Léim ar aghaidh chuig an bpríomhábhar
Gnáthamharc

Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 21 Jan 2015

Vol. 864 No. 2

Mother and Baby Homes Commission of Investigation: Motion (Resumed)

The following motion was moved by the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Deputy James Reilly, on Wednesday, 21 January 2015:
That Dáil Éireann:
— having regard to the motion passed by Dáil Éireann on 11th June 2014 which recognised the need to establish the facts regarding the deaths of children at the Bon Secours Mother and Baby Home in Tuam, County Galway between 1925 and 1961, including arrangements for the burial of these children, and which further acknowledged the considerable public anxiety as to the conditions generally in mother and baby homes operational in the State in that era;
— noting that it is the opinion of the Government that these matters of significant public concern require, in the public interest, examination by the establishment of a Commission of Investigation;
— noting that the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs has led the Government’s consideration of these sensitive matters;
— noting the factual information compiled and the specific matters identified for further consideration in the Report of the Inter-Departmental Group on Mother and Baby Homes which was laid before Dáil Éireann on 16th July 2014 and which has assisted to inform Government considerations on the scope, format and terms of reference for a Commission of Investigation;
— and further noting that a draft Order proposed to be made by the Government under the Commissions of Investigation Act 2004 (No. 23 of 2004) has been duly laid before Dáil Éireann on 16th January 2015 in respect of the foregoing matters referred to, together with a statement of reasons for establishing a Commission under that Act;
approves the draft Commission of Investigation (Mother and Baby Homes and Certain Related Matters) Order, 2015 and the statement of reasons for establishing a commission of investigation.
Debate resumed on amendment No. 2:
To delete all words after “establishing a Commission under that Act;” and substitute the following:
— calls for Schedule (11) (B) of the draft Commission of Investigation (Mother and Baby Homes and Certain Related Matters) Order, 2015 to be amended by inserting after ‘their children’, ‘with particular regard to the practices employed in obtaining the consent of mothers who had recently given birth to their treatment’;
— calls for Appendix 1(1) of the draft Commission of Investigation (Mother and Baby Homes and Certain Related Matters) Order, 2015 to be amended so as to include the following homes:
Braemar House, Cork.
Ovoca (or Avoca) House, Co. Wicklow.
“Regina Coeli Hostel, Athlone, Co. Westmeath.
Saint Gerard’s, 39 Mountjoy Square, Dublin 1.
Saint Joseph’s Centre (aka Saint Clare's Centre), Stamullen, Co. Meath.
Saint Patrick’s Infant Hospital, Temple Hill, Blackrock, Co. Dublin.
Saint Philomena’s Centre Lakelands, Stillorgan, Co. Dublin.
Saint Rita’s Nursing Home, 68 Sandford Road, Ranelagh, Dublin 4.
The Nurseries, Fermoy, Co. Cork
Westbank Home, Greystones, Co. Wicklow; and
— calls for Appendix 1(2) of the draft Commission of Investigation (Mother and Baby Homes and Certain Related Matters) Order, 2015 to be amended by inserting after ‘these mothers and children.’, ‘Any former resident of any County Home will be entitled to be heard by the Commission of Investigation.
-(Deputy Robert Troy).

The point I was making before the debate was adjourned was that I hoped the commission would not be the same as others and issue reports which would leave issues unaddressed and people dissatisfied and waiting for justice. I hope there will be enough flexibility and leeway for the commission to go where the stories take it. We are all aware of the relationship between the industrial schools, the mother and baby homes and the laundries which were all part of the institutional network. If that is where the story goes, it must be followed there.

There is an outstanding issue in regard to An Grianan at High Park because for various reasons some women did not receive an award from the redress board and were also denied support under the ex gratia scheme because An Grianan had not been included, yet we know that some girls there worked in the laundry. This small group of women hoped their issues would be addressed in the mother and baby homes investigation. I discussed this issue with the Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald, and the women concerned had that expectation. However, they will now have to take the judicial route.

I am aware that one group of people included in the terms of reference for the commission was happy to meet the Minister who gave them time to discuss their issues. It includes mixed race Irish people. Their issue is colour-specific abuse which they suffered while in Irish institutional care. Some 71 people have been identified in this group to date, but they believe the group should number approximately from 100 to 150 born to African fathers and Irish mothers. Some women went to Britain to give birth, but they returned and placed their babies in the care of the State. Some went straight into mother and baby homes, while some were given up for fostering and adoption. Some of the mothers ended up in the laundries, while some raised the children themselves. These children have never received recognition for their cases to date. They were failed by the State and many of them suffered chronic racial abuse in institutions. They suffered appalling treatment and were left helpless and unprotected. Some 51% of the known 71 spent their entire childhoods in the institutions, while only 12% were adopted. These children had to endure the double impact of being illegitimate and of mixed race. I acknowledge the Minister's role in meeting this group and listening to them. They hope their issues will be addressed during the commission's investigation because they have waited so long.

