Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 17 Feb 2022

Vol. 1018 No. 3

Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Deputy Pearse Doherty

Cé go bhfuil sé soiléir dúinn uilig faoin am seo go bhfuil géarchéim mhillteanach ann maidir le costais mhaireachtála, níl clue ag an Rialtas cé chomh holc agus atá rudaí. Tá sé ag déanamh neamhaird ar theaghlaigh agus ar oibrithe atá ag streachailt amuigh ansin. Ní hamháin sin, leis an fhírinne a insint tá sé ag déanamh rudaí níos measa. Tá costais fuinnimh agus teasa ag ardú leo agus tá an Rialtas ag cur pionóis orthu siúd atá ag fulaingt le cáin charbóin agus níl ciall ar bith leis seo. Workers and families face a cost of living crisis. Rising prices are reducing the living standard for low and middle income households and many families are being forced to make choices they simply should not be making. Those choices include cutting the amount of food they buy, whether to turn on the heat or for some it is even both of those.

Figures released by the Central Statistics Office today show that prices have increased by 5% in the last year and as I have repeatedly said to the Minister and other Ministers, inflation does not affect everybody equally. Lower and middle income households spend more of their money heating and lighting their homes than those on the top do. The measures the Government came forward with last week abjectly failed to meet the needs of those many families. For example, the Government handed out the same level of support to millionaires as it did to low and middle income households through the electricity credit. It will spend €12 million to give financial support to over 60,000 holiday homes. This makes no sense. Sinn Féin proposed a package of measures that would have been more focused and that would have offered greater support to those in low and middle income households. It would have done so through, for example, a direct cost of living cash payment, as has been done elsewhere. However, the Government did not listen and it simply would not go there.

Today’s figures show that electricity has gone up by 22% in the past year. The price of gas has gone up by 28% and, staggeringly, the price of home heating oil has gone up by over 50% in the past year and it is continuing to rise. This is the method one third of the population uses to heat their homes and two thirds of the population in the Border region of Cavan, Monaghan, Donegal, Sligo, Leitrim and Louth use home heating oil to keep themselves warm at night. Despite soaring energy prices, this Government is determined to increase those prices further with a hike in the carbon tax coming into effect on 1 May. The Government needs to get a grip on this and come to planet Earth and to where people really are. So many people are struggling, every euro counts and every single bit makes a difference. Pushing ahead with the carbon tax is wrong, it lacks common sense and it should not go ahead.

The measures announced by the Government last week were criticised, not just by Sinn Féin and the Opposition but by the Society of St. Vincent de Paul, the lone parent organisation One Family Ireland, Social Justice Ireland and many more. More importantly, they were criticised by ordinary people who know what it feels like to have a Government that is ignoring them and does not get where they are at. All of those comments were valid. At the same time we have the bizarre comments of the Taoiseach warning that increasing the disposable income of struggling families risks making matters worse. Could the Government be more out of touch? The Tánaiste is calling on the ESB to act in a way that many recognise will damage our economy and threaten jobs. The Government needs to wake up, get real and understand what is happening out there to ordinary workers and families. Will the Government cancel the planned hike in the carbon tax which is due in May and will it introduce targeted measures to support workers and families to deal with the cost of living increases?

Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications (Deputy Eamon Ryan)

We are introducing targeted measures; that is exactly what we did last week. A 20% reduction in public transport fares is targeted and real and will affect people every day. It will be introduced at the end of April and that will make a real difference to people’s everyday lives and their cost of living. The Deputy is right that people are exposed to these high fossil fuel prices, which are due to international factors and it is a signal that we have to rid ourselves of our dependency on that. An 80% grant to put in attic and wall insulation, which could be done quickly, is the best approach and the best targeting. That cuts the average energy bill by about 25% and combats the price increases we are suffering because of international factors and that is real. It improves health, homes and addresses the issue.

I fundamentally disagree with the Deputy and with Sinn Féin’s position on this because the measures we are introducing are socially progressive. There is no other tax like carbon tax in that the Department of Finance has guaranteed that we will give all of it back to the people and that it does not go into the Exchequer. Some 30% of it goes to increasing social welfare provision, which brings about real and targeted improvements for those most in need. This includes those on the living alone allowance, qualified child allowance and fuel allowance, which target the poorest. In the last two budgets when we have done that the Economic and Social Research Institute, ESRI, and others have done immediate and detailed analysis showing that it is progressive and that those on the poorer side of our society benefit most. The other 55% is going to improve people’s homes, while cutting emissions. If the Deputy is asking what planet we are living on it is the one we want to protect, the one we want to stop burning and the one where we do not just talk about climate change but do something about it.

