Tourist Traffic Bill, 1959 (Certified Money Bill) — Second and subsequent Stages – Seanad Éireann (9th Seanad) – Thursday, 30 Jul 1959

Tourist Traffic Bill, 1959 (Certified Money Bill) — Second and subsequent Stages

Question proposed: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

Minister for Industry and Commerce (Mr. J. Lynch)

The purpose of this Bill is to provide for the payment of additional funds to Bord Fáilte Éireann to enable the Board to operate schemes of financial assistance for the development of major tourist resorts and the provision of additional bedroom accommodation in tourist hotels.

It is clear that in the general plan to expand the tourist traffic industry considerable importance must be attached to the development of our tourist resorts. Many Irish resorts are lacking in the facilities and amenities which people expect to find when they go on holidays. We are all aware and proud of the fact that nature has endowed our country with a wealth of natural beauty and other attractions for visitors, but we have to realise that if the tourist industry is to be properly developed, these natural assets must be supplemented by the provision of practical facilities such as promenades, parks and outdoor recreational facilities of various kinds. Furthermore, in view of the uncertainty of the Irish climate, it is essential that adequate indoor recreational facilities should also be available.

Under the Tourist Traffic Act, 1952, the Minister for Industry and Commerce may, on the recommendation of Bord Fáilte Éireann and with the concurrence of the Minister for Finance, guarantee loans required for the purpose of providing amenities and services at tourist resorts. In addition, he may authorise the Board to make grants to meet the interest charges arising on such loans for a number of years. A scheme for the giving of these guarantees and grants has been in operation since October, 1953, but although resort development proposals have been formulated by local interests in some cases, little real progress has been made in carrying out major improvements. The failure of the guaranteed loan scheme to promote resort development may be attributed to the fact that it can of necessity be used only in the case of works which will earn the revenue needed to repay loan and interest. Examples of revenue earning works are ballrooms, entertainment halls, amusement parks, boating lakes, pitch and putt courses and tennis courts.

There are, however, many improvement works which are essential for the proper and orderly development of tourist resorts, but which are not directly revenue earning, and consequently cannot, in the ordinary way, be financed by means of loans. Works of this kind include basic site development, provision of promenades, parks, river-side walks and pathways. The past experience of Bord Fáilte Éireann in relation to resort development works supports the view that substantial capital investment of a non-remunerative type is essential in order that profit earning activities may later be established. It is the opinion of the Board that in many centres local interests are unlikely to be in a position to proceed with revenue earning projects unless basic amenities of a non-revenue earning character are first provided; and it is clear that non-revenue earning works of this kind will have to be financed other than by way of loan if the general development of our tourist resorts is to be achieved within a reasonable time.

It was precisely for this reason that, as announced in the White Paper on Economic Expansion, the Government have decided to set aside a sum of £1 million to assist, by way of grants, the financing of a 10-year programme for the development of major resorts. The new grants, which will supplement expenditure from local resources and the guaranteed loan facilities already available through Bord Fáilte Éireann, will be confined to non-revenue earning works of the kind I have mentioned.

The grants will be subject to two conditions, namely, that the works to be carried out at a resort shall form part of a fully co-ordinated plan of development for that resort, and that a substantial local contribution will be forthcoming either from a local development group or from the local authority concerned. The scheme will be administered by Bord Fáilte Éireann and its operation will be limited to 10 years so as to ensure that development of resorts will take place as rapidly as possible.

It is visualised that the works to be undertaken with the help of these grants will constitute part of an overall development plan to be prepared by the local authority and the local development company or other local interests concerned, in consultation with Bord Fáilte Éireann. In the normal way the responsibility for the execution of the grant works will rest upon the local authority, to whom the grant moneys will be issued; and the revenue-earning portion of the project will be undertaken by the local development company with whatever funds are raised locally, as well as by means of loans guaranteed by the Minister under the Tourist Traffic Act, 1952.

It must be realised that the task of developing our resorts is primarily one for local enterprise, even though some assistance from the State is obviously necessary if the job is to be done quickly and properly. I must emphasise, however, that while the State and Bord Fáilte Éireann will continue to assist financially and otherwise in the carrying out of the necessary development works, the main initiative and effort must come from local interests.

Local authorities in particular must play their part and adopt a more positive attitude towards the development of the tourist traffic. Senators who are interested in tourist development can render the industry no greater service than to use their influence to persuade members and officials of local authorities of the importance of the industry and of the necessity for active local co-operation in order that the potentialities of the tourist traffic may be exploited to the full.

Under this Bill, local authorities and other local interests in major resort areas will, in the course of the next 10 years, have an excellent opportunity of developing and improving local amenities with generous assistance from the State. By availing themselves of the opportunity they can lay the foundation for the establishment of a thriving tourist trade that can bring additional employment and prosperity to their locality. This Bill provides that over the next ten years Bord Fáilte Éireann will be able to draw a sum of up to £1 million from the Exchequer to be paid in the form of grants to local authorities and other agencies who are willing to prepare and execute suitable schemes for the improvement of local amenities.

About eighteen months ago, the House considered another Tourist Traffic Bill, the purpose of which, inter alia, was to renew the power of the Minister for Industry and Commerce to guarantee loans required for the construction, extension and improvment of hotels and other forms of holiday accommodation. The then Minister said on that occasion that hotel accommodation continued to be a major bottleneck in the tourist industry and that further substantial private investment would be necessary in order that the tourist industry might be enabled to meet the demand for more and better accommodation. Over the past two years there has been a small increase in the total number of registered bedrooms in hotels and guest houses, but the rate of progress is extremely slow and far from adequate to cope with the growth in international travel which experts say we may expect in the next few years.

It would appear that one of the biggest deterrents to the expansion of accommodation is the heavy capital cost involved in relation to the comparatively short duration of the tourist season and the consequent low rate of occupancy in hotels in tourist centres. Accordingly, in order to provide further encouragement and assistance for the expansion of hotel accommodation, the Government last year decided to authorise Bord Fáilte Éireann to introduce a scheme of grants to cover portion of the cost of additional bedrooms and bedroom/bathroom units in tourist hotels and motels. The scheme was introduced in May of last year. The grants cover 20% of the cost involved, subject to maximum limits which range from £275 for a double bedroom with bath to £175 for a single bedroom without bath. Where central heating is installed in the new accommodation a further grant of one-third of the cost, subject to an upper limit of £25 per bedroom, is payable. In order to finance the scheme over the next ten years this Bill provides for the payment to Bord Fáilte Éireann of a total sum of half a million pounds in that period.

The scheme of grants can be altered to suit changing conditions and I understand that the Board are proposing certain changes in the scheme as it has operated up to the present. I hope to be able to consider these proposals soon, but my consideration of them will be influenced by the fact that the Government have already provided a very generous measure of assistance in a number of ways to the hotel industry. Hoteliers already have the advantages of a State guaranteed loan scheme which assures them that the capital required for the carrying out of improvement works will be readily available.

They also have the benefit of the grants made by Bord Fáilte Éireann to cover the interest charges arising on State guaranteed and other loans for the first 5 years during which the loans are in operation. If they carry out improvements to their premises they qualify for a remission for seven years of two-thirds of the local rates attributable to the improvements and there is also the concession that 10% of the capital expenditure incurred is allowable as a deduction in computing profits for income tax and corporation profits tax.

Furthermore, as announced by the Minister for Finance in his Budget speech, provision has been made for the granting of a 2% annual wear and tear allowance for capital expenditure on hotel buildings with effect from 6th April, 1960. Last, but not least, hoteliers benefit directly from the expenditure of almost half a million pounds which is applied each year by Bord Fáilte Éireann to the general development of tourism and the publicising of Irish tourist attractions.

