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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 27 Jan 2015

Vol. 865 No. 1

Priority Questions

School Staff

Charlie McConalogue

Ceist:

114. Deputy Charlie McConalogue asked the Minister for Education and Skills her plans to provide schools with ring-fenced resource hours for the employment of those holding a recognised qualification in guidance counselling to enable all schools to provide every student with appropriate guidance as per section 9C of the Education Act 1998; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [3643/15]

This question is to ask the Minister whether she has plans to provide schools with ring-fenced resource hours for the employment of those holding a recognised qualification in guidance counselling, in order to enable all schools to provide every student with appropriate guidance, as is their obligation under section 9C of the Education Act 1998.

In the budget two years ago, this allocation for guidance hours was entirely removed, although the obligation for schools to continue to provide the service remains. It is high time that this decision was reversed and I ask the Minister to detail her plans, if any, in this regard.

I have no plans at the moment to re-introduce a separate allocation of resources hours to schools for guidance counselling.

If economic recovery continues, I hope the Government will be in a position to improve the standard staffing allocation to schools. However, I believe that it is desirable to give schools some discretion on how to use these increased resources.

Guidance and counselling is a whole-school responsibility, with guidance counsellors playing their part within an overall team approach. Guidance counsellors have two distinct functions. The first is general career guidance and guidance on the educational opportunities a child or young person might pursue, while the second involves support for the well-being of students. The principal and leadership of a school have the best knowledge and experience to determine how exactly guidance resources and teaching resources should be allocated.

The very point is that by removing the resources, the Minister has removed the discretion of schools to ensure that guidance hours are provided. She has removed the resources and particular funding which had been provided in the past to do so. The Minister has left the responsibility with the schools which means that in order to provide the service, they must cut back other teaching services and also subject provision in many cases. However, schools have been unable to maintain the level of services. A survey by the Institute of Guidance Counsellors found an up to 70% reduction in one-to-one time between a guidance counsellor and students which had been provided previously. This is the impact on schools and the Minister should not push the responsibility onto already overstretched school management. The Minister needs to recognise the fact that the removal of resources for funding those posts means a reduction in the service being provided.

It is impossible to provide the service in the absence of these resources. Schools need a commitment from the Minister to allocate funds to reinstate the service, because it is high time there was a recognition that the cut was not one which can be stood over and it needs to be addressed and reversed.

The decisions made in recent years were not easy. Sometimes it was a case of deciding whether to reduce the overall allocation to schools or take specific measures. Schools are required under the Education Act to use available resources to ensure students have access to appropriate guidance to assist them in their educational and career choices. We have not removed the obligation on schools to provide guidance in this way. This obligation exists. As the economy improves - and it is improving - I will examine a range of areas where I believe we can begin to approve resources for schools. The most recent budget included the first increase in funding for education for many years and we will be working to ensure this continues. Resourcing schools is of particular importance, and I am conscious schools are having difficulty with the general resources they have at their disposal. It is something I want to address when we have more money in the economy.

Has the Department carried out an assessment on the impact this is having in schools? The Department has an obligation to ensure schools are equipped to provide a counselling service to students. Earlier, I referred to the survey by the Institute of Guidance Counsellors, which outlined the cut to one to one hours in particular. Have the Department and the Minister engaged with schools to find out what is the reality? This cannot be stood over as there is more pressure than ever on students and they require a service to be provided by professional guidance counsellors. This is very important but it has been drastically reduced. I urge the Minister to prioritise reinstating resources to allow schools provide this service. What actions has the Minister taken to assess the damage this cut has done? Without admitting and assessing the damage, faith in the Minister's intention to restore the service will be diminished.

We constantly engage with schools on their obligations and the support and services they provide for students, and this will be ongoing. A range of supports exist through the National Educational Psychological Service, NEPS, and other areas. We engage on a regular basis with representatives of management bodies on these issues. It is under ongoing monitoring. I certainly agree it is my obligation as Minister to ensure we have the necessary support for students in schools and for the schools themselves. The entire school has an obligation with regard to guidance and it is not only specific teachers. This is part of the Department's approach in terms of monitoring the situation. We hope we will be in a position to improve resourcing schools.

