Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 17 May 2017

Vol. 951 No. 1

Insurance Costs: Motion [Private Members]

Deputy Michael McGrath

I move:

That Dáil Éireann:

notes that:

— spiralling business and motor insurance costs are undermining the competitiveness of the State and pressuring businesses and households;

— the National Competitiveness Council has cited the cost of doing business, of which insurance is a major contributor, as a major concern to businesses across the country;

— as of 2014, small and medium sized enterprises (SMEs) employed over 900,000 people in Ireland;

— business insurance, specifically public liability and employer liability insurance, is a major and growing cost of doing business in Ireland and is particularly a major issue for SMEs;

— many SMEs have experienced business insurance cost increases of between 6 per cent and 15 per cent according to research from the Irish Small and Medium Enterprises Association;

— increased insurance excess and insurance exclusions are becoming an ever increasing issue for all businesses;

— the practice of insurance companies using non-disclosure at the point of a claim for the sole purpose of avoiding payment, when such discoveries and enquiries should have been made at the proposal stage, is unacceptable;

— motor insurance has increased by 11.6 per cent in 2014, 30.8 per cent in 2015 and 8.9 per cent in 2016; and

— while monthly motor insurance inflation in 2017 has remained level, individuals, families and businesses are facing unsustainably high insurance premiums;

further notes that:

— a motion was passed by it on 9th June, 2016, urging the Government to act on this issue;

— the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach published the Report on the Rising Costs of Motor Insurance setting out a series of recommendations;

— the Government only published its Report on the Cost of Motor Insurance as late as January 2017;

— only ten action points were scheduled for completion by the end of the first quarter of 2017, more than three years after the explosion in motor insurance premiums began;

— three of these action points have yet to be completed; and

—there has been complete inaction on tackling business insurance costs; and

calls on the Government to:

— urgently complete the remaining action points set out in the Report on the Cost of Motor Insurance, which were set to be completed by the end of March 2017;

— amend legislation and require insurers to provide a breakdown of the premium cost to the customer and to have this completed before the current deadline of the end of June 2018;

— develop a general protocol that requires insurance companies to notify policyholders of claims made against them before settlement and to have this done before the current deadline of the end of December 2017;

— establish a national claims information database before the current deadline of the end of June 2018;

— have the Personal Injuries Commission report before its current deadlines of the end of December 2017, and the end of March 2018;

— establish a fully functioning database to identify uninsured drivers compelling insurance companies to provide the driver license number before the current deadline of the end of December 2018;

— establish a clear timeline for the Cost of Insurance Working Group to complete its report on employer liability and public liability;

— extend this assessment to other relevant areas of business insurance, including an assessment of the extent to which insurance excess and insurance exclusions are being used at the expense of customers;

— undertake a comprehensive study on the cost of obtaining all insurance to businesses with the aim of providing transparency to the sector and in order to track developments in the market;

— bring forward legislation to enhance transparency in the sector by requiring insurance companies to provide a detailed breakdown of premiums for business customers;

— require insurance companies to inform business customers of the fact that a claim has been made and/or settled against them and the details of that claim;

— extend the Personal Injuries Commission to employer liability insurance and public liability insurance; and

— address the issue of insurance companies using non-disclosure at the point of a claim to avoid payment when such discoveries and enquiries should have been made at the proposal stage.

We are again raising the issue of insurance, this time not just motor but also business insurance. As the Minister of State knows, in June 2016 we used our Private Members' slot to put the focus on motor insurance and proposed changes which we felt would make a real difference to the spiralling premiums people have had to endure.

The Government responded and the following month set up the working group which reported in January 2017, around the same time as the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach reported, with 33 recommendations from the Government's working group and over 70 action points. I welcome the work that is being done, but more can and needs to be done.

There needs to be greater ambition in the Government's approach and there has to be swifter implementation of the key recommendations, in particular those around the establishment of a national claims database, which is not due for another year or so. The work of the personal injuries commission needs to be accelerated, and the central issue there is benchmarking the level of awards in Ireland vis-à-vis awards in other jurisdictions.

We need legislation on the motor insurance compensation framework so that if another Setanta Insurance collapse occurs there is clarity on who foots the bill in such a scenario. That is a priority. We need to have the report on the role of legal fees in the resolution of insurance claims brought forward earlier than the anticipated date of the second quarter of 2018.

The issue of uninsured drivers is, unfortunately, playing an increasing role in society and is, of course, a menace which has to be condemned in all respects. The database of uninsured drivers which is technically possible, in terms of the different datasets that are available through the national fleet database, the databases of different insurance companies and so on is not due until the end of 2018.

I welcome the CSO data that shows some stability in the market. It does not match the reports I have received from constituents who are still receiving renewal notices in the post advising of increases of 20%, 30%, 40% and, in some cases, even more. There is discrimination against certain categories of drivers. Drivers with older vehicles which have up-to-date and valid NCT certificates are being asked to pay exorbitant renewal premiums. God help older or younger drivers, emigrants returning to Ireland or anyone with an open claim, in terms of what quote they will be given. Taxi drivers are being driven out of business by virtue of the quotes they are getting, if they are lucky enough to get one at all.

We know from the declined cases agreement with Insurance Ireland that the number of people who simply cannot get a quote has multiplied elevenfold in the past four years. Almost 2,000 cases have been brought before it.

A central issue is the need for greater certainty around the level of awards. Insurance companies are settling out of court and outside of the Injuries Board process out of fear of what an award will be if they go through the court process. That fear is driven by experience. There is a need for greater certainty and consistency in regard to the level of awards. Companies are simply not taking the risk. Many dubious claims are being settled and people are being paid "go away" money, to put it mildly. That is the reality of what is happening and it is because we have a dysfunctional market which is simply not meeting the needs of consumers.

On the question of business insurance, the CSO is not capturing that data so we have no firm evidence of the level of premium renewals that are being issued to businesses. The key issue is employer liability and public liability. Any business that has a significant level of public footfall, businesses in the service industry, pubs, hotels and restaurants are being hammered with significant insurance increases.

The Minister of State and I were interviewed earlier today, and I quoted figures I received from the Restaurants Association of Ireland. Many restaurants which have had no claims in recent years are facing a doubling of their insurance policies. It is not good enough and it cannot go on.

Many people in business are now making the decision not to renew their insurance at all and are taking the crazy risk of having no insurance cover in place in respect of public liability or employer liability for their businesses. Many of these people are not in limited liability companies, therefore they will be on the hook in the event of a claim which could potentially go all the way.

There is a significant degree of commonality between the issues on the motor insurance and employer and public liability sides which affect businesses. Insurance companies on the business side are becoming increasingly selective. The terms of policies are being changed. The levels of excess in policies are increasing significantly. The levels of exclusions now being specified within policies is also being expanded. They are vital issues.

The cost of insurance working group, phase two, is now dealing with business insurance. We are calling for an acceleration of the implementation of the recommendations on the motor insurance side. They are generally good. On the business side, we need the report to be published and the CSO to capture the data so that we know where we stand. We need to start tackling the underlying causes of these increases. The issue of insurance has now become a major economic issue in our country, as well as being a devastating issue for many families who will end up off the road.

Deputy John Lahart

It has been a year since my colleague, Deputy Michael McGrath, introduced the first Private Members' motion to the new Dáil. A year on, people are still facing, as he outlined, exactly the same challenges in respect of paying motor insurance.

Fianna Fáil produced a 12-point plan at the time in response to the 60% or 70% increases consumers and motorists had experienced since 2013 and 2014. Most of the recommendations in the 12-point plan have been fleshed out in a 186-page document produced by the working group. Like my colleague, I commend most of the recommendations but I am concerned about their acceleration and speed.

As Deputy Michael McGrath said, the virus of spiralling motor insurance costs has now spread to businesses, something which is more than anecdotal. When I knocked on doors in Tallaght in my constituency, I heard multiple examples of rising insurance costs in one afternoon, in particular from taxi drivers to whom Deputy Michael McGrath referred. I spoke to two couples who were taxi drivers and whose insurance increased by €1,800 in two years, which is colossal.

What comfort can we and the Minister of State offer those motorists? I heard the Minister of State speak on radio earlier, and he referred to the time it would take for things to bed in. Motorists need comfort. I spoke to a constituent whose premium increased from €500 to €2,500.

Politicians of all political hues receive queries about insurance each week, which are not confined to geography, gender or age. There seems to be a particular attack on older people. Returning emigrants simply cannot get motor insurance. As Deputy Michael McGrath said, older cars that have passed the NCT cannot be insured. The Minister of State will agree that there has to be some connection between an NCT certificate and car insurance, otherwise what is the point of getting an NCT certificate? Any tax cuts people have received and appreciated in the past three years have been wiped out by one car insurance premium.

Deputy Michael Moynihan

I compliment Deputy Michael McGrath for tabling this motion because it is a very serious issue.

Many businesses have been looking at the colossal rise in insurance costs in the past few years. When there was a halt in motor insurance cost rises in the past week or so, the claim was made that the strategy dealing with the spiralling cost of insurance was working, but it is on the back of increases of 34% or 35% in a 12-month period. Businesses, in particular those with a major footfall in retail units, restaurants and nightclubs, are telling me that they simply cannot get insurance. Is it correct that in respect of some categories of licensed premises, a number of underwriters have left the market which has now been reduced to one or two providers? If so, it is a damning indictment of the entire insurance industry and the fact that conditions were created which allowed them to leave the market and businesses completely exposed in making decisions to go without insurance. In respect of other policies, people are having to fork out the first €10,000 of any claim. This is not sustainable. I ask the Minister to address the issue of underwriters leaving the market and to explain how the Government permitted circumstances to develop where those providers left. The cost of motor insurance and, in particular, the cost of insurance for businesses are having a crippling effect and will have a knock-on effect on employment in the sectors mentioned.

Deputy Dara Calleary

I thank Deputy Michael McGrath for raising this issue. There has been a complete lack of urgency on the part of the Minister in dealing with it. I have a couple of examples to set out. The first involves a 33 year old man who is the model citizen as far as this city is concerned. He lived in an apartment for four years. As he had no need for a car, he went around on a bike. He was given a promotion and has now acquired a car, only to be charged €2,300 for insurance. He pays more per month for insurance than he does for his car.

