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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 4 Dec 1991

Vol. 414 No. 1

Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Deployment of Helicopters.

Bernard Allen

Ceist:

14 Mr. Allen asked the Minister for Defence whether (1) the Dauphin helicopter has yet been placed in Cork and (2) if training for the placement of the helicopter on the LE Eithne has been completed.

Joe Sherlock

Ceist:

59 Mr. Sherlock asked the Minister for Defence the reason two fishery patrol helicopters, acquired in July, 1986 at a cost of £7.4 million, were used for fishery protection operations for ten flying hours over the four years ending 31 December 1990; if he will outline his response to the criticism of this matter raised in the recent report of the Comptroller and Auditor General; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

I propose to take Questions Nos. 14 and 59 together.

The five Dauphin helicopters, which were acquired in 1986 have been in continuous use in many roles since their acquisition. The operation of these helicopters, which are very significantly more sophisticated and complicated than the Alouette helicopters on which the Air Corps had acquired their expertise in helicopter handling, entailed the development of a planned training programme in terms of flying and maintaining them. This programme was structured to equip the crews first with Dauphin daytime training experience, then, in series, with instrument flying experience, with winch training in daytime search and rescue, with night-time maritime experience and then with winch training for night-time search and rescue. In the case of the two Dauphin helicopters acquired for use in conjunction with LE Eithne in the fisheries surveillance role, the next stage in the development of expertise was in the area of deck landing and operations experience by day, and finally with deck landing and operations experience at night.

It was vital that the training programme should be fully in place if crew members were not to be put at risk. In the event the project proved to be very complex technically and the build up of Air Corps expertise was slower than anticipated primarily because, in the period 1987 to 1989 a large number of skilled technicians left the Air Corps to take up civilian employment and, in the period 1987 to 1990, an equally serious loss of skilled pilots occurred for the same reason. The unusual measure of refusing to allow pilots to retire early was imposed to halt this trend.

A further factor which retarded the training programme was that the Dauphins were fitted with new aviation electronic packages which took between two and three years to prove and to eliminate teething problems. In practice it took far longer to get the necessary training to a level at which ship-helicopter operations could be mounted with confidence than was originally anticipated.

The present position is that steps are being taken to locate a helicopter in Cork to advance the operation. When not embarked on LE Eithne, the helicopter will be deployed to Cork for operation on search and rescue. I expect the relocation of the Dauphin helicopter and its integration operationally with LE Eithne to become established in the early weeks in 1992. To date in 1991 a total of 100 deck landings on LE Eithne have been made.

I welcome the news that a helicopter will be located in Cork. However, the Minister missed the point of my question. Does the Minister realise that the Le Eithne which cost £28 million — double the cost of most other ships — is running at 60 per cent capacity because of the absence of a helicopter on deck resulting in reduced effectiveness of LE Eithne with consequences for our fishing stocks and the efforts to keep down poaching levels off our coasts? What planning procedures are in place in the Department, if an investment of £28 million can be made in a ship which is not being used to its full potential?

Of the five Dauphin helicopters delivered in 1986, two were intended to operate on maritime patrols in conjunction with LE Eithne and were part-funded by the EC Commission for this purpose. Accordingly, both were fitted with specialised equipment for ship borne operations. Since October 1986 the Dauphin helicopters have been conducting operational training missions from the deck of LE Eithne. To date in 1991 a total of 100 deck landing have been made, however training on search and rescue operations was given priority and this militated against the allocation of a helicopter to LE Eithne on a full-time basis.

Will the Minister agree that taking off and landing on the ship is just a way of raising the figures to make them look more impressive but that the Dauphin helicopters have played no role in the operations of LE Eithne? Will he agree that until such time as the Dauphin helicopters take part in the operations of LE Eithne, its effectiveness is reduced by about 60 per cent? Is this not a farcical use of resources? Should there not be greater emphasis on planning and training?

I totally reject the point made by Deputy Allen. Since 1987 the Dauphins have carried out 321 sea and air rescue missions. I know that this matter will be examined by the Committee of Public Accounts of which the Deputy is a member very shortly.

We cannot get the Minister to appear before that Committee.

The Committee have set an agenda but I can only give specific information in response to the question tabled but should the Deputy wish to go into detail on the points raised in the report of the Committee of Public Accounts, obviously the committee is the best place to do that. The Dauphins conducted sea and air rescue missions on 321 occasions. I know that this does not agree with the figure in the report, but it is a matter of opinion and obviously, it will be sorted out by the witnesses before the committee.

As is the Comptroller and Auditor General I too am dismayed at the cost of and under utilisation of the LE Eithne-Dauphin operation. However, I welcome the Minister's announcement that the helicopter will be deployed to Cork early in the new year. Will the Minister give a clear unequivocal assurance that the Dauphin will be fully operational in Cork and will not simply be deployed in training operations because to date it appears that is all it has been engaged in? Could the Minister assure the House that when it goes to Cork early in the new year it will be fully operational in conjunction with the LE Eithne in fishery protection?

As I indicated in my reply, the present position is that steps have been taken to locate a helicopter in Cork to advance the operation. I can only give an assurance that when those steps have been taken and are finalised, no further training will be required except, of course, the usual ongoing training to keep personnel up to date with what may be required in sea and air rescue missions. Training does not stop overnight, it has to be sustained.

Does the Minister not agree that there appears to be a lack of serious commitment from the top to this matter in that his predecessor made a promise that the system would be operational before last summer and then said that it would be operational before the end of the year? While I welcome the Minister's announcement that the system will be operational at the beginning of 1992, I wonder how true that is because the commitment has already been made in the House. Indeed, during the summer season many felt that the fishing stocks were severely exploited because of the lack of a helicopter on the LE Eithne. As it involves only one helicopter and the necessary crew, one wonders why it should be so difficult to combine the LE Eithne and a helicopter. Would the Minister not agree that at this stage there is a need for a definite commitment from the top to make sure that the system becomes operational?

I shall be having talks with the Chief of Staff and the Air Corps about this matter. Until I have had those talks, I do not wish to give any commitment. I shall state only the Government's expectations.

Since the Minister has announced that the helicopter will be located in Cork, the key question is whether it will be in operation full-time. In other words, will the helicopter do night-time flying to and from the LE Eithne at sea?

That is something I shall take up in my talks with the Air Corps. It would be very foolish of me to give commitments——

The Minister should know.

No. It would be very foolish of me to give commitments on such a matter without having all the facts. I should not wish to give an assurance without knowing that such assurance would be fulfilled and carried out.

Minister, it will not.

First, I take this opportunity to wish the Minister well, as I have not previously had the opportunity in the House to do so. Is there available at Baldonnel a permanent helicopter for search and rescue purposes in the Irish Sea? Will that be threatened by arrangements that may be made in order to make helicopters available anywhere else? Does the Minister know that in the past month there were two occasions — one well known incident involving a collision in Dublin Bay and the other incident off Wicklow Head — on which no helicopter from Baldonnel was available for search and rescue missions, search and rescue being the main purpose for helicopters in this country?

The question is now being extended, it was confined to Cork.

It is about search and rescue.

Please, Deputy Kavanagh, the question relates specifically to Cork.

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