Seanad Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 20 Oct 2004

Vol. 178 No. 7

Planning and Related Issues: Statements (Resumed).

Mr. Brennan

I will share my time with Senator Mansergh. I welcome the Minister to the House and wish him well in his new portfolio. I have no doubt he has addressed many of the problems within the planning system. Solutions lie in many areas and the Minister is first to identify them.

Local authorities experience many problems in the planning process in respect of staffing levels and applications. The large number of applications is a sign that much development is taking place nationally. Councils are at full stretch to process the applications. A suggestion has been made from both sides of the House that pre-planning discussions should take place. Hopefully the Minister will address the issue of national staffing levels.

In his address, the Minister mentioned national infrastructure. We have seen many changes take place with regard to waste management plans, which have been adopted by local and regional authorities and brought forward to the Minister by county managers. Much has been said about An Bord Pleanála and An Taisce and their roles in the planning process. There is also concern as to how industries will implement their waste management programmes. It is important that elected members of local authorities and the Oireachtas have a say in where they are established. It is fine to welcome development of national infrastructure, but it is important that people have a say, through their elected representatives, in how decisions are made. We have adopted county development plans but it should not be the right of the county manager to be the first person to break the plan. I refer to the issue of waste management which is important. People will be watching this issue carefully in the years ahead. Perhaps the Minister could elaborate more on that issue.

Dr. Mansergh

I warmly welcome the Minister and congratulate him on his appointment. He was an outstanding Minister of State with responsibility for European affairs. Given his particular background in the Civil Service, public administration and local and national politics, he is an extraordinarily well-equipped Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government and I look forward to the impact he will have.

I must declare an interest in this discussion as I have a brother in the planning profession in County Cork. I am not my brother's keeper, nor he mine, and our views do not always coincide.

The national spatial strategy is important in facilitating development outside Dublin. Development is starting to spread away from the main centres. I am beginning to feel it in Tipperary, especially in the south, in some of the towns other than Clonmel.

There are extraordinary development pressures which in turn put a great deal of pressure on planning offices to work very late to cope with demand. We have record levels of housing and construction. There are also other sorts of developments and these need to be examined.

We have discussed whether there should be a break between planners leaving planning offices after a short time and taking up consultancy work. This was discussed in the context of the central Civil Service.

Senator O'Toole made the point regarding eight million people living in Ireland. In the 1840s people lived and worked in situ and did not have to commute to work. We will have to cope with a much larger population than we have now, but it is a different problem from the great problems that existed then.

The key is pre-consultation between planners and applicants. That works well in some counties in terms of problems being ironed out and people knowing what to expect. In Cork County Council, for example, the architecture department has produced a book of models for one-off housing in the countryside. If one is chosen from among these several dozen models, it may help to reduce planning difficulties.

I am a little alarmed by the degree of ideological conflict. At one end of the spectrum is the Irish Rural Dwellers Association which effectively seems to be saying that all planning should be eliminated and most planners are foreign in any case.

Mr. Bannon

Nobody would ever say that.

Dr. Mansergh

On the other hand, An Taisce has an ideological approach whereby everybody in this reasonably sizeable country must live in close proximity so as to make public transport viable. One must go with the grain and we should remind ourselves occasionally that we live in a democracy. It is necessary to marry the wishes of the people with the professional advice we receive. It is a constant process of negotiation between the two. I deprecate, particularly with regard to Dublin, the views of some commentators that all our green spaces and parks should be built upon. That would be a dreadful approach to take.

Sitting suspended at 1.35 p.m. and resumed at 3 p.m.