The special funds which are being made available to Bord Fáilte Éireann under this Bill for the development of tourist resorts and the expansion of hotel accommodation are, of course, in addition to the existing annual maximum grant of £500,000 which is available to the Board under the Tourist Traffic Act, 1955 for the general development and publicising of the tourist industry.

I confidently commend the Bill to the House.

Mr. O'Quigley

I think the Minister can quite rightly commend this Bill with confidence to the House. The only criticism, strange to say, that I would offer of the Bill is in regard to the financial end. If I had anything to do with the ordering of the finances, I would take some of the money in regards to Aer Lingus and add it on to this Bill. It would be much more likely to be productive in different directions.

I think that people are generally agreed that the Tourist Board is certainly making progress. This Bill is designed to assist it in a way which, I think, many people would regard as very necessary. The provision of ordinary amenities such as seating accommodation, walks and that kind of thing is very necessary. I have oftentimes felt it was a great pity that at some of our tourist resorts these ordinary amenities were not available to tourists, whether from home or abroad. I am quite sure that Bord Fáilte will spend this money very advantageously for the tourist industry. It will make benefits available to the people of the country generally as well as to the tourists.

There is one point in which, it seems to me, sufficient progress has not been made by the Tourist Board. I do not know whether the Tourist Board itself can do very much about it. It does not make any difference, it seems to me, whether you have good accommodation, if the services to be rendered by hotels are not up to standard. We are told that the standard of cooking in some of our hotels is extremely low; that there is no imagination whatever in the menus provided and that the food is not served in a way that makes it appetising. After all, when people go on holidays, the three elements that matter to them are—the weather, food and the bed they lie on. As far as drink is concerned, the hotels and public houses will take care of that. Nothing much can be done about that aspect of it but the food given to people in hotels is a very important thing. This does not apply merely to the smaller-class hotel. Food is the kind of thing that really leaves visitors satisfied. One of the acid tests in regard to tourists returning to a particular area or a particular hotel is the question as to whether the food is good. The first inquiry that people make about hotels is what the food is like.

I do not want to appear as a kind of gourmet but it seems to me that the Tourist Board might direct its attention to the provision of menus which would be likely to attract people and the kind of meal that might leave a good impression on tourists, both Irish and foreign. I have seen hotels where it is obvious that grants given by the Tourist Board have been expended. There is a lot of gloss and glitter and chromium finish, with bars and lounges rigged out in a very fine style, but other amenities, such as the simple matter of providing toilet accommodation, and the manner in which that accommodation is kept, are absolutely deplorable in most cases. I often think that the acid test of a management in a hotel is how toilet accommodation is kept. It is a very simple thing but lack of attention or failure to realise the importance of a matter of that kind is responsible for that defect.

I understand from some hoteliers that the attitude of the Tourist Board towards the type of accommodation being provided is rather too rigid. I know of a case recently of an hotelier who would not be in Grade A or in Grade B but as he pointed out when an inspector came around, there are people who go to Grade C hotels because it suits their income. They do not go to a Grade B hotel because they cannot afford it. "What I am providing," he said, "is suitable for people with a certain income and I get sufficient of them." I think regard should be had to the position of that kind of hotelier and that kind of traffic which he is likely to have. The Board should not insist on the kind of improvements which the hotel proprietor feels would not bring him in any more income, or which if he did make them would necessitate his raising his charges with consequent loss of some of the traffic.

Another complaint I have heard from another hotelier is that the scheme which An Bord Fáilte wishes him to carry out would destroy the whole character of the hotel. The inspector from the Tourist Board should look at the hotel as a building and see what should be done. In this case, the proprietor knew precisely what was wanted and he was not prepared to meet the requirements of the Board. Consequently, no improvements of any kind were carried out. It may well be that that was only the outlook of that particular inspector, but if it were general, it would be a bad thing. A great deal of regard should be had to the views of the people on the spot who know the type of trade their area is likely to attract.

There is another matter which calls for some attention. There has been an improvement in relation to the sailings from Dun Laoghaire and there have not been the same bottlenecks there in recent years as a result of the representations made by the Department of Industry and Commerce and An Bord Fáilte to British Railways. The matter on which I am about to speak is something over which we can exercise no control. I understand there are times when tourists from this country returning to England find on arriving at Holyhead that there are not nearly sufficient coaches to accommodate people in any degree of comfort. That situation, of course, is likely to create a sourness in the minds of people who have enjoyed themselves here and militates against the prospect of these people returning because of the discomfort they had to endure in the last stages of their holidays. Some representation should be made to British Railways to ensure that that situation is avoided, or if it is not possible to avoid it completely, that it is minimised to the greatest possible extent.

I also understand that in regard to the car ferry service which has been introduced no provision is made for a service during the day time. People who come on the car ferry service from Britain find themselves down at the docks at 4 o'clock in the morning and that is not the type of thing that is likely to encourage these people to come over here, bring their cars with them, buy petrol and so on. That seems to me to be a matter in respect of which the Tourist Board might be able to effect some improvements.

Members of the Dáil and the Seanad regularly receive the Bord Fáilte publication Ireland of the Welcomes. In general, that seems to be a well turned out production but there seems to be an undue emphasis on what is not typical in Ireland. It conveys a false impression to people abroad that we are still going around in práiscíns and báiníns. I do not know whether it is fair to the country or to the people living in rural parts that they should be so portrayed in that magazine. I have known American tourists to come here and to be sorely disappointed with the few castles they found. Apparently they got the impression from some source that Ireland was a different kind of place from that which they found it to be and they were sorely disappointed as a result of their experience. It seems to me that in this magazine they ought to portray more accurately the conditions which people may expect to find here.

As I say, the only regret I have is that more money is not being devoted to this well worth while industry than is being devoted under this Bill, and that some of the money being devoted to other matters is not being devoted to tourism.

Mr. Ryan

Because of its unique importance to the economy of the country, I am sure the House will welcome anything designed to help the tourist industry. I think there can be little doubt that there are many resorts and many towns which have outstanding attractions but which are not properly developed and which, by the expenditure of even a small amount of money, could be very much improved. This Bill which combines with the grants for the development of amenities, grants for the expansion of accommodation, should go a long way towards realising the potential income of many towns from the tourist industry.

I should like to suggest to the Board that when allocating money under this Bill, they should ask a town when preparing a scheme to make up their minds as to what exact characteristics of the town they want to develop. It should make up its mind as to the principal attraction of the town as a tourist resort, and should build the town as a tourist resort around that attraction. Every potential resort, every town which holds itself out as having pretensions to being a tourist resort, presumably has some attractions, some amenities, such as fishing, bathing, golf or scenery. Presumably, it has a number of attractions, but it almost certainly has one outstanding attraction, and it is very necessary that the town should decide what its outstanding attraction is and should devote at least a high proportion of the money it gets towards emphasising its best point. It should build around its best point and it should aim at having a distinctive character.

Nothing would be less desirable than that all our resorts should be more or less alike and have the same attractions. It is essential that each town should do its best to develop a distinctive characteristic. A tourist resort which tries to do everything, which tries to offer everything, will probably end up by pleasing nobody and certainly will leave no lasting impression on the tourist who visits it. It will not move him to think that this is a town which he will never forget, to which he will come back again and again, and to which he will send his friends. I would, therefore, suggest to the Board that when they are considering schemes from towns and allocating money, they should ask each town to consider that point and try to emphasise a particular attraction and bring out a particular characteristic—a different one, if possible, for each town.

Mr. Louis Walsh

I should like to endorse what Senator O'Quigley has said with regard to the standard of cooking. The Board has a scheme of staff training in a number of places throughout the country and they finance that scheme very generously. I feel that too many waitresses are being sent forth from the six months' course, while hotels find it extremely difficult in those areas to obtain cooks. If more time were devoted to instruction in cooking, by an intensified course, and less time were given to waiting, it would result in quite an amount of good to the tourist industry generally.