We acknowledge the work of Catherine Corless and also Dr. Devlin who took on the State and the Church. It is important to establish the facts. I acknowledge that is what the Minister is trying to do. However, the commission must go further and complete the narrative. I hope the provision concerning specific matters not included in the scope of the investigation which may warrant further investigation will allow the investigation to continue. I wish the commission well in its investigation.

I welcome the publication on 9 January of the terms of reference for the commission of investigation into the mother and baby homes and certain related matters, which will be constituted under the Commissions of Investigation Act 2004. It is important to note that is a commission of inquiry rather than a tribunal. There are concerns about tribunals costing a great deal of money and going on for years. It would be great if all institutions could be investigated but is this possible in the context of the time required and so on? It is proposed to examine 14 institutions and a representative sample of county homes to be selected by the commission.

The interdepartmental committee report to establish the facts around State involvement in the Magdalen laundries dealt with institutions in County Galway. I recall the poignant State apology in February 2013 to the victims and survivors of the laundries. The Ryan report on child abuse detailed the horrific conditions and abuse endured by boys in Letterfrack Industrial School. Last May, reports emerged about the Bon Secours mother and baby home in Tuam, which attracted international coverage. As a nation, we have been coming to terms with our past over the last decade or more. The investigation into the manner in which single women and their children were treated in mother and baby homes, how they came to be there and the circumstances of their departures is the latest part of the process of coming to terms with the past.

I also acknowledge the fact that the fathers of these babies got away scot free. Today in modern Ireland we all understand that fathers have rights and responsibilities. Regrettably, in old Ireland, when a young girl fell pregnant and had a baby, the view at the time was that it was her fault, her sin and her shame. It was not and it should not have been. Two people were involved - a mother and a father.

I welcome the consultation that has taken place since the Dáil decided last July to initiate this inquiry as well as last week's Cabinet decision. I also welcome the willingness of those who were centrally involved and who have contributed to the process this far. I welcome the appointments of Judge Yvonne Murphy as chairperson and of two experts, Dr. William Duncan and Professor Mary Daly. It is always important that inquiries such as this have appropriate powers and there will always be concern about this. The 2004 Act confers powers to seek and facilitate voluntary co-operation of people whose evidence it requires. The inquiry will have a wide range of coercive powers, if required. The members will be able to give direction to people to attend or to answer questions and they will have powers to disclose and produce documents, powers of entry and inspection, powers to seize documents and equipment and powers to make determinations and give direction where privilege is claimed over documents. If a person fails to comply, the commission can apply to the courts to compel compliance.

The commission will be able to access all records relevant to its work, no matter the status of the person or entity in possession of the records, which is welcome. The evidence will generally be held in private except where a witness requests to give evidence in public. There may be cases where people want to tell their stories and outline what happened to them in public in order that the country can witness their testimony. That would have to be an individual choice. The commission would have to grant the request where the commission feels it desirable in the interests of both the investigation and fair procedures for the evidence to be in public.

A number of groups have commented on the commission. The Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission has welcomed the comprehensive terms of reference and emphasised the importance of independence, impartiality, transparency and expertise. It also stated it is vital that victims are consulted during the investigation and given a voice in the process. The organisation One Family, which was founded in 1972, also welcomed the publication of the terms of reference. Its directors felt that they and other groups were listened to during the consultation. They also feel that it is of great importance that there is an awareness of the social context that contributed to discrimination against non-marital families and mothers. The Adoption Rights Alliance cautiously welcomed elements of the terms of reference. However, it has concerns that the inquiry is limited to investigating institutions and agencies with direct connection to a mother and baby home and excludes women who gave birth in State and private maternity homes and who also may have suffered illegal adoptions.

I welcome the commission and hope it will hear all the evidence in an open fashion and report to the satisfaction of all who suffered.

Táim fíor bhuíoch as ucht an deis labhairt. This is a difficult topic for any of us to make a contribution because it is associated with painful, traumatic and heart-rending stories that we have heard through the modern day media doing their best to give us a feel for what it was like for the people caught up in this but, at the end of day, all most of us can do is try to imagine and understand. A commission that tries to get to the bottom of what went on and tries to make right some of the wrongs that were perpetrated will have an incredibly challenging time. From the bottom of my heart, I wish the commission the best of success and I wish the Minister and the Department in their guidance and stewardship of the commission heartfelt good wishes as well with what will be a difficult and traumatic story to be told by many people.

I have limited knowledge of what happened, although I have had the great good fortune, honour and privilege of working with children in the care of the State. That has given me some understanding of the difficulties faced by children who struggle with their identity and sense of belonging when they become adults and have questions about this. It is a difficult and challenging road for them to navigate. While what happened in the homes is examined, these questions need to be answered more than anything else to assist people to repair relationships and bring them together.