The second example involves an emigrant returning from the Continent, which is to say the kind of person the Government is trying to attract as a result of Brexit. Notwithstanding the fact that they have a perfect driving record, the person concerned is being charged just under €3,000 for car insurance. It is crucifying us, in particular younger drivers. Older customers are not even being given quotes. If a person is over 75 years of age and trying to get an insurance quote in this market, he or she will be loaded beyond belief, if he or she will even be given a quote.

As Deputy Michael Moynihan said, businesses in the service industry, in particular, are being refused cover because of a lack of competition in the market, all because of a cosy consensus which does not allow out-of-court settlements to be revealed. Settlements are being made without any record or note being taken of their scope and the impact they are having on insurance costs. Urgency is required because the issue is affecting our competitiveness and impacting on requests and demands for improved pay and conditions. It will impact on the Government's ability to attract businesses as a result of Brexit. Unless there is urgency, we will be back here in a year's time with the problem having got worse. We need action now. We need the Minister to demonstrate that the gravity of the problem is understood and that the nettle will be grasped.

Deputy Bobby Aylward

I only have two minutes, but I could speak for an hour were I to go into detail about some of the calls and emails I have received from distraught young people, their parents and many angry business owners about the scandalous rise in the cost of motor and business insurance. This is not a new issue. Fianna Fáil has long called for the Government to act on it. In 2014 motor insurance costs were increasing at an annual rate of 11.6%, while in 2015, they rose by 30.8%. In the 12 months to December 2016, they increased by 12.2%. It is extremely frustrating that it took until January 2017 for the Government to respond to an issue which affects every household in the country. In simple terms, this and the previous Government have done nothing. They kicked the can down the road for three years and delayed matters further by establishing working groups and commissioning reports. In the meantime, small taxi operators and haulage companies have been forced out of business.

Insurance costs are proving to be a major concern for all businesses throughout the country, whether it be motor, public liability or employer's liability insurance. Many SMEs have experienced business insurance cost increases of between 6% and 15%, while in some cases the increases have been much more. In addition, insurance companies are using insurance excess figures and exclusions to protect themselves at the expense of their customers. The Central Bank should be pressurised to take a more hands-on role to regulate the insurance sector to ensure there will be greater transparency. It is totally unfair that motorists have been left in the dark about the rise in premiums and are expected to put up and shut up as insurance companies act like cartels. We must bring forward deadlines for certain major action points in the reports such as for the establishment of a national claims information database. The Government released a quarter one update last week on progress on the report on the rising costs of motor insurance. Despite being three years into this issue, three of the ten items to be completed in quarter one have yet to be implemented. It is simply not good enough.

This is scandalous. A young member of my own family who is 18 years of age was covered under his mother's insurance policy last year as a named driver for approximately €800. They paid for his lessons, after 11 of which he got his driving licence. When he went back to take out insurance as a named driver, the insurer asked for €4,500 from him. It is impossible. It has gone out of all proportion and is up to the Government to do something about it.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke

I welcome the opportunity to speak about this issue and acknowledge the good work done on it by my colleague, Deputy Michael McGrath, consistently in the past few years. I raised it with the Minister of State as a Topical Issue a couple of weeks ago. Despite the CSO figures at the time, the Minister of State told me that the trend was that insurance premiums were becoming static, which was to be welcomed. While I provided examples, the Minister of State said they were anecdotal, but that is not completely true. Notwithstanding what the CSO figures indicated, it is not what we are all experiencing day in and day out. With only limited time available to me, I cannot go into all of the examples. However, the reality is that an acceleration of implementation of the recommendations made in the report is needed. Despite what the CSO stated and what the Minister of State said here, it is not reflecting positively for consumers, whether private individuals or businesses, particularly in the haulage sector.

This is a real problem which is causing many to drive without insurance or, in some cases, go out of business. That is unacceptable. There are inconsistencies such as incidents where insurance companies are not quoting for cars with valid NCT certificates. There is a massive problem and, despite what has been said, insurance premiums are increasing by more than 30%. A lady contacted my office on Monday having received a quote for renewal of €850. Owing to personal circumstances, she did not get to renew it until three days after the renewal date, at which point the same company stated it was a new insurance policy which would cost €3,000. That is absolutely crazy. While I accept that the Minister of State is acting in good faith when he tells us things are starting to improve, the fact is that they are not. All Deputies could bring forward multiple examples, not from the last three months but from the past few days and weeks which demonstrate that things are not improving.

Implementation of the report must be accelerated to help private individuals and businesses as a matter of urgency in order that they can continue to exist. The people concerned are already stretched and this is a step too far, as I told the Minister of State a few weeks ago in the Chamber. It is time for action. Inaction is not good enough and has significant consequences.

Deputy Lisa Chambers

I commend the work of my colleague, Deputy Michael McGrath, on this issue and welcome the opportunity to speak. Motor insurance is mandatory for every citizen who wants to drive. As such, there is an obligation on the State to ensure it is accessible and fairly priced. That is not the case. I pay more for my insurance today after ten years of driving than I did when I started. There is something wrong with that. The cost is crippling and means that many young people cannot afford to get on the road. As someone from a rural constituency, I know that having a car is a necessity for many, in particular to get to work and school. At a time when we are trying to get people to return from abroad, the cost of insurance they are being quoted is astronomical. One is talking about a sum of more than €2,000.

I turn to the cost to business. A man in my constituency with a tree surgery business has a fleet of three vans. Last year his insurance costs actually doubled and this year the insurance companies will not provide him with a quote. Things are not improving; they are getting worse.

As has been said, we could be here all day talking about this. The reality on the ground is people cannot afford the costs as they currently stand and we need to address this matter urgently.

Deputy Eamon Scanlon

Irish small businesses are facing an insurance cost crisis with the potential for devastating consequences. The National Competitiveness Council has highlighted that insurance costs are one of the issues of greatest concern to businesses in the country. Many businesses, in particular small and medium enterprises, are experiencing massive increases in the order of 40% and higher in their premiums for motor, public liability and employer liability cover. This type of cost escalation is not sustainable for businesses, homeowners or individuals. If the current situation continues it will become impossible to do business in Ireland from a domestic and foreign direct investment perspective.

The significant cost increase has been borne by small businesses, resulting in job losses and non-expansion by companies. In the SME sector, which employs 920,000 people, many businesses, in particular retailers, are waiting for the Government to deal with costs, which continue to rise and show no sign of moderation. High costs make Ireland less attractive to foreign markets and this impacts on exporting sectors and drives consumers to look at other markets for cheaper goods. The Government must also set out a clear timeline and parameters for phase 2 of the cost of insurance working group, which will look at business insurance. It needs to be prioritised by the Government as lost competitiveness is a massive risk to Irish businesses. It is past time we stopped talking about our out of control insurance costs and do something about them.

Deputy Peter Fitzpatrick

I welcome the opportunity to take part in this debate. Dramatically rising insurance costs over recent years have affected almost everybody in this country, whether it be for car insurance, home insurance or business insurance. Last August I spoke on this very topic and raised the very many concerns I had about rising insurance premiums. CSO figures released at that time showed that general insurance costs had risen by more than 47% since 2011 and insurance costs in the motor sector had risen by more than 51% in the same period.

I know from my constituency work that people have suffered even greater rises and it must be said this has been for no obvious reason. In fact, I had one particular case where a person in Dundalk, who owns and drives a 2001 Polo with a 1 litre engine, was quoted almost €5,000 for insurance, with a reduced quote of €3,000 if a driving monitor box was installed. It should be noted this person had a full driving license and a no claims bonus. I had other cases where renewal premiums of more than €1,000 were being quoted when in previous years insurance renewal premiums of approximately €500 were the norm. We in County Louth have been particularly hard hit as we are deemed to be in a high risk category for location purposes.

I very much welcomed the establishment of a task force, led by my colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, which was tasked with reporting on the cost of motor insurance in Ireland. I commend the Minister of State, Deputy Murphy, on his report. The group has published a very detailed report highlighting a large number of actions to be undertaken over the next 24 months. Recently the Minister of State published his first progress report and highlighted that seven of the planned actions had taken place while the remaining three have been partially completed and are due to be fully completed in the very near future.

I know many on the opposite side of the House will attempt to play political games with this issue and, indeed, the motion is a prime example of this. I ask Members opposite to look at the bigger picture. The Minister of State, Deputy Murphy, was tasked with the job of finding out why insurance costs are rising, what can be done to halt the rise and to put in place measures to ensure we do not see a sudden increase in insurance costs in the future. Putting aside all political views, everybody can agree that while we are at a very early stage of the implementation of the actions highlighted in the report we are already seeing some real results.

As I said earlier, insurance costs had risen between 47% and 51% in the period from January 2011 to 2016. Recently released CSO figures show insurance costs have not risen month on month in 2017. This is progress and should be treated as such. Let us not forget the objective of the working group was to identify and examine the causes of the rising cost of insurance and recommend short, medium and long-term measures to be taken to address the issue of rising insurance costs. Although we are only a short period of time into the implementation of the measures included in the report, we are already seeing some very worthwhile benefits.

I commend the Minister of State, Deputy Murphy, on his work to date on the rising cost of insurance and his initial success in stalling increasing insurance costs. The cost of insurance is a major expense, not only for businesses but also for private individuals as they insure their cars and homes. We must ensure we have a fully functioning insurance sector where premiums are at a level that is affordable and sustainable. I look forward to the publication of the next progress report, which I firmly believe will provide further proof that real results will come as a result of the many actions recommended by the action group for rising insurance.

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Finian McGrath)

I welcome the opportunity to address Dáil Éireann on behalf of the Government on this very important motion. The matters raised are very important. I commend, compliment and thank the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, for his work on this matter.

