the Community. We cannot have the benefits of the EEC in every way. We must conform with their policies. Whatever plan we have must be in the context of the Common Agricultural Policy.

I was glad that Deputy Noonan agreed with the point I made earlier about the necessity to improve the quality of the breeding of sheep, particularly lowland sheep, in this country. It is essential to do that because it is the only area of significance left within the Community where there is a deficit. All the other major commodities produced in the northern part of Europe are in surplus or have reached saturation point, whether it is milk, cereals, bacon, pork or even beef. We produce only 75 per cent of our own sheep meat requirements within the Community. Our breeding policy here over the years has, unfortunately, not been good enough. It has not been up to standard and, if one goes to Britain and sees the high quality of the lambs there and the high proportion of lambing, one realises that this is an area where we have not achieved the same efficiency as in other sectors of agriculture. It is one of the few areas where there is tremendous scope for expansion. As well as producing more sheep we will have to improve the quality and my Department have been very involved in that, especially over the past year. We are bringing in top-class rams from Britain and other places and An Foras Talúntais, ACOT, UCD and my Department are working to see if the strains in the breeding qualities of sheep can be improved. Our sheep and our lambs are too fat and are not getting the best price on the continental markets.

We are all well aware of the problems we have had in the bacon and pork industry in this country over the last 15 months. It is also prevalent throughout Europe and in Germany pig producers took a terrible beating in 1983. Our producers also did badly in 1983 and the early part of 1984. It is a complex problem and a case of over-supply and price resistance for diminishing markets. We have done much in this area: we got intervention wheat transported free of charge to this country, we got the private storage aids from the Community, which is a big help, and we got improved export refunds for the pork which we have been exporting to Japan. Those measures have been of assistance to pig producers and there are indications that the market is improving. However, I am concerned that there are a number of bacon plants here whose performance is not up to standard. We have been outstanding examples of rationalisation and modernisation in many parts of the country but, in others, the plants are still substandard and my Department will be taking fairly drastic action if people cannot bring their operations into line with EEC requirements. If we do not do it the EEC will do it for us and that is why I am issuing the warning that we will have to take measures to see that people conform with modern day standards of hygiene and performance. I am also glad to see that a number of companies which were grant-aided by the IDA earlier this week will be exporting to the United States. That is a market which we have almost ignored in recent times and it is considerable.

Deputy Byrne referred to home economic colleges. We had a lengthy debate on that last week and I outlined what measures I hope to take in conjunction with the Minister for Labour, the Youth Employment Agency and AnCO. We will be announcing the steps we propose to take in this matter as soon as we decide what can be done.

Will that be soon?

I will have to see what the outcome of the discussions will be. Deputy Noonan referred to discussions currently in progress in Brussels on structural directives. These were originally drawn up before we joined the EEC so the present negotiations are particularly important from our point of view. Of course negotiations are hamstrung to a considerable degree by the financial constraints within the Community are present. People come in here saying they know there are financial difficulties in Brussels "but"— the "but" means that we are supposed to ignore the fact that there are financial difficulties in Europe. There are no ifs and buts, there are financial difficulties and every country is supposed to contribute to some of the cost cutting. We cannot expect everybody else to take the cuts and to escape them ourselves. We got away with it in the superlevy by getting £180 million extra — that is what it means in terms of extra milk — in 1984 whereas other countries had to take a cut back amounting to thousands of millions of pounds. Having done that, some people here expected us to get every fiddle faddle that is going as if there was no financial crisis within the Community. We would not have any problems if there was no financial crisis but there is and it amounts to thousands of millions of pounds. Considering that, we have done extraordinarily well but some people prefer to ignore it.

Deputy Noonan raised a relevant point about which I have been speaking to the Minister of State, Deputy Connaughton, who is in charge of the structures area, that we must try to gear our grant-aid to buildings and structures which should not have to be as streamlined as they were in the past. We should not have to have masses of concrete everywhere or superb buildings. Something less adventurous and less expensive would suffice. Perhaps we have been a little over-ambitious in this area.

Deputy Noonan raised the problem of stray dogs. If other Departments are finding it difficult to administer this scheme I will take the responsibility. It has major implications for agriculture because of the destruction that dogs can cause to sheep by worrying them, causing loss of lambs and untold suffering. It is also relevant because of the danger of rabies being introduced here. Something will have to be done because if we ever have a rabies outbreak there would be terrible consequences.

Deputy Byrne claimed that the hardship fund had disappeared. It has not. We provided £1 milion in 1984 for his fund compared with £350,000 in 1983, a 300 per cent increase. With regard to transmissible gastro enteritis in pigs which has been causing problems in the Leitrim-Cavan area, we are well aware of the problem and are in close contact with the owner involved. We are doing everything possible to see that the spread of the disease is curtailed and we believe that it has been. We have adopted a most responsible attitude in this respect.

I am also vitally interested in seeing that we get a greater return from our food industry with regard to employment, processing and in combating imports. Deputy Byrne is mistaken if he thinks he should aim his milk yield at a target of 4.6 per cent. You cannot be penalised if you go to 4.64 per cent. People can go as high as 15 per cent or 20 per cent because, with the natural drop-out from milk, some producers will be able to expand as they have always done but they will have to keep in contact with their local cooperatives to know what the situation is.

I wish to thank everybody who took part in the debate and to say that agriculture is in particularly good shape and in particularly good hands.

Vote put and agreed to.
The Dáil adjourned at 4 p.m. until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 29 May 1984.
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