I remain haunted by a story I heard. A friend of my dad's was in our home and he talked about a neighbour of his when he was a young boy who walked around the yard repeatedly. This young woman had a heavy sack of potatoes on her back and she walked around in circles for days on end. The man recounted how as young men they wondered what this was about. It was only in later years that they learned that this poor, unfortunate young woman was pregnant and this was her attempt to rid herself of what she considered to be the cancer in her body. That is how society taught that young woman and her extended family to react to probably one the greatest and most exciting and brilliant times in people's lives when they discover they are pregnant and will create a life. This poor individual did not live in a society that was accepting of a young woman being pregnant outside of wedlock and fear was the dominant emotion that she and her extended family experienced at the time. The reason I recount this is she entered one of the homes subsequently.

With regard to the issue of the mortality rate in the homes, I do not apportion blame but we need to review all the circumstances in the context of the time they occurred. Having tried to inflict maximum physical damage on her body to end the pregnancy, this poor individual entered a home and lost the baby. There were many compounding factors for the loss of the baby. Society should take the largest share of the blame but it is not for me to play judge and jury in hindsight. We need to look at the events of the past but we also need to be careful not to do so through the prism of today's attitudes because we need to be cognisant of the shameful attitudes in times past.

The best gift we could give to the commission is all of us as a society acknowledging our shameful past and contribution to these individuals' lives and ensuring we do our bit today to challenge society on issues of inclusiveness and acceptance while questioning attitudes along the way.

This is something for all of us to take into the future. From my heart, I wish this commission the very best. It is an extraordinary challenge and I know there are many aspects of it that people are not happy with - that it is not covering enough and is not reaching out to enough people. It is, however, a start that is welcome and I hope it will serve to ease the pain carried every day by mothers separated from their children. I hope the results of this commission will go some way towards addressing that.

There is much political play made in this Chamber about the necessity for an apology to the survivors. On behalf of the people of Galway East, I would like to say "Sorry" to those survivors. I hope they hear it loud and clear from this Chamber. I also understand how difficult it is for the Government not to get to its feet today and say sorry. It is the advice it has been given. I hope that whatever little sense survivors can take from that acknowledgement goes some way to address their circumstances.

I broadly welcome the terms of reference for a commission but I share the concerns outlined by my colleagues in the Chamber today. I ask the Minister to consider taking on board the observations made by all Deputies in the Chamber over the course of this debate. The terms of reference demonstrate some flexibility. My concern is that in the past, previous inquiries and tribunals were challenged in the courts in respect of that same type of flexibility. It would be better if the Minister would consider opening up the terms of reference for amendment, as has been proposed by other Deputies in the House today.

If that was the case, we could include three holding centres: Temple Hill, Stamullen and the nurseries in Fermoy; Westbank, Ovoca (or Avoca) House, Braemar House, St. Philomena's and St. Gerard's; and St. Rita's nursing home and the second Regina Coeli hostel, which was the sister of another hostel in Dublin which was included. If we amended the terms of reference, we could expand it make it more inclusive, get more information and seek as much justice as possible for those who have been injured by the past. The method of taking a representative sample of county homes is reasonable enough but survivor groups have requested through their Oireachtas representatives that the sample should include any home where a survivor from such a home presents themselves to the commission. It is unfair to exclude any survivor because we have segregated homes and said that one home will take precedent over another. It is unfair to those people who seek to have questions answered. It is not an unreasonable request and would provide at least a partial measure of justice to survivors whose circumstances are not provided for in the appendices. Given the large body of records and research that has already been gathered on the Magdalen laundries, it is inexplicable as to why we would turn our faces from these people. Even at this late stage, I would ask the Minister to consider including those data.

The treatment of women and children in these institutions and in society at large is a dark chapter in our history. We need to face up to it, be honest and complete this process in the interest of justice for everybody involved. We also need to pay tribute to those people by having an open, transparent and inclusive process. Given the mortality rates, forced adoptions, forced labour and the mechanisms of shame imposed on those people, they require the most inclusive process to ensure that this commission is worthy of the justice that is required. Society's shaming placed women and children into these homes. It ensured that the dark events of our past - the unsayable - were kept unknown. These mother and baby homes must be seen in the broader context of the scale of institutions that existed in this country in the past, be they mother and baby homes, industrial schools, Magdalen laundries and mental health facilities. It has been said in this House that at one point in our history, we had more people locked up as a proportion of our population than the Soviet Union. We know that society, State and the churches combined to shame these women and their children, sought to separate these vulnerable people from the rest of so-called respectable society and punish them for actions that were not a crime under any statute law. Rather, they were being punished for violating a harsh and unforgiving social code.