While the Government does not dispute that the increase in the cost of insurance has had a negative impact on consumers and businesses, it disagrees with the thrust of the motion that the Government has done nothing to try to address the underlying causes of the problem. Consequently, the Government will be opposing the motion and will set out in response what has been done to date to tackle this issue.

In relation to tackling the cost of insurance, the first point to note is the establishment of the cost of insurance working group by the Minister for Finance in July of last year and the subsequent work of this group, including its motor insurance report. In carrying out its task, I remind the House about the collaborative approach which the working group has adopted through its regular engagement and co-operation with the Joint Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach on the cost of insurance project. In this regard, the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, has made several appearances before the committee and has been held accountable. He has listened very closely to the views of the committee and its Chairman, Deputy John McGuinness. While there are some differences in emphasis between the respective reports, there are far more similarities than differences. There is also a recognition in both reports that there is no single policy or legislative silver bullet to stem or reverse premium price rises immediately. This suggests there is an appreciation by the committee report that it will take a certain amount of time to transform the current insurance premium landscape. This is the reality.

The cost of insurance working group produced its first quarterly report on the progress of the implementation of the action plan at the start of this month. This report provides a comprehensive update on progress to date and reasons where delays exist. The Government remains committed to continue to drive implementation in a timely manner in line with the prescribed deadlines in order to stabilise this important sub-sector of the domestic economy. It should also be noted that the timeframes chosen for various recommendations and actions were considered very carefully by the cost of insurance working group. Great care was taken to strike a balance between the urgency of implementing change as soon as possible and the realisation that where significant initiatives are being undertaken time is required to ensure the necessary consultation is carried out before decisions are made as to how to take such projects forward. A good example of this is the establishment of the personal injuries commission. This body lies at the heart of this current review process. However, before it can come to any conclusions about what changes are needed as to how injuries are assessed and how they are graded, it first needs to carry out, among other things, a comprehensive data gathering exercise to assess systems for handling personal injuries claims elsewhere. This takes time and this is why we have given it until quarter four of 2017 to submit its first report.

The motion makes a number of valid points, and I accept this, with regard to the rising cost of business insurance. However, it is incorrect to say the Government is not doing anything to address this issue. Deputies will be aware the cost of insurance working group commenced the second phase of its work in January to look at public and employers' liability insurance in parallel with implementing the motor insurance recommendations. The working group is building on the work done in the motor phase to determine how it can be applied in the employer liability and public liability insurance claims areas. The working group is also considering the impact of the cost of insurance on the competitiveness of particular business sectors, the impact of health and safety issues on the cost of insurance and other market issues.

Extensive consultations with a range of stakeholders have been held. Further consultations are also planned and submissions have been invited from interested parties.

With regard to specific points raised around the timeframe for this work, the intention is to publish an addendum to the motor report, covering employers liability, EL, and public liability, PL. While a final report may not be ready until September, this does not mean that work on EL and PL reforms will only commence then. It is hoped that there will be clarity around the potential new measures in July. As soon as there is certainty about the planned direction of travel, the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, will publish accordingly and will appear before the Oireachtas committee to explain the underlying thinking.

The latest data from the Central Statistics Office indicates that motor insurance inflation in 2017 has remained flat month-on-month. There was 0% change from December 2016 to April 2017. As of April 2017, motor insurance was 6.1% below its recent peak in July 2016. If this trend continues, the Government is hopeful that it might be signalling the start of a stabilisation of pricing in the market.

For the reasons outlined, the Government does not accept the assertions made in the motion and must oppose it as it gives no recognition to the significant level of work done to date by the cost of insurance working group on addressing the cost of insurance issue.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Pearse Doherty is sharing with colleagues.

Deputy Pearse Doherty

Tá mé ag roinnt ama le mo chomghleacaithe. There is an advertisement that appears regularly on people's social media. It is from Insurance Confidential and is an Insurance Ireland creation. The advertisement is supposed to show us how fraud is the reason all of us have been paying so much more for car insurance in the past few years. Every so often the advertisement pops up on social media and users can comment underneath it. It is hilarious, and it is interesting to read the comments. Most of them use very unparliamentary language. If I was to repeat some of it I am sure the Ceann Comhairle would have a lot to say about my language here but the general consensus is that nobody is buying the line from the insurance industry spin or its distraction campaigns. One states, "My insurance premium is higher because of greedy insurance companies" and "childish advertisement" is one comment that sums up most of the others.

As the motion before the House states, and I commend Deputy Michael McGrath for bringing it forward, it has been three years since we have seen an explosion in motor insurance premiums, yet this week I have heard of young and middle aged drivers who are receiving quotes for hundreds of euro on top of their existing high premiums. Many people do not have the option and cannot find better value when they shop around so it is a case of pay up or get off the road. The Facebook users know the score, and we all know the score. The insurers are still getting away with it just as they have done for the past few years.

The Government's report has some very good ideas but they need to be implemented as soon as possible. It has other ideas that are simply feeding the straw men that have been set up by the insurers. I repeat what has been obvious to me and to my party for a long time. All the legal fees, the fraud and the excuses dreamt up by insurers do not come close to explaining the massive increases we have seen, and are still seeing in some cases, in motor insurance premiums. The insurers invested poorly and their business model, which delivered so much profit for so long, has failed them and consumers are now paying the price. No amount of Government initiatives can change that but transparency is the key to at least removing the excuses, and lack of transparency favours the insurers and only adds to the suspicion of cartelism.

I welcome the focus in the motion on tackling the use of so-called failure to disclose by consumers as an excuse by insurers to prevent payouts. My Consumer Insurance Contracts Bill, which has passed Second Stage in this House and is awaiting Committee Stage, proposes changes to the law so that this type of behaviour will be much more difficult to get away with. The onus in that legislation would be put on the insurers to ask the relevant questions instead of on the consumer to know the information that will be held against him or her eventually. The Bill contains many other measures that are needed to level the playing field so that the consumer, be that the small business or the individual, can stand up to the insurers. It is part of the overall solution package.

The motion put forward by Deputy McGrath is correct to look at the cost of business insurance in the same way we have looked at the issue of motor insurance. Many of the same issues apply and as far as I am concerned, the same root cause is to be found. The more public fuss there is about car insurance the more the insurers are likely to spread their increases across other areas. That is what we are seeing in terms of recent trends. Health and home insurance will not be immune either. When I asked the committee on finance to look at this issue I hoped that swift intervention would have shamed the insurers into delivering fair prices. We are seeing some movement in that regard but we are also seeing that they have hunkered down and are trying to brazen out the storm, and in some ways the Government has facilitated them and even met them half way in some of their claims.

I support this motion. Pressure needs to be kept on the Government to meet its own timetable at least, which is very poor, and I made that point in the debate on the Government's report. Motor insurance and business insurance keep the economy moving. When the system that implements them is failing it has huge implications. The answer must be a greater role for the State in this issue when the private sector is so clearly failing to deliver a functioning market.

Deputy Denise Mitchell

I welcome the opportunity to speak in the debate on this Private Members' motion. This is an issue that is affecting citizens across this State. Insurance companies would have us believe that fraudsters, excessive court settlements and the costs associated with the legal profession are the reasons behind the huge increases in motor insurance. Basically, they want to blame their customers but if we scratch the surface we can see that far from being solely the fault of others, it was the investment policies of many of these insurance companies faring far worse than expected, during a time of low interest rates, that resulted in worse than expected returns. To make up for that, they are the heaping extra costs onto drivers, many of whom have clean driving records and never had a claim in their lives. That is unacceptable.

We have seen a huge drop in the number of people holding learner permits in the past decade. Part of the reason for that is because many young people see no point in learning to drive as the costs are so high. This week I was contacted by a constituent who had returned here having been away for a year only to find that the cost of her insurance had gone through the roof, so to speak. She had nine years of driving experience, five on a full license, and she had never been in a collision or accident, yet her insurance cost has quadrupled to over €3,000. She said that this was "extortion at its finest", and it is hard not to agree with her.

We need urgent action on this issue. The Government must stop dragging its feet. It needs to complete the action points in the Report of the Cost of Motor Insurance, which was supposed to have been done two months ago, and it needs to ensure that the Central Bank enforces proper legislation on the industry.

Deputy Carol Nolan

Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCeann Comhairle as ucht an deis labhairt ar an topaic fíorthábachtach seo inniu. Every Deputy in this House knows that the cost of insurance, especially motor insurance, has been a major issue of public concern for some time. Deputies across the House have been constantly saying that.

There is huge public anger about this issue. The insurance companies have not taken any responsibility and have made every attempt to deflect from their duty to address this issue. The failing business model employed by insurance companies is the real reason for the increases and customers have become the easy targets to recover the losses from imprudent investments. I commend my party colleague, Deputy Pearse Doherty, for all his hard work in highlighting this important issue. It was on foot of his suggestion that the committee on finance engaged with relevant stakeholders and produced a report. The report of the finance committee lays out clearly many measures that would help create greater transparency and would potentially reduce prices. Furthermore, the Government’s own report on the issue makes 70 separate recommendations in this area.

Another issue relating to motor insurance is the refusal of insurance companies to insure cars that they deem to be old. These would be cars with 1995 and 1996 registrations owned by elderly people who have an NCT certificate.

These people are facing the absolute refusal of companies to insure their cars. This needs to be investigated because it is not good enough. It is clearly showing again that our insurance companies are trying to take advantage of people. It is discrimination against people who cannot afford newer cars.

The Government has shown a lack of urgency in addressing all of these issues. We need action now. We are not going to sit back and allow this to continue. The Government must commit to the full implementation of the report on the cost of motor insurance without any further delay or excuses. We need to ensure that appropriate oversight of the sector is established and maintained in order to protect consumers. I am happy to say my party will be supporting this motion and I urge all Deputies in the House to do the same.

