Léim ar aghaidh chuig an bpríomhábhar
Gnáthamharc

SELECT COMMITTEE on HERITAGE and the IRISH LANGUAGE díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 20 Jun 2001

Vol. 4 No. 4

Estimates for Public Services, 2001.

Vote 41 — Arts Council (Revised).

Vote 42 — Department of Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands (Revised).

Vote 43 — The National Gallery (Revised).

I was dealing with advertising directed at children and the developments that have taken in place in some EU countries. Deputy O'Shea asked whether this issue was raised at meetings, particularly during the Swedish Presidency, because the Swedes have taken a particular interest in this matter. They have been somewhat frustrated at the undermining of what they see as the national provision by broadcasters under their jurisdiction due to the Television Without Frontiers Directive. I had an opportunity at a recent informal Council of Ministers meeting to discuss the issue when I made my views known and supported the Swedish position. The Commission, which will be drawing up proposals to amend the Television Without Frontiers Directive, is aware of both the Swedish and Irish positions on the matter.

Deputy Higgins asked whether the capital funding of £500,000 applied to community stations as well as local stations. Yes, this funding will assist both stations in regard to difficulties with transmitters where more than one site is required and where different franchise areas must be covered. The £500,000 is referred to in the broadcasting legislation following the commitment to the 3% levy but the allocation of the money is purely a matter for the Independent Radio and Television Commission.

The funding of TG4 was raised by a number of Deputies. Obviously we all have an ongoing interest in the development of TG4 and a great deal of good work is being done by a group of very young of people, which is an example of what can be done in broadcasting. As a result I was very pleased to have secured a significant increase of 24% in funding this year for the station. The additional funding for 2001 enabled TG4 to begin substantial capital works at its headquarters in Baile na hAbhann where it wants to update and expand the existing facilities. The station is also looking to the onset of the digital era. The provision in the Broadcasting Act refers to the establishment of TG4 as a separate entity, which will be done by way of consultation with the Comhairle and RTE.

Deputies McGinley and O'Shea raised the question of the commencement of the Broadcasting Act and the establishment of the Broadcasting Commission of Ireland. Given the debate on the Bill in both the Dáil and Seanad, Deputies will be aware that the Independent Radio and Television Commission, which will become the Broadcasting Commission of Ireland, will have an extended role. It has put forward proposals which I have put to the Department of Finance. We are attempting to secure the necessary sanction for additional resources which the commission will need given its new role.

Questions were raised in regard to the current Arts plan 1999-2001. There is currently an evaluation of the plan. The same procedure was carried out following the completion of the first arts plan. This exercise was very useful and will be needed before the council will be in a position to plan for its forthcoming arts plan. It has already begun an extensive consultation process for the next plan from 2001 onwards. The council is encouraging people to take part in that consultation process and has set up a website where people can give their views. Under the current arts plan, the Arts Council has moved from being purely a grant-giving agency to being a developmental agency. I am sure this is something we all welcome because it is the way we should progress.

Deputy McGinley asked about the Asgard which he will be aware is in the ownership of the Minister for Defence. My Department’s role relates to the issuing of a licence to the Asgard restoration project. On the housing of the artefact, I am advised that the ARP was notified by the National Museum of Ireland that the accommodation for the Asgard in the car park of the Point Depot raised many concerns and was most unsuitable. The ARP has since moved the vessel to the enclosed yard in the docks which has 24 hour security. This appears to be a far better option and the National Museum will continue to monitor the conditions under which the Asgard is stored.

A question was raised about the opening hours of the National Museum. Apparently the museum opens six days a week from Tuesday to Sunday, to which Christmas Day and Good Friday are the only exceptions. Opening on Mondays is receiving considerable attention and the Department of Finance is considering the significant staffing implications of this. I hope the matter will be resolved and that opening seven days a week can be achieved. Turlough Park is of great interest because this will be a great improvement on what we can offer those who come to enjoy the different elements of the museum. The folklife collection will be housed there. The official opening will be in the autumn if not before. The opening of Turlough Park House has implications for staff. Six were appointed and 18 more posts are sanctioned. I am confident that the museum will operate to a high professional standard with 24 staff.

