Having moved to report progress on this amendment on the last occasion, I have since gone into the matter fairly fully and I am satisfied that the position which exists at the present time, and the failure of the Minister to accept this amendment, must be appreciated by this House. Deputy MacEntee, at an earlier stage, used the words "comparatively unimportant" in relation to this Bill and now that there are 11 or 12 hours at the disposal of the House it causes one to think what reason the Government has for making such an Order. We can only deduce that the Minister has at the back of his mind that he does not want the Greyhound Racing Bill to be amended in any way or to have our amendment discussed.
Greyhound Industry Bill, 1955—Committee Stage (Resumed).
Debate resumed on the following amendment:—
SECTION 26.
In Section 26, to add to the section the following new sub-sections:—
() On the coming into operation of this Act and pending the making by him of the Order under sub-section (6) of this section the Minister shall make an Order appointing an independent qualified person as receiver to administer the affairs of the club.
() On the coming into operation of this Act and pending the making by him of the Order under sub-section (6) of this section the Minister shall make an Order appointing an independent qualified person as receiver and manager to carry on the business of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, for the sole benefit and advantage of the club.
() On the coming into operation of this Act and pending the making by him of the Order under sub-section (6) of this section the Minister shall make an Order appointing an independent qualified person as receiver and manager of Powerstown Park, Limited, to administer the affairs of the club for the sole benefit and advantage of the club.—(Deputy MacEntee.)
Will the Deputy come to the amendment?
The Taoiseach has stated this morning that this industry is one of our most important industries. With that we all agree and we maintain that every single section of this Bill is worthy of the greatest consideration by the members of this House.
I suggest that the Deputy come to the amendment.
In supporting this amendment moved by Deputy MacEntee I gave instances, on the last occasion, of the necessity of putting in a qualified person as a receiver to administer the affairs and assets of the club. The Greyhound Advisory Committee dealt very fully with the financial administration of the Irish Coursing Club but, unfortunately, I had not the time on the last occasion to deal with the matter under that heading.
In paragraph 123, page 40, of their report, the advisory committee stated that they felt that the funds of the club could have been more efficiently administered and more equitably distributed, particularly as regards the funds of the subsidiary companies, which are dealt with under the amendment. These are the Sporting Press, Limited, Powerstown Park and the other assets. This is a very serious matter and the report goes on to say that, in regard to the administration of the funds, the finance committee appeared to have failed to ensure that the resources of the club were applied efficiently and equitably. It states that members of the finance committee were lax in attending meetings and that some of them took little interest in the affairs of the committee.
Surely that is a surprising report from a committee composed of people of all political persuasions. These responsible men come along and put their names to a document containing a statement to the effect that the present Irish Coursing Club, as constituted, is inefficiently administered and that the members take little interest in the affairs of the committee and that the best use is not being made of the finances of the club. Surely that statement bears out the necessity of the Minister accepting this amendment.
If I might go back, Sir, and refer to the time allowed for this debate, if there had been a little co-operation by the Minister for Agriculture perhaps this debate would not be as acrimonious and contentious as it has turned out to be. If the Minister wants to adopt that attitude we, on this side of the House, will have our say.
That is the greatest understatement of all time.
This is not the first time that Deputy Briscoe and Deputy MacEntee have offered co-operation to the Minister in a non-acrimonious atmosphere.
I am interested in the amendment and I hope the Deputy will deal with it.
I am pointing out that this Bill was originally introduced in December, 1955.
Hear, hear!
Since that time the Minister for Agriculture has not shown the slightest tendency to co-operate with the Deputies on this side of the House. We are trying...
To deal with the amendment, I hope.
The terms of this amendment would have been disposed of long ago, if the Minister for Agriculture would listen to a little reason. No matter what case is put up by us, on this side of the House, we are wasting our sweetness on the desert air. The onus is on us, if not on the Minister, to show the citizens of this country the serious plight in which the industry finds itself at present and the more serious plight in which it will find itself, if this amendment is not passed. I consider this to be the most important amendment tabled to the Bill.
To get back to the Report of the Greyhound Advisory Committee, about half way down paragraph 123 they refer to the distribution of income and remark on the failure of the club to plough any of their assets back to the coursing clubs in fair proportion. I maintain that each of these remarks made by the advisory committee shows one thing and one thing only, that there is something very rotten in connection with the whole financial structure of the Irish Coursing Club. That is not my personal opinion backed up on my own knowledge. I have not that much knowledge but I do accept this report and in that connection I should like to refer the House also to paragraph 125, where it is said that this body are of the opinion that:—
"...a full explanatory statement of accounts and balance sheet should be produced at each annual meeting."
Would the Minister or anyone in this House or outside it tell us what shareholder would put up with the state of affairs whereby the members and shareholders attending an annual general meeting—they have been attending these meetings down through the years—have never caught sight of a balance sheet? Is that not a preposterous state of affairs?
This amendment deals with the appointment of a receiver.
The reason why the receiver should be appointed. The manner in which this organisation has conducted its business is surely relevant?
They go on then at paragraph 125 of the report to say:—
"Similarly, we consider that the present practice whereby the only reference in the balance sheet of the club to the subsidiary companies is to their nominal value at £1 each, is misleading...."
Do the public realise what the carry-on of this body is? In the balance sheet the assets of Powerstown Park appear at £1. Powerstown Park, the subsidiary companies, the Sporting Press, are valued by the commission at £60,000. This appears as £1 on the balance sheet. If a crowd of school children carried on like that and if an individual in the Intermediate Certificate examination were asked in a question to frame a typical balance sheet of a company and gave such examples, we can imagine what marks he would get. The position is fantastic. The value of Powerstown Park itself has been mentioned also at £26,000.
Powerstown Park Racecourse consists of 168 statute acres of the best land in the Golden Vale and it appears on the balance sheet at 20/-. For the same Powerstown Park, Limited, the secretary of the Irish Coursing Club offered an annual rent of £1,200 and surely they were not biased when they calmly suggested that the reference in the balance sheet to the fact that the nominal value of the subsidiary companies was £1 each is misleading. They go further in the report and say this should be altered forthwith. Of course, it should be altered.
A consolidated statement of revenue and expenditure, as well as a consolidated balance sheet covering all operations, should be presented but it has never been presented. I know members of the Standing Committee of the Irish Coursing Club. They are very reputable men who for different reasons have been unable to attend as much as they would like. But when they attend and ask a question, they are nearly frozen out of the room by certain individuals. It is a fantastic position to say that they cannot ask a question at a general meeting and get the necessary information.
To bear me out further, they say in the report:—
"Every member of the club should be entitled to full information about any and every activity of the club or its subsidiary companies, and we feel that much of the prevailing dissatisfaction originated because members felt that they had not been given sufficient details in this connection."
We had the same thing happening at the last standing committee meeting of the Irish Coursing Club, held in Jury's on the 1st May, 1956. People came to that meeting, particularly the country members, and asked questions about the valuation.
I have the full reports of both committees held on the 1st and 2nd May. Again, they were met with a closed-shop attitude. Mr. Smith, of Smith, Griffin & Co., Auctioneers, was paid a fee of 30 guineas to give his valuation on Powerstown Park. One particular individual asked for the valuation and they nearly jumped down the unfortunate man's throat. They would not disclose the information. They would not say what Mr. Griffin offered for the premises. Is it not fantastic? The secretary can offer £1,200 a year or a bid of £20,000 to buy it outright, keep the grazing rights, keep the house and keep the profits. The secretary can do all these things, but when a couple of honest and unfortunate members up from the country ask what Mr. Griffin, of Messrs. Smith, Griffin & Co., valued the premises at, they are told, and not so politely, to shut up. For two columns of the report, other members, including a reverend gentleman, said that everything was not over-and-above-board and that it was about time the information was given to the ordinary members of the standing committee.
They were right in demanding that. Is it not a fantastic state of affairs to say that, having paid an auctioneer and valuer 30 guineas out of the funds of the Irish Coursing Club, the members of the Irish Coursing Club could not hear what that valuation was? It would have been of assistance to this House to have known what Powerstown Park is valued at. The secretary himself must have a very good idea since he bid £20,000 for it and offered £1,200 a year.
These are not my opinions. They are facts unanimously signed by the members making up this committee. Further on, in paragraph 125 of the report, they made a remarkable observation quite in keeping with the point we are making here in connection with Deputy MacEntee's amendment. They said:—
"Normally an executive committee and its officers"—
the operative word is normally—
"are at all times merely the custodians of the funds entrusted to them by the parent body, each member of which is entitled to all reasonable information. We find it difficult to avoid the conclusion that the standing committee of the Irish Coursing Club and its administrative officials frequently lost sight of these precepts."
That passage occurs at the end of paragraph 125. The sting of a sonnet is often in its tail and it is certainly in the tail here: "Its administrative officials frequently lost sight of these precepts", is putting it in a very mild but lucid form.
On the last occasion on which this amendment was debated, on 19th June, the Minister went to the greatest trouble on several occasions to interrupt me to state that a trust deed had been executed in regard to Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited. I have looked through all the documents at my disposal and from statements issued by the Coursing Club itself, I can find no indication of that. The point I am making is in reference to Volume 158, column 541. I was referring to the Sporting Press and Coursing Calendar. I said:—
"There is a typical example of the slipshod method in which the Irish Coursing Club do their business."