Deputy Peadar Tóibín

At the start of this year, this country was racked with the Bus Éireann strike. Most of the focus at the time was on the economic viability of Bus Éireann. One of the pieces of information that came to my attention at the time was that the director of Bus Éireann stated the cost of insurance claims within the company had risen from €1.5 million in 2014 to €7 million in 2016. We were told this was one of the reasons there was downward pressure on workers' pay and entitlements. I wondered at that time how insurance increases could be the cause of downward pressures on workers' wages. Surely shocking increases in the cost of insurance would be reasons for the downward pressures on insurance costs. Bus Éireann either became extremely negligent, or had accidents it could not deal with, or the insurance industry was responsible for developing an unfair situation. Conas gur féidir an méadú atá tagtha ar chostais árachais a úsáid mar leithscéal don bhrú anuas ar thuarastail oibrithe? An é go raibh Bus Éireann ag éirí níos neamartaí ar a chuid dualgais nó an bhfuil an tionscail árachais mí-chothrom?

Over the past few months, I have been inundated by communications from many families and businesses. The latter either have major difficulties functioning as businesses or they are having their transportation ability curtailed in a massive way. This is happening because of the cost of insurance. A typical small business in Navan, County Meath, employs 15 people and has been open for about nine years. Its insurance cost was roughly €7,000 for approximately eight years. Last year, it went up to €14,000. The business never had a claim. The reason it gives is that it feels there are not enough competitors in the market. It has a choice of only two separate companies from which to procure its insurance.

Another business in Meath opened four years ago. It had an insurance cost of about €2,500 per year. This has increased to about €8,500. The business has had two claims made against it. It obviously believes these claims are unfair, etc., but it is not for me to say whether they are. It is important, however, to note that a claim or two can actually push a business over the tipping point in terms of functionality. Another business in Meath, which has just won a competition for the best business of its class in the whole State, has told me its insurance has jumped from €8,000 to €12,000. Therefore, there are many businesses that have come through eight or nine years of really difficult trading experiences that are just at the very edge of functionality. Now they are being hit with massive costs.

A couple of months ago, I organised a public meeting in Meath on insurance. We were inundated with people at the meeting. An individual told me his insurance cost increased from €450 per year to €900 per year for absolutely no reason. Another individual told us they had to pay €2,600 for car insurance. A young woman driver who attended the meeting was quoted €6,500 for car insurance.

A key point I took from the meeting concerned the issue of older cars. It became very clear that a number of participants stated they had cars that were over 15 years old. The cars were fully functional, safe, in perfect working order and with an NCT certificate. That they cannot be insured has the effect of saying to two elements of our demographic that they will not be able to drive. Young people and people on low incomes are the people likely to be driving these cars.

The structure of the insurance industry is broken. The Government is responsible for the development of the conditions for industries to function in. One of the key problems with the Government is that it does not seem to be tackling the dysfunction within the insurance industry. There are serious ramifications. Ireland is currently suffering massive increases in inflation in a number of specific areas. There was a report a couple of days ago stating Dublin is now in the top ten cities in the world with regard to construction costs. We are seeing an erosion of the competitiveness of the country. For the past few years, every time the issue of competitiveness came to a head the Government focused on workers' wages, conditions and entitlements but did not seem to feel the same need to focus on insurance.

The gamut of products and services we consume as a people is being affected by insurance costs in this country. Day by day, younger people and poorer people, including those on lower incomes, are being prevented from functioning in the economy itself. It is really important that the Government consider this. Tá struchtúr na hearnála árachais briste. Is cúis lárnach é seo leis an laghdú ar chumas iomaíochta na tíre seo ar bhonn bliaintiúil. Is cúis lárnach é leis an méadú suntasach atá tagtha ar chostas earraí agus seirbhísí. Tá sé ag cur bac ar dhaoine óga agus daoine níos boichte tiomáint ar na bóithre agus páirt a ghlacadh sa ghnáth-shaol.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

We welcome the motion. We will be supporting it. I believe the Minister of State to be genuine in his attempts to deal with this issue. If we had one criticism, it would be that some of the deadlines should be sooner rather than in quarters three and four of this year.

I wish to speak briefly to some of the issues inherent in the update of 3 May, as presented by the Minister of State. Recommendation No. 6 relates to ensuring greater consistency of treatment for returning immigrants. When the Minister of State is responding, I would be very grateful if he could let us know whether there is scope within the recommendation to ensure such a protocol is achieved, perhaps by the end of quarter two or three, because it is such a vital issue. I do not need to rehearse in the House the issues that affect returning immigrants but if the protocol could be designed in a way to ensure it may be implemented with greater haste, it would provide a lot of confidence for people who are returning from abroad.

On recommendation No. 7, on the subjection of the declined cases agreement to ongoing review to ensure transparency, we welcome the progress. I seek clarification on the exact position at present. Bearing in mind the review, the Minister of State will correct me if I am wrong on Insurance Ireland's updating of its website. My understanding from the report of 3 May is that Insurance Ireland has actually updated the website. Again, I want clarification on that.

On recommendation No. 8 of the Minister of State's report, dated 3 May, there is to be a protocol for policyholders to be notified of claims made against them before settlement date. I seek a real-time clarification from the Minister of State on that. That was a matter of some discussion today in the media. The Minister of State and Deputy Michael McGrath referred specifically to it. I was listening to the discussion in passing. What is the position on that?

There is a school of thought that such a recommendation should be much stronger and that defendants should be given an opportunity to mount a defence instead of an insurer deciding that it is uneconomic to defend and going to a default payment mechanism. I acknowledge Deputy Michael McGrath on that point because he raised it on the Sean O'Rourke show earlier today.

We all want to ensure the cost of motoring will be reduced for every motorist, regardless of his or her demographics and the age of the vehicle. I was a member of the finance committee that reported on this issue and one of the major issues was related to older vehicles. If an older vehicle passes the NCT, the owner should not be discriminated against because of its age. That does not make an ounce of sense as the NCT is subject to the law of the land.

I have serious difficulties with the issue of transparency because we were told all along that the reason for the stark increase in the cost of premia was the provisioning that was necessary on the part of insurance companies to cover losses. There is nothing in the reports about this, but I have a great difficulty with the amount provided for. People will accept an increase in their premia, but they cannot sustain the increases they have had to sustain in the past 12 months. The insurance industry is telling us a corrective mechanism is in place whereby premia have been reduced by 40% in some instances. A component has to be pure and utter profit. There is no transparency on that profit making.

Another issue I have is that Insurance Ireland seemed to speak for the industry at the committee hearings. It is not about personalities, but I found it difficult to understand why one person with one voice seemed to represent the entire industry. Will the Minister of State outline whether the working group has heard from voices other than Insurance Ireland? In other words, have the chief executive officers of insurance companies dealt directly with him? What has been the nature of the engagement between them? Consumers would not necessarily recognise Insurance Ireland as the sole voice of the sector. It would be useful for us to have some insight from the Minister of State into what his engagement was with them. It would be even better if he named the individual companies. I doubt that he will, but I make the request respectfully.

We support the motion. I recognise the work the Minister of State is doing, but I would like him to ensure the goals to be attained within certain quarters are fast-tracked, particularly in the case of returning emigrants. Perhaps he might have something to say about that. It would be useful and send a signal. I would also like him to comment on the issues affecting older drivers, drivers of older vehicles and public service vehicles and the distinction between taxis and so on and SMEs that have fleets but which find their insurance costs have gone through the roof. He should ensure a level playing field in respect of transparency on the difference between the provisioning and the corrective measures he has said are being introduced and the profits generated. People want to feel that they are not being screwed. I do not know if the word "screwed" is unparliamentary language, but I am speaking in the vernacular. It is unfair that consumers find themselves in this position at this time. I have no doubt that I will receive a letter if the word is deemed to be unparliamentary. I read the list of prohibited words lately and the term "corner-boy" was proscribed. Perhaps that is now anachronistic, but it was appropriate at a certain time.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will have to refresh my memory on the appropriate phraseology to be used.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

We do not want the insurance industry to act like a corner-boy in this regard.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

I thank Fianna Fáil for tabling the motion on an extremely important subject. Huge numbers of citizens are being ripped off by insurance companies. I primarily want to address the cost of motor insurance, but I will comment on the cost of health insurance initially. It is the biggest scam ever. I would never take out private health insurance on principle because in the area of health it is obscene and unacceptable that we have a two-tier system under which people receive premium health care if they pay and second-class health care if they do not. It is worse than that because many of the inadequacies in the public health system result precisely from the existence of a private health tier and private health insurance leeching off the public system, a little like fee-paying schools. They receive the benefits of public funding and support, while generating a premium above it to support a two-tier system.

I understand many people take out private health insurance out of fear of the public system, but the problem is that is a self-fulfilling prophecy. By taking it out, they reinforce the system. I do not blame those who do it out of fear, but, ironically, are they better off with private health insurance? It is a serious question as to whether they are because when it comes to the most serious illnesses, they end up having to go back into the public system. The private health insurance industry is a parasite on the public health system and resources and finance that should go into providing a quality universal health system for all. The Government parties often talk, as a way of absolving themselves of the crisis in the public system, about the fact that Ireland spends one of the highest proportions of GDP on health services, but they always fail to say a huge portion of that figure, approximately €3 billion, is paid to the private system. When it is taken out, one realises why there is a crisis in the public health system. We mirror the United States in that sense. A total of 40% of expenditure on health services in the United States basically represents profiteering by the private health insurance industry and other private health service providers. We should get rid of private health insurance by having a national health system. It is one extortionate cost imposed on huge numbers of people that could be removed.

I do not disagree with anything in the motion and there is not much with which I disagree in the reports of the Minister of State and the Oireachtas joint committee which made some good recommendations. However, none of them will address the problem, which is that motor insurance providers are profiteering from the fact that it is a mandatory legal requirement to have motor insurance if one drives. They have a captive audience.

Many people do not have a choice about driving. A car is necessary for many people in rural areas where public transport is woefully inadequate. One has to have insurance, otherwise one is breaking the law. For elderly people, people with mobility problems and people who earn their living through driving - the most obvious are taxi drivers but there are other jobs that require a car - one is captive in that one has to drive and the law requires one to have insurance, but the State does not provide a minimum level of not-for-profit insurance. Therefore, one is prey for the private motor insurance companies which profiteer from the fact that they have a captive market.