The issue of CDIS and the access scheme was raised. EU and Exchequer funding of £19.5 million was provided under the operational plan for tourism 1994 to 1999. When other money is taken into account, the total funding was around £45 million. The CDIS ran out in 1999 and was not replaced. We need Exchequer funding to build the arts infrastructure and the Government gave £36 million for the access scheme which will run from 2001 to 2004. As with CDIS, private funding will be generated to bring the overall capital expenditure to more than £45 million. The applications are being carefully sifted through and I will announce soon the successful applicants under the access scheme. Deputy O'Shea raised the funding of projects and mentioned some in which he is interested. I spoke to him separately about one of those projects. These projects were outside the scope of access. There is huge interest in the scheme and the number of applications will not facilitate general funding outside its parameters. Only some applications will be successful.

Deputy Michael Higgins referred to Eglinton Canal, Galway. He asked when the required works will be carried out. The project, managed by Office of Public Works, involves replacing a bridge at Parkaverragh lock in Galway city. The detailed design will be completed this month and the job will go to tender. A contractor should be on site at the start of September and the job completed by the end of October.

Concerns were voiced about stone national monuments. A Case Study 2000 was produced by the Heritage Council. My Department, through Dúchas, is aware of the points raised in the survey and agrees with most of them. Reference was made to damage caused by repair work using Portland cement. That cement is not used by my Department. The report states that such repairs, while problematic in themselves, did arrest structural decay, especially in harder limestone constructions and so there is a positive element. I emphasise that my Department is to the fore in stone conservation and follows best international practice. Last November I announced an investment of more than £100 million in built heritage under the national development plan, an unprecedented commitment to the conservation of national monuments in State care. Baltinglass and Trim abbeys were specifically referred to. Dúchas conducts maintenance work twice yearly at Baltinglass Abbey. Masonry work on the nave arcade was undertaken three years ago and is routinely checked. The Heritage Council assessment of the abbey is not shared by Dúchas professionals. My departmental advisers believe the risk to Trim Abbey is not as acute as the Heritage Council report suggests. Deputy McGinley referred to Donegal and Doe castles. The work on Donegal Castle represents a step forward for it and the town generally. Such improvements mean we can promote the built and natural heritage which increases visitor numbers bringing revenue to an area or region. Donegal Castle has 30,000 visitors annually. The site at Doe Castle is conserved and the remaining structures are in good condition. We want to conserve our many national monuments for the future. That does not always necessitate full restoration. If that were so, we could concentrate on only a few to the detriment of the rest. Our general approach is the right one.

The national inventory of architectural heritage was discussed in both Houses. It will take 12 years to complete. There are a million structures and sites and we want to ensure the standards in surveying them fulfils international criteria. Other jurisdictions take longer to correlate their information. During the debates, I stated that if we took this road, the work would take 12 years, but if we did not it would be 40 years. I reiterate that there will be interim surveys of the 26 counties in the next two to three years, which will help speed up the process. We are making good headway compared to other jurisdictions, such as England where it took four years to compile a parks and gardens register of 1,085 sites.

Everyone here favours conservation but the method and implementation of programmes cause concern. We formally transmitted to the European Commission 362 candidate special areas of conservation. Our proposals will be sufficient when the second seminar evaluates the proposals in the EU's Atlantic region. That conference will take place later in the year. Members are aware of the liaison committees, appeal systems and compensation for loss with regard to SACs.

Preparation is under way to designate further SPAs and extend some of the existing sites. Many sites — the important areas for birds — comprise coastal and inland waterways or small offshore islands. Some are on farmland. The same comprehensive procedures apply as for SACs, where landowners are concerned.

The acquisition of headquarters for the Heritage Council is primarily a function for the council. There have been discussions between the council and the Representative Church Body of the Church of Ireland because there was interest in acquiring the building known as the Bishop's Palace in Kilkenny and agreement had been reached. As there was some concern within the congregation of the Church of Ireland, a motion was put to discuss the matter further and the majority were in favour of proceeding. The Church of Ireland has resumed communications with the Heritage Council and I await the result of these deliberations. The decision is, first and foremost, one for the Heritage Council and the RCB.