No alternative funding is being presented for that sum of €9 billion. Where would we get the money? Where would that €9 billion we will get through this mechanism and give back to our people to protect them come from? What other spending would be cut instead of that or would Sinn Féin stop providing the grants? Would we not provide the 80% grant or the increase in the fuel allowance? Those are the questions I have to put back to the Deputy. This is not easy or particularly popular but it is the right thing to do for social justice as well as for environmental protection and I am convinced of that. If there is an alternative I would love for the Deputy to come back and say Sinn Féin would raise the €9 billion somewhere else. That would be a good debate and then we could have a real analysis.

To say that this is the source of the problem is incorrect. The source of the problem is our reliance on fossil fuels and the damage they are doing to our immediate health as well as threatening the future of our children on this planet. We have no choice but to respond to that by acting now in a quick way and with a just transition. I am convinced by this approach, which has been analysed by academics for decades, which says this is the way to do it, to give the signal but protect people at the same time. We will do it again next year - increase fuel allowance and increase the social welfare package and that will continue to be beneficial in helping those who need those supports most. That is targeting and that is the right approach. What is the alternative? Where would the money come from? It cannot be an easy answer that everything comes from general taxation. That means we might have to cut spending in health, education or social welfare and I do not want to do that.

Deputy Pearse Doherty

I agree with the Minister that the Government is targeting and its targets are ordinary workers and families and that is the problem. The Minister may shake his head but I will say this. Despite the fact that the cost of home heating oil has increased by over 50%, the Government’s decision is to increase it further on 1 May. Despite the fact that the cost of gas has gone up 28%, the Government will bump it up further on 1 May. That makes no sense and that suggests to me that the Government does not get it.

The Minister asks what the alternative is. To abandon the increase in the carbon tax in May would cost €32 million. The Minister and his Cabinet colleagues in government signed off on a cut in the bankers' levy to the tune of €63 million this year. That is where the alternative funding would be but that requires being on the right side of workers and families instead of being on the side of the bankers. The Minister can stand there and justify to me why the Government will take an additional €32 million out of the pockets of these families, which are already crucified by high energy and home heating costs and at the same time give double that amount of cuts to banks in this State. There are always options but the Government has to be on the right side and it has to get where people are at. After hearing what the Minister has said in the last four minutes I am convinced that he does not understand where people are at in the here and now. I ask him again to come forward with a package that deals with what the Society of St. Vincent de Paul, the lone parents organisation and Social Justice Ireland are saying and meets the needs of so many people are struggling. The Government should stop making things worse.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

I have the greatest respect for Sinn Féin. We have worked together collectively over the years, so this robust argument is done out of respect. What I have to know is: what is Sinn Féin's position on this? It keeps changing. It says it would stop any increases in the carbon tax now. It will agree to the carbon tax increases that have occurred previously because it knows that is central to the ability of any Government, including a future Government, to pay for the things we need. However, it keeps changing. It is always, "Okay, we will stop it now". Either this is the right approach or it is the wrong one. I believe it is the right approach.

There is one further category, that last element of 15% which is €1.5 billion. We are targeting that for small farmers. If one looks at the poverty map of our country and at who gets least-----

Deputy Pearse Doherty

The Minister asked for an alternative and I gave him one - the bank levy.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

-----who pays most and who are most at risk, that €1.5 billion will be very important for that community. That is why I stand up for it. I still do not have a clear understanding of where the Deputy says the money would come from in a real way, if not in this way.

Deputy Pearse Doherty

I just explained it to the Minister. He just does not want to make the choices. He is on the wrong side of this argument. Jesus Christ-----

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Thank you, Deputy. I call Deputy Kelly.

Deputy Alan Kelly

NPHET is meeting today to consider what will happen with mandatory mask wearing. For many people this will be a welcome sign that we are leaving the pandemic behind us. However, many unions representing workers in transport and retail, particularly Mandate Trade Union and the National Bus and Rail Union, NBRU, have concerns. Ms Patricia King, general secretary of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions, ICTU, has called for the rules to be kept for a short period. As the Minister knows, there will be a lot of anxiety for staff and people who are vulnerable. This will impact especially on those considering using trains, buses and other forms of public transport. Encouraging people back onto public transport is essential to meet our climate targets. Emissions were up 11% at the end of September compared with 2020. What advice does the Minister for Transport have for people concerned about mask rules on public transport being changed?

