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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 17 Dec 1996

Vol. 473 No. 1

Adjournment Debate. - Breaking the Cycle Scheme.

The Combat Poverty Agency's criteria for the identification of schools in designated areas of disadvantage was the basis for the selection of schools to participate in the Breaking the Cycle scheme. In the foreward to the report, Educational Disadvantage in Ireland, the Combat Poverty Agency states:

Education has a central role to play in improving the life chances of young people today. This is particularly the case for young people coming from disadvantaged backgrounds. Children who have been born into poor households or live in deprived areas are most subject to educational failure and subsequent labour market exclusion. ...Poor educational achievement can lead to low confidence levels and a poor sense of morale and self-confidence.

The likelihood of obtaining qualifications is associated with social background; those from disadvantaged backgrounds constitute the majority of those with no or low qualifications. Thus, to improve the life chances of children from disadvantaged backgrounds, equal access to education and equal opportunities to participate in and benefit from education are not sufficient. Positive discrimination is required to ensure at least fairness, if not equality, in outcomes. ...Poverty is about exclusion, isolation, and powerlessness, as well as material poverty. Poverty affects both urban and rural communities. Unequal distribution of resources and opportunities is the main reason for the relatively high level of poverty in Ireland.

Under the heading Rural Disadvantage, the report states:

It appears that about 60% of pupils defined as disadvantaged under the criteria adopted in this report live in rural areas. It may be assumed that the vast majority of them are in the 50% of primary schools which do not have the services of a remedial teacher. Further, the Early Start project is confined to urban areas and less than one pupil in twenty living in a rural area is in a school designated under the Scheme of Assistance for primary schools. Thus, the access of the rural disadvantaged to schemes for disadvantaged pupils appears grossly unequal. It may even be that the lack of access to these schemes contributes to the high level of disadvantage in rural areas.

In view of these statements, it is extraordinary that the Breaking the Cycle scheme discriminates against pupils in the disadvantaged rural schools, which have been selected to participate in this pilot scheme, vis-á-vis those in the disadvantaged urban schools which have also been selected for the scheme. The scheme states that the pupil teacher ratio in urban national schools shall not be more than 1:15. In the case of Our Lady Immaculate National School in Darndale, County Dublin — an urban disadvantaged national school — the number of teachers will, I understand, be increased from 17 to 29 to meet the terms of the scheme. However, because the 1:15 ratio does not apply in rural schools, the pupil teacher ratio in Letterfrack national school, County Galway, which is also in the scheme, remains at 1:30. Due to a small decline in numbers recently, the number of teachers has been reduced from four to three. Had the urban disadvantaged national schools criteria been applied equally to rural schools, the number of teachers at Letterfrack national school would have been increased from four to seven.

The Department of Education stated that it based the Breaking the Cycle scheme on the criteria set out in the report of the Education Research Centre, yet that report does not recommend that a pupil teacher ratio differential of this magnitude should apply between urban and rural disadvantaged schools. There is no educational or philosophical reason for this deliberate discrimination against rural disadvantaged schools and one is forced to come to the conclusion that the reason for discrimination must be political. The least that pupils in disadvantaged schools are entitled to is equality of treatment under such a scheme, whether their school is located in an urban or a rural area. However, that is not the case under this scheme. Children in second class in a disadvantaged school in an urban area, for example, will now have the advantage of one teacher per class which will consist of no more than 15 pupils. However, in a rural school 30 children from four different classes, beginning with junior infants, will sit together in the same classroom and be taught by one teacher.

This scheme was designed to deal with disadvantage. However, in the case of rural schools it seems to perpetuate the disadvantage rather than taking a serious step to remove it. Why is there discrimination? Surely it cannot be justified on any grounds? Will the Minister for Education alter the rules now so that urban and rural schools receive equal treatment under this otherwise excellent scheme?

The package of supports being made available to selected rural schools under the Breaking the Cycle initiative represents a distinct response to the assessed needs of the schools in question. This response was developed by the Education Research Centre following a detailed study of educational disadvantage as manifested in urban and rural settings. The study in question was carried out by the Education Research Centre and the Combat Poverty Agency and represents one of the most comprehensive studies of educational disadvantage ever undertaken in the State. I reject the allegation that there was political interference in this scheme.