Schools Building Projects Expenditure

Michael Fitzmaurice

Ceist:

115. Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice asked the Minister for Education and Skills if she has negotiated a summer works grant scheme for which schools may apply; the size of the budget available for the scheme; when applications will be accepted; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [3486/15]

Has the Minister negotiated a summer works grant scheme for which schools may apply? What is the size of the budget available? When will applications be accepted?

The Deputy will be aware that spending of more than €70 million was approved for the 2014 summer works scheme to allow over 770 schools to undertake improvement works. This allowed for the funding of applications received under categories 1 to 6, which cover gas works, electrical works, mechanical works, toilet facilities and roof works. Schools which had applied under categories 7 to 10 were advised that their applications would be retained for prioritisation if funding for further summer works projects could be secured for 2015. I also wish to advise the Deputy that provision has been made in the 2015 allocation for the carryover costs of improvement works already approved in 2014.

The feasibility of making further funding available to facilitate consideration of those applications which were received under categories 7 to 10 under the 2014 summer works scheme is currently being considered. In view of the need to prioritise available funding for the provision of essential school accommodation, it is not possible for me to advance a new summer works programme in 2015, but the files on the applications under categories 7 to 10 were kept open and they are currently being reviewed. I hope that information is helpful to the Deputy.

This is unacceptable. Thankfully, we are supposed to have turned the corner. The most important issue for any country is to start with the basics, namely, with education. We are all aware of the cuts that affected all schools throughout the country during the recession. We must get our priorities right and decide where are we going. Schools, especially the smaller ones, throughout the country are on their knees. They need the leg up that would be afforded by this scheme. A few months ago there was the question of whether funding would be provided for the minor works grant. This drip-feeding of information leaves schools in a very precarious position. The Department of Finance should be contacted and more money should be made available. This is win-win situation in some cases. Schools could be made more efficient and could be run on smaller budgets if matters were done right.

I agree with the Deputy. We on this side of the House would like to spend much more money on schools, and we tried as best we could during the tough years to ensure that funding for education was protected and prioritised over that for other Departments. An additional €60 million has been allocated in the budget for education this year, because we recognise that, but it will only keep pace with demographics. We agree that we would like to have more money for the summer works scheme projects, but we do not have it at present. We have made and will continue to make a case for it. We are always chasing up extra money for resources. We recognise that it would be well spent, that it would be spent locally and that it would also provide jobs; there is no doubt about that. I agree with the Deputy that the arguments for it are very clear. The key point is that, unlike in other years, the applications are being kept open and, where funding for applications under categories 7 to 10 was not available, those applications are being kept on file and will be prioritised as money becomes available. That is a fair commitment. We would like and hope to get more money at some stage, but it would be wrong to say that we can open up the next round of the summer works scheme when there are still applications on file under categories 7 to 10.

There is no doubt that education is very important, but the number of young people coming through education is growing every year. It was good this year, in terms of funding, to have been able to keep up with demographic change, but it is about providing additional accommodation first. That must be the priority and summer works, essential repair works and minor repair works, in respect of which there have been some announcements, will be kept up as well. The priority has always been to make sure that places are available for new people coming into the system, of whom there have been quite a number in recent years. That has been a fair challenge for the Department of Education and Skills. We recognise that education is one of the most important areas and that the Department must be funded.

I understand that more children are starting in school and that there is more pressure on schools. We welcome the announcements regarding schools that are being built. That is not a problem. I have looked around the country, and there is a certain degree of waste here and there in all Departments. We put prefabs in place when we should have looked at the bigger picture. I urge the Minister of State to hit the Department for Finance for funding to ensure that some is made available, because otherwise it is a matter of being penny wise and pound foolish. The carrying out of some of these works will pay in the long term. I ask the Minister of State to try to secure additional funding to provide for this.

Yes. We certainly will and we will keep making the case for it. The Deputy was not a Member at the time, but thankfully this Government adopted a commonsense approach, along the lines of the Deputy's comments, whereby prefabs were replaced with classrooms where possible.