Deputy O'Shea asked for information about the Discovery programme. The programme is funded through the Heritage Council. It was initiated in 1999 and deals with the western stone forts projects, the north Munster project, the Tara project, the lake settlement in Ireland and the medieval rural settlement. A total of £900,000 is provided for the work in 2001, an increase of £60,000 on last year's figure.

Deputy McGinley raised the question of co-operation between my Department and others, particularly the Departments of the Marine and Natural Resources and the Environment and Local Government, under the national development plan. There is tremendous co-operation, both politically and between officials, arising from which we hope to deliver on the NDP.

Bhí go leor ceist faoi Údarás na Gaeltachta. Aontaím, go mórmhór faoin méid a bhí le rá ag an Teachta Mac Fhionnlaoich mar gheall ar bhéim níos mó a chur ar na mion-Gaeltachtaí. Tá a fhios ag an Teachta go bhfuil na réamh-monarchana ag dul ar aghaidh ins na mion-Gaeltachtaí agus tá súil agam go gcuideoidh sé sin le muintir na nGaeltachtaí uilig.

Maidir le fostaíocht ar na hoileáin, bhí seans agam casadh le muintir na n-oileán cupla seachtain ó shin. Easpa fostaíochta an deacracht is mó atá acu. Tá brú ar thionscail na hiascaireachta agus mar gheall ar sin tá mé ag smaoineadh ar scéim do mhuintir na n-oileán, b'fhéidir tríd na boird fiontair, chun níos mó cabhrach a thabhairt do na hoileáin. Tá cuidiú le fáil fós ó Leader ach tá deacrachtaí ag baint leis sin. Tá súil agam go gcuideoidh polasaí na Roinne maidir le cursaí infrastruchtúir agus nua-teicneolaíochta le saol na n-oileán. Aontaím go bhfuil fadhbanna ann. Déanann Údarás na Gaeltachta agus na boird fiontair gach iarracht chun cabhair a thabhairt do mhuintir na n-oileán agus ath-chruth a chur ar fhostaíocht ar na hoileáin.

D'fhiafraigh an Teachta Ó Sé cár cailleadh na postanna. Cailleadh iad, go mórmhór, i dtionscail na n-iascaireachta, phróiseáil éisc agus déantús na n-éadaí. Tá an brú céanna ar na Gaeltachtaí uilig. Cailleadh go leor postanna nuair a dúnadh monarchana i mBéal an Mhuirthead agus i gCasla. Ag an am céanna, tá Údarás na Gaeltachta ag amharc ar phostanna nua-aimseartha a thabhairt isteach chuig na Gaeltachtaí uilig. Tá súil agam go mbeidh mé féin agus an t-Aire ábalta comh-oibriú a dhéanamh leis an Aire Fiontar Poiblí chun teicneolaíocht úr a thabhairt isteach go dtí na Gaeltachtaí agus go gcothóidh sé sin na postanna nua-aimseartha ab ea cheart a bheith sa Ghaeltacht. Tá Údarás na Gaeltachta ag déanamh gach iarracht ard teicneolaíocht agus postanna le pá níos fearr a thabhairt isteach ins na Gaeltachtaí mar sin an fhadhb is mó atá againn. Níl mé thar a bheith sásta leis an méid atá déanta. Tá deacrachtaí ag gach duine agus cailleadh postanna ag an IDA, mar shampla, chomh maith. Chun seans níos fearr a thabhairt do mhuintir na Gaeltachta caithfear níos mó béime a chur ar na tionscail úra.

An fhadhb is mó atá ins na Gaeltachtai ná an infrastruchtúr, ní hamháin an teicneolaíocht ach na bóithre chomh maith. Sin an fáth go bhfuil ról ag an Roinn seo i gcur ar fáil na mbóithre straitéiseacha sa Ghaeltacht. Cuidíonn sin le forbairt na dtionscal ins na ceantair Gaeltachta agus beidh athrú, le cúnamh Dé, i gcursaí fostaíochta.

