Other Questions.
8 Mr. O’Dowd asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government his views on whether there is a necessity to introduce legislation to protect local authority employees who wish to report allegations of corruption; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9502/06]
View answer47 Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he will introduce legislation to protect employees of local authorities and elected members of local authorities against reprisal where a bona fide report or complaint was made by an employee or a councillor who believed that they were being required to act in a manner which was illegal, improper, or unethical, was in breach of constitutional convention or a professional code, may involve possible maladministration or was otherwise inconsistent with the relevant code; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9468/06]
View answer92 Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if, in relation to the codes of practice for both employees of local authorities and councillors, he will introduce a whistleblowers charter as recommended by the Standards in Public Office Commission; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9467/06]
View answerI propose to take Questions Nos. 8, 47 and 92 together.
The Local Government Act 2001 sets out a new ethical framework for local government, including provision for the publication of codes of conduct for the guidance of members and of employees of local authorities.
Two codes, one for members and one for employees, were issued in June 2004. The two codes are similar in that they each cover certain common areas such as general conduct and behaviour, conflict of personal and public interest, planning, gifts, hospitality, personal dealings with a local authority, regard for council resources and satisfactory working relationships. The emphasis obviously varies to some extent to fit the respective circumstances of councillors and employees.
The codes of conduct are a relatively new development in the local government sector and I am keeping their operation under close review. In the light of experience, I have decided to amend the code of conduct for employees, in consultation with the Standards in Public Office Commission and the Department of Finance, on the employment of senior local authority officials following their retirement or resignation.
The Local Government Act 2001 does not contain provisions concerning complaints and protection similar to those in the Standards in Public Office Act 2001. In light of relevant developments in other sectoral codes and having regard to ongoing contacts with SIPO, I am open to the development of suitable provisions within the local government legislative code, subject to detailed consideration of the specific issues arising in a local government context, and to Government approval. I would be disposed to bring such provisions forward at the next appropriate legislative opportunity.
I thank the Minister for his reply. The 2004 report of the Standards in Public Office Commission requested that the Minister do something about this but so far he has taken no action. The chairman of the commission asked for legislation to protect employees of local authorities and elected members from reprisal when a bona fide report or complaint was made by an employee or councillor that they were being required to act in a manner which was illegal, improper or unethical, in breach of constitutional convention or professional codes and which could result in maladministration. The Minister could simply introduce a planning code.
A major issue that arises at the Mahon tribunal every day is that people like Frank Dunlop approach councillors outside meetings to secure commitments to support motions on rezoning. I do not doubt that this is still happening throughout the country, and that is a matter of grave public concern.
In England there is a standards board and if someone feels the public good has been brought into disrepute, he reports that fact to the board, which then investigates. County councils in England have a planning standards policy whereby a councillor cannot give a commitment prior to a meeting on a planning decision and meetings cannot be called to discuss votes on controversial motions. There is transparency in the planning process and the due consideration of the quasi-judicial function of the elected member.
Fine Gael would co-operate fully with the introduction of such a standards board and planning code. The Minister could achieve this without legislation through discussions with local authority members and county managers. The public would then know where they, their councillors and their officials stand on the massive rezoning decisions that are being made in areas under pressure for development. That will root out corruption.
As ever Deputy O'Dowd is positive and I will consider the points he has made. The Department is in consultation with the Standards in Public Office Commission and the Department of Finance regarding the review of the code for local authority employees. These decisions which address the general issue will produce some changes in the code.
The discussions with the Standards in Public Office Commission and the Department of Finance were not expanded to address the issue of providing immunity, the main point in the question. The discussions, however, will deal with people who in good faith make a complaint.
The general point about the influence of lobbying in the wider sense is interesting. The Deputy is aware a major debate is taking place on this matter, on which a considerable amount of literature has also been published. I am not certain the process he has in mind would provide a balanced outcome.
The current system results in forgotten cheques at the planning tribunals.
The Deputy, in his wildest dreams, does not believe I would condone such cases. Some of the revelations are horrifying.
They are appalling.
I agree.
The Minister is doing nothing to address the matter.
That is not a fair, reasonable or accurate comment. I have outlined the steps I have taken and I am prepared to listen to proposals on what other steps could be taken. The Deputy and I share a common interest in ensuring the taint of the past does not persist in the future.
