asked the Minister for Health what proportion of hospitals afford their nurses an 80-hour fortnight; and if he will now have all necessary steps taken to ensure that hospital and public health nurses will not be required to work in excess of these hours.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Nurses' Working Hours.
16.
I am not aware that any local health authority hospital operates an 80-hour fortnight for nursing staffs.
The question of a further reduction in the working hours of nurses is a matter for negotiation between the County and City Managers Association, on behalf of the employing health authorities, and representatives of the nurses. Should my sanction be sought to any settlement, I shall be happy to consider the matter.
Has the Minister any figures for voluntary hospitals or is his information or lack of it confined entirely to public authority hospitals?
I have not got any information about any question of a hospital employing nurses on an 80-hour basis. As the Deputy knows, the working hours were reduced to an 85-hour fortnight in 1966. In some areas it has been found difficult to recruit the extra nurses necessary to implement the 85-hour fortnight. Having reached a 42½-hour week we have been making progress in any event.
Is the question of negotiating shorter hours outside the normal negotiating machinery? Are we to understand that it would be open to the county managers to concede this without requiring the involvement of the Minister, as was apparently believed necessary in 1966?
The Minister's difficulty is, as the Deputy knows, that whereas we do very often express sympathy with suggested improvements in conditions, if the Minister starts to pre-decide any particular issue of this sort he would be in great difficulty and it might result in distortions of policy or distortions in improvements which are not related to those of other serving officers in local authorities. The Minister has to take a reasonable attitude. He can certainly encourage certain improvements but for the Minister to say in advance that he will approve of a particular condition or change in the character of service on every occasion would be most undesirable.
Is the Minister aware that Mr. MacEntee, when he was Minister for Health, stated that he would approve the 80-hour fortnight for nurses if the County Managers Association and the trade union concerned reached agreement?
We have gone very far in encouraging better conditions for nurses. Both I and my predecessor, and the Minister before that, have done much to encourage improved conditions, but it is not necessary on every occasion to give approval in advance because of the difficulties that could arise.
In view of the fact that the Minister has suggested that he was not as much in favour of this as Mr. MacEntee was, would he now say if it was negotiated he would be prepared to sanction the 80-hour fortnight?
I said that I would consider it sympathetically.
The Minister's predecessor said that he would sanction it.
Does the Deputy want him back?
(Interruptions.)
Now that he has started to recommend brotherly love.