Aontaím leis an méid a bhí le rá ag an Teachta Mac Fhionnlaoich mar gheall ar ról níos lárnaigh a bheith ag an údarás i gcursaí teanga. Caithfear níos mó béime a chur ar an teanga agus ar thionscail na teanga. Ag éirí as an mBille chomhionnanas teanga, tá súil agam go mbeidh deis níos fearr ag muintir na nGaeltachtaí chun postanna úra a fháil sa Ghaeltacht ag plé le cursaí aistriúcháin agus mar sin de. Tá ceangal mór idir tionscal na teanga agus tionscal na turasóireachta. Tá postanna le fáil ina leithéid de Oideas Gael, an Chrannóg nó in áiteanna mar iad ar fud na nGaeltachtaí. Beidh béim níos mó feasta ar thionscal na teanga.

Chuir an Teachta Dónal Ó Muimhreacháin ceist mar gheall ar thithe Gaeltachta. Maidir le Bille na dTithe (Gaeltachta), atá sínithe anois ag an Uachtarán, ní féidir le duine a bhfuil Gaeilge aige ach atá ina chónái taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht deontas a fháil. Caithfidh duine a bheith ina chónaí ins an nGaeltacht chun an deontas a fháil. Chaithfeadh duine dul chun cónáí, nó dul ar ais chun cónaí, ins an Ghaeltacht sula a bhfaigheadh sé an deontas.

Ní raibh a fhios ag an Teachta Mícheál Ó hUigínn, nuair a bhí sé anseo an tseachtain seo chaite go raibh an Bille um chomhionnanas teanga ag dul ar aghaidh nó go bhfuil an Bille curtha ar aghaidh go dtí an chéad chéim eile agus go bhfuil sé luaite ar an am-chlár. Tá an Bille curtha go dtí Oifig na nDréachtóirí Parlaiminte don Rialtas. Tá súil agam go mbeidh sé réidh i mí Meán Fomhair agus go mbeidh sé ós comhair an Oireachtais go práinneach. Beidh mé ag lorg tacaíochta ó gach duine sa Dáil agus sa tSeanad nuair a thagann sé ós comhair na dTithe.

D'fhiafraigh an Teachta Ó hUigínn cén fáth go raibh Ciste na Gaeilge agus Foras na Gaeilge ann ag an am céanna. Is iad na comhlachtaí atá faoi chúram Fhoras na Gaeilge ná, Comhdháil Náisiúnta na Gaeilge, Gael Linn, Conradh na Gaeilge, an t-Oireachtas, an Comhlachas Náisiúnta Drámaíochta, Cumann na bhFiann, Comhluadar agus Iontaobhas Ultach. Oibríonn Foras na Gaeilge ar fud an oileáin ar fad agus sin an fáth go bhfuil na heagraíochta sin faoina chúram. Tugann Ciste na Gaeilge tacaíocht do Chomhaltas Ceoltóirí Éireann, Bord na Leabhar Gaeilge agus Taidhbhearc na Gaillimhe, nach bhfuil eagraithe ar fud na tíre ar fad. Fuair Comhaltas Ceoltóirí Éireann níos mó airgid i mbliana mar go bhfuil an comhaltas ag ceiliúradh an caoga bliain i mbliana.

Tá súil agam go mbeidh an Teachta Ó hUigínn in éineacht liom dé Luain nuair a thabharfaidh mé cuairt ar oileáin na Gaillimhe. Tá mé ag fanacht ar moltaí ó na comhairleoirí mar gheall ar chéibh Inis Meáin agus mar gheall ar na céibheanna ulig ar na hoileáin uilig. Tá súil agam go mbeidh na moltaí sin agam go luath. B'fhéidir go mbeimid ábalta iad a phlé nuair a rachaidh mé go dtí na hoileáin dé Luain seo chugainn. Ba mhaith liom moltaí mhuintir na n-oileán, na dTeachtaí agus na gcomhairleoirí a phlé ach níl siad agam go fóill. Tá a fhios agam cé chomh tábhachtach agus atá na céibheanna do mhuintir na n-oileán agus an tionchar atá acu ar shaol na n-oileán.