The study reviewed the procedures in place to identify and address educational disadvantage. It evaluated the effectiveness of current approaches, using a wide range of national and international research data and recommended approaches for the future.

While the report recognised the considerable advances which have been made in alleviating the effects of educational disadvantage, it also made a series of comments and recommendations aimed at improving on former arrangements. Among the key issues raised in the report was a concern that under the current criteria the scheme did not have due regard to rural and dispersed disadvantage. It was recommended that the selection criteria be amended to better reflect educational disadvantage as manifested in rural settings as well as urban settings. It also recommended that a more targeted approach be adopted, with resources being directed towards the most disadvantaged urban and rural areas. The report also considered that disadvantaged area supports should be confined to 16 per cent of the school-going population. In this connection, it was noted that the disadvantaged areas scheme already extends to more than 17 per cent of pupils.

Following the study, the Minister for Education commissioned the Education Research Centre to carry out further work aimed at developing precise criteria to be applied in the selection of schools for special disadvantaged supports and identifying a range of appropriate supports. The outcome of these studies formed the basis for the Breaking the Cycle initiative which was recently launched by the Minister for Education.

Under this initiative, a new targeted programme of supports is being made available to 25 selected schools in large urban areas. The 25 schools in question were selected by the Education Research Centre following examination of data submitted by the schools. A further eight associated schools were also included in the urban element of the scheme because their enrolments involved a high proportion of children from the same families as those attending one of the 25 most disadvantaged schools.

My question related to pupil-teacher ratios, not to any other aspect of the initiative.

We should hear the Minister's reply.

The Minister is making a farce of raising a matter on the Adjournment.

If the Deputy is dissatisfied with the reply, there are other ways for him to follow up the matter.

The Minister has wasted five minutes.

I have no control over that.

The Deputy made an allegation which he could not stand over. If he has the courtesy to listen to me, I will answer his questions.

My matter related to pupil-teacher ratios as between urban and rural schools.

In the case of the rural phase of the initiative, the centre concluded that the initiative should focus on schools with fewer than five teachers and whose proximity to each other was such as to create a cluster which can reasonably be served by one locally based co-ordinator. In the case of both the urban and rural elements of the initiative, a specific package of support measures was devised to address the particular needs as identified in the studies to which I referred. Many of the features of the support package are common to both urban and rural areas. For example, both the urban and rural schools will receive special funding for the purchase of materials and equipment; special funding for local initiatives and special targeted in career development for staff. In addition, the rural schools will receive increased capitation funding at a rate of £75 per pupil.

My question did not relate to any of this.

However, there are also other particular features of the initiative which are unique to one dimension or the other, urban or rural. The 15:1 maximum class size is a feature of the urban dimension of the scheme.

The time is gone now.

However, the 15:1 arrangement is applicable only to the junior classes of the selected schools. It will apply from junior infants to second class. The appointment of a locally based co-ordinator to each individual cluster of rural schools is a feature of the rural dimension which will not be applicable to urban schools.

The Education Research Centre has been contracted by the Department of Education to assess the effect of each component of the two dimensions on pupil attainment. The advice of the centre at the end of the five year period of this initiative will inform future directions and the nature of future supports.

The allegation made of political interference and discrimination against rural schools does not apply.

I wish to register my protest at the Minister of State refusing to address the issue I put to him, which was discrimination against rural schools.

The reply of the Minister of State ends the debate.

It is making an absolute farce out of the Adjournment debate. It is typical of this Government. It is absolutely disgraceful.

The Deputy is making allegations that he cannot stand over.

The Minister of State should be ashamed of himself. The Minister does not even have the courage to come in here. It is political bias against rural Ireland.

We have a procedure for dealing with Adjournment matters. We do so in accordance with the status of the Ministers in this House. However, I have a request that Deputy O'Rourke's matter be taken now as she has an urgent engagement. Without creating a precedent in the matter, I will entertain it if the House so desires. Is that agreed? Agreed.

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