Vol. 408 No. 6
14 Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for the Marine if he has received a report regarding the circumstances of the sinking of a Scottish trawler by a nuclear submarine, which he stated on 12 December 1990 had been requested from the British authorities; if any decision has been made yet on further approaches to the British authorities in the light of any information supplied; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
48 Mr. J. O'Keeffe asked the Minister for the Marine whether he has been able to agree improved safety procedures for trawlers in the Irish Sea with the United Kingdom authorities; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
49 Mr. G. O'Sullivan asked the Minister for the Marine if he has had recent consultations or meetings with the British Government regarding submarine traffic in the Irish Sea; the measures he intends to take to protect Irish fishermen's lives and boats working in these waters; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
I propose to take Questions Nos. 14, 48 and 49 together.
As Minister with responsibility for the safety of life at sea and for the development of the fishing industry, I have publicly expressed my concern at the tragic incident involving a Scottish fishing vessel, the Antares in the Firth of Clyde on 22 November 1990, in which four fishermen lost their lives.
Following investigations into the incident, a number of practical measures are now being taken by the British authorities to reduce the risk of such an accident occurring in the future. These include providing fishermen with advance information on planned movements by dived submarines in the Firth of Clyde area which is broadcast by the UK Coastguard every six hours on VHF radio and so is available to all seafarers using a VHF receiver. Trials are also under way on the feasibility of providing electronic devices — or bleepers — to be attached to a trawler's nets, which would alert a submerged submarine to the presence of the trawler's fishing gear.
At my request, the Department of Foreign Affairs are seeking additional information about these measures from the British authorities, including whether they could be applied more generally in the Irish Sea. At my instruction, the secretary of my Department has been in contact with the fisheries administrations of powers believed to have submarines in the area and my Department are maintaining contact with the UK Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to reinforce our expression of concern and to advance the case for greater safety of life and property of fishermen.
The Government are very seriously concerned about the dangers that submarines pose to shipping. We avail of every opportunity to raise this topic in international fora such as the United Nations and the International Maritime Organisation. This matter is again being raised by Ireland at the 59th session of the IMO's Maritime Safety Committee now being held in London. At this meeting my Department's chief surveyor will put the maritime safety committee on notice that Ireland will prepare a paper on this topic for the next general assembly meeting of the IMO with the aim of focusing the attention of the international maritime community on this issue and on the need for constant vigilance in this area if a major tragedy is to be avoided.
I thank the Minister for his reply. Will he agree that the measures now being taken by the British authorities, particularly by the Ministry of Defence, acknowledge that submarines in the Irish Sea pose a threat to fishing and other vessels? Will he also agree that the proposed measures will not eliminate the possibility of tragedies occurring, since they are dependent on the fishermen picking up the message which is broadcast or on the bleeper system working? Will he further agree that the time has come for an international treaty to be negotiated between this State and Britain which would require submarines using the Irish Sea to travel on the surface? Since, quite clearly, we are not in a state of hostility with Britain——
The Deputy is making a statement, he has made his point.
——there is no justification for submarines travelling under water.
The House and I agree that submarines in the Irish Sea are a problem. I should remind the House that submarines belonging to the United Kingdom are not the only submarines plying in those waters. I said in my original reply that I instructed my departmental secretary to contact countries; he contacted the United Kingdom, France, the United States and the USSR, all of which had an interest in that area either through watching one another or going about their business. Use of VHF is very important and availed of because to my knowledge, there is a special listening officer on board tuned to it.
I have partly covered arrangements with the UK; it would have to be on a wider basis and my departmental officer, who is in London at the moment, is putting it on that basis. In the meantime, if VHF and the bleeper systems were in operation, they would be helpful in this regard. I agree that it is a serious problem and I remember, when I was Minister for Transport in 1982, that one of our boats was sunk by a submarine belonging to the UK.
It is a matter of serious concern to many people that this has gone on for so long. I take the Minister's point in relation to meeting his British counterpart but our fishermen — as well as Scottish fishermen — are in danger. Submarine underwater activity in the Irish Sea is unnecessary and agreement could be reached between both nations that it should be curtailed.
It is a matter of satisfaction to me — and to Members of the House — that the activities are not as intensive as they were and we are delighted with the reasons for that.
Will the Minister consider convening a committee of the Cabinet comprising himself, the Minister for Defence and the Minister for Foreign Affairs? The three Ministers could then meet their counterparts in England and France, who are also members of the EC, to resolve the matter. As the UK and France are members of NATO, perhaps they could negotiate with the United States as well as Ireland to have this matter finally resolved. Are the Government aware of the type of activity these submarines are undertaking in the Irish Sea and is there really a necessity for their movement in that sea?
I can assure the Deputy that there is no need for that kind of special committee being set up because the work to which she referred is being done.
A final question from Deputy Gilmore.
Has an assessment been made of the possible danger to passenger vessels and shipping generally in the Irish Sea having regard to the fact that the submarines about which we have been talking are, for the most part, nuclear powered? Has any assessment been made of the possible dangers that could pose to the transportation of people and goods across the Irish Sea?
The hazard to passenger vessels is in the same category as the hazard to fishermen. While the Irish Sea is used by submarines it is not as crowded as the approach to the Firth of Clyde.
