asked the Minister for Justice if he will state in respect of the State car used by each member of the Government and each Parliamentary Secretary the total mileage covered and the total cost of fuel during the period 5th November, 1973, to 5th November, 1974.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - State Cars.
41.
(Cavan): The records that are kept relate to mileages during calendar months. The mileage covered by the official car assigned to each member of the Government and each Parliamentary Secretary for the 12-month period 1st November, 1973 to 31st October, 1974 are shown in a tabular statement, which with the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to have circulated with the Official Report.
Petrol and oil for State Vehicles, which include official cars for Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries, are purchased on the basis of a negotiated price and it is an essential part of the arrangement that the price is not disclosed.
Following is the statement:
MILEAGE recorded in official cars allocated to each member of the Government and each Parliamentary Secretary in the year ended 31/10/1974.
|
Member of Government or Parliamentary Secretary |
Mileage |
|
1. Mr. Cosgrave, the Taoiseach |
36,943 |
|
2. Mr. Corish, the Tánaiste |
35,117 |
|
3. Mr. Ryan, Minister for Finance |
32,078 |
|
4. Mr. Keating, Minister for Industry and Commerce |
52,418 |
|
5. Mr. Donegan, Minister for Defence |
49,180 |
|
6. Mr. Tully, Minister for Local Government |
53,017 |
|
7. Mr. Fitzpatrick, Minister for Lands |
49,944 |
|
8. Dr. O'Brien, Minister for Posts and Telegraphs |
48,336 |
|
9. Mr. Clinton, Minister for Agricultre and Fisheries |
31,076 |
|
10. Mr. O'Leary, Minister for Labour |
37,118 |
|
11. Mr. O'Donnell, Minister for the Gaeltacht |
51,271 |
|
12. Dr. FitzGerald, Minister for Foreign Affairs |
23,141 |
|
13. Mr. Burke, Minister for Education |
37,300 |
|
14. Mr. Cooney, Minister for Justice |
49,655 |
|
15. Mr. Barry, Minister for Transport and Power |
41,426 |
|
16. Mr. Begley, Parliamentary Secretary, Minister for Local Government |
55,219 |
|
17. Mr. Bruton, Parliamentary Secretary, Minister for Education |
34,010 |
|
18. Mr. Kenny, Parliamentary Secretary, Minister for Finance |
38,146 |
|
19. Mr. Cluskey, Parliamentary Secretary, Minister for Social Welfare |
28,124 |
|
20. Mr. Barry, Parliamentary Secretary, Minister for Health |
46,288 |
|
21. Mr. Kelly, Parliamentary Secretary to the Taoiseach |
27,049 |
|
22. Mr. Murphy, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries |
52,415 |
Can the Minister give us the total figure in each case. There are only two figures.
(Cavan): I cannot. It will all appear on the tabular statement.
42.
asked the Minister for Justice if State cars providing transport for members of the Government and Parliamentary Secretaries will be required to observe the 50 mph speed limit.
(Cavan): The drivers will be encouraged not to exceed 50 miles per hour save in exceptional circumstances.
I noticed the Minister used the word "encouraged". Would the Minister not agree that there is scope for a vast amount of petrol conservation in this field because the State cars referred to used a total of 47,461 gallons of petrol in the 12-month period ending 31st October? Would he not agree that the speed limit should be imposed on those cars in the very same way as it is on the rest of the petrol consuming public?
(Cavan): I agree there is a need to conserve petrol consumption and, as I have said, instructions have been issued or are being issued to the drivers by the barrack master.
Does the Minister consider, in view of the fact that the new panda or special squad car, had to follow a ministerial car at 110 miles per hour recently through the town of Cashel——
(Cavan): That seems to be a different question.
The same petrol.
(Interruptions.)
43.
asked the Minister for Justice why State cars recently purchased are of a higher horse power and have a higher petrol consumption.
(Cavan): The State cars which have been purchased recently are not of a higher horse power than those bought in recent years; neither is there any reason to think they will have a higher petrol consumption.
Will the Minister agree that the Mercedes 220 is no longer produced in four cylinders and that all 230s have been purchased in recent times? In the special circumstances of the present time when we are all asked to conserve fuel would it not have been the appropriate thing to buy 200s rather than 230s which are definitely consuming much more petrol?
They are six cylinder.
(Cavan): My information is that the cars bought this year for the Ministers' fleet consisted of Mercedes 19 h.p. and Fords 24 h.p., the horse power of which is similar to the Mercedes and Fords purchased for the fleet in recent years. One Peugeot with a 16 h.p. which is a lower horse power than that usually used for the fleet was also purchased.
Would the Minister not agree that the entire fleet which was used by Ministers in the past was made up of Mercedes 200s which were 16 h.p. and that the present cars are at least 19 h.p. and six cylinder instead of four? Those cars have been bought at a time when the Government are asking all of us to drive slowly and to conserve petrol.
(Cavan): I think I was using the same car up to quite recently that the Deputy had himself. My information is that the cars purchased are the same as have been purchased in recent years, contrary to the suggestion contained in the question.
Would the Minister consider that when State cars are being sold, as occurred last week at the Garda Depot, there should be a reserve price? I know of a 1973 Vauxhall Victor car which was sold for £600 at the depot. It does not sound economic.
(Cavan): That is certainly a different question.
Would the Minister not consider that it would be more appropriate for the Government, as an example, to buy smaller cars and use smaller cars? If you are concerned about fuel consumption, are you prepared to travel in a smaller car?
(Cavan): It is strange that the Deputy puts that question to me because the very same question was put to Deputy Colley on television the other night.
Are you prepared to take a smaller car?
(Cavan): Deputy Colley said that in the unlikely event of the position being changed he would consider the position.
In other words, you are asking the Irish people to do what you will not do yourself?
I asked the Minister about the change in the h.p. and petrol consumption and he gave the impression that he is using the car I used. He should have used past tense. He was using it. The present replacement cars are all six cylinder, higher h.p. and with a greater petrol consumption. I would ask the Minister to deny that if he can.
The Minister has answered the question. I am calling the next question.
(Cavan): I am not a mechanic. I can only give the Deputy the information I have got and that is that they are the same h.p. and that they use the same amount of petrol.
Is the Minister aware——
Acting Chairman
I have called the next question. The Minister is not in a position to reply at the moment. I have called the next question.
Chair.
Is the Minister aware that his colleague, the Minister for Industry and Commerce, gave as the reason for not changing the cars the fact that the Garda Síochána were only trained to drive Mercedes and could not drive any other type of car?
Acting Chairman
I cannot permit a debate on this question.
Are you prepared to set an example by using a car with a lower h.p. and lower petrol consumption?
Hypocrite.
Acting Chairman
The Minister must not reply to questions which are asked without the permission of the Chair.
(Interruptions.)
We did not make the statement that Ryan made here last week. Are you prepared to practise what you preach? Otherwise you are hypocrites in the eyes of the people.