Vol. 469 No. 7
9 Mr. M. McDowell asked the Minister for Education the analysis or study of the cost implications for the Exchequer, if any, her Department has carried out on the proposed establishment of regional education boards; if so, whether such an analysis or study has been tendered to the Department of Finance; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [16764/96]
34 Mr. M. McDowell asked the Minister for Education the analysis or study of the cost implications for the Exchequer, if any, her Department has carried out on the proposed establishment of regional education boards; if so, whether such an analysis or study has been tendered to the Department of Finance; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [16765/96]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 9 and 34 together.
As already confirmed by the Minister for Finance in his reply to Deputy O'Donnell on 24 May 1995 and by myself in my reply to Deputy Martin on 28 September 1995, the cost implications of implementing the education reform proposals, including the cost of establishing the education boards, were considered as part of the process of finalising the White Paper on Education. The Minister for Finance and his officials participated in that process.
The White Paper on Education, Charting Our Education Future, makes clear that the establishment of education boards will take place on a phased basis, following the enactment of the necessary legislation. The gradual transfer of functions to the boards will facilitate careful appraisal of the incremental costs in the context of the Education Estimates for the year in question, within the overall context of the budgetary parameters approved by Government.
The establishment of the boards will also bring significant benefits for the administration and effectiveness of education services, through improved regional planning and co-ordination and the provision of support services to primary and secondary schools in the most cost-effective way. The establishment of the education boards will involve changing the administrative framework for education. It will not result in a completely new area of expenditure but rather will involve the reallocation of funding and administrative responsibilities within the education system.
As Deputies are aware, costing exercises can depend on many variable factors. These factors include the startup time of an initiative, the timescale within which a proposal is implemented, the outcome of discussions/negotiations with concerned interests, expert advice on the detailed implementation strategies and the final administrative and operational arrangements.
The operational cost of the education boards, like the costs of many education reform measures, will be determined to a large extent by pay costs. These in turn would reflect the numbers employed by the board and pay rates at any given time. It would not be useful or appropriate for me to comment now on what the various elements of new administrative structures might cost at some time in the future.
I should answer this question since the Minister for Education could not. She said it would not be useful or appropriate to speculate on what this could possibly cost in the future when it might get off the ground. In other words, she has announced a whole policy area and has no idea whatsoever of the cost or when it will start. She cannot answer this question. The answer to this question, if I may be so bold, is that a cost analysis has not been done. The Minister is expecting to embark on a change in policy in relation to education that is far reaching and does not think it would be useful or appropriate to dwell on what it would cost us. Will the Minister devote more time to identifying what needs to be done within the education system to better the education of our children and less time on looking at structures which it appears she will not be able to implement because she will not be here to do it?
I would remind the Deputy of what the education boards are about. We are looking at an education system which since the beginning of the State has been centralised in the Department of Education in Marlborough Street. That involves the day to day running of 3,600 primary schools and three different kinds of second level schools and post-leaving certificate activity. Our education system has been subject to detailed examination not only from within the State but by agencies outside the State. It has been recommended on more than one occasion by various Governments that the education system should be regionalised instead of administered by a central Department in Marlborough Street. We are not setting out to put an alternative structure in place or to create ten Departments of Education. We are responding to informed criticism, debate and advice. It is proposed to establish on a regional basis the services administered by the Department of Education.
As I said in my reply, the main cost in the Department is teachers' pay. The establishment of ten boards will not take teachers off the payroll. Consideration is being given to the role of the education board and the regionalisation of the inspectorate and psychological services so as to meet the needs of the community.
There is no psychological service.
Let us hear the Minister's reply.
In my reply to a later question I will detail what is in the service. It seems from the questions that the Deputies were unaware of the earlier debate and advice about the structure of the Department of Education.
The questions relate to the cost.
The preamble to the White Paper deals with the Education Vote and the increase in the level of investment in education in recent years.
The Minister is talking around the question.
We are looking at the Department's role in the administration of the education system. I have committed myself to the publication of legislation. The education system needs to be established on a regional basis.
The Minister has been asked this question on a number of occasions but has refused to outline the cost implications, if any, of the establishment of regional education boards or to say whether an analysis has been undertaken and submitted to the Department of Finance. The Minister has consistently withheld information on this issue from the House by refusing to outline the details of this scheme.
Accusations.
The Minister should be more transparent on this issue than she has been to date.
What defects in the administration of the education system does the Minister hope to rectify through the establishment of the regional education boards and in what way will these boards be more cost efficient than the current arrangements?
The recommendation was made following consultation with the partners in education over a number of years. The answers to the Deputies' questions can be found in the White Paper to which I refer them.
The answers are not in the White Paper.
That concludes questions for today.