Chuir an Teachta Ó Sé ceist mar gheall ar an bhfoclóir. Táthar ag smaoineamh ar sin a thosú ag deireadh na bliana agus leanfaidh an obair ar feadh cúig bliain. Beidh an obair faoi chúram Fhoras na Gaeilge. Tá an fhoireann beagnach réidh fá choinne na hoibre.

Sin an méid a bhí ós mo chomhair. Má tá ceisteanna eile beidh mé lán sásta iad a fhreagairt.

Dúirt an t-Aire Stáit go bhfuil scéim á beartadh aici do na hoileáin in áit go mbeidh na boird fiontair agus daoine eile ag teacht i gcabhair orthu. Cad é, go díreach, a bhéadh i gceist leis sin? Cad é an gné de shaol na n-oileán a mbéadh siad ag tabhairt tacaíochta agus cuidiú dó?

I missed some of the Minister's contribution but I am sure she replied to most of the issues raised at the previous meeting. A number of years ago a conservation grant for protected buildings was introduced in conjunction with local authorities. Can the Minister tell us how that scheme is progressing, what is the take up and how effective it is?

Has the Arts Council's difficulty with the Gate Theatre been resolved? What is the up-to-date position? What is the up-to-date position on the Irish genealogy project?

The Asgard project has generated much comment and opinion is divided on it. The Minister seems to be bearing the brunt of the criticism for issuing the licence. Has there been a change of heart or is the project being reconsidered in view of the number of experts publicly stating their opposition to the issuing of the licence?

Representatives of An Taisce addressed the committee in recent weeks. The organisation is anxious to be placed on a statutory footing, like most of its counterparts throughout Europe. Has the Minister given consideration to this wish? Is there any reason it should not have the same status as similar organisations in other countries?

I refer to subhead A2, which refers to córais taistil agus cothaithe. There is a reduction in the outturn for 2001 for travel as it pertains to the European Union. The Estimate figure for 2000 was £64,000 while the figure for 2001 is £53,000. The Minister is, no doubt, aware of the controversy which has arisen in recent days with regard to her attendance and that of her Minister of State at Council of Ministers meetings. How many meetings have the Minister and her Minister of State attended since the Government came to office? Can she assure the committee that a boycott is not being operated by her and the former Minister of State at her Department?

While the cost of travel to the European Union has decreased, there is an almost fourfold increase in the cost of travel to places outside it. Can the Minister give details of this travel? Why is there such a large increase in this year's Estimate for other overseas travel? The figure has increased from £35,000 to £130,000.

The number of staff in the Department's training unit has increased from one person to six. Can the Minister tell the committee in detail what will happen in this regard?

Tá vótáil sa Dáil. Leanfaidh an cruinniú ar aghaidh i ndiaidh an vóta. The meeting is supsended for 15 minutes.

Sitting suspended at 10.35 a.m. and resumed at 10.55 a.m.

As I understand it, there was a lengthy exchange of views the last day.

No, there was not. I do not know how you got that impression. There were many questions asked the last day, some of which the Minister has answered. I am not the spokesperson. My colleague, Deputy Brian O'Shea, is.

Okay. We will adjourn for 15 minutes until the vote is over.

We will have difficulties later this morning. I do not know about the Fianna Fáil parliamentary party but, as you are aware, we have a parliamentary party meeting at 11.30 a.m. Would another adjournment be in order because it will obviously take more than ten minutes to complete the Estimate?

We also have statutory obligations. We will suspend the sitting for 15 minutes, return after the vote and then decide the exact procedure.

Sitting suspended at 11 a.m. and resumed at 11.15 a.m.

I am prepared to continue with the meeting and see questions being put.

Could we clarify the statutory position?

We must report tomorrow to ensure inclusion in the Order Paper for Tuesday. Our statutory obligation is to consider the Estimates.