Senator O'Quigley also said that there is a greater demand for grade B and grade C hotels than for grade A in tourist districts. With that viewpoint I certainly agree. In an area with which I am very familiar, a middle-class hotel refused a great number of people, through lack of accommodation, while a better class hotel in the area, a much more expensive hotel, just did not have the numbers of people which they could accommodate. The successful growth of tourism depends largely upon ability to cater for the middle class.

No country in Europe depends to a greater extent on tourism than we do. A reasonable flow of tourist business coming into a district is nearly as important, socially and economically, as a factory. It can provide a living for people in remote areas where there is little possibility of attracting the industrialist. Compared with the proposals to extend the Undeveloped Areas Act and the Industrial Grants Act, the proposals contained in this Bill are meagre enough, over the ten year period, considering the fact that tariff walls are crumbling all over Europe at present and therefore tourism may be an important factor in our economy in the years that lie ahead.

This money is well worth while spending on the proposals in this Bill. However, the lesser known areas— which have considerable potentialities —will not benefit to the extent to which I should like them to benefit under the Bill. If the Minister is not aware of the expenditure by An Bord Fáilte on non-major resorts at present and their commitments to that particular expenditure for the next two or three years, I should be grateful if he would make inquiries and find out—as I have done—what their expenditure is on these smaller and lesser known resorts at present and what their proposals are in that connection.

The Minister stated that substantial local contributions will be expected. I cannot see much difficulty in getting local contributions in an urban area or from a borough council, but there is not much chance of getting local contributions in a small area. A local authority, namely, a county council, may not be in a position to put up the funds. The Minister will appreciate that that small area is represented by a county councillor who lives a number of miles away. He will find it difficult to influence the other members of the council. Even then, the council may not have authority. As chairman of a county council, I am not so sure that a council can expend money, or contribute to the expenditure of money, other than on a county road or on some matter for which they are responsible, such as the provision of sewerage and water supplies. The Minister will appreciate that the county council go to considerable expense in providing amenities of a social nature at tourist resorts, in order to help out the tourist. They also provide lighting. Considering the rate which is being paid now in many counties—in some of them it is more than three times the rate paid pre-war—it is not easy to expect them to provide much of a local contribution, even if these smaller areas can benefit.

At present, no person can carry on a hotel unless it is registered by An Bord Fáilte as a hotel, irrespective of the size of the building. If it is registered as a hotel, it cannot obtain a reconstruction grant under the Local Government Housing Acts. A private house—or a house in which business is being carried on, if there is a separate entrance—is entitled to obtain a reconstruction grant of up to £140, with a supplementary grant from the local authority of a similar amount; but hotels ae excluded from benefit under the Housing Acts.

An Bord Fáilte have a scheme under which a grant of £175 is provided, I think, in the case of a single room with bath but it states here that the project shall comprise five bedrooms so that if an hotel erects three or four bedrooms, it cannot qualify. The minimum size specified is 130 sq. feet for a double room and 80 sq. feet for a single room. In many places, I find the bedrooms are too large and are not economical. In other countries, sometimes bedrooms are smaller. It might be well to investigate whether the prescribed area should be reduced.

If, as the Minister states, new regulations are being brought before him for consideration I would ask him to see that a project will be entitled to a grant for a lesser number of bedrooms than five. The Minister will appreciate that there are small family hotels which have not sufficient capital to provide five rooms at one time. They may not have sufficient space to expand and while the proposal is admirable from the point of view of C.I.E. or the large company hotels, it does not always suit the small family hotel which is important in the tourist drive.

Professor Quinlan

I join with other Senators in welcoming this Bill. My only regret is that it did not come to us earlier in the session when we could have, with benefit, I am sure, devoted a whole day to discussing the various aspects of the tourist trade because the Minister in his introduction made interesting references to many essential features of the tourist trade today.

I feel at one with Senator O'Quigley and others in thinking that the £1 million voted here is too little. It has been suggested that it should be spent over a ten year period. I hope the Minister will succeed in expending it in a far shorter time with the desired results so that he will be back before the ten years are up seeking increased grants to meet increased expenditure in this valuable industry. It is recognised that tourism is our second industry and that it is growing very rapidly. Consequently, it is coming to the stage where in the future we shall have to make a far greater investment in it and incur much more expenditure than we have incurred up to the moment. With that in mind, it seems that tourism is so closely linked with our travel facilities that I wonder was it a mistake that the tourist industry was not included in the new Ministry which has been set up to deal with communications and so on, because in many ways tourism is the greatest single contributor to our rail and air services.

We have an excellent air service between here and the Continent and we are to have a jet service. If we have this jet service, I feel we must use it to the full and it then comes within the province of the tourist industry to fill these jets. I cannot see any great objection to what might be viewed by some international authority as a concealed subsidy to the airlines by the Tourist Board.

There are a few aspects of tourism with which I wish to deal briefly. The first is the number one problem of the tourist industry—extending the tourist season. It seems to me that far more positive direction and example are required from the State. Our tourist industry is largely concentrated into the months of July and August and one of the chief home factors concentrating it there is that school holidays are mainly in those two months. If we really want to develop and lengthen the season, the Department of Education should set a headline by ensuring that it is possible for parents to take holidays either in June or September. It might be well if schools generally finished pretty near the 1st of June and opened again early in September. To compensate for that, I do not see why the American practice of having a midterm break between the 1st September and Christmas could not be followed.

I think the State and local authorities likewise with their many employees could set a headline by putting some premium on holidays taken outside the months of July and August, perhaps by allowing additional days or longer leave, when holidays are taken outside those two months. In those two months, all our citizens can avail of any good weather periods by going to the sea at weekends or just going down in the evenings rather than being cut off completely from the good period. I think a valuable contribution can be made to the June and September periods.

I feel we should be able to utilise May and October largely for instructional purposes. We all recognise that practically all groups, whether farmers, industrial workers or others, require, or could benefit by, a great deal more instruction in various fields. Especially for the farming community, May is a rather slack month, and October in many regions is slack also. Certainly, the region which is busy in May is not very busy in October so that our hotels and accommodation could, with benefit, be utilised to foster the idea of combining business and pleasure, giving instruction to our farming and other communities while at the same time, giving them the advantages of a communal holiday.

After that, there is still the problem of the hotel staffs and of the extra training they need and also of their holiday period. One of our greatest difficulties is that when a hotel has its staff trained, the season ends and there is nothing further for them to do but emigrate. Until we can face up to that problem, we shall find it difficult to maintain the high standard of service that is so necessary in order to keep the tourist industry in the forefront.

We should explore other possibilities of developing the tourist trade by utilising the facilities we have without having to incur expenditure on elaborate buildings and so on. I have in mind what might be termed farming family holidays or country family holidays. People living in the country, by adding a few rooms to their houses, could cater for families during the tourist season. Many country families have cars and it would be good utilisation of the cars to make then available to the tourists at a reasonable charge during a few days in the week. We have to be distinctive, as was emphasised by Senator Ryan, and develop what is the chief characteristic of our people, namely, that we are a family people and we should cater for the family unit in the matter of holidays. The family unit is a guarantee of continuity of the tourist trade because the children who come to the country for the first time and see the magic of nature, the animals and everything else that is to be seen on the farm, will go back with a glowing view of Ireland and its attractions and they, in turn, will want to bring their children to sample these pleasures. That is an aspect of the tourist trade that should be developed.

Perhaps the Minister will be able to resolve some of our dilemma. Senators express views in this House but they are third removes from the source of action, Bord Fáilte. How can the Minister harness the genuine enthusiasm and co-operation in both Houses on such a completely non-political subject as tourism? I suggest that the Minister might consider using his offices as Minister for Industry and Commerce to set up a joint committee of both Houses, a tourist development committee, which would channel the views expressed in both Houses and would then be in a position to have them presented to Bord Fáilte, to the benefit of Bord Fáilte and Parliament. We would not feel, as we often feel, that we are blowing off hot air and getting nowhere.