Would it not be beneficial to protect in law conscientious employees and members of local authorities who wish to expose irregularities or corruption? We cannot continue to bury our heads in the sand and pretend such corruption does not exist. I had the privilege of being a member of a county and city council for many years. Serious lobbying takes place prior to the production of development plans. I adopted the principle of telling anyone who made representations on planning matters that I would not indicate my position until I had listened to the manager's report on the relevant issue. Councillors should be obliged to hear the county manager's report on all submissions related to development plans before making public commitments or adopting a position. As the Minister will be aware, officials must prepare a report on all submissions and councillors must not commit themselves to any course of action until they have heard the county manager make his or her report.
Council employees have a role to play in this regard, having frequently drawn my attention to various practices. In doing so, they told me they were not in a position to voice their concerns because they would face discrimination as a result or would be liable to face a charge for exposing issues which required investigation in a local authority. Such employees should be offered legal protection. This would improve matters and remove a difficulty members and employees of local authorities encounter in some circumstances, particularly in the area of planning.
Members of local authorities are placed under colossal pressure prior to the adoption of development plans which can increase land values from a couple of hundred thousand euro to several million euro. Those with responsibility for making such decisions are entitled to be protected should they expose irregularities.
I agree that members of local authorities face considerable pressures, the reason being that we have vested in local councillors the right to make decisions on these matters in an open, transparent and democratic manner. It is a matter for each individual councillor to make moral and ethical decisions. The Deputy stated that councillors should not be pressurised to give a commitment regarding a forthcoming planning decision. I am not certain it is legally practical to require a councillor not to indicate what is his or her view on a planning decision.
Not only is it practical, it is also the current legal position.
I am not sure how one could prevent a councillor from forming an opinion on a particular case.
Deputy McCormack and I referred to making public commitments, not forming an opinion.
I agree it is foolhardy for councillors to give commitments, particularly ones produced by an inducement which is illegal.
Is this another justification for the Government to accept the Labour Party Bill on whistleblowers which will be taken in Private Members' time tonight with the support of the Fine Gael Party? The Minister referred to the introduction of regulations in respect of employing or engaging the services of senior officials of local authorities following their retirement. When will such regulations be made?
I am trying to progress that matter rapidly because, as I have already stated, I am anxious that regulations are introduced sooner rather than later. The local government code must be brought into sync with the code applied centrally because it is, in some ways, more urgent given the local and specific nature of local government affairs. The type of cases the Deputy and I discussed illustrate that a person retiring from a particular local government service could exercise significant influence. I am not yet certain how we will address this issue but I am anxious to make rapid progress.
I do not propose to add to the comments the Taoiseach made on whistleblowers on 1 March. To return to my main point, we can make as many laws as we wish but ultimately it is up to each councillor to adopt ethical standards. While this is an interesting debate, I do not know how one would prevent someone from forming an opinion.
The Minister should not misunderstand me. My proposal was to preclude members of local authorities from making commitments to vote either one way or another before a matter is debated. That is the problem. Everyone has a right to form an opinion.
In addition, the public interest should be the prime interest in every planning decision. Across the country, on the night before development plans are passed, developers and landowners make numerous telephone calls to councillors with the result that the public interest is the last issue on councillors' minds when they meet to discuss the development plan. It is the Minister's duty to protect the public interest, councillors and officials by immediately introducing a code of conduct. People are fed up with the rank corruption in public life and local government. They are sick to the teeth of tribunals and amnesia and want the Minister to take action now.
They can expect action from me. It is wrong to suggest there is still rank corruption in local government. That is not the case.
The law has not been changed.
Like other Deputies I have some experience of local government. The vast majority of the men and women in local government, of all political parties and none, are honourable people. To be fair to them, the public interest is the main priority for the vast majority of them.
The Minister has not provided legal protection for them.
In any way that I can possibly protect——
He should introduce the planning code of practice.
As I stated, I am interested in a code of practice but it would be wrong and silly to rush into the issue without first concluding ongoing discussions with stakeholders.
Does the Minister accept that councillors, in making decisions on rezoning matters under their reserve functions, exercise a quasi-judicial role? As such, they are expected to take into account the arguments made by professionals and technical staff. A judge would not offer an opinion as to the guilt of a defendant before hearing evidence in a case. I ask that this be taken into account as a benchmark for the manner in which councillors will be expected to behave with regard to planning matters, which have serious financial implications and major consequences for communities. Will the Minister consider requiring local authorities to establish an ethical point of reference, for example, by appointing an officer to provide training in the ethical standards and parameters which should apply? It could also be a point of contact for those seeking to report suspicions that ethical standards are not as they should be. Such persons should be given senior positions and provided with appropriate training.