As part of the budget, €25 million was announced to cut fares in half for young people between 19 and 23 years old. The Labour Party called for the fares to be free but, in fairness, the Government met us half way. This will make a real difference for young people struggling with the cost of living and will encourage lifelong use of public transport. However, when will it be a reality? Was no work done in advance of the budget to get this in place or was it thrown in at the last minute? All we are being told is that it will be mid-2022. When exactly will it be put in place? Has the Minister given a deadline to have this delivered? My colleague, Deputy Nash, uncovered this week that there are no plans yet to provide this youth fare reduction on commercial buses. The Budget Statement said quite clearly that this would apply across the transport network. Many young people, especially in rural areas, will not have access to cheaper fares because they will not be available. No timeline could be provided by the Minister to Deputy Nash as regards when this will be in place.

With more people working remotely or part-time in the office after the pandemic, there is also still no flexi-taxsaver ticket in place to reflect the changed work practices. When will that be delivered? There is much talk about tackling the cost of living, but a concrete measure that would encourage more people to use public transport and reduce costs is delayed. The Minister made a lot of announcements and I have outlined many of them. However, we are getting very little about definitive dates for when the measures in respect of public transport will be implemented. Again, a 20% reduction in fares was announced last week as part of the cost-of-living package. However, we hear that it will not come into force until May. If the Government is serious about encouraging more people to use public transport, these proposals would be a priority.

What is the Minister's and the Government's position on mask wearing on public transport and in retail settings for workers who have concerns? When will the half-price youth travel card be ready?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Thank you, Deputy.

Deputy Alan Kelly

Will the Minister ensure that commercial transport operators are covered? When will the flexi-taxsaver ticket be introduced? When will the 20% fare reduction announced recently also be introduced?

Deputy Eamon Ryan

As the Deputy said, NPHET is meeting today and it will issue a letter to the Minister for Health, Deputy Stephen Donnelly. I look forward to seeing its advice. My view, which I am happy to share, is that we should start immediately by removing the requirement for schoolchildren to wear masks in school. It was introduced for good public health reasons, but there are also good reasons for them not having to wear masks, for the health of children in a wider context. I hope that can be done straight away.

I have the same view with regard to retail and public transport. I believe we should go from a mandatory system towards a public health guidance to continue to wear masks. It makes good public health sense. I would advise anyone to continue with it for the immediate future because we still have Covid-19 at quite a scale. However, the time for mandatory conditions is part of the unwinding. I will listen and heed. Obviously, we will take NPHET's views into account, but my view is that we should further the loosening of the restrictions in place. I listen with respect to the teachers unions and the public transport and bus workers unions, but my view is that while I expect the vast majority of people will continue to wear masks for the immediate future, we should not continue it as a mandatory system.

We want people back on public transport. The numbers are back to about 60% of pre-Covid levels. It varies across the country. The long-distance commuting numbers are not back. It will be no surprise to hear that. Some of the regional cities' numbers are back. Some of the new services in Louth and Navan and some of the other services are up way beyond what the expectations were. The cost-of-living measure introduced last week of cutting public transport fares by 20% was not just for cost-of-living reasons, urgent as they are, it was also to try to give public transport a boost at this time, so we will not see the road space taken up by people going back to cars. We want to encourage people back onto public transport. It is safe and we want to get the numbers back up.

I had a meeting last week with the chief executive officers of Dublin Bus, Bus Éireann, Irish Rail and the National Transport Authority, NTA, to impress on them the need for us to be quick on this. The end of April is the timeline I was hoping would see both the introduction of the new 50% reduction in youth travel fares and the 20% reduction in the public service obligation, PSO, public transport measures. The CEOs say, and they are the experts in the area, that it typically takes six, eight or ten weeks to change all the ticketing machines and all the tariffs. I told them we have to do it and that I want them to do it by the end of April. They assured me they will do everything to deliver it in that timeframe.

It is more difficult with the commercial operators because we do not set, monitor or regulate their fares in the same way. That presents a significant difficulty in how we implement both the PSO and the youth travel card.