I suggest a compromise. If we conclude our consideration of the Estimates inside the statutory framework, we should return at a later stage to informally consider outstanding issues. That may meet both points of view.

On previous occasions if questions were put, the Department arranged to provide written replies. Would the Deputy not be satisfied with that?

The best way to proceed would be to take them orally.

That is a kind of stop-start arrangement but if it is agreed——

Is it proposed to approve the Estimates and hold a meeting at a later date to consider some of the issues arising?

I would agree to that.

The proposal is that we complete the examination of the Estimates, accept or reject them and at a later date hold a meeting to discuss informally the outstanding issues.

I have no objection to that.

Is that agreed? Agreed. We have 13 minutes in which to take questions.

I was in possession when the committee adjourned for the votes. Under subhead A4 there is a considerable reduction in the Estimate for postal services. What is the basis for this? Subhead C1 covers general expenses for the main cultural institutions. There is a reduction from £3,650,000 to £2,975,000 for the National Museum. What is the basis for this? Under subhead E a figure of £6.8 million relates to scéimeanna feabhsúcháin sa Gaeltacht. What projects are in hand in the current year? Subhead E3 deals with strategic Gaeltacht piers and the smaller piers under local authority control. May I have a list of the piers to be dealt with this year?

In regard to the cultural development incentive scheme, I do not understand the £19 million figure. I remember a figure of more than £30 million for the CDIS. The figure was made up of 75% European funding with public and private involvement also. I am confused by the figure of £19 million.

The Minister said she would be announcing the successful CDIS projects. Perhaps she will give us an idea of the evaluation process. Is it the same as the previous process for CDIS or is it a different process? I asked the last day about the fate of those projects which met all the criteria but were not funded because sufficient funds were not available. There were four positively evaluated projects for every one which could be funded. What is the fate of the projects which were not funded and what is their chance of being funded in the present allocation?

The work on the Eglinton Canal is not on a new bridge but a lock which is being replaced. It was to have been completed in September 1998. It is absolutely important.

I asked the last day for the gross figures in relation to film. How much of the increased allocation for An Bord Scannán, the Film Board, is accounted for by the transfer of the commission's functions to the board? Are we comparing two different sets of figures? It would be useful to have the gross spend in every year since the recasting of section 35 and the new film initiative of 1993. That would be a better basis of comparison.

What is the Minister's position in relation to the relocation of the Abbey Theatre? There are now 17 new theatres in existence in the regions and this is a factor which leans on the options.

In relation to special areas of conservation, if the Minister has submitted 362 candidate SACs to the European Commission, when will the maps be available and why are they not available now? Why is it impossible to get a map showing the boundaries of the candidate SACs and how quickly can I have them, as an elected representative? They are not available from local authorities.

Will the Minister give an idea of the process in relation to this matter? How many meetings took place and where did they take place? How many appeals were submitted and about which areas? What significant changes were made to the REP scheme in relation to compensation and how does it differ from the previous scheme?

I was irritated by the construction put on the process with regard to special areas of conservation. If one wanted to change, for example, the Habitats Directive which I signed in 1997, the time to make representations was when the directive was coming into being. The suggestion has been made that the Minister has been presented with a fait accompli. I too was handed a fait accompli when the directive was formulated. This emphasises the importance of attending meetings at European level and of having a proper review process for draft directives. This exists in the House of Lords in the United Kingdom but a similar system does not exist here. I intend to make this point publicly again and again if necessary, if this deliberate misinformation is propagated. The behaviour of the former Minister of State with regard to SACs has been disgraceful. There has been misinformation in relation to the status of the directive, the process and the procedures.

It is a pity we must accept the Estimates now. If the Minister says she has submitted 362 candidate SACs I request the list originally submitted to the Commission and the accompanying maps, the revised list submitted and the list now submitted to the Minister. There are organisations which are excluded from the Minister's process. It is not possible to appeal an SAC unless one is a property owner. Environmental organisations and environmentalists are excluded from the process which has been introduced to shaft conservation policy. We are at least entitled to the maps. I demand them on behalf of those organisations and myself.

