Vol. 252 No. 11
I move:
That a supplementary sum not exceeding £636,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1971, for the salaries and expenses of the Office of Public Works; for expenditure in respect of public buildings; for the maintenance of certain parks and public works; for the execution and maintenance of drainage and other engineering works; and for payment of certain Grants-in-Aid.
This Supplementary Estimate is for increased expenditure on some of the services rendered by the Office of Public Works and to cover an under-realisation in Appropriations-in-Aid of the Vote.
The excess on subhead A is due to salary increases authorised since the original estimate was prepared. Part of the cost of these increases is being met by savings on the subhead.
The excess on subhead B is caused principally by increased rates for travelling which have been authorised and by the cost of incidental expenses being higher than expected.
The excess on subhead D is due in the main to the purchase of the lessors' interest in Nos. 11/13 Upper O'Connell Street known as Hammam Buildings which house certain staff of the Revenue Commissioners and a telephone exchange. A lease of the offices held by the Commissioners of Public Works expired in June, 1970, and the commissioners were faced with a renewal of the lease at a substantially increased rent or alternatively the purchase of the lessors' interest. The State already owns the properties on each side of Nos. 11/13, namely, Nos. 9 and 10 and Nos. 14/15 Upper O'Connell Street also occupied by Revenue staff and inter-connected with Nos. 11/13. In all the circumstances it was decided that purchase of the lessors' interest in Nos. 11/13 would be preferable to a renewal of the lease. Following protracted negotiations purchase terms were agreed early this year.
The excess on subheads F.1 and F.2 is in the main due to wage increases granted since the original Estimate was prepared. The excess on subhead F.4 arises principally from increased costs of fuel, electricity, et cetera. The excess on subhead G.1 and G.2 is due to wage increases and to the commencement of the Groody catchment drainage scheme in County Limerick. The excess on subhead H arises from the purchase of plant which had not been provided for but which during the year was found to be necessary. The excess on subhead K.1 arises from requirements being higher than expected and to wage increases authorised since the Estimate was prepared.
A new subhead K.3 is being opened to meet the cost of conservation and restoration of Hollycross Abbey, County Tipperary. The conservation costs will be the State's liability, but the expenditure primarily incurred by the State on work classified as restoration will be recovered from the promoters of the scheme and brought to credit as an Appropriation-in-Aid.
The principal short-fall in receipts, subhead M, is under item 6 which reflects the volume of work carried out by the commissioners for the Department of Posts and Telegraphs and under item 2 which was adversely affected by the disruption of traffic at Dún Laoghaire caused by the fire at Menai Bridge in Wales. Under-realisation in certain items of the subhead was partly offset by increased receipts on others, principally item 3, sales of property.
The gross total of the excesses amounts to £897,000 but, allowing for savings on a number of other subheads, that figure is reduced to a net £636,000.
In conclusion I should like to draw the attention of Deputies to the fact that while subhead E overall is showing a saving, expenditure on the erection and improvement of national schools will be of the order of £3,300,000 by the end of the year against the sum of £3,000,000 originally provided.
Inflation.
Any Estimate or Supplementary Estimate must be examined carefully because the people who give the money for those Estimates should get a clear and lucid explanation of what the money is required for and how it will be spent. This is not a concession to the public. It is their lawful right because they provide the money, or at least it is extracted from them by the necessary taxation. I want to say here and now that we have the unenviable reputation of heading the league again with the highest cost of living in Europe.
When we examine this Supplementary Estimate it can readily be understood that where wages and costs are involved there is a ready explanation for the increased expenditure and the revised Estimate. Under subheads A, B, F.1, F.4, G.1, and G.2 we have wages, salaries, incidental expenses and travelling expenses. This can be readily understood by the people because over the past year there was another rise in wages, consequent on the higher cost of living, which may be the fault of the Government. When a Government are in charge of a country they are supposed to manage that country thriftily and not allow the cost of living to go so high that they must increase wages to offset it. I do not intend to speak about anything except the subheads here, as arranged. In the case of subhead D, the explanation given by the Parliamentary Secretary in his memorandum is absolutely clear. The majority of the Deputies agreed, when speaking on the Estimate some time ago, that they were in favour of buying out office accommodation instead of leasing it. I wish to congratulate the Parliamentary Secretary on buying out Hammam Buildings in O'Connell Street. The cost may be excessive but property values are not going down. I know that this policy meets the wishes of the Deputies and of the people.