It is important that we face up to our past and state in unambiguous terms that the survivors of these homes have no cause for shame. I invite the rest of society to open its arms to ensure they can be part of the acknowledgement of the dedication, commitment and action for justice for those survivors. We know that church and State combined together and engaged in forced adoptions, aspects of whom continue to echo in respect of the refusal of certain bodies to permit those affected to have access to their own information. The long history of forced adoption in this country needs to be faced up to and we need to amend the law where necessary.

Worse still, those not adopted were often sent out as virtual slave labour on farms or in businesses owned by the so-called respectable persons in society. I have personally met former residents of the homes and I ask that the Minister include those people and allow them to make their allegations about the practice of child labour and the abuse that took place in rural Ireland in respect of farming out children as slave labour for the well-off. I have also met others who were farmed out to the infamous industrial schools and endured physical, mental and sexual torture.

We also know that vaccines and clinical drug trials were carried out on children in the care of the State in homes subcontracted to and run by the churches. This information is not new and has been known for well over a decade. In respect the extent of the practice and questions around it, we cannot be complacent about securing truth and justice.

This story began in Tuam and the many of the specifics of what happened there seem likely to have been common in other mother and baby homes. In Tuam, we know that almost 800 children died in the mother and child home enduring a mortality rate that was far higher that the prevailing national infant mortality rate at the time. We know that their deaths were recorded but not the circumstances of their burial. We know that some if not all of the bodies were buried in unmarked graves in or near the site of the home. We know that there are some skeletal remains within a tank, most likely a disused septic tank, which lies inside a local authority housing estate on the Dublin Road in Tuam. In its high mortality rates and in its burial practices, Tuam was not unusual in comparison to other such homes. I hope the commission will examine the circumstance of the burial of deceased children. There is a need, unfulfilled since this story broke, for the State to take an active part with regard to managing that grave site. This matter is causing considerable distress to many families in that area who suspect that their relatives are buried there and to those living in the estate.

I have been contacted by some of them who have been distressed by the accumulating speculation and rumour about burial sites in that area.

We need to get into that location to clarify the nature of the burial site and the tank. Even if only one body is discovered, that will still leave us with almost 800 dead children unaccounted for. Even if we find all 796 children buried in neat rows and with obvious care, it will still leave us with a mortality rate far in excess of the national figure. The site in Tuam should be properly secured, as should any records connected to the Tuam home and to all other such homes throughout the country.

The fact of malnourishment being listed as a cause of death is worrying and requires investigation, as does the exact function and management of the dying room. Who was monitoring these homes, from the point of view of the State and the church? This State outsourced and privatised the care of the most vulnerable of people. Who in this House was responsible for ensuring accountability and transparency on behalf of the most vulnerable people in our history?

The announcement two weeks ago of a commission to investigate mother and baby homes is another step we have to take to deal with the failures of the past. These reports help us to heal past wounds while giving us opportunities to learn from our mistakes. I think the Minister has found the right chair in Judge Yvonne Murphy, who has proven in the past that she is capable of handling complex and serious issues with sensitivity. She will need this sensitivity as she deals with people who were hurt, abused and traumatised by their experiences in these homes.

However, we must consider not only individuals' experiences in these homes but also, as the report puts it, the exit pathways that led children out of them. Unfortunately, many exit pathways led to more abuse and neglect, with long lasting effects on those affected. It is important that what happened to the children after their time in the homes are investigated and documented and that people who broke the law are brought to justice. I know from speaking with survivors that they deserve no less than the justice they have been waiting for.

I have been fortunate in the past couple of years to work with a group called Mixed Race Irish. Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan eloquently outlined the experiences of members of this group in her contribution. The group comprises people who were born to mixed race parents in the Ireland of the 1950s, 1960s and 1970s and whose births were handled in the only way that official Ireland knew at the time. The babies were taken from their mothers and fathers and put into mother and baby homes, where they experienced harrowing and painful treatment. Many of those concerned have carried their experiences throughout their adult lives. When representatives of the group appeared before the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality last year, they stated that the State singularly and spectacularly failed mixed race children. I have been working with the founders of the group, Carole and Evon Brennan, Rosemary Adaser and Conrad Bryan, to rectify this failing and to find ways for the State to acknowledge its failure. I am aware that the Minister has met these individuals and that he recognises the truth of their story. The group has grown from strength to strength since 2012 and now has over 70 members, many of whom live in the UK. Very few of them stayed in Ireland after reaching the age of majority because they were told bluntly by the managers of these homes that they had no future in this country. They were told that if they stayed here they would find it difficult to get work or meet a partner in life. Many of them had no choice but to emigrate to other countries. They survived and in many cases are dealing well with their experiences growing up in Ireland. In addition to appearing before the joint committee, the group also met a number of Members of these Houses, including several Ministers, and its representatives have conducted local and national media interviews about their collective histories and to reach out to other members of this community who may not be aware of the group's existence. They have shown incredible bravery, fortitude and resilience. I am extremely proud to have worked so closely with them. Their hard work has started to pay off because race is mentioned specifically in the terms of reference for the commission of investigation. I do not believe this would have happened without the hard work done by the Mixed Race Irish group. The terms of reference ask the commission:

To identify...the extent to which any group of residents may have systematically been treated differently on any grounds [religion, race, traveller identity or disability].

