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Seanad Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 29 Mar 2007

Vol. 186 No. 18

Order of Business.

The Order of Business is No. 1, a referral motion whereby the subject matter of No. 25 on the Order Paper, which concerns an order which will come into effect on 1 May 2007 to refine the class of media mergers which must be notified to the Competition Authority and to revoke the Competition Act 2002 (Section 18(5)) Order 2002 (SI 622 of 2002) which is in operation since 1 January 2003, is being referred without debate to the Joint Committee on Enterprise and Small Business for consideration; No. 2, a referral motion whereby the subject matter of No. 23 on the Order Paper, which concerns a ministerial order which is required to allow the Dublin Docklands Development Authority to prepare a draft planning scheme for the Poolbeg area of the docklands, section 25 of the Dublin Docklands Development Authority Act 1997 providing for the preparation by the authority, and the approval by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, of planning schemes for parts of the Dublin docklands area, is being referred without debate to the Joint Committee on Environment and Local Government for consideration; No. 3, Health Bill 2006 — Report and Final Stages, to be taken on the conclusion of the Order of Business and to conclude no later than 12 p.m.; No. 4, Social Welfare and Pensions Bill 2007 — Report and Final Stages, to be taken at 12 p.m. and to conclude no later than 1 p.m.; No. 5, motion for earlier signature of the Social Welfare and Pensions Bill 2007, to be taken immediately and without debate on the conclusion of No. 4; No. 6, Finance Bill 2007 — Report and Final Stages, to be taken at 1.30 p.m. and to conclude no later than 3.30 p.m.; and No. 7, motion for earlier signature of the Finance Bill 2007, to be taken immediately and without debate on the conclusion of No. 6. There will be a sos from 1 p.m. to 1.30 p.m.

Will time be provided next week for the Minister for Education and Science to attend the House to make a statement and take questions on the controversy surrounding legal letters sent to victims of sex abuse who came through the national school system over many years? The Acting Leader will be aware of a "Prime Time" programme on this subject last week. It is worrying that needless anxiety is being caused to hundreds of sex abuse victims who seem to be put to one side simply because they attended national school.

I am the first to admit that the rainbow Government made mistakes in the McCole case, but at least a compensation mechanism was put in place for victims in that situation. The Government should realise that public administration and politicians often make mistakes but we need to learn the lessons of that mistake. The manner in which the Department is dealing with this matter is suspect.

An opportunity should be afforded to the Minister for Education and Science to attend the House because the Seanad has a role to ensure the Government can rethink its position and not repeat past mistakes. Colleagues on both sides of the House have raised this matter over the past week. I request that debate to ensure we do not make the same mistakes again concerning people who have been traumatised by the most grotesque sexual abuse, including rape allegations. Just because they went through the national school system, they seem to have been put to one side, and that is unacceptable. Can time be provided next week for that debate?

There is much in the Criminal Justice Bill which I and my party colleagues would support, but we need to have a significant period of reflection between Second Stage and Committee Stage. I am not sure whether the Bill is coming to the House next week, but if it is, will the Acting Leader give a guarantee that Committee Stage will not be taken until after the Easter recess? This would give us more time to consider the legislation which deals with basic issues such as the criminal justice system and fundamental rights. We need to get it right and ensure the balance is firmly in place in the legislation as it goes through both Houses of the Oireachtas.

I support the call for a debate on that issue. Some 150 families are now under threat from the Department of Education and Science. They have been told by the State Claims Agency that every single case will be fought. They have also been told their houses could be at risk if they lose the case because the State will force them to pay their legal expenses. I have no doubt that colleagues on the Government side of the House will feel exactly the same as we do on that issue. I think the Government's legal advisers have lost the run of themselves.

The State Claims Agency is run by the National Treasury Management Agency which is in the business of saving and making money. Going back to where we were long ago, they will frighten, charge, punish and pursue people for the sake of an extra shilling. In all these cases, no one is trying to take the State for anything. They all concern people who seek some form of redress having suffered appalling physical or sexual abuse, or people who seek some form of special education for their children.

We may agree or disagree with some of the issues, but these matters must be raised with the Minister for Education and Science and the Taoiseach. This is not the way to do it and it does not reflect any Minister's view. It would not reflect the Minister, Deputy Mary Hanafin's, view. It is no longer acceptable, however, for Ministers to say this is the legal advice and this is what they are doing. It is not acceptable and the matter must be discussed in this Chamber. The Minister should attend the House for such a debate.

The Minister should also take the opportunity to spell out what the Taoiseach meant last Saturday when, in a most welcome development, he indicated that thousands of extra teachers would be made available to improve class sizes. I have raised previously the question of primary school class sizes, but the same applies to post-primary schools where thousands of pupils attend classes of more than 30. The Taoiseach said he looked forward to improving class sizes, especially for English, mathematics and Gaeilge. The Minister for Education and Science should explain to us what she intends to do in this respect. There is a great deal of aggravation about class sizes. If the Government has a solution in hand, let us hear it and reduce the pressure by implementing it.

We had arranged a number of extra seats on the cross-benches today in expectation that some Government Members might cross the floor.

No show yet.

It is a no show, however. Perhaps the Government Whip will indicate whether we should make arrangements for additional Members on the cross-benches.

It is not relevant to the Order of Business.

We might need to reshuffle our spokespersons.

It is not relevant.

He is staying with the same cabal.