Subhead F.2 relates to furniture, fittings and utensils. There is an explanation there that an additional sum is required to meet increases in wages and increased requirements. Unless the employees of the Office of Public Works make furniture, fittings and utensils, how can wages be involved in this subhead? It struck me as strange that this should be so.
Coming now to subhead E, this subhead is mentioned on page 8 where there are Appropriations-in-Aid, and the words "Less a saving on subhead E" appear. Subhead E involves new works, alterations and additions. There is £171,000 less expenditure. Had this anything to do with decentralisation of the Departments of Lands and Education to Castlebar and Athlone? If the £171,000 was spent it would pay a large amount of the cost of erecting offices in Castlebar, where they are long awaited. Decentralisation was emphasised a month ago by the former Minister for Justice at a Fianna Fáil function in Castlebar. Does the non-expenditure of this £171,000 mean that the money should have been sent down to Castlebar to establish these offices but that has not happened? I would like to know why the buildings were not built even though there was an allocation of £171,000 for the year for them?
Subhead G.2 refers to arterial drainage. This is important to the rural community. The Moy arterial drainage scheme is almost finished. The maintenance staff have taken over. There are regular complaints in connection with employment. There is a drop in the numbers employed on maintenance. There seems to be a similar drop in employment in the Black River-Corrib Scheme where no single man has been employed since Christmas. Married men with families should be employed, but there seems to be a drop in the employment of single men. The only work available to such men in County Mayo is that provided by the county council and the arterial drainage scheme. I ask the Parliamentary Secretary to endeavour to have these young people employed, because the only alternative open to them is emigration.
When the Parliamentary Secretary was introducing the Estimate some time ago there was an allocation of £30,000 for the Corrib-Mask scheme. This money has not been spent. There is no indication as to when the work will start. I would like the Parliamentary Secretary to give us an approximate date for the commencement of this work.
There have been complaints of compensation withheld through mere technicalities. This compensation is in respect of deposits on the shores of rivers. It is well known in Mayo that the most fertile land lies along the river banks. Compensation should be paid to applicants within a month.
The Parliamentary Secretary has given us information about the grants for national schools. I am glad that the grant for the national schools has been increased by £300,000. Managers and the parents and teachers of the children will welcome this scheme under which the managers of the schools can, on their own initiative, install flush toilets and other amenities. I hope that the managers will avail of the grants and that the Parliamentary Secretary and his efficient staff will deal with the applications in an expeditious manner.
Has the Parliamentary Secretary any information regarding a central national school in Newport, County Mayo? I hope that within a year at least the school, which is badly needed, will be built.
Subhead M shows a shortfall of £154,000. That could be due to miscalculation, but it is a very large sum. The explanation given here which relates to the destruction of the Menai Bridge possibly clarifies the position. This deficiency means that the Office of Public Works have over-estimated what they should have got from the various services. There are receipts amounting to £108,000. This leaves £46,000 to be added. In the case of these receipts, I would like an explanation from the Parliamentary Secretary of the procedure adopted for the sale of property and produce in the stores under the Board of Works. Is it by auction, by tender, or by contract, or how do they get rid of such things? There must be a tremendous amount of surplus stores in the storehouses and yards of the board and it would be very interesting to know how they get rid of this material.
I have covered most of the more important items and there are various minor matters with which we can deal on the main Estimate, because we want to get through the remaining Estimates fairly quickly as this is the last day of the financial year and if we do not, most of the people concerned may not be able to get their salaries or get various jobs under way. From my own experience, and from information I have received from other Deputies, I can say that we have received the utmost co-operation from the officials of the Office of Public Works and especially from the Parliamentary Secretary. I trust that this co-operation will continue because if there is no co-operation in a Department there is no efficiency.
I should like to thank Deputy Kenny for his constructive remarks. The first thing to which I should refer is the property at 11 and 13 Upper O'Connell Street. The purchase price for this property was £270,000 and the premises contain about 70,000 square feet, that is, between the office and the telephone exchange. The purchase is a particularly good one because it puts the State in the position in which they are the owners of practically the whole block between Cathedral Street and the Savoy Cinema. In the circumstances, in spite of policies followed in the past, on the recommenadtiton of the Commissioners of Public Works, the Minister agreed that this was a property the State should buy and I am very glad that they have done so.