The transparency measures do not go far enough. The emphasis put by the Government in the prelude to these reports was all about fraudulent claims, overstating the extent of those fraudulent claims, legal costs, which are a factor but do not explain the dramatic increases in recent years, and giving more information to the consumer about the breakdown of premiums or increases and all the rest of that. They do not get to the fundamental problem, and I do not think any of these measures will get to the fundamental problem, that the private insurance companies with a captive market can always find ways to ratchet up premiums to make money.

Private insurance companies are entirely tied up with a market. The biggest reason for the big increases was that their investments went bad. They lost much money on the markets and then decided to recoup that money by screwing the premium holders and people seeking insurance. That was the major reason for these dramatic increases, and nothing is going to stop, including the measures proposed in the Fianna Fáil motion, in the Government's recommendations or for that matter by the all-party Oireachtas committee. Given that it is a legal mandatory requirement, there has to be the provision of some sort of basic motor insurance which is affordable for everybody on a not-for-profit basis. If people want premium insurance after that, they can go to the private market.

This is a legal requirement. If it is a legal requirement, the State has to make it affordable for those who need it. Taxi drivers are literally being put out of business by these guys. If one has the slightest prang - of course, one is going to have small prangs if one is driving all the time for a living - one is gone. Premiums are already massively high and people who have never had accidents are getting premiums of €17,000 and €20,000, which are ridiculous figures. That is not sustainable for taxi drivers. Of course, over the course of driving for a living, one is going to have some little accident, which is not even one's fault. It could be a small thing, but that is it - one is out of a job. There has to be a particular control or the provision of a special category of insurance premiums and policies to allow taxi drivers to function, or for that matter other people who have to drive for a living. Something has to be done about the issue of discrimination against the elderly, against young people and against rural dwellers. I also believe young nurses and other health care workers are getting punitive premiums, and I believe journalists also get punitive premiums for some reason just because they are journalists. I do not quite fully understand that. That discrimination should not be allowed.

I asked the Minister of State about this and he said that is just the way insurance works. He said companies look at categories of drivers and this is going to influence the premiums. That is not fair. If one happens to be in one of those categories, but has a perfectly good record, or has a car that passed the NCT, but happens to be older, one is penalised. That penalises the young or less well-off but it is just not fair. None of the Minister of State's measures is doing anything to deal with that unfairness and discrimination.

Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan

I will just look at motor insurance and will refer to a reply from the Minister to a parliamentary question in which he said that there was no silver bullet to reduce the costs of insurance. He acknowledged the volatility in the market and then said that co-operation and commitment between all parties can deliver fairer premiums for consumers without unnecessary delay. I welcome the report of the working group and the recommendations, actions and timeline, but we are not seeing any action on it. What we are seeing is life becoming very difficult for motorists, in particular in Dublin. The increase in the insurance costs is just another factor in that.

I want to look at particular groups, which Deputy Boyd Barrett mentioned. Taxi drivers use their cars to make a living. I have numerous constituents who are taxi drivers and they tell me they cannot afford to work. Their taxis are off the road because of the huge increase in insurance. These are taxi drivers who have completed all the tests. They are adhering to very stringent standards, including the NCT and public service yearly checks. They are dealing with increasing anti-social behaviour on the part of some customers. They are providing a service and are being crippled by the rise. I have seen increases of insurance up to over €10,000.

For pensioners, some insurers make the cost of insurance so high for them that they are forced to give up their cars. These pensioners use their cars for mobility, for their independence and for leisure activities and their children depend on them to bring their grandchildren to various activities. Now they are not able to drive because of the increase, which will increase their isolation and dependence. I have one constituent, aged 70, with 20 years no claim bonus, who faced a 70% increase. This will mean she has to rely on her neighbours to do the chores she could have done herself. We also have families who rely on their cars and who are being crippled by these insurance costs.

I also mention these foreign-registered companies that go into liquidation, the policyholders being left in difficult situations and the industry footing the bill. It is really the customers having to pay the exorbitant increases, so I do not understand this collective liability. There is a need for a central EU database to ensure common standards. People are turning to companies based outside Ireland and I think there could be disastrous consequences. It is their right to make this choice, but I think they need to know the risks involved. We are also aware of the discrepancy between what the insurance industry is saying and the legal profession we are paying, but in the middle is the customer who is paying the price.

I am aware of a very disturbing situation relating to house insurance for a person with a disability. There are extremely aggressive policies from the insurer, backed by a US vulture fund investor that has taken over the insurance. I hope the debate will lead to some action because that will speak louder than words.

Deputy Thomas Pringle

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to the debate this evening on the costs of insurance. We could probably all use our time citing cases which have heard about in our constituency offices in regard to the costs of insurance for people who have no choice but to have cars and small businesses which have no choice but to have insurance. I want to cite one case of a young man in Donegal who has to have a car for work and was quoted €6,000 for car insurance. He would be working for a year just to insure his car. Those are the kinds of increases people are facing throughout the country. It is over three years since this crisis was flagged. The action which has been taken is quite disappointing when one sees the time taken to get the reports of the insurance working group.

The myths the insurance companies have been putting out must be dispelled. We hear the narratives that fraud, legal costs, the costs of claims and so on are causing the increase in the cost of insurance policies. The most interesting sentence in the report on the costs of motor insurance is that the working group did not find that legal costs were a major contributory factor in the recent increases in premiums. The working group set up to look at it has shot out of the water the reasons put by the insurance industry about costs.

I believe it is true that the reason the costs have gone up is that insurance companies' returns on investments have gone down over the last couple of years. That is why. It is because of the business model of the insurance companies. That is what has lumped the cost on. Yet, the Government buys into the narrative that fraud, legal costs and everything else is lumping it on.

It is worth noting that Zurich Insurance made $2.9 billion in profits in 2015. Allianz made €10.5 billion in profits in 2016. These are extremely profitable companies that are gouging their own customers because they know they will get away with it. That is the bottom line. They know they can do it. As was mentioned earlier, due to the fact that it is a legal requirement to have at least third-party insurance in this country if one wants to drive, there is an onus on the State to ensure that people can achieve that minimum standard. If that means the State should establish its own insurance company to provide that, we should be doing that and it should have been done already. We should not have to say that it should be done. The only way to put manners on the insurance companies is to provide insurance for people. The companies will then change their tune.

Deputy Joan Collins

I support the motion. I generally support the tenor of the debate this evening. For three years now, we know that premiums have gone up very high by more than 50%. We know that more people are being forced into driving without insurance because they cannot afford the insurance as it is so high. I want to take the opportunity to deal with some of the issues that have been raised already about car insurance.

I was recently contacted by a constituent. Like many stories we have heard, my constituent has seen an almost 400% increase in the cost of basic third-party fire and theft insurance in two years. In 2015, he was able to get insurance for €400. In 2016, it went up to almost €700. This year, he was quoted €1,472. He tried ringing around. He got one quote for more than €2,000 but most refused to even offer him a quote. Was this person some sort of dangerous maniac? Has he been guilty of drink-driving or dangerous driving? He has not. Does he have penalty points? No. Does he have a full licence? Yes, since 1974. Does he have a medical condition that makes it unsafe for him to drive? No. Is the car roadworthy? Yes, it passed the NCT. Therefore, what was the problem? He was over 65. There was no other reason. I note that a recommendation of the report states that the insurance companies must advise and tell somebody why he or she is being refused. However, that is no use if one cannot get insurance anywhere else. It good to have a bit of transparency, but it is not going to make the fundamental difference.

Insurance companies are penalising older drivers. It is a major issue for Age Action. Older people have taken up this issue themselves and are pushing for it. The companies are also penalising young drivers. USI has come out with many instances of its members facing huge premiums. A young woman called into my office whose car was 13 or 14 years old. She obviously needed the car. She was travelling around with an old car. If one is on a low wage, one is not going to be going out spending big money on big cars. One is using the car to get around. She was quoted nearly €2,500. It is just unbelievable. As has been said, car insurance is mandatory. If a person has a full licence with no convictions, no penalty points and a roadworthy car that has passed the NCT, he or she should be entitled to affordable insurance.

This situation is forcing people off the road, or even worse, to drive without insurance. The Government must act. As has been said by Deputies Pringle, Boyd Barrett and O'Sullivan, there must be a neutral not-for-profit company that would provide affordable basic insurance to people like those constituents who are facing those basic third-party insurance costs. That has to be the case. If we do not do that, nothing is going to change because, as has been said, the insurance companies know that they have a captive audience, they know that people cannot go anywhere else and they know that people have to drive.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

I thank Deputy Michael McGrath and the Fianna Fáil party for putting this motion before the Chamber and for giving us the opportunity to discuss this very serious matter of which, as public representatives, we are reminded every single day and maybe several times in any one day. Young drivers cannot get realistic quotes that they can afford to pay. I am of the belief that one should always give young people a chance at least until they blot their copybook. They are entitled to be treated fairly until that happens. They should at least get a chance and be allowed to start off. Young people need their cars, especially where we come from. There is no mode of transport in rural places other than a car and one needs to have a car of one's own. Many of these youngsters now cannot go to work because they cannot afford insurance.

Likewise, old drivers are being penalised. Their quotes are being doubled. That is not fair and it makes no sense. Quotes for taxis and hackneys have gone up. The cost of their yearly premiums has gone up. I know of two cases in which the quote rose to €14,000. They could not come up with that kind of money and it forced them off the road.

I will give one example in each case. I know of a haulier who paid €70,000 last year. This year, he is being quoted €250,000. That is the truth. Youngsters of 21 years of age are being asked to pay €4,000 and €5,000. They cannot afford that. Returning to old people, I know of one man who never had a crash in his life. His insurance went up from €340 to €780. He has actually paid it. I know another man who was a bit luckier. His quote went a way up as well from around €300 to more than €700. He went along and told his son about it. His son had a lot of vehicles and could not believe the figure his father was being quoted. The son went along to the insurance company or broker and asked how his father was being charged so much. The response was, "Oh, is he your father?". This is a fact. The son said that it was his father and the company said to leave it with them. They came back after a few hours and said that his premium would be the same next year. That tells me that something is going on and that insurance companies are not being honest.

