asked the Minister for Education if, in view of the chaotic situation which now prevails in the holding of the practical examinations, he will consider postponing these examinations until he can be certain that they can be correctly and adequately held.
Private Notice Question. - Postponement of Practical Examinations.
The Deputy's description of the situation as chaotic is not in accordance with the facts. Yesterday was the first day of the tests in woodwork and in engineering. These practical tests are scheduled to run over a number of days.
On the first day, yesterday, these tests took place in over two-thirds of the schools involved. I am informed that the proportion of schools holding the tests is much improved today. I am satisfied that these tests will be run correctly and adequately in all the schools involved. Accordingly I am not prepared to postpone these examinations.
Is the Minister aware that many of the facts he has given this House today, although I am sure given with good intent, represent misinformation? Is the Minister aware that, of the leaving certificate marks for construction and engineering, one-third are awarded for the practical examinations, one-third for theory and one-third for practice? Therefore, will he agree that students are likely to be discriminated against with regard to one-third of their higher paper and two-fifths of their lower paper? The Minister has said that the proportion of schools holding these tests today is much improved. I would wish that that were true but it is not. Is the Minister aware that the number of schools in which chaotic situations obtain has increased today, that attendants who turn up wishing to participate find that they cannot do so because of lack of knowledge of the practical equipment needed for such examinations? Furthermore, is the Minister aware that these are not tests merely of manual dexterity, which he has been contending, but are also tests of tasks to be performed. Is the Minister of my view that it is educationally unsound for one set of pupils to be aware of the tasks yet to be performed while others have already done so?
The Deputy is suggesting that I have misinformed the House as to the facts of this matter. I want to categorically reject that suggestion. My information — and is has to be unlike hers — is coming from that being fed into the offices of my Department charged with running these examinations. I am satisfied that what I have said here is factually correct. The vast majority of schools in this country commenced the practical examinations yesterday. There were some schools where they did not commence for one reason or another, into which it might not be appropriate for me to go having regard to the fact that at this moment talks are taking place. I will leave it at that. But in a good number of those schools substitute arrangements have already been put into place. I am satisfied that the majority of them will have substitute arrangements in place tomorrow, or the following day, to ensure that the pupils — and our concern must be for the pupils — concerned will have their examinations presented to them and will be given an opportunity to equip themselves adequately.
My concern is solely for the pupils, many of whom contacted me over the last 24 hours, saying that they are not satisfied with certain aspects of the examination in that some pupils have sat them and others have not. Is the Minister aware that the association of teachers involved in third level education have issued a statement today saying that the marks accruing to these practical examinations will, in their eyes, have no authority or validity for entrance to third-level institutions? Can the Minister comment on that?
Those teachers have no authority to make any such statement.
I very much admire the aplomb and confidence — if one can call it that — of the Minister.
The Deputy must. It is well founded.
However, when it verges on disparagement and a complete disregard for the wishes and——
I cannot allow a debate. It is not appropriate.
Is the Minister aware of the dismay, consternation and chaos which are building up in young people's minds throughout the country and of their wish that there should be fairness and equity in these results? Is the Minister aware that there cannot now be such equity because of the accelerating difficulties being experienced in the holding of the examinations? He said over the weekend that in the great majority of schools examinations would go ahead and that the appropriate arrangements had been made in his Department. Regretfully the appropriate arrangements have not been carried out.
Would the Deputy please confine herself to the question?
There is chaos and confusion in the schools.
I get the feeling, unworthey on my part——
I am sure that it is.
——that some people might not be altogether displeased that there has been some upset because of the continuous exaggeration and emphasis placed on the minority of schools where there was disruption. Let me emphasise again what I said in my original reply, that in over two-thirds of the schools the examinations ran normally.
The Minister is responsible for all our schools, not two-thirds of them. What about the other one-third?
In the remainder the position is that the alternative arrangements are being put in place today and the balance will be put in place tomorrow and the following day. It is hoped that by the end of this week in all schools — and I emphasise this, a Cheann Comhairle — notwithstanding the disruption, which was not caused by my Department, the pupils will be adequately and properly examined on these subjects.
The champagne luncheon must have gone to the Minister's head.
I think that I should really move to the next item of business. I ask you to agree, Deputy O'Rourke.
I ask for assurance for the Minister that the marks given to these pupils will have authority and validity. In my opinion, they will not. Because of that I call upon him——
Deputy, that is a separate question.
——on behalf of the students to ensure that these examinations will be carried out in a correct manner.
The Deputy should not ignore the Chair. That is a separate question.