As I have far too much respect for the Cathaoirleach, I will not follow Senator O'Toole's concluding line, however tempted I might be to do so.

The Senator jumped himself.

Order now, please.

One down and one plus.

I have called Senator Brendan Ryan on the Order of Business.

The behaviour of the legal people, operating on behalf of the Minister for Education for Education and Science, towards victims of what can at best be called State neglect — people who were sexually abused in primary schools — is nothing short of disgraceful. The Members opposite were probably among the most vocal in the country when a previous Minister for Health was blamed for similar letters. I would like to hear them rediscovering their voices now. When they do so, they might ask the Minister why she stated that she has no legal responsibility towards these people when we know the Government had no legal responsibility towards the religious whom it bailed out to the tune of €1 billion when they were being sued. Maybe that was the correct decision, although I do not want to go down that road. It is clear, however, that the State had no legal obligation to do it. Are we to take it from the Government that the religious orders are more important than sexually abused children in primary schools?

That is the question.

That would be an appalling statement of priorities for our society and the country at large. I would like to hear something about that matter from the Members opposite.

Although the media did not make a big fuss of it, the Arab world yesterday offered Israel a deal. If it returns to its pre-1967 borders, the Arab world will give Israel full recognition. A statement in this regard was issued from Saudi Arabia yesterday on behalf of the Arab world. I want to hear an immediate and generous response to this from our Government and from the European Union because there will be no immediate and generous response from Israel if nobody stands up to it.

I ask the Acting Leader to arrange a debate on mental health services, although I know time is short. I am concerned at utterances made by Dr. Finnerty, the Inspector of Mental Health Services. I have been involved in this issue for many years and have always advocated the devolution of the service from the hospital to the community. The community can provide a better service for staff and patients, but it is more expensive.

I read an article on this subject in one of the national newspapers this morning and one thing that came to mind was that we recognise that additional resource have been devolved, rightly, to this area. I cannot help noticing, however, that many of the issues reported by the inspector are operational matters. The painting of a building is not a matter to concern the Minister or any Member of either House. It is a matter for the Health Service Executive, HSE, and the people it employs. I do not propose to have this debate now but I ask the Acting Leader to organise a debate on this matter, if possible, in the short time we have left as I have many points to make.

I have often raised the issue of electricity costs and the lack of activity when the market was liberalised some years ago. I pointed out that domestic consumers have no option but to pay the enhanced rate while commercial users may enjoy a degree of competition. I welcome the decision to separate the grid from the main service provider in this country to stimulate competition. People realise and the Government recognises that if we do not do this the European Commission will insist we do it to liberalise the electricity market.

I believe the Electricity Supply Board, ESB, workers and unions are going in the wrong direction if they are threatening to stop this happening. High energy users met our committee and told us bluntly that escalating energy costs in the country will deter employers and threaten jobs unless a degree of competition is introduced. I think making such threats before the general election is the wrong road for the unions to take.

Many Senators wish to contribute and I ask speakers to be brief so that everyone can be accommodated.

I formally congratulate Senator Brian Hayes on being announced Senator of the year.

I asked for brevity and request that the Senator speak on matters relating to the Order of Business.

Mea culpa.

There will be no complimentary copy of Magill for Senator Leyden this year.

Senator Finucane should not speak too soon.

I think a debate on the issue of local radio would be timely. When I was spokesman for Fianna Fáil, I brought a Bill through the House relating to the establishment of local radio stations.

Did they have radio then?

They did not have local radio then.

We must try to accommodate all speakers and we will not have time if this continues.

The media group East Midlands Allied Press, EMAP, is selling the local radio stations Today FM, FM 104 and Highland Radio. The local radio station, Shannonside & Northern Sound, was sold to a Kerry group in which my colleague, Senator Coghlan, has an interest. My point is that the State gave these licences that are being sold as commodities from which people are making fortunes. Local radio should be local, not a national radio service, and I will not get much coverage on local radio for saying that. I hope the Acting Leader can arrange a debate on the future of local radio stations before the election because they are no longer local; they are multinational commodities.

I request that we discuss fishing either in this session or in the session after Easter because I see that the European Union is introducing a ban on the dumping of fish. Between 30% and 90% of the catch off the west coasts of Ireland and Scotland is dumped and this an appalling waste of resources, especially as our fish stocks are threatened.

Despite the fact that I was knocked off the electoral register for a while in North Great George's Street, I was polled. I have now received a letter from Bertie. I can call him Bertie because he signs his name so and he calls me David. He tells me that owing to the level of security in my flat complex, it is not always possible for him to meet me so he invites me to meet him at his clinic in Drumcondra. Could the Cathaoirleach tell him that I am too busy in this House and will have to await his visit?

I do not think that is relevant to the Order of Business.

I beg the Cathaoirleach's pardon and I am sure he will find the next item entirely relevant. Although we are graced by the presence of the Acting Leader, Senator Dardis, today, it is a pity the Leader cannot be with us because she is a woman of international celebrity, as we learn from the property pages of The Irish Times.

This is also not relevant to the Order of Business.

The Irish Times points out that while the United Nations has goodwill ambassadors, the Secretary General, Mr. Ban Ki-Moon, can eat his heart out because Athlone has Senator O'Rourke. Cleopatra may have ruled the Nile but the scintillating Senator is queen of the Shannon.

What is Senator Norris queen of?

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