I do not have the figures in front of me, but every year for the past three years there have been major developments in removing prefabs and replacing them with permanent, stand-alone classrooms, something which should have been done years ago. Many of us in the House have mentioned this issue, but it took a new Government to start the process. The former Minister, Deputy Quinn, changed the model in his first year in office. There has been a serious spend on new classrooms to remove prefabs which were rented and were, as the Deputy said, a waste of money. Things have moved on.

We are trying to get money from wherever we can to fund new projects. The summer works scheme and other such schemes help to protect the existing infrastructure and provide a better place to educate our young people. I stress that the applications which were met involved gas works, electrical works, mechanical works, toilet facilities and roof works, and were major priorities. The other areas of priority include window projects, curriculum requirement projects and other structural improvements which are needed. Money was spent on essential areas. The Deputy is correct and we will try to find more money where we can.

The applications made under last year's summer works scheme are still held in categories 7 to 10, which did not always happen. If money becomes available, it can be, it is to be hoped, dished out to the outstanding applications. In case there is any confusion, I wish to clarify that category 4 applicants for the previous summer works schemes relate to projects to facilitate access to schools for pupils with special needs. These applications are now considered under the Department's emergency works scheme, which is right. They get higher priority, something with which I think the Deputy would agree.

Special Educational Needs Service Provision

Charlie McConalogue

Ceist:

116. Deputy Charlie McConalogue asked the Minister for Education and Skills the way she proposes to address concerns that have been expressed regarding the school profiling element of the proposed new special needs model; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [3644/15]

How does the Minister propose to address the concerns that have been expressed about the school profiling element of the proposed new special needs model?

The National Council for Special Education, NCSE, working group recommended the development of a new model for delivering teaching resources to schools to support students with special needs. It recommended that a school's special needs teaching allocation should be determined by a baseline component according to pupil numbers and a school's educational profile. This profile is to take account of the number of pupils with complex needs, the percentage of pupils performing below average in standardised tests and the social context and gender breakdown of the school. Following consultations with education partners last summer, my Department has developed a new model which could be used to allocate special needs teachers to schools. The Department last week engaged in a further round of consultations with stakeholders on the new model.

I am sure the Minister is aware, as she is consulting education partners and is talking to teachers and principals, as I am, that there is very genuine concern among teaching staff and school management about how this will work. In regard to the school profiling principals have been asked to undertake over the past couple of months, they have been asked to provide information which many find sensitive, such as whether families and students have medical cards and financial details and backgrounds on families. Many principals have found they are not in a position to ask for that type of personal information and have been informed that if they are not able to get it directly, they should make a guess as to the situation in their schools. As a result, there is genuine concern about how the information will be used. Many principals have told me they have given very honest answers to the best of their ability on the profiles of their schools, but they have concerns about whether other schools will do the same or be as accurate in their responses. They are also concerned about how the information will be used in the future.

There are serious deficiencies and a real difficulty in ensuring that teaching hours, in particular special needs teaching hours, are allocated to students promptly. It is important that any model which is proposed to replace that is one which is fair and in which schools, teachers and parents can have confidence. What assurances can the Minister give on school profiling and the surveys teachers have returned to her in regard to how that will be used and that it will be fair system?

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue because it is of great interest to parents, in particular, of children with special needs, as well as schools in general. As is the case with anything of this nature, we have to be very careful with the introduction of a new model. At the same time, it has been clearly identified by the National Council for Special Education that the current system, which in many cases requires a medical diagnosis to put facilities in place for children in schools, discriminates against parents who cannot afford a diagnosis.

It also causes the problem mentioned by the Deputy whereby we want to have the resources in the school when the child goes there. We all agree that looking to change the model is good.

I acknowledge that there are concerns. We must find a way to figure out which schools will have the requirement for extra resource teachers. We want to give every school an element of resource hours for the children. We must try to find a way to provide those resources for the schools with particular requirements for complex needs, etc. The consultation is ongoing and we have not made a decision as to exactly how it will apply in schools. I am very keen to get the views of people particularly affected by this, as well as Deputies. If we are going to replace this model, we must ensure we can replace it with something better than what is currently in place and which is fair to all children.