This explicit reference to race is a vindication of the group and a recognition of the experiences of mixed race children. This good work needs to continue. I urge the Minister to ensure the commission also includes a separate section on race in its report. We do not want all the grounds mentioned in the terms of reference to be dealt with in one section. It is important that the specific stories of each of the relevant groups are investigated and recognised by the commission. We cannot allow the commission to undo the good work that has just been started by failing to recognise that issue from the outset. I ask the Minister to ensure that the commission meets with members of the Mixed Race Irish group to speak with them about their experiences and to assure them race will be dealt with separately in the report. Such an assurance would go a long way to vindicating their rights and, in the process, helping them to heal. We have an opportunity not only to deal with the unspoken racism of the past but also to shine a light on the racism of today. We have to learn from the past if we are to combat the scourge of racism. The commission affords us such an opportunity.

I commend the Minister on the work he has done to date to prepare inclusive terms of reference. It is a good start to this process and I wish the commission well in its work.

I welcome the opportunity to speak on this important debate and I acknowledge the men and women in the Public Gallery who have come to the House to follow this debate. In June 2014, Amnesty International's Europe and central Asia director, John Dalhuisen, stated that Ireland's obligation to provide truth, justice and reparations to victims of past human rights abuses must be central to the work of the commission of investigation, and that is essential to confront and deal with this legacy if Ireland is to progress as a society that respects rights.

It was noted that the Government must respond to the commission's findings with a more faithful adherence to its obligations under international human rights law than in the case of the Magdalen laundries. Victims should be able to participate effectively in the commission's investigations and be consulted on key issues where their interests are affected. They should be treated with humanity and respect for their dignity.

The terms of reference for the commission of investigation into mother and baby homes and related matters propose to establish a series of basic truths regarding the circumstances of entry of single women into named institutions between 1922 and 1998. Their living conditions, mortality rates and exit pathways are to be investigated. The commission will seek to do the same for the children of these women and establish how they were cared for within those institutions and what adoptive procedures were in place. The commission will ask whether mothers' consents were given fully, freely and with full information. For survivors of those institutions and their families to have confidence in the findings of the commission, it must identify any violations of the rights of these citizens, identify those responsible and propose effective remedies. Only then will justice be seen to be done.

The establishment of the commission of investigation is to be welcomed. Sinn Féin argues that the commission must be cross-Border in nature and that any international dimensions should be accounted for also. This would require cross-jurisdictional and international co-operation. The time span as outlined is too limited. It covers the period between 1922 and 1998, which presumes that with the closure of mother and baby homes all related concerns disappeared. This could not be farther from the truth. Massive legacy issues remain, including the inaccurate recording of children's and mothers' deaths, causes of deaths and unidentified burial grounds. Another significant and alarming legacy issue is the matter of trial vaccinations on vulnerable children within care. In my constituency of east Cork, I have met with several individuals who were subjected to vaccine trials while in mother and baby homes. The main concern for these individuals is the lack of information around the drugs prescribed. In some cases there have been residual effects. Understandably, this causes huge ongoing distress.

The Minister, Deputy James Reilly, has told us that the commission of investigation into mother and baby homes will have the power to compel the drug companies which conducted vaccine trials on children resident in the homes to come before it. This is to be welcomed. The commission will examine whether regulatory and ethical standards were followed in relation to vaccine trials conducted on children. At least ten mother and baby homes were involved and it is believed the trials took place between 1960 and 1976. Fresh reports suggest that at least 3,000 children in 24 residential institutions and as many as 40,000 children among the general child population were administered experimental vaccines. As an investigation into vaccine trials was previously stopped following a Supreme Court ruling, it is very important that those vulnerable children who were subjected to testing without consent are given justice. Many of these children did not realise that they had even been involved in the trials until 30 years later.

The vaccine trials were conducted by Burroughs Wellcome, which is now GlaxoSmithKline. Children were subjected to trials of the four-in-one vaccine. No detailed records of the trials were recorded, nor was there any detail on whether informed consent was given. We must find out exactly what happened, who sanctioned these decisions and why these children were held in such low regard by those who should have protected them. Redress is warranted. In this context, victims of the mother and baby homes need a positive right to representation before the commission and legal costs should not be a barrier to this. They should also be supported by an independent advocacy service, which we suggest could be managed through the network of free legal advice centres.