The Minister interrupted to say:—
"The trust deed has been executed since."
I asked a member of the standing committee of the club if the trust deed had been executed since and he said that, so far as he knew, and he had attended all the meetings, the trust deed had not been executed.
In paragraph 152 of the report of the advisory committee, the recommendation is made:—
"We believe the new club should cause to be executed a trust deed which will specifically name members of the club as trustees for the assets of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited."
If the Minister is in a position to have more definite facts on these matters, we would certainly like to know of them.
In this amendment, Deputy MacEntee specifically mentions a receiver; but I am sure we would have been satisfied even if the Minister had said that, instead of a receiver, he would appoint a financial committee. In paragraph 150 of the report on the finances of the reorganised Irish Coursing Club, the committee said:—
"In the belief that efficient control and equitable distribution of its finances are essential if the club is to fulfil its functions properly, we are of opinion that the newly constituted club should at the outset establish a finance committee comprising members prepared to attend regularly and including if possible a person well versed in accounting matters."
We could not have a greater advocate for this amendment than this report of the advisory committee. Every point referred to here to-day by me has been backed up by reference to the unanimous opinions of this impartial body.
The most important observation contained in the report is made in paragraph 111. This says:—
"Despite these liquid assets and the fact that the assets and property of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, must be regarded as being held in trust for the Irish Coursing Club, it appears that this concern has never contributed any portion of its substantial profits to the Irish Coursing Club."
That means that, of the thousands of pounds made by the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, not one halfpenny has gone to the smallest coursing club in West Clare or any other part of the country. Not a shilling has been contributed out of the profits of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, which was supposed to have been set up and held in trust for the Irish Coursing Club. Every year they have been most successful, and of the thousands of pounds which accrued from this success, not one penny has been ploughed back into coursing, greyhound racing or, as in the case of the Racing Board, contributions towards stakes and contributions to the management, not only for increased stakes but so that the admission charges to certain tracks could possibly be reduced. Not one penny of that was used in this way.
What did they do with the money? They spent £32,000 on buildings and installing machinery. They gave evidence before the commission and very generously admitted on behalf of the company that its property and revenues belonged to the Irish Coursing Club; but they argued that the surplus revenue was retained merely in order that it might later be readily available to the Irish Coursing Club, should the latter's financial position decline or should the industry as a whole need help. They suggested to the advisory committee that they were holding all the surplus revenue and profits in trust, in case they might be called on by the Irish Coursing Club. Of course, as was found out later by the committee, the money was invested—and it was possibly a good investment— in buildings and the purchase of machinery for £32,000.
Is it not about time the Minister stepped in and appointed the receiver we are looking for? How do we know that the people administering the Sporting Press will not embark on some other scheme and spend another £20,000 or £30,000 out of their considerable assets before the new control board is set up? I quote from the report of the advisory committee:—
"We have already expressed doubt in regard to the action of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, in expending a sum of approximately £32,000 in the erection of buildings and installation of plant; in other words, utilising in this manner reserves which must have previously accumulated. We cannot, therefore, accept as sufficient the explanation as to why the company did not contribute to the funds of the Irish Coursing Club as a whole during a period when coursing might have received greater financial assistance, e.g., by way of reducing fees, increasing prize money at coursing meetings or employing additional supervisory staff."
One could not call the Sporting Press, in its present form, inefficient. Any body that can make £32,000 or £40,000 is certainly not inefficient. Our argument is not so much on the manner in which the Sporting Press is run as the manner in which the assets are disposed of. They must have been marvellous businessmen.
How were the assets disposed of?
I cited the case of the erection of buildings and installation of machinery and plant.
That is creating assets.
How much do they pay the managing director?
Deputy Barry interrupted me. Would he just look back on the records he has at his disposal? If he does, he will find out that when the Sporting Press was set up originally, it was to be held in trust for the Irish Coursing Club and that the assets and any profits deriving therefrom were to be used for the benefit of coursing. If Deputy Barry suggests that to plough that money into buildings and plant was improving the position of coursing in this country, we must disagree.
I was about to say that these were marvellous businessmen. The Irish Coursing Club owned the Sporting Press, but the Irish Coursing Club were charged for the printing of the Greyhound Calendar and the Stud Book, not alone nominal sums but the highest market prices. Not satisfied with printing for the Irish Coursing Club at top market prices, the Sporting Press entered into competition with commercial firms in the printing trade.
Here is what the report of the advisory committee has to say at paragraph 112:—
"We understand that the company prints the Stud Book at a profit to itself, charging considerable sums to the Irish Coursing Club for the service. The income derived by the Irish Coursing Club from the sale of the Stud Book to affiliated coursing clubs, etc., covered only a fraction of the cost of printing, so that the book in consequence is published at a consistent and serious loss to the club. We see no valid reason why, in view of the sound financial position of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and the fact that it was set up with funds provided by the Irish Coursing Club, it could not at least have undertaken the printing of the Stud Book free of charge, or at a nominal charge, to the parent body. We are indeed of opinion that every affiliated coursing club would be reasonably entitled to a copy of the Stud Book, free of charge. We also feel that the company could readily have made other printing concessions to coursing clubs generally."
But no; any coursing club in Ireland who required printing done were charged top market prices. Now Deputy Barry will know to what purpose the assets and surplus revenue were put. They were not used for the purpose intended. There was quite a deal of comment in certain provincial newspapers as a result of discussions concerning Powerstown Park. In the South of Ireland generally, it has become the subject of a great deal of controversy. The rumour that Powerstown Park was sold seemed to be completely incorrect, according to the decision at the last meeting of the Irish Coursing Club, held in Dublin on May 2nd last. On that date, they decided to leave it to another meeting, and an undertaking was given to one of the members, who was worried, that no action would be taken pending the summoning of a special meeting.
Since then, newspapers in that province seem to have more information on the subject than possibly the Minister or the members of this House. There were statements published that Powerstown Park was purchased for some fantastic figure. That now seems to be completely incorrect. I am referring to a leading article in a provincial paper. In fairness to the standing committee, I should like now to say that these rumours seem to be incorrect.
According to the report of the advisory committee, Powerstown Park, Limited, is a private company with a paid-up capital of £10,000. The company was formed in 1932 by the Irish Coursing Club, mainly to establish a permanent national coursing ground and, to that end, to purchase the property known as Powerstown Park Racecourse. The shareholders of the company, who were the nominees of the Irish Coursing Club, executed, in April, 1932, a deed of trust under which they acknowledged that they held their shares in trust for the Irish Coursing Club and were prepared to act in all respects under the direction of the club, as expressed or contained in resolutions from time to time passed by the standing committee.
At that time, according to the report of the advisory committee, the senior joint-secretary of the Irish Coursing Club acted as salaried manager of Powerstown Park, Limited, and in consideration of payment of an agreed annual sum, was entitled, while acting in this capacity, to reside in Powerstown House and to use the lands of Powerstown demesne, comprising about 130 acres—the figure is incorrect—except at such times as portion of them is required for coursing or racing.
I have shown that the Irish Coursing Club, the owners of the Sporting Press Limited, have been charged "considerable sums" for the services of printing. I have shown that Powerstown Park is supposed to be owned by the nominees in trust for the Irish Coursing Club, and I want to show now the benefits, moryah, that are derived by the owners, the Irish Coursing Club, from their property.
The report of the advisory committee says:—
"As in the case of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and although Powerstown Park, Limited, appears to be a prosperous undertaking, no contribution whatever appears to have been made by it to the funds of the Irish Coursing Club."
From what is the Deputy quoting?
The Deputy is quoting from paragraph 114 of the report of the advisory committee. Here is the fantastic statement:—
"Indeed the Irish Coursing Club actually pays £100 per annum for the right to hold coursing meetings on its own lands at Powerstown Park."
Indeed the members of the advisory committee were dismayed and amazed. As they said, they were paying the top price for their own printing and now, after landing out the money to buy Powerstown Park, they are being charged £100 per annum. One would think that a balance sheet would show that something was coming back, but the advisory committee has pointed out that nothing has come back. Where the money of Powerstown Park has gone, I do not know—and I would like to make it very clear that there is no question or suggestion that anyone has absconded with hundreds of thousands of pounds from Powerstown Park—but I do say that the whole position is frightfully serious. The profits made by Powerstown Park were utilised to increase the company's assets. In other words, they carried out improvements to the racecourse, to the buildings themselves, to the tote, and to the stabling accommodation. But, as in the case of the Sporting Press, the purpose for which it was set up has been defeated. It has been argued by very knowledgeable people that the directors of Powerstown Park, Limited, do not have to consult the Irish Coursing Club, if they dispose of their assets.
Deputy MacEntee has put down this amendment that:—
"...the Minister shall make an Order appointing an independent qualified person as receiver and manager to carry on the business of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, for the sole benefit and advantage of the club."
Two individuals at the Irish Coursing Club meeting in Jury's Hotel held some time in May, received an undertaking, and that undertaking was not too clear, that it would not be disposed of without a further meeting.