There is a huge increase in claims and the value of claims. There are companies out there especially putting claims together for solicitors. Claimants cannot lose because the legal profession operates on the basis of "no foal, no fee". They cannot lose. Why is it that the Personal Injuries Assessment Board is only dealing with 20% of the claims? For a serious case of whiplash in England, the maximum payout a claimant can get is £7,600. For a very minor one here, a claimant will get €18,400. For a serious one, a claimant will get €77,000. A girl got €76,000 for her finger being caught in a door. The solicitor got €47,000 of that. I will not say where it was, but another solicitor boasted that he got €80,000 for such a claim and said that if others have similar cases, he can get that money for them too. A fella who slipped on a wet floor when he was actually pushed, for some reason or other - I cannot understand it - got €750,000. I have said it before that the fraud squad or some special investigation unit should be put into action to follow these things up because this is what is causing much of the increases, or at least this is what we are being told is the cause of the increase in quotes and premiums for the young, the old and the business people I mentioned.

If we go back about 14 years, we had the same scenario in this country. People could not afford insurance because it had become very expensive at that time. I know that because my oldest two lads were coming on the scene at the time and I could not insure them on their own. I had to insure them on an old jeep I had and put them on my insurance. That is a fact. We do not have enough competition in the insurance market at present. I will say categorically that while Seán Quinn was operating we could pay for insurance. Sadly, he has been taken out of it. People could get insurance and when he was there, they could pay for it. He was taken out but he would have paid his way back. The bankers who broke the country were let off and they got away with it.

Deputy Boyd Barrett brought the issue of health insurance to my attention and I agree with him. How is it if a person is in hospital for two or three days, he or she is liable to pay about €75 a night for his or her stay yet if he or she has VHI the hospital will take a fee of €800 or €850 from VHI for the same stay? Why is that happening? It is the HSE that is doing it. It is driving up the cost of private health cover. That should be investigated. It is happening everywhere. Regardless of what hospital it is, it is happening and it is unfair because, at the end of the day, it is the public that has to pay for it.

We are raising all these issues in respect of the cost of insurance with the Minister of State, and I have done so since I came here. Something needs to be done. The Government should have a role to play when someone has been refused insurance or when someone is given an exorbitant quote he or she cannot pay. The Government or some independent body should have the power to ask why that is the case because it is totally unfair. It is the most common thing we are asked at our clinics and especially when we meet youngsters. They are trying to get going and want to get out in the world but they are being prevented from doing that. There must be more competition in the market and the Government must investigate further to ensure companies are acting fairly because I do not believe they are at present.

Deputy Catherine Murphy

We are all in a unique position because we interact with the public all the time. One of the issues on people's minds is the cost of living. One of the major concerns is the cost of insurance and motor insurance is a significant factor in that context. The high cost of living has undermined the ability of many families to make ends meet. Motor insurance becomes one of those out-of-the-ordinary costs and unexpected, big increases can really cripple a family's monthly budget. The average cost of insurance has risen by over 60% since 2012. Such an increase is proof positive the system is dysfunctional. We have all heard stories. Most Deputies or their family members will have had experience of premiums rising dramatically since last year despite the fact there may have been no change in circumstances.

Just this week I had contact from a constituent who after 40 years of driving claim-free had cause to make a claim on his policy in 2016. This resulted in him having his premium increased by €455 for the next year, bringing it to €894. He shopped around for a few weeks and tried to see if he could get a better quote. While he was doing that his insurance company withdrew the quotation of €894 and is now seeking €2,770. The man is 40 years driving with no claims and is facing a premium not far off €3,000. It will obviously not be just one year; it will be an issue that will go on for several years. It is absolutely outrageous. While it is true things have calmed down in terms of increases in motor insurance over the last number of months, the fact remains the insurance regime is flawed and requires a new way of doing business.

We are almost an outlier in terms of international standards for some injury awards. A broken arm in the UK tends to attract an average settlement of £5,000 whereas here, the average award for the same injury is €16,000. It is legitimate to ask why there is a discrepancy. The £5,000 might be too low but is there a good reason for the discrepancy? There is an urgent need to provide far better settlement guidance for judges and for the Personal Injuries Assessment Board when it comes to making decisions on injury settlements. Where there are injuries that merit awards or very high awards, it is imperative those awards are in keeping with the seriousness of the injury, the rehabilitation required and the loss of earnings and potential earnings. It is important there is transparency in how it is calculated. It is possible to reduce legal costs associated with personal injuries claims by improving the methods of non-litigation settlement and thereby further reducing costs. Once the legal profession is involved in the court system, it becomes a very big element of any settlement.

Small and medium businesses in this country face significant bureaucratic pressures and ever-increasing costs associated with trying to run a business. Motor and business insurance are chief among them. It simply does not make economic sense to cripple businesses with exorbitant insurance costs which could potentially price them out of business and reduce the number of people who are contributing.

Of the ten action points specified in the Government's report on the cost of motor insurance, which came after the crisis in the industry had pretty much exploded, three have still not been completed. Many data are collected and we should have a mechanism for monitoring the situation and not allowing it to get to the point of a crisis. In the past number of years, we have had a number of debates in the House on this issue when it escalates to the point of being routinely on the airwaves.

I will make a comment that is slightly off track on the issue of health insurance and the regime in place at the moment. When anybody is admitted to hospital through accident and emergency, he or she is, by definition, vulnerable. People are not admitted willy-nilly into accident and emergency. A woman contacted me who ended up having a serious increase in her blood pressure, to the point where the consultant had to be called, because of the pressure put on her to fill out a form to say she was a private patient because she had health insurance when, in fact, she went in through accident and emergency as a consequence of ill-health. The kind of pressure being put on people is absolutely outrageous. They did not take account that it presented a problem for that woman that evening and they came back again the next morning.

They even wrote to her after she got out of hospital. However, she was very determined that she was not going to fill in the form and was told not to do so by her insurance company.

The pressure that is being put on people who are in a very vulnerable position is outrageous. When patients are in a vulnerable position and are dependent on people to treat them, the last thing they want is to be having a row. That needs to be sorted out in the context of the overall issue of insurance.

Deputy Eugene Murphy

Since I became a Member of this House in February 2016 I have been very impressed with my party colleague, Deputy Michael McGrath, who has put an extraordinary amount of effort into raising the issue of increasing insurance costs. I also want to acknowledge the sincerity of the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, in trying to deal with this issue. The Government must take urgent action now to tackle exorbitant motor insurance costs as the situation is reaching crisis levels and leaving businesses, families and motorists struggling to make ends meet. I have had many calls to my constituency office from people who are angry and frustrated, having been hit by 30% to 50% increases in motor and other insurance costs. Many families are struggling to keep their heads above water. They are paying mortgages, meeting exorbitant child care costs and paying other bills while trying to put food on the table. The increases in insurance costs are putting extra pressure on already struggling families.

This is an issue of particular concern in rural areas like my own constituency of Roscommon-Galway, where we have a very poor public transport system and so many people rely on their cars. They need their cars to bring their children to school, to get to work and to do whatever work they have to do around the place. A car is vital in rural Ireland. I was contacted recently by a constituent whose car insurance had increased by 30% from €560 in 2015 to over €800 in 2017. This is a person with absolutely no claims, whose car is about ten years old and is valued at €2,000. As he pointed out, he got €5 back per week in his salary with the budgetary cuts to the USC but he is now faced with rising car insurance costs as well as the crippling cost of family health insurance. He has no fear of anyone coming in through his front door to rob him when they can just do it through the letter box and that is what is happening. Many businesses, particularly SMEs, are also experiencing massive increases, in the order of 40% and higher, in their motor, public liability and employer liability insurance premiums.

I know of a 19 year old girl with a full licence who has never been involved in a crash but the first insurance quotation she got was for €6,000. Her car is only worth €2,800. The driver of a wheelchair accessible taxi was quoted €12,000. A hotel in my constituency paid €20,000 in insurance last year. It made one small claim and now its insurance premium has increased to €50,000. We all know about the problems with health insurance and other areas of insurance too. We need to address this issue.

Deputy James Browne

I thank Deputy Michael McGrath for tabling this motion and for pursuing this matter relentlessly in this Dáil. The cost of insurance is causing a very real crisis across our country. The rapid, unjustifiable and unsustainable increases in insurance costs are undermining our national competitiveness, crippling businesses and hurting families. This is leading to widespread anger and anxiety in my own county of Wexford. However, it is not just the increase in the principal that is causing distress. Increases in excesses and the denial of claims for minor non-disclosures or for slight delays in notifying insurance companies of potential claims are all adding to distress. Furthermore, we have seen significant increases in the number of drivers being refused car insurance three times. In County Wexford, I have dealt with a number of instances where elderly women have been refused insurance for no reason other than their age, which is blatant discrimination.

All these issues have been ongoing for some time now. The increases in insurance premiums reflect a combination of Government imposed costs, poor regulation, mismanagement by insurance companies and legislative failure. I do not get any sense of urgency from the Government to tackle this issue and we are not seeing any relief on the ground. I am conscious of the requirement for parliamentary language so I will say that people rightly feel as if they are attached to another object by an inclined plane wrapped helically around an axis.

The high cost of motor insurance is preventing people from going back to work as the insurance is often significantly higher than the price of a car. Returning emigrants are being discriminated against with high insurance premiums. Taxi and hackney drivers are going out of business due to the unaffordability of insurance and this in turn limits the ability of elderly people and people with disabilities to get around. Some people are completely dependent on taxi and hackney services for mobility.

We have also seen significant increases being imposed on road hauliers. Motor insurance is mandatory; it is a legal requirement and is not avoidable. It acts as a flat charge in that it takes no account of ability to pay and as such, it affects the struggling classes more, including older people, young workers and families. High insurance costs have a disproportionate effect on such people. Spiralling business and motor insurance costs are undermining businesses. In particular, increases in public and employer liability insurance are having a very negative effect on businesses in the services sector like hotels and restaurants. I urge the Minister of State to start taking action on this matter.