The institutional scope as outlined in the Government's order is far too narrow. The terms of reference should encompass all mother and baby homes regardless of denomination, both Catholic and Protestant. Mother and baby homes and related institutions were merely one part of a network of institutions and individuals which illegally abridged Irish mothers' human rights. However, the terms of reference frame the inquiry as an investigation of a too narrow sample of named institutions and not as an investigation of extensive practices spanning the full spectrum of related institutional types. Survivors have expressed the concern that the commission will not be allowed to examine lives blighted outside institutions where unmarried mothers were forced to give up their children. Survivors have also said that while the terms of reference mention exit pathways from mother and baby homes, it is unclear if such pathways led into similarly dysfunctional institutions to which children were sent. Children who arrived in mother and baby homes from other pathways have been excluded from the terms of reference. Children sometimes arrived direct from maternity hospitals. It is also recommended that the commission should have specific regard to the agencies, hospitals and other institutions, and related professionals alleged to have been involved in facilitating illegal or forced adoptions and, or, illegal birth registrations.

The Magdalen laundries constituted a significant exit pathway as part of the containment of supposed problem women and girls. As the McAleese report was limited to the question of State involvement in the Magdalen laundries, the commission should have specific regard to the women who resided in these institutions and extend the scope and intensity of the investigation to include them in its inquiries.

Given the age profile of the survivors, a timely full public State apology is of the utmost importance. This need not wait for the outcome of the commission's final report in three years' time. All survivors deserve public acknowledgement and tribute. There should also be provision for official mourning and commemoration of those who died in these institutions. This should include the right to a name and dignified burial for those who are buried in mass graves. Survivors' families and next of kin should be fully included in the process of planning in this regard. This is stated in the Sinn Féin submission on the proposed commission of investigation. While the inclusion of Bessboro House of Blackrock, Cork, in the list of institutions in the investigations is welcome, I urge strongly the inclusion of Braemar House and the Nursery Rescue Society, Fermoy. We call for all victims from other related institutions also to be included.

Effective remedies and redress must include financial compensation and other social supports. They must also include the right to information and contact, on foot of legislative change if necessary, to facilitate access to personal and family records and adoption information and tracing. The Minister has indicated that this is beyond the scope of the commission but we need - and the survivors deserve - the assurance that it will be properly dealt with in tandem. The State must ensure that the orders and other institutions are held fully accountable and make a full proportionate contribution towards remedy and reparation commensurate with their level of responsibility as found by the commission. That should include contributions to the cost of the investigation. There must be no indemnity deal with the religious orders as happened in previous times.

I welcome the Minister. I welcome the initiative he has introduced and am glad to have the opportunity to speak on the motion on the draft order for the commission of investigation into mother and baby homes. The terms of reference are not perfect by any means. In fact, they make it quite clear that this is not the final word on the issue of the treatment of mothers and babies in this country over very many decades during the 20th century.

It is another important step in Ireland's coming to terms with its tragic past.

The industrial schools and reformatories condemned generations of Ireland's poor and marginalised children to separation from their parents and families and to lives of misery and drudgery in grim, isolated institutions. Although these institutions were condemned in 1970 by Miss Justice Eileen Kennedy, they were only gradually phased out. The apology of the Taoiseach in 1998 and the establishment of the Residential Institutions Redress Board in 2002 under the Residential Institutions Redress Act enabled tens of thousands of the institutionalised youth of Ireland of the 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s and 1970s to receive some acknowledgement of their treatment and the survivors some recompense for their suffering.

The 2009 Ryan report on child abuse produced a devastating examination and analysis of the operation of these institutions and the mistreatment of the children. Subsequently, in 2011, the present Government moved the process further and set up the investigation into the Magdalen homes, where thousands of young Irish women were incarcerated without trial, largely for the crime of becoming pregnant and bearing children out of wedlock. Former Senator Martin McAleese produced his report in 2013, and a scheme of redress was put in place. While none of these initiatives was perfect, they all contributed to addressing, however inadequately, the wrongs that were perpetrated on the children and mothers of Ireland under an uncaring, unchristian society in much of the 20th century.

Today, the latest phase of the Government's attempts to undo the wrongs of previous generations is initiated. It, too, is far from perfect and will not address all the concerns of those survivors who were placed in mother and baby homes. Most serious of all is the fact that so many are no longer with us and have never seen any State acknowledgement of their suffering as young citizens of this country. Given that many of the survivors, some of whom are in the Visitors Gallery today, and whom I welcome, are now in their twilight years, it is important that we get it as right as possible on this occasion.

I congratulate the Coalition of Mother and Baby Home Survivors, both in Ireland and abroad, on the campaigning work they have done to date. I am pleased that Bethany Home, a Protestant mother and baby institution, has at last been included in this inquiry. In 2002, when the Residential Institutions Redress Bill was being debated, I met the courageous and determined Derek Leinster and extracted a commitment from the then Minister for Education, Michael Woods, that Bethany Home would be included in an additional schedule of institutions under the legislation. This was 12 years ago. It never happened, and successive Ministers all refused, despite the protestations of Mr. Leinster and his colleagues. Now, at last, after 12 years of constant campaigning, they have got a commission of inquiry. They should be facilitated in telling their stories, both as a testament to their experience and as a record of that unsavoury past, lest we ever forget. There is ample provision within the terms of reference to facilitate full personal testimony.