You told us all this the last day.
I did not.
You read it out of that paper.
I read it out of this paper? I did not get to this portion the other day. What I am saying now is that certain individuals got an undertaking that it would not be disposed of. Another meeting is to take place, according to the chairman of that meeting, in seven or eight weeks. There might be a meeting in the middle of this month or next month and we might be in recess by that time, although we may not be, thanks to the Minister.
Thanks to me? I have not said a word to-day.
You had better laugh it off.
We will probably be sitting in August and September at this rate.
We will be in the coursing season then.
The point I am trying to make is that we could pick up the paper some morning and see that Messrs. So-and-So, having carriage of sale, have disposed of, to Messrs. So-and-So, the assets of Powerstown Park, Limited, because I understand that there is no onus whatever on the directors of Powerstown Park to consult the Irish Coursing Club.
Hear, hear!
And there can be a fait accompli, and the Minister can do nothing about it.
Deputy Barry and his colleagues concluded, when dealing solely with the Sporting Press, Limited, and Powerstown Park, Limited, that:—
"The formation of these two companies, both of which engage in commercial activities, and the investment by the Irish Coursing Club in such commercial enterprises of funds arising directly from the Irish greyhound industry, appear to have been outside the terms of the constitution of the club."
In fact, Sir, not only were they outside the terms of the constitution of the club, but according to their articles of association, as one will realise if one goes to the trouble of reading the Articles of Association of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and Powerstown Park, Limited, they have no authority, and never had any authority whatsoever, to embark on certain activities on which they have embarked. They have exceeded the powers vested in them and they failed to take the necessary steps to acquire those powers which they lack, however they got away with it.
Having said that the formation was outside the terms of the constitution, the report goes on to say:—
"The position whereby one of the enterprises has been enabled to earn profits at the expense of the club— namely, the admitted profit on the printing of the stud book and the loss incurred by the club on its distribution—appears to justify the allegations of several witnesses that the funds of the club as a whole, including its subsidiary companies, are not used to the best advantage. We believe that having formed these companies, the club should have ensured their subordination to the needs, financial and otherwise, of the club itself."
It is not a brainstorm of Deputy MacEntee or Deputy Briscoe that these amendments are put down and not, as the Minister has got into his head, that any persons have any axe to grind in the matter. That is the case and there is irrefutable evidence to show that the whole financial position is in a state of chaos.
A very important point arises from all this: the failure of the Irish Coursing Club to get back their own assets and to get some of the revenue has had a bearing on certain proposals and decisions made by the Minister. After all, when the proposed levy on the bookmakers was introduced in this Bill, the Minister mentioned that he had taken into consideration the existing financial position and the probable future financial position of the Irish Coursing Club, and he came to the conclusion that it was necessary to have a levy imposed because they themselves would not have sufficient assets. If Deputy MacEntee's amendments were accepted in whole or in part, and even if a receiver or manager was not appointed, a financial committee were set up, I maintain that very little need for this levy would arise.
In relation to the assets of the Sporting Press, paragraph 117 of the report says:—
"In regard to the assets of the Irish Coursing Club other than Powerstown Park, Limited, and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, no instrument is in existence to show that these assets are vested in trustees for the club. In the course of evidence, it was implied that the club's property and assets were vested in the standing committee, but, if so, they would be trustees for the individual members of the Irish Coursing Club. In fact"
—and here is the serious position—
"it would seem logical to assume that the property and assets of the club belong to all members of the club jointly. Indeed, it could be argued that every member of an affiliated coursing club has a vested interest in the property of the Irish Coursing Club. It might further be logically assumed that this applies also to the assets of the subsidiary companies."
I have referred already to the question of the balance sheet in connection with the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and Powerstown Park.
The Deputy is getting tired.
We shall be going strong at one minute after 10.30 tonight.
There is nothing like proclaiming your intentions brazenly.
So that we will know what you are after.
Deputy MacEntee is getting anxious.
We are going to let the public know the dirty work that is going on here.
Your appearance is the best evidence of that.
We have made our position very clear, that we were willing as far as possible, and still are, to co-operate with the Minister, but evidently we have not converted him to our way of thinking in connection with these amendments. We will do all in our power to show beyond yea or any that the arguments we can put up are irrefutable. It is stated in the report at paragraph 119:—
"Assets, under the heading of offices, fixtures and fittings, equipment, stationery, etc., do not however appear on the balance sheet under any heading, so that in reality net assets are considerably higher. Offices which the club, as stated in evidence, erected in Clonmel at a cost of £15,000, are not referred to in the balance sheet. These assets were probably written off against profits."
That was a very kind deduction. The paragraph continues:—
"As the club holds all the subscribed capital of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and Powerstown Park, Limited. It is at once apparent that the net assets of the club as shown in its balance sheet are not fully representative of the actual position."
I lack the forensic capabilities of the Minister for Agriculture but I can certainly visualise how, if he were on this side of the House, he would go to town on that. We would probably go on until Friday and be featured in the Sunday Independent in similar articles to those we had every Sunday a couple of years ago.
It is becoming very hard. The Deputy is getting dizzy.
Deputy Barry is the cause of my dizziness. Here is the Greyhound Advisory Committee's Report which was adopted unanimously, and the second signature I see under that of the chairman, Timothy O'Connell, is that of Anthony Barry, who is known to all and sundry by the remarkable appellation of "Deputy Anthony Barry". If I am getting dizzy it is Deputy Barry's opinions which are making me so, and I accept most of them. There are very few I do not accept and we would be far better off if the Minister accepted the recommendations of the committee set up by himself.
There is one other aspect of this matter I want to mention before I conclude on this amendment. I saw in one newspaper the suggestion made that to put the value of the asset of the Irish Coursing Club, known as the Greyhound and Sporting Press, at £60,000, as referred to by a Deputy, was fantastic. The newspaper in question went on to refer to the appalling plight in which newspapers in this country find themselves to-day with the cost of paper, etc., and suggested that we were grossly exaggerating. I would like to clear that point up because the position is set out without any doubt whatever in paragraph 110 of the committee's report:—
"Apart from printing The Coursing and Racing Calendar— recently renamed The Sporting Press—the company prints the Stud Book on behalf of the Irish Coursing Club and prints ‘membership’ and other cards for coursing clubs. The company undertakes printing work for a number of horse racing companies and other sporting organisations, and—presumably in order to employ its staff and machinery full time-engages also in a considerable amount of other commercial printing and paper trading, outside the greyhound industry.”
The Deputy said all that at ten minutes to eleven.
I did not. I am trying to make a particular point in this connection. Is it not about time that we had the benefit of Deputy Barry's wisdom on some of these points? When I sit down he can speak. The paragraph continues:—
"The Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, appears to have been remarkably successful from the outset, and the value of its assets, including buildings and equipment, is estimated by the Irish Coursing Club to be at present at least £60,000."
I want to go on record as saying, therefore, that when Deputy Briscoe referred previously to that figure of £60,000 there was nothing fantastic about it and no evidence that the members on this side of the House were exaggerating, because the Irish Coursing Club themselves valued the assets of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, at £60,000.
The estimate includes buildings which were erected in recent years at a cost of £14,000 and plant, machinery and equipment at a cost of £18,000, making a total of £32,000, the figure to which I referred about ten minutes ago. The question arises—it has been asked here and in letters to newspapers of a sporting character—as to why this £32,000 was spent, £32,000 representing an asset of the Irish Coursing Club. A delegate from West Cork asked that very pertinent question at, I think, the second last meeting.
In further proof of the ludicrous decisions that can be taken, this was the excuse given for putting up these buildings at a cost of £14,000 and installing plant and equipment at a cost of £18,000. It was stated by the Irish Coursing Club—that is, by the members who gave evidence before the committee—that this expenditure had become imperative when the printing company was informed by the military authorities during the emergency period that it would have to vacate certain buildings held on lease in Clonmel and utilised in connection with the publication of the Racing Calendar and by the Irish Coursing Club in other directions. Fortunately, there were some very efficient staff helping out this committee and they said that they had ascertained that the proposal of the Department of Defence to resume possession of the buildings “has not up to the present been proceeded with.”
Now, I am very interested in this, and so are Deputies on both sides of the House. One of the members of the standing committee discussed the matter with me. Unfortunately, he was not at the meeting—he should have been—and he is paying for the consequences now. This man and other members of the standing committee sought information as to the existence of a record of this whole proceeding; there was an expenditure of nearly £40,000 involved and the Irish Coursing Club said they were satisfied it was imperative that the buildings should be vacated. Is there any record of the Department of Defence serving notice to quit on the Irish Coursing Club? Is there any record in the Minister's Department to show that a deputation waited on him from the Irish Coursing Club to point out that the buildings which the Department of Defence proposed to take would not be of the slightest use to the Army authorities? No such deputation took place.
This meeting was held. Mark you, it was not a special meeting. None of the representatives all over the country got a three-line whip to attend Clonmel urgently in order to reach a major decision on the depletion of profits in relation to one of the subsidiary bodies. An ordinary meeting of the Irish Coursing Club was held and, there and then, it was decided that because of the Department of Defence's intimation—wherever the record is, I do not know—that they required these premises, the premises would be vacated and £32,000 would be spent on the erection of a new premises.