We need to get over a particularly shameful period in our history about which the tribunals continually remind us. Can we address the issue of the Kenny report, for which, according to the all-party committee, we would not need a referendum and can be implemented if the political will exists, and which should remove the enormous temptation that continues to pertain to such decisions? Despite the Minister's belief that all is well in local authorities, the temptation has not gone away. That is a fundamental source of many of the problems raised at the tribunals and the Government needs to address it because it will not go away of its own accord. I concur with Deputy Gilmore that legislation on whistleblowers is long overdue and I ask the Minister to support that.
The Deputy asked a number of separate questions. On the issue of behaving in a quasi-judicial manner, local authority members are often cautioned that they have to make decisions with planning specifically in mind. For example, that admonition is frequently given with regard to the operation of section 140 of the Planning Act 2000. Case law exists in which decisions of members have been struck down where they transgressed in that regard. That exists within the current arrangements.
In theory.
It exists in practice and strong county management teams certainly make recourse to it. On whether there should be a central point for dealing with ethical issues pertaining to local authorities, my understanding is that officials have been designated with this responsibility, although the code has only recently been introduced in a number of local authorities. I will find out whether it is a general practice because I concur with the Deputy that there should be a senior official in the local authority who can be consulted in a value free manner.
On the Kenny report, the Deputy will be aware of the differing opinions on the issue of constitutionality but I suggest that we will not discuss these today.
Inertia is the main one.
That is not true.
9 Mr. Deenihan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he is satisfied with the use by local authorities of information technology and the Internet to assist clients; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9491/06]
View answerA key objective of the local government modernisation programme is to enhance the quality of service to customers. Information technologies are an important means of providing easier access to services, supplying information on the wide range of local authority activities and speeding up service delivery.
Substantial investment has been made in e-local government and the use of on-line technology to improve efficiency and effectiveness in service delivery. Local authority websites are updated on a regular basis with news, information, publications and tender and job opportunities. Application forms are generally available on these sites. A total of 27 local authorities have on-line payment systems in place across 79 different payment services, 51 planning authorities have on-line access to planning decisions, updated nightly, and more than 20 authorities have facilities in place to enable citizens to check on-line whether they are on the electoral register. Local authorities make extensive use of the e-tenders procurement portal and were early adopters of this system. The flagship motor tax on-line system is available through every local authority site and on-line access to library services is available throughout the country.
Internally, local authorities make extensive use of information technology in the management of key functions such as finance, housing, water services and roads, with the overall objective of enhancing efficiencies in the delivery of services to their customers. A number of authorities are now using information technology based systems to better manage contacts with customers. Some also have impressive systems for informing local authority members.
While much has been achieved, I am anxious that momentum is maintained and further progress made. In this context, local authorities will continue to expand the use of information technology in the delivery of enhanced customer services in consultation with my Department and the local government computer services board.
I agree with Deputy Deenihan that the intention should be to make local government more client oriented. When I became Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, one of my primary objectives was to improve access to local authorities and the level of courtesy in client services. That agenda should be informed by best practice and local authorities have done impressive work in this area.
I welcome the increasingly efficient use local authorities make of the Internet. When the Minister entered office, his Department's website was advertising grants which had been abolished a year earlier. The Department's services have since improved, however.
In light of longer commute times and the fact that people are less able to visit local authority offices during office hours, I welcome the increasing use of information technology and the Minister's commitment to expand services throughout the country.
I thank Deputy O'Dowd for that. I am aware he shares my opinion that we can make local government better and more cost effective. Extraordinary progress has been made in this area by South Dublin County Council under its current county manager. I want to see that standard in place elsewhere, so that, for example, planning files can be interrogated at any time of the day or night, and hope that other local authorities will be similarly proactive. Some of the smaller local authorities have also improved significantly. We now have to find out how the group in the middle is performing.
The local government computer services board receives a substantial amount of money from local authorities but an overall strategy seems to be lacking. Has the Minister considered the use of e-procurement globally? For example, in Britain, where the local authority budget is £27 billion, savings of 10% have been made through that country's impressive e-procurement system. I urge the Minister to consider that in the context of the efficiencies he mentioned earlier.
With regard to staffing, the website of Kildare County Council's planning system gets approximately 1,000 hits per week. Given that these people might otherwise visit the council's offices, significant savings can be made through the use of information technology. However, an overall strategy should be driven by the Department rather than by individual local authorities. Does the Minister have a vision for the future of local government or is this planning left to local authorities?
Deputy Murphy made a valid point in that there is nothing more liberating for a local authority than a good website because the potential savings are incredible. For example, millions of euro have been saved through the on-line motor taxation system. Local authorities can benefit by reducing expenditure on staff members and it is in everybody's interest at local level to be more proactive in this area. However, I do not want a gap to develop between those with access to the Internet and those without. Local authorities should spend some of the savings they make from e-technology on better counter services.