The second mother and baby case with which I have been engaged over many years is the case of baby Marion Howe, who died in 1955 in controversial circumstances, having been transferred from Goldenbridge orphanage in Inchicore, which was run by the Sisters of Mercy. Marion was aged 11 months when she was admitted into Goldenbridge. Marion's mother was ill at the time and her father was working in England. She was to be in Goldenbridge for only two weeks while her mother recovered. On 21 May 1955, just four days after her admittance, Marion died. Although the Sisters of Mercy sent a telegram to her father telling him not to come home, and he had little money as he was working as a labourer in England, he decided to come home. When he went to see Marion at the mortuary in St. Ultan's Hospital, he saw that her head and two legs were bandaged. When unwrapping the bandages, he saw two identical holes on the insides of her knees. However, the cause of death on the death certificate was given as acute dysentery infection. Marion's parents went to the Garda at the time, but were told to let it go. The family went to the Garda again 40 years later, in 1996, when such matters came into the public domain. At first, the Sisters of Mercy denied that Marion had ever been in Goldenbridge. However, gardaí eventually uncovered a sick book that named Marion and which read, "one leg burned and a history of vomiting". That is where the case rests.

The accusations in the 1996 RTE documentaries "Dear Daughter" and "States of Fear", which focused on mismanagement and mistreatment in Goldenbridge have never been followed up or fully explained. The findings of the Ryan Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse in 2009 were scathing of Goldenbridge as a place where children were humiliated, assaulted and neglected. Goldenbridge should be included in the schedule of mother and baby homes, and the remains of Marion Howe should be exhumed as part of that investigation. This will be the last opportunity for some considerable time to address the issues involved and this commission is the ideal forum for doing so.

I thank the Minister for setting up this inquiry within a relatively short six months of coming to office. I also thank the Minister for Justice and Equality for recently agreeing to ask the Dublin City Coroner to review the case for exhumation of the remains of baby Marion. It is the dearest wish of the family members, some of whom are here today, that the exhumation should take place so that, at last, the cause of death can be determined after 60 years without answers. Their mother and father, who fought for many years so that the circumstances of baby Marion's death would be examined, are sadly deceased.

I welcome the provisions in the terms of reference that provide flexibility for the commission to decide how it proceeds with its investigation. I further welcome the Minister's invitation to the family in a reply to a parliamentary question on 14 January 2015, in which he stated that "the family may wish to consider providing the commission with any information in their possession which they consider may be relevant to its terms of reference". The terms of reference state: "the commission may include in its reports any recommendation that it considers appropriate, including recommendations in relation to relevant matters identified in the course of its investigation which it considers may warrant further investigation in the public interest". This case falls within the commission's remit and Goldenbridge should be included in the schedule of homes to be inquired into.

There are other similar cases throughout the country of families being bereft of their children. Many stories have been only partially told and people have lived for up to 60 years with a legacy of what they believe to have been mistreatment, humiliation and serious neglect of members of their families. They want an end to it. They want to be able to put these matters to bed. As I said, we have taken it step by step. Ireland has been very slow to address the grievances that have been in the public domain and to recognise the flawed society we have had for so many decades. I ask that we re-examine some of the institutions that have and have not been included in the schedule. As we discuss the draft terms of reference of the commission we must ensure it is as comprehensive as possible so that we do not have another generation coming back to this and asking why we did not finish the business while there were still some survivors left.

Let us ensure this is our legacy.

I welcome to the Gallery any of the families or relatives of survivors of any of these homes. I must start on a negative note. It is a bad sign that the Government saw fit to cut the debate today by an hour and a half. It is not showing sufficient seriousness and I must state the Government benches are not showing sufficient seriousness regarding this matter either. This is part of a legacy of abuse and oppression of women and children in this State. It runs through the Magdalen laundries, the mother and baby homes and other institutions mentioned previously such as Goldenbridge. It runs through the practice, for example, of symphysiotomy when women were butchered while giving birth and the recent practice - not in the dim and distant past - of this State going to court against women who have been abused either at school or in some institution and challenging their cases. This has been evident right up to the present. Moreover, to this one must also add laws, such as the eighth amendment, which equate women with a foetus and do not give women control over their own lives. The common denominator of all these practices is that the State and the church saw fit to take control of the lives and bodies of women and girls. Members must recognise this pattern, which has continued right up to the present and which has not gone away, of a church-ridden and weak capitalist State that allowed the church such absolutely massive power.