Surely there are good business people on the Irish Coursing Club. Everyone knows that if an ordinary individual who owns or leases property from the Department of Defence or any other Government Department receives an intimation that the Department in question intends to exercise certain powers, that individual has certain legal rights and will take steps to ensure that he receives adequate compensation. There is no evidence of any compensation for disturbance being obtained by the Irish Coursing Club or the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited. It has been remarked by certain members of the Irish Coursing Club that, due to the action or alleged action of the Department of Defence, they had to build a new premises at a cost of £14,000. Forgetting all about the cost of the machinery, surely they were entitled to some compensation in relation to the premises they had to vacate. If I were involved in that kind of situation, I would certainly be entitled to compensation, compensation adequate to purchase another house or to build a new house. But the Irish Coursing Club did not get one penny compensation towards the erection of a new building. Is that efficient administration?
If the Minister continues to refuse to accept this amendment, all I can say is that he is sticking his head in the sand and saying to Fianna Fáil that he will not accept any of their amendments, without any qualifying adjective, good or bad or indifferent. On one memorable occasion he asked Deputy Briscoe: "Why should I accept the Deputy's amendment in order to give the Deputy political kudos?" or words to that effect.
It has been suggested that the erection of this new building was a good deal. Later on the advisory committee remarked, in relation to the expenditure of £32,000: "On the whole, we have some doubts as to whether in the circumstances mentioned the company was justified in expending on the erection of new buildings and, more particularly, on the installation of new and elaborate printing machinery large sums which, properly speaking, belonged to the Irish Coursing Club and to the greyhound industry. We have no information"—they could not get the evidence; despite the questions asked by them at the commission they could not find out—"as to whether the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, decided on this expenditure or whether the sanction of the standing committee for the expenditure was sought." I suggest that is a most important statement because it shows that the Sporting Press came to a certain decision without the sanction of the standing committee of the Irish Coursing Club. It is quite on the cards that what they did then, they will do again. The Sporting Press, Limited, and Powerstown Park, Limited, could at the moment, without consulting anybody, dispose of their assets. For all we know, they may do it next week. The Sporting Press, Limited, states categorically here:
"The committee, without the sanction of the standing committee, spent this £32,000. The company appears to hold liquid assets to the value of £13,000 approximately."
To show the House another bit of fantastic childishness, I would ask the House to listen to this:—
"Although these assets——"
that is, the £13,000 liquid assets they have
——include Government securities earning only from 3¾ to 4 per cent., no effort has been made to redeem 6 per cent. debentures to the value of £4,000 held personally by the senior joint secretary of the Irish Coursing Club who is also manager of the Coursing Greyhound Calendar and Sporting Press, Limited."
Here it might be noted that income-tax and corporation profits tax, amounting to £24,800, were paid by the company since 1933. This is very big business. That company alone, the Sporting Press, paid nearly £25,000 in income-tax and corporation profits tax since 1933. Not one shilling was expended in subsidising stakes, in a reduction of entry fees or in any such alleviation of the hardships from which coursing clubs particularly in country areas suffered. This is a childish bit of business whereby they invested in Government securities earning only from 3¾ to 4 per cent. and made no effort whatever to redeem 6 per cent. debentures to the value of £4,000. That is another one of the very many peculiar things carried on by the Irish Coursing Club and their subsidiary bodies.
On the last occasion on which I was speaking in regard to this matter here, I gave a guarantee to the Minister that he could be assured of our 100 per cent. co-operation in this matter. I suggested to him that he might communicate with the directors of the Irish Coursing Club. I am asking him now to meet us in some small way on this amendment. If the Minister would assure us that he will make his views known, in the light of what has been revealed in this House of the carryon of the whole financial administration of the Irish Coursing Club and from the facts which have been disclosed, not by me but through me, it would be a great help. I have only been referring to the advisory committee's report. I think it has been proved beyond yea or nay that the position is frightfully serious.
The point I wish to stress more than any other is that there appears to be no method whereby the assets will not be depleted. If the Minister would communicate with the secretary and directors of the Irish Coursing Club and suggest to them that he would not approve of the disposal of any of these assets until the new board is formed, it would go a long way towards meeting the purpose of Deputy MacEntee's amendment. I am certain that due consideration will be given to any such views expressed by the Minister. The Irish Coursing Club know perfectly well that, when the new board is formed, their members will have control. I presume they will not become antagonistic to the Minister if a letter from the Minister for Agriculture is read out in two or three weeks' time by the secretary at the next Irish Coursing Club meeting here in Dublin saying that it has been brought to his notice——
This has nothing to do with the amendment.
It has. I presume they will not become antagonistic if a letter is read out from the Minister for Agriculture to the Irish Coursing Club stating it has been brought to his notice, as it has, that the question of the disposal of Powerstown Park and possibly other assets of the Irish Coursing Club is under consideration and that, while he has no statutory power at the present stage, he would deem it a favour, and so on, if such were not done until the new board comes into existence. If the Minister would give us some information on the point, it would go some way towards meeting us.
Notice taken that 20 Deputies were not present; House counted, and 20 Deputies being present,
This amendment is designed to empower the Minister for Agriculture to appoint a receiver in respect of the property of the Irish Coursing Club after this Bill is passed and is law. I do not know whether those who drafted the amendment bothered to read the Bill. If they had, they would see that, under Article 13 of the constitution, the Bill provides that the property and assets of the club and its subsidiary interests, including Powerstown Park, Limited, and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, shall be vested in trustees appointed by the club. Therefore, with the passage of this Bill and its coming into law, all the assets referred to in the amendments will be vested in trustees.
The purpose of this amendment, therefore, is to provide for the period between the signing of the Bill by the President and the date of its coming into operation. It is fantastic to suggest that anything is being done to protect the assets of the club by postponing indefinitely the enactment of this Bill, which, under Article 13 of the constitution, vests all the property and assets, including Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, in trustees to be appointed by the club. The most effective way of securing that all these assets will be permanently held by the trustees, to whom will attach all the obligations of trustees, and these are heavy obligations, is to pass this Bill. The sooner the Bill is passed, the sooner the trustees will be appointed and the sooner all the assets, including Powerstown Park and the Sporting Press, Limited, will be held in trust for the benefit of the club. That is the purpose of the Bill. The longer the Bill is delayed in passing, the longer that excellent purpose will be frustrated. I think that Deputy MacEntee knows that but he announced this morning at half past ten that he proposes to obstruct to the limit——
I did not.
He never used the word "obstruct".
——to the limit of his capacity. Anyone can prostitute the proceedings of Parliament and do his best to prevent Parliament working. Those who believe that is a desirable thing to do are, I think, mistaken. The privileges of Parliament have been dearly bought and they must be sedulously protected, however mistakenly they are used.
I want to make it perfectly clear that there is not the slightest desire on my part, or on the part of anyone on this side of the House, to be either unreasonable or unco-operative in handling this Bill. Already, I have endeavoured to meet the Opposition in relation to a number of points they have raised. Some of the amendments on the Order Paper in my name have been drafted for the purpose of meeting points raised by Deputies on the Opposition Benches on the Second Stage. I believe that the provision in Section 13, vesting all the property of the club in trustees, fully and amply incorporates the principle enshrined in these amendments.
I want to emphasise that the only difference between the effect of Section 13 and the effect of these amendments is that, for the period that may elapse between the day on which the President signs this Bill and the day on which the Bill shall be brought into operation, the Minister will have power to appoint a receiver. But I have not the slightest intention, once this Bill is passed, of delaying the day on which it will come into operation. The day on which it comes into operation all the property and assets of the club and its subsidiary interests, including Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, will be vested in trustees appointed by the club as provided by Section 13 of the revised constitution scheduled to the Bill we are at present discussing. If we want to achieve that purpose, the sooner we pass this Bill the better it will be for everyone. If the Opposition want to help the Government to get the Bill enacted, they have no reason to anticipate—
What if some of the assets are sold next week?
How does the amendment help to prevent that?
The Minister can cure that, too.
How?
By bringing in one unambiguous clause enshrining the principle of this amendment. That will go through this House in one day.
There is not the slightest danger that anyone will sell anything. These amendments cannot operate until this Bill becomes law. I do not believe there is the slightest intention on the part of anybody to dispose precipitately of anything. These amendments do not do anything to cure the situation whereas, if this Bill had been passed a month ago, or even six weeks ago, all that property would now be vested in trustees, which is what I wanted to have done.
Oh, no. The Minister has the appointing of a day.
But I am telling the Deputy I have not the slightest intention of delaying the appointing of the day. The only effect of these amendments is to provide the Minister with power to appoint a receiver between the day on which the Bill passes into law and the day he appoints for the coming into operation of the Act. That is all. If this Bill had passed in the ordinary way, the trustees would now be appointed and all the property would be vested in them. I still urge on the Opposition that they should co-operate in getting this Bill passed so that we may put this industry on a satisfactory basis. I ask them to realise that the substance of the amendment in Deputy MacEntee's name is, in fact, enshrined in Article 13 of the draft constitution which is annexed to the Bill.