Deputy James Lawless

I want to focus on the costs to businesses in an already difficult environment, particularly businesses in towns in rural and regional Ireland. Businesses in our towns are already under huge pressure on a number of fronts because society has changed. In particular, how we shop has changed, as have our demographics and our use of technology. People now purchase more goods online, they commute longer distances and often pick up their groceries on the way home. People engage in commercial activities in very different ways now so town centres and once thriving traditional market towns are struggling. Businesses in town centres also have to contend with the difficulties caused by planning decisions which have led to the development of out-of-town centres and satellite centres. This drives people out of the town centres and away from traditional businesses.

The issue of commercial rates has been well debated in this House recently. In my county of Kildare we witnessed a huge commercial rate re-evaluation in recent months at the most inappropriate time, just as the country is coming out of recession and into some form of putative recovery. Businesses are being kicked again, just when they were beginning to get back on their feet, by rates increases of between 300% and 400%. In many cases, these increases are not linked in any way to an ability to pay, turnover or profitability. Coupled with that, retail theft remains a huge issue. The issues of crime, vagrancy and the lack of gardaí as well as old-fashioned daylight robbery are unfortunately features of my constituency of Kildare North, where we have the lowest number of gardaí per head of population. Businesses are being hit again and again and have almost become resigned to it at this stage, having been held up time and again. Brexit and the uncertainty that it brings has also been mentioned in this debate. All these issues underscore why insurance costs are so pivotal in keeping the door open for many traditional, bricks and mortar, small businesses on the main streets of our towns. These factors in combination mean that their competitiveness is taking a hammering. They are trying to trade in the face of online and other forms of competition and are finding it increasingly difficult to keep the door open.

I urge the Minister of State to take on board the detailed motion tabled by my colleague, Deputy Michael McGrath, which contains some excellent points. This issue needs urgent attention. I heard the Minister of State on "Morning Ireland" dealing with some of these issues and gamely trying to avoid dealing with other issues, which he succeeded in doing. It is a very important motion which I commend to the House.

Deputy Mary Butler

In tabling this motion, Fianna Fáil wishes to highlight the crippling costs of insurance for home owners, individuals and businesses. Motor insurance costs are putting immense pressure on households and businesses and for many SMEs, insurance costs have risen by 15% or more. Motor insurance premiums are still on the rise despite assurances from the Government that people would see premiums start to fall as we progress through 2017. While there are early signs of stability in the market, many worried motorists are still contacting me. I was contacted by a taxi driver from Tramore who was setting up a new business, providing the first wheelchair accessible taxi in the lovely seaside town of Tramore, County Waterford. He got an insurance quote for €10,500, which almost put him out of business. This man got up and set up a business but his insurance costs amount to €200 per week, before he pays back any of his car loan or puts a drop of diesel into his vehicle. The cost of insurance is having a huge effect on small businesses.

I would also like to point out that insurance costs are causing enormous difficulties for young people and I say that on the basis of personal experience. My 24 year old son had a budget for a car and insurance of €5,000. Unfortunately, as insurance cost €2,000, his car had to cost €3,000.

If the insurance policy had cost €1,000, he would have been able to buy a car for €4,000. The budget was there, but the cost of insurance determined the type of car he could buy. That is exactly what we are listening to day in and day out. Insurance companies do not want to insure younger or older drivers or taxi drivers. They certainly do not to insure anyone with an older car. That is making it very difficult. An open market is needed to ensure fairness for all. We have constantly highlighted the need for action by the Government at policy and legislative levels. The Minister of State urgently needs to review the action points which should have been completed by now. I ask him to do this. I compliment my colleague on bringing this issue to the fore. We are living with it day in and day out. As I said, one appreciates the scale of the problem when one meets someone who tried to open a small business and insurance costs almost caused him or her to fail before he or she even started.

Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Deputy Eoghan Murphy)

I thank Deputies for their contributions to the debate. I thank Deputy Michael McGrath for tabling the motion and thereby giving Deputies the opportunity to highlight the examples being raised with them by their constituents every day. I thank the Deputies who helped us to gather information when we were putting together our report in the second half of last year. The Government will oppose the motion not because we do not understand the genuine concerns of constituents but because the motion suggests nothing is being done. That is unfair, given the amount of work that has been happening across many Departments for quite some time. As an elected representative, I receive emails just like every other Deputy. Ever since I took on this role, I have been receiving emails from all over the country. We know that something needs to be done in this regard and that is exactly what we are trying to do.

Deputy Frank O'Rourke spoke about the data received from the CSO. We discussed this issue recently in the Dáil Chamber. The statistics are relevant and we have to pay attention to them. In the past five months we have seen no increase in motor insurance premiums. In the past year we have seen a decrease, but that is not to suggest people are not still experiencing increases in their insurance premiums. We know that they are. Equally, I am not suggesting there is a direct correlation between the publication of the report earlier this year and the reforms under way as a result and the stabilisation in the insurance market. As a result of the work done in the past 12 months by Deputies Michael McGrath, Pearse Doherty and Sean Sherlock and their party colleagues - by all Members of this House, together with the Government - to draw attention to this issue, to find out exactly why this had come to pass and to set out a roadmap for the reforms to be introduced and as a result of the clarity being driven by that work, there is an understanding among the public at large, within the industry and among the vested interests in this area that change needs to happen. It is clear from the reforms we are seeing that welcome change is happening. I accept Deputy Michael McGrath's point that we do not have the data we need for employer's liability and public liability insurance. That is something we need to fix.

Co-operation is very important in dealing with this issue which, as we all know, is complex. It is recognised in the Oireachtas committee's report and ours that there is no single silver bullet that will fix the problem. We know that it cannot be solved overnight. However, there is a comprehensive suite of reforms that can be actioned. It is important to emphasise that we cannot give false hope to our constituents when they contact us by saying we are going to fix it immediately. That would not be a responsible approach to this complex issue. As Deputy Danny Healy-Rae pointed out, we need competition in the market. We need a stable, properly functioning and competitive market if we are to drive down prices and ensure people in areas of business where they cannot get cover will be able to get it in the future. It is important to bear that in mind as we work to address this issue. While the clarity and sense of purpose we have shown in working together have been helpful, we risk undermining them if we are not careful in how we work together into the future as we implement these reforms.

I dispute Deputy Dara Calleary's suggestion there has been a lack of urgency on the part of the Government. Last year, when we set up the working group and began working on our reforms, we had subgroups meeting every week across the Government to look at the different areas that needed to be reformed. When people were dissatisfied because our report was not due until December, we made a commitment to bring forward emerging recommendations by the end of October to help to inform the Oireachtas committee's report. We met that commitment. When we committed to quarterly reporting beginning later this year, the Taoiseach and the Oireachtas committee asked us to bring it forward and we did. Prior to that, we produced an interim report before our quarterly report in order that when I appeared before the Oireachtas committee, as I did on a number of occasions, it had as much information as I had. This facilitated a proper and constructive debate on these matters and enabled the committee to hold me to account in line with my role as the Minister of State with responsibility for this area. We have brought transparency to the process in the way we have built the report. We have set out clear timelines. We have said which party will be responsible for implementing the various elements and actions mentioned in the report. Where there are delays - I will come to them - we have signalled them. Rather than saying "we will do this in a year" and then apologising a year later when it was not achieved and saying "we will do it soon", we have said quarter by quarter what steps will be taken. We have put in place a traffic light reporting system to enable people to see in advance where delays might happen and allow us to work on fixing them.

I ask the Deputies who have claimed that work is not being done to look at the detail in the first quarterly report which states what is happening on each of the 33 recommendations. The report we published in January set out 71 actions, 40 of which are to be completed this year. That means that most of the recommendations will be acted on this year. Ten actions were due for completion in the first quarterly report, but there have been delays in three areas. We are working to address these delays, one of which will be fixed imminently, while work to fix the other two is ongoing. We hope to address them before the end of the second quarter. The Personal Injuries Commission which has been mentioned by a number of Deputies as one of the most important areas in the first quarterly report is already up and running and doing good and important work. Good progress is being made with the national claims information database, another key element of our efforts to have transparency on what exactly is happening in the claims and insurance market. We can take comfort from it.

I have been asked to speed up our work in areas such as the uninsured database. We have to be very careful in that regard. The last time an effort was made to implement an uninsured database, it failed because it is not easy to get the right data into the right system and make them easily accessible to An Garda Síochána. While we see the urgency in doing this, we have to proceed with caution to make sure we get it right and do not make a mistake that will ultimately make the system fatally flawed. If we cause this proposal to be put back on the shelf, we might end up three years down the line with nothing to show for our endeavours.

It has been suggested we have moved too slowly in the past year. I have spoken about the urgency I have attached to incremental reporting on the work we have been doing. It is important to recognise that we produced our report a few weeks after the Oireachtas committee had produced its report. We had to do an added piece of work - we had to include an action plan with timelines to identify the responsible actors and get buy-in from them. That is the responsibility of the Government. We have done that. I remind those who have said this should be done more quickly that we have prepared a detailed report which runs to over 100 pages and that we have done serious work on the timelines. We recognise that work needs to be done in a number of areas at the same time. I ask Deputies not to say we should do this more quickly. As we have laid out in our report, we have had to resolve detailed issues in addressing the national claims information database. How could we have done it more quickly? I remind the House that other work needs to be done by the actors involved, including the Central Bank, across their various priority areas. It is important that we make constructive contributions when we are talking about doing things more quickly. Those who want things to be done more quickly are proposing in the motion before the House that more burdens be added to our work in new areas. We have to recognise that significant resources are being invested across government to get this work done.