I would ask the Minister to indicate if there is any hope of setting up such a committee. We all feel the necessity for a committee system here. We feel the futility of the L. and H. type of debate engaged in on both sides. Would it be possible to introduce the committee system that is in operation in Holland, America and elsewhere? The Minister for Finance disagreed with that suggestion recently because he felt the subject was rather political, that is, the Industrial Credit Company, but nothing could be less political than the development of our second most important industry, the tourist industry. The Minister may be able to set a headline and may be able to harness the energies obviously present here and bring them together, irrespective of Party.

Seán Ó Donnabháin

I do not think I am the only one who is confused as to how the various authorities concerned in the matter of improvements in towns and rural areas and tourist resorts operate. There are county councils, corporations, municipal authorities, the Board of Works and Bord Fáilte and when we wish to discuss some project, we do not know which authority or what conjoint authority should do it.

I shall refer to amenities which have been provided in Dublin and the vicinity of Dublin. Dublin is the greatest tourist resort in this country. Could the Minister indicate to what extent Bord Fáilte subsidised the amenities provided in Dublin? I have in mind the promenade at Clontarf and improvements at Howth. They are within the jurisdiction of the corporation. These improvements are magnificent and are a great attraction to tourists and provide facilities for the citizens of Dublin. The green that has been created along the Clontarf wall is a great attraction and is used by many visitors and citizens.

That brings me to refer to the Bull Island and Dollymount Strand, which has not been developed to the extent that it should be. Unfortunately, a group of citizens objected to Corporation plans for the improvement of the Bull Island. I do not know how the matter stands at present. It would create a tourist attraction if Dollymount Strand were improved according to the plan which is at present in abeyance. I do not know how many authorities are involved. The Port and Docks Board erected signs at the entrance to the strand indicating that anybody bathing there is in grave danger of drowning. Yet, bathing facilities are provided within 50 or 75 yards of that warning to facilitate people in drowning themselves. That is fantastic. I suggest that if Bord Fáilte have the authority, they should help in the improvement of Dollymount Strand because it is just as important that developments should take place in the city of Dublin as in any part of the south or west of Ireland.

The amenities already provided by the Corporation at Howth and Clontarf are a wonderful attraction. The same would probably apply on the south coast of Dublin. I read in the paper that people objected to the Corporation taking in portion of Sandymount strand. Senators will recall that, years ago, Fairview Park was a slobland. To-day it is a beautiful park and it is delightful to see children availing of the lovely green there on Summer evenings and using the hurling and football pitches. Bord Fáilte, the municipal authorities and other authorities conjointly should provide facilities in the area to which I have referred, which attracts a greater number of visitors than any other area.

Business suspended at 6 p.m. and resumed at 7 p.m.

Seán Ó Donnabháin

Before the tea adjournment I was speaking about the lack of facilities at Dollymount Strand. It is a pity that better facilities cannot be afforded by somebody, be it Bord Fáilte, the Board of Works or Dublin Corporation. At holiday week-ends up to 20,000 people visit that island. If there is a sudden downpour, those unfortunate families are drenched before they reach the Clontarf road where they can get buses back to the city. I saw plans for the provision of magnificent facilities, shelters, toilets and so on which, unfortunately, for some reason or another are in abeyance at present.

I leave the North side and go to the South side to Dun Laoghaire. It is a few years since I travelled by train from Dun Laoghaire to Dublin. I never saw worse carriages anywhere than on that train. If such carriages are still provided for the conveyance of tourists from Dun Laoghaire to Dublin, it is a very bad advertisement for the country at a time when these tourists are setting out to enjoy a holiday in Ireland. The facilities at the pier itself have been greatly improved, but they are still not sufficient to meet the great influx of people coming by boat and travelling by train to Dublin. It is a big contrast with the splendour of the airport and the approach to Dublin for those who can afford to travel by air.

I move now from Dublin, having commented favourably on the improvements at Howth and at the esplanade at Clontarf. Last Sunday I travelled to Navan. Passing over the bridge near Navan, approaching one of the nicest towns in Ireland, I asked in astonishment was the river over which I was passing the Boyne. Because of the accumulation of mud and "flaggers"—I think that is what they call them— the royal iris and fallen trees, you could not see this river which is of such historic importance. The river could form a lovely approach to the town of Navan if it were cleared and cleaned, and I am sure it would be a great attraction for anglers.

The conditions there struck me as something that should not be allowed to exist. Tourists coming to this country often make Dublin their headquarters and drive to various places in the precincts of the city. Anybody seeing the condition of the Boyne would be tempted to ask what the local authority, the Board of Works, Bord Fáilte or whatever authority is responsible, was doing in the matter. The same thing applies in other cases, too. It all adds up to a disparagement of the beauties of our country and indicates complete neglect.

I wish to pass now to a wider field and deal with the provision of bathing facilities at seaside and inlands resorts. Killarney had no bathing facilities on the lakes for visitors anxious to have a dip in Lough Léin. Then, for some reason or other, the bathing facilities provided were entirely inaccessible to the ordinary people. The only means of ingress was through the golf links. Possibly one could be prevented from using the golf links as a right-of-way. It seemed rather extraordinary to put this magnificent swimming pool in such a locality. Possibly it was Bord Fáilte who were responsible for providing the pool, but the position in which it is sited is quite fantastic. It is too far from the town and access to it might possibly embroil one in an action for trespass.

Last year I was in a small village in West Cork. The weather was bad. Had the weather been fine, the situation would have been rather perplexing. There were no proper bathing facilities and it would have been quite impracticable to bathe under the conditions that existed there.

As far as the countryside generally is concerned, for quite some time now I have been campaigning for the use of lime-wash. Everywhere one goes, one sees relentless grey walls and grey houses. Lime-wash would brighten things up considerably. Its application is easy. It is comparatively cheap. Such houses and cottages from Cork to Connemara and Donegal should be lime-washed. That would enhance the natural scenery from the point of view of the tourist. Equally, our towns are drab in appearance.

Mr. L'Estrange

That is not sabotage, of course, when it comes from the Senator's side of the House.

Seán Ó Donnabháin

It is the Senator who is the saboteur. I do not interrupt the Senator when he speaks and I expect to be accorded reciprocal treatment by him. I am not sabotaging anything. It is not sabotage to point out how amenities might be provided or conditions improved at very little cost. One always appreciates the town which receives a liberal coat of paint. There are towns in which development associations look after these things and the towns in question are a credit to these associations. Last year I travelled through the little village of Durrus. I understand it was placed quite highly by the Tourist Board, though it did not get first place. It was a pleasure to drive through it. There were about 20 houses, and each one had been freshly painted. Surely other villages could follow the good example set and improve the appearance generally of the villages.

I do not suppose Bord Fáilte could do anything about bathing in dangerous waters. Last week two young men were drowned in the River Liffey through being entangled in the weeds. Of course, it is foolish for people to go into water in which there are weeds. On the other hand, it is not always easy to resist the temptation. Some steps should be taken to clear rivers of weeds, particularly rivers in the more densely populated areas which are availed of by people for bathing and swimming.

With regard to the facilities in our hotels, I have never had any complaint about either food or accommodation. Admittedly, I avoid the rush periods and I believe that it is during the rush period that cause for complaint arises. It is rather an extraordinary situation that two Grade A hotels in the City of Dublin were prosecuted not so long ago by the Dublin Corporation for non-compliance with the health regulations.

I remember, when the Health Bill was being enacted here, I referred to the fact that there would be duplication of inspectors. At one time I myself was one of those Corporation inspectors, and I say that it is not the butcher shop but the place behind it to which attention should be paid. In hotels it is the kitchen which requires inspection and care, as far as cleanliness and hygiene generally are concerned. It is a curious fact that Dublin Corporation had to prosecute two first class Grade A hotels for not complying with hygiene regulations, though prior to that Bord Fáilte had the responsibility of grading them. To my mind, it does not reflect credit on Bord Fáilte that such an event should occur.