The Minister has alleged that we are prostituting the proceedings of Parliament. The Minister is quite a good judge of that scabrous occupation. But we are not prostituting the proceedings of Parliament. We are here in the discharge of a public duty to induce or persuade the Minister to prevent what, in fact, will become one of the most scandalous abuses of office and authority that this country has known for a long time.
I agree with the Minister that the amendments are not perfect. They do not do what we should like to do, namely, to ensure that a receiver should be appointed immediately to administer the affairs of the club, the affairs of the Greyhound and Sporting Press and the affairs of Powerstown Park, Limited, all for the sole benefit and advantage of the Irish Coursing Club and of those who are the foundation upon which that club has been built, the greyhound owners and breeders and the small farmer about whom the Taoiseach professed to be so much concerned this morning. We could not, within the title of this Bill, do anything more than set out the things which we think should be done, if possible forthwith. We are, of course, in the position to which the Minister has referred. This Bill will take same time before it reaches the Statute Book. The reason why it is likely to make slow progress in that regard will be easily understood by any person who studies the report of the Minister's own advisory committee, the committee he set up to advise him on the greyhound industry, and, side by side with that, studies the provisions of this Bill. In every particular, except perhaps one—clause 13 of the constitution of the proposed reformed club—the Bill disregards the recommendations made to the Minister by the advisory committee. It is an expression of lack of confidence in the Minister's own nominees, not excluding Deputy Anthony Barry who, I am glad to see, has replaced the Minister on the Front Bench. I hope it is a happy augury and an indication of things to come.
As I have said, we recognise very fully the imperfections of this amendment. It is imperfect in so far as it cannot come into operation until the Bill becomes law, but that is a matter which could easily be remedied, if the Minister were concerned to prevent the dissipation of the assets of the Irish Coursing Club for the benefit of some members and some officials of the club. This is a simple amendment, consisting of three sections. The Minister could introduce into this House to-morrow morning a Bill to give effect to the principles of the amendment, and, if he did so, he would get all stages before to-morrow afternoon. He could then take steps to protect the property which really belongs to the people who own and breed greyhounds in this country, because it was through their fees and the payments exacted from them that this club has accumulated the relatively enormous assets which it now has.
It is difficult to bring home to our people, who are at the moment so preoccupied with the grave plight in which they find themselves, why we in the Opposition have taken up the attitude which we have taken in regard to this Bill and particularly to bring home to them why we have put down this amendment. The men in C.I.E. who are trembling on the verge of dismissal, or who are being told that, in lieu of dismissal, they must accept a reduction in their wages, no doubt will think that the Greyhound Industry Bill is of small concern. The people who are on short time in many of the industries in this country will probably take that view also. The unfortunate people who have entered into commitments for the purchase of houses, I would say——
I do not think this is relevant.
I think the Deputy is getting away from the amendment.
I am merely pointing out why we are taking up this attitude on this Bill. We are not prostituting the time of Parliament. We know we have a difficult task in convincing the people that we are doing a great service to the State and to the people in the attitude we are taking up on this Bill and doing a great service to public morality in this country in the attitude which we have adopted. As I have said, people have entered into commitments to purchase houses on the assumption that the money would be forthcoming, and it would be hard indeed for them to regard the Greyhound Industry Bill as of great importance, but this Bill is a matter of great importance to the State and to the people.
The Deputy is now discussing the Bill and not the amendment which has to do with the appointment of a receiver.
Both the Taoiseach and the Minister for Agriculture have suggested that we have taken up the attitude we have in regard to this Bill in a spirit of wanton and deliberate obstruction. I want to make it quite clear that it is no pleasure for me to be here this morning and of no benefit or advantage to me or to any other member of the Opposition to be in this House this morning, but we are here because we have a public duty to discharge. We are not here, to use the elegant phrase of the Minister for Agriculture "in prostitution of the procedure of Parliament." We are here because the Minister has shown a calculated disregard of the recommendations of Deputy Anthony Barry and his colleagues on the advisory committee, and it is rather startling to think that Deputy Barry has not spoken one word of explanation of any kind of his volte face in this matter and he is now under the Whip of the Fine Gael Party going to go into the Lobby to vote against his own recent recommendations.
I will break down and cry in a minute.
Deputy Barry and the Minister for Agriculture apparently did not take the report of the advisory committee as seriously as we have taken it. Everybody has known for a long time that the air in sporting circles was reeking with suggestions of mismanagement of the affairs of the Irish Coursing Club. That is one of the reasons why the first paragraph of this amendment is on the Order Paper. It is because of the suspicions and the allegations about the way in which the affairs of the club were being managed for the benefit, advantage and profit of certain individuals. It has been proven up to the hilt by the report of the advisory committee. That is our justification for asking the Minister to appoint a qualified person as receiver to administer the affairs of the club, because Deputy Barry, over his own signature, has found that these allegations were justified; that the abuses which were alleged to exist did, in fact, exist; and that this club owned very valuable properties which were not being administered for the benefit and advantage of the club.
Deputy O'Malley says that you are wrong about that.
There cannot be any doubt in the mind of any person who listened to the cogent, reasoned speech of Deputy O'Malley, substantiated in every particular by quotations from Deputy Barry himself, that there is grave need in the public interest to ensure that positions of trust will not be abused, that there is grave need to prove to the public that the sole and only reason why the Minister has introduced this Bill in the form in which it is now before the House is not to give these people an indemnity for their past misdeeds and to establish themselves in position under the protection of the laws of this country.
When this Bill was before the House on the Second Stage, we welcomed it. We hoped that we would be in a position on Committee Stage to bring it into closer conformity with the recommendations of the committee. The Minister in his statement made a few minutes ago boasted that he had put down some amendments to meet the views of the Opposition. The Minister expects a great measure of gratitude for trifling concessions. The great man has unbent. He is no longer the dictator of Dáil Eireann, no longer the Mussolini of the greyhound industry. So, he has put down a number of amendments—an amendment to Section 13, an amendment which corrects the faulty drafting of the Bill and which says that a licence will not be refused for a track on the ground of unsuitability——
Surely we are not discussing Section 13.
It was the Minister who raised this, boasting about the amendments which he had put down— an amendment which says that the greyhound board will not turn down an application until the applicant has been heard. It does not, of course, appeal to the Minister. That is not consistent with the sort of star chamber procedure which would be dear to his heart. He has an amendment down to Sections 28, 29 and 30. They are mere amendments of phraseology, to make his own confused drafting of the Bill clearer. He has an amendment down to Section 35 which is of the same effect.
The one concession that the Minister did make to the common wisdom of the House, the one concession which he did make to those who support him as well as those who criticise him, was amendment No. 24 to Section 48.
I take it these amendments will be discussed in the proper places.
Yes, Sir, but I am merely dealing with the fact. The Minister has charged the Opposition with obstruction. I am charging the Minister with deliberate dictatorship. He is attempting, for some reasons best known to himself, to steamroll this Bill through Dáil Éireann in defiance of the recommendations of his own advisory committee and, Sir, that is relevant, as I shall show you, to the amendment which is on the Order Paper. That amendment was put down after certain facts came to our knowledge. That amendment was carefully considered. As I have already said, Sir, it is not a perfect amendment— the Minister has drawn attention to its imperfections—but its acceptance by Dáil Éireann would be a clear indication to the gentlemen who control and administer the affairs of the Irish Coursing Club that they are not going to get away with it. It would be a red light to them.
The Minister was quite right: the amendment cannot become effective immediately, even if the House were to adopt it and that, as I concede, is the one weakness in it. But, if it is a weakness and if the Minister thinks that in other respects, having regard to the knowledge which he now has, thanks to Deputy O'Malley, the principles of the amendment are sound, then he has a remedy, a remedy which we will be glad to facilitate him in devising. He can ask us to withdraw this amendment and give us an undertaking, as I have said, that he will bring in a simple Bill to give effect to the principles and we will ensure that that Bill is given a speedy passage through this House.
The Deputy said this before, at 12.10.
The Minister was not here. Deputy Barry had the advantage of hearing. I do not wish to leave the Minister under any disadvantage as compared with Deputy Barry. After all, it will be the Minister's responsibility to say yea or nay to this, to accept our very reasonable proposal or to reject it. That will be his business. He will be in a position to protect this industry and all the assets that have accrued to the Irish Coursing Club, if he is concerned to secure that, and to conserve them for the benefit and advantage of the owners and breeders of greyhounds in this country. I trust he will accept the principles of this amendment, and, as I was going on to say when Deputy Barry interrupted, if he undertakes to bring in a simple Bill embodying the principles of this amendment——
That is the third time.
Sir, I protest. Deputy Barry has not spoken in this debate, but Deputy Barry carries a very heavy responsibility in regard to the matters with which this Bill is dealing. Deputy Barry was a member of the advisory committee, but he has kept up a running string of interjection, during the speeches of both Deputy O'Malley and myself. If I have to repeat myself, it is because of these interruptions which throw me back to the point at which I was when the interruptions were made.
