asked the Minister for Education if he is aware that not all holders of medical cards are getting free books for children who are pupils in post primary schools; and if he has any plans to extend this facility to these needy pupils.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Free Books Scheme.
28.
The condition for assistance under the free books scheme is that the school principal should be satisfied there is genuine hardship in the pupil's home. I am satisfied that the scheme is generally being operated satisfactorily and that it is meeting the reasonable demands of pupils in need of assistance. I do not consider that an amendment of the general terms of the scheme is required, but naturally will endeavour to improve it if financial resources so permit.
Mr. Kitt
Now that Deputy Coughlan has gone, we will not have any interruptions and I might be able to get a reply from the Parliamentary Secretary, to my previous supplementary. I asked why the means test which applies to those seeking a medical card does not hold for the free books scheme? Why should the principal of a school or anybody else have a second means test to decide whether a pupil should be given free books? Why do the people who are holders of medical cards not qualify for free books for their children? Is it because the money is not there to give them?
I have already answered that question in response to a supplementary from Deputy Power. I explained then that before I took office this change was made. Initially, when the scheme was introduced, there was a definite link to the holding of a medical card but because it was found that standards varied from the area of one health authority to that of another in relation to the issue of medical cards it was decided that it would not be fair and equitable to relate it directly to the holding of a medical card. Naturally, the principal teacher, who is the person responsible for a decision in these matters, will take all relevant considerations into account and amongst these will probably be the holding of a medical card.
The Parliamentary Secretary, in reply to an earlier supplementary, said he would review the situation but now he says that he is satisfied with it. However, the system is entirely unsatisfactory and needs reviewing very urgently. I should like to ask the Parliamentary Secretary to carry out this review in view of the fact that children suffer humiliation in having to disclose information or in having to put up their hands in reply to a query from the principal teacher as to whether their parents can afford to pay for the books. It is very humiliating for children. Could some alternative arrangement be devised whereby these children could get these books without having to disclose anything or to arrive at school in tattered clothes or with their parents' medical card? Would a direct application to the Department of Education not suffice?
This would add greatly to the difficulties in the case. As I pointed out, this grant is available to families where genuine hardship exists. While the school principal may not have any perfect means of determining whether such conditions exist, he is in a better position to do so than would an official of my Department sitting in judgment on such application.
Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that school principals have told me that only between 50 and 60 of the 140 applications submitted are being considered and that many genuine cases are not being considered as a result of this system which has been in operation for some years?
We cannot debate the matter of free books here today.
Is the Parliamentary Secretary casting an aspersion on the ability of the home assistance officers who investigate these cases in the first place.
No.
Arising out of the Parliamentary Secretary's admission that standards vary at health boards in such important matters as the distribution of medicines and the free availability of medical attention, would he not agree that his statement is an admission that when this scheme was introduced under a previous administration GMS cards were used as a guideline for eligibility for free books? Now his Department believes that those who were eligible for free medicines are not eligible for free books.
I would agree with the first part but I would point out to the Deputy that the change in relation to this matter was also made by the previous administration.
The Parliamentary Secretary has not replied to a fair and relevant question dealing with the use of medical cards. He has avoided answering the question of whether he considers that those holding medical cards are in need of some help.
I have already answered that question.
Surely the fact that people have a medical card is an indication that they are in need.
I dealt with that matter on two occasions.
Deputies should restrain themselves.
I should like to ask the Ceann Comhairle if it is in order for a Deputy to enter this House without wearing a tie?
It is only right that the Parliamentary Secretary should inform the House why medical cards are not accepted as an indication of a person's means.
(Interruptions.)
Mr. Kitt
The Parliamentary Secretary has thrown a great onus on the principal teachers of schools. If the home assistance officer has already agreed that a person is entitled to a medical card, why should he put the onus on the principals of the schools?
Deputy Kitt is being disorderly.
Mr. Kitt
This system should be changed.
You should be honest with the people and admit you have not got the money.