As both I and interested groups perceive it, there are major shortcomings in the scheme, which only includes mother and baby homes strictly. The Adoption Rights Alliance, for example, has called on the Government to amend the first clause of the terms of reference to include all institutions where women had babies and where women out of wedlock went to do that. I believe this constitutes piece-by-piece resistance to tackling this real issue. While it has been hinted at previously, the failure to include archaeological investigation of all the sites is of real importance. This has been brought to light already in the past year by Catherine Corless, who rightly has been commended. In many cases, it is known that these institutions were the scenes of crimes. If it is known that crimes were carried out - premature deaths of babies took place at a much higher rate than the national average - consequently these people deserve investigation as to what happened to those babies. Furthermore, one cannot rely on records in the institutions to tell the story of what happened to the babies because that would be taking the word of the religious orders as being absolutely valid and trustworthy. However, Members are aware this is not the case. Many records have been destroyed and what is needed is a forensic medical examination of what in many cases are mass graves. This was evident in Tuam but there are other institutions as well. I suspect the main reason such investigations are not included is because of the cost. It would cost the State a huge amount of money to do that but this is an absolutely cancerous episode in our history, albeit one of many, and it must be investigated.

Irish First Mothers, which is a group of women who were victims of the mother and baby homes, also has pointed out that justice and redress are not mentioned directly in the terms of reference. Will any perpetrator be prosecuted after this commission investigates? Will any of the religious orders with connections to these homes be brought to answer in any way? Will there be proper medical and financial compensation for the victims of these homes? It is hard to escape the conclusion arrived at by this group, which is that what is envisaged is minimalist redress, symphysiotomy style, that will be on an ex gratia basis. Women will be obliged to agree if they want any kind of compensation for the misery caused to them on behalf of these institutions and the State, which in many cases paid for or knew of their care. How hopeful can Members be when the Magdalen survivors have not been dealt with properly, as one has read in the newspapers only within the past two days? One Magdalen survivor, who I have met at a number of meetings, is dying of lung cancer. Survivors have asked that the coalition would deliver on the high profile promises that were made. The Taoiseach, Deputy Enda Kenny, got very emotional in the Dáil Chamber but it has come to light lately that they still have not got what they need. How seriously are Members to take the Government's efforts to deal with the mother and baby homes? For example, the National Women's Council of Ireland has pointed out that the current Bill relating to the Magdalen women is a "denial of the rights of women survivors of the...laundries". It undermines the scheme as proposed by Mr. Justice Quirke and provides only minimal recognition for the abuse that woman suffered. If this is the pattern for the Magdalen women, can the women of the mother and baby homes and their surviving descendants expect any better from the Government? I conclude by reiterating that I view this as part of a pattern in which the State and the church colluded in the oppression of women and children and girls in particular, denying them control of their own sexuality and future. The State needs to listen to these groups and to respond accordingly.

First, the State has many questions to answer in this regard. What has gone on down through the years is horrendous and I welcome the survivors who are present in the Gallery today. In the Magdalen laundries and the mother and baby homes, people suffered. This was in an Ireland where one could nearly say a blanket was put over matters, there was quietness and nobody talked about the wrongs that were done down through the years. One must also remember the question of where these children were buried. The Tuam Children's Home Graveyard Committee has brought to my attention one such case. There is a graveyard there in which approximately 800 babies have been buried. People in the Tuam area, not now or ten, 20 or 30 years ago but 40 to 50 years ago, voluntarily kept the grounds there. Year by year, they looked after the site and put up gates and statues. They did so in a voluntary way when the State had walked away from it. Through their anger and throughout all this, they kept their silence and before the terms of reference were approved, they kept quiet. Sadly, they have not been included in this scheme. While a local stonemason, Liam Kelly, donated a plaque to those children, one thing they found in that area was that even after the searching, some inaccuracies remained. They want the State to ensure that all those children are cross-referenced to ensure the information is factual, proper and right because the information regarding one baby that was named was wrong. The committee in Tuam also has made a request of the Minister through me. Its members have stated they consider themselves to have been left out of this process. They wish to meet the Minister personally to talk to him, to feel included in this regard and to express all the issues and problems involved in the Tuam case. At present, they feel left out and believe the Minister should look again at this and should make sure they are included. I hope the Minister will listen to all these people throughout Ireland in respect of what has gone on. Let us right what has gone wrong. I refer to redress.

Whatever is needed, let us as a nation recognise our failures, learn from what we have done wrong and show remorse for the scandalous things that happened years ago. I will be writing to the Minister in the coming days asking that he take the time to meet with the committee from Tuam and allow their voices to be heard.

Can the Minister advise the House when the debate on this matter is scheduled to resume?

It is a matter for the Whip, but my understanding is it will resume next week.

The Minister's response is very vague. It is important that not only Members of the House but survivors know when it will resume so they can plan for it.

I appreciate that. I understand the debate is scheduled to resume tomorrow week. There is no attempt to shorten this debate. There are still many Members who wish to contribute to it.

Debate adjourned.
Barr
Roinn