Deputy Alan Kelly

I asked the Minister a number of questions. He outlined what his view is before taking NPHET advice regarding mask wearing. I am saying out straight that many workers have a deep concern there, particularly in transport and retail.

I know there are problems with introducing new technology in the public transport system. I had to clean up a mess that lasted eight and a half years, under the last Government involving the Green Party and the previous Fianna Fáil Government, in respect of the Leap card and finally introduce it. There is always a lead time with changes in technology, and I understand that. However, the Minister has given us various different dates and commitments regarding the four schemes I mentioned.

As regards commercial services, I am one of the people who opposes this urban-rural divide. The Minister has to deliver as much for commercial services and for providers who are operating in rural areas as in urban areas. If he wants people to use public transport in rural areas, as he keeps saying, he will have to deliver for them on timelines as well.

Finally, the Minister did not give a commitment on when the flexi-taxsaver travel ticket will be delivered. Everybody needs to be able to use that as well, given their changing working conditions and times.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

I ran out of time before I was able to answer that question. I agree with the Deputy that the transformation of public transport has to be for the whole country. We could introduce a new flexi-ticket within the urban Dublin area, for example, very quickly because we have the Leap card and the swipe-on, swipe-off on the Luas. The difficulty is that we do not have that with the longer distance commuting services. I have to listen to the reality that the officials meet, which is that they have a difficulty in adapting when they do not have that swipe-on, swipe-off facility in the rural train or bus stations. Similarly, I believe rural public transport will be key. The Connecting Ireland new rural public transport system will also be key. However, I have to be honest with the Deputy. We have to face the reality before us. We do not regulate those non-PSO services.

We do not monitor or manage those non-PSO services or have control as to how they manage cash or other ticket systems. This presents real difficulties which we are looking to resolve. It will not be done in the same timeframe or as quickly or as easily as we can on the PSO services where we do have these systems in place.

Deputy Noel Grealish

When I last raised the issue of the N6 Galway city ring road with the Minister on Leaders' Questions on 25 May 2021 I highlighted the plight of the 54 families and individuals who were to lose their homes to make way for the road. I sought a commitment from the Minister that once a decision was made by An Bord Pleanála to go ahead with the project that top priority would be given to putting in place a scheme, without delay and regardless of subsequent legal or judicial challenge, to enter into negotiation with any householder affected by this who wished to sell and move on but was caught in limbo. Not all householders want to sell. Some are willing to wait until the process is complete.

The Minister expressed sympathy for the plight of these people whose lives have been put on hold for the past seven years since the preferred route for the current ring road plan was published back in 2015. Since then, the owners of 44 homes to be demolished and a further ten homes to be bought to facilitate the ring road project have been caught in limbo. They cannot sell a house pencilled for demolition. This meant neither could they move on with their lives and set up a new home elsewhere.

The Minister promised that subject to a decision of approval he would encourage Galway County Council through its negotiation strategy to assist these householders who have been affected. He said he understood that Galway County Council had already established and advanced the negotiation strategy for the road project. He stated all affected householders were invited to participate and he encouraged Galway County Council as I have outlined. He also stated the Government would do everything it could in this regard to assist the householders who have been affected.

The decision in favour of the Galway city ring road has been made by An Bord Pleanála. While three High Court actions have been taken challenging the decision, we cannot leave these homeowners linger in limbo for years. The most recent proposal would mean a total of 14 years. They deserve to be allowed to try to move on with their lives. The time for this is now. Will the Minister put in place a scheme to facilitate the householders who want to sell and move on and not leave them hanging on for years and years to come while the legal challenges are taking place?

Deputy Eamon Ryan

I thank Deputy Grealish. He has been raising this issue privately and publicly consistently with me over the past two years. He has raised a very valid concern for the 54 families in a very difficult position. I absolutely understand and see the argument in the case he is making on their behalf. This is a controversial project that has been long delayed like many other transport projects in the country. It is particularly sensitive with regard to habitat issues and climate issues. Three cases for judicial review have been taken. I understand these are due to a variety of interests, including local property interests and the climate issue regarding the particular project. It is not possible to take the course the Deputy suggests because the High Court has issued a stay against any such action by Galway City Council. By order of the court, it is not possible to progress with what we would presume would be a compulsory purchase order system. This is a High Court decision. We are all subject to these. It will have to work itself out. The process has to be allowed to take its course. In the interim, I encourage the local authority to engage with the householders so that subject to the issues being resolved they can act quickly. It is not a significant sum. For the householders, it is a hugely important issue. Their engagement with the council may at least shorten the process, depending on what the final outcome will be. We cannot ignore an order of the High Court. It would not be appropriate or right. We have to await the outcome of it.