Deputy Kenny raised the question of savings under subhead E and I should like to say that in a way I am sorry we have had these savings which are principally due to difficulties arising over the acquisition of land at major fishing harbours at Killybegs and Castletownbere. The Deputy will remember that on the main Estimate we proposed further extensions at these harbours but we ran into some difficulty acquiring land. Subsequently the Minister for Lands, under rather recent legislation, appointed the commissioners as his agents for the purpose of implementing a compulsory purchase order in respect of these properties. Steps are now being taken to implement these compulsory powers; the matter is with our legal people at the moment and I hope that in 1971-72 we will be able to proceed with the very important work of major harbour development. Deputies in general will agree with me that any investment we can make in relation to our fisheries is a very worthwhile one because it is quite clear, under the present terms of the Common Market, that this industry will be in some difficulty. Naturally, if we are hoping for a period in which to help our fishermen adapt to Common Market conditions, then to do this the most important thing is to give them proper landing facilities, proper harbours, into which they can bring bigger boats which apparently will be necessary over the years, as we have to adapt to Common Market conditions. While these savings at Killybegs and Castletownbere may help out in the overall budgetary position in Vote No. 8, they are not savings which I was very happy to make. As the Deputy is probably aware, a survey is being carried out of all landing places on the western seaboard and we hope we may be able to proceed with some work on these very soon. However, it is only fair to say that it is quite clear that next year the amount of money to be provided under nearly every head is going to be pared to the absolute minimum and there may be things which we would like to do which we will not be able to do in the coming year. However, I sincerely hope that we will be able to proceed——
Why would that be?
Well, the Deputy is aware that we have an inflationary situation and if anyone has to give a lead to fight inflation the Government themselves must take steps to do so.
But have the boys in Revenue not brought an awful lot of money into the kitty this year which the Government could not possibly have taken into account last year? Will the same thing not happen again this year?
Well, the Book of Estimates is not out yet. I am only aware of the dealings of my Department with the Department of Finance.
The Parliamentary Secretary can read the signs as well as we can.
Apparently the Minister for Finance is quite anxious to limit any increase in national expenditure in the forthcoming financial year. As I say, as a result of this there may be things which I personally would like to have done which we may not be able to do, but we are proceeding on the basis that we will be able to carry on our programme as we have been doing in the past. That is the only way in which we can do it. As I say, the compulsory proceedings in relation to the harbours are under way and we expect to be able to proceed with them before very long.
Deputy Kenny also referred to subhead F.2 and he wanted to know how wages were involved under this head. The Deputy is probably aware that we operate a central furniture store in Rathmines in which we have roughly 30 employees including upholsterers, storemen and all the other people you would expect in a general furniture store. It is quite an extensive store. As Deputies are aware, we are proceeding with the decoration of some of the rooms in this House and we were able to find additional furniture there without having to get furniture specially made. In this connection, too, although it is only indirectly related, we have in Inchicore a furniture workshop where they design prototypes of various furniture that will be suitable for Government Departments. When they design these prototypes the various private manufacturers are asked to submit tenders for the supply of this furniture. The Deputy is also aware that the greater the quantity you buy of any one design in furniture, or for that matter, textiles, or plastic bottles, the better the price deal you can make.
When placing orders we must always bear in mind new offices coming into Government possession. We shall have an enormous building in Kildare Place, probably the largest single Government office in the country. It will house the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries and other offices. I think Deputy Ryan asked about the delay in the provision of a police station in Ballyfermot. The interior decoration there is almost completed but, strangely, we are waiting for furniture despite the furniture store position.
Rathmines is not far from Ballyfermot. The Parliamentary Secretary knows we both have the privilege of representing the area.
In four or five weeks we shall have the gardaí in the station in Ballyfermot. As I am sure the Deputy is aware, we are now making decent progress with the Rathmines station also. It was a bit slow for a while but it is moving satisfactorily now.
Deputy Kenny was mainly concerned about how wages were involved and that is how they are involved: we have these storemen and upholsterers and so on in connection with the Rathmines furniture factory. The people there are doing some great work. They can produce tables and items that I never knew existed at the drop of a hat when they are required for a special committee meeting, or something like that.
The Deputy also raised the question of the proposed Newport central school. The difficulty here has also arisen in other places. Preliminary sketch plans were prepared some time ago for this school on the basis of five classrooms and a general purposes room. Our information now from the Department of Education is that the requirements are changing and until requirements are finalised the Office of Public Works cannot make any progress. This difficulty arises from time to time because we work as agents for various Ministers. We understood this school was to proceed but on examining the whole question of the area the Department concluded the requirements might differ from what was originally envisaged so that therefore we are not in a position at present to proceed.