Maidir le céibh Inis Meáin, tá sé tábhachtach go mbeidh an áis ann agus go gcuirfear t-airgead ar fáil ar bhonn chaipitil má thagann torthaí na gcomhairleoirí éagsúla ar ais chugainn i rith na bliana. If the consultation process is to come in during the current year we should not have to wait until next year's Estimate to make capital provision. If there is a positive conclusion to the evaluation of what is best for Inis Meáin we should be able to find capital funding in the current year.

There is some confusion regarding conservation with particular reference to architecture. The grants which are available from local authorities come under legislation brought forward by the Minister for the Environment and Local Government. In conjunction with that I introduced the national inventory. The Minister for the Environment and Local Government and I worked together to make sure this legislation would be enacted so that a pool of money would be available to local authorities and that private owners of important listed buildings could apply for grant aid to maintain them. The pool of money was £4 million. This is a small amount of money but it establishes the principle of local authority funding for this purpose. The fund will increase over the years.

The Heritage Council has an important role to play in the matter of buildings at risk. The council depends for funding on the Department of Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands. To deal with the issue of buildings at risk there has been an increase this year of £500,000. Funding has increased from £750,000 to £1.25 million. That is an important increase and provides funding to private or public buildings. Any type of building may apply for 50% of the cost of exterior work. This grant is over-subscribed because there is a wealth of heritage and a great interest in preserving it.

The question of the Gate Theatre was raised by Deputy McGinley. The difficulties that may have arisen between the Arts Council and the Gate Theatre are a matter between them and it is not for me to get directly involved. The Arts Council is a statutory independent body so it would not be appropriate for me to interfere in discussions taking place between it and any of its clients.

In regard to the genealogical project, a study has been carried out on the operation of the IPP. It has identified targets that have to be met and there has been good progress in increasing funding. It was £210,000 in 2000 and will rise to £300,000 for 2001. I answered a parliamentary question on An Taisce to the effect that I have no plans to introduce a statutory basis for a national trust and that is still my position on that issue. My responsibility in regard to the Asgard is in terms of the licence and I gave the go ahead for that. I said that concerns were expressed by the museum regarding the actual housing of that particular artefact and I referred to that earlier. The museum is keeping an eye on it. It has been moved to a different location and there is now 24 hour security on it.

The issue of my attendance at European Union meetings was raised. There have been 14 formal and informal meetings from June 1997 to November 2000. I attended five of those personally. All other meetings were attended by officials and information is naturally fed back. The reason for my non-attendance on 16 May 2000 was due to the tremendous celebrations taking place in the Kennedy Centre in the United States. This was something in which Ambassador Kennedy-Smith and this Government were involved. It was a question of promoting Ireland, North and South, and it was an important and successful occasion. On 26 September 2000 there was a North-South plenary session and obviously that took precedence. Since then there was one formal meeting in November 2000 and one informal meeting in May 2001 which I attended.

Today I am on my way to attend a formal meeting where there will be further discussions on broadcasting and an issue concerning advertising and children. I will have the opportunity to express my concerns on public service broadcasting and the directive on television without frontiers. We feel a particular frustration in regard to this directive because we cannot implement our own national approach as we are hampered by the directive. Any changes that take place will have to be initiated by the Commission. I do not boycott any meetings but I have to set some priorities in terms of meetings. Those meetings were not the only meetings attended by me or the former Minister of State, Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív. We had other meetings with the Commissioner to deal with issues and we also had meetings concerning the question of overgrazing by sheep. My attendance is not therefore just a question of attendance at Council of Ministers' meetings.

The CDIS funding was raised by Deputy Higgins. The £19.5 million was a total of both EU and Exchequer funding and the £45 million——

Is it the allocation or is it the outturn?

The £19.5 million was from the EU and the Exchequer. The money from the scheme was in the region of £45 million. Taking those figures together——

The £19.5 million is not the figure of the original allocation for the CDIS?

I am advised that the money from the EU and the Exchequer was £19.5 million.

The issue is whether it was the money allocated or the outturn?

I have no problem in checking that and will get back to the Deputy on it.