I was saying, Sir, that if the Minister accepts the principles of this amendment, and gives an undertaking that he will bring in a Bill to give effect to those principles, we, on our side, are prepared to withdraw the amendment and to ensure that the Minister's proposals giving effect to its principles will have a speedy passage through the House. We cannot, of course, speak for the members on the Government Benches, nor can we speak for the caucuses of the Parties which support the Government. If the Minister brings in that simple Bill, the whole purpose of our criticism of the present measure will have been achieved. We shall have ensured that the property and assets that properly belong to those who have built them up, the greyhound breeders and owners of this country, will be conserved for their benefit. That is a simple thing.
I do not know whether the Minister will reject that proposal as he has rejected every other constructive proposal that emanated from this side of the House. It is made seriously and with full justification. It is rather unfortunate that there are so few members of Dáil Éireann interested in the point of view which we are expressing, that there are so few members of Dáil Éireann who have read the report of the advisory committee. If they had read it, it would not have been necessary for Deputy O'Malley and myself to have argued the case for drastic amendment of this Bill. The report of the advisory committee would convince everybody that the amendment which we have down is essential.
Deputy O'Malley has referred to the very substantial assets which belong, in equity, if not precisely in law, to the Irish Coursing Club. It is exceedingly difficult for the ordinary person, merely reading the report of the advisory committee, to appreciate exactly what is the relationship between the administration of these properties and the controlling body of the club. It is exceedingly difficult for any person, who has not had access to the internal accounts of these concerns, and of the club, to form an opinion as to what extent these valuable properties are being milked for the benefit and advantage of certain individuals. Any outsider may be suspicious about the set-up, about the inter-linkages, but he cannot have much more than suspicions.
This amendment will clear the air, if effect is given to it, if the Minister accepts it. A qualified person is to be appointed, one who has no financial or social entanglements, no bonds of ordinary social intercourse and friendship to fetter him in investigating the affairs of this club, a person who has no link with those who are members of the club and has no personal connections with the value of the property which, over the years, has accrued to them. That is why we are asking that a qualified person should be appointed as receiver.
As I have said, Sir, this amendment was not put down except after close and serious consideration. It is, I admit, an extraordinary step to have to take, but we have been driven to it. We have been driven to it by an appraisement of the facts which are disclosed in the report of the advisory committee. It is an axiom of ordinary commercial life, and certainly a requirement of company law, that a balance sheet shall disclose the true position of the concern in respect of which it is published. I do not suppose anybody will query that.
What do we find in respect of the balance sheet of this organisation? We find that a property, the Greyhound Sporting Press, Limited, modestly estimated by the managers of it, in 1951, as being worth £60,000, appears in the balance sheet at a valuation of £1. Another property, Powerstown Park—a very valuable property indeed, because, under its present management, it has the unique advantage, like a racehorse, of making its owner pay for its keep—towards which the Irish Coursing Club, in the words of the report, actually pays £100 per annum for the right to hold coursing meetings on its own lands, is a property which so far has not been valued. It is a property the value of which has not yet been disclosed to the Irish Coursing Club, but it is a property upon which considerable sums— £12,000 approximately by Powerstown Park Company, itself, and a further £2,000 by the Irish Coursing Club— have been spent in recent years. This property, whose value, let me emphasise again, has not been disclosed to the members of the club, but upon which £14,000 has been spent by hardheaded shrewd businessmen, appears in the balance sheet for the edification of the members of the club at their annual general meetings valued at £1.
Is it any wonder that, when a proposal to dispose of some portion of this property was before the meeting of the Irish Coursing Club, some members of that club took the view that the property was worth little or nothing, and that it should be virtually given away to the secretary of the club who is inflicting a grave hardship on the club by resigning from his present position in order to secure an appointment, which is rated to be worth £5,000 a year to him?
I was saying that the balance sheet of any concern is supposed to present a true and accurate picture of the assets of the concern. I have shown that Powerstown Park, about which proposals have been made which will seriously affect the value of the property but upon which £14,000 has been spent, is valued at £1. I have mentioned that the Greyhound and Sporting Press, valued by the management at £60,000, appears in the balance sheet at £1, but there are other properties, as Deputy O'Malley pointed out, which are owned by the Irish Coursing Club and which are not mentioned in the balance sheet at all. According to Deputy Anthony Barry, "assets, under the heading of offices, fixtures and fittings, equipment, stationery, etc., do not, however, appear on the balance sheet under any heading."
Will the Deputy give the reference?
I am quoting, Sir, from paragraph 119 of the report of the advisory committee. The report goes on: "So that in reality, the net assets are considerably higher." That is a masterly understatement. Let us see what the assets of this club are according to the balance sheet and what they are presumably in reality— the assets which we think call out for protection, which we think ought to be put into the custody and under the control of a receiver, a qualified person who would administer them for the benefit and advantage of the members of the club, the greyhound breeding industry as a whole and the small farmers of Ireland about whom the Taoiseach was so concerned this morning.
Here is the balance sheet of this company as at the 30th June, 1950. I should say, Sir, now that I have refreshed myself by looking at the figures, that I did say that certain values had been put upon Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press by the committee in 1951. I see that, in fact, it was a year later than the valuations had been made because the balance sheet to which I am going to refer was the balance sheet of the club as at 30th June, 1950. I am continuing to quote from paragraph 119.
According to this balance sheet, the assets of this concern, representing debtors, cash-on-hands and investments in Government loans, amounted to £8,558. That was the main asset disclosed in the balance sheet. Why they made such a disclosure in the balance sheet, having regard to the manner in which they concealed the value of assets like Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, is, of course, inexplicable. They might just as well have written that asset down to £1. If they had, however, they would have shown that the club was carrying a substantial deficit.
Is the Deputy aware of that? Is he aware that they wanted to do that?
Am I aware of what?
That they wanted to show a deficiency?
I did not say that. I think the Deputy has misheard me. I said it is somewhat inexplicable that they did not write down the items— debtors, cash-on-hands and investment in Government loans—in the same drastic way as they had understated the value of Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press. I went on to say that perhaps the reason why they did not do it was that, if they had done so, the balance sheet would have shown a deficiency of assets over liabilities. That is what I said. I did not suggest that they wanted to do that. Perhaps Deputy Barry may have the advantage.
Notice taken that 20 Deputies were not present; House counted, and 20 Deputies being present,
May I recapitulate slightly for the benefit of the members who have just come in? I was saying that the balance sheet is supposed to disclose a true picture of an organisation's affairs. I pointed out that Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press, both exceedingly valuable properties with great potentialities, appear in the balance sheet at £1 each. I was pointing out that the debtors, cash on hands, and investments in Government loans amounted to £8,558, or that they appear in the balance sheet at a figure of £8,558. I was then going on—I am omitting the digression into which Deputy Anthony Barry led me—to point out that the net assets, after allowing for bank overdraft and creditors, are shown at £2,041.
The result is that the ordinary members of the club, many of whom are not well acquainted with balance sheets, many of whom are engaged in agriculture and are more concerned with the valuation of their lands and the rates upon them than getting out a balance sheet at the end of every year to show whether they have a surplus or a deficiency in their assets, would assume that this club was a comparatively impoverished body and therefore would be quite willing to dispose of the assets of the club, thinking that, however little they got for them, they would be well paid. One must ask oneself very seriously why was a property like the Greyhound and Sporting Press, valued in 1950 by the management at £60,000, property which included buildings which were erected in recent years, to use the phraseology of the report, at a cost of approximately £14,000, which owned plant and equipment valued for £18,000 in the year 1950—buildings which would be worth at a modest estimate perhaps 30 per cent. more today and plant which would certainly be worth 50 per cent. more to-day— why was this property entered in the balance sheet at the trifling figure——
Why did the Deputy not ask that question previously?
Order! Deputy MacEntee.
——at the contemptuous figure of £1? Why was Powerstown Park, upon which £14,000 had been spent in a few years, entered in the balance sheet at £1? Surely these are questions which must be answered by the Minister, who is putting this Bill before the House to confirm in their present position the people who have been responsible for misleading the members of the club in this way? I have said that the true value of Powerstown Park has not been disclosed to the members. A valuation of that property was made recently. Was that valuation put before the members? If not, why not? Has the Minister ascertained why that valuation has not been disclosed? Is the Minister not aware of the fact that there are very valuable mineral clays on that property, the property which belongs to the Irish Coursing Club and not to the secretary of the club or to the standing committee of the club or to any officer of the club or any friend of any officer of the club?
Is the Minister not aware of that fact, or is he as remote and aloof from the transactions of this organisation as he has been remote and aloof in his approach to this Bill and to the arguments which have been addressed to him in regard to it? I refer to the fact that there are very important deposits of mineral clay in Powerstown Park, so valuable that the secretary of the club—I am sorry to have to mention names, but there is no other way in which I can justify the amendment I have put down——
I believe the Deputy's main purpose is to slander individuals——
The Minister should not talk about that at all. He is a good hand at it himself.
——living and dead.