Would the Parliamentary Secretary give any information about Dunkellin?
Yes, but I should prefer to get a note on it first.
A decision was supposed to be made by the end of March on that drainage scheme and this is the last day of March.
I will come back to that. I should like to get a note so that I can be completely clear on it. It is not being unduly held up.
Many people think it is.
I shall give the Deputy the exact position in a few moments. Deputy Kenny also inquired about sale of produce.
What kind of produce?
Practically all of this relates to the produce from the farms at the Bourn Vincent Memorial Park, Killarney, where we have an experimental farm producing milk and cattle. Some of the milk is sold directly to local people, the remainder going to the creamery. If the Deputy is ever in the Bourn Vincent Memorial Park——
Yes, I was there.
——it would be a good exercise to ask one of the park managers to point out some of these features such as the experimental farm which is very interesting and up-to-date. They are trying out all the new methods of milking and so on.
One thing that was wrong a few years ago was that the workers were very badly paid. I think, however, that has been remedied, to some extent.
We are improving that all the time.
We are still not getting enough.
Is Garnish Island the property of the Office of Public Works?
Yes, Garnish Island is State property. The principal produce is that coming from the experimental farm in the Bourn Vincent Memorial Park.
Deputy Kenny also inquired about sales of surplus stores. This relates to worn out plant and equipment from the Central Engineering Workshops, mostly scrap. We also have old furniture which is surplus to State requirements. I understand we shall be selling some soon following stocktaking at Rathmines. We usually appoint a furniture auctioneer.
It is mainly dealers who would take it.
Yes, they can price things much more quickly than anybody in the Office of Public Works. In general, since I became responsible for the Office of Public Works, sales of property are by public auction. Previously, I think the practice was to sell by public advertisement. We now sell by public auction as far as possible and I try to ensure that a local auctioneer is appointed. In one case where I appointed a Dublin auctioneer there was some objection and so I try to avoid that situation arising again.
Who has the sale of vacant national schools?
Usually a local auctioneer is appointed.
But is it the manager or the Office of Public Works?
The manager, usually, but some are State property. I should now like to answer the question about Dunkellin. A scheme for Dunkellin has been surveyed and it is now being designed in consultation with the Department of Lands on account of the existence of the Rahassane-Turlough wildlife region. It is not expected this will hold up the scheme. This is a matter that would be investigated with any drainage scheme. The scheme is not being unduly help up. It will be dealt with when the design is completed with due regard to the money available.
What number is it in the order of priority?
No. 10, I think.
Is it next to be done?
We have two or three just ready.
A decision was promised on this by March, 1971, and this is the last day of March.
I must explain that we ran into some problems, including the Maigue scheme where a court order was made against it. We are very much understaffed as regards engineers. We are moving them from one scheme to another in an effort to have a continuous programme and get the best possible return for the taxpayers' money.
May I take it that the decision as to whether the Dunkellin will be done on a certain date has been postponed?
The scheme has not been sent to the Minister for Finance for permission yet.
When it goes to the Minister for Finance I would ask the Parliamentary Secretary to ensure that there is no part of the original scheme left out because it looks as if there are plans on foot at the moment to leave out part of that scheme.
There is one turlough on which there are wild birds and wild duck. This will be maintained so that even at low water there will be three inches of water available in the turlough. The people whose land will not be drained as a result will be compensated out of funds available from the Department of Lands not from the Office of Public Works.
Was this discussed with the local people?
I have written to the local people very extensively on this matter and the Minister has made a statement on it.
If they are prepared to meet you in regard to this turlough will you meet them?
I would be delighted to. I will not make a date now. The Black river, a part of the Corrib-Headford scheme, was mentioned by Deputy Kenny. This scheme is due to be completed in the next financial year. There is nothing else to add to this. The actual expenditure on schools will be about £3,400,000 but as I said subhead E is showing some saving.
The Corrib-Mask scheme has not yet commenced although money has been allocated.
A detailed scheme for the Corrib-Mask is being prepared and should be ready by the end of the year. Then the usual formalities have to be gone through. We have to get sanction from the Minister to have the plans exhibited locally and so on. That should be ready for the end of the year.
Are the plans available for scrutiny in the Parliamentary Secretary's office?
My information is that the detailed scheme is now prepared and the Deputy can see it at any time he wishes if he makes an appointment.
Can anyone see them?
Yes, certainly.