On the question of the film industry, the information is on the gross spend on tax relief on a year by year basis. If specific information on facts and figures is required, we can supply it. Under both the CDIS and the access fund we will have more opportunity for theatre. Was the Deputy's question on the Abbey Theatre concerned with it as the national theatre or——-

The concept is that the national theatre's history has the concept of the national theatre on tour. The reality of the national theatre on tour is changed by the fact that we now have many more venues. We can originate productions in the regions, make greater productions and travel to the regions. My question is concerned with whether this new circumstance of achieving a national theatre on tour will be taken into account centrally as a factor?

I hope it will. The whole purpose of having further venues is to be able to provide access and opportunities to people who live outside the Dublin area. Our national theatre will play an important role in that.

Subhead C1 refers to general expenses of main cultural institutions. A question was asked about the National Museum. The outturn was £3.65 million in 2000 and £2.975 million in 2001. That reflects the slowdown on capital. There was also a question of moneys spent on postal services. Less post is being used — land lines, mobile phones and IT are used more. The onset of new technology has had an effect on that budget.

I understand that maps for SACs have been supplied to local authorities for display.

Will the Minister check this and let me know because they are not available in the local authorities?

I will certainly check the circumstances in regard to Galway County Council. They are also available——

Are they available for consultation or what is the cost if one wanted to purchase them?

They are supplied to local authorities. I will check the specific case referred to by Deputy Higgins regarding Galway County Council. The maps are available for inspection at the headquarters of the Department. If any landowner wishes further information that will be forthcoming. They are also available for inspection, by appointment, with any of the 90 conservation rangers throughout the country. That is the most locally based service and it is where we are trying to get the information across.

There was an error in the information given at last week's meeting. There is an increase in the allocation to subhead C1 in 2001 over 1995. The percentage increase over 1997 was 85% for IMMA, 87% for the National Concert Hall, 43% for the National Museum, 124% for the National Library, 71% for the National Archive, 25% for the National Archive Advisory Board and 106% for the Chester Beatty Library. The percentage overall increase for the national institutions since 1997 is 75%. This will be found under subhead C1.

The site and proposed capital development of the National Archive was raised at last week's meeting. The National Archive made a submission to me regarding the provision of further space and the best use of space on the site. The initial proposal was for approximately £13 million and I approved that figure, with the full support of the Department of Finance. Representatives of the archive then came back to me with more comprehensive, ambitious and expensive plans but ones which they felt made better use of the site. I have been working with the Department of Finance to secure the funds for this second proposal. The cost will be approximately £40 million. I am glad the Department of Finance has agreed to go ahead with the plan on a private public partnership basis.

Maidir leis an rud a luaigh an Teachta Mac Fhionnlaoich mar gheall ar na boird fiontair, tá deacrachtaí ag na hoileáin atá taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht maidir le cabhair a fháil ó Údarás na Gaeltachta. Táimid ag smaoineamh ar sparán speisialta a bheith ag na boird fiontair chun cabhair a thabhairt do na hoileáin nach bhfuil faoi chúram an údaráis. Tá mé ag caint le Comhdháil na n-Oileán faoi seo agus tá súil agam go mbeidh an cheist á phlé ag an gcoiste. Ní fhaigheann na hoileáin ina labhartar Béarla an tacaíocht céanna agus a fhaigheann na hoileáin Gaeltachta.

Maidir leis na scéimeanna feabhsúcháin agus na bóithre áise, níl an liosta iomlán agam ach gheobhaidh mé é díreach tar éis an chruinnithe. Táthar ag leanúint ar aghaidh leis na scéimeanna. Beidh £5.3 milliún á chaitheamh ar na bóithre straitéise.

Tá an liosta fá choinne na céibheanna straitéise beagnach réidh. Beidh sé agam i gceann cúpla seachtain agus beifear ábalta leanúint ar aghaidh leis an obair ar na céibheanna straitéise ins na ceantair uilig. Tabharfaidh mé an liosta atá réidh do na Teachtaí i gceann cúpla bomaite.

An bhfuil sibh sásta?

Bhéadh sé sin deacair.

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