I have here in my possession the minutes of a meeting of the Standing Committee of the Irish Coursing Club held in May last. In the words of the minute itself, the meeting was held at 2.30 p.m. I have here also the issue of the Sporting Press for Thursday, May 17th last. There is no slander in commenting upon the transactions which took place at that meeting, but there is, as far as I am concerned, a grave charge to be laid against the Minister that, with this information, which is available to many people in this country, he has taken no steps to protect the properties of the members of the Irish Coursing Club. Not once has he made any public announcement that he would not permit the Irish Coursing Club to divest itself of its assets, unless their true and full value was received for them.
He has not even written the letter which Deputy O'Malley suggested he might write. The Minister will not get away with this. As Deputy O'Malley disclosed, a great deal of interest has been aroused in these transactions. The provincial and sporting Press are commenting upon them and, in due course, the responsibility for what is now being done will be put on the Minister. We have been compelled to open this matter in this way because of the inaction of the Minister, because of his stubborn refusal to do what we believe to be his public duty to do—to protect the property of the hapless individuals who cannot protect themselves. As Deputy O'Malley mentioned, and as the report of the advisory committee itself states, it is almost as much as a man's life is worth to go to one of those meetings and utter a word of criticism or protest. I have read the evidence given by individuals who had the temerity to go to one of the annual general meetings of the Irish Coursing Club.
Notice taken that 20 Deputies were not present; House counted, and 20 Deputies being present,
I was saying that the Minister was failing in his public duty in refusing to take action to preserve the property of the hapless individuals who are unable to protect themselves. I referred to a statement made by Deputy O'Malley. He did not put it in precisely my words, but he said that individuals who went to the annual general meetings of this club attempting to ask questions were put in the deep freeze. I said it was as much almost as their lives were worth to go there and attack or query any action of the persons who have control of this organisation. That statement is not made rashly. I have read the statements made before the advisory committee by individuals. It is true the statements were not made on oath and, to that extent, they can be discounted. But they were made and they were statements which were sifted. They were not taken just at their face value. They were sifted and investigated by the advisory committee, the members of which included a present member of Dáil Éireann. They came to the conclusion that there was substantial foundation for these allegations.
That brings me back to the point I was making, that when people find themselves in a position in which they are estopped, almost by fear of physical violence, from protesting against what they know to be wrong, it is the duty of the Minister who set up this committee to investigate these allegations, amongst others, and to take steps to ensure that the properties which belong to the members of the Irish Coursing Club will not be dissipated and done away with. That, as I have said, is the purpose we seek to serve in this amendment. We are asking that some person should be put in by the Minister at the earliest possible date, which would make our amendment relevant.
I have already suggested, and I am only referring to it in passing, that if the Minister has a cogent argument against the amendment in so far as it cannot be immediately effective, we say he can make it immediately effective by bringing in a Bill which would get a speedy passage through this House and, I am sure, through the Seanad; but, in any event, there is a clamant need to do something either through a public statement made by the Minister or by means of a letter written to the persons in control of the Irish Coursing Club.
I was establishing a case for this amendment. I was showing that the balance sheet of the club, according to the advisory committee, is not a true and accurate statement of the affairs of the club. I was going on from that to say that these very valuable properties—Powerstown Park in particular at this moment—are now the subject of negotiations between an officer of the club, an executive of Powerstown Park who holds not merely the position of chief executive officer of the club, but is also an executive of Powerstown Park—that is one of his capacities— and the standing committee of the club, either to rent or purchase Powerstown Park. Surely there is a conflict of interest here which should not be allowed to exist in relation to an undertaking which is the subject of legislation now before the House?
How can a person who wishes to purchase or rent portion of the property belonging to this club advise that club objectively in his capacity as an officer of it? I think it will be conceded that it would be exceedingly difficult, even if he suffered from schizophrenia, even if one side of his brain were to operate solely in the interests of the Irish Coursing Club and the other side solely in his own interests and those of his colleagues who wish to enter into occupation of the lands of Powerstown Park or some portion of them, and utilise them for their own use and benefit.
The Minister, we know, is a philosopher, a great student of mass psychology. I am putting that question to him. Even a genius could not disentangle the border line between his own interests, on the one hand, as a potential owner, and on the other from his duties or obligations to the club of which he is an officer, but that is what is going on at the moment. It would be quite impossible, in the ordinary course of human nature, for a person to keep right on both sides of this narrow line, which would divide self-interest from his official duties; but whether difficult or easy, it will certainly be impossible to convince outside people that that line has been strictly preserved and has not been traversed in any way.
The difficulty in this matter becomes more accentuated when we study, firstly, the minutes of the standing committee and then turn to the report of the general meeting of the club which appears in the Sporting Press, because then we realise what the effect this fictitious and unreal balance sheet, to which I have referred, has had upon the minds of the members of this club, and even of the members of the standing committee. Do not forget that here is a concern possessed of assets, which I think it is no exaggeration to say, have a net value of about £100,000. The net assets of this concern appear on the balance sheet circulated to the ordinary members at a value of £2,041. What do we find? We find that the unfortunate members of the standing committee took the view that Powerstown Park was worth little or nothing to them. I am sorry to delay the House.
He knows that this operation is in order to spend time.
I protest.
I now allege Deputy MacEntee is hypocritically mouthing from papers, pretending he is looking for them, in order to waste time.
I have these papers marked. Unfortunately I cannot find the reference which would clinch what I have said. However, it is there. There is not a doubt about it that the members of the standing committee themselves were under the impression that Powerstown Park was a property of very little value, an impression which the prospective purchaser or tenant of this property was not himself averse to creating. A report appeared in the Sporting Press of May 17th of the proceedings at the Irish Coursing Club meeting, a report which was edited and prepared for the Press by the person to whom I must refer as the prospective purchaser. When he was asked by a member of the club why did he propose now to sell the property—and I hope this will sink into the minds of those who are giving me the courtesy of listening to me—his reply was: “This had been going on for quite some time”—mark the words—“following the report of the advisory committee.”
Is that not a very relevant statement? The persons who have been battening on the property of the Irish Coursing Club were afraid that effect would be given to the recommendations of the advisory committee which had been set up by the present Minister for Agriculture in, I think, the year 1950. Because these individuals were afraid that action would be taken to rectify the abuses which the advisory committee found to have been established, they proceeded to consider what they were going to do with, among other properties, Powerstown Park.
Is that not the plain and simple deduction to be drawn from the statement that "this"—I am quoting the words as they appeared in the Sporting Press—“had been going on for quite some time following the report of the advisory committee.” They sowed the seeds at one stage and the principal officer of the Irish Coursing Club and his associates are now proposing to reap the rich harvest from those seeds.
Notice taken that 20 Deputies were not present; House counted, and 20 Deputies being present,
Again, Sir, I am sorry, but will you permit me just to inform the members——
I cannot allow the Deputy to repeat what he has said.
Is it not a great pity that they should be deprived of the facts?
They can read them.
I was impressing upon the House the fact that the balance sheet of the committee had misled members of the Irish Coursing Club as to the true value of the assets which belonged to them, and I was about to say how was it——
We cannot hear the Deputy.
I can speak a great deal louder. The Deputy has not heard me outside. I am quite well aware that I could not be heard inside in the committee rooms; probably there was too much shouting and turmoil going on there. I am very sorry these gentlemen cannot hear me: I suggest they come down and sit nearer. Do not skulk away up there in the background.
Perhaps the Deputy would come to the amendment.
When the Deputy has something objectionable to say he usually drops his voice.
Opposition Deputies call for a House and then run out.
After all, I realise the Deputies opposite are not converted yet. They are not persuaded. It is they who will have to face the music in a little while when people are asking why Fine Gael have not done something about housing, why they have not done something about C.I.E., why they devoted a whole morning to the Greyhound Industry Bill. Twelve hours are scheduled for this Bill today. When the country is going to the dogs all the Minister for Agriculture can think about is greyhounds.
Acting-Chairman
Perhaps the Deputy would come to the amendment now.
He is just fiddling at the moment.
While Rome burns.
Oh!
If the gentlemen who have ears to hear will keep their tongues from wagging for a little while, I shall try to disclose to them why Powerstown Park is about to be destroyed for the benefit and advantage of an officer of the Irish Coursing Club. That, Sir, is the point with which I was dealing when it was discovered that I had not a House to hear me. At the meeting on 2nd May, as reported in the Sporting Press of Thursday 17th May, it was disclosed to those members who attended—now I warn the Deputies on the opposite benches that if they go away they will only have the trouble of coming back again—that Powerstown Park was to be alienated and a member of the club put this question: why did they propose to sell the property? The answer given by the prospective purchaser of the property was in these very significant words: “This,” he said, “has been going on for quite some time following the report”—I trust Deputies opposite are listening—“of the advisory committee.”
That report was the red light. The gentlemen who were affected by that report, the gentlemen whose conduct was impugned by that report, the gentlemen who, according to the advisory committee, had tolerated the most grievous and scandalous abuse in connection with greyhound racing, greyhound selling and indeed, greyhound breeding, the gentlemen who were waxing rich on the fat they were getting from Powerstown Park and the Greyhound and Sporting Press began to say to themselves, following the report of the advisory committee, "The Government must take action to stop us." I can tell you that, if there had been a different Government in office——
When did the report come in?