I shall conclude by referring to O'Connell Bridge and by saying that down through the years I have been angered by all the derogatory remarks made by architects and other allegedly aesthetic people upon what they call: "The thing on O'Connell Bridge."

I think that matter has been sufficiently discussed.

Mr. O'Reilly

The two Senators should be taken outside.

Mr. O'Quigley

Anybody who speaks with feeling on this side of the House is always hysterical, according to Senators opposite.

I do not want to be taken as in any way trying to deprive Bord Fáilte of the credit which I think is due to them for their endeavours to do a creditable job for tourist development in this country, but I am obliged to say I am not satisfied that the dynamic drive which we were led to believe would be put into the tourist industry has yet materialised. When we hear that there was only a small increase in the number of bedrooms provided during the past two years, in spite of all the advantages now available by reason of legislative action here, it is proof, in my opinion, that Bord Fáilte are not putting the push behind one aspect of tourist development which is its most important aspect, that is, the provision of accommodation for the visitors we expect to attract.

The greatest bottleneck in the development of tourism, in my experience, is the complete and utter inadequacy of single bedroom accommodation. Very little effort, if any, has been made by Bord Fáilte to encourage hoteliers to go into that aspect of the problem in a big way, in a way which will ensure that a potential visitors trade of many thousands will be secured for this country and not lost, as it is being lost, by reason of the fact that adequate accommodation in single bedrooms is not available in any of our reports. Neither is it available in the city of Dublin.

I know of one hotelier at the movement who has been turning down applications for single bedrooms at the rate of 20 a day for the months of July and August simply because he has not got the accommodation, and does not see any prospect of providing it. I referred on previous occasions to the case of a father, mother and their grown-up daughter, or an engaged couple, who write to a hotel and ask for single rooms. The father and mother want one double room and one single room and the engaged couple want two single rooms, but the hoteliers, by reason of the fact that the income from the double rooms is much more attractive and popular, are in a position to let double rooms but not single rooms, with the consequence that the father and mother and grown-up daughter probably do not come here at all but go to the Continent, or take their holiday in a caravan or in a camp in England. Something must be done about that and, in my opinion, nothing has been done.

Under this Bill, £500,000 is now being provided in the form of grants for the purpose of development of holiday accommodation. I hope the Minister for Industry and Commerce will strongly urge on Bord Fáilte that the greater proportion of that £500,000 should be allocated to hoteliers who are prepared to go into this project of the provision of single bedroom accommodation. More than that must be done. If a hotelier builds a block of single rooms, he finds that the furnishings are just as costly as the furnishings of double rooms and he finds that his income from a single room is half what it would be from a double room. On top of that, when he has completed the job and provided accommodation for that class of tourist, which is a most profitable class, he finds that his local authority will slap an increase on his rates.

Therefore, there is active discouragement to any hotelier to extend his premises in the direction of providing single room accommodation. Some consideration should be given by the Minister or by Bord Fáilte, or both, to the possibility of hammering out some scheme which will encourage hoteliers, not only in the form of grants and guaranteed loans, but in the form also of a cut in rates either for a stated period or for good, to provide by new buildings single room accommodation for visitors. There is no doubt that there is a big potential tourist trade being lost to us for these reasons. I feel that unless the drive comes from the authorities directly concerned with tourism, such as the Department of Industry and Commerce and Bord Fáilte, the hoteliers by themselves will not go into the matter on a big scale. I hope, as I say, that something concrete will come out of these discussions here today in that regard.

I am not satisfied either that Bord Fáilte have broken through the red tape and the administrative bottleneck about which we heard something during the debate on the Tourist Traffic Bill last year. I am not satisfied that they have overcome the delays which we were told they would overcome in a short time. Particularly am I not satisfied that they have solved the problem of dealing with applications for loans from the point of view of their architectural section. I complained on former occasions of the delays in regard to the approval of plans or the inspection of actual projected improvements for hotels. I feel that these applications, and perhaps the plans also, hardly ever get beyond a junior official. I do not say that applies to every case but it certainly does apply to some cases I know, and I am convinced that the reason for their rejection and the reason for the discouragement given to hoteliers is that the Board itself or its higher executives did not hear of these cases and had no opportunity of examining these applications.

I cannot understand how it is that a situation such as this can arise. A man who invested quite a considerable amount of money in a hotel, who showed initiative, ability and vision in the modernisation of the hotel, and who had practically committed his available capital to the improvement and further extension of that hotel, applied to Bord Fáilte for one of these interest free loans to the tune of between £3,000 and £4,000. He submitted plans to Board Fáilte, and the plans were visionary plans which involved pretty big structural alterations, and when he applied for the £3,000 or £4,000 loan, he had collateral to the extent of £25,000 in the shape of three buildings, valued by independent valuers. He also had money still in the bank which he did not want to touch but he could not get the loan. The excuse was that his plans were not as satisfactory to the board's architect as they should be. I think Senator O'Quigley referred to something of that nature. If I understood him correctly, I should like very much to support his remarks in that regard.

He did not get this loan and he almost became discouraged. Fortunately, being a man of courage and vision, he decided to commit his remaining capital. He went ahead with the job and has done it himself. He now has one of the finest modern hotels in this country. His experience is most discouraging. When he meets other hoteliers and tells them of his difficulties they are inclined to become discouraged and to throw up the sponge at any possibility of development of their own premises in view of the fact that that small amount of money was not made available to him despite his excellent security.

Loans and grants, particularly interest-free loans, should be as easily obtainable by a solvent business man as it was at one time possible for a solvent business man to get an overdraft in the bank. I hope such accommodation will again be provided. That is a bottle-neck that has to be widened if we are to make any progress in the provision of the tremendous amount of bedroom, lounge and bar accommodation required in many of our hotels.

Senator Seán Ó Donnabháin referred to Dún Laoghaire. I want again to draw the attention of Bord Fáilte who, I am afraid have done nothing about it, to what those in the hotel trade believe to be the greatest single factor militating against the extension of the tourist season, for the months of May and June particularly. I refer to the lack of a day sailing in the Holyhead-Dún Laoghaire route. There are thousands of people in England— which is our best tourist market, in my opinion—who would like to come to Ireland and who would have money to spend. Seventy out of every 100 people who visit this country come by sea. Not everybody likes to fly and not everybody can afford to fly. There are thousands who come by sea and there are thousands who would like to come here.

Many of them want to avoid the peak period rush holidays in July and August and would like to come here in May or June. Some of them are old. Many of them do not like the long train journey from North-eastern England or from South-western England and the night trip on the boat which is involved in May and June. If British Railways could be persuaded to put on a day's sailing from, say, the middle of May instead of, as at present, the 1st July a tremendous number of potential customers from the Midlands of England, particularly, would be inveigled into availing of the service. They would come over here in the months when our tourist trade is slack and when our hotels are in an excellent position to cater for them.

Another aspect of all these journeys by sea is the deplorable service between Glasgow and Dublin. Apparently no effort has been made to improve that service. I suggest Bord Fáilte could ensure a tremendous increase in tourist traffic if some steps were taken to ensure a decent service on the Glasgow-Dublin and the Dublin-Glasgow route. I do not think it necessary to develop these points any further except to say, in connection with Senator Seán Ó Donnabháin's remarks—and Bord Fáilte might take this up, too—that the first thing the tourist who lands on the mailboat pier at Dún Laoghaire sees these bright sunny mornings is a dilapidated puffing billy of a steam engine.