Significant savings have been made through e-procurement, although more can probably be done. I would like to see more use made of on-line electoral registers because I share the concerns of many in this House on this issue. I am committed to pressing local authorities to be even more ambitious in this regard because it is of mutual benefit to citizens and local authorities.
10 Ms B. Moynihan-Cronin asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government his views on setting up a task force within his Department to examine the possible regulation of the planning status of adult entertainment venues and shops; if such regulation can be achieved through the planning code; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9600/06]
View answerI recently received a request from the Association of County and City Councils to introduce legislation to regulate the planning aspects of the adult entertainment industry. Members of the association expressed concern that the recent growth of this sector can have a marked effect on the perception and character of a particular location. I acknowledge that the establishment of adult entertainment venues and shops can raise real public concerns, welcome the interest expressed by the association and believe it is appropriate that local authorities should be involved in regulating this sort of activity at local level. Further consideration is needed of whether planning regulation alone can adequately support a local control regime with regard to these activities. Entertainment venues and shops, adult or otherwise, are already potentially subject to a wide range of different regulatory requirements, a number of which may come within the remit of my colleague, the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. These include alcohol and dance hall licensing. The importation and sale of pornography are addressed by the criminal and customs codes. The interaction of these codes with the local regulation regime also needs to be considered. I therefore intend to work with my Government colleagues to ensure the most appropriate form of local regulation in this area.
In advance of any new regulatory powers, local authorities should use powers available to them under the planning code to ensure that late night entertainment venues are not inappropriately located, for example, in quiet residential areas or near schools.
I am disappointed with the Minister's response. This issue was raised by my colleague, Councillor Emer Costello, following the recent opening of an adult entertainment venue in the Parnell Square area. She drew attention to the fact that if a person wished to open an Internet café, planning permission would have to be obtained. However, this is not required to open a lap dancing club. It would be treated by the planning code in the same manner as a newsagent or hairdressing salon.
Would it not be a simple matter for the Minister to make a regulation under the Planning Acts which would require that operations of this kind would at least have to apply for planning permission? People in the local community could at least express their views on the appropriateness of the location and activity through this mechanism. If he cannot do this through regulation, will the Minister take the opportunity of the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Bill 2006, which completed Second Stage in the Seanad today and will come to the Dáil shortly, to strengthen the law in this area? This would ensure that adult entertainment venues would have to apply for a planning permission.
It is a loophole in our planning law that needs to be closed. Much of the public would be surprised that if a person needs to build an extension over a certain size on to a house, planning permission is required, but if a person wants to open one of these clubs, he or she does not have to apply to the local authority for planning permission. A club licence would be required.
I see the logic in the Deputy's point. If he recalls, I took a similar decision a while back with regard to off-licences. It was remarkable that planning permission was not required for an off-licence, but if a shop was being converted to a chip shop, for example, it was required. The same logic would apply in this case. I am considering the issue.
I am surprised the planning process does not distinguish between ordinary entertainment and so-called adult entertainment. Neither does it distinguish between bona fide shops and so-called sex shops. A lacuna is evident. I am not saying there is a reluctance to examine the matter, but I wish to consider if the planning code is the only way of dealing with it. It is not as simple as the off-licence issue. I will be disposed to dealing with it.
Local authorities have certain powers in zoning, but this case in the Parnell Square area of Dublin is indicative of an issue. It is a concern to me to draw these distinctions because the planning code should do this. Planning authorities have powers to zone activities for certain activities, but this episode has indicated a lacuna, as did the off-licence issue. I am concerned with this and will look to address the issue.
I appreciate the Minister is discussing other forms of control with colleagues, such as the licensing side of things. There is a planning dimension to the matter. Planning control is appropriate for some elements, whether they be location, the change of a normal retail shop to one of these uses, opening hours or whatever. I acknowledge that the Minister acted on off-licences and I compliment him on having done so. I urge him to act in the same way on this issue. There may well be a need for a more comprehensive regulatory regime down the line, which may be worked out in time.
In the short term, the loophole facilitating the lack of planning control, with a local authority having no power over these outlets, needs to be closed. The issue should be brought under planning control and a requirement for planning permission should be included in these cases.
The Deputy's points are well made, and his latter point is attractive to me. Even if there is a short-term solution as well as one over the longer term, I will consider the matter. The Deputy may keep in contact with me on the issue. We in the House all agree that action should be taken. I agree that there is a lacuna and where there is one, we should look at existing law and consider how to deal with it. We can then deal with a longer-term issue.
Written Answers follow Adjournment Debate.