If there had been a different Government in office——
There was a Government in office. The Deputy's Government had the report for three years.
Had there been a different Government in office, I was saying, Sir, they would have stopped this business. They would have brought in a Bill——
The Deputy's Government was there for three years. What a hypocrite the Deputy is.
——and it would not have been a measure such as this, which will allow these abuses to be perpetrated and will confirm in the enjoyment of their perquisites those who have been responsible for the fact that the members of the Irish Coursing Club had the general idea conveyed to them, and impressed upon them, that Powerstown Park was not a valuable property, that it was a liability costing the Irish Coursing Club £100 a year and that the Greyhound and Sporting Press was not a very prosperous undertaking. That is what they had in mind when they said that this question of alienating the assets of the Irish Coursing Club had been under cogitation for quite some time following the report of the advisory committee. And then he went on to disclose how it was that such a preposterous proposal, as had been made, could be considered by any body of rational men, whether they were members of the standing committee or members of the Irish Coursing Club, whether they were men who were versed in commercial transactions or whether they were men who did not particularly mind, men to whom balance sheets were more like crossword puzzles than statements of affairs.
He went on to say—and this is why the members of the Irish Coursing Club had before them year after year balance sheets which misled them as to the real condition of the affairs of the club: "It was felt," said this prospective purchaser, a very skilful propagandist—some samples of his propaganda were recently before a special committee—the Committee on Procedure and Privileges of this House—"it was felt"—and this is his own record: this is his own report sub-edited by himself and printed in the paper of which he is editor—"by some members that the return from Powerstown Park was so small that some step should be taken to realise the investment or see if something could be got out of it." May I repeat that, so that it will sink in? Some members opposite are saying they cannot hear me, so I will repeat it a little more loudly: "It was felt by some members that the return from Powerstown Park was so small that some step should be taken to realise the investment or see if something could be got out of it." Now, why was the return from Powerstown Park so small in the eyes of the members of the Irish Coursing Club?
This valuable property upon which, according to paragraph 114, £14,000 had been spent in a few years, was being managed and administered not for the benefit of the club—I say that deliberately—but for the benefit and advantage and personal profit of the officers of the club. That is why a return from this investment, worth at least £14,000 according to the figures which are printed in paragraph 114 of the report, was worth £1,200 a year to one of the officers of the club who has actually offered to rent it, to take it on lease at that figure, because this property was managed and administered not for the benefit and advantage of the persons to whom it belonged but of the officers of the club—self-appointed managers of this concern enjoying perquisites and emoluments such as few members of the club would never dream might attach to themselves. The use of the lands, the use of the magnificent residence, were given as an emolument to the late senior joint secretary of the Irish Coursing Club who was also acting as salaried manager of Powerstown Park, Limited. I am making that statement on the responsibility of Deputy A. Barry who signed the report of this advisory committee.
I think the House heard before that I signed that report.
Of course. There is nothing like repeating the truth. I want to stimulate Deputy Barry's memory. I want to keep him alert in this House. I notice that the moment his name is mentioned, he immediately becomes——
Be careful lest I become too alert, because I may have something to say.
That is what we are waiting to hear. As soon as I am certain Deputy Barry will come up and say: "When I signed this report, I signed something which I knew to be wrong; I made recommendations which on the findings, I was not justified in making," then I shall certainly sit down and keep my ears open——
We had this discussion last February and last December.
——to hear Deputy Barry's retraction of his own printed word and, I am sure, his own authenticated signature. However, we are not discussing Deputy Barry.
You are discussing some enemies of yours.
We are not discussing enemies of mine.
Oh, yes; nothing else.
We are not discussing enemies of mine. It is quite true that the statements which this gentleman made about me have been the subject of consideration by the Committee on Procedure and Privileges. It is quite true that the House has accepted the findings of that committee. Deputy Barry himself endorsed them. I do not think it might be relevant, but, since the Deputy has mentioned it, I do not want to refer to the terms which the committee applied to that publication and to the person who was responsible for it. He is no enemy of mine, but those who are my enemies are those who are going to allow these abuses to go unrectified. Those who are my enemies are the people putting through this Bill—not personal enemies—which does not give effect to one single recommendation of the advisory committee.
You were there for three years yourself to do it and you would not do it.
The Bill was in draft when the Minister came in.
That is hypocrisy.
This is a different Bill.
The report did not come to us.
Which story is true?
This report was presented to us on 18th January, 1952.
And you were there for two and a half years afterwards.
There are many other reports which take a longer time in gestation.
How long is the Emigration Commission report there?
Am I at liberty to discuss these interruptions?
The Deputy is long enough in this House now to know the answer to that question.
He is long enough on his feet this morning.
I am not permitted to make the speech——
You are not able to do so.
These completely irrelevant interruptions and interjections are thrown in——
Are you inviting them?
No.
Deputies are not permitted to accept invitations to interrupt.
I was on the point to which I shall come back and from which the Deputy was very anxious to lead me away, of how the members of the Irish Coursing Club were led to believe that Powerstown Park was a property of very little value. That is what I was addressing myself to. The reason, according to the prospective tenant, purchaser—what you will—of these lands is that they were getting a small return on their investment. Deputy A. Barry will no doubt recall the strictures he passed on the committee because of that. He said:—
"Similarly, we consider that the present practice whereby the only reference in the balance sheet of the club to the subsidiary companies is to their nominal value at £1 each, is misleading and should be altered."
Then he said—I am quoting from paragraph 125:—
"Normally, an executive committee and its officers are at all times merely the custodians of the funds entrusted to them by the parent body, each member of which is entitled to all reasonable information. We find it difficult to avoid the conclusion that the Standing Committee of the Irish Coursing Club and its administrative officials frequently lost sight of these precepts."
Again Deputy Barry seems to have overlooked a statement which he endorsed, a statement which appears in paragraph 123, and which he endorsed by his signature to the report:—
"In regard to the administration of funds, the finance committee appears to have failed to make sure that the resources of the club were applied efficiently and equitably."
How could they? The ordinary working members of the club might like to see things properly conducted but how could they ensure that the funds were being administered equitably when the funds were not being made available to them, when the only information they had as to the value of their property was the fact that it figures at £1 in the balance sheet of the club, when they could get no revenue from Powerstown Park but, on the contrary, were led to believe that Powers town Park was a charge upon them, a liability in so far as they had to pay £100 per annum to hold coursing meetings?
Think of the rather sarcastic manner in which that fact is alluded to in the report of the advisory committee. They say:—
"As in the case of the Greyhound and Sporting Press, Limited, and although Powerstown Park, Limited, seems to be a prosperous undertaking, no contribution whatever appears to have been made by it to the funds of the Irish Coursing Club."
Then comes this masterpiece of sarcasm:—
"Indeed the Irish Coursing Club actually pays £100 per annum for the right to hold coursing meetings on its own lands at Powerstown Park. Profits made by Powerstown Park, Limited, have been utilised to increase the company's assets."
On the one hand we have Powerstown Park, one of the properties which is referred to in this amendment, described as a prosperous undertaking; on the other hand we have the owners of Powerstown Park—I mean the owners in equity and, I suppose, in law as the trustee deed had been executed —looking upon it as a poor investment, an investment, to quote again the chief executive officer of the club, which was so small that some members of the club thought it would be better to divest themselves of the asset altogether, an opinion which no doubt was reinforced by the fact that the club was paying £100 per annum for the right to use its own lands.
As I was saying, on the one hand we have Powerstown Park, Limited, which Deputy Barry and his colleagues on the advisory committee at paragraph 114 of the report declare was—and I am sure is—"a prosperous undertaking" and on the other hand you have the owners who think it is of little value to them. Now consider what is happening in this situation; consider what is the justification for the amendment which we have put down in these circumstances, with the valuable property managed and administered by the chief executive officer of the Irish Coursing Club, a property into which all the profits that should properly have been brought into account as income of the Irish Coursing Club have gone, a property which has been developed and improved by ploughing back those profits into this company. The chief executive officer of the Irish Coursing Club comes along and makes an offer—I was going to use an adjective which I do not want to use——
I do not see why the Deputy should be so perturbed: he is using a lot of other ones.
——makes an offer to members of the club who are being deceived by an inaccurate balance sheet as to the real value of the concern and then modestly says: "Having created the atmosphere, I am not going to participate in the discussion, but here I am offering you £1,200 a year." At the same time, because he has to think, as he says himself, of his private domestic concerns, he offers or tenders his resignation to the club because he has found, or is being offered, a more lucrative position in managing the property of which he and his colleagues are going to become either tenants or purchasers.
Is not that, as I have said, an extraordinary situation? The whole ground, according to this gentleman himself, having been prepared, he is going to enter into the lands and reap the rich harvest of all the moneys belonging to the club which were being ploughed back to develop that property. While I have mentioned the secretary, I want to say that the responsibility does not rest with the secretary. That was an ordinary business transaction, perhaps, from his point of view, but there is a grave responsibility resting on the Minister and it is because he is refusing to discharge that responsibility to protect these people who are not able to protect themselves that we have moved this amendment and that we are going to fight this Bill to the bitter end. I move to report progress.
Progress reported; Committee to sit again.