We have some of the finest diesels in Europe on some of our lines as, for instance, on the Westland Row-Wexford line. Yet the first thing a visitor sees when he lands at Dún Laoghaire is an old-fashioned steam engine. It puffs up and down there for half an hour getting up steam in a station on which hundreds of pounds were spent to beautify it with beautiful white paint and a very nice colour scheme. It will not be long before the beautiful white paint is as black as the railway station used to be before the diesels came. Soon the goods impression created by this fine job which C.I.E. have done will be lost because of these old steam engines.

Mr. J. Lynch

C.I.E. are doing it, not Bord Fáilte.

Tomás Ó Maoláin

Bord Fáilte should put this up to C.I.E. Why is it necessary to use steam engines and give the people such a poor impression of Dún Laoghaire and Ireland when they arrive at the pier?

I think the money voted for the development of tourism is well invested and I should like to see much more of it. If the drive is made on the lines suggested in regard to single-bedroom hotel accommodation, Bord Fáilte will secure, without the expenditure of thousands of pounds on newspaper publicity abroad, thousands of customers who are now forced to deprive themselves of the pleasure of a visit to Ireland because of the lack of the accommodation to which I have referred.

Mr. Hogan

I congratulate the Minister on the introduction of this Bill which is designed to help one of our major industries. I agree with those Senators who say there is room for improvement in the cooking in many of our hotels. The menu in many of our hotels is the same year in and year out. There is a scarcity of trained personnel in that profession. We should do something to improve the quality of the cooking in our various hotels.

Last Sunday morning I had experience of a hotel in the principal tourist town in the West of Ireland. I came to that town hungry and poor. I was not a tourist but a visitor. I had money to pay for a meal for myself and for those who were accompanying me. I asked a respectable gentleman on the street where I could go for a meal. He pointed to a hotel and said it was one of the best hotels there. I proceeded to that hotel. On the way to the dining-room, I met a gentleman who stopped me. I said: "The dining-room, please.""Oh, yes," he said, "but you will have to get a ticket." I asked: "A ticket for what?" He said: "A ticket for the dining-room." I said that that was all right. He produced a ticket and said that a meal in the dining-room cost 6/6d. and consisted of a mixed grill.

I was hungry and, were it not for that, I would not have had a mixed grill. However, I paid for it and proceeded to the dining-room with my friends. I had no choice. It was one o'clock in the day in our principal tourist town in the West. At one of the principal hotels there, I could not get a lunch unless I was prepared to accept what was called "a mixed grill" but was not a mixed grill. It consisted of bacon, egg, a small piece of pudding and a bit of tomato. It had obviously been cooked for a considerable length of time. I am not making a complaint. I was glad to get anything. However, I thought over this matter and remembered that that hotel was aware that there was a considerable number of people in the locality on Sunday last.

They knew well there would be some rush on them although there was no rush at the time I was there. That was all they had to offer and, if there were tourists from Carolina, there would be no other treatment for them than to pay for their meal and take what they got. If that is all that can be expected from our so-called Grade A hotels, the Tourist Board is falling down on a job. I am not exaggerating the facts of the case I have instanced. I protested to the manager at being charged for a meal before it was provided. I should like to make that protest here this evening particularly on account of the town where it happened, in the tourist area.

There could be a big improvement in the cooking of meals in hotels and in the manner in which they are served. Our vocational committees and other organisations could help by training staffs for our hotels.

I welcome the fact that money is being provided to help local bodies to improve the amenities of our tourist centres. I would suggest to the Minister that one object to which we might allow money to be devoted, apart from the provision of water, sewerage and other amenities, is derelict sites and ruins which are to be found in every village and town in many of our tourist counties. Local bodies, I do admit, have powers under what is known as the Derelict Sites Act to remove these unsightly ruins but this puts a direct charge on the rates and in most counties the rates are not able to bear it. I agree with Senator Louis Walsh who says there is a danger that public bodies will not avail of this money because they have too many other commitments to meet. I would ask the Minister to consider giving assistance to public bodies to deal with these derelict sites and ruins that are destroying our countryside. You can travel through many of our counties, particularly in the tourist areas, and see no houses except unsightly buildings without roofs which are a disgrace to our countryside.

I heard Senator Seán Ó Donnabháin being interrupted a few minutes ago. He should not have been interrupted because the suggestions he made were practical and worthy of adoption. I hope that as a result of the passing of this Bill there will be great improvements in many of our tourist centres. I have one other suggestion to make. Apart from tourist areas, adjoining the sea, we have some splendid tourist centres in the heart of Ireland. Take County Westmeath, where we have some of the most beautiful lakes in Europe, most of them neglected. They could all be improved. I should like to know if money under this heading can be utilised for the purpose of improving those lakes so that they can be brought to the notice of the people who come to Ireland to spend their money.

Mr. Colley

I, like the other Senators, welcome the Bill and hope great benefits will come from it. The only comment I have to make is to disagree strongly with the point made in such an excited fashion by Senator O'Donovan in regard to the thing on O'Connell Bridge. As a Dublin man I think it is one of the greatest improvements to our city in recent years. I disagree with him also on the point that the people generally do not approve of it. My experience is that nine out of every ten people approve of it. As a Dublin man sitting in this House, I did not want to remain silent on this question. I believe the whole opposition in this regard has been merely the result of propaganda by a small section of the people of Dublin. The vast majority of the people of Dublin think that structure is a great improvement and an amenity that ought to be left there.

Pádraig Ó Siochfhradha

Níl mórán le cur agam leis an méid molta atá déanta ar an mBille seo. Molaim é agus is cúis áthais dom go bhfuil a leithéid á bheartú agus á chur chun cinn. Tá ní amháin nár cuireadh aon bhéim air agus sé sin go bhfuil dhá chineál tráchta cuairteoireachta againn in Éirinn, trácht cuairteoireachta laistigh den tír féin do mhuintir na hÉireann gur maith leo dul ar saoire agus cuid eile d'Éirinn seachas a gcuid féin a fheiscint. Is dóigh liom gur ceart go luífi níos mó air sin mar tá cuairteoireacht chomh riachtanach dár muintir féin agus atá sé riachtanach córacha a chur ar fáil dóibh sin comh maith le iad a chur ar fáil do dhaoine ón iasacht.

Tá an difríocht seo ann, dar ndóigh: na cuairteoirí laistigh d'Éirinn ní chuireann siad aon mhéadú ar an ioncam náisiúnta. Tá an t-airgead laistigh den tír cheana a chaithfidh ár muintir féin má théann siad ar thuras go Cill Áirne, Gaillimh nó Dún na nGall, agus b'fhéidir nach bhfuil sé sin chomh tábhachtach i gcúrsaí airgid leis an rud eile, ach is tábhachtach thar barr é do mhuintir na tíre féin, do mhuintir Baile Átha Claith, dul fén dtuaith nó muintir na tuaithe teacht go Baile Átha Cliath, nó go háit eile art mhaithe lena sláinte nó ar mhaithe le saoire dóibh féin.

Is tábhachtach chomh maith na daoine a thagann thar lear go hÉirinn. Siad sin a bheireann leo an t-airgead breise atá chomh tairbheach do thráchtáil na cuairteoireachta. Ní eile, níor cheart dearmad a dhéanamh gurb iad ár gcine féin dhá dtrian de na daoine a thagann anso ó Shasana nó ó na Stáit Aontaithe. Tá sé riachtanach córacha a bheith ullamh dóibh, ní amháin chum iad féin a mhealladh ar ais arís ach chun daoine eile a ghríosadh chomh maith.

Tá sna Stáit Aontaithe tuairim is 20 milliún daoine go bhfuil cuid de dhúchas na hÉireann iontu. Ba cheart dúinn oibriú orthu sin agus oibriú orthu ar an dtuiscint gur cuid dár gcine fein iad agus gur ceart dóibh turas a dhéanamh go hÉirinn. Tá Éire ann anois nárbh eol dár seanaithreacha céad bliain ó shin. Ba cheart dúinn súil a choimeád air sin agus feidhm a bhaint as agus tuilleadh spéise a mhúscailt i measc na ndaoine a thugann cuairt ar na ceantair úd as a dtáinig siad. An chuid is mó de na daoine a thagann ó Mheiriceá agus Sasana is de chine na hÉireann íad. Meallann siad san daoine eile. Meallann áilleacht na hÉireann, compord na hÉireann agus caraictéar na hÉireann roinnt eile ach is roinnt bheag é.

