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Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 10 Mar 1964

Vol. 208 No. 4

Committee on Finance. - Vote 56—Remuneration.

I move:

That a sum not exceeding £303,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1964, for Remuneration of Civil Servants.

Deputies are aware of the recent national agreement on wage and salary adjustments. A claim for a 15 per cent increase in Civil Service pay was made in September last under the conciliation and arbitration scheme and agreement was reached on 4th February, 1964, on an increase in Civil Service pay within the framework of the national agreement with effect from 1st February, 1964. Under the terms of the agreed Civil Service increase, existing rates of pay are increased by 12 per cent with a minimum increase of £1 a week for certain full time male officers.

Following representations from the Association of Higher Civil Servants, it was decided to extend the 12 per cent increase to officers above the salary limit for arbitration.

To meet the cost of this pay revision for the Civil Service proper, a sum of the order of £2½ million will be necessary in a full year; this sum will be somewhat increased to meet the cost of providing similar increases for certain non-Civil Service groups e.g., sub-postmasters. For the two months of the current financial year to which it applies, the additional sum required is estimated at £303,000, allowing for available savings.

Are we to take it from what the Minister says that the corresponding increases in a full financial year to cover this award will be in the order of £2½ million plus?

That is right.

Am I right in believing that this subhead covers civil servants but does not cover the Garda and members of the Defence Forces——

The Army, Garda and teachers are not in this category.

But postmen and employees of the Department of Posts and Telegraphs are?

I agree that the Estimate is necessary so that the money may be made available and I compliment the Minister on introducing it so quickly. Why, however, was he unable to include the manual sections of his Department who, apparently, have not any arrangement made and for some extraordinary reason, must be left behind when the question of wage adjustment is dealt with?

In any case where a straight salary or wage is paid, that is, a basic wage or salary, and where there are certain difficulties—for instance, where bonuses may be involved—it may take some time to agree on what the amount should be.

Could the Minister not state that it is proposed to apply the ninth round with effect from a certain date to those workers and they would be satisfied? Or is he aware that they think there is an attempt being made to do them out of the money until after April 1st.

The Civil Service has agreed on February 1st.

(South Tipperary): What is the total number of people to whom this applies?

I answered a question today about the Civil Service. As far as I know, it is 40,000.

(South Tipperary): I think that was local government employees.

No, civil servants.

I think the Minister said that the total annual bill for this increase would be in the region of £3 millions?

Yes; that was another question.

Does that include all increases which are the State's responsibility? Does it include soldiers, guards, teachers, civil servants, postmen and the like?

The only reason I ask is that some months ago I heard the Taoiseach saying that the total increase represented by the 12 per cent would amount to something like £7 million.

Yes. This includes the Civil Service, including postmen, but does not include the Army, guards or teachers.

The total is £7 million?

Yes, about £7 million.

Could the Minister say if he is serious when he says that 1st February will be the operative date?

I could not answer that because there are other Ministers responsible for some of these services but as far as any agreement that was made so far is concerned, it was 1st February.

The Minister will have to give the money. He will find himself in trouble with trade unions representing the workers because this agreement for an increase has been negotiated by the trade unions for, in the main, these manual workers and their colleagues in private employment will get the 12 per cent from 14th January and so they are entitled to be dissatisfied.

I saw a trade union settlement this morning which I think was for 15th April.

It may have been a recommendation. I think I know the case the Minister is referring to. Surely he will agree that it is only fair that the workers concerned should know the date?

Do not pin him down or he might say April 15th.

The only thing is that I will not agree to a Minister putting up a date before 1st February.

The local authorities have agreed on 14th January.

They have more money than I have.

Vote put and agreed to.
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