The project still has to go through a business case to be prepared and presented to the Government. Our process for assessing projects is very long and drawn out. We would all agree it is in need of reform and shortening. The whole issue of planning concerns and consent needs to be reformed. The Attorney General is doing this. It is important we retain central to it protection for the environment and support the rights of those who want to do this and protection for the ability of people to develop and for the State to be able to act in introducing infrastructure. We have to get the balance right. Our current systems are not fit for purpose. Our planning laws are not working well. This is why the Attorney General is engaged in major reform. This will not help these particular householders out of the difficult position they are in. Anything we can do we will do but it has to be within the law.

Deputy Noel Grealish

I have to say I am very disappointed in the response of the Minister. It is not for me to be disappointed but for the 54 householders caught up in this. This legal challenge could go on for years. The last time it went on for more than seven and a half years. Eight householders were caught in the previous project. This has been going on for more than 22 years. Is the Minister telling me these 54 householders have to sit and wait until a judicial review has taken place before they can sell a house? Many of these people are moving on in years. They want to downsize. They want to leave a bit of money to their children or grandchildren. They cannot sell the biggest asset they have. The Minister is telling them to sit at home and wait until this whole process has been complete. I will not accept this. That is wrong. That is not fair on the 54 householders. Nobody in this House would like to be affected whereby they could not sell their properties on the open market because nobody would buy it due to a decision by the Department that it wants to put a ring road around Galway. I ask the Minister please to intervene personally and deal with TII and bring forward some scheme to give a bit of comfort to these householders who want to sell and move on.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

It is not my intention to push through this scheme in this way. We have to follow the law that protects all our people in the long run. If we start ignoring orders of the High Court-----

Deputy Noel Grealish

We change the law in here.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

We do. We are engaged in a process whereby we are looking at how we reform the law. This is probably one of the most important projects we have to do now for the sake of everyone in the country. It takes a certain period of time. This process will not be concluded until the end of this year. Any new planning legislation would take time to go through the House before it would be law. In the interim we have to do everything we can to help any householder caught, as these households are, in a very unfortunate situation. As I have said, I would encourage Galway County Council to engage with them so at least they have an idea, subject to other matters being resolved, of what the final outcome would be. In the interim they are caught in a difficult situation. I fully accept the Deputy's point that for them it is particularly difficult and troublesome.

Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice

The Minister and I sat together on the Opposition benches a few years ago and had many a chat about agriculture, recycling and reusing. The Minister often told me about his green policies. Fifteen years ago when development was being done around Dublin people driving lorries - they called them hackers - would get ten loads to the tips in Balally, Dunsink and other places. Today these lorries go to Longford, Westmeath, Monaghan and various parts of the country because of the problems with tips. Ironically enough, if we are stopped at traffic lights in Dublin and watch the shears taking down the buildings the rubble comprises concrete, mortar, gravel and cement. Throughout the country, be it Galway, Dublin, Cork, Limerick, there is a lot of what we call "muckaway" being shifted. In Dublin alone there are 3,000 to 4,000 loads per day. One third of everything being taken out is concrete, stone and cement. If this is brought to a tip it has to be buried with everything else. The Minister is overlooking this. This one third could be used on greenway roads or making roads. I am well aware of mica and I understand the situation but there is not the same effect with tar.

Consider farmers' roads, when they develop their farms around the country. One third of this could be saved in the re-use and recyclable situation. Article 28 is guidance on end-of-use waste, which is from the Minister's Department, but people are trying to get around the hoops at the moment, for example in trying to screen topsoil, whereby one makes topsoil available for green areas or for around houses. They are trying to recycle this stone, but then someone will come in from the council and say "If I catch you at that we will take your tip licence off you." For God's sake, as the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications, and especially as a Green Party Minister, will the Minister, Deputy Ryan, go into his Department and sign a regulation so that cement or concrete, which is basically sand and cement, or stone that has been used, can be recycled for certain projects? I am not saying that it would be put under houses or used under factories, but there are plenty of uses that could be made by the person who is thinking of the environment. Instead of a lorry going with it to Longford, Westmeath or Monaghan, this material could be reduced by one third. Will the Minister do that? It is a very simple question.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

Yes. We intend to introduce a circular economy Bill, which will have a whole range of provisions to help to reduce the amount of materials we are dumping or seeing going to waste. I fundamentally agree with Deputy Fitzmaurice. When I was originally a city councillor in Dublin, I remember the shock of realising that one third of our landfill then was demolition waste. It was often very good, expensive, and carbon-intensive products, which we need to reduce, reuse and recycle. It is going to be at a scale beyond compare.