Is iad ár muintir féin na daoine is mó a thagann ar cuairt chugainn. Is dóigh liom gurab é an cuspóir ba cheart a bheith ag Bord Fáilte Éireann ná fáiltiú thar n-ais roimh na daoine a chuaigh ó Éirinn thar lear agus a chur in iúl dóibh go bhfaghidh siad luach a gcuid airgid.

Ba mhaith liom dá dtabharfadh an tAire tuairim éigin dúinn faoi cad é an gléas atá ag Bord Failte Éireann chun na tithe ósta a riaradh mar ba cheart maidir le compord an lucht fanúna iontu, maidir le bia, riar bia, agus maidir le córacha eile a bhaineann le turasóireacht. An bhféadfadh cigirí cuairt a thabhairt ar na tithe ósta sin gan a chur in iúl roimh ré go bhfuil siad ag teacht, ionas go bhféadfaidís rudaí a réiteach cosúil leis an ngearán a rinne Seanadóir anois beag i dtaobh lóin a fuair sé nach raibh sásúil i dtig ósta den Ghrád A i mbaile éigin san Iarthar? Is dóigh liom go mba cheart go mbeadh eolas le fáil i dtaobh cé acu atá na tithe ósta sin dá rearadh fé mar ba mhaith linn iad a bheith. Ba cheart dúinn luí air sin—luí ar an bhfírinne. Is iad ár muintir féin na cuairteoirí is iomadúla a thagann ar cuairt chugainn in Éirinn agus ba chóir dúinn ár ndícheall a dhéanamh chun go dtiocfaidís thar n-ais arís agus taitneamh a bhaint as a dturas.

Mr. J. Lynch

In so far as there was any criticism levelled against this Bill, apart from An Bord Fáilte, it was that sufficient money was not being made available under its provisions for the purposes set out. I should like to remind Senators, however, that the provisions in this Bill are not total amounts. The £1,000,000 provided for amenities is intended to supplement local contributions. I should like to remind Senators also that all the ills from which our countryside suffers are not the responsibility of An Bord Fáilte and that there is an onus on local authorities, much more than they have been inclined to accept in general, to brighten up the countryside and avail of the facilities they have for the clearance of derelict sites and so forth.

I might say, however, that even though the Derelict Sites Act is in existence, it has not been, for one reason or another, availed of to any appreciable extent for the purposes for which it was intended. Therefore, there is in preparation in the Department of Local Government the heads of a Bill that will speed up the clearance and facilitate in general the clearance of these derelict sites throughout the country. I have to travel to many places myself almost every week. I agree with Senators that it is unpleasant to see houses that have been vacated, with thatched roofs falling and haybarns with rusty corrugated iron hanging down and not used. These are eyesores that should be removed on the very earliest possible occasion.

It is a pity that local authorities have not availed of the powers they have. It is hoped that with the powers they will get and the facilities that will be available to them, they will tackle that job with greater vigour and with some effect. We all agree that we have in this country facilities and amenities that are not available in many other countries which call themselves tourist countries. We may not have scenery which is nicer than anywhere in the world; we may not have roads that are better than the roads anywhere else in the world; but we have a combination of scenery and roads that is better than anything that can be found in any other part of the world.

For that reason, I think we have here an attraction for motor tourists in particular greater than in any other country that I am aware of or have read about. The big difficulty is, of course, the provision of adequate and suitable hotel accommodation. Despite the inducements offered in the previous measures, unfortunately, the hotel owners have not been availing of these facilities to the extent required.

Senator Ó Maoláin pointed out one of the immediate difficulties, that is, the propensity of the local authority to increase their income by way of rates from the owners of premises which are improved. I have often wondered whether our local rating system is the proper one, whether we should not have a new system of local taxation altogether because I believe it bears unfairly on too few people. The property owner has to bear the brunt of local taxation, whereas a wealthy man who owns no property in a particular area can get away without paying any local taxation or paying relatively little local taxation. There are many people who are wealthy people in a local community and who pay taxation only to the central Exchequer. However, I do not know whether the day will come when we can so revise our local taxation system as to ensure that the burden will be borne more evenly throughout the community.

Since we have got this system of rating, the system of valuation through which we provide our local taxation, I think it must be accepted that the rates must be based on the value generally of property, but, nevertheless, there are means whereby hoteliers can escape the full brunt of the local taxation by way of the remissions provided. I said, in opening, that if improvements are carried out there is for a period of seven years a remissions of two-thirds of the increased rate attributable to these improvements. As well as that, account is also taken of the fact that there may not be full occupancy of increased bedroom accommodation, so that it is not quite true to say that rates are slapped on— as has been said here—the minute somebody adds to his premises, particularly to hotel premises. Nevertheless, I have great sympathy with them, but, on the other hand, we have the systems of relief that has been introduced not only by way of relief of rates but the tax concession of 10 per cent. of the capital expenditure and the further two per cent. annual wear and tear allowance.

In regard to the criticisms of hotels in particular—or possibly the criticism of An Bord Fáilte in so far as they have the means of requiring these hotels to attain a certain standard— Bord Fáilte cannot be on the doorstep of every hotelier. It is a matter for the hotels themselves to appreciate that they have a goose and to take advantage of that goose in order to get the golden egg will, in the long run, affect their own business. It is true for Senator O'Quigley to say that our food standards are not very good. I will agree with him if he refers to the question of variety but not if he refers to the question of quality. By and large, the quality of our food is as good as we get in any part of the world but unfortunately we have not got the capacity to get variety in the food. We need only refer to our own restaurant in the House. There is not a Senator who could not reel off tomorrow's menu, whether it is for luncheon or for tea.

Similarly in many hotels we can anticipate approximately 75 per cent. of what is to be provided: kidney soup, or brown windsor, roast mutton, roast lamb, cabbage, peas, carrots, potatoes, mashed or roasted, and a few sweets, trifle and so on, with which we are all too familiar. That perhaps is not the fault of the hoteliers themselves but rather the fault of the training facilities we have been providing down through the years. I am glad to say that Bord Fáilte have taken up that matter very actively and, I hope, ultimately, very effectively. There are a number of training schools for hotel staffs throughout the country which are operated by Bord Fáilte in conjunction with the vocational committees. There is one in Cobh and one in Bundoran and there is one elsewhere. There is a particular one in Athenry in which young chefs are trained and which was opened only last Winter. I believe that with such training, we shall be able eventually to provide a variety of dishes for our visitors that will enhance the tourist trade and add considerable to the income of the hoteliers throughout the country.

There is one matter in that respect which I should like to raise and it is a personal point. In many parts of the continent, they have special dishes. It may be goulash or sauerkraut, which I think is peculiar to the Alsatian countries. There are in our own country dishes which we could popularise in a similar manner. I will come nearer home and refer to drisheen which is a dish popular in Cork. Unfortunately, very few people outside Cork eat drisheens—perhaps because it is prepared in a simple and not generally attractive form. I feel that there is room, especially in Cork, for cashing in, so to speak, on the individuality of drisheens by presenting that dish in such a manner as to make it attractive to visitors not only from abroad but from our own country. Perhaps there may be other dishes peculiar to other parts of the country which might, with a little imagination and care, be presented in such an attractive fashion as will, first of all, create a reputation for that dish and consequently a reputation for that particular area.

