Vol. 241 No. 3
asked the Minister for Local Government if he will give details of the recent trends of internal migration on which the White Paper on Housing in the Seventies bases its tentative calculation that the net additional housing needs for migrants in town areas may amount to about 1,000 dwellings a year in the next five or six years; and if he will indicate the nature of these tentative calculations.
28.
asked the Minister for Local Government if he will explain the basis on which in the recent White Paper on Housing it is estimated that, despite the increase of almost 2,000 in the average annual number of marriages between the quinquennial period 1961-1966 and the first three years of the quinquennial period 1966-1971, the average annual increase in the number of married couples in the quinquennial period 1966-1971 will be only 600 higher than in the immediately preceding quinquennial period.
29.
asked the Minister for Local Government the method by which in the recent White Paper on Housing it was estimated that 14,600 of the 24,600 households comprising more than one family unit do not need rehousing.
30.
asked the Minister for Local Government if he will explain the basis on which in the recent White Paper on Housing the figure of 55,500 overcrowded dwellings containing not more than one family was reduced to 15,500 severely overcrowded families requiring rehousing; and, in particular, how the allowance for dwellings capable of extension by building additional rooms was arrived at; what the cost of these extensions is estimated to be; and over what period it is proposed to carry out these extensions.
With your permission, a Cheann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 27, 28, 29 and 30 together.
May I challenge that procedure in view of the fact that the questions have no direct relation between them and should be answered separately?
The Chair has no responsibility for Ministerial replies.
It is done with your permission.
Why do we say "With your permission"?
This has been the procedure in the House for many years.
Might I ask you to refuse your permission as it has been very politely asked by the Minister? The Minister asked would you give your permission and I suggest that you should answer in the negative.
We have some respect for the Chair on this side of the House.
This is very immature.
We all know that Deputy Lemass has no respect for the truth.
I have pointed out that the Chair has no control over Ministerial replies.
The Minister asked your permission to do something and I feel you should answer his request either in the affirmative or the negative.
I did not. I said, "With your permission" and the permission has been granted.
Let the Chair answer.
I know immaturity when I hear it and it is not necessarily on this side of the House.
I have ruled that the question are in order, and it is a matter for the Minister to reply to them in his own fashion.
Why then the preamble, "With your permission"? I should like to have information on that.
Is it incorrect procedure on the Minister's part?
It has been the procedure in this House for many years.
To ask your permission even though you cannot give it? I must say that in the other House we had more orderly procedure.
The Deputy should have stayed there.
That is a reflection on the Chair.
In accordance with your ruling, therefore, it would be permissible for any of the Ministers to answer the questions with just one answer?
Yes, so far as the Chair is concerned.
Particularly when Question Time is being abused like this, with the Deputy trying to do his professional work by means of Parliamentary Question.
I shall raise this matter through the appropriate channels, with your permission.
Have I the Deputy's permission to proceed?
Questions Nos. 27 to 30, inclusive.
In regard to internal migration, the trends on which the need for about 1,000 dwellings a year on account of internal migration are based are derived from censuses and returns by local authorities, who were asked to take into account information derived from local inspections, trends in applications for houses, needs arising from industrialisation, etc. An allowance is made in the White Paper estimate for duplication with needs arising from other causes.
The estimate of the increase in the number of married couples living in the country—which is not the same as the increase in the number of marriages to which the Deputy refers—is based on a series of population projections by the Central Statistics Office described in appendix D of the Third Programme for Economic Expansion.
The estimate of an effective need of about 10,000 dwellings for persons in the 24,600 households approximately comprising more than one family unit is based on the assumption, supported by the rate of application for dower house grants, that the effective need for separate accommodation for households engaged in agriculture is small and that more than one out of every two of the families in the remaining households would require separate accommodation.
The basic data for the estimate of about 15,000 families living in severely overcrowded dwellings with not more than four rooms are local authority returns, the interim results of the census of population 1966, as published in the June, 1968, issue of the Irish Statistical Bulletin, with an allowance for duplication as between needs included under other heads and for houses provided since the census was taken for persons living in overcrowded conditions.
Most of the overcrowded dwellings with four or more rooms are privately owned. A decision to extend is, therefore, a matter for the individual occupier or owner. In view of this no separate estimate was made of the period within which extensions would be carried out or of the cost. In recent years about 10,000 dwellings a year have been substantially reconstructed with State aid.
In conclusion, I may say that the aggregate forecasts of housing output arrived at in the White Paper are supported by a number of other independent and expert assessments of which I am aware, including that at paragraph 518 of the Buchanan Report.
May I ask the Minister if he can furnish me with the calculations to which he referred in reply to Questions Nos. 27 and 28 where he mentioned that certain calculations had been carried out. As it is not evident from the White Paper how the figures in it are arrived at, I should be grateful if the Minister would furnish the information. As regards Question No. 30, is the Minister not aware from his own White Paper that the local authority assessments on which he has at least partially based the calculations dealt with in Question No. 30 have, in fact, uniformly underestimated the demand, as it is clear from the White Paper itself, and is he wise, therefore, in placing reliance on these estimates?
I am not so aware.
The Minister did not reply to my supplementary on Questions Nos. 27 and 28. Would he furnish me with the data?
I shall consider it.