We began our work on employer's and public liability insurance which is incredibly important at the start of this year. It is important to recognise that a number of the reforms in the motor insurance area, such as those relating to the claims awards being made in the courts, are already being worked on by the Personal Injuries Commission and will feed into the reforms on employer's and public liability insurance. I have been consulting stakeholders in this area, including hoteliers. Deputy Tom Neville and others have brought detailed concrete information from their constituencies to help us to gain a proper understanding of this area. We have consulted hoteliers, IBEC, ISME, RGDATA, Chambers Ireland and the Health and Safety Authority. We have also received submissions from the IFA. We are, therefore, aware of the complicated issues in this area. I am worried about the increases in the excess figure being taken on by individual businesses. I am very worried about the trend towards self-insurance. I know that some businesses are withdrawing from particular parts of their activities. For example, a hotel might take out a disco from its offering because it cannot afford the insurance. This undermines the total offering of such businesses.

We have received great information from businesses on what they believe is happening in respect of fraudulent claims and are trying to get harder data. As we seek proper solutions in this area, we are going to encounter some serious constitutional issues in areas such as the Statute of Limitations and the burden of proof that has to be put on a business if it is to be possible for it to successfully defend a claim against it. If a claim is made at the very end of the Statute of Limitations period of two years, a business might not have the necessary CCTV footage to hand, or it might not be able to contact its former employees who dealt with the issue at the time. We have to try to address these issues, but it will not be easy. It would not be responsible for me to say we will be able to get on top of the employer's and public liability aspects of this issue in the morning. Constitutional issues require serious consultation across the House in conjunction with the Attorney General. We are potentially looking at trying to get difficult legislation through the House. We need to make sure businesses can avail of more competition in the market. We know that people are moving out of particular areas in a way that is fundamentally undermining the operation of their businesses into the future.

The practice of insurance companies using non-disclosure where it would have no bearing on a decision by an insurer to price cover at a particular level is raised in the motion. I agree that it is unacceptable for it to be used as the sole purpose for avoiding payment. Deputy Pearse Doherty has proposed some very constructive legislation in this area. We want to work on it, but it is a resource issue. We need to get to it at the right time in the committee in order that we can deal with it in an effective manner and see it through.

Regarding the timelines within which we hope to report on the next phase of employer's and public liability insurance cost reforms, I want to provide as much clarity as I can, but we are reviewing what we hope to do. The intention at the beginning of the year was to have an addendum to the motor insurance report because so many issues crossed from the area of motor insurance into employer's and public liability insurance. I have had an addendum published to the existing report, but increasingly as we work on the issue of employer's and public liability insurance, we see further areas in the motor insurance sector on which we want to update data. It might be the case that in September this year we will bring forward a more comprehensive report with new parts on employer's and public liability insurance. Because I anticipate some significant legal and constitutional issues in the near term, I hope in July to give a very clear indication of the direction I would like to take and go to the Oireachtas committee to get its support in order that we can go about addressing these issues as quickly as we can.

Deputy Lisa Chambers has spoken about the fact that her motor insurance premium is more expensive now than when she started to drive ten years ago. We must recognise that in the early 2000s premiums were unsustainably low. It was a failure of the business model at the time and we are now dealing with its correction. We need to move away from these super cycles in which insurance cover is priced too low and then too high. That is part of the work we are doing. Good work has already been done in that regard when we consider the solvency II related legislation.

I will shortly be appearing before the Oireachtas committee when I would like to go into more detail on the issues raised in the quarterly report and return to some of the questions raised in this debate.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Eugene Murphy)

I thank the Minister of State for his co-operation. Fianna Fáil Deputies Aindrias Moynihan, Anne Rabbitte, Declan Breathnach and Robert Troy are sharing the final speaking slot.

Deputy Aindrias Moynihan

I have repeatedly raised in this House the issue of the spiralling cost of motor and household insurance, which costs are crippling household budgets. Action needs to be taken to address them to take the financial pressure off households. We have seen car insurance premiums rise for no apparent reason. People who own a car that is more than ten years old have struggled to have it insured. Returning emigrants who may have driven in Australia or Britain where motorists drive on the same side of the road as we do have also seen a dramatic increase in their motor insurance premiums.

There is a complete lack of competition in the insurance market in seeking cover for vans and motorbikes. Elderly drivers are being pushed out of the motor insurance market purely because of their age. They are almost being forced to stop driving which would have a dramatic impact on an older person's life. The number of people who have been declined insurance cover has increased dramatically from 178 in 2012 to 1,914 last year. This morning I spoke to a constituent in Cork who had moved house across his estate and was parking his car on the opposite side of the same green and who had seen his motor insurance premium increase from €900 to €1,200.

Last summer Fianna Fáil brought forward a similar motion with constructive proposals to address spiralling insurance costs. It was six months before the working group came forward with many of the same proposals. Clear targets were set, with 40 to be met this year. However, the quarter one report shows that three of the ten action points have not been finalised. That does not show a lack of urgency but that the Government was coming late to addressing the issue and that it has fallen behind. It needs to show more urgency to drive forward on the issue to which it is coming late. Businesses are also falling behind, but I will leave it to my colleagues to address that aspect. The Government needs to show greater urgency and support for families by driving down insurance costs.

Deputy Anne Rabbitte

I thank Deputy Michael McGrath for bringing forward the motion and giving us the opportunity to highlight the issue. I listened to the Minister of State intently. In part, the motion was brought forward to enable us as an Opposition party to do our duty by holding the Government to account as the insurance business affects people's lives. The cost of insurance impacts on households, individuals and businesses and is crippling people. As Deputy Eugene Murphy said, it is impacting on people who are going out to work and those living in rural Ireland.

When Deputy Michael McGrath tabled the motion last week, I put it up on Facebook. It is one of the few political motions I have posted and it received traction it Australia among emigrants who were thinking of returning home. They have received insurance quotes of approximately €5,800. There are skill shortages across the country and they have skills we need. We are targeting them, but they are focusing on what would it cost them to re-establish themselves here and the cost of insurance is a factor.

The Minister of State spoke about meeting those involved in the sector. A few months ago I spoke about a business located on the banks of the River Shannon. It involves a pub and a restaurant. Last year it received an insurance quote of €7,500. Because it had made a small claim, it was unable to get a quote elsewhere. There are only three providers in the market who will provide this insurance cover, as the Minister of State is well aware. The premium increased from €7,500 to €50,000 which following long discussions the business had reduced to €15,500.

It is not acceptable for the Minister of State to reject the motion merely because we are holding the Government to account. Three out of ten action points have not yet been completed. It is our role as an Opposition party to hold the Government to account. We told the people that we would be a voice for them and I was hoping we could all continue to work together.

Deputy Declan Breathnach

I have not come into the House to be repetitive. My colleagues, led by Deputy Michael McGrath, have clearly highlighted the crippling effect of rising home, motor and business insurance costs, together with the undermining of our competitiveness. I wish to refer specifically to the undue pressure placed on community groups and the voluntary officer boards associated with them. Most Deputies have had some involvement with voluntary and community organisations throughout Ireland and will know first-hand about the issues to which I will refer.

I was glad when the case taken by a hillwalker in County Wicklow against the Office of Public Works was thrown out of court. There are increasing worries and concerns about the litigious nature of society which is affecting football clubs, Tidy Town groups, scout and guide groups, just to mention a few, all of which have been impacted on by the extortionate and exorbitant hike in insurance costs. People fear that the risks for organisations are too great and, as a consequence, are becoming concerned about the level of their personal exposure. The Public Participatory Network, PPN, which represents the community and voluntary sector in each local authority area, is seriously concerned about the exposure of voluntary organisations because of the risk involved in terms of personal liability, particularly in properties such as community halls, on playing pitches and in various other places. I highlight the fact that many of these excellent voluntary organisations are picking up the slack for many Departments. Tidy Town groups are a case in point. In these instances the cost of public liability insurance should be covered by public bodies where works are agreed to with local authorities to enhance the environment and properties generally in the charge of local authorities. Insurance costs have become so prohibitive for community employment and other public schemes that the employers, namely, community employment and Pobal management committees which are voluntary are finding themselves with depleted and, in many instances, no surplus funds to manage valuable projects.

Deputy Robert Troy

I compliment Deputy Michael McGrath on bringing forward the motion. To be fair to him, he has championed this issue for many years both inside and outside the House. The contributions highlight the seriousness of the issue and the geographical spread of the Deputies raising the issue shows that it is not isolated to one particular pocket of the country.

I acknowledge that the Government established a working group late last year to examine the issue, but it was late in coming to the game and acknowledging the problem in the insurance market. As a party, we published recommendations early last year and the main difference between our recommendations and those of the working group is that ours were made approximately 12 months earlier.

Listening to the concluding remarks of the Minister of State and to him on Radio 1 earlier, he seemed somewhat content that the figures of the Central Statistics Office, CSO, showed that renewal premiums were static. That is not good enough.

It is welcome that premiums are static but it comes on the back of an increase of 11% in 2014, of over 30% in 2015 and 12% in 2016. The progress report for the first quarter of this year indicates that three of the ten items have yet to be fully implemented. The Minister of State indicated the working group involving owners of small public vehicles has yet to meet and I understand the taxi federation has not been invited to such a meeting. It is critical those people are invited to that meeting.

The Minister of State has heard many examples from my colleagues and I could add to them. There is a lady with 20 years of claims-free driving who has seen her insurance go from €400 to approximately €800. I know a man who drives a van as the second family vehicle. The family is into sports such as triathlons, and it has bikes and surfboards. He cannot get insurance for the van because it is not being operated commercially. We have seen insurance for companies increase by a huge amount over the past number of months and years. The recommendations are there and the Minister of State has said he wants us to acknowledge that he has established this group. He will not acknowledge that he is not affording this the priority it deserves.

The Minister of State asks what can we do faster. We know the minority Government in this Dáil means there is a lack of legislation going through this Oireachtas over the past year. Why not prioritise the legislation that will give effect to proposals in this report. The Minister of State argues we cannot give false hope to constituents, and we should not do so, but we should say to them that while we cannot decrease premiums this year, we will accelerate the recommendations in the report and the legislative proposals arising from it to ensure that next year, they will not be crippled by the high cost of insurance. The Minister of State has sat on his hands for too long. I ask him to accept this Private Members' motion in the spirit in which we put it forward.

Question put.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Eugene Murphy)

In accordance with Standing Order 70(2), the division is postponed until the weekly division time on Thursday, 18 May 2017.