The waste action plan has been introduced. It includes 200 measures that are very practical, very deliverable and we are systematically delivering. The Minister of State with responsibility in the area, Deputy Ossian Smyth, is delivering on this. We are starting to see it happen in how we recycle more. All soft plastics, for example, can now be put into the green bin. Demolition waste is an area that often would not get the same attention because it not household waste. I agree with exactly what Deputy Fitzmaurice is saying. We need to switch so that the materials used in building are recycled, reused and reduced.

I will give an example of the scale of the change that needs to be made. I had a meeting with Dublin Port recently. One measurement shows that some 97% of Ireland's roll-on roll-off port traffic comes in through Dublin Port. It is huge. So many of the goods we consume come in through that route. Dublin Port has said that Ireland will go from 35 million tonnes up to 70 million tonnes of imports. I asked myself what it was that we would be consuming twice the amount of? How is it that in this inexorable world there is a 2% or 3% expected growth every year in the use of materials? I said to them we need to review it and need to look again at the whole strategy of this ever-increasing growth in materials. We need to dematerialise development. In the building sector in particular we need to look at recycling and using materials, in a safe way and subject to proper environmental standards that saves us money, reduces the amount of waste, reduces the amount of imports and reduces the carbon.

"Yes" is my answer to the Deputy. Deputy Fitzmaurice is exactly right about the direction we need to take. I look forward to working with my colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Ossian Smyth, and the Department, to introduce the sort of measures that Deputy Fitzmaurice has spoken about.

It is not just about using the same materials. In building construction we need to switch to wood. I believe that laminated timber will allow us to replace a lot of the concrete and cement. It is not just about reducing the use of existing materials. It is also about changing the materials we use. That would be another way we could change from this big consumption and never-ending use of resources to switching to better ways.

Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice

With due respect to the Minister, the first thing we must do is knock the building before we could switch to the wood that he is on about. We must get the stuff that is there recycled. People have been trying to get around this for the past 14 months, in licences with different councils. I know one person who has taken the initiative of screening topsoil and screening stone out of the loads of muck that comes in. It is fine if it is boulder clay because everyone will use it on the roadways that they are making, and it is perfect stuff. One can put lime into it and it makes a perfect job of a roadway.

The Minister talks about legislation and looking at this. Why is there not a regulation, signed by the Minister immediately, to say that for farm roadways or for a greenway, for example, which there would be no problem with, concrete material or stone that is crushed and tested could be used, or that topsoil could be screened out of a load of muck that comes in? Currently, it is all being dumped.

The Minister speaks about legislation. I welcome his answer and I am not saying that I do not welcome it, but getting legislation passed in here is like pulling teeth. It is pretty slow and I do not want to be here a year's time asking the Minister when is legislation coming. I am asking the Minister, who has the opportunity, to sign a regulation to change this to being green waste or whatever.

Deputy Eamon Ryan

It will not be one year, it will be quicker than that. A lot quicker. This Government has three years to run and I believe that it has the necessary plans: Housing For All, the climate plan and the national development plan. The Housing For All plan also commits exactly to the sort of measures that Deputy Fitzmaurice was talking about.

Across all Departments we now have to focus on delivery, delivery and delivery, and it being fast. We must take some of the capability we showed during Covid and during Brexit to make decisions quickly and not to be forever examining and going to the nth degree. Deputy Grealish also referred to projects taking so long. I commit to Deputy Fitzmaurice that I will go away and sit down with the Department and come back to the Deputy to see how we could be fast and quicker and how could we introduce not just the legislation but also the regulations needed to make that happen, subject to the right environmental standards and making sure that we keep the proper rules in place. I agree with the Deputy that we need to be quicker and more flexible and innovative and particularly in this area. Dealing with such waste and the carbon emissions coming from it is one of the best and most economic ways of saving emissions and saving money.