Senator Louis Walsh made a point about Grade B and Grade C hotels and appeared to suggest that if a person improved his hotel and qualified for Grade A rating, he would automatically have to increase his prices. I do not think that is correct. Perhaps I misunderstood the Senator. All that Bord Fáilte requires is that the hotel —no matter what its grade—should publish its prices in advance so that its customers will know what they are being charged for rooms and for a meal for the short or long term they propose to stay. Certainly a man with a Grade A hotel can charge as low as he likes as long as he publishes in advance the cost of his room and food.

It is true, of course, that the bulk of our visitors from abroad come from the Midlands of Great Britain and it would be wrong for us to ignore that fact or to ignore the possibilities that are available to us in catering for that kind of trade. The defects of the cross-channel services have been the subject matter of inter-Governmental negotiations and certainly Bord Fáilte have on many occasions made representations to British Railways for improvements in these services. I should like to point out, however, that many defects of that nature are not peculiar to this country, or to the services being provided for tourists coming to this country. I am sure many Senators have had experience of British Railways as they operate in Britain.

On my way back from a Council of Europe meeting last year, I ran into fog and had to come overland from Parish and across the English Channel by ship. The services provided for us certainly were anything but First class. When we arrived at the station at Folkestone we found there was one dining-car capable of seating 20 people and there were 260 people on the train. Even though the boat arrived in at 6 o'clock in the morning, there were no facilities for seating people and the first 16 or 20 people into the dining-car were the only people who got breakfast between there and London, unless they had flasks with them and very few had. These are matters which would scarcely be tolerated in this country and if they were experienced somebody would kick up a tremendous row. The British seem to accept them without any great show of resentment. I mention this experience only to indicate that if there are shortcomings here, they are by no means peculiar to our own country.

As I have said, in so far as there were criticisms made, many of them were directed against Bord Fáilte. I was one of the critics of Bord Fáilte before I ever realised I might have some responsibility for them. Now because I have responsibility, I am not going to try to defend them until such time as I may find that these criticisms are not justified. I have not had the opportunity of going in to the matter fully yet and, as a matter of fact, I was to meet members of the Board today but I had to postpone the meeting as I had to come to the Seanad.

I am not satisfied that we are getting either an adequate return from the money we put at the disposal of Bord Fáilte or for the effort they are putting into it. I am not suggesting that that shortcoming, if it is a shortcoming, is due to Bord Fáilte itself. Bord Fáilte cannot be expected to lead people by the ear and show them what should be done or how it should be done. As many Senators know and have pointed out, there is a responsibility on local communities to do something for themselves—and on individuals, for that matter. An Bord Fáilte have the facilities for helping them on their way.

So far as the specific complaint made by a Senator Ó Maoláin is concerned, I, too, have had similar experience of a hotelier who appeared to have everything in his favour and who was more than reasonably solvent, who had well prepared plans for extension and he was almost literally played out by An Bord Fáilte in the matter of securing his grant. These are matters I propose to investigate for myself, now that I have the opportunity of doing so.

Senator Ó Donnabháin took us on a conducted tour from the front at Clontarf down through the country and back again to O'Connell Bridge. As far as the specific question he put to me is concerned, as to who financed the improvements at Howth and Clontarf and Dún Laoghaire, the truth is, of course, that the local authority, as they should do, carried out the major portion of it but An Bord Fáilte assisted them by way of grant.

I do not intend to get into the row between two Cork men resident in Dublin about the merits of the thing on O'Connell Bridge. I have my own views on that, but not being a member of Dublin Corporation, I have no responsibility for it and no means of doing anything about it.

Senator Louis Walsh made another point about the fact that, in order to qualify for a grant under this hotel bedroom extension scheme, there had to be a minimum of five bedrooms. Unless we have some minimum, it would be very difficult to know what is and what is not a hotel. It is not the intention, I may as well say candidly, to assist in the extension of ordinary private accommodation of people who may want to let their houses or let rooms in their houses to tourists in the Summer time. The intention is, not only to extend but to improve accommodation and to ensure that such accommodation is of a certain standard. If people want to go in for the constant letting of their premises or rooms in their premises to tourists, they will have to set about getting proper registration from An Bord Fáilte; otherwise An Bord Fáilte will not be interested in assisting in improving their premises. They have other means available to them to do that.

Senator Quinlan's suggestion about a House committee is one which I approach with mixed feelings. In the first place, tourism was examined in great detail by the first inter-Party Government. I think it was through a special commission or special expert consultants, who presented a report called the Christenberry Report. At the same time, a delegation of Irish hotel-owners went to the United States and studied tourism from most angles and particularly from the hotel accommodation angle. These, too, presented a report about the same time. These reports were examined by the Government—I think, by two successive Governments—and a special Cabinet sub-committee was set up to report and make recommendations to the Government. After prolonged examination and discussion, the 1952 Tourist Act emerged and that is the basis on which our tourist policy stands.

To that extent, it is a combination of not only the combined thinking of two Governments but of outside experts, as well as our own hotel experts at home. As well as that, as the House knows, there is the Irish Tourist Association—which is composed largely of members of local authorities —who receive their income from the local authorities and who have representation on An Bord Fáilte as well. I believe that a joint House committee might to a certain extent tend to overlap what is already being done and there might be certain duplication of effort.

I should like to assure the Senator, however, that as far as I am aware, An Bord Fáilte examine very closely the debates touching on tourism in both Houses and any worthwhile suggestions contained in these debates are always examined home and, where desirable, are adopted. As well as that, there is no Deputy or Senator who, if he feels he has a worthwhile suggestion to make, need have any reluctance about approaching Bord Fáilte or any one of the officers or members of the Board.

Mar focal scor, ba mhaith liom a rá leis an Seanadóir Ó Siochfhradha go bhfuil, fé mar a dúras cheana, córas cigiríochta ag An Bord Fáilte. Is sé an géaran a chloisim, pé scéal é ná go mbíonn na cigirí ró-chúramach nó ró-ghéar in a gcuid cigiríochta. Dé gnáth, fé mar is éol dó, ní thugann siad aon fhógra roimh ré, dón ostóir, go bhfuil siad ag teacht.

Pádraig Ó Siochfhradha

Bíonn an t-eolas acu, mar sin féin.

Professor Quinlan

Would the Minister indicate whether he would consider the suggestion about a joint committee?

Mr. Lynch

I thought I dealt with that. Having considered it, I do not think it is necessary—in this particular instance, anyway.

Question put and agreed to.

Agreed to take remaining Stages today.

Bill considered in Committee.

Section 1 agreed to.

SECTION 2.

Question proposed: "That Section 2 stand part of the Bill."

Professor Quinlan

There is just one query I have to put under (a), regarding grants for the development of major tourist resorts. The Minister indicated that he would like, as far as possible, to have local contributions. Would it be possible to have local contributions by way of payment on cars entering those major resorts? It always struck me that the travelling motorists gained the benefits of the resorts, while paying little or no contribution. A slight fee, of 2/- or 2/6, on each car would build up a fund and help the contributions from the Board.

Mr. J. Lynch

One of the most irritating things any tourist in any country has to subject himself to is a toll in any form. There is something operating in London that annoys me—— the tax of five shillings at London Airport.

Mr. McGuire

It is seven and six now.

Mr. J. Lynch

I nearly always have an argument with the person who seeks to collect it from me. I certainly would avoid these irritants in Ireland, as far as we can.

Senator Walsh asked how a local authority, a county council, might be expected to contribute to such a development scheme. The contribution may be assessed in kind, for example, the cost of road works or drainage schemes or maintenance of walls. They have that power already so that there will be no legislative or administrative difficulty arising in that regard.

Question put and agreed to.

Section 3 agreed to.

Title agreed to.

Bill reported without recommendation, received for final consideration and ordered to be returned to the Dáil.

Seanad Éireann díospóireacht - Thursday, 30 Jul 1959

Tourist Traffic Bill, 1959 (Certified Money Bill) — Second and subsequent Stages

Seanad Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 30 Jul 1959