The Minister has not dealt in any detail with what I asked her to do, which was to give reassurance to schools, teachers and families as to how the school profiling will be used. The process has started and the documentation has been returned to the Department. As I indicated, there are very real concerns about the validity and consistency of the process across the board and the purpose for which it will be used. In her final response, will the Minister give an assurance that the process will be fair to those who have that concern? Although a final decision on the implementation has not been made, the Minister has certainly decided to progress with it and to undertake school profiling.

The Minister mentioned difficulties with parents not being able to afford tests and diagnoses for children to ensure they can access resource hours. Unfortunately, that arises because the State is not providing enough resources to allow such testing. Often, it is only families which can afford to have a test carried out that can access those resource hours. There is an implementation timeline for the proposed new model. What are the current plans for introducing it?

The Government has not yet taken a decision on whether it can be implemented for next September. I want to ensure we get it right so I have not yet made a decision on the timing. With regard to profiling, there is a certain amount of factual information relating to numbers of pupils with complex needs and the percentage of pupils performing below average in standardised tests. The area where concern is being expressed is a social context. We have asked schools to do their best in giving us information in that regard. The gender breakdown is there because evidence suggests there tends to be a higher percentage of boys than girls who need this kind of support.

The National Council for Special Education recommended that these criteria should be used to get a fix on a genuine way of assessing the needs of a particular school and to be fair to all children. We have asked that this be done in good faith to ensure we have accurate information before implementing any new model.

Pupil-Teacher Ratio

Michael Fitzmaurice

Ceist:

117. Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice asked the Minister for Education and Skills if the pupil teacher ratio in two, three and four-teacher schools will be reduced prior to the commencement of the new school year in September; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [3487/15]

I ask the Minister for Education and Skills about the pupil-teacher ratio, especially in schools with two, three and four teachers. The numbers in three-teacher schools has increased over recent years from 48 to 56. Is there a plan in the next school year to change it?

My focus in budget 2015 was on obtaining the additional funding that was necessary to provide for demographic growth, as the Minister of State, Deputy English, said earlier. The last budget included an increase in spending on education for the first time in recent years, amounting to additional funding of €60 million during 2015.

This funding will be used to provide 1,700 additional teachers and SNAs for our schools as well as to fund prioritised reforms, such as implementation of the literacy and numeracy strategy, reform of junior cycle and the introduction of education focused preschool inspections. It was not possible to secure also the funding which would have been required to change the staffing schedule for primary schools, including small schools.

Since becoming Minister all of the education partners I have met have indicated their own set of priorities. In the school sector, these priorities include school leadership, pay restoration, reductions in pupil-teacher ratios, increases to capitation and the restoration of ex quota guidance counsellors in schools, which we dealt with earlier.

Outside of the schools sector, the list of demands includes funding of third level, investment in early years and investment in technology. It is not, and never will be, possible to satisfy all the demands of the education system at one time. However, I am determined that education should be prioritised for investment as our economy recovers. In my discussions with the various stakeholders in education, I will seek to agree a set of priorities for such increased investment into the future.

My first day in the House was budget day and I saw a beautiful document about the extra teachers to be employed around the country. The previous Minister increased the pupil-teacher ratio and some schools have lost teachers. To clarify the situation, is the Minister saying the teachers who were lost as a result of the increase in the pupil-teacher ratio will not be replaced? Are these 1,700 teachers to cater for the increase in the number of children going to school and for retirements and not specifically intended to reduce the pupil-teacher ratio?

They are for the purposes the Deputy outlined. We have not made any change for the current year in terms of what was done in previous years. That has been factored into the allocation of teachers. However, I am looking to the future in terms of what we might be able to do, including in regard to small schools and the pupil-teacher ratio. In the context of what was decided in the last budget, there was not a specific proposal in regard to the numbers of teachers allocated generally in terms of the pupil-teacher ratio but specifically for the schools